Cubs to pursue Cristian Guzman if they miss out on Matsui

by cubsfan25 on Nov 29, 2007 1:14 AM CST Comment 30 comments

I got this from Mlb4u.com, and I think they got it from Buster Olney.

"Cristian Guzman, SS--Washington Nationals: The Cubs could pursue a trade for him if they fail to sign Kaz Matsui.
Last updated: 04:54 PM - Nov 28, 07 by MLB4U.com | Source: Buster Olney"

It seems like Hendry and Piniella think it's very important to have a lefthanded hitter who can play second and short with some speed. Honestly I would rather they sign Matsui, because I still think he has some upside, if he could ever stay healthy. Cristian Guzman is a faster verison of Neifi Perez. The Cubs must not think OBP is a important for a bench player/spot starter in the infield. Being a lefthanded hitter with speed seems to be what their after. If were gonna make a trade with the Nationals for lefthanded middle infielder, I would rather the Cubs try to trade for Felipe Lopez. But he would probably cost alot more talent in return then Guzman.(who the Nationals should be willing to dump for nothing)

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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What is with Hendry's obsession.......

in trying to acquire shite middle infielders??

RAMIREZ!! PRIOR!!

by PriorandAramisfan23 on Nov 29, 2007 3:44 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

that's..

the first question that comes to my mind...

Reds will finish above the Cubs in the NL Central. Book it.

by wicubfan on Nov 29, 2007 10:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe eventually he'll...

...find a good one?

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Nov 29, 2007 10:54 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Better question

He found one in DeRo. Why is he trying to replace him so quickly? I'd rather have a RH batter with a .290 BA than a LH batter with a .220 BA. Lou doesn't seem to agree with me.

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Nov 29, 2007 11:40 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Okay, so we have one good middle infielder...

...and I expected to get called out on that. But we have two middle infield spots.

FREE CARMEN PIGNATIELLO!

by cwyers on Nov 29, 2007 7:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Blame Lou as well

Hendry wouldn't be going after a lefthanded middle infielder, if Lou didn't tell him he needed that. I'm sure Lou told Hendry he needs a lefthanded high OBP hitting outfielder with power, and a lefthanded infielder with speed. To have a more balanced and complete roster.

Jim Hendry is the type of GM who's gonna go after the type of players his manager ask for. If Lou says Jim I need this type of player to have a better team, Hendry is gonna go out and get that player for his manager. Sure Hendrys the GM and gets to choose what player to bring in, but I doubt Hendry would add a player to the team unless Lou approves.

Why do you think we traded for Steve Trachsel? Lou Piniella told Hendry he didn't trust Marshall in September, and we needed to add another veteran starting pitcher. So if you believe Lou is a very good manager, and one who knows how to win. Just trust these moves, they might not look good on paper, but they could help the overall Cubs team win. Or at least I hope they do.

by cubsfan25 on Nov 29, 2007 4:29 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I think...

I think this theory has a lot of merit.

Hendry is a GM that constructs his team as his manager wants it constructed.

Of course having said that, it bears mentioning that Hendry's also the guy that chose the manager to begin with.

by davearm on Nov 29, 2007 10:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

This is someone

misreading what Buster Olney wrote.

Olney wrote (ESPN insider only, no link)

In the event the Cubs can't sign Matsui, they are looking to deal for a left-handed hitting middle infielder -- and beside Cristian Guzman of the Nationals, who played well in an injury-shortened 2007 season, the pickings may be slim.

Olney is barely even speculating--he just wrote that the Cubs want a left-handed hitting middle infielder and after Kaz Matsui, Guzman is the only one available on the trade market.

The artist formerly known as JoshinLA

by Josh77 on Nov 29, 2007 5:23 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Classic example of a site misstating things...

That Olney quote doesn't come close to saying that the Cubs might pursue Guzman. He just shows how little is available after Matsui.

Technically, I guess you could construe what mlb4u says into the same thing (they COULD go after Guzman if the decide to do so). But the presentation is much more leading than what Olney said.

And that's how internet rumors get started, I guess.

by SouthernCub on Nov 29, 2007 7:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly.

These two posts have the situation exactly right. Look how that mlb4u site took a completely throwaway comment by Olney and suddenly it became transformed into "THE CUBS ARE GOING AFTER GUZMAN!!!111!!!"

It's like the old game of Telephone, where you'd repeat what you THOUGHT you heard, and by the time it got to the end of the line it was nothing like what the original person said.

The headline of this diary is, thus, completely incorrect.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 29, 2007 8:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

If I had a choice...

Matsui...hands down. I just think he's a better all around player and I believe stayed healthy last year. Guzman was hurt some I think.

by mattmilzarek on Nov 29, 2007 6:21 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Matsui was hurt too...

he missed a fair amount of games with leg/back problems.

by SouthernCub on Nov 29, 2007 7:48 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

If I had a choice

neither of the them. Please wasting the time with these two marginal middle infielders Jimbo.
Get an outfielder with POP, Fukudome go hard after him when they arrive on the shores.
Unless they go after Tejada, and it will cost the Cubs two many chips, keep the infield as is.
The Orioles will dump Tejada, and I feel the cost will not be to steep.

by Johnny Callison was a Cub on Nov 29, 2007 7:26 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

and I got this from my azz....

......blah blah blah blah blah blah.

Pawns.

by lemon20pie on Nov 29, 2007 7:37 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Isn't that where you are from..

you azzzzzzzzz?

Why dn't you blah, blah, up blah blah blah, you blah?

MMMMM...Golden shrimp and chicken combo from Ron of Japan!

by Kinky Reggae on Dec 3, 2007 10:38 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Felipe Lopez

is a switch hitter, but his splits are of the right-handed variety, meaning that he doesn't really give you a left-handed bat in the lineup.

by DGU on Nov 29, 2007 8:02 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Olney's view of a light middle IF market

Buster Olney is right that there aren't a lot of left-handed hitting middle IF, and to be honest, there aren't a lot of high-OBP middle IF. So, for everyone saying, "We don't want Kaz or Guz, we want OBP," I ask - well, who, then, do you want? It's not like we have a high OBP SS right now.

For discussion purposes, here is the list I came up with for other lefty middle IF that should be available for a reasonable price:
NYY Wilson Betemit (blocked by Jeter-Cano-A-Rod; range decreased by weight problem)
ARI Alberto Callaspo (blocked by Orlando Hudson, comes with baggage)
TB Ben Zobrist (flopped in '07, the lefty version of Ronny Cedeno? His AAA numbers were good last year, but not as good as Ronny's)
LA Tony Abreu (blocked by Kent-Furcal-Hu-LaRoche; questionable at SS; the Dodger may hold him assuming Kent won't be back next year)

On the high-end of the market, none of these players may actually be available
ARI Orlando Hudson (premier 2B defense, connected to the Cubs before)
BAL Brian Roberts (perhaps a better trade target for the cost and the value than Tejada; a personal favorite of Angelos, though, and any deal could end up busted at the last minute)
ATL Kelly Johnson (actually came up as a SS and I wonder if he could play there now; I highly doubt he is available, but his name came up early in the year and the Braves have Lillibridge ready to go)
BOS Jed Lowrie (may not be ready at the beginning of the year because he probably needs some more time at AAA; plus the Red Sox are a lot more likely to want to trade Lugo than Lowrie)

by DGU on Nov 29, 2007 8:18 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Lillibridge

The Braves seem set with Escobar and Johnson up the middle, but reports are that Lillibridge is playing CF in winter ball (if he is healthy), and that they want to look at him there in ST. The Braves don't usually trade guys until they are sure they don't need them (at least that was Schuerholz's MO -- not sure about Wren), so Lillibridge is probably not available unless they get a better CF prospect in return (i.e., Pie).

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Nov 29, 2007 11:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

In my opinion

players like Guzman have no value, his production can easily be replaced by any number of young minor leaguers and his defense is probably overrated. How many weak, low .ops, slap hitting middle infielders are said to have good gloves? All of them.

The day Jim Bowden gave Guzman his contract was the day I realized he had no business running a major league franchise. If Jim Hendry takes on the contract I'm afraid I'll have to conclude the same thing about him. I've stuck up for Hendry in the past as well as gotten on him about things, but this would be indefensible.

I'm glad it's just a rumor that started from a throwaway comment that didn't have any basis in reality, but it saddens me because this was one seed that didn't need to be planted in Jim Hendry's mind.

I know that you believe that you understood what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. - Robert McCloskey

by pageian on Nov 29, 2007 10:00 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Hendry

Well said.

I'm also normally one of the first to stick up for Hendry, but this would be utterly indefenseable.

by davearm on Nov 29, 2007 10:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

It's really getting slow now

As has been mentioned there is nothing in the original comment that evens suggests that Hendry is considering Guzman. If anything it might indicate the reason why Hendry wants Matsui so badly. After Matsui, the pickings are non-existent.

by rlpete on Nov 29, 2007 11:07 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Not no-existent

just relatively expensive for what you get. All the other options (and there are a good # of options, see above) must be traded for, so, while I like Wilson Betemit and Alberto Callaspo better than Matsui, to get those guys I'd have to give up, at least Michael Wuertz, and Hendry probably thinks Matsui+Wuertz is worth more than Betemit or Callaspo-Wuertz.

by DGU on Nov 29, 2007 11:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

As long as we're throwing up (...er, out) rumors

here's another one that have the Cubs 'linked' to Santana (not Carlos). grain of salt and all that.

http://fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/view/28691

"Who are you going to believe, me or your own eyes?"

by Jettero2112 on Nov 29, 2007 11:45 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Once again...

... here's a noncorroborated, unsubstantiated "link". Read what the original article says:

Three teams have emerged as frontrunners for Johan Santana, The Post has learned. The Yankees are among that group. The Mets are not.

The Red Sox are almost certainly among the clubs the Twins are currently talking with most seriously about Santana. The Dodgers likely are the other team, though the Cubs, Mariners and Angels have been linked to these discussions, as well.

The writer, Joel Sherman, gives NO evidence of how the Cubs, Mariners or Angels are linked to Santana discussion.

Incidentally, when any of you find a link on a site like this, or a fantasy site, I strongly encourage you to go to the original source article for better information. Doing that would have prevented a misleading diary like this from being posted in the first place.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Nov 29, 2007 11:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly the point

I was trying to make. Guess I wasn't facetious enough in my less than witty remarks. There are bound to be more media induced false rumors than one can count this off-season. The only way to truly know what's going on is to wait for an official announcement. As much fun as speculating or wishing can be, for the most part, it's just that, wishing and speculation with no basis in truth except some blurb from a media guy that can't or won't take the time to do actual research and just posts whatever sounds good. That's my $0.02.

Come on winter meetings.

"Who are you going to believe, me or your own eyes?"

by Jettero2112 on Nov 29, 2007 1:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

At 5:23 AM, Josh ran over this rumor but good.

Then at 7:51 AM, bababenti ran over it again, and shoved it off to the side of the road. And finally at 8:52 AM, Al pulled up, got out of the car, went over and gave it a nice double-tap right between the eyes, just to be sure.

And still the posts continue (mine included).

Mr. Hendry, please toss some fresh meat this way - the natives are getting restless...

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Nov 29, 2007 2:30 PM CST reply actions 0 recs