Steroids, Revisited

by Al Yellon on Feb 27, 2007 6:00 PM CST in Chicago Cubs News

The steroid scandal in baseball -- and other sports -- may be about to bust wide open:

ORLANDO, Fla. -- A downtown pharmacy was raided by a law enforcement task force on Tuesday, the climax of a large New York state grand jury investigation into Internet drug sales that could expose widespread illicit steroid use by professional athletes and thousands of people across the nation.

Here's something that ought to chill the veins of the LA Angels, if no one else:

The customers include Los Angeles Angels center fielder Gary Matthews Jr., according to sources with knowledge of the investigation.

Wow. And just in time for spring training games to start.

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Explains alot

makes sense, his breakout year and such.

By the way, who missed me for that week?

on hiatus

by Faith plus 1 on Feb 27, 2007 6:01 PM CST reply actions

no positive tests

I know more will come out about it, but I'm not going to jump to conclusions so fast.

by miltowncubbie on Feb 27, 2007 7:53 PM CST up reply actions

who's jumping to conclusions?

my post was just as speculative as the the article itself despite the tone soundin a little more definitive.

on hiatus

by Faith plus 1 on Feb 27, 2007 8:08 PM CST up reply actions

I did?

PAGAN!

by Jesse Guam on Feb 27, 2007 7:56 PM CST up reply actions

Thanks Jess

missed you too

on hiatus

by Faith plus 1 on Feb 27, 2007 8:08 PM CST up reply actions

Why does it make sense?

Why would any player under jeopardy of continual random drug testing risk their multi-million contracts by taking steroids these days?

And treated with the same respect as Bonds, McGwire and Canseco?

by JFCubFan on Feb 27, 2007 10:26 PM CST up reply actions

Maybe because..

..there is a lot of money at stake and MLB still doesn't test for HGH. That, to me, is the biggest crime.

Chicks dig the long ball

by Will23 on Feb 28, 2007 8:06 AM CST up reply actions

Note Olney's Blog on ESPN MLB Site today

He comments some what extensively on the lack of testing for HGH.

My God that one is going to land in Milwaukee - Lou Boudreau describing a Dave Kingman home run in the Cub/Phillie 23 to 22 game in 1979.

by cjn54 on Feb 28, 2007 2:30 PM CST up reply actions

That's why ..

I always ate my Wheaties.

Well, Next Year is here .. and Jack's century's gotta end some time .. GO CUBBIES!

by cubnational on Feb 27, 2007 6:09 PM CST reply actions

I laughed...

...good one.

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Feb 27, 2007 6:49 PM CST up reply actions

Read that story earlier today and chringed

I hope there are very few (and absolutly no Cubbies) involved.

by stelmodad on Feb 27, 2007 6:11 PM CST reply actions

good

its name for people to put names out there

public shame will go alot futher than more inquiries and discussion panels.

"Just say Smith or Jones again, it dont matter, none of this matters"

by ksucubbie on Feb 27, 2007 6:14 PM CST reply actions

Can you just say...

...that Barry Bonds is involved? That will make me feel better.

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Feb 27, 2007 6:49 PM CST reply actions

Several Stories

There were several stories on the steroids/HGH front.

First off, we've seen players say that they are not going to cooperate with the George Mitchell investigation. Bonds, Sheffield, et al. It appears that Don Fehr is telling players that this is just a witch hunt and to do what they wish.

We also learned today that during his time in San Fransisco, Barry Bonds went from a size 42 jersey to a size 52. His hat size went from 7 1/8 to 7 1/4, despite the fact that he began shaving his head. His shoe size went from a 10 1/2 to a 13 1/2.

DmL

by dmlichte on Feb 27, 2007 7:12 PM CST reply actions

Really?

I'd love to get a link on the Bonds story.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Feb 27, 2007 7:20 PM CST up reply actions

Verducci

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/tom_verducci/02/27/shadows.afterword/index.html

He mentions what they talk about in Game of Shadows--how Bonds feet and hat size changed.

PAGAN!

by Jesse Guam on Feb 27, 2007 7:56 PM CST up reply actions

Bonds

His feet size changed? That's unreal. If there were any justice, he'd have been tossed out of baseball years ago and would have as much chance of breaking Aaron's record as I do.

"Hello again, everybody. Harry Caray from Wrigley Field on a beautiful day for baseball."

by danimal15 on Feb 27, 2007 8:38 PM CST up reply actions

Loud, sustained applause.

n/t

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Feb 27, 2007 8:39 PM CST up reply actions

Feet size

That seemed to be one of the more damning elements.

I think I might need to read Game of Shadows.

PAGAN!

by Jesse Guam on Feb 27, 2007 8:42 PM CST up reply actions

I would...

... highly recommend Game of Shadows to EVERYONE here.

Here's the review I wrote of it last April.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Feb 28, 2007 4:29 AM CST up reply actions

I read the book

Got a used copy from Amazon and paid like $11.99 before shipping. Was a good read. Got bored in the chapters that weren't about baseball, but I guess that is probably just me. I don't care that much about the Olympics like I did when I was a kid.

by LT on Feb 28, 2007 9:34 AM CST up reply actions

We should be so lucky

Unfortunatly I expect the race card to be played (even though Aaron is also African-American) when or if Bonds breaks the record.

I plan to ignore it.

My God that one is going to land in Milwaukee - Lou Boudreau describing a Dave Kingman home run in the Cub/Phillie 23 to 22 game in 1979.

by cjn54 on Feb 28, 2007 2:32 PM CST up reply actions

I'll follow Hank's lead.

If breaking the record is no big deal to him, it's no big deal to me.

Race has no part of it. Jerky-ness and cheating does.

Coming Soon: The Martha Stewart Collection's Mark Prior "Signature" Towel ...

by Littlerock Rynofan on Feb 28, 2007 3:19 PM CST up reply actions

Re

Actually, his hat size went from 7 1/8 to 7 1/2. But what's really telling is the increase in his shoe size. During his 30s. There's only one thing that could possibly account for that, and it's illegal.

Visit The Digital Gazette

by Jed Taylor on Feb 27, 2007 9:37 PM CST up reply actions

Actually

I gained half a foot size with each pregnancy. But I don't think Bonds has ever been pregnant.

For Cub fans spring training combines the eternal hope of spring with the irrational belief in the impossible.

by kerrysotherwife on Feb 28, 2007 10:22 AM CST up reply actions

Agreed.

As I have entered my forties, my feet are now a 7 1/2, after being a size 5 1/2 to 6 throughout college and my twenties. They've also widened a fair bit as well (without the benefit of pregnancy). But an increase like Bonds' seems beyond the realistic limits of aging.

Start warming up those asterisks, guys!
LRRF

Coming Soon: The Martha Stewart Collection's Mark Prior "Signature" Towel ...

by Littlerock Rynofan on Feb 28, 2007 3:17 PM CST up reply actions

Shoe Size?

Steroids make your feet larger and shrink other equipment? That shatters that adage.

by N Oakley on Feb 27, 2007 9:50 PM CST up reply actions

Barry...

Everyone knows he took steriods, he knows he took steriods. All we are wating for are those positive tests!!

"Did you hear that? I didn't hear anything. Put that question another way." -Ernie Banks

by Little Al on Feb 27, 2007 9:12 PM CST reply actions

Someone

needs to tell Selig because he obviously doesn't have a clue.

Players win awards but teams win championships.

by tharr on Feb 27, 2007 10:42 PM CST up reply actions

I may be in the minority on this..

But I'm so tired of the entire steroids thing. I know it is against the law, but the fact is that MLB did everything possible to look the other way. Can I really hold it against any professional athlete that tries to win "whatever it takes?"

Everyone gives such cudos to the NFL and their steroids policy. But look at these guys. 230 lb guys running 4.3 in the 40 yd dash and they aren't on roids?? For that matter, look at todays high school athletes. There are many 300 lb kids comming out of high school and you're telling me they aren't on roids?? I just don't buy it.

Hate Bonds if you like because he's a jerk. But on the use of steroids, I don't think he's any different than thousands of other athletes across many different sports.

Well, sometimes nothin is a real cool hand.

by wicubfan on Feb 27, 2007 9:31 PM CST reply actions

This is true....

Bonds only maintains his place in the spotlight because:

He's an unbelievable athlete even without the steroids.
He treats the media/many fans like shit.
He's about to break the "big" record.

Take away any or all of these factors and Bonds isn't in the spotlight anymore.

UZI

"I'm not pissed because you said 'gizzards', I'm pissed because my fingers are burning" - My wife, Christina.

by Ozgreeder on Feb 27, 2007 9:34 PM CST up reply actions

Correct

Even given he took roids to be able to hit the ball that far, he still had to hit it. That's something a lot of guys on roids could never do.

Well, sometimes nothin is a real cool hand.

by wicubfan on Feb 27, 2007 10:01 PM CST up reply actions

ability

Nobody denies his great baseball ability, but when you have to cheat to maintain longevity; thats the real issue.

by miltowncubbie on Feb 27, 2007 10:24 PM CST up reply actions

That ignores the possibility...

as some tests have shown, that HGH can improve or at least stave off the age related decline in hand eye coordination.

by FullyKraeusened on Feb 28, 2007 11:18 AM CST up reply actions

NFL

Heck, the NFL had a player suspended four games for steroids, and he nearly won Defensive Player of the Year. So what does that tell us about the double standard between football and baseball?

PAGAN!

by Jesse Guam on Feb 28, 2007 9:43 AM CST up reply actions

Apparently,

the steroids that Bonds "allegedly" took, also caused his testicles to swell as well. This would explain the absolute "ballsiness" of his latest actions.

UZI

"I'm not pissed because you said 'gizzards', I'm pissed because my fingers are burning" - My wife, Christina.

by Ozgreeder on Feb 27, 2007 9:31 PM CST reply actions

I don't wanna know

how in the world you know that Barry Bonds balls are swollen.

by Josh Timmers on Feb 27, 2007 10:48 PM CST up reply actions

Just because player X hasn't failed a test

Doesn't mean that they're not doping. They could be carefully maintaining schedules or using "undetectable" substances.

by gjdow on Feb 27, 2007 10:39 PM CST reply actions

Has Bonds

even been tested recently? I'm not aware that he was even tested in the past number of years.

Players win awards but teams win championships.

by tharr on Feb 27, 2007 10:45 PM CST up reply actions

Steroids, I don't know

But supposedly, he tested positive last year for amphetamines.

by gjdow on Feb 27, 2007 11:46 PM CST up reply actions

To test positive...

... for steroids, you need to use them. It appears that what Bonds is using is Human Growth Hormones. MLB doesn't test for them, in part because there is no urine test for them. They are only detectable via a blood test. Further, athletes who use illegal substances are so far ahead of the sports leagues that even as MLB, for example, makes progress, so do the athletes. The substances being used now are so sophisticated.

DmL

by dmlichte on Feb 28, 2007 12:26 AM CST up reply actions

Exactly.

by gjdow on Feb 28, 2007 11:09 AM CST up reply actions

HAT sIZE

A friend of mine got a batting helmet from Sammy in 1993 handed to him after practice in Mesa.

It is the same size as the one that cracked when he got hit in the head in 03.

For Cub fans spring training combines the eternal hope of spring with the irrational belief in the impossible.

by kerrysotherwife on Feb 28, 2007 10:24 AM CST reply actions

Contracts

What I really cannot understand is why the owners haven't insisted on an addition to MLB's uniform contract saying that players who are found to have used steroids or HGH may be subject to having their contracts terminated. The Anaheim Angels very well may have signed a player who used illegal substances to boost his numbers, but after signing that big contract, may stop using them. If a player is awarded a big contract based on a faulty premise, which is that he is capable of archiving a certain level of play within the confines of the law, it would stand to reason that the team would have a right to terminate that contract.

DmL

by dmlichte on Feb 28, 2007 2:07 PM CST reply actions

I'm sure...

... the owners would LOVE to have such a clause, but I'd bet the MLBPA has fought them tooth & nail on it.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Feb 28, 2007 2:24 PM CST up reply actions

Voiding Contracts

That would be a great deal for the owners. They are making a killing off these guys while they are performing from ticket sales and concessions. If they are ever able to void these deals when guys get caught, I should be able to get a couple of Old Styles and a dog for a lot less jack.

by MHef08 @ Bleed Cubbie Blue on Feb 28, 2007 9:19 PM CST up reply actions

The dumbest thing of all

The dumbest thing of all is all the players we suspect we darn good players before they started taking steroids if they did.

Not all Hall of Famers but not benchwarmers either.

Sammy was a 35 homer 270 average guy for example.

For Cub fans spring training combines the eternal hope of spring with the irrational belief in the impossible.

by kerrysotherwife on Mar 1, 2007 10:11 AM CST reply actions

Matthews

Part of this depends on when (if) he started taking steroids and HGH, but he was not a very good major leaguer. Remember his stint with the Cubs? Fans wanted to know if he had compromising pictures of Don Baylor and Andy MacPhail that allowed him to remain on the major league roster. Matthews was not very good and he may be an example of a player who performance enhancers turned into a quality player.

DmL

by dmlichte on Mar 1, 2007 11:27 AM CST up reply actions

This could be interesting

Right now a test will only show is if a player has taken steroids in the last 6 months.

So let's say Sammy passes a test tomorrow. Doesn't mean he didn't take them 4 years ago. He's just off them now.

But there's talk a new test will be able to tell if someone has in the past 10 years.

If that does come out every player should go and take it.

I feel bad for any of the accused players if they are innocent. They have no way of proving it.

For Cub fans spring training combines the eternal hope of spring with the irrational belief in the impossible.

by kerrysotherwife on Mar 1, 2007 10:13 AM CST reply actions

Its not steroids

its Human Growth Hormones. This is what, it is suspected, that players are using these days. This is what Bonds is suspected of using. There is no test that MLB has for it as HGH can only be detected via a blood test and MLB is not allowed to do that. Sosa, Bonds, Gary Matthews, even folks like Ryan Howard or Aramis Ramirez may be using HGH as we speak. It is illegal but NO current test that MLB is allowed to use detects HGH.

DmL

by dmlichte on Mar 1, 2007 11:30 AM CST up reply actions