Kerry Wood speaks on being let go
by TJ3117 on Nov 14, 2008 3:27 PM CST
421 comments
Here's the link to Paul Sullivan's article:
http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports_hardball/2008/11/wood-leaving-cu.html
I am very confused with Jim Hendry right now. Yesterday I assumed Kerry didn't want to return to the Cubs for a 1 yr deal or something at a low price but clearly he would have. Why on earth are we letting Wood just walk away without even offering him a contract? Hendry looking out for his best interest and his family? Please let Kerry worry about his family. It's not like a million dollar contract is hard to feed you're family off of. This just upsets me so much. I know we have Marmol as a closer but Wood could have been perfect as an 8th inning guy. So far I am not looking forward to next season at all.
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So the "feed your family" comment was all Hendry's...
… and it appears Wood would have taken less money and less years to stay.
He did a good job closing, and Marmol did a fine job setting up. Why they’d want to screw with that, and get rid of the face of the franchise at the same time, is completely beyond my understanding.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 3:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Hendry is trying...
…to give justification to the decision he has made. That’s all.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 3:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This whole situation
is really making no sense to me. I understand Hendry has enough respect for Wood to say “Go get what you deserve”, but come on, not offering anything and instead dealing an important trade chip?
I am really confused about how/why this just happened, but unless Kerry is hurt this whole thing seems dumber than hell.
by jbertram on Nov 14, 2008 4:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It is a business
Gregg will probably be signed for $4M and Marmol given $600K, Wood would demand $10M…..even for one year.
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Nov 14, 2008 6:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Like I said before...
Wood + Ceda > Gregg+6M, even if that were the case, I’d rather we stuck with what we had.
by jbertram on Nov 15, 2008 1:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think its simple...
…Hendry has written too many checks and Kenney is telling him only a slight bump from last year and most of that is eaten up with the escalations and raises without adding anybody.
In the end, the can have Marmol close for 400K vs paying Wood one year at 8-9 mil, and Hendry needs every dollar to use in other places that are more crucial.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 5:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
sounds sensible
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 5:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
it is as it is ..
.. that’s really what I read into all of this. Kerry’s remarks didn’t change the core issue – it’s pure business decision. But it does make me ill to see a man of Kerry’s caliber and soul leave the Cubs .. VERY sad day
Well, Next Year is here .. and Jack's century's gotta end some time .. GO CUBBIES!
by cubnational on Nov 18, 2008 8:54 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
???
I don’t understand at all. Kerry says he would have done anything to stay but that the Cubs basically told him he wasn’t wanted? If that’s true, I’m shocked.
by McRipper on Nov 14, 2008 3:34 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
this makes me sick
seriously if he’d take a 1 year deal what the hell is the problem
i don’t usually get angry, but this is infuriating.
god i feel sick
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 3:35 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
You and me both
There has to be a reason. You don’t just say bye to Kerry Wood. You just don’t. I could understand the business aspect but this doesn’t even sound like it was a business decision. This is very odd.
by McRipper on Nov 14, 2008 3:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i know i'm sounding ridiculous right now
but is there any way we can get the message out to the Cubs front office about how much Wood means to the fans?
I mean if he’d really take a 1 year deal why on earth wouldn’t we go after him?
I’ll throw $100 to his salary right now
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 3:40 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Seems very odd doesnt it
I understand if they want to move ahead with Marmol as the closer. But why are we weakening the strengths of this team (the back end of our bullpen) when clearly we don’t have too. Makes me want to puke.
by TJ3117 on Nov 14, 2008 3:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
its pretty clear
Kerry just wants to be a Cub, so even if we wanted to move forward with Marmol as the closer (which is ridiculous for so many reasons when you have a 1 inning guy DYING to come back), Kerry probably would’ve been willing to step aside into the setup role
damn’t i’m angry right now
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 3:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
if Kerry really would sign a one year deal
then why not wait until the Cubs offer him arbitration? I mean, we will offer him arbitration now wouldn’t we, it would make absolutely no sense not to.
bring up felix.
by kylejo on Nov 14, 2008 4:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
good point
It will be interesting to see.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just read it and I am sick.
Give the man a two year deal and let’s move on.
Face of the franchise – check
Leader and Competitor – check
Affordable – check (for two years)
WTF is this about best for the family if it wasn’t said or thought by Kerry?
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Nov 14, 2008 3:41 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Ummm...three words
SCREW YOU HENDRY! He says that he is welcome to stay with us if he pleased, but didn’t want to sign him for 3-4 years. But Wood would have accepted ONE year?? What kind of horseshit is that?
Does Hendry care about him so much that he wants him to gain more money instead of helping out the Cubs? Thats absurd!
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 3:42 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Why wouldn't Hendry want Wood back on a sweetheart deal.
No, there’s something else here, and I’m guessing it’s LOU PINIELLA.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 3:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
what does Lou have against him? He sent him out over 60 times
But I thought Hendry really liked to keep him too..
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What explanation is there for a GM
dumping a player that
1) he likes.
2) the city likes.
3) that will do anything to stay.
?
There is one explanation. The manager doesn’t want him.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Strange, because...
… Lou always seemed to like Wood.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I know.
What other explanation is there? Unless Hendry is playing brutal hardball with Kerry.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If Lou didn't like Wood...
…there is no way in hell he tosses him out there as much as he did, especially after missing all the time with the blister. Lou could have just put Marmol in there if he wanted, but Wood never lost his role.
This is all about money and needing to find some to fill more pressing needs.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 6:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
But Kevin Gregg may get almost as much in arbitration...
… as Wood would have taken on a one-year deal.
So how can it be all about money?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 7:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Lets see what...
…Gregg ends up getting and than compare that to what Kerry would have received for one year. I’ll bet the difference is at least 5 mil.
Bottom line; Hendry has hit the wall with his spending and now he is having to back track to address the most pressing needs.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 10:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe Not $5M...
… but darn close…
In Hendry We Trust
by initram on Nov 14, 2008 10:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Can't be that Lou thinks Kerry is
bad at baseball. Is this political?
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
In what sense?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm guessing something in regards to
clubhouse leadership? i.e. that Lou doesn’t like Wood’s leadership? It’s mindblowing.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's what I was implying
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Nov 14, 2008 4:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Why wouldnt he be a good presence?
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just thinking aloud, but
maybe a good presence and one blessed by Lou are different.
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Best construction would be
Lou wants to cut ties with the Cubs past; thinks some of the older Cubs may expect to lose. I don’t know. This is guessing.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not buying that it was Lou's decision to cut ties with Woodie
Lou is a throwback and so is Kerry. Lou wants to win more than anything and I find it hard to believe that he would jeopardize this teams success because of politics like this.
Over time, your quickness with a cocky rejoinder must have gotten you many punches in the face - Al Swearengen
by lemon20pie on Nov 14, 2008 4:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You guys are really reaching...
…this is all about finding money and still having a very good closer in place with Marmol.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 6:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Kerry said he'd do anything to get a deal signed
I imagine that would included a low first year salary and higher second year salary. “Anything” means Kerry was exaggerating or the Cubs didn’t want him.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 6:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't doubt...
…that Wood would have accepted a one year deal, but what you don’t know is how much he wanted for only one year. Considering his injury history (and himself knowing the other shoe could drop at any time), I would imagine he was seeking a legit wage for one year – around 8 mil. In fact, didn’t he make 8 mil this year with incentives?
This really comes down to choices, and they felt they could let Marmol close and use the money they save on another need.
Hendry did dance a bit when he talked about it yesterday, but he did admit that Kerry could get more years and more money elsewhere.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 10:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How Do You Think Gregg Felt?
In announcing his trade to the Cubs, 95% of the discussion was about Kerry Wood. The other 5% was introductions and beeps from people dialing into the telephone bridge.
I thought that was fishy, too.
In Hendry We Trust
by initram on Nov 14, 2008 10:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wood said he'd do anything to get it to work.
Anything can include a 2 year contract, backloaded and with incentives for when Marquis is off the books or a 3 year for when DLee is off the books.
Plus, Wood knew it was coming for the past year, and beginning of last year, there was no budget crunch because Dome wasn’t a budgetary albatross.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 10:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How About...
… Piniella felt that Marmol would be better as a closer than Woody? That combined with the fact that it may be too weird to “demote” Woody to a setup role?
Yes, I see the $4-$5M savings being applied somewhere else. But does this line of reasoning make sense to anyone else?
Combine that with how many times we’ve heard Piniella say that the game is saved often times in the 6th or 7th inning. Who is going to replace Marmol in doing that? Didn’t Marmol set the franchise record for holds?
In Hendry We Trust
by initram on Nov 14, 2008 10:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's not even 4-5 M savings if Wood takes a backloaded contract.
Gregg could, in fact, cost more in 2009 than Wood would have required.
I have no solid conclusions.
Sue said she heard on the radio Lou wanted him gone. That would make sense.
I expect someone in the Chicago media to run this down more. It’s too big a story not to find out exactly why he’s gone.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 11:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I heard that on the radio...
…as well, and it was Paul Sullivan. By the way, he was purely speculating and said so much.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 11:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ok - just speculation. Glad to hear what a second pair of ears heard.
I expect someone will try and run this down a bit more in the week ahead.
And if we get no specific answer, then Kerry is being gracious.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 11:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This team...
…can’t afford anymore backloaded contracts, NT clauses and all this other bullshit. If Hendry wouldn’t have handed those out like candy the last couple of years, Wood probably gets signed.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 11:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sully speculated that Lou chose Marmol over Wood at the GM meeting
I posted that as the interview took place. What am I, chopped liver? ;-)
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 15, 2008 11:00 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You guys are missing the big picture...
…when the entire organization determined where the club needs to improve, I believe the consensus was LH power bat, maintain solid rotation and possible leadoff hitter.
Now, the next step is determining how you improve those spots and sometimes, you need to take away from other areas to do it (bullpen in this case). When you could have a very good closer for 400K vs 8-10 mil, that was an obvious place they could find money to fix the other stuff.
This isn’t some conspiracy against Kerry Wood (by either Piniella or Hendry), it is simply finding the resources to fix the biggest problems.
At some point, Hendry’s spending/NT clauses was going to force him to make a tough decision, and this is tough decision number one.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 2:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
and you're missing a part of the picture as well
taking from a strength to address a weakness sometimes creates another bigger weakness.
by moving Marmol into the 9th and out of multi-inning leverage roles, we’ve significantly downgraded the 7th and 8th innings to maintain the strength of the 9th inning
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 15, 2008 4:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You have to pick...
…your spots. IMO, its easier to fill out the bullpen, than it is your rotation or the needed OF with some pop.
You simply can’t have everything (unless money is no object) and I think the Cubs have made the right call here.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 4:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
But what if Wood would have taken less money in order to...
… leave enough to accomplish those other goals? His statements imply that he would have.
What conclusion can you draw then?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 15, 2008 5:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
We don't know...
…whether Kerry would have taken less money for one year to stay. He sounded like he would have taken one year, but I’ll bet that would have been at very close to market rate. Didn’t he make 8 mil last year with incentives?
I really get amused at how so many Cub fans point the finger solely at the manager when something doesn’t go their way, Piniella gave no indication he didn’t like Wood, and he went out of his way to protect him (which was smart, considering his history).
I guess there has to be a villian and Piniella is the easy choice. I’ll say something I have said before; once Piniella is gone for a while, Cub fans will appreciate much more, what he brought to the club in many areas that were sorely lacking for a long time.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 5:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Short and long
Short – term – Kerry said he’d do anything, which could include multi-year contracts where he is paid very little this year, but more in a year or two to come.
Long – term – Lou’s tenure – I’ve agreed with you on this before, but if Lou is behind this (I still say "if"), we’re going to start counting up the numbers of players he had us dump for nothing in return.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 15, 2008 5:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
I’m not casting Lou as a villain here, but I’m still puzzled why he casts off useful pieces (Eyre, for example), while keeping players who continue to fail (Howry, for example).
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 15, 2008 6:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Al is right.
The conclusion is someone in the Cubs – for all we know, it could be Kenney – wanted Wood gone (or Kerry is exaggerating).
As to MPH73’s argument, it’s always a good idea to take someone who will come to you below-market, because you are almost always improving your club more per dollar there than anywhere else.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 15, 2008 5:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
then why lie?
its not about saving money if it was JH should have the balls to come out and say it, not lie one lie after another. theyve been saying the whole offseason they wanted to resign wood but it was always a question of giving him a long contract. now hes willing to take a 1 year contract and they dont do it. this doesnt make sense. I hate jim hendry. I am glad I called him a slob last year after he signed edmonds. yes i know it was a good signing but it still satisfies me.
by Glacier on Nov 14, 2008 6:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Woods been in 4 playoff series
So i wouldnt imagine thats the case
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 6:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Lou might not think that Kerry is "bad at baseball",
but he may think that Kerry’s arm has to be babied too much.
Remember how many innings Marmol and Howry racked up last April and May? It obviously affected both of them in June; Marmol eventually recovered, but Howry never did.
Lou never used Kerry except in a save situation, and then only for one inning. (Kerry pitched more than one inning only five times.) We don’t know how many times Woody told Lou that he was not available or was only available in an emergency; those things don’t always get leaked to the press.
Perhaps Lou’s continued overuse of Howry in the second half was a message to Woody about what he expected in a reliever.
I’m not saying that Lou is correct about wanting him gone because of a real or perceived lack of availability. I’m just saying that it would be a possible reason for Lou wanting him gone.
(Wood pitched 66.1 innings in 65 appearances.)
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Nov 14, 2008 8:14 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I think you may have hit upon it.
It is typical Lou. He expects players to fit into his exact mold. When they don’t he either tries to force them into that mold or discards them.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 10:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Thats a big drawback, no?
I dont think this guy should be lauded for that(being old school), which is why a younger manager might be better when his deal is up.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 11:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And Lou is SO good at assessing pitching
Howry keep using even though he sucks. Eyre dump. Marmol use till his arm falls off even with A HUGE lead or
blowing a HUGE lead.
Lou is just locked in on the my way or the highway managing school and it does the Cubs no good. Lou is obsessed with a LH power hitter but says zilch about the need for a lead off hitter and two failed years of coddling Soriano by letting him hit leadoff.
We will never know how much Lou was behind dumping Wood but he certainly did not have a big problem with it and the amount of financial savings is just not enough to explain it.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
by Doggie Stalker on Nov 15, 2008 3:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Knowing Wood's history...
…does anyone disagree that Piniella did the right thing by watching Wood’s innings?
This guy was a couple days away from hanging them up for good, and then all of a sudden his arm felt better. No one knows how long he can sustain a high level of pitching, but Lou relied on him in a critical role and he also tried to protect him.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 11:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed, but...
… arguing that he was “showing Wood a lesson” by overusing Howry and Marmol doesn’t take into account the fact that throwing a closer for an inning at a time is exactly how almost every major league manager uses his closer in modern baseball.
Wood’s use wasn’t any different from K-Rod’s or Brad Lidge’s. How does that make Wood the villain?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 15, 2008 5:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
????...
…I don’t think I said Wood was a villan, or Piniella was “showing Wood a lesson” did I? I was simply responding to the post above mine.
Does everyone have amnesia about Wood’s injury history and the fact he still has a tear in his cuff? I don’t know how long his arm can hold on, but I would not be surprised if he spends significant DL time for the club he signs with. I admire his toughness, but I sense the other shoe is going to drop with him sooner rather than later.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 5:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree Wood's injury history remains a concern.
That’s why I said it was a sound business decision when we were presented with the idea that Wood was seeking a 4 year deal. Tying Woody up for 4 years would not have been smart.
Here’s a straight question to you – do you believe Wood’s interviews are exaggerated or do you believe they faithfully and truthfully reflect his side of the story? To the point, do you believe he would have accepted the same deal he took last year or a similar two year deal that paid the incentive clauses in 2010?
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 15, 2008 5:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I have no idea...
…but I’ll guess.
I think he would have taken a one year deal at close to the market rate with an option for a 2nd (on innings pitched) or maybe even just a straight one year deal.
Compared to what he could get on the open market, yes, that is giving in quite a bit. But, it doesn’t solve their 09 dollar issue and what they need to do to fill holes. One other thing that hasn’t been discussed much is his health, and we don’t know whether he had to pitch through some troubles and or the Cubs have serious concerns how he will hold up – even next year.
Lastly, when Piniella doesn’t have faith in a player, it is fairly easy to see and he showed no signs he didn’t have faith in Wood.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 5:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry...
… I was trying to respond to another comment in this thread, I know you didn’t say the above. I do know the Cubs are concerned with Wood’s durability — but I would argue he showed he was durable for a whole season; the DL time was completely unrelated to his elbow or shoulder, unless there’s something we weren’t being told.
If you’re right about Piniella, then what’s the backstory here? It’s a mystery, especially since Gregg is likely to get nearly as much via arbitration as Wood would have settled for.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 15, 2008 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Where we differ...
…is in what Wood may have needed for one year and what Gregg will get. Even if the difference is only 3-4 mil, it is the start of scraping up enouph to fill another hole. Also, what we don’t know is how the brain trust thought about Wood’s health, and whether there were some signs (the public didn’t see), that he may be a risk to breakdown in 09.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 11:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You may be right...
… that there are things we don’t know. If that’s true, why wouldn’t they just say so?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 16, 2008 9:34 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well, as for the potential breakdown risks...
I can totally understand not wanting to say anything that would damage Woody’s value in the marketplace. This isn’t like selling a house where you have to disclose everything. Sure they’ll most likely make medical records available – I think that’s a given. But no reason to air out breakdown ‘predictions’ – at least at this time. I can see Hendry willing to take the heat from the public for not bringing that up if it helped Woody out.
You shouldn’t lie, but you don’t always have to say everything either…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Nov 16, 2008 10:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Medical records are available
MLB (with permission of MLBPA) runs an injury database on every player. Each team (either MD or trainer) must submit some kind of form on every injury and some illnesses (e.g., mono, TB). I’m not sure if GMs are permitted to access this database, or whether it is limited to MDs, but every team can see every player’s history.
What the records don’t show is how hard a player works at rehab. (It will show “torn ACL, surgically repaired”, but it won’t show whether or not the player worked hard to regain 100% strength and flexibility or only 90%.)
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Nov 16, 2008 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm guessing...
…but I feel part of this is probably a concern over health. If it is part of the issue, Hendry wouldn’t admit it, because he doesn’t want other teams to shy away from Wood as a favor to him.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 16, 2008 2:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I can agree that the issue with Wood isn't likely to be performance related.
There are other potential issues. This is a shot in the dark and please take it as such – but Lou could feel Wood is too connected to the Cubs losing past, that the Cubs need to break from that and have only leaders who have won before.
That explanation wouldn’t make Lou a “villain.” He would, in fact, be doing what Al has suggested, change the clubhouse culture, just in this case, he would be doing it by subtraction instead of by addition.
I’m not ready to say who the villain here is – if there even is one. I want follow-up stories.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 15, 2008 7:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
ok, I know you said you're just shooting in the dark here...
…but isn’t this getting just slightly ridiculous?
I’m sure Lou has many faults, but I fail to see how he – hell, how anyone with even half a brain – could look at Kerry Wood and somehow connect him to the Cubs losing past. It’s not like Kerry’s the guy who’s singing in the shower after losses, taking naps in the clubhouse during games, or always shrugging his shoulders and saying “aw shucks, guys, we lost again, but at least we tried, gosh durnit” at the end of every season.
I saw no evidence there was a losing culture in the clubhouse last year. And even if there was, you can’t be serious that Lou would somehow think Kerry Wood is part of it.
I realize this whole situation is unsettling to say the least and clearly lacking in facts, but until we get more definitive information, you might want to wait until daylight before you shoot again.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Nov 15, 2008 7:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Your point is taken. The shot in the dark was wide of the mark.
My point was that you can come up with explanations that don’t villainize anyone.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 15, 2008 9:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think so...
…because Wood fits the mold of the kind of pitcher Lou likes in the back of the pen. Flame thrower, with a good breaking ball that can dominate hitters and also a competitior.
I really don’t think Lou is concerned that Wood has been here for 10 years, but he is concerned with the lineup, more than he is the back of the pen.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 11:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I have a nasty feeling that might be it too
No way to prove it but I am beyond disgusted.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
by Doggie Stalker on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think so...
…but what I do think happened, is at the organizational meetings, they came to a consensus that their highest priorties to improve lie in other areas. Without an umlimited payroll, the obvious choice to save is not paying Wood 8 mil and having a very capable guy in Marmol fill that slot for 400K
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 14, 2008 6:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I like the comment on that article
“How can the Cubs justify keeping Jason Marquis and Kosuke Fukudome for $10 million a year and let a true Cub go elsewhere. Give me a freaking break. I’m starting to hate baseball more and more. I hope Wood goes to the Cardinals or Brewers and "Bites the hand that once fed him” in the immortal words of a drunken stumble bum."
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 3:43 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Going by Hendry's comments this made some sense
And I actually thought it was a class move. But in light of Wood’s comments I have a much lesser opinion of the Cubs organization
If the world didn't suck we would all fall off.
by carolinacub on Nov 14, 2008 3:43 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Now in no way am I in favor of letting him go
But it seems Hendry has far too much respect for Wood to let him settle for less money in Chicago. This seems to be two very bizare characteristics clashing here. One guy who will take far less to stay, and another not wanting the other guy to do it
Los Cachorros!
by Laven on Nov 14, 2008 3:44 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Not likely
If this was Hendry’s logic he should be fired.
You are suggesting that he made the Cubs a worse team and cost the Tribco more money… Yeah, he should be fired.
Eamus Ursuli!
by WGNstatic on Nov 14, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
More than what's obvious
“in the end, having a little bit of knowledge about the organization, and what’s going on with the team and who was up for free agency and the contracts,”
I think there’s a lot in that quote right there. What does he mean by “little bit of knowledge about the organization and what’s going on with the team”? I think there’s more than what meets the eye.
Formerly NO100
by jerry morales rules on Nov 14, 2008 3:45 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
There has got to be something...
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
HENDRY OFFER HIM A DAMN DEAL NOW!
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 3:45 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I KNEW IT!
There is more to this than meets the eye. I honestly believed Wood wanted to stay with the Cubs and would have done most anything to do so.
I used to back Hendry… but I dont anymore. Especially after some of these crappy big money signings like Fukudome and Marguis. It reminds me of the Mark Grace thing some years back. I know that Grace rubbed a lot of Cub fans wrong… but I think when he dissed the organization, it was more management and not the fans. Every quote I have ever read seemed as such.
This just makes me sick and really hurts.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 3:46 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
If they didn't even make him and offer then I don't think we can justfiy this
as a business decision anymore. If he knew it was coming it must have been very hard for him the last few weeks of the season. I thought by now nothing the Cubs could do would surprise me but this does not compute.
JH is trying to make it look like he has Wood’s best interest at heart and is on the side of the angels. Woody will take care of himself; that’s not Jim’s job. This just sucks. I guess I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue.
Tommie Agee was out.
"This field, this game, is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that was once good, and it could be good again." TM
by Weeghman Park on Nov 14, 2008 3:47 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
"and" = "an" in the title
Tommie Agee was out.
"This field, this game, is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that was once good, and it could be good again." TM
by Weeghman Park on Nov 14, 2008 3:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Elmer's will do that to you.
Free Ronny Cedeno
by Kansas25 on Nov 14, 2008 3:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's good stuff
and cheap.
Tommie Agee was out.
"This field, this game, is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that was once good, and it could be good again." TM
by Weeghman Park on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly.
I don’t understand this “business” decision at all. Wood’s been forced out. For what reason, I do not know, because he said he’d do just about anything to stay AND he did a good job in a baseball sense in 2008.
I’m absolutely dumbfounded.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 3:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
is there anything we can do?
Al,
I feel silly and childish asking this, but is there anything we can do to make sure the Cubs organization knows how the fans feel about Kerry.
This is ridiculous. I’ve NEVER been angry at this organization for anything they’ve done. I’ve always been frustrated or disappointed, but this is a new level for me. Kerry is the ONE player we’ve had in a long time that has openly talked about his love for being a Cub
He’s the ONE GUY who gets it. He’s one of us
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 3:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Al is on his way to Hendry's office.
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think
Alothough to late, But should show up to the Cubs convention and make it known that we are not happy
by Kchance on Nov 14, 2008 4:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that's a fine idea.
You could also email Crane Kenney.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 4:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Cub emails are of the form
firstinitiallastname (at) cubs (dot) com
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 7:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Business is business (before Blue Mike catches up here)...
…but in business, it is not always the right move to make moves just to make them. I knew this deal reeked from the beginning.
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i say we get a angry mob together and teach Hendry lesson
by Glacier on Nov 14, 2008 6:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree completely.
If Kerry was insisting on 4 years, then I understand the decision. Because it would be a sound baseball move. But, if K was willing to stay for a one or two year deal, why in the world wouldn’t you do that?! That’s a good move. A short contract for someone that has an injury history. It also keeps one of the current “iconic” Cubs players on the team. I’m confused and a little sad.
by storkysm on Nov 14, 2008 4:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hendry failed - again
He did not do his homework and “thought” the market for closers was going to go berserk driving Kerry out of his price range. Instead of asking Kerry and his agent what a contract may cost him, he figured he’d tell him to get get his pay day. This is utter BULLCRAP.
Shame on Hendry.
by socalbob on Nov 14, 2008 3:49 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
If Hendry made no offer, implying there
was any thought is giving him too much credit.
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Nov 14, 2008 3:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
he made no offer
because he didn’t do his homework with Kerry. It’s a bad testament to Hendry as a GM. He wasn’t prepared to hear Kerry tell him, “I’ll do a 1 year low-cost contract with incentives.”
by socalbob on Nov 14, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No way he didn't do his homework.
GM’s do their homework. The Cubs wanted him gone for a reason. Either this is ongoing negotiation or it’s Lou.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
At the dinner did Wood refuse to pay the check?
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 3:50 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Im pass the
Shock and Awe and now I’m starting to get pissed. This is bullass. What the hell is Hendry doing?
by McRipper on Nov 14, 2008 3:55 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I knew it...
It’s negotiation people. I’ll believe Kerry is gone when I see him in another uni.
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 3:56 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
So...is there any honest chance of him resigning now?
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 3:57 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Sure.
Think about it. Wood will take less years and money to stay. He wouldn’t get any fair offers if everyone saw it as a foregone conclusion that he would return to Chicago for less. So Hendry sets the price for Wood by saying they can’t meet his 4 yr. demand, and says- go get what you can- I’m not going to low ball you. Honestly, for a guy with his injury history, the fact that he almost retired, then all of sudden half-way through ‘07, he can pitch effectively again without pain- for no apparent reason. He’s only had one year at closer, and though it was successful, it’s still only one year. I just don’t see other teams knocking down his door with big offers. If they don’t- both Hendry and Wood have left the door open, while still exploring what is best for the player, (Wood), and the team, (Cubs).
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 4:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's possible, I suppose.
Basically, they have told him that Marmol is going to close in 2009. That’s fine, but Wood seems to have made it clear that he’d be happy coming back as a setup guy (and remember, Bob Howry just got about $10 million over three years to be a setup guy, so there’s money to be made there, too).
I just don’t understand the entire “business decision”, because clearly, this would NOT have cost the Cubs a ton of money.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's about what is Demp going to do? Will he sign with the Cubs for less?
If so, the Cubs will be able to sign back Kerry. I think both will.
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 4:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you suggesting the Cubs are playing Wood against Demp?
That Dempster is being saddled with the possibility that if he asks for too much, HE will be the reason the Cubs can’t get Wood?
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm saying that Hendry is obviously now under financial constraints from above.
I’m also saying that while the Cubs may not be intentionally playing Demp against Woody, but that the financial realities may have the same outcome and effect. As an example: The Cubs didn’t force out Alou, but the Sosa situation definitely played a role in him not being re-signed.
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 4:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Tribune stock lost 20% this week
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
huh? I thought Tribune was privately held.
where are you seeing stock prices and valuations?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Nov 15, 2008 3:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
really, I thought Sosa and Alou were friends?
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
They were.
The inability to trade Sosa until late in the off-season did directly affect not being able to commit the type of money to Alou that he was demanding.
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 4:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So if Demp signs for 3/36
then Kerry comes back?
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Given the now obvious financial constraints the Cubs are under...
If Demp does come back for less out of loyalty, that definitely frees up money to sign Kerry. I personally don’t think everybody is going to be knocking down Kerry’s door to lay out 4 yrs. and a ton of money to a guy that really doesn’t want to be there. Plus he has only one year of closing experience, and was almost retired until the middle of ’07; when all of a sudden he could pitch effectively, pain free- for no apparent reason, with his injury history to boot?
I think it could very well all be that Wood ends up coming back for 2 yrs., with a mutual option for a 3rd-based on a ton of incentives- with a big buy-out to boot.
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 5:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
We'll see.
I see a couple options here:
1) Wood is stretching things for Chicago sympathy.
2) There’s a hardball game being played with Wood and/or Demp to save money.
3) Lou wanted Kerry gone.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 5:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
very plausible.....very risky and ballsy, but possible.
"When I got to Chicago, fans came to Wrigley Field just to have fun, now they come to see us win. The expectations have changed, for the players and for the fans. It’s about winning." Kerry Wood, 7/14/08
by JB 23 on Nov 14, 2008 8:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What if they relize their mistake
And trade marmol or the shark for someone very good. I wouldnt be against that
by Kchance on Nov 14, 2008 4:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Confused
I am just confused.
I don’t get it. If there is one thing Hendry is strong at his relationship with players. Remember when Scott Willamson was traded, he thanked Jim Hendry, you don’t see that every day.
I just don’t get it. I want to be pissed, but something isn’t squaring up right now.
Eamus Ursuli!
by WGNstatic on Nov 14, 2008 4:00 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Kerry Article on Cubs.com
Completely leaves out his desire to stay for a one year contract. Typical Muskat bending of news
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
not sure if this is the same article
but i pulled this brief line on the cubs.com article i was just reading:
If the Cubs had offered Wood a one-year deal, the pitcher said he would’ve considered it. But he wasn’t in their plans.
“I just don’t think it was the right time for the team and the things they need to address,” Wood said. “Obviously, the first choice was to stay here, and I would’ve done just about anything to stay here. They have other issues and a very capable guy to get the job done.”
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 4:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
overlooked it, my bad
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just need to get away from the Computer
because I am pretty much writing everything out of anger..
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i can relate
this is the first time in my life i’ve ever been angry with the cubs
frustrated, disappointed, exhausted, saddened…. yes
but angry… this is truly a first
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 4:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed, I created my signature yesterday and today's story proves it more
Wood was basically cast aside by this organization
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
amen
I’m seeing “Cardinal red” right now.
by socalbob on Nov 14, 2008 4:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I doubt....
Kerry will purposely go to the Cards just in spite of the Chicago Cubs. However, I could see them signing him because they need a closer and it’s closer to Chicago where is wife’s family is from.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm very disappointed about them not keeping Wood
but the last time I was really mad at the Cubs was when Wrigley was to cheap to pay Bill Madlock and let him walk.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings. ~Earl Wilson
by tucsoncubsfan on Nov 14, 2008 4:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
I’ve never been angry with the Cubs before but this is just mind-numbing. They tossed Wood aside and made the team worse. Stunning.
by dr stabbingworth on Nov 14, 2008 7:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Really? The first time?
Amazing.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Nov 14, 2008 7:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
muskat
needs to be slapped across the face. how can they let that clown write? like honestly its amazing.
by Glacier on Nov 14, 2008 6:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
she's nothing but a propaganda piece. I never read her anymore, waste of time
"When I got to Chicago, fans came to Wrigley Field just to have fun, now they come to see us win. The expectations have changed, for the players and for the fans. It’s about winning." Kerry Wood, 7/14/08
by JB 23 on Nov 14, 2008 8:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh i always read her
but only to see what kind of stupid shit as spewed out of her mouth
by Glacier on Nov 14, 2008 9:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Did You Catch The Latest?
In the Gregg conference, didn’t she say something like, “Welcome to Chicago, I think”. What’s up with that? Not good if she is the first one to ask a question, too.
How about her mailbag this week. Someone said that Wagner was a FA. Um, last I checked, he wasn’t, even if he was hurt. No mention from her on that.
She clearly doesn’t do her homework..
In Hendry We Trust
by initram on Nov 14, 2008 10:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Speechless.
Stupid Cubs. There better be a good reason for this, and we have a right to know what that reason is.
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
This is typical Cubs inept management
Its not the goat, its not the damn black cat, botched ball by Durham
Its the horrible management this team has had to endure since PK
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hendry a Yellow Belly?
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Chill Out
Kerry seems to be taking the news better than any Cub fan. This is the way the system works and Wood seems fine with it. He was paid well and treated well. I like Kerry and would like him to stay but maybe there is a better plan.
by Chodes on Nov 14, 2008 4:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
"this is the way the system works"
I don’t understand that, considering he would have stayed for a one year contract, which was Hendry’s WHOLE argument about not resigning him
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hendry Can't Say
that Kerry Wood is not in their plans for the future or even for one year. He hopes to spend that money on a longer term investment. Hopefully for a player that will improve the Cubs. I think Kerry understands this. He (and us) may not like it but that’s the way it works.
by Chodes on Nov 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What longer-term investment?
Sign Kevin Gregg to a four-year deal? That’d make a lot of sense.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 14, 2008 4:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
CLarify
He said he’d consider it and that’s easy to say when it’s not offered.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
ha give me a break
did you read sullivan’s article where he clearly says he would have “done anything” including “sign a one year deal” to stay with the cubs?
bring up felix.
by kylejo on Nov 14, 2008 4:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My Boycott
I know this isn’t going to amount to much, but I am not going to spend any money on the Chicago Cubs next season. My decision is based upon how they are just letting Wood go. I have loved the Chicago Cubs for over 20 years. The only time I can remember ever being so mad at the organization was when Himes let Dawson and Maddux go.
I know the Cubs are an organization which wants to make money… but there are right ways and wrong ways about going about it. If this is how the management is going to treat somebody who has dedicated his life to being a Chicago Cub… and a good one at that, then I have to do something to show that I do not approve of this.
I wish the Cubs the best next season. I will follow the team, and I still want them to win it all… but, I will not give them a dime of my money during the 2009 season.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
WWWD
What would Wood Do? I don’t think he would boycott the team.
by Chodes on Nov 14, 2008 4:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not boycotting the team...
….I will follow them, but I am not giving them any of my money. I can pick up a newspaper and read how the team is doing. I can catch a game on WGN and i won’t be giving them a dime. However, I will not buy any gear, hats, go to the ballpark, etc…. I will give them a dime.
I love the Cubs too much to just drop them. But I do not have to financially back some of the decisions Jim Hendry has made.
Hope this makes sense.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not Kerry...
and I will do this. My decision, not yours and I’m fine with that.
I meant "i will not give them a dime.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think they will miss your dime...
I think JH is starting to feel the effects of all the bad contracts of the last few years.
by EB14MyIdol on Nov 14, 2008 4:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
But isn't the point here
that he wouldn’t have had to sign Wood to a bad contract?! He could have signed him to a 1-2 year deal. Maybe incentive laden with a club option for a third.
by storkysm on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
maybe, but
I don’t think he can until he moves some of the bad contracts.
by EB14MyIdol on Nov 14, 2008 4:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Although if you look at the market
for relief pitchers, then a one or two year deal for Kerry makes damned good baseball sense. Even from a financial standpoint.
by storkysm on Nov 14, 2008 4:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
I think the bad contracts have caught up with Hendry… but I think he had a lot of time this off season to TRY to free up some money. He didn’t even try. Theres obviously more to this story than we will ever know….
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree,
there has to be more to this story. I just don’t think we will see JH do much until he frees up some money, JM, Dero, DLee???
by EB14MyIdol on Nov 14, 2008 5:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure he won't....
… but I don’t feel like I just have to back something that feels morally wrong. You can, thats fine with me.
As I said, I love the Cubs, but I don’t have to give them any of my money next season.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Al - print out this page and save it for this summer
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This is shady.
As Al said, why, if one year was a possibility, would you bring in Gregg, who sucked hard last season IMO, to replace a solid Woody. (That was funny)
Kwa...Ki...Sur...Pee...Nee...Ku?
by Kinky Reggae on Nov 14, 2008 4:06 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
This is inexcusable
He’ll take one year deal? Are you *%&! kidding me!? you then proceed to trade a rocket arm for some bum who spells his name with three G’s
This is inexcusable, bad enough he got fleeced by the Marlins again, now we know he wouldve taken a one year deal
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Last two days have not been Hendry's finest..
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Hendry set himself up for one interesting Convention next year
Wish I was going.
by JFCubFan on Nov 14, 2008 4:07 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I can't put 2 and 2 together here
The entire situation is bizarre.
Hendry said: He felt like Wood wanted a 3-4 year deal, which the Cubs weren’t willing to give him, therefore it was a good business decision. He also stated that the door is still open for Wood to return if he wanted to and that he was always a Cub
Wood said: He’d definitely take a one year deal because he loves this city and wouldn’t mind returning??
What the hell is going on? Did something happen that we weren’t aware of??
This also makes the Gregg deal look like shit. We basically gave up Ceda and Wood for Gregg, which we didn’t have to do in the first place if Hendry had heeded Wood’s words.
Seriously, is Hendry drunk??
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:11 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Does Wood think he should be a SP again?
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
I was firmly with Hendry on this one, but if Kerry was available at less than 20 million and/or three years, this makes no baseball sense.
Unless Kenney sold fans a bill of goods on the budget.
by Damen Jackson on Nov 14, 2008 4:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I have no idea what is going on.
The drama surrounding this situation is like a soap opera. It makes me want to cry. I just hope that Hendry pulls his head out of his ass and offer Wood a 1 or 2 year deal. He has a LOT of explaining to do.
If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base. - Dave Barry
by zm1217 on Nov 14, 2008 4:14 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Clarify
He said he’d consider a one year deal not that he’d accept it. Big difference. When all would be said and done I doubt it would have happened that way.
The union would have crucified him if he did it too.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:15 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Reclarify
he did say he would’ve been amenable to staying and “would have done anything” to stay a Cub. The Cubs told him to go get a three- or four-year deal for more money, but Wood said he would’ve agreed to a one-year deal to stay.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
His agent
His agent and the players union would never let it happen.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
why so??
if the player wants the deal then why should the union have anything to say about it?
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
In the past
In the past there’s been talk the union pressures players not to do this because it can hurt other players negotiations.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:21 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
absolutely true
"The object of a ball game for the fan is not to be entertained. It is to win." - Max Lapides
by CaliCub on Nov 14, 2008 8:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
sure the union pressures players
sure the union pressures players not to take less money or less years – that’s part of their job. But they don’t send Luca Brasi over to Kerry’s house and hold a gun to his head and tell him to take the most money or else.
Wood is his own man. If he wanted to sign a 1 year deal with the Cubs, he would. And I’m pretty sure he’d be more than willing to “close” (ha ha) the door on anyone from the union who would harass him and/or try to convince him otherwise.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Nov 15, 2008 3:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I take it back about the Maddux comparison
In another thread I wrote this was not at all the same because the Cubs had dicked with Maddux ( sorry Al but like all us except MBNIU I am a BAD mood) and pulled back contracts etc. While not the same this is sounding to sound similar. I can never boycott the Cubs but this is a day that will live in infamy as bad as Maddux not so much in that Wood is going to go out and win 3 straight Cy Young awards but in treating our most loyal player like DIRT.
There just HAS to be more to this and like DGU I smell a Lou rat.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
by Doggie Stalker on Nov 14, 2008 4:16 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
What would this have to do with Lou?
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I doubt it very much that Lou
had any problems with Kerry whatsoever – unless he caught him sleeping with his wife or something.
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno about Lou, but....
This does sound like the Himes-Maddux/Dawson situation. (So far) Hime wanted to build up “his” team… he wanted the Cubs to win but wanted to have all the credit for it. What he did then was take away the heart and soul of the team….Maddux/Dawson/and eventually Sandberg.
I think Wood is the heart and soul of this team. Hendry just removed it….
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm Kerrys biggest fan
But the reaction to this is ridiculous. First this is his side of the story and saying he’d accept a one year deal is easy when it didn’t happen.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:20 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
He should have just said he would have missed Chicago
by saying he would have signed a one year deal is basically saying the Cubs shafted him!
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Its easy
Its easy to say when you won’t be called on it.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
but he shouldn't have made that comment at all!!
People say things like this for a reason..
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hurt and anger
I think he also is still hurt and angry over this.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He did it last year!
What makes you think that he wouldn’t do it again?
There were 3-year deals on the table for Kerry last season, too. And while the dollar values weren’t quite as high last year as what he’ll see this year, they were pretty good. Moreover, that kind of multi-year job security meant even more to Kerry after the 2007 season, when his arm health wasn’t so established.
I honestly believed that Kerry would finish his career with the Cubs, primarily on a series of 1-year save/appearance incentive-laden deals that would net him around $8-10M for the next 3-4 seasons.
This just sucks, in every respect. Hendry’s series of ridiculous decisions to overpay for mediocrity is finally coming back to haunt him. Well, at least we have a LHB platoon CF who is actually worse against RHP than his platoon partner for 8 figures for the next 3 years.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Nov 20, 2008 10:18 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So you're calling him a liar?
"I see I'm not the only one around here who can't hold his water." - Last words of the leaky pipe in the visiting team dugout, Dodger Stadium, October 4, 2008.
by dat cubfan daver on Nov 14, 2008 4:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
Not exactly but it’s easy to say when you won’t be called on it.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Why won't he be called on it?
The media is going to be all over this story.
"I see I'm not the only one around here who can't hold his water." - Last words of the leaky pipe in the visiting team dugout, Dodger Stadium, October 4, 2008.
by dat cubfan daver on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I HOPE so!
I hope it gets out there so that everyone can see that this organization shafted him. Hopefully this can force Hendry into resigning him
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well
He’s not going to be offered a one year deal so he wont be called on it.
If he signs a one year deal elsewhere then that’s a different story,
I can say I would turn down a million dollar movie contract, Would never happen but its easy to say,
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He was offered and signed a 1-year deal last year.
Even at a time when his arm health wasn’t completely established, he left a ton of money and guaranteed years on the table in order to come back to Chicago.
You may say that everything is different now because he’s another year removed from his arm issues, and the guaranteed dollars in his multi-year offers will be higher — but at the same time, Kerry is also more assured of his ability to stay healthy for future seasons, and the necessity for guaranteed years is lessened.
The man said he’d take a 1-year deal last year. He did so. He’s saying he’d do it again. I don’t know why you wouldn’t take him at his word – he’s been nothing but honest with the fans for over a decade. I can’t even come up with an equivalent to this situation – it would be like ditching Banks after he’d returned to productivity in 1964, or telling Ryno that he wasn’t welcome when he wanted to retire.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Nov 20, 2008 10:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You mention Ernie Banks.
When Leo Durocher came in as manager, he didn’t much like Banks; thought Ernie’s sunny attitude was the wrong approach. He tried a number of different people at 1B from time to time, hoping they’d outhit Ernie, but none ever did.
Ernie did have a down power year in 1966 (and played 22 fewer games than 1965, despite being healthy), but came back and had three good years in 1967, 1968, and 1969.
If Leo had had his way, the Cubs probably would have traded Ernie, but P.K. Wrigley wouldn’t hear of it, as he loved Banks.
Lou seems to have gotten his way with Kerry Wood.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Nov 21, 2008 1:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This is another explanation.
Kerry is playing to the fans.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
then just say "I will miss Chicago, the fans were great"
Why would he even put that comment out there then about the one year deal?
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's negotiation.
Hendry probably didn’t offer him a one year deal, because he didn’t want to low-ball him and send him to the open market.
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's right it didn't happen
That is the point. NO OFFER OF ANY KIND WAS EVER MADE. That is clearly not Wood’s fault. Also Ii he wanted to take a one year
deal that was up to him. I am sure union was not crazy about Mags’ deal allowing the Tigers to void his contract if his old injury re-occured
but nothing they could do about it.
I grant you there is a lot of sentiment here but it is ALSO about talent and winning. Every baseball commentator looking at the Ceda/Gregg and Gregg & Marmol Vs Wood deal has said the Cubs got screwed. Did we really need to save maybe 5 or six million
IN ONE SEASON to do this ? To make our closer situation much less reliable ? What we gonna go out and get Lou his LH hitter with that ?
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
by Doggie Stalker on Nov 14, 2008 4:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wood could still re-sign with the Cubs, and I believe he will.
Then you have another RH set-up guy in the pen in Gregg in place of Howry. All the Cubs lost was a guy in Ceda, who, in my opinion, will not be a great reliever, or have much of a career.
Jimmyeatworld
by Jimmyeatworld on Nov 14, 2008 4:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Before
Before we shoot Hendry this is November 14th and let’s see how this all plays OUT before we say it was a bad decision.
Who would ever think I was about the only reasonable person on a Wood thread?
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:22 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I think youre wrong...
Wood wouldve stayed on a one year deal, so whats so hard about that? That would have had little to no bearing on the rest of the FA period and wouldve saved us a valuable trading chip in Ceda and not enervated our bullpen
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He said he'd consider it
He said he’d consider it not that he’d sign it.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wrong
Re-read the article, especially this paragraph:
“While Wood was understanding about the Cubs’ decision, which Hendry said was made in the best interests of Wood and his family, he did say he would’ve been amenable to staying and "would have done anything” to stay a Cub. The Cubs told him to go get a three- or four-year deal for more money, but Wood said he would’ve agreed to a one-year deal to stay."
Sounds like he would have signed it to me.
by McRipper on Nov 14, 2008 4:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
It clearly says “he would’ve agreed to a one-year deal to stay.”
would’ve = would have
"I see I'm not the only one around here who can't hold his water." - Last words of the leaky pipe in the visiting team dugout, Dodger Stadium, October 4, 2008.
by dat cubfan daver on Nov 14, 2008 4:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It will be very very interesting to see what Hendry's next move will be
,,,,that is saying if he even has a next move. Now not only with a need for a LF bat and a starting pitcher, we need someone to set up Marmol. That is if Marmol is your closer, if Gregg closes then Marmol can still set up but i doubt that will happen. Now let see what happens next. Dempster sign? Trade for a LF bat? Hendry needs to make up for this huge error of letting (excuse me, MAKING) Kerry Wood walk away from the Cubs.
by TJ3117 on Nov 14, 2008 4:22 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Thats plain silly
You’re right Hendry is going to go to Australia for the rest of the winter and not make another move.
This is silly.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's silly wondering what Hendry's next move will be
okayyyyyyyyyyyyy
by TJ3117 on Nov 14, 2008 4:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
No saying if he has a next move like there’s any doubt there is one.
Like any reasonable person I’m waiting to see how everything pans out.
Don’t you guys think my heart is breaking the last 24 hours?
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Gregg won't be a Cub for long...
Either he is going to be traded this winter, or he is going to be boo’d out of the ballpark next year. I know it’s not his fault, and that this statement isn’t true, but he’s going to be remembered as the guy who took Wood’s spot on the roster. He’s already got some strikes against him for that and he can’t help it.
I think you can thank the media for that though.
by TheHawkRules on Nov 14, 2008 4:24 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't mind having Gregg on the team, he is a decent upgrade over Howry
The problem is we got him for a prospect that will be much better than him. Also, he is replacing one of the greatest players on this team.
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ceda will not be a MLB player in 5 years
Throwing strikes and having a general idea of where the ball where land, is generally a good thing at the Major League level. They should’ve gotten more for him though. But Ceda will be nothing more than Roberto Novoa.
Over time, your quickness with a cocky rejoinder must have gotten you many punches in the face - Al Swearengen
by lemon20pie on Nov 14, 2008 4:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well even if that is so
We should have been able to have gotten more for him, since most teams thought he was going to be a pretty good pitcher
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
How much do you think a AA middle reliever with control problems is worth?
by Damen Jackson on Nov 14, 2008 4:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He has a high upside. If he can gain control, he would dominate the league
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I can't begin to tell you...
often that gets said about guys in Spring Training camp. Unless your prospect is graded an A or better, I wouldn’t get too caught up in that stuff.
Hate the Wood situation if you like, but Hendry went out and found a closer canddiate that he didn’t have to make a long-term commitment to, for a guy that may turn into something — but probably wasn’t going to do it for the Cubs in 09. That side I have no beef with.
by Damen Jackson on Nov 14, 2008 4:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It doesn't matter how often it gets said...
Its the truth. Look at the reviews from people about this trade. Most say we basically were robbed.
by jbertram on Nov 15, 2008 1:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Its all about perception
Whats so great about Phil Hughes, the yankees wouldnt even give him up for Johan….hows that working out?
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Working out pretty bad...
I would have had that kid freezing his ass off in Minnesota within 48 hours of the Twins calling.
by Damen Jackson on Nov 14, 2008 4:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Who's perception?
Obviously the perception that Ceda will be a good pitcher is all by Cub fans and a some “experts” and not by the one’s who really matter, MLB GM’s. The Cubs got Ceda for Todd Friggen Walker. Obviously Hendry shopped Ceda around and the best he could get for him was Gregg. I find it hard to believe that Hendry had his mind set on Kevin Gregg.
Although, after today’s quotes by Woodie, I may be wrong about that.
I’ve seen Ceda pitch many times and even though Ascaino hasn’t had the success I thought he’d have by now, I always liked Ascaino more and thought he’d wind up being the better MLB pitcher. So, I’ve never really cared for Ceda, despite some of his gawdy numbers. You need to throw strikes and Ceda has NEVER been able to do that consistently and It is highly unlikely that he ever will.
Over time, your quickness with a cocky rejoinder must have gotten you many punches in the face - Al Swearengen
by lemon20pie on Nov 14, 2008 4:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I meant the perception builds up the value
Like when people keep saying “oh you gotta go see such n such movie” after you hear it dozens of times, your like “damn, i bet its good”
So I think perception and hype plays a great deal in prospects
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 5:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I know what you're saying but
again, it appears the “perception” that he’ll be a good MLB pitcher, is all by Cub fans and so called experts. IF Hendry’s phone has been ringing off the hook for Ceda, he would’ve been able to get much more for him and involve him in a much bigger deal, but the fact that all he could get for him is Gregg, leads me to believe that the interest in Ceda by other GM’s, just wasn’t there.
Over time, your quickness with a cocky rejoinder must have gotten you many punches in the face - Al Swearengen
by lemon20pie on Nov 14, 2008 5:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Rosenthal reported
that many GMs were surprised Hendry gave him up for so little. It happens all the time. Last year GMs were surprised the price for Lidge was so low.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 5:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
anyone who isnt shocked at Hendry giving up thier #4 overall prospect...
…for a journeyman middle reliever isnt paying attention. At this point I refuse to believe that this deal is what it seems, something else must be in the works that includes Gregggg
"When I got to Chicago, fans came to Wrigley Field just to have fun, now they come to see us win. The expectations have changed, for the players and for the fans. It’s about winning." Kerry Wood, 7/14/08
by JB 23 on Nov 14, 2008 8:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
youre most likely correct
but i think the hype factor plays a role in these types of situations
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 5:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
When people tell you they know what will happen with a prospect
either positive or negative – there’s no point in continuing to listen to them. No one knows what Ceda will be.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What?
Don’t you find it odd that such a “stud” like Ceda was given to the Cubs for Todd Walker and now the best the Cubs could get for him is Gregg? Even though Cub fans thought he was the next coming of Lee Smith?
Don’t listen to me, listen to MLB GM’s who have spoken loud and clear.
Again, throwing strikes at the MLB level, is a good thing. Ceda will not be a MLB in 5 years.
Over time, your quickness with a cocky rejoinder must have gotten you many punches in the face - Al Swearengen
by lemon20pie on Nov 14, 2008 5:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You don't know.
Ceda is a highly rated prospect. That’s all. He’s not a ML player. He’s not a prospect bust. We don’t know what he will be. We only know that he is a highly rated prospect.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 5:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
some guy named Marmol
had those same issues…
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 5:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Some guy named Marmol
Is a converted Catcher. Big difference there. Ceda has gotten by feasting on inferior talent because of his electric fastball and despite his control. He won’t be able to do that at the MLB level. As I’ve said many times before, see Roberto Novoa.
Over time, your quickness with a cocky rejoinder must have gotten you many punches in the face - Al Swearengen
by lemon20pie on Nov 14, 2008 5:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
ridiculous comparison
http://minors.baseball-reference.com/players.cgi?pid=25479
http://minors.baseball-reference.com/players.cgi?pid=31456
the comparison is LUDICROUS
Novoa’s minor league k/9 = 6.60
Ceda’s minor league k/9 = 11.3
Novoa NEVER missed bats like Ceda does
by DartmouthCubsFan on Nov 14, 2008 5:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
ha honestly
that guy has no idea what hes talking about
by Glacier on Nov 14, 2008 7:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Prediction...
Gregg falls flat on his face, forcing the team to give up more prospects to get a more reliable reliever sometime in July
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:25 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Whats sad
Whats sad is fans are going to be rooting against him. He did not make this trade
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I won't root against him.
I’ll be saying insulting things about Hendry under my breath, but I won’t root against him.
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Nov 14, 2008 4:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed, I won't boo him at all; I hope he prospers here
But I have lost a lot of respect from Hendry over the past 36 hours.
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe not...
but many will. Sort of like a Jacque Jones thing. Fans were VERY critical of that signing and we started slow, people were on his ass the first week. Kinda hard to recover, particularly a relief pitcher, when the fans are against you from the get-go.
by Great Odin's Raven on Nov 14, 2008 6:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Right....Hendry should be held accountable
People rave about how he never loses a FA he wants to keep…big deal, I doubt that is that hard as long as you give the guy fair market value, like if Hendry wasnt the GM, Zambrano wouldve turned his nose up at a 90M dollar deal.
He overreacts to losing Beltran by wildly overspending on Soriano when no one else was in the same range ( I believe it was the Stros and Philly). He throws away two pitching prospects for a rag arm, low OBP leadoff man in Pierre.
He gives Marquis 20+M dollars when the Cubs had seen first hand how bad he was, he was in their division for crying out loud.
He’s been salvaged by a 300M shopping spree, which would make any GM look good.
I can see why he likes Soriano, he’s exactly like him, its feast or famine with his moves
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hendry
Hendry should be held accountable when this all plays out not NOW.
Thngs of worth are worth fighting for regardless of the odds.
by cubstoseriesby100 on Nov 14, 2008 4:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well apparently he doesn't want Wood
unless Wood resigns then Hendry should be held accountable
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
true, I might be typing out of emotion
But this just seems like a mistake when the guy wanted to stay and theres no real rationale argument against a one year deal, he was healthy, an allstar and had over 30 saves
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 4:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
On what basis
do you blame Hendry? By all accounts his relationship with Kerry is good. He’s not going to turn his nose up to a one-year below-market deal. He never did the past two years. Hendry is not responsible for pushing Kerry out.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 4:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He didnt offer a one year deal, thats the point
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Nov 14, 2008 5:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
We don't know what was offered and what wasn't.
But there’s no way Hendry wouldn’t agree to take Wood for the same contract he gave him the past two years – unless someone else in the organization told him not to. We have a positive history of Hendry’s negotiations with Wood. They are fair to one another and each is saying that publicly still.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 14, 2008 5:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So you're saying we don't know what was offered and what wasn't.
I agree. We don’t know. And won’t know until/unless the right people come out and make some definitive statements (I’m not gonna hold my breath waiting for that…)
Yet you indicate with some degree of certainty that someone else in the organization told him (Hendry) not to (sign Wood).
How do you know what the the rest of the organization is thinking when you’ve already said we don’t know what was offered and what wasn’t?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Nov 15, 2008 3:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Because...
…it plays into the (Lou is a bad guy) conspiracy theory. Never mind the club has more pressing needs, that just isn’t important.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 5:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
ahhh.... silly me. How could I forget about the conspiracy angle...
I needs to watch me some old x-files episodes. ;-)
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Nov 15, 2008 5:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I know my qualifications can be annoying
but this is one case where qualifications are necessary until we know more.
That said, a picture is emerging if you believe Kerry’s side of the story, and that picture suggests someone in the Cubs wanted a pitcher off the team, a pitcher who was willing to do “anything” to sign.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 15, 2008 5:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Again...
…do you know what anything means? I’ll bet Wood was willing to take one year, when he could get 3 on the open market. What we don’t know is how much he wanted for one year, and anyone who says they do is full of shit.
Did they want him off the team? Yes, they absolutely did, because they needed that dough for needs they deemed more important in 09.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Nov 15, 2008 5:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It sounded like Kerry was willing to work any kind of contract.
I’ve admitted that Kerry could be exaggerating. That is one possibility. I’m hoping this story has more to be written yet, because I have more questions.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 15, 2008 5:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i wouldnt be worried
in 2007 we heckled him pretty damn good and he handled it well. i think he pitched a 123 ninth actually. funny thing actually same game we heckle matt treanor. funny ass guy. he said he would meet me in the parking lot after the game to smoke a joint. plus hes got a hot wife
by Glacier on Nov 14, 2008 7:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Email your complaints here (season ticket holders)...
Just got this email from Crane at 3:51pm today
You said you would like a separate area within the Cubs.com Web site to converse with each other,
coordinate events and ticket exchanges, obtain updates from Cubs management, provide feedback on a
more regular basis and celebrate Cubs baseball. Today we launched the beta version of that Web site,
which can be accessed at www.cubs.com\sth.
"Just win tonight" - derv
by derv on Nov 14, 2008 4:30 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
so let me get this straight
Wood was paid 4.5m last year, Gregg is arbitration eliglble and will most likely get the same if not more. Wood would of taken a deal in the 6 million range I am sure.
This is 48 hours of stupidity that reeks of 2004 all over again.
Where is Blue mike and all the others who wanted Wood out and this being a good baseball move. Lets here from you.
This is Horse $%^&
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
by Grockcubs on Nov 14, 2008 4:33 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
don't even put those symbols
you can say the word shit on moves like this
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Nov 14, 2008 4:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I really am shocked after reading this.
It seems from Woodies comments that it was the Cubs who didn’t want him and he really would’ve done whatever it took to stay here, which is not at all how I thought it would be. It is horseshit. Wood would’ve obviously made the Cubs better next year than Gregg and not only that, but Wood has been loyal to this organization and taken less money. I want Hendry’s head on a platter.
Over time, your quickness with a cocky rejoinder must have gotten you many punches in the face - Al Swearengen
by lemon20pie on Nov 14, 2008 4:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs