Calling for Dusty's Head

by cephyn on Jul 7, 2005 6:00 PM CDT

I hate Dusty. I've said it before, for years, that the Cubs success in 2003 was in spite of, not because of, Dusty freakin' Baker. And he's really proving now that he can't manage his way out of a paper bag. He has lent no stability to the lineup, instead flipping people around in RIDICULOUS orders for RIDICULOUS reasons.

Then we go and think about our suggestions for his replacement. Grady Little's name came up, but really, does anyone know "how" he manages? What his process is? We know Dusty goes by his gut (which only gets us stupid decisions like Wilson, Macias, and only gets his son nearly killed), but doesn't Little do that too? Wasn't leaving Pedro in a Gut Decision?

I'm tired of the carousel, here in the MLB as well as others sports (most notably the ridiculosity that is NBA head coaches). The same hacks get jobs over and over and over. They do crappy somewhere, then get hired somewhere else for millions, do crappy there, rinse, lather, repeat. WHY? WHY do teams hire known losers instead of taking chances on NEW blood and NEW ideas?

Which brings me to my point: Why don't we find someone new and actually INTERVIEW them or REVIEW what they may have already said. Find intelligent new blood that needs a chance. Find someone who understands things like OBP (at the VERY least).

Lets start thinking the Moneyball way - find what is UNDERVALUED in managers, and find someone who excels in those things. And then start propping him up. Start a mailing campaign to Tribune and Hendry. Plaster his/her name and the reasons why they might make a good manager, in our Informed Fan Opinion. At the very least, maybe someone up top will take notice and start thinking critically about management decisions. It's worked in Boston. It can work on the North Side.

Just my (idealistic, I know) opinion and dream. But seriously, with the kind of baseball knowledge at places like Beyond the Box Score, Baseball Prospectus and the like, someone has GOT to be able to do better. At least have a better plan, for goddsakes. Dusty has got to go.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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Dusty Says

``We've played three games here, and we've got one run,'' Chicago manager Dusty Baker said. ``That makes it tough. This is a tough period we're going through right now. It hurts not to have D. Lee in there, especially against a left-hander. We've got to change something.''

How about YOU Dusty? How about we change YOU? Stop changing things (lineups) just to change them! Put some goddamn thought into it!

by cephyn on Jul 7, 2005 6:16 PM CDT reply actions

Dempster in the 8th

Someone please tell me why Dempster wasn't brought in to begin the 8th inning tonight? Dempster had pitched once in the last week so he was well rested and he's obviously used to throwing more than one inning. Plus, the 8th inning was the real save situation of the game with the 2-3-4 hitters coming up. But what does Dusty do? Brings in Novoa (who has pitched well), brings in Rusch (who has not pitched well), and THEN, five runs and ZERO outs later, he brings in Dempster.
One of example of the many poor decisions made. Dusty has to go. He's not a good manager and it seems he is losing his players trust.

by BringBackRyno on Jul 7, 2005 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions

And I love....

the idea about Maddux!

by BringBackRyno on Jul 7, 2005 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions

this is exactly why...

we can't just fire Dusty and recycle a proven failure. 98% of the managers that have worked for MLB clubs the past 20 years would have saved Dempster for the 9th, instead of putting him in for the heart of the order and seeing how he felt after that. So, if we're going to fire Dusty it can't be to hire a retread like Brenly or (god forbid!) Larry Bowa.

The Cubs will thrive in twenty-oh-five!

by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 7, 2005 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions

A retread's better than..

a proven idiot.

Let's play two!!!

by jsmckay on Jul 7, 2005 9:34 PM CDT up reply actions

no, a retread is...

a proven idiot.

The Cubs will thrive in twenty-oh-five!

by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 7, 2005 9:56 PM CDT up reply actions

You're right...

A kid with a computer is the way to go.

Let's play two!!!

by jsmckay on Jul 8, 2005 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions

hey

worked for the red sox.

by cephyn on Jul 8, 2005 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions

Maybe....

the new manager should be a retired player???

Cubbie blue always sPaRkLeS in my eyes.

by sparkles721 on Jul 7, 2005 10:29 PM CDT up reply actions

How about Joe Girardi?

He's had manager written all over him for some time. And he won't let whiny babies liek Korey tell him where they want to hit in the lineup.

Hey-Dawson backwards is Noswad!---Harry Caray

by cubbiejulie on Jul 8, 2005 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions

what's his philosophy?

old guard? understands how to use statistics? hates/loves kids? I don't know anything about him.

by cephyn on Jul 8, 2005 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions

Girardi has...

... exactly one-half a season's experience as a coach (bench coach under Joe Torre).

The Yankees are grooming him to succeed Torre as manager. I think Girardi wants that job. I can't imagine Steinbrenner letting him go without a high price.

by Al Yellon on Jul 8, 2005 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions

In Sync

The most important thing is for the manager and the general manager to be in sync and Dusty and Jim Hendry have been at odds all year (Dubois, Dempster, etc.).

by jolietconvict on Jul 7, 2005 8:29 PM CDT reply actions

absolutely!

This was the biggest problem the Bears had a few years back with Dick Jauron and Jerry Angelo. The two had completely different philosophies on how to run a defense, and Angelo might as well have never signed Jauron to a contract extension given the players he let go and brought in, given the system Jauron was using. Instead, he signed Jauron to the extension and let Jaruon "fail" with the players he gave him, completely out of place in his system. Then, he fired Jauron and got someone who saw D the same way he did.

The Cubs will thrive in twenty-oh-five!

by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 7, 2005 8:37 PM CDT up reply actions

This is the best fire Dutsy post i have ever read.

Actually, its one of the best posts of any kind i have ever read. I do think Dusty has his advantages, but i'm at the point where i don't think he's the right fit for this team anymore. I credit you for suggesting an alternative in that we should apply the moneyball philosophy to hiring a new manager in hiring someone who is undervalued or exhibits undervalued qualities.

The problem is that moneyball is also about finding quantitative ways to measure those undervalued quantities, for players that means OBP, PC/AB, and their new (and as far as i know private) statistics measuring baserunning and defense. I don't know if those statistics exist for managers, or what they would be measuring.

However, your general notion that the Cubs should think outside the box if/when they hire a new manager is a good one. What would happen if the Cubs just hired a sabermatician to run the club? What if they hired Steve Stone? What about giving an unproven guy like Joe Girardi a chance?

The Cubs will thrive in twenty-oh-five!

by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 7, 2005 8:34 PM CDT reply actions

A sabermatician is...

exactly what this team needs. Dusty is the anti-sabermatician and therefore gets in the way of the players who could get the job done.

Let's play two!!!

by jsmckay on Jul 7, 2005 9:38 PM CDT up reply actions

A suggestion

Tom Kotchman of the Angels system.

The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

by scareduck on Jul 8, 2005 1:51 AM CDT up reply actions

that should read...

...moneyball is also about finding quantitative ways to measure those undervalued qualities.

The Cubs will thrive in twenty-oh-five!

by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 7, 2005 8:38 PM CDT reply actions

Your point is valid....

...but let me twist it up a bit -- maybe I'm saying an undervalued talent/skill of a manager is attention to sabermetrics.

by cephyn on Jul 7, 2005 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions

if that's the case...

i'm all for it. But then, wouldn't you also need a GM that pays attention to sabermatics? Maybe Hendry does, but if he doesn't then you'll have a sabermatically-unfriendly club managed by a sabermatically-inclined manager. That doesn't sound like a recipe for success.

The Cubs will thrive in twenty-oh-five!

by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 8, 2005 1:56 AM CDT up reply actions

Excellent Point

The GM and the manager need to be able to work together well. However, if the manager has a solid enough plan and enough backup, I can see Hendry giving him a chance.

by cephyn on Jul 8, 2005 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions

Thinking outside the box

How about Greg Maddux for player/coach? He's arguably the best baseball mind of our generation, including players, managers, sabermaticians, authors, fans, and hot dog vendors. Why not give him a shot at running the club? His brother has worked wonders up in Milwaukee so maybe Mad-dog could do the same here.

The Cubs will thrive in twenty-oh-five!

by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 7, 2005 8:52 PM CDT reply actions

Great idea, but...

Greg won't do it. Remember when we were trying to get him to come back and play here again, and everyone said a real benefit would be that he could sit down with the young pitchers and help them learn to pitch better. Greg didn't even want to do that--he preferred to be able to golf on his off days. I don't see him shouldering the burden for running the whole club, even though he would be a stellar manager.

If you're going to go with an unproven manager, I'd suggest Steve Stone, who has pretty close to the same encyclopedic baseball knowledge as Maddux, and who would clearly be willing to take the job.

by Molechaser on Jul 7, 2005 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions

petition for Stone

hi folks.
did a google search and someone started a petition for Steve Stone to become manager of the Chicago Cubs...LAST YEAR!
anyhow, the site's still up and people are signing it...only 177 right now, but if we pubilcize it...who knows what could happen?!?! I would LOVE Steve Stone in our dugout.

here's the link. tell everyone you know and share it with other message boards:

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/Stone

btw, I'd keep Prior, Z, Woody, Rusch, Mitre, Ohman, Dempster, Wuertz, Williams, and Ramirez, Blanco, Barrett, Burnitz (maybe), Nomar (maybe), Walker and DLee. everyone else must go!

in Dusty we trusty? no...make that "the Dust is a Bust."

-rt

by toalster on Jul 7, 2005 10:23 PM CDT reply actions