Trying to pull together what is on the stove?
by Ivy Walls on Nov 7, 2008 2:23 PM CST
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PrintNow that the Presidential Election is over I can come up for air. Illinois is now center of the world.
Now let me see what I am figuring out. Jake Peavy is top of the choice. Cubs are willing to give up Samardzija, Pie (two good proven prospects) plus fill ins like Cedeno, Hart, Marshall, Fontenot (who is a nice role player) and possibly a prospect in Veal.Sounds like a lot of players, for a rent a pitcher who is 27 and an All Star and another almost Ace. That said Peavy is approaching is prime year. Losing Samardz could be costly but not core....Pie is expendable period especially with Dome going to CF with a possible platoon.Marshall as well.
Fontenot is also expendible as is Cedeno since I think the Cubs are seeking a real SS and that means Theriot is moved to the role of utility/spot starter....
This dovetails into the Furcal chatter.....which would solve the SS and lead off problem where having Theriot as a utility spot starter makes sense.
So that leaves Dempster where I see chatter that he is going to be resigned. Now that also goes to Samardz where if the Cubs don't sign Wood leaves a hole.
Do I have it all? Well no.
There is a left handed RF or other power thumper that the Cubs covet. Who----Bradley? Abreu? Dunn? Tex?
I don't like old but Bradley would be interesting and will Piniella work with him? Could he survive the press here?
A lineup of Furcal, DeRosa, Soriano, Ramirez, Bradley, Lee, Soto, Dome would be balanced, left handed/right handed
SP'ing: Peavy, Zambrano, Harden, Dempster and Lilly would be devastating
The thing is it leaves Marquis and Hill out. Hill could be put in AAA back up but Marquis is then traded.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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Harden also rumored in Peavy deal, plus, it looks like Dempster won't be
resigned because he’s demanding 5 years. So, although that rotation would be devastating, it’s extremely unlikely.
Look, in the sky !!!
It’s a plane, it’s a bird, no…it’s the mambochicken !!! So many aliases !!!
McGrath: I got a good deal on those boys. The scouts said they showed a lot of promise.
Reggie Dunlop: They brought their f***in' TOYS with 'em!
McGrath: Well, I'd rather have em playin with their toys than playin with themselves.
Reggie Dunlop: They're too dumb to play with themselves. Boy, every piece of garbage that comes into the market and you gotta buy it!
huh?
Mike, what the hell are you talking about. I think somebody pounded a little too much sand up your ass.
lol
he thinks you’re me. Or I’m you.
I think the lids have come off the paint cans in his grandmother’s basement. He needs to come up for air.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on Nov 7, 2008 4:04 PM CST up reply actions
If you're mambochicken, he's the Disco Duck
He just keeps repeating the same thing over and over and over . . . .
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 7, 2008 4:12 PM CST up reply actions
well, when you essentially
refuse to respond to 80% of the replies made to your comments, you can’t really have a conversation with anyone, so all you’re left with is repeating yourself, slowly speaking louder and louder till you’re shouting in the lobby of the Hilton, while the guests & busboys ignore you, and security hurries towards you with a displeased look on their faces.
Usually they have bags of sand, too.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on Nov 7, 2008 4:22 PM CST up reply actions
I wonder if he's one of those
Who speaks slllowwwwly AND LOUD to people who don’t understand English . . .
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 7, 2008 4:27 PM CST up reply actions
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE WORDS THAT ARE COMING OUT OF MY MOUTH?
PITCHING IS KING!
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on Nov 7, 2008 4:32 PM CST up reply actions
FU mambochicken, that's so clever
mama likes mambo, daddy likes mambo
I like my chicken fried and my microphones blue
I can play baseball better than you
if you don’t believe me then read my posts
I was the one who voted for Ned Yost.
mama likes mambo
Tommie Agee was out.
"This field, this game, is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that was once good, and it could be good again." TM
by Weeghman Park on Nov 7, 2008 4:36 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
One of the 10 best posts ever
Let’s turn this one green.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 7, 2008 4:43 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
SO rec'd...
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on Nov 7, 2008 5:03 PM CST up reply actions
Fontenot and The Shark are reportedly not in this deal
Shark has a full no-trade.
It also makes zero sense for Harden to be involved. The Padres will want cheap guys with as little service guys as possible, not guys with one year and millions of dollars left on their contract.
Further...
… I read somewhere (can’t find the link right now) that Shark’s agent was quoted as saying that they will NOT waive the no-trade under any circumstances.
So you can forget that part of any such deal.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
If someone runs across a link for that
I’d like to see it.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 8, 2008 5:47 AM CST up reply actions
Let me try that again,
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Nov 8, 2008 11:43 AM CST up reply actions
Wow.
I’m surprised Samardzija would rather be a reliever in Wrigley than a starter in PETCO.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
I'm not
a) Samardzija grew up in Valparaiso. He likes it here.
b) The Cubs are obviously closer to winning than the Padres are.
Seems like a no-brainer to me.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Not sure that I agree.
Shark has made $10M so far — at least when that contract ends.
Depending on service time, option years, etc., he may or may not have an arb year or two.
Then it gets interesting…
Medicore SPs like Marquis make $7-10M per season. Good SPs make $12-15M. Only the top closers make that much; set-up men usually get less than $5M. So…
In refusing a trade to a team that will develop him as a SP in the MLs, he wants to stay with a club that will use him in the bullpen for the foreseeable future — which will cut his future earnings potential in half.
That seems a bit short-sighted, if you ask me.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
Maybe, maybe not.
There are what, three years left on that deal? By then, maybe he’ll be the Cubs’ closer. Then he could make the big $.
Again, I point out that some players have agendas other than just squeezing out every single dollar they can. Remember that baseball players, if they’re any good at all and can have, say, a ten-year career, will make more money than they can ever spend.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
There's no guarantee of future health
I think that the popular sentiment of Wood being willing to turn down +$10M over the length of a contract is misguided, but we may find out.
I really think if Samardzija believes that he’s guaranteed to pitch effectively for 10 years, thereby making essentially the same money, that he’s just being foolish.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 8, 2008 7:37 PM CST up reply actions
Peavy
He’s hardly a rent-a-pitcher. He’s a top flight pitcher who would be under the Cubs (or whoever else) control for at least four years.
sorry ---that changes everything
it is a very good trade
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
The idea of inserting Peavy
into the rotation is definitely arousing, as you can “never have too much good starting pitching.” But, as was written in the Times today, we would probably have to move the bulk of our bargaining chips to complete any kind of a Peavy deal. By doing so, we would more than likely wave goodbye to any possible chance to re-visit TTTSNBM. Would most everybody, as it seems, prefer to add Peavy to the rotation as opposed to using those pieces and making the move for Roberts? I know, I know, there is no gaurantee that that deal can be swung, and I know what a headache Baltimore was to deal with last year. I just think, if I had to choose, I would rather make the move for the top of the order guy…if possible.
"I love when they play that Go Cubs Win song."
You might be right
The Peavy thing has taken on a life of its own. If I had my druthers, Id go for Furcal and Dunn. Roberts would be good, but that still wouldnt address the issue at SS, particularly defensively.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Yeah
no it wouldn’t address the SS issue. This is true. I just would really really enjoy going into next season with a typical leadoff guy. And I actually just don’t see the Furcal thing happening. And being that our rotation is not really close to being our big problem, I just think I’d prefer to use those bargaining chips to try and solve one of our bigger problems…having a prototypical leadoff guy. I’m just not sure what to do with our SS situation though. I just don’t know…
"I love when they play that Go Cubs Win song."
I agree, and if it wasnt...
Jake Peavy we’re talking about, I wouldnt be so interested, but he’s a hell of a pitcher…..so if it came down to trading for him and letting Dempster walk, using the 10-15M that wouldve gone to him to address other areas, Id be ok with that as well.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Yeah, I know
I won’t be crying in my Old Style if we somehow landed Peavy, that’s for sure. Though, I prolly won’t believe it until I see Hendry hanging the pinstriped jersey on Jake sometime this winter.
"I love when they play that Go Cubs Win song."
Agreed
I would prefer Dunn and Furcal as priorities over Peavy, but if this replaces Dempster in the rotation I am all for it – am I the only one who feels he will never repeat last season’s success?
I know Dunn would probably be a butcher in RF, but his bat should be worth far more. And Furcal would solve the lead-off dilemna (if his back can hold up) or he’d fit in the 2 spot just as well if Soriano cries and mopes too much (heck, I might prefer Furcal batting 3rd over Lee right now).
Hermida would be a fine second-place trophy in RF though. (But is there anything to the rumors out there that Hermida is highly unmotivated as a player? Of course, the same was said about Dunn too.)
What about Orlando Cabrera at SS? Should come cheaper than Furcal and would look nice in 2 hole.
100 years would have been nice, but 101 years still has a nice ring to it.
Dunn
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8754588/Dunn,-Teixeira-can-expect—plenty-of-interest
Obviously, the Cubs must re-up with Ryan Dempster and Kerry Wood. They also need to add an impact right fielder, now that Kosuke Fukudome is going to be part of a platoon arrangement in center. Preferably that right fielder will have strong OBP skills from the left side of the plate. Adam Dunn would work, as would Raul Ibanez. Should the Padres decline their option on Brian Giles, he’d also be a good fit. And even though he’s not right-handed, Manny Ramirez would of course greatly improve the Cubs.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Ummm....
Is Dayn Perry talking about the Manny Ramirez that played for the BoSox and Dodgers last year? The guy who played against the Cubs in the NLDS? He stood in the RH batter’s box every time I saw him. How is he suddenly “not right-handed”?
Dayn Perry needs to find a new vocation.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
HA, I didnt notice that.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Fukudome blurb
I don’t buy it, but there was a blurb on chicagosports.com (Trib) that other teams had asked about Fukudome.
Also, supposedly (I say this as I didn’t hear it) Bruce Levine suggested that the Cubs were discussing Olsen/Hermida with the Marlins to potentially spin Olsen off to the Padres (does make some sense, Hermida would be a cheap RF option, which would be necessary if we add Peavy; Olsen, as much as I think he is overrated, might fit well in Petco (flyball rate); and we do match up somewhat well with what the Marlins are rumored to be seeking).
Well
They went into this offseason looking to reshape their positional base. They were very strikeout/home run prone last year and wanted to increase the speed/defense capabilities. Adding Cameron Maybin will help with that, but they could look for another speed/defense OF to challenge. They’ll also perhaps contemplate another infielder. They do have Gaby Sanchez at 1st and Chris Coghlan at 2nd, along with a bunch of other guys.
As of right now, though, most indications are pointing to them wanting a catcher, and that’s where we match up with Wellington Castillo. They have John Baker and then a bunch of eh’s in Matt Treanor and Mike Rabelo. Another thing they may be looking for is a young pen arm with closer potential, as Lindstrom isn’t exactly young (with Gregg likely to be moved).
And this being the Marlins, they’ll look for any and all arms.
Sounds good, we dont need Castillo
If he comes cheap, Id be all for it, but there sure are some conflicting views on Hermida
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
We MAY need Castillo in a year or two.
I wouldn’t be so quick to deal him.
(Looking to make him Soto’s backup after Blanco retires)
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
We won't NEED a backup C
nearly as much as we’ll need a LH OF with power, OBP, and some speed.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 8, 2008 5:52 AM CST up reply actions
If Castillo projects as a starting catcher,
the Cubs should trade him — when the right deal comes along — to maximize his value. Making him the backup will just reduce his value, and guys like Koyie Hill are readily available. (cf. Jarrod Saltalamacchia with the Braves)
It is best to trade a guy like that after his AA or first AAA season. Repeating AAA can reduce a guy’s value, as can burning a guy’s options.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
We have some other options
Clevenger could still develop into a decent enough catcher to backup. Carlos Perez is certainly an intriguing young guy. Too lazy to dig up other names, but there’s also um, the 7th round pick, Flores from this year (defensive guy, not much bat), and of course there’s Cerda. And someone like Blake Lalli could be a survivable backup catcher option.
Of course, with a young guy like Soto, there stands a possibility that the team goes to look for another veteran if Blanco goes.
On a side note, part of me, from a value perspective, is wary about giving up Castillo in that he really could be a good one. A lot of people still believe his bat will develop and add a bit more pop to it. Add in his plus defensive skills, and he is very good value. That said, with Soto available, Castillo is definitely a chip that can be moved without really hurting our short or long term.
Just to give it a bit of thought....
if the Cubs are unable to give Wood the cash he deserves due to possible deals in the near future….
How would anyone feel about the Cubs taking a look at Izzy?
He’d be cheaper, that’s for sure.
That way you’d keep Marmol as SU and give Izzy a shot as CL.
Trevor Hoffman might be available...
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
Izzy?
The same pitcher who lost his closer role due to sucking last season? Hoffman would be a better shot. I personally think we need Woody back, Demp back, and I like the idea of Hermida and Peavy. While I am at it, sure, throw Manny in there too. It’s not like our economy is unstable or anything right?
Kwa...Ki...Sur...Pee...Nee...Ku?
We dont have an unlimited budget....
otherwise great idea!!!
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
of
imagine soriano in left and dunn in right.all the teams would say hit it to the outfield
Maybe the NL could start having a
Designated Fielder rule.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 8, 2008 5:53 AM CST up reply actions
Or softball rules
extra fielder. Goodness, no Dunn for me. The one area the Cubs were solid in was catching the ball. Outfield defense is underated, and with the adventures in left with Soriano, we don’t need a nose tackle in right.
I would love Peavy on this team, but my first priority would be to sign Wood, 2 years guarenteed, 3rd opition. Then leadoff hitter.
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
That's usually the objective, anyway
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 8, 2008 8:31 AM CST up reply actions
What do all the teams say now?
Hit it to the infield?
Tommie Agee was out.
"This field, this game, is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that was once good, and it could be good again." TM
by Weeghman Park on Nov 9, 2008 9:34 PM CST up reply actions
Dunn
has everyone forgotten that he’s another free swinging hack who strikes out ALOT?? he’s horrible in the field,aging and he will want a huge contract. stay far far away from dunn.
I BELIEVE!!!! GO CUBBIES!!!!!!!!!!
There are plenty of reasons to dislike Dunn.
However, “aging” is not one of them. He’s one of the younger free agents.
Also, “huge contract” is not one of them. Given his drawbacks and the Riccardi-revealed-reality that some teams will stay away from him, his market is smaller than other players who produce less with the bat.
Also “strikes out ALOT” is not such a big deal given where he will bat in the order – presumably before Aramis Ramirez, who makes great contact. The complaint on Dunn is that he walks or strikes out more than hitting RISP in – that’s actually a great guy to have hitting before Aramis, because Aramis will either still have a chance with one more out or have a chance with someone else on or Dunn will have cleared the bases – all either good or not a problem for Aramis.
The one issue is “horrible in the field.” The problem is that Ibanez and Abreu aren’t any better. And Dunn offers more with the bat and a much younger age than either of them.
So, who did you want as your LH bat?
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
I think we should just stick him at SS
and dare people to try and break up the double play.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
your sarcasm is breathless....more summary
I wanted the post to flush out the situations since even before we lost I was in another world of focus. Starting out I think Dunn is Dave Kingman reincarnate from the left side. Big swing, lot of wiffs, big majestic HR’s when struck, out of his league in the NL playing any field position.
But he has some talent. The problem I see is that he forces the Cubs to put Soriano in RF where things would be worse than LF and yet less chances in RF which might balance things out.
To me in the position and lineup the Cubs need to deal with SS…period. That is the key position for improving that and if that person happens to be a bona fide lead off than all the better. What this does is make Theriot either the best utility/spot starter where he can play 2B against LH starters where Cubs could move DeRosa to RF if there is a LH bat playing there. What it does is allow the Cubs to then either turn to Fontenot as their PH designate and/or put him in winter ball and learn the OF as a utility player. This improves the first line bench since Theriot could play two infield positions and spot start and move Fontenot to the OF for spot duty as well but keep his good bat.
Now getting more left handed bats in the lineup. Fukudome goes to CF…. I think he will improve more in his second season both driven to work on changing some of his approach and two not being worn down early on as he will platoon with Reed Johnson. As the season unfolds he could wrestle the full time starting spot with more success than this year.
So back to RF….Hermida or Bradley are supposed attitude risks. Then there is Giles from SD, except for the talented Milton Board Game namesake there is not much power here but still left-handed bats. So the thing comes back to Furcal. He is a switch hitting, good glove, good base running able SS. He adds a LHB to the lineup with two OF’ers, still 3/8 but better.
Okay back to the Peavy Sweepstakes…
Appears that Samardzija is off the table which would have cemented the deal for Ronnie OneDec, Felix Neverquitemadeit and Sean 5IP Marshall, plus trying to add Kevin ‘Slider’ Hart, and dangling prospects Donnie lookalike Dontrelle Veal, big prospect Vitters, catching phenom Wellington Castillo, or big arm Ceda.
The best thing is that the Padres have a limited time and limited pool to work a deal, Braves and Cubs are bidding against each other and hopefully the Cubs aren’t bidding against themselves since Braves are not dealing pitching phenom Hansen.
I predict that Pad’s go with Marshall, Pie, Ronnie plus take Veal and Castillo & Ceda. Cubs don’t give up on Vitters and Samardz (who won’t relent).
This then puts the Cubs in the money sweepstakes for Furcal.
Now the other smoke signals appear with the Marlins. Cubs have to sign Dempster to trade Rich Hill. Signing Demp would complete the rotation——Z, Peavy, Harden, Demp, Lilly and with Marquis and Hill as extra’s. Funny what that could bring.
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Nov 8, 2008 11:44 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I've said the same
regarding Kingman = Dunn many times on BCB. Please, Jim. . . resist temptation!
You seem to be summarizing things well enough.
What’s astounding to consider, though, is that 10 days ago, none of us here were even considering the possibility of Jake Peavy. Things could come along and surprise us again.
A few wildly irresponsible predictions….
Furcal will be revealed as a top target the day he hits the open market. Hendry will get him to a chorus of complaints here at BCB.
The deal with the Pads will be a four-team deal with FL and Cleveland – the Cubs will have few trade chips left after netting Jeremy Hermida, Jake Peavy, and Rafael Perez.
The Cubs WILL trade Alfonso Soriano.
Our lineup will start the season as:
Furcal
Myan Fontiot
Ramirez
Ibanez
Lee
Hermida
Soto
Fukudome
It will end the season as:
Furcal
Fukudome
Ramirez
Soto
Hermida
DLee
Reeul Ibahnson
Nate Spears
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
DGU
Serious or sarcasm?
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
Maybe
neither.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 8, 2008 4:56 PM CST up reply actions
Dunn's lack of mobility now is what worries me about the future.
With Dunn’s lack of athleticism at the age of 29, I don’t think he will age well.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Nov 8, 2008 11:48 AM CST up reply actions
ummm
so ur saying dunn has no problem but his defense?? sorry I dont agree—he’s another guess hitting hack who’s had back problems. Someone’s gonna give him a monster contract to the tune of 12-14 at 3-4 years.
I BELIEVE!!!! GO CUBBIES!!!!!!!!!!
ummm
No, that’s not what I said. I said that 3 out of the 4 problems you mentioned weren’t real problems. He has problems. Most of them are in the field.
And if Dunn only takes 3/36, the Cubs should jump at that.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
That's a bit harsh
I’d rather have Dunn than Ibanez, for example.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 8, 2008 1:03 PM CST up reply actions
thats what he is
watch him. he’s a all or nothing hitter. he leaves nothing on the table when swinging.
I BELIEVE!!!! GO CUBBIES!!!!!!!!!!
Heaven forbid we sign...
a 40 HR guy who gets on base like crazy based on completely subjective criticism.
Free Ronny Cedeno
having seen........
alot of reds games this year his HR stat is a little decieving. I watched many many games where he was really needed and didnt come through. after the game was out of hand he would belt a 420 ft shot and hit a double. things like that. at the end of the day dunn is a good ballplayer but he just dont fit what this team needs. especially in terms of what are payroll is and how much we have left to spend.
I BELIEVE!!!! GO CUBBIES!!!!!!!!!!
I'm sorry, but K25 is right.
That’s completely subjective.
And in looking at his OPS, I’d take him for $12 M to play RF.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 8, 2008 7:41 PM CST up reply actions
stop already
he cant play right field at all whatsoever. why is that so hard to believe?? he cant even play left field. no no no no no no stay away from adam dunn
I BELIEVE!!!! GO CUBBIES!!!!!!!!!!
how do you really feel?
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 8, 2008 8:02 PM CST up reply actions
How many GIDP did Dunn have this year?
We need a power hitter; let’s get two. Just sign JR up at the same time and they can each play two early innings and then put Koske in for late inning defense. Hell, I heard a rumor we could get Barry Bonds cheap to play LF and then make a 3B out of Soriano and make a 1B out of Aramis and trade DLee straight up for Jake Peavy and sigh CC. Easy. Then all we would need to is get Jimmy Rollins and Chase Utley for middle infield and we should finish over .500
Key is to get Henry Blanco signed cheap and for Demp, Wood to five us huge hometown discounts with 30 year personal service contracts to spread our their liability. And get some professional therapy for Z to channel his energy through his left eyelid and you’ve got a solid contender for the upper half of the NL Central.
Tommie Agee was out.
"This field, this game, is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that was once good, and it could be good again." TM
by Weeghman Park on Nov 8, 2008 10:32 PM CST up reply actions
I'm amazed.
That lineup will definitely enable us to lose only 3-1 in the NLDS next year. PROGRESS!!!
Free Ronny Cedeno
If you've read any of the previous posts...
I think I’ve conceded the fact that Dunn will most certainly be subpar in the outfield. I get it. My personal opinion is that his LH bat in the middle of the lineup is worth his defensive woes, especially when we have two potential defensive replacements for late innings and special situations (Dome, Pie).
I could understand a valid argument against Dunn. He has his weaknesses. But “guess hitting hack,” “he leaves nothing on the table (at the plate),” and “stay away from Dunn” are hardly means to an intelligent argument. I respect your hesitation to sign him, but your argument seems bizarrely personal. Did he refuse an autograph?
Free Ronny Cedeno
no
we have soriano who leaves it all that the plate but many times ends up headed back to the dugout after taking a monstrous homerun cut on a pitch 3 ft outside.
Yes I said it-stay away from dunn—-dunn in right field would be like daryle ward playing shortstop. I realize dunn is only 29 but i gotta believe his body has aged well beyond that with the back problems etc.
I’ve watched Dunn ALOT and when he is on(much like sori) he can carry a team for a few days at a time. For the most part his numbers are decieving IMO. He’s not half as good as ramirez in the clutch. Many many times he looks like a fool at the plate much like sori with his pitch selection.
So I guess by your standards thats not a “intelligent argument” but I will stick by my opinion—stay away from adam dunn.
I BELIEVE!!!! GO CUBBIES!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks.
Your last statement summed it up—you have no argument based on reality. So be it.
Like Darlye Ward at SS? Really? I realize that’s sarcasm, but it’s ridiculous. Dunn has 5 straight years of 40+ HRs, with an almost identical OBP. Where exactly has the back issues become a cause for concern?
Numbers are deceiving…is he a ‘stats whore’? Geez….I’m just in favor of signing Dunn…not necessarily even fully supporting the thing, and yet I find myself enthralled in his defense because these arguments are baseless.
Free Ronny Cedeno
Adam Dunn - Milton Bradley - Barry Bonds
The Axis of OF EVIL. Not only should we stay away from these guys, we should actively seek out and punish any teams that harbor these guys.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 9, 2008 6:37 AM CST up reply actions
You're equating Dunn to Bradley and Bonds?
On what basis?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
The reactions people have to these guys here;
reactions which completely ignore baseball ability when discussing what might make for a winning roster.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 9, 2008 7:33 AM CST up reply actions
Dunn can hit.
Dunn can’t field.
I won’t be disappointed if it doesn’t happen, but I think it would improve our team.
Free Ronny Cedeno
Right.
The Cubs should not be considering Garet Anderson, Raul Ibanez, or Bobby Abreu as long as the bidding on Dunn is low. And, as much as I like Hermida, it’s questionable that we should trade anything for him if Dunn is really available for closer to 10 M than 15 M.
Now, I would be open to arguments that Barry Bonds is preferrable to Dunn.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 9, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions
I think a team
can get a away with one bad fielding outfielder but not two. A defensive outfield with Soriano and Dunn on the corners would frighten any pitching staff!
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Nov 9, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions
You're right...
but I think Soriano is slightly underrated in the OF. He isn’t good by any means, but his arm keeps runners fairly honest and he has the speed to get to balls.
Free Ronny Cedeno
Sure.
Answer me this question – how much better would the Cubs’ offense have been in the playoffs had Bonds been batting 2nd?
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Nov 9, 2008 4:57 PM CST up reply actions
I actually would agree...
And even though I hate the man, I would have been in favor of signing him the last two years. I just don’t know if he’s still got anything left after sitting this whole year.
I will say that, when I wanted him signed, that I even considered moving Soriano back to 2B…
Free Ronny Cedeno
your just another
armchair gm who wants to sign every big name FA out there. How well has that worked for the yankees. come up with someone thats gonna help this team, then you can come back and have a sensible conversation with me.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year os an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
Ok.
So you make your argument with subjective analysis and BlueMike logic…e.g. “guess-hitting hack.” Then you accuse me of not having a sensible conversation? Right.
Signing a FA doesn’t make us the Yankees. I’m not saying, get Peavy, get Dunn, get Abreu, get Burnett, etc. etc. so don’t tell me I’m trying to make us like the Yankees.
An argument against Dunn could certainly be made and supported. Unfortunately, you failed to do this with logic and statistics. I’m signed off on this.
Free Ronny Cedeno
no
you’ve failed to tell us why we need him other than he hits 40 hr’s. your not taking into account his k’s, terrible defense(where would he play?), large contract considering we are near budget max, and his past back probs. please please dont ever compare me to bluemike,,I would rather you slap my mom or spit in my face. hehehe
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
I don't think that he said the Cubs needed Dunn
Just that if the price is low, he is worth taking a chance on.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 9, 2008 2:42 PM CST up reply actions
but
take a chance on him where???? thats what i’m getting at. he cant play center,nor right,and is horrible in left(his current position). we have sori in left,lee at 1st and no dh. this is really a non conversation. i’m done with it.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
Then why do you keep replying?
You’re really coming across as condescending.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Nov 9, 2008 3:11 PM CST up reply actions
If a player's price drops,
don’t you wonder why?
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Nov 9, 2008 3:57 PM CST up reply actions
That was indeed my intent...
I’m not saying “get him no matter what.” I just feel he’s worth a reasonable contract, if available.
He has had 5 straight seasons of almost identical HR and OBP stats (40+, .390ish) and seems right in his prime.
i don’t know. I see the cons, but I feel it might ultimately be worth it.
Free Ronny Cedeno
nice conversation
nonetheless. I enjoyed being able to have a good back and forth talk with you. I think we have way to many holes to fill.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
Stay Away From Dunn!
Hermida is a better option if you’re looking for a young lefty who strikes out a lot. At least he can field. He’s a way cheaper solution and he may develop into a great talent in a few years. Certainly he can provide power out of right field but not like Dunn, who I would not even consider.
I agree with this.
The Marlins are definitely going to look to trade arb-eligible guys like him… and Ricky Nolasco, who I have also advocated acquiring.
That’s what Hendry is going to have to do — be creative and improve the team through trades, not just pile up names from the free agent list.
A couple of years ago, I was all for getting Adam Dunn. But that was when the Cubs needed a left fielder. Dunn isn’t even a good LF any more. He’d be brutal in RF. Yes, he played 23 games last year there for Arizona. That doesn’t mean he’s a right fielder.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
As far as I understand,
Scott Olsen is the pitcher they want to get rid of for cost cutting.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Nov 9, 2008 4:00 PM CST up reply actions
Well...
… Olsen has talent, but he’s a headcase.
Nolasco is likely to be in line for a very large arb raise this winter — I heard they might be wanting to move him.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
I haven't heard that one
Where’d you hear that Al? Just curious. Everything out there suggests that, after Jacobs, their main focus is moving Olsen and Gregg, with one of the OF’s as a possibility. With their increased payroll, they can afford to hang onto most of their guys.
The only thing I remember out there
hinting at a possible Nolasco deal was Evan Grant suggesting that NEftali Feliz and Taylor Teagarden might net you Ricky Nolasco and Renyel Pinto. We really don’t have that sort of value just lying around, as Feliz is a big time prospect.
I did hear this before the season ended.
Perhaps things have changed since then. If that’s true, then the Cubs should set their sights on Hermida.
As far as getting a cheap young pitcher, would the Cubs have enough to pry John Lannan away from Washington?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
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