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A Priori, and Open Thread: Cubs vs. White Sox at Tucson, Friday 3/16, 3:05 CT

MESA, Arizona -- It wasn't so very long ago -- about three and a half years -- that Mark Prior stood on the mound at Wrigley Field, about to be the hero as the Cubs were five damned outs away from the Promised Land.

Well, we all know what happened then. No need to belabor it, but this morning in Mesa, Arizona, many miles, many years, and much water under the bridge from that October day, Mark Prior stood on a mound at Fitch Park in front of about fifty fans and reporters and Cubs brass, trying to figure out what went wrong, bringing him to the point at which his career might hinge.

I'm here to tell you it's unhinged. Prior threw four innings, fifty-nine pitches (only a little more than half of them, thirty-two, were strikes). He walked two, hit a batter, was constantly behind hitters, gave up two hits and no runs to a team consisting of players who will wind up spending this year playing for Tennessee and Daytona (some names I recognized: Dopirak, Fontenot, Spears, Simokaitis). The outs were hit fairly hard, and it was just not very impressive. There weren't any scouts with radar guns -- just one of the Cubs' minor leaguers behind the plate with one. I was able to see it while Jason Marquis (who was the opposing pitcher; he went today in this game because the Cubs wanted Angel Guzman to face the White Sox) was on the mound; Marquis was consistently at 90.

But while Prior was throwing, this player (who I couldn't identify; he was wearing warmups) hid the gun so no one but him could see it. It didn't matter. It was easy to see that Marquis' fastball was popping into the catcher's glove; Prior's wasn't. Prior seemed to be dropping down his arm again -- that's a sign of something wrong, even though he and everyone else denies it.

But most importantly, the guy who used to look like he was on top of the baseball world had absolutely no mound presence. Constantly wiping his face (it wasn't that hot at 8:30 in the morning!), scuffling around, he looked as if he'd rather have been just about anywhere else in the world than on that pitcher's mound.

Do I think he's done? No, but he is absolutely not ready to pitch in the major leagues at this time. I doubt he'll see the Ho Ho Kam Park mound again this spring; likely, he'll be placed on the DL (they'll either have to invent an injury, if he's healthy, or own up to one, if he's not) and keep him at extended spring training, and then they'll have to make a decision, to either get him to Iowa to throw, or let him go. And given the money and the time invested in Prior by the Cubs, I think they will go a very long time before they will simply release him -- whether that's the right call or not.

It's a shame. Here's a guy who was called "the greatest college pitcher ever", compared to Tom Seaver, and dominant in the National League in his first full season in 2003. Now he's barely hanging on to his baseball life.

You'll like this. I was talking to Bruce Miles while we were watching Prior throw, and I casually mentioned, without making an accusation, the difference in the size of Prior's calves (remember "Calfzilla"?) when he first came up, compared to now -- they look almost sticklike. Guess who, standing right next to me, rolled her eyes and said, "Oh, come on!"?? That's right, Carrie Muskat. Draw your own conclusions.

After four innings (Marquis threw five, and looked very sharp -- 68 pitches, 45 strikes, and had hitters beating the ball into the ground), Prior had a brief conference with Larry Rothschild, who then looked up at the "guard tower" that's in the middle of the four fields at Fitch Park toward Jim Hendry, who yelled down, "I'll pick you up at Ho Ho at 10!" Yes, that's right -- he actually said "Ho Ho". In addition to Hendry, Oneri Fleita and John McDonough were up in the tower watching Prior.

So that's what I saw this morning. This afternoon, I have the choice of sitting by the pool or sitting inside watching the game... hmmmm.... well, I think I will try to catch at least a bit of Angel Guzman's outing. It does appear that Guzman's the front-runner for the fifth rotation spot, especially if he does well today.

Finally, I learned today that my friend Kevin Ciarrachi, trying to make Double-A as a backup catcher, was released by the Cubs, likely ending his professional baseball career. That's a shame too, because I know how hard Kevin has worked trying to rehab injuries and make a baseball career for himself. I wish him all the best.

For today's game, there's TV on WGN and also MLB.TV via the MLB Mediacenter. And as always, there's MLB.com Gameday.

Discuss amongst yourselves. Finally, here are some photos I took of Prior and Marquis this morning:

(as always, click on thumbnail to view full-size in new browser window. If you are using IE, you may have to click the lower-right corner of the image in the new window to expand it to its full size; in Firefox click anywhere on the image. Photos by Al)

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What can you
say after that? Done? No, but one foot in the grave, yes. Thanks for the report Al, have fun by the pool!!
I'm a bleedcubbiebluer!

by mrcubsfan on Mar 16, 2007 1:34 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Calfzilla!
From your pictures, he totally looks stick-like.  I'm not sure if it's because he's wearing his pants down to his ankles and not the high-blue socks making this an optical illusion, but "stick-like" sounds about right.

It's all a shame, really.

So did Carrie have anything else to say?

by MikeJ on Mar 16, 2007 1:34 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Nope.
She just stood taking notes along with the other reporters -- then they all left, including Bruce, to speak to Prior afterwards. Us peons were not invited.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I anxiously await...
...her rose-colored recap.

Not to read another person's thoughts, but I suspect her reaction to your remark is because of the whole PED issue.  In other words, she might have thought you were implying that he's stick-like after giving up the roids.

Not that you were implying that, but the next person who whispered "steroids" around Mark Prior wouldn't be the first.

by MikeJ on Mar 16, 2007 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wasn't.
I was just making an observation that I think any one of you could also make, given the photos I posted here today.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Muskat's Article is up on MLB.com
And,yes, it's pretty rose-colored

by DTJchris on Mar 16, 2007 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

So...
 Did Carrie know who you were?

by Damen Jackson on Mar 16, 2007 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I didn't identify myself to her.
If I'd have had more time, I might have asked Bruce Miles to introduce me. Maybe another time.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Watching him pitch earlier
this spring, I remember remarking that his calves still looked the same, so I'm not sure what to make of Al's observation today.  But boy, are we overanalyzing this or what?

by davidalanu on Mar 16, 2007 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think we are...
Rumors have floated around the guy for years now, and this mind boggling "reversal of fortune" the guy has endured (in the post steroid setting nonetheless)does nothing but strengthen any type of suspicion.

I for one am inclined to the cynical opinion. Doesn't mean I would bet on it but unfortunately my gut feeling leans towards big calfs.

GREAT SUCCESS!!!

by Chitown Mojo on Mar 16, 2007 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There's.......
plenty of explanations for why Prior's not the same as what he was.......injury and overuse probably causing the majority of it. Staring at his calves and drawing conclusions from how big or how small they look now is no different than blaming 98 years of futility on a damn goat or Steve Bartman instead of horrible mismanagement.
RAMIREZ!! PRIOR!!

by PriorandAramisfan23 on Mar 16, 2007 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Uh...
...seeing as you use leg muscles to deliver velocity to your pitches, noting that they lack muscle mass... doesn't that, um, help explain his lack of velocity? Regardless of how it came about?

by cwyers on Mar 16, 2007 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thank you
You've made my head spin now fom all your damn logic
GREAT SUCCESS!!!

by Chitown Mojo on Mar 16, 2007 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wanted to respond intelligently to your post
until I read the last sentence.

I do not even know if I believe Prior took steroids, but during the moments when I do it certainly has nothing to do with the size of his calves.

GREAT SUCCESS!!!

by Chitown Mojo on Mar 16, 2007 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You're sort of right
 A pitchers legs are important to his velocity but not his strength of legs or muscles in calves, isn't the main factor in high velocity. How a pitcher pushes off is more important. Sure a pitcher with "big calve muscles" doesn't hurt but I can name you pitchers off the top of my head who don't have strong or "huge" calf muscles and throw mid 90's.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I never said
strength of legs was the main factor in high velocity. I didnt even say they mattered in anything. They do as you stated but I never mentionned it.

My point was that steroids rumor have floated around the guy for a while and his complete breakdown along  with alleged loss of muscles did nothing but strenghten those suspicions.

GREAT SUCCESS!!!

by Chitown Mojo on Mar 16, 2007 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's alright, no biggie...
Just cut down on all the Barney watching.
GREAT SUCCESS!!!

by Chitown Mojo on Mar 16, 2007 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Actually as it turns out....
....my comment was directed towards cwyers and not you.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

My comment still stands...
No Barney watching!
GREAT SUCCESS!!!

by Chitown Mojo on Mar 16, 2007 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I want to throw up...
...seriously, how depressing is this?  I thought Prior - he of the impeccable fundamentals, developed college arm and body, huge calves, and intimidating nature - was going to be the ONE for the Cubs.  

And now this - struggling against minor leaguers on a practice field early in spring training.

It's almost funny in a "there goes the Cubs" way, if it wasn't so damn tragic.

by Chadnudj on Mar 16, 2007 1:45 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I have a picture......
from his start against the Mariners and his calves still look pretty big, but he was wearing the high socks. His calves never look big in the gray pants.

I don't see what's such a shame about all this, this is what happens when you overuse young pitchers.....they break down. Hendry hired just about the worst manager that he could have to nuture young pitching and now he has to deal with the mess that Baker made. Listening to what Hendry's saying about Samardzija he seems to me like someone who just doesn't learn from the bad mistakes he's made. I'll be happy when Hendry's gone.

RAMIREZ!! PRIOR!!

by PriorandAramisfan23 on Mar 16, 2007 1:45 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I disagree.
As you know, J, Prior was dominant in 2005 before getting hit by the line drive.  After that, his control fell apart, his fastball wasn't as fast as it once was and he was walking people, throwing wild pitches, consistently behind in the count and it led to 2006 and now to this.  The abuse he took under Baker may certainly have had an impact of some kind, but it was the line drive that had far more impact than the abuse.  

No matter what though, Prior is going to be used as an example for the pitch count crowd as they've already been doing for years.  

by Maddog on Mar 16, 2007 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There's no doubt in my mind......
that the line drive played a big part in this, and I was probably one of the few people who thought it was extremely stupid to bring him back after that happened. The team was going nowhere and I personally didn't see the need for it, but someone in the organization did. Dustbrain has his part to play in this, I don't think his penchant for riding SP can be overlooked.  I recall a situation about 3 or 4 starts after he came back against the Braves and Dustbrain left him in for 138 pitches. I remember that because I threw my remote against the fireplace in my living room thinking to myself, "This man can't possibly be that stupid" but 180 games later 90 of which featuring Neifi in the 2 hole and my question was answered for me.

The only thing I can look at is how other teams are handling their young SP........Phil Hughes, Homer Bailey, Tim Lincecum, Felix Hernandez.......for as good as those guys are and how much better they would make their respective teams.....I don't see any of those teams chomping at the bit to throw those guys 200 innings the way the Cubs did with Prior. At least not before they gradually worked them into it.

I don't think its out of the realm of possibility to look at an organization that's continually made the wrong choices for 98 years and consider this to be something to add to the list. The track record is there.

RAMIREZ!! PRIOR!!

by PriorandAramisfan23 on Mar 16, 2007 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think it's unreasonable either.
But I think it's unreasonable to consider it a major factor in his downfall.  It's been 4 years since Prior came into the league and all the pitchers you've mentioned have, or are just coming into the league.  A lot of things have been learned since 2003.  The Twins took it easy with their young ace and he got injured.  Pitchers and injuries are two things are inevitably linked together and sometimes it's hard to accept it.  It's precisely why teams don't tend to give out contracts to pitchers longer than 4 years.  It's why some have adopted the philosophy that there is no such thing as a pitching prospect (TNSTAAPP).  Pitchers prior to the age of 25 are twice as prone to injury as someone older than 25.  

No matter what a team does to prevent these injuries, they're going to happen.  

Prior coming back so quickly after that line drive was mostly his decision.  He's the one who pushed it to get back so soon.  The Cubs are certainly responsible for some of this, but so is Mark Prior and so is dumb luck.  

by Maddog on Mar 16, 2007 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree
with you, Maddog. The way Baker used Prior in 2003 was no different than managers have used young pitchers for a century.

I would guess the elbow injury plays a big role. Maybe Prior is pitching in fear - fear of being hit by another liner. Couldn't that affect a pitcher's psyche just the way a batter can lose his ability after being hit in the head?

"Hello again, everybody. Harry Caray from Wrigley Field on a beautiful day for baseball."

by danimal15 on Mar 16, 2007 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You may be on to something here.
I never thought of that, but that would explain a lot.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I've thought about that too...
Look at Adam Greenberg's case, destined to superstardom and bam! We also know that Sosa's downfall was due to Salomon Torres and only to him.

But seriously, it is more than just a possibility.

GREAT SUCCESS!!!

by Chitown Mojo on Mar 16, 2007 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not to get statistical on you...
...but correlation does not indicate causation.

In other words, just because he fell apart following that line-drive does NOT NECESSARILY mean that the line-drive caused the damage or had more impact.

I really have to think the abuse under Baker is more to blame.  Remember, Prior came back relatively quickly after that line-drive, and I disagree that he was dominant before the line drive....

by Chadnudj on Mar 16, 2007 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

True.
As for whether or not he was dominant, check out the stats for April and May, 2005.  

As for what may have been the biggest impact, I don't know, but I know when the problems that we're seeing now started.  Sure, maybe it started at that point and is just coincidental, but the major reason for it is abuse.  Maybe he threw out his arm in college and it just became a problem.  I have no idea.  

by Maddog on Mar 16, 2007 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow ..
I mean it just seems like yesterday Prior-Wood-Zambrano were gonna be the top 3 pitchers not only in the NL but of this generation. Now, Prior looks as if that he may be hiding something, Wood is in the bullpen and is a huge question mark to say completely healthy, and Zambrano, our horse, is the only one left standing.

I truly believe it's time to move on. I loved Prior... but I really think it's SOMETHING wrong with him. Something that he is not willing to admit. It's time to develop Donald Veal and maybe he will be the dominate force that we thought Prior would be.

"Losing is my only fear"

by Unique on Mar 16, 2007 1:49 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Al
this is a hateful post and i hate you for posting it.

But thanks for the info. Maybe we know who Muskrat is here on BCB : )

"Just say Smith or Jones again, it dont matter, none of this matters"

by ksucubbie on Mar 16, 2007 1:54 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Don't hate the playa
Hate the game.....

by LT on Mar 16, 2007 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LMAO
Thanks, ksucubbie, for lightening up the atmosphere! :)
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Prior
is done..Just trade him for whatever..Im sick of hearing the drama of mark prior every other day..He can be sumones elses problem.He will never be close to what he was

by PrimeTime on Mar 16, 2007 2:16 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Wow. That was blunt.
I hope you're never my doctor!

by Hobbes on Mar 16, 2007 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks, Al...
...for the on-the-spot reportage and the pics. FWIW, I think Prior's calves do look smaller in those pics than they have in the past.

Is this the beginning of the end for Mark Prior? Probably. With each successive failure (and I'd define today's outing as a failure), it becomes less and less likely that he'll ever resurface as the great pitcher we saw in '03. Is it possible he might? Yeah, it's possible. And I'm a Cubs fan, so I hope that possibility comes to fruition. But I doubt it ever will.

I don't think the Cubs should release him either. They should give him every opportunity to succeed. But I fear the end is drawing near. Simply put, if Prior could pitch well, he would. And he's not.

The only immediate bright side I see here is at least we're learning of Prior's inability to pitch competitively now -- on March 16 -- instead of April or May 16, when damage would have surely been done to the Cubs regular season.

I didn't have the ball, bitch!

by dat cubfan daver on Mar 16, 2007 2:25 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Interesting spin for a guy who went
4IP with 0 ER, 2H and 2BB.  Your post Al makes it sound like he had nothing but the results weren't all that bad on the surface.  Did he strike any of the batters out?  

Clearly he is not the power pitcher he once was but that doesn't mean he can't improve.  Little to early to give up on this guy.  The lack of control is not surprising given how little he has pitched the last 2 years.  

by CA Cub Fan on Mar 16, 2007 2:52 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I think what Al...
meant to say is he is not ready to face major league pitching, not that he is wrong, because he did not have it today.

Let's send him to Iowa, and see what he has left.

"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Mar 16, 2007 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Right.
There was one strikeout. But remember, these are high-A and double-A hitters he was facing. Major league hitters would have laid off a lot of the pitches that these guys swung at -- that would have forced Prior to throw more pitches, and as he was out of the zone about half the time, that would have let a lot of stuff UP in the zone, which is what was happening in his major league starts.

All today proved is that he can get minor league hitters out -- about half the time.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You're still reachin Al
I am not all that hopeful for Mark, but the picture you pain to me doesn't check with the stats. If you asked me before he pitched today, what to expect I think I would've hoped for this kind of outing. Granted his pitch count might've been high. But c'mon. Were you expecting him to have 0H. Even Z could've gone out there and given up a couple of hits. And we all know he would've walked 1 or 2. If anything today, I am slightly encouraged. I can't believe there are only a couple of us who saw the disparity of the line and analysis.
"You know what? You want a job? Go out and earn one." Sweet Lou

by Kyle Turney on Mar 16, 2007 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There is a difference...
... between facing the sort of hitters Prior faced today and facing major league hitters.

The difference can clearly be seen in how Jason Marquis, who pitched for the "other side" in this game, against the same type of hitters, fared.

Marquis consistently got ground balls, threw strikes (45 of 68 pitches), was ahead of hitters. Prior wasn't. In a game against hitters of this caliber, you can get away with pitching from behind. Against major league hitters, you can't.

It really is as simple as that.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What was Marquis line?
n/t
"You know what? You want a job? Go out and earn one." Sweet Lou

by Kyle Turney on Mar 16, 2007 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

A few names to consider
What do these three players have in common:
  1. Don Gullett - Made the big leagues at 19, was 15-4 in only 22 starts at age 24
  2. Mark Fidrych - 19-9 the year before at age 21 with 24 CG in 29 starts. 6-4 in 1977 before getting hurt
  3. Mike Norris - 22-9 w/24 CG at age 25
All three were out of baseball three years later due to injuries. (Well, excluding Norris' comeback at age 35 for 14 games of relief...)

Sports medicine and pitching strategy has come a long way since then, but is it possible that Prior's injury puts him in their category?

Absolutely.  It's just been so rare, and it's our team for once.  Are we feeling any different then say Tigers fans in 1980??   The 1980 A's staff which Norris fronted was the poster child for pitcher abuse.  The warning signs were there with Dusty.  

I think that he could have overcome basic pitcher abuse, but not the combination of abuse AND consecutive fluke injuries.

I may be wrong here, but I think Prior has the physical potential to retool his game at Iowa for 30 starts and become a good #4 starter with a different kind of game.  But, I seriously doubt that somebody as primped and coddled as Mark Prior wants to go through that much effort for what he may consider a lowly reward.

by Invalid User on Mar 16, 2007 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Can't give up quite yet
Despite this trusted, eyewitness report I hold onto hope that with some more time in minors or rehab he might come back to some semblance of what he once was...

The Cubs were smart to build a team and a pitching staff that did not depend on either MP or K. Wood (see his latest "setback'' yesterday or today, termed minor). Whether it's good enough to win a division or make playoffs remains to be seen; I personally don't see them as a powerhouse without at least one performing up to, or close to, his old ability. It is very sad to see and tough to absorb, like Len Bias' death on the Celtics, Prior is dying right before our eyes as a dominant pitcher.

Still, I did not and still do not agree with the Mariotti "stir up controversy'' take on Prior to rid themselves of this guy once and for all and move on...no value, and could come back to bite us big time even this year, depending.

Does not make sense that he's "healthy'' and struggling this badly.

But we'll never know the "real story'' on Prior until, when, if, he leaves Cubdom...then it may seep out. Whatever "it'' is.

Will be checking to get Carrie M's take on the outing as well as others...how much glossing over can you do?? Sully in Trib. has been pretty hard hitting about it.

by writerinwrigley on Mar 16, 2007 3:02 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Damn
That's depressing.

BTW, Ron Cey walked right by me fleeing from the rain at the Red Sox-Dodgers game this afternoon.  Matsuzaka looked variably shaky to OK, but deifnitely not worth the money at this point unless he is just working on stuff.

¡BLANCO!

by 08Cubs on Mar 16, 2007 3:04 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

For those of use stuck at work...
can someone let me know how Guzman looks?  If he can live up to his billing, that would make the Prior sting less painful.

by madtown on Mar 16, 2007 3:19 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

re: For those of use stuck at work...
Yeah, if anyone happens to be watching the game on WGN and wouldn't mind giving us periodic updates, that'd be great. I'm stuck at work, too!
I didn't have the ball, bitch!

by dat cubfan daver on Mar 16, 2007 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I came in from the pool...
... to watch Guzman for a while. So far, so good ... one hit, Blanco threw him out trying to steal, and the other outs were routine. Good velocity and location so far.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yep,
spudnik hit one sharply past theriot at third but after that guzman was rather filthy good.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I would but my computer is in a different room
funny the schedule on cubs.com doesn't say it's on WGN like the rest of the games, but it is.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

HR MURTON!
2-0 Cubs.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:25 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

1-0 I think
they're not showing the replay either. talking to kenny williams instead.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry -- that was a typo.
It is 1-0.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

1-0 Cubs
go back to the pool Al :)

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Unless that bad boy is heated
than stay in the room and crank up the AC!!

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He hates the cubs
that's why he's sitting at the pool drinking 20 beers watching barney on a portable tv.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

re: He hates the cubs
And don't forget the f word. He's using it constantly.
I didn't have the ball, bitch!

by dat cubfan daver on Mar 16, 2007 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

hawk sez..
"here comes johnnny bench" when hank white came up. he plays like it against the sox, so sez hawk

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:29 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Hawk...
Is being quite complimentary on our Blue guys.

Believes that Sori is the best player they've gotten in years, and 2., believes the team will win the NL Central.

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 3:30 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

soriano makes questionable throw to third
on a mackowiak single, allowing mackowiak to advance.

by Short4Fanatic on Mar 16, 2007 3:37 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Pie, right?
n/t
"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Mar 16, 2007 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ugh.
Floyd's awful in the outfield. Wish we had the DH in the NL.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:38 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Bite Your Tongue!
I can't believe you said that. There would be no more baseball if that happened.
Besides the obvious - Go Irish.

Z. He doesn't need an exclamtion point. He is one.

by PopeFlick on Mar 16, 2007 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know about no baseball...
but I wouldn't like that.  I mean it's OK if the AL has one, but both leagues would be too much for me.
"I don't talk. I just let what I do talk for myself." -Johan Santana

by sparkles721 on Mar 16, 2007 10:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ugh, cliff floyd looking ugly in left
lets a ball get by him.  two runners score.

by Short4Fanatic on Mar 16, 2007 3:39 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Yeah,
I think Murton's job is safe.
"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Mar 16, 2007 3:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ugly, horrid, Left Fielding by Cliff...
WHAT A FIELDING HACK!

CLIFF FLOYD!!!  Horribly mis-played a single hit to left - turned into a "triple."

Just waved at the ball...and then lightly jogs back to the wall...

Ughh!!!!

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

looks like
he got an in-between hop. couldn't decide. poor cliff. he'll have to hit like 2005 to justify putting him out there half the time. It was just one ball though.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Unfortunately,
it is his reputation. I can see why, based on "the one ball".
Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i know it's his rep

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

2-1Sox
5 hopper up the middle advances man to third and hitter advances to 2nd on a terrible decision by Pie to throw to 3rd.

Guzman up 0-2 in the count and hangs a curve over the middle of the plate, Iguchi lines it to LF and Floyd plays a single into a triple. Guzman not getting any help by Cubs Defense so far.

THrowing 94-95 with some really nice hooks. He should be the Cubs 5th starter, just from what I've seen so far.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 3:41 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Thanks!
I hope the not getting help from defense isn't a theme this year again.

by madtown on Mar 16, 2007 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Guzman is not yet...
ready to assume the 5th starters role.

I predict it will be Miller.

These guys HAVE to learn how to finish off hitters and innings.

As I've said before, Roberto Novoa is great at getting two strikes or two outs. YA GOTTA FINISH THE DEAL, BABY!

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 3:44 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

That wasn't all Guzman's fault...
... better play in the OF might have helped Guzman quite a bit.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not watching
But it sounds to me from the comments that those runs were more the fault of poor fielding that poor pitching by Guzman, even if they weren't errors and will still be charged to him.

by SuperContext on Mar 16, 2007 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree..
 but you also have to learn how to finish the deal. I think he deserves the opportunity to. His upside is obviously much better than Millers.

                           

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly.
n/t
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Uh...
...how, exactly, was he supposed to make Cliff Floyd get to the ball?

Spring training is about process, not results. If Angel Guzman is doing his job, locating his pitches well, and doing what he's supposed to do, that's what matters. Luck will start to even out with larger sample sizes.

by cwyers on Mar 16, 2007 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Grudgingly
I agree.

But it is time to learn how to finish the deal.

He went 0-7 in '06 and couldn't find a way.

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 4:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Guzman around the plate constantly
good stuff save for a couple pitches to crede and iguchi. he did walk the last batter though after he fouled off a bunch.

spudnik tries to bunt his way on. guz gets over quickly to end the inning. 2-1 after one.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:47 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

quick inning for cub hitters
thanks in part to a nice play by spudnik in LF.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 3:56 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Guzman
looked good the few batters I watched him. Nice zip on his fastball (one was clocked at 96), and around the plate a lot.
"Hello again, everybody. Harry Caray from Wrigley Field on a beautiful day for baseball."

by danimal15 on Mar 16, 2007 3:58 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Sox broadcast
How many times can the TV camera zero in on Ozzie Guillen watching the game? He's not that interesting! Show me the game, instead.
"Hello again, everybody. Harry Caray from Wrigley Field on a beautiful day for baseball."

by danimal15 on Mar 16, 2007 3:59 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

guzman
looks sharp to me
"Just say Smith or Jones again, it dont matter, none of this matters"

by ksucubbie on Mar 16, 2007 4:00 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

another good inning by guz
his strike/ball ratio must be ridiculous. a beautiful sign.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:02 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Between Gameday for Cubs-Sox
Streaming NCAA tournament games, and trying to do actual work, I'm thoroughly confused.  

But Go Cubs, Go T-A&M-CC, and Go Creighton (in that order)

by SuperContext on Mar 16, 2007 4:03 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I think Gameday's broken.
It just said that Ronny Cedeno took a ball with a runner at third and two outs. Clearly THAT'S never going to happen.

by cwyers on Mar 16, 2007 4:11 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

It also placed the ball in the strike zone
And said Cedeno singled to tie the game - what gives?

by SuperContext on Mar 16, 2007 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know...
...if the strike tracker is fully operational yet. Gameday seems to be operating in fits and starts.

by cwyers on Mar 16, 2007 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

hey, thanks ronny
bloop single to RF scores JJ, who singled, stole 2nd and went to 3rd on the bad throw on the steal. 2-2. Murton K'd between that.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:12 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Marquis today
Al-What was Marquis stats today?
"You know what? You want a job? Go out and earn one." Sweet Lou

by Kyle Turney on Mar 16, 2007 4:16 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I'd say maybe Wade Miller is now the front runner?
Looks like Guzman pitched pretty well, but that last 1/3 inning wasn't so hot.  

by SuperContext on Mar 16, 2007 4:29 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

re: I'd say maybe Wade Miller is now the front run
D'oh! Looks like the Sox scored two runs. What happened exactly?
I didn't have the ball, bitch!

by dat cubfan daver on Mar 16, 2007 4:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The defense has let him down a couple of times
but for the most part Gooz has looked very good today.

by VS on Mar 16, 2007 4:29 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Yeah...
Our Defense has NOT looked good at all this spring. Seeing as most good teams win by pitching and defense, I am getting very concerned about this team.
"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Mar 16, 2007 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with previous Guzman comments
he's throwing a LOT of strikes, but he's not finishing off hitters. He's keeping the ball down and always around the plate, but I've yet to see him go up in the zone to put somebody away. I don't think I've seen it once. he's had 0-2, 1-2, several times but he keeps pounding the zone. maybe he's just concentrating on strikes in ST, but with a 95 fastball, heaters up in the zone is a must.

hitters were fouling off pitch after pitch today so his pitch count was getting up there even though he wasn't that wild except for the pitch he hit Iguchi with.

He's out now. Ryan O'Mally in.

sac fly to Pie, who had trouble with the sun. now 5-2 sox. 2 outs.

FO to JJ. inning over.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:30 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

also..
he did hang his curve several times

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

"several" times?
 Hmm I didn't see the several times you're referring to. His curve had good bite, except for the one he hung to Iguchi.

Anyway, he had some positives he can build on.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 4:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

he hung at least 3 to uribe
shortly before he was pulled, and a few others. He did have nice bite on most of them, and could throw them in any count, which was a good sign too.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It doesn't make sense
If Guz is throwing 97, why isn't he missing any bats? No K's today is very telling.
Players win awards but teams win championships.

by tharr on Mar 16, 2007 4:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

definately pitching to contact
like i said, he may just be working on pitching strikes so far, but yeah, with that heater he could be blowing hitters away.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 5:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wasn't bad, wasn't great...
...His curve looked very good and was around the zone the whole game, hitting 95 consistently. Looks like he ran out of gas at the end but by no means put himself out of the race for the 5th spot.

Like many said, his Defense didn't do him too many favors and for the most part, wasn't hit too hard.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 4:37 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

single by Lee 5-3
after theriot singles and advances to 2nd on wild pitch

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:39 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Sounds like to me...
...like this wasn't quite the "puzzle solver" many of us had hoped for in terms of the starting rotation. I still see Miller as the frontrunner as Guzman seems to need just a little more time to prove he can get guys out consistently.

I agree, though, that the defense is worrisome.

I didn't have the ball, bitch!

by dat cubfan daver on Mar 16, 2007 4:43 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I don't think this game
was supposed to solve anything yet. still 2 weeks of ST left, and even then, no harm in letting miller start the season on he 25, then let guzman come up a bit later. They're 2 different pitchers, but equally effective at this point, with guzman having the better upside.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

_exactly_
N/T

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Carry Muskat
seems to have been watching a different game from you Al.

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070316&content_id=1845947&vkey=spt2007new s&fext=.jsp&c_id=chc

She only saw 1 hit and had 68 pitches(45 strikes). Also had Marquis at 86 pitches through 5 innings. Looks like they were both at about the same pace. I expected it to be puffed but the number disparity is alot. Not sure who to believe, but I know who I'd rather believe.

"You know what? You want a job? Go out and earn one." Sweet Lou

by Kyle Turney on Mar 16, 2007 4:44 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Those pitch counts...
... aren't what Bruce Miles gave me. The 68/45 count was Marquis' count..

Guess I should have kept track myself. But given the game I saw, there's no way Marquis threw more pitches than Prior, and certainly not 18 more.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 5:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

oh dear
stick a fork in him. NOT

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gameday seems to think....
...that Guzman is issuing four-pitch walks to Thome and Konerko. You guys seem to think that O'Malley replaced Guzman. Help?

by cwyers on Mar 16, 2007 4:50 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

O' Malley was in
but is being lifted. I didn't see who's comin in.
"You know what? You want a job? Go out and earn one." Sweet Lou

by Kyle Turney on Mar 16, 2007 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

O'Malley got *LIT*
Up. Piniella didn't even waste any energy pulling O'malley as Larry did the honors.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

O'Malley
O'Malley's pitching. Actually, he just got pulled (roughed up pretty bad)--Rocky Cherry now.
We love no other, so let our motto be: Victory Illinois Varsity!

by NightPutting on Mar 16, 2007 4:51 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Sidenote
as an aside, it's a shame to see O'Malley not up to the caliber of pitching he had in 2006. That was my favorite story of last year next to Barrett's slam against the Cards.
We love no other, so let our motto be: Victory Illinois Varsity!

by NightPutting on Mar 16, 2007 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That was the...
.... only good story of last year.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I dunno...
...Rich Hill's second half was a pretty good story at the time.

by cwyers on Mar 16, 2007 4:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't forget
Rich Hill's shutout and Barrett's decking Pierzynski.
"Hello again, everybody. Harry Caray from Wrigley Field on a beautiful day for baseball."

by danimal15 on Mar 16, 2007 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who's pitching for the Cubs?
Gameday says it is still Guzman???

by SuperContext on Mar 16, 2007 4:51 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

was o'malley who gave up the walks and hit
now cherry coming in bases juiced. 1 out

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The only thing
more painful than the Cubs losing to the Sux is the incessant homerism and promotion and inane chatter on the Sux telecast.  There isn't even a WGN radio broadcast so I'm relegated to watching it with the sound off.

by Clark Addison on Mar 16, 2007 4:52 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

ouch
I'm not regretting missing out on the telecast now.

by SuperContext on Mar 16, 2007 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

second that
the vp of marketing idiot was just waxing poetic about the "ambience" of US Cellular. "It doesn't even matter who wins the game"....sounds like someone's really trying to sell tickets. We'd be more than happy to take the Cubs' series down there if they didn't sell them in season ticket packages.
We love no other, so let our motto be: Victory Illinois Varsity!

by NightPutting on Mar 16, 2007 4:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sickening
US Cellular has all the "ambience" of a funeral parlor.
"Hello again, everybody. Harry Caray from Wrigley Field on a beautiful day for baseball."

by danimal15 on Mar 16, 2007 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LOL!
"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Mar 16, 2007 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

nice play by derosa getting force at 2nd
run scores. 2 outs. 6-3 now

first time i've seen cherry

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:57 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

nice play by derosa getting force at 2nd
run scores. 2 outs. 6-3 now

first time i've seen cherry

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 4:58 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

O"Malley that bad? & Floyd in LF
Game day or online boxscore at Cubs.com omits him entirely, goes straight from Guzman to Cherry...oh well, guess he needs more work to regain form of last year.

I'd rather lose to Sox now; we're resting a lot of big bats today anyway...unsure why Floyd is in left and Murton DH...guess they gotta see what Cliff can do in field...worries me and probably why they need to keep Pagan; lift Floyd after 6-7 innings tops when he plays for "defensive replacement.''

by writerinwrigley on Mar 16, 2007 4:59 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

JJ and Murt groundout. 2 outs

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 5:01 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

At this point in ST...
The talent in the head-to-head games shine on the South Side.

Somehow, we have a hard time beating these guys.

It will be interesting to see how this will pan out in the regular season.

The Sox are a very talented, stacked team, it pains me to say.

I'd love top have Uribe and Iguchi as opposed to our mediocrity.

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 5:06 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Uribe???

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 5:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

World Series, 2005? See it? 9th inning?
Uh, did you happen to watch ANY of game 6?

YES. URIBE.

Are you watching our "hopefuls" today? Coates and Thierot? And, Cliff Floyd?

IF you are not watching it with your own eyes, you are avoiding depression. IF this team continues giving 4 and 5 outs an innings to teams, it will make the difference in them being "in it" or gone.

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 5:15 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

oh boy
which game 6? the sox swept the series in 4, and I don't watch them any other time. Yes I know the final play. I saw all 4 games of the 2005 series.

Uribe is less than a mediocre player. look it up, and learn how the spell our player's names.

Yes our defense is not great. Our pitching and offense will have to do it this year. I'm not one of the optimists predicting 90 wins.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 5:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Neither am I.
n/t
"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Mar 16, 2007 5:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You knew what I meant
Yir-ee-bay.

And indeed it was four games, sealed with outstanding play at the shortstop position. But you'd rather have Ronny Cedeno or "Gold Glove" Izturis?

Look THAT up.

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 5:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i've looked them up
of course. i know their numbers. would I rather have better? duh. uribe is still toward the bottom of all-around shortstops.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 5:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well "the bottom"..
Has a World Series ring, and was HUGE when the games counted, on the biggest stage. That's all most people need to know while you look up meaningless stats. And, he plays for a former Gold Glove player who knew a few things about playing the Shortstop position. Squirt some milk on that.
Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Reply

and was HUGE when the games counted, on the biggest stage.

What? He hit .250/.368/.438 with 2 RBI in the World Series.  Not exacly setting the world on fire.  

by VS on Mar 17, 2007 2:49 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

How I view Uribe...
As a Sox fan, this is how I view Uribe, just from my observations...

Limited range
Strong arm
Overall a good defensive player
Way over the top aggressive swinger

I watched Uribe "battle" Angel Guzman yesterday.  Guzman had Uribe down with 2 strikes.  Even though Guzman had the advantage with 2 strikes and no balls, Guzman did not take advantage of the wild swinger and Guzman kept nibbling around the plate.  IIRC Uribe ended up with a hit.  Knowing Uribe, I wondered why Guzman did not toss high/hard fastball, say over Uribe's head but over the plate.  No, just nibble, nibble.

by DrCrawdad on Mar 17, 2007 8:13 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Al,
if you're in the park, please go over and smack the air raid siren right now. he's coming over wgn agonizingly loud and clear.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 5:28 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Just came in from the pool...
... to hear the human air raid siren's noise in the background.

Who on Earth transported that idiot to Tucson? Could we get whoever that is to LEAVE HIM THERE?

Or maybe the Sox fans will take care of him. Ugh.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 5:28 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Woo-Woo
sits right by the main location sound guy! How does a virtually homeless guy get to winter in Arizona?
Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Years ago...
... Mark Grace used to pay his way. I think now, some of the morning disk jockeys who think he's funny do it.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 5:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ohhhhh...
I NEVER knew that, Al.

Do you think he will succumb to permanent throat silence ever?

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gosh, I sure hope so.
The sooner the better.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re
Why don't a bunch of you take him out one night, get him completely drunk, and then put him on a plane to nowhere Kansas.  By the time he figures out what to do, ST will be over.

by Jed Taylor on Mar 17, 2007 6:52 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well...
maybe people should stop paying for him and pay for my trip.

Maybe after Woo Woo dies I can take his place and get all this free stuff.  It seems like an awesome job.  He gets so much for doing basically nothing.

"I don't talk. I just let what I do talk for myself." -Johan Santana

by sparkles721 on Mar 16, 2007 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re
Uh, Sparks, Ronnie WW is basically a whore.  He walks around Wrigley dressed up in a full Cubs uniform offering people the privilege of having their pictures taken with him for cash - last time I was solicited, it was $5.

Are you sure you want the job?

by Jed Taylor on Mar 17, 2007 6:49 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

woo woo boo boo
The one time I have been at spring training about three years ago, I was heading to the bathroom at Ho Ho Kam.  As I turned the corner to head from the stands into the concourse, I nearly steamrolled over the idiot.  It was only instinct which made me stop... if I had known it was him I'd have run him over and gotten free beer from most of the nearby seating section.

by Invalid User on Mar 16, 2007 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I saw Woo Woo..
 up at Sluggos yesterday and had a perfect opportunity to karate chop his adams apple, but wasn't drunk enough.

 People were taking pictures with him like he was some sort of celeberity. Why encourage him? He just walked around the bar waiting for someone to buy him a beer and inevitably someone always does.

 It is hot out here lately so we can hope heat exhaustion kicks sets in.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why does Woo draw
such scorn? It's having to listen to the Hawk that irritates me.

Christ, I give the guy credit for turning himself into a mascot before the concept even came about. You might say he was ahead of his time. He manifested celebrity without really trying to.
(In the current climate, that's a regular industry. But back then...)

Al, I'll respond for you. Stay by the pool and enjoy.

Al: "...and I wish he'd go back in time!!!"

Bada-bing!

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Mar 16, 2007 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Here's the difference...
... between the Hawk and he-who-shall-not-be-named.

You can turn off the TV when the Hawk is on, or mute the sound.

You can't do that with the other one.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh, you mean
Coatz? The minor leaguer?
Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 5:29 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

ESPN had a teaser on sportscenter just now
Asking is Prior done as a Cub.... They must hate him. New at 11....

by LT on Mar 16, 2007 5:44 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

This offseason...
There were some relatively big contracts given out to less-than-great pitchers. Why not spend a few million to see if Prior can regain his form this year? Seems like it's worth a try to me.

by vegascubsfan on Mar 16, 2007 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who does pay for Woo Woo? and how old is he anyway
Great mystery to me how he gets around to OT games esp. spring training...he had some folks raise money to fix his teeth a few years ago.

Nice guy but basically a nitwit...he adds to the bleacher experience (for some) but that sound might be annoying after a few hours (minutes?) if he gets too close and doesn't stop.

Either way the guy's a legend when was he first sighted out there? 60s?? I think I've seen him, definitely, since the 80s...his age, I'm guessing is around 60, maybe higher.

A friend of mine once talked to him in the 70s I'm thinking and at that point, he worked at the Y...

by writerinwrigley on Mar 16, 2007 5:46 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

He's 63.
I can remember hearing him during TV games as far back as the 1960's.

It wouldn't be so bad if he'd just stop when you asked him to. Several people yelled "shut up" at him yesterday -- he ignored them. See, that just shows that it's "all about him".

Which it isn't.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

bases clearing double
and we. are. tied.

by cashcowsquirtingsourmilk on Mar 16, 2007 5:59 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Jenks has nothing today.
n/t
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Mar 16, 2007 6:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Speaking of annoying...
....the "let's go cubbies" chant needs to die!

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 6:03 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

It sounds like...
five or six people.
Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You've obviously never been to a Cubs..
....road game during the regular season, where its 5 to 6 thousand drunken Cub fans, on a regular basis.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Quite a few empty seats...
and I do location audio for a living. There were NOT five or six THOUSAND fans chanting in the late innings TODAY, if that's what you were implying.

I have been a part of "the Chant" at places like Dodger Stadium, Atlanta, yadda yadda...

And NOT drunk.

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Did you even read my post?
Just curious.

by lemon17pie on Mar 16, 2007 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I've "obviously never been to A Cubs
Road Game"? That one?

Am I missing your point?

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Do you mean...
That the "weak showing" of the five or six people doing the "Chant", in comparison to what the "full-force" effect feels like on the road?

If THAT's what you meant, I get it now.

If not, then I missed the point.

The most vociferous "Chant" "let's go __" I have personally heard live has been by Red Sox fans AT WRIGLEY.

But they also sing, "Sweet Caroline".

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 6:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mc Gehee
Ties it - then does the bone-head.

Gets doubled off the bag.

Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 6:07 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

When are the NEXT CUTS?
Man - its time to get the "real" team together.
Cardinals make me see Red!

by TheEman on Mar 16, 2007 6:14 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Prior is just kind of there.
I still support him, and I hope he can fix himself.  I love him, and I've always wanted to see him pumping his fist again.  He's had so much bad luck.

Why was Marquis in the same game as Prior? Why did he pitch against minor leaguers?

"I don't talk. I just let what I do talk for myself." -Johan Santana

by sparkles721 on Mar 16, 2007 10:30 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I feel the
same way Sparkles and it is disheartening to see this happening.
Let's play ball!!

by sue369 on Mar 17, 2007 8:12 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Shortage of innings.
The Cubs had an off day, and as they start to stretch the starters out, they're running out of innings to give people. Rich Hill faced minor leaguers, too. Angel Guzman needed innings against real competition -- Marquis and Hill have been doing fine, they just needed innings to get stretched out further. Prior just... yeah.

by cwyers on Mar 17, 2007 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

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