Why I think Brenly is right

by Scott G F on Oct 3, 2006 8:40 AM CDT

Brenly is the right choice for the manager of the Chicago Cubs. He has seen the Cubs for 2 seasons. Knows the players, the orgainization and what the Cubs need to bring in to win.

He understands what OBP is. That alone makes him better then the previous manager. He was hired by McDonough.

Now ask yourself. Why would you hire an ex-World Series winning manager to sit in the broadcasting booth if you didn't think he might, one day, be a good option as manager? I believe if Grady Little was still here he would have been announced already. Remember Grady Little? The playoff bound manager of the Dodgers?

When the people calm down and take a good look at what they have in front of them. I believe Brenly will be announced as the manager.

Stone will be back in the booth as well.

I then expect Am Ram to be resigned along with Zambrano. I now expect J. Pierre to walk/run away and Jones to ask for a trade.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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I would not object to Brenley

However, I think Bob may fall into the Stoney trap of becoming very accustomed to the sanctity and security of the broadcast booth. After watching up close what Dusty Baker went through with the fans and the media, I'm not sure the broadcast booth is looking pretty cozy for Brenley. I might be completely wrong on this, and maybe he does want to manage the Cubs. It's just a hunch.

"Don't complain to me about the stormy weather, boys. Just bring the ship into port." --Steve Stone, September 2004

by ctcoff99 on Oct 3, 2006 8:45 AM CDT reply actions

Correction

I meant to say I AM sure the booth is looking pretty cozy for Brenley. Typo.

"Don't complain to me about the stormy weather, boys. Just bring the ship into port." --Steve Stone, September 2004

by ctcoff99 on Oct 3, 2006 8:47 AM CDT up reply actions

At the very least....

... spell the man's name right.

It's B-R-E-N-L-Y.

by Al Yellon on Oct 3, 2006 9:00 AM CDT reply actions

Let Jones walk....

(actually be traded) If he is that attached to Dusty, it's a great time to trade him. I'd like to see him go anyway, especially now while his trade value is as high as it's going to be. I do not see Jones as an intregal part of championship team in Chicago.

by LuisSalazar on Oct 3, 2006 9:02 AM CDT reply actions

Bob Brenly

will get strong consideration for the managerial opening in San Francisco.

by BlueBooHoo on Oct 3, 2006 9:06 AM CDT reply actions

Maybe....

we'll be lucky to see SF also be drooling over Pinella and swipe him up before the Cubs can get a chance!

by LuisSalazar on Oct 3, 2006 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions

It's Official....Girardi's available

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2611327

by LuisSalazar on Oct 3, 2006 9:27 AM CDT reply actions

What happened?

"P-A-L-A-T-I-N-E! Go, Pirates!"

by Littlerock Rynofan on Oct 3, 2006 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions

Loria Happened

Girardi's problem is that he made the mistake of telling Loria to stop yelling at the Umpire and making Giradi's job harder. Loria is a franchise destroyer, doing now to Florida what he did to Montreal before this.

And to top it all off, he has told his front office to crush Girardi's reputation as well.

by frustratedfan on Oct 3, 2006 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions

Careful now

Cub fans are falling into the trap of selectively evaluating Joe Girardi and largely ignoring his faults. To chalk up his demise in Florida to the owner being a jerk is gross over-simplification.

Be careful what you wish for. This whole Girardi thing is eerily similar to the Dusty thing four years ago. As Cub fans we peed our pants at the thought of Dusty coming to Chicago, all the while ignoring his managerial style and way of doing (or not doing) things.

by BlueBooHoo on Oct 3, 2006 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions

Baker and Girardi

I thought Baker was a rotten hire from Day one. His success in SF had to do with one thing -- Barry Bonds. During Baker's managing career Bonds posted some of the best offensive numbers of any player in the history of baseball (and for purposes of this discussion, it is irrelevant as to whether or not they were enhanced). And they had a number of other very good veteran players on the club. Baker didn't do much more than was expected out of those teams.

Once in Chicago, even during the "winning" season, he was making stupid managerial choices.

In contrast, Girardi put it all together with a team in Florida which was given no chance to compete. He took a young team with a horrible start and got them to turn it around. He didn't particularly abuse the pitchers, and quite the contrary, took out some pitchers over their rather strident objections.

Does hiring Girardi ensure that the Cubs win? Of course not. But he should be a viable candidate and be on the list of prospective manager candidates. And he should be well above any of the retreads.

by frustratedfan on Oct 3, 2006 9:54 AM CDT up reply actions

I know, I know.

Apparently we need the "joke" font around here, too ...

"P-A-L-A-T-I-N-E! Go, Pirates!"

by Littlerock Rynofan on Oct 3, 2006 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions

I would expect...

... that he WILL be interviewed by Hendry.

It is my understanding that the Marlins still have to pay him for the two years left on his deal.

by Al Yellon on Oct 3, 2006 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions

I respectfully disagree

I stand by the belief that Jim Hendry ignores Joe Girardi on his short list of managerial candidates.

by BlueBooHoo on Oct 3, 2006 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions

Then we respectfully agree to disagree.

I think Girardi is on the list, and will be interviewed.

I have my reservations about him too, given what we've heard about his style. If he is hired, it is almost exactly the same thing the White Sox did in hiring Ozzie Guillen -- hiring a popular former player to, in part, try to placate an angry fan base.

There are worse reasons to hire a manager.

by Al Yellon on Oct 3, 2006 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions

You all are crazy

you make it seem like girardi's popularity is the only reason people want him as manager. Let's keep these things in mind.

Multiple World Series wins
Bench coach for the most successful manager of the last 15 years.
Service time with the team
NORTHWESTERN engineering DEGREE
The way he handled, or rather didn't respond to, the smear campaign.
Low cost -----> More to invest in players?
HE WANTS to be here!

by Santos Sorrow @ Bleed Cubbie Blue on Oct 3, 2006 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions

I agree......

I want Girardi as much as you do.

by PriorandAramisfan23 on Oct 3, 2006 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions

Okay

1. World Series won as a manager which is what we're looking for.
2. 2 years watching the team very closly
3. Service time with the bad teams (05, 06)
4. The way he handled, or rather didn't respond to, the stupid mistakes by the manager and players during observation.
5. Mid cost -----> More to invest in players?
6. HE WANTS to be here!
7. He's proven

You're never a loser untill you quit trying - FortuneCookie

by Scott G F on Oct 3, 2006 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions

I have to laugh at #4..

As much as sabermetrics are all the vogue in baseball today, I doubt it takes an engineering degree from Northwestern to understand it. There have been many successful managers with far less education.

by wicubfan on Oct 3, 2006 8:35 PM CDT up reply actions

Do you think it hurts?

He is far and away the brightest candidate, its not even contested. I will argue other things, like playoff experience, if you'd like but in terms of intellegence is self-evident.

ps. Joe Girardi has MORE World Series experience than ANY of the other candidates, as well.

by Santos Sorrow @ Bleed Cubbie Blue on Oct 4, 2006 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions

Not managing

Whole different ball of wax.

You're never a loser untill you quit trying - FortuneCookie

by Scott G F on Oct 4, 2006 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions

No it's not

managing isn't some mystical skill in ANY walk of life, a famous Darden study (University of Virginia business school) showed the only two factors that were highly correlated with job performance is 1) Conscientious and 2) Intelligence.

That's it!

Now, if you can provide some examples to Girardi not dotting his proverbial T's, I'll listen. Absent that, Girardi is the BEST candidate.

PS. I could find the case, if you want to read it. I know its with my files from grad school.

by Santos Sorrow @ Bleed Cubbie Blue on Oct 4, 2006 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions

I don't think it hurts

I just think it's irrelevant. You were listing reasons why he's a great candidate and I just don't happen to think a Northwestern education would be #4 on my list of reasons for hiring a major league manager. There are a lot of guys with Northwestern engineering degrees that aren't going to be interviewed by the Cubs.

I will take this one step further and argue a person doesn't even need to be particularily "smart" to be a successful manager. They just need to know the game and how to manage people.

by wicubfan on Oct 4, 2006 4:39 PM CDT up reply actions

Brenly or Girardi

I would be happy with either of them. I would prefer Girardi, but I can also see the upside to Brenly. He has seen the product two years in a row now and hopefully has an idea how to fix the problem.
I agree with everyone though that a retread like Lou Piniella would not be a good idea. I hope Hendry doesn't wait so long to make up his mind that the good managers have already been gobbled up. This is what he has done with some FAs in the past.

"The only way to prove that you're a good sport is to lose." - Ernie Banks

by madog93 on Oct 3, 2006 9:39 AM CDT reply actions

Brenly?

I just can't warm up to that idea. I don't know, it just doesn't seem right. Maybe being in the booth for a few years after he had a shot at managing gave him time to think about it and maybe he'd be a better manager now than he was before. Who knows?

Doesn't sound like we are getting Gonzalez, and I hope we aren't getting Piniella or some other retread. At this point Girardi looks like the best option to me.

Why isn't Hendry making noise about interviewing Gonzalez, has he conceeded him to the Marlins? Maybe they have an agreement, fire Girardi so he's available to the Cubs and they have first shot at Gonzalez? Doubtful, but it makes you wonder why there isn't any Cubs/Gonzalez buzz.

by pageian on Oct 3, 2006 10:25 AM CDT reply actions

Hendry...

... interviewed Gonzalez four years ago when he hired Baker. He also worked with him a number of years ago when both worked in the Marlins organization. I think Hendry knows Gonzalez quite well already.

Doesn't mean he won't be interviewed. Not everything is going to make the papers.

by Al Yellon on Oct 3, 2006 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions

Except

mlb.com is reporting that Gonzalez is going to be announced for the Marlins this afternoon.

I guess they didn't decide to start tomorrow with their 25 man list and work from there.

by rlpete on Oct 3, 2006 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions

What 25-man list?

Hendry specifically said he DOESN'T have such a list.

by Al Yellon on Oct 3, 2006 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions

My error then

I mistakenly thought he said that he did have a long list he was going to consider.

by rlpete on Oct 3, 2006 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions

Don't know enough about Brenly's

Management style to offer a qualified opinion, but he certainly would--given his broadcast experience with the Cubs--have more familarity with the team's problems than the other candidates for the manager's spot. He'd have a head start, for certain. He seems to be a positive guy, especially compared to Pinella--but that may not be quite enough for players who need that proverbial fire lit under their behinds. Of course, we may lose ARam to free agency--problem solved.

But, if it will bring Stoney back to the booth ...

"P-A-L-A-T-I-N-E! Go, Pirates!"

by Littlerock Rynofan on Oct 3, 2006 11:09 AM CDT reply actions

Brenly

Despite what you may have read here, Brenly was an excellent field manager and was highly respected in Arizona. NOBODY, not even management, felt that the D'Backs debacle of 2004 was Bob's fault...in fact, once Brenly was let go, the team immediately got worse.

I would look at his 2 division titles and 1 World Series title in 3 1/2 years for evidence.

People that say he won because he had Randy Johnson and Curt Schilling haven't got a clue. The team had Randy Johnson and Curt Schilling the year before (2000) with Buck Showalter and didn't even make the playoffs.

Brenly's clubhouse style here in Arizona was to pretty much let the player's police themselves (the polar opposite of his predecessor Buck Showalter). It worked well with a veteran team with some leadership.

Yet, Brenly also demonstrated he can crack the whip when necessary. He understands the game and has great people skills. I also heard it pointed out yesterday on the SF Giant's radio station (by someone who knows Bob well) that those who think he is a clone of Dusty Baker don't know the man at all.

I'm sure Bob is smart enough to realize it might take a somewhat altered approach with a younger ballclub. But, Brenly is well-liked and respected and IMO, the Cubs could (and probably will) do a lot worse. Word is that SF is extremely interested in Brenly.

by jazzman56 on Oct 3, 2006 11:49 AM CDT reply actions

Thanks Jazz

Joe Girardi as manager is a knee jerk reation. a popular choice, but not the right choice. Same as Pinella whom I've campained for in the past.

Of the choices out there I like Brenly the most.

For those bringing up his wisdom in the broadcast booth. There is only some nuch you can say about a 96 loss teamthat is possitive. Brenly was a pro and didn't question Dusty's stupidity at times. He did near the end of the year along with Am ram's laziness on the base paths.

He would right the ship with much more ease then anyone else.

You're never a loser untill you quit trying - FortuneCookie

by Scott G F on Oct 3, 2006 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions

If...

... Brenly does get the SF job (or a job other than the Cubs)... I would think that'd make an opening for Steve Stone to return to the TV booth.

I'm not sold on Girardi either, however, it WOULD be a very POPULAR move, as would bringing Stone back. Keep in mind that a marketing guy is now team president. He knows how disgruntled much of the fanbase is.

There is value in making your fans happy, and while hiring Girardi might not be the perfect move, it wouldn't be the worst either.

If this sounds like I'm waffling about Girardi, I am. There are very good reasons both for and against him.

by Al Yellon on Oct 3, 2006 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions

I think

the jury is still out on Girardi. He made some mistakes this year, but he is a 1st year guy. The key is: does he keep making the same mistakes because he so locked into a certain way of doing things, or does he learn from them.

One of the fun things about watching Brenly in 2001 was seeing his growth and improvement as the year went along. He made some boo-boos early in the year, but did not repeat them. He tends to be a "gut-feel" manager, like Dusty, but his gut feelings are mostly based on sound baseball and a thorough understanding of match-ups.

I think the popularity factor is greatly over-rated. Dusty was a very popular choice, and look how that turned out. I think fan popularity would be pretty far down on the list of priorities. If there were two guys who were approximately equal in other more important areas, then it might tilt it one way or another.

I believe they will think long and hard about getting a guy who has the right stuff to helm a team that is clearly going through a transition and/or rebuilding phase.

A guy who can lead a team that will look quite a bit different next year, help the holdovers to continue on their growth path and also be a good mentor/teacher for some of the younger players who are sure to be in the mix. I would guess some veterans from the FA market will also be included, so a skill set to deal with them would be important as well.

I really think Brenly brings these qualities to the table, but whether he is interested in a situation like that is something I do not know.

by jazzman56 on Oct 3, 2006 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions

The popularity factor...

... is different for Girardi -- he's ALREADY popular here because he was a popular Cub player. That gives him a "honeymoon" possibility that Baker didn't have; Baker got his because the Cubs did so well his first year here.

Fan popularity might be far down the list in a "normal" situation -- but this isn't one of those. The fanbase is VERY disgruntled. This would be a way of getting a qualified guy AND making a lot of fans happy. Or shutting them up, depending on how you view it.

by Al Yellon on Oct 3, 2006 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions

Agreed Girardi is popular

But, like you, I am not getting on his bandwagon just yet. I like the level headedness that Brenly brings to the table. The Cubs hired Baker because he got to the World Series. Brenly won it, fair or not. Girardi isn't even on the map except his popularity and getting a great young team to compete. Brenly and Pinilla has had teams compete and win at the highest level.
I hope that Hendry makes the right baseball decision and not the popular marketing decision.

Fans be damned.
If the Cubs wanna win the World Series hire the guy that knows the way and has been there before that is sitting right in there lap.

Why do I believe that it's going to be the popluar decision?

You're never a loser untill you quit trying - FortuneCookie

by Scott G F on Oct 3, 2006 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions

Please clarify

"Brenly won it, fair or not."

Huh?

by jazzman56 on Oct 3, 2006 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions

To clarify

Of all the managers available right now. Brenly and Pinella are the only 2 being openly debated that have won it all (World Series). Girardi when held to this criteria, "fair or not" doesn't compare. Even Baker doesn't fit the criteria since he just got to the World Series and didn't win it.

You're never a loser untill you quit trying - FortuneCookie

by Scott G F on Oct 3, 2006 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions

Oh

LOL

I thought you were saying that somehow the 2001 World Series wasn't "fair". Now I get it.

by jazzman56 on Oct 3, 2006 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions

No

I was pulling for Gracie to get his ring. I was thrilled to see that he didn't have the stink of failure follow him. It gave me hope that one day this team could one day do it.

You're never a loser untill you quit trying - FortuneCookie

by Scott G F on Oct 3, 2006 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions

As I recall,

I called the D-Backs "Cubs West" in 2001. Didn't pay too much to other baseball outside of Cubdom, but man, I was happy to see the Evil Empire go down.

"P-A-L-A-T-I-N-E! Go, Pirates!"

by Littlerock Rynofan on Oct 3, 2006 4:36 PM CDT up reply actions

Since when is 'popularity' a managerial plus?

I submit that the number one priority of the next Cubs manager is to transform this team into a competitive, playoff-quality team - something Baker was unable to do the past three years.

Yet Baker was very popular with the media, Cubs management, and fans (at least during his first 2 years). When it comes to the bottomline - winning - this popularity did not contribute to wins.

If the next manager is one charming mf'er, that's fine, as long as he can deliver W's. If he turns out to be an abrasive Elia-type but turns this team around, that's fine with me too.

When Jim Hendry begins to evaluate candidates I hope he considers overall leadership and capability to win with this team FIRST (which I believe he will).

Remember, the goal here is to win the WORLD SERIES - not to make nice with disgruntled fans. As far as I'm concerned the fans can wail away - which they will do in any case anyway.

by JFCubFan on Oct 3, 2006 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions

Honestly...

I think you're missing the point.

It isn't about Al arguing FOR Girardi because he's popular. That's not one of Al's plusses as to why he thinks he would make a good manager. At least, that's not what I get from it.

To me, what I think, and what I think others are saying, is that his popularity is a reason the new "marketing" president of the Cubs might hire Girardi.

I can't even say "All things being equal..." here.

The fact of the matter (or so it seems) is that Girardi's seeming popularity with the fans of the Cubs will be a heavy factor in McDunough's choice-well, Hendry's choice, but who are we kidding here?

Whether anyone thinks it should matter or not to his managerial qualifications, it absolutely, 100% factors into his hirability as a manager for the Cubs.

Seriously, I don't need to win in '07 or '08. I can take two more 90-loss seasons if we have some talent to build with. Let's start over and do this right.

by tyger1147 on Oct 3, 2006 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions

You could be right about McDunough

but then the question is, as the 'interim' President, how involved and how demanding of Hendry will he be during the interview/hiring process? Ultimately, who knows (besides those guys) what the hiring criteria will be?

Everyone can question the ultimate selection made by Hendry/McDunough. I just hope they offer the job to someone who has a legitimate shot to improve the caliber of play from the past three years and get us in the playoffs.

And if he doesn't, well, we can all cry, whine, and moan about it as us fans are wont to do.

by JFCubFan on Oct 3, 2006 6:55 PM CDT up reply actions

Just a note:

Brenly was criticising ARam's "hustle" since late April, especially after Lee went down. That said, I am starting to like him as Cubs' manager more and more.

"P-A-L-A-T-I-N-E! Go, Pirates!"

by Littlerock Rynofan on Oct 3, 2006 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions

PInella is 63, he'll be selective

This will probably be his last time around as a manager. He'll probably command a four year guaranteed contract. I'm not counting out the Cubs, however. I refuse to believe that there is no hope. Free agency can fill some holes. D-Lee will make a lot of things better.
Like Al said in his post, take a deep breath now. Even Cedeno isn't without redemption. Take some time now to realize he is 24 and played at double A last year. I saw a lot of correctable errors by a young player. He wound up hitting just below .250, nothing to cheer about, but did he really get any support this year. How many great hitters have Sarge and Gene Clines produced in the last few years? Eliminate the stupid errors, teach him a little selectiveness at the plate and you've got yourself a player.
Murton, I don't know his final number of home runs, but if he plays next year you can probably add 8-10 for next year. He shows good instincts on the basepaths, and discipline at the plate. That, along with some coaching in the field and you have a quality major league player.
That being said a guy like Pinella who has been observing all the teams around baseball may jump on board, and you won't have to worry about him sitting in the dugout like a lump a-la Dusty. I can guarantee you he won't go to San Francisco if they bring back Bonds. No way Pinella would let that side show exist in his clubhouse.

by Nibbles on Oct 3, 2006 1:07 PM CDT reply actions

Girardi or Brenly

Now that Gonzalez is off the market, I'm trying to decide who I would prefer if it came down to Girardi and Brenly. I agree that there is a strong upside to both, and the downside to Girardi seems to be that he is a bit hardheaded. Not at all unusual for big league managers, especially former catchers, who typically make very good managers. I like the fact that Girardi is a Cubs fan at heart, so it seems that winning to him would be more than just about doing his job. It would be personal as well. That is a big intangible. But for a non-Chicagoan, I think Brenly has a good understanding of what the Cubs and Chicago are all about, and he knows the organization from having been here the last two years. I think they both would run a tight ship. Tough decision. Both seem to really make sense. I would love to be a fly on the wall during these two interviews. Assuming, of course, that Hendry even interviews these two guys.

"Don't complain to me about the stormy weather, boys. Just bring the ship into port." --Steve Stone, September 2004

by ctcoff99 on Oct 3, 2006 2:18 PM CDT reply actions

Sound like you're waffling too

All things being equal I like Girardi, but things are not equal and looking at it in the eye Brenly is a better guy for the job.

You're never a loser untill you quit trying - FortuneCookie

by Scott G F on Oct 3, 2006 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions

I like Brenly

He has been around the organization for the past two years and has a World Series ring. However, I'm pretty sure Cubs management isn't going to ask my opinion.

by qccub on Oct 3, 2006 6:53 PM CDT reply actions