Cubs Add Insult To Insult With Dreadful 10-3 Loss To Dodgers
Put away your dreams, everyone. It's over.
Last night's 10-3 Cubs loss to the Dodgers, which felt like the score was 100-3, was the most embarrassing postseason loss I have seen by any Cubs team, in fact possibly the most embarrassing postseason loss I've seen by ANY team.
Yes, I know. In fact, Manny Ramirez said it in the postgame press conference, which I listened to with little enthusiasm on the drive home: it takes three wins, not two, to win, and there have been seven five-game series in the history of MLB postseason play in which a team went down 2-0 and came back to win. They are:
- This 1981 "Division Series" between the Dodgers and Astros which was played because of the split season due to the strike. The format was 2-3 instead of 2-2-1 and the home team won all five games; the Dodgers shut out the Astros in game 5 to move on to the NLCS.
- The 1982 ALCS between the Angels and Brewers, played in the days when the LCS were five games. Again, a 2-3 split in which the home team won all five games.
- The 1984 NLCS. Nuff said.
- Moving on to the wild card era, this 1995 division series between the Yankees and Mariners. The split in '95 was still 2-3, and once again, the home team won all the games (the Yankees were the wild card).
- By 1999, the series was played in the format we now know: 2-2-1. The Red Sox came back and beat the Indians, losing the first two games at Cleveland, beating them 23-7 in game four at home and then winning game five on the road.
- The Yankees lost the first two games at home in their 2001 division series against the A's, took two games in Oakland including the famous play in game four in which Derek Jeter's relay cut down Jeremy Giambi, who was trying to score standing up.
- And, this 2003 ALDS between the A's and Red Sox; this time the Red Sox lost the first two games on the road before winning the series. Game Three, oddly enough, was started by Ted Lilly (for Oakland) and the losing pitcher was... Rich Harden.
I guess this means it can be done. But not by this team, not the way it's playing. Embarrassing doesn't even begin to describe the disastrous second inning last night in which Carlos Zambrano got not one, not two, but three ground balls, the last two of which could have ended the inning as routine double play balls, and none of them were fielded. The first one by James Loney -- that glanced off Ryan Theriot's hand for a base hit into left field -- that one I can understand, because Theriot appeared to be shifting to cover second base on a hit & run. It happens. Teams execute hit & runs all the time, and even to get to that ball was good effort on Theriot's part.
But the easy grounders booted by Mark DeRosa and Derrek Lee -- wow. I just can't understand those at all. You can't give a major league team five outs in an inning, especially in a playoff game. Z did the best he could to get out of the inning and his defense failed him, and when Russell Martin cleared the bases with a double, the crowd, which was jazzed up like a playoff crowd ought to be before the game, was silenced. All of us in our section sat there -- I can't even describe the feeling of being stunned that I felt throughout the game. It didn't help matters that by the 9th inning, the bullpen had helped tack four more runs onto the Dodgers' lead, including Neal Cotts allowing a single that scored the seventh (third earned) and final run on Z's record, so that when the Cubs got the remains of the sellout of 42,136 (maybe about half stuck it out to the end) noisy again with a two-run rally, it didn't matter -- maybe if it had been 6-1 instead of 10-1, the Cubs might have pulled off a miracle, but they had dug themselves far too deep a hole. Mike got me to laugh, finally, in the 9th inning when he said, "Maybe we've all been dead for 40 years and this is hell." (Was the fact that each infielder wound up with an error by the end of the game a macabre way of making each one feel better about himself? Or just another cruel joke?)
Yeah, that's what it felt like. Hell. (Although, maybe this movie describes it better.) The Cub offense looked like the 2006 version -- swinging and missing at bad pitches, or bouncing into groundouts. The only walk before the ninth inning was drawn by Z -- and then the second walk was drawn by Felix Pie, who had walked 21 times in his 266 major league plate appearances before last night. It's as if impostors showed up at Wrigley Field last night and put on the pinstripe pants and the blue shirts that Z favors. These guys couldn't be the ones who won 97 games during the regular season. What do you say about this? Management spent a ton of money and virtually every single move that Jim Hendry and Lou Piniella made during the season seemed the right ones, were hailed by most of us here, and almost every day new heroes were made, things Cubs fans hadn't seen in decades happened... and now this?
I received an email from BCB reader mjk83 this morning which read, in its entirety:
I will see you on Tuesday for Game 5.
Rich Harden and Ted Lilly will get this back to Chicago and Ryan Dempster will redeem himself.
..hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies.
And those of you who have read this site for a long time know that I am, in general, optimistic in nature, want to see the best of things, want to hope against hope (you know, if you are a "certain age", this is the way Jack Brickhouse always was on the air back in the hopeless early '60s, even when the Cubs were down several runs late in the game, always hoping they'd pull it out, even though they never did)... but this one's just about too much for me. I hope mjk83 is right. Really, I do. But that hope is much smaller this morning than it ought to be, and as I write this I'm 99% certain I'm cancelling my trip to Los Angeles... the game tickets I thought I had in hand fell through, and to go out there without tickets to see what feels like it's going to be a series sweep? Why bother?
I hope I'm wrong. If I am wrong and there's a game five on Tuesday, of course I'll be there. I know there are a ton of FanPosts today, far more than usual, and there may be some duplication in topics but at this point, I'm just going to let you guys vent. If this really is the end... yes, we're left with the wonderful memories of a great regular season, but it may be an extremely bitter taste from 2008 that will take a long time to wash away.
Let's hope that isn't the case. Go Cubs.

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Comments
No seriously...
Awful, awful game.
I have to ask as an aside, how did you get your same seats for the playoffs?
by Damen Jackson on
Oct 3, 2008 9:18 AM CDT
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I'll tell you some other time.
Right now, that just doesn’t feel very important.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Oct 3, 2008 9:25 AM CDT
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Rich Harden vs Hiroki Kuroda
I still have faith until the last out is recorded.
by dr stabbingworth on Oct 3, 2008 9:20 AM CDT 0 recs
That was a horrid display of baseball
This team looked like they had never played baseball before!
Really, really sad to see them collapse like that. the label of “CHOKERS” is going to be hard to shake for a long time to come.
Players are paid to play the game. The Cubs couldn’t execute when they had to (outside of DeRo and Edmonds) and this game is all about execution.
I feel so sad to be a Cub fan today.
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on Oct 3, 2008 9:21 AM CDT 0 recs
What the hell did DeRo execute????
The season? That double play ball boot was as bad as I’ve ever seen and cost the Cubs 5 runs.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
by Itchy on
Oct 3, 2008 9:50 AM CDT
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I was referring to...
his offense the last two games!
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on
Oct 3, 2008 10:40 AM CDT
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I can understand not going to LA all things considered.
That’s a tough trip to take with no tix and a good chance of being punched in the stomach.
I still can’t believe that Z came through with a big game. He pitched well and kept his emotions in check while the defense behind him fubar’d the game.
The Dodgers are a good team. The Cubs losing last night was not the shock, it was the way they lost and the run differential. That game was never close and the other starting 8 owe Z an apology.
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Oct 3, 2008 9:23 AM CDT 0 recs
Agreed
Z did remarkably well considering the lack of help he received. For Z to hold it together like he did was quite the feat. When I got home from work and watched the “highlights”, I have never had an ache in my heart for a Cub as I did when they showed Z in the dugout holding the towel to his face with his eyes squeezed shut. Just a totally heart wrenching night all around.
It has to start some place. It has to start some time. What better place than here. What better time than now. ~Rage Against the Machine
by love the ivy on
Oct 3, 2008 9:56 AM CDT
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Z did all he was expected to do
I am proud to have seen him pitch and hold the line as well as could. He brought his A game and the rest of the infield did NOT.
He was probably hot when he said he what he said at the postgame, but he was absolutely 100% RIGHT
Well, Next Year is here .. and Jack's century's gotta end some time .. GO CUBBIES!
by cubnational on
Oct 3, 2008 11:21 AM CDT
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I didnt get to hear this
can you paraphrase for me
It has to start some place. It has to start some time. What better place than here. What better time than now. ~Rage Against the Machine
by love the ivy on
Oct 3, 2008 11:40 AM CDT
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Aw man
what a picture.
There's magic in the ivy...
by halfblindcubbiegirl on
Oct 3, 2008 3:00 PM CDT
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+1
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
by zevkalman on
Oct 3, 2008 3:12 PM CDT
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I did
Thankfully golden retrivers are completely understanding.
There's magic in the ivy...
by halfblindcubbiegirl on
Oct 3, 2008 3:13 PM CDT
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sums it up
That's the beauty of baseball. You never know what's going to happen until the final out -- Lou
by Emelie on
Oct 3, 2008 3:29 PM CDT
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I don't knon what Demp said
when he came over to talk to him, but he then put the towel over his head and leaned back. Completely killed me
It has to start some place. It has to start some time. What better place than here. What better time than now. ~Rage Against the Machine
by love the ivy on
Oct 3, 2008 6:10 PM CDT
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I finally understand Yankees' fans feelings about A-Rod
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Oct 3, 2008 9:23 AM CDT 0 recs
As crazy as it sounds,
I agree with mjk83. Lou has been in this situation before and won. (See the 1995 Seattle Mariners)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1995_Seattle_Mariners_season
Remember the Yankees historic collapse in 2004? Who was the manager?
Our best pitcher is going on Saturday. Lilly has been lights out 2 starts in a row.
I still say we win this thing.
Let the flaming begin.
by Neifi Puppy on Oct 3, 2008 9:24 AM CDT 0 recs
If you're right we will all have come from the depths to the mountains in four days.
I just don’t expect it.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Oct 3, 2008 9:25 AM CDT
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fifty fifty chance It's Gonna Happen
Well, Next Year is here .. and Jack's century's gotta end some time .. GO CUBBIES!
by cubnational on
Oct 3, 2008 11:22 AM CDT
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Those are better odds than I would give right now.
I’ll take ’em, though.
The Chicago Cubs: 2008 Central Division Champions
by dat cubfan daver on
Oct 3, 2008 11:29 AM CDT
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I wish I could be more like you
If anyone flames you, I’ll kick them in the shins.
There's magic in the ivy...
by halfblindcubbiegirl on
Oct 3, 2008 3:01 PM CDT
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I'm glad you have faith....
but the season (for all intents and purposes) is over.
A team can’t play that kind of ball and expect to go anywhere in the Postseason. The Dodgers are executing flawlessly in every area (hitting, defense pitching) of the game, but the Cubs are failing in every area. That my friend is a recipe for a quick exit from the Playoffs
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on Oct 3, 2008 9:26 AM CDT 0 recs
Even the voice of reason - Al- has succumed
so sad…..but now I am falling into believing this Curse thing is true…
the question is, where do you even start in trying to improve this thing? change attitudes? rid the pressure laden atmosphere?
this team on paper has some holes, but no more so than any other in this postseason, and arguably less than anyone else who is still playing…
by LuisSalazar on Oct 3, 2008 9:26 AM CDT 0 recs
the holes are not the reason...
the Cubs are failing.
It all comes down to EXECUTION!
The Dodgers are executing flawlessly, the Cubs…not so much.
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on
Oct 3, 2008 9:28 AM CDT
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No curses
Simply coming to the park ready to play…some teams are and some are not during the postseaon. Its what seperates the winners from the losers. As I’ve said before when your hot your hot, when your not your not.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 9:28 AM CDT
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I agree completely
so where do you go from here? everybody in the starting lineup has no trade clauses. these are players who have not failed on other teams in playoff situations….but when they come here…it’s a different story
by LuisSalazar on
Oct 3, 2008 9:31 AM CDT
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We're following the Braves
pattern from 2002 – 2005. We can win the division, just not much else, but its only 2 years in a row. At least we are beginning to consistently dominate in that area.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 9:36 AM CDT
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That's easier to take
once you’ve got at least one WS ring.. Braves fans probably would not agree; they wanted to win it all every year during those glory years.
Tommie Agee was out.
by Weeghman Park on
Oct 3, 2008 9:38 AM CDT
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If the Cubs can emulate the Braves from 1992 through 2005 in
competing and post season appearances, that is a great start. You gotta get to the playoffs to advance.
All said, I’m not pleased with this season… yet.
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on
Oct 3, 2008 9:48 AM CDT
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Agreed
We’ll wait and see, sometimes its like a giant puzzle—need all the pieces.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 12:31 PM CDT
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I'm at least thankful that
there’s no “Bartman” episode here. It’s simply execution and how the Cubs couldn’t execute.
Sobering synopsis Al. You hit the nail on the head with it.
Formerly NO100
by jerry morales rules on Oct 3, 2008 9:26 AM CDT 0 recs
For the first time ever this season
and for the first time since I can remember, I turned off the television and went to bed before the game was over. I just felt sick.
This is not the same team that we followed all year.
I haven’t given up on this team just yet, but I sure as hell gave up on last night’s game.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel
by Blue W on Oct 3, 2008 9:26 AM CDT 0 recs
I completely agree
About the 6th inning I just turned it off and went to bed. I couldn’t take it anymore.
"Are you gonna bark all day little doggie, or are you gonna bite?"
by VicVega on
Oct 3, 2008 9:34 AM CDT
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I can not turn off the TV...
I want to say it’s over but to many times this year they have proven they can bounce back. We know the games. I refuse to admit it’s over. I know it’s called denial but I still…..
Just because I don't care doesn't mean I don't understand. - Homer J Simpson
by MikeOxbyg on
Oct 3, 2008 9:41 AM CDT
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The players looked rattled early on
and I guess it rattled me.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel
by Blue W on
Oct 3, 2008 9:43 AM CDT
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I went to bed immediately after the game
But couldn’t get to sleep until quite a long time after that. I just couldn’t stop thinking about it.
I am not as downtrodden today as I thought I would be, but I think I am still in shock.
Making plans to watch Saturday night’s game feels like making plans to attend a funeral.
by SuperContext on
Oct 3, 2008 9:58 AM CDT
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Wake me up when October ends
It has to start some place. It has to start some time. What better place than here. What better time than now. ~Rage Against the Machine
by love the ivy on
Oct 3, 2008 10:26 AM CDT
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Wake me up before you Go Go
I haz blurg: hotbeans.wordpress.com
by digitalbenjamin on
Oct 3, 2008 11:03 AM CDT
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Don't leave me hanging on like a yo-yo
There's magic in the ivy...
by halfblindcubbiegirl on
Oct 3, 2008 3:15 PM CDT
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It feels like a wake
That's the beauty of baseball. You never know what's going to happen until the final out -- Lou
by Emelie on Oct 3, 2008 9:27 AM CDT 0 recs
This thread is a wake
the team wasn’t last night
Tommie Agee was out.
by Weeghman Park on
Oct 3, 2008 9:28 AM CDT
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How embarrassing.
This team is playing like they played right after the ASB.
That Theriot play was crap. All the tiny little guy had to do was glove the ball. Quit trying to barehand it and play fundamental baseball.
Bench Fukudome; he can’t hit and as a result shouldn’t be in the lineup. Even batting 8th.
by kanderber on Oct 3, 2008 9:28 AM CDT 0 recs
Hmmm
I agree with Al, Theriots was probably the only one that could be justified. Lee and Derosa had rocks for hands last night.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 9:29 AM CDT
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Theriot's play wasn't "crap".
He was going the other way to cover second. He made a great effort even to put a hand on the ball.
The DeRosa and Lee errors — inexcusable.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Oct 3, 2008 9:33 AM CDT
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Disagree.
If he would’ve simply used his glove, he would’ve got the ball. It wouldn’t have been difficult at all to glove that ball.
Agreed on DeRo and Lee.
by kanderber on
Oct 3, 2008 9:35 AM CDT
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Yeah
If not for Theriot everything would have been different. Drop it.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 9:43 AM CDT
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That's a bit harsh
I’m not sure that he had a play at first, anyway — but he could have gloved it and kept the ball in the infield. Who knows what happens then?
I’m not blaming Theriot (and his AB in the first was crap), but it’s fair game to point it out.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on
Oct 3, 2008 9:46 AM CDT
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The point was made clear
If there were plays that were “crap” I think Theriots (far from good) was at the bottom of that list. kanderber chose to pick soley on Theriot, for which I think it was unjustified considering the other lousy plays the infield made.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 9:52 AM CDT
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Drop it? LOL. No.
This is a place for discussion of the Chicago Cubs. If you don’t want to read discussion about a pivotal play from last night, I would suggest not reading here.
And I didn’t choose to pick solely on him… I took issue with Al’s original comment about him.
by kanderber on
Oct 3, 2008 9:57 AM CDT
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And I took issue with your comment
For which you had no follow-up argument, hence the “drop-it” sorry if I offended you, at the time I am sure I intended that as you see today is not a good day for me. Glad you can laugh, I am sure I will regret my remark later…I hope you’ll understand.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 9:59 AM CDT
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I must've missed your argument
What was it that you were expecting a follow up argument to?
by kanderber on
Oct 3, 2008 10:06 AM CDT
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Arguments are in the next room;
this is animated discussions
Tommie Agee was out.
by Weeghman Park on
Oct 3, 2008 10:13 AM CDT
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I thought it was
How to Crush a Dream in Two Games 101
make*art
by neverAcquiesce on
Oct 3, 2008 10:14 AM CDT
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We've successfully merged Monty Pyton and Jeopardy
for our Cubs humor for the day. That’s probably all there will be.
Tommie Agee was out.
by Weeghman Park on
Oct 3, 2008 10:16 AM CDT
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No need to be sorry
We’re miscommunicating pretty badly here, it appears. Maybe it is best to drop it.
by kanderber on
Oct 3, 2008 10:14 AM CDT
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Just emotion
getting the best of me, its easy to be snarky with text. No hard feelings I hope.
by StevenABQ on
Oct 3, 2008 10:17 AM CDT
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Agree
That ball could have been gloved. Theriot must have thought he was Ozzie Smith for a moment.
He is not.
by salparadise23 on
Oct 3, 2008 10:26 AM CDT
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Right
That was about as perfectly executed hit and run as you will see. The Dodgers have played good fundamental baseball and have executed; Cubs have not (Z excepted)
Tommie Agee was out.
by Weeghman Park on
Oct 3, 2008 9:35 AM CDT
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sorry Al, but gotta disagree (again) on Lee's
while errors, by their very nature, are incidents that should (and could) be avoided, the ground ball hit to Lee was a difficult play. Yes, he’d be the first (and you the second) to say he should have made the play, but the runner did cut in front of him right as the ball was getting there. This was no boneheaded play.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on
Oct 3, 2008 10:02 AM CDT
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I've seen D Lee,
DeRosa, Theriot and everyone else make those plays.
That patented double play pivot from DLee (that we have watched countless times) is probably the best executed by any first-baseman I have ever witnessed.
Theriot is a sure handed glove and I really think he could have made that play on the hit and run (and i love Theriot). On the hit and run, I’m pretty sure that DeRo and Theriot both broke for the bag, that is mis-communication.
How else can you explain the statistical improbability of the second inning? I know anything can happen, but this was a tank job if I have ever seen it. i hate to say it but these guys looked like the Black Sox.
I also can’t believe I read an article from some sportswriter who obvs mailed it in on how Z didn’t step up. For a while it looked like Z was the only one who was trying to record an out.
Cubs Karma: Don't take anything for granted.....
by Andre Fonseca on
Oct 3, 2008 12:36 PM CDT
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The text in parenthesis explains the lunacy of the rest of the statement.
Theriot is a sure handed glove and I really think he could have made that play on the hit and run (and i love Theriot).
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on
Oct 3, 2008 12:40 PM CDT
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Since you guys insist on making this a Theriot-bashing zone
Anything negative about Theriot normally has zero credibility, so I have to append the comment with some Theriot love to balance it out.
Suddenly our entire infield turns into Dan Uggla?
Cubs Karma: Don't take anything for granted.....
by Andre Fonseca on
Oct 3, 2008 2:09 PM CDT
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I only say negative things when he does negative things...
and I say positve things when he does positive things. Now you know why I alwasy seem to be “basing” him.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on
Oct 3, 2008 2:11 PM CDT
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