Hopefully last Peavy post: Levine reports deal almost done
by Rezze21 on Dec 10, 2008 11:48 AM CST
284 comments
Just listening to ESPN1000 and a deal is about to go down between the Cubs/Phillies/Padres
Cubs get:
Jake Peavy
Padres get:
Kevin Hart
Jason Marquis (Cubs eat portion of contract)
Josh Vitters
Phillies prospects (I think Happ is one of them)
Phillies get:
Mark DeRosa
Basically giving up Hart, Vitters, and Derosa for Peavy. I like it. I think this is deserving of a new thread. He also said the Cubs might be trading for a RF now.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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Wow
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Dec 10, 2008 11:52 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Wouldnt the last Peavy post be "We got Peavy!"
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 12:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hate to lose Dero, but I like it overall
and the Cubs’ starting rotation would be SICK
by DunstontoSandbergtoGrace on Dec 10, 2008 11:52 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure I like it.
Maybe 2 of the three, but all three for Peavy? I hope the Cubs get some insurance on his arm (and not through AIG).
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
by zevkalman on Dec 10, 2008 11:52 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
No, this is a great deal!
We keep Marshall and Guzman. We lose Hart (oh, well), get rid of Marquis and make our lineup more left-handed by plugging Fontenot in at second. Sure, losing Vitters kind of sucks. But the Cubs are in a win-now mode.
As for DeRo, I think this is an instance of the Cubs selling high for once. Love DeRo, but I’m OK losing him for Peavy.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:02 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
Agreed
and rec’d.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 12:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
unbelievable deal
we keep Cedeno, Guzman, Pie, Castillo
We get a Cy Young pitcher who will be top of the rotation allowing Zambrano to get some cover and concentrate on pitching. This pushes down Lilly or Harden to the 5th spot in the rotation, (probably Harden) where he will get 25-28 starts due to his brittle nature.
Cubs trade a prospect, a spare part, a super utility starter and an innings eater for a Cy Young pitcher still in his prime!
They probably dump $11M in salary to take on $11M in salary.
Cubs still can deal from strength….they can deal Wuertz, Cedeno, Pie for something like a Hermida or they can stand pat and acquire a FA RF’er.
This is a great trade…..a great one….as long as Peavy stays healthy
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 10, 2008 2:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Seconded.
This is a pretty great price to pay for 4 years of Peavy.
But I want to see this confirmed before I start jumping for joy.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 12:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
definitely
But I’m pretty psyched if we keep Marshall.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If so
it pretty much ends Marshall’s SP career for awhile ( or until Harden breaks down).
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Dec 10, 2008 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Or ...
it makes him our main lefty out of the pen.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes of course
My point, if I had one, was that those happy that Marshall was untouched don’t have anywhere to put him right now (except the bullpen, where his value isn’t as high).
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Dec 10, 2008 12:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that's arguable
He’s smart enough. Maybe he becomes a (pre-2007) Scott Eyre.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Marshall could still be traded.
Or so could Zambrano or Lilly.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I would not be surprised to see Marhsall or Lilly (or Harden) traded
but Z would be a big surprise.
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Dec 10, 2008 12:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Dont Trade Lilly, please!
He’s our Chuck Norris
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 12:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Indeed...
One of my favorite discussions of 2008: Ted Lilly Facts
I haz blurg: hotbeans.wordpress.com
by digitalbenjamin on Dec 10, 2008 12:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Z has a NTC
And Cubs officials were adamant in stories today that Z isn’t going anywhere.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Zambrano
is not going to be traded. Period.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Dec 10, 2008 12:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Also
Peavy will not be a Cub. That one had a “period” just two weeks back.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The difference is that there were multiple credible rumors around the Peavy thing
The Zambrano thing is a throwaway quote from a single article that’s been denied multiple times over. Common sense should tell you that Z won’t get moved.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 12:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's commonsense that has me thinking
Z could indeed be traded. I’m not saying It’s Definitely Going to Happen.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Nothing personal
but your common sense when it comes to trades isn’t very common.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 1:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If it weren't for the NTC, it makes perfect sense
Z is signed to a huge contract, is arguably no longer the ace of the staff (of course this is all assuming the Peavy rumors are true), has his obvious emotional issues, and has been overused early in his career.
The no trade clause makes it all irrelevant, though.
"Enough foreplay- let's get crackin'"- Fred Garvin
by davidalanu on Dec 10, 2008 2:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The NTC is what makes it difficult.
But I could see some scenarios where this would work very well. You just can’t do it like Towers did it.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 2:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No it wouldn't make sense
It doesn’t make sense.
Z is priced at market value. If you traded him, it would be a salary dump scenario, where you don’t get much of value in return (in terms of major-league ready talent). Look at Peavy – he’s signed below his market value and isn’t really yielding a huge bounty. The Braves balked at sending more than one of their top prospects for him.
But yes, it’s all academic anyway.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 2:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The market for top pitchers is thin.
The problem with Peavy’s trade value is that everyone knows he has to be traded. If you trade Z right, you talk quietly to one or two teams you know Z would waive his NTC to go to. You don’t ask for prospects, you ask to swap contracts of a player that other team would be willing to trade, if only they got equal value in return. That is why Beltran is a perfect target. The Mets get him out of NY and get an Ace.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 3:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Why would the Mets want to get him out of New York?
It just doesn’t make any sense at all. There’s a reason trades like you’re proposing never ever happen.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 3:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think Mark DeRosa
is a pretty good bounty. The guy plays at least five positions.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on Dec 10, 2008 4:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Peavy isn't getting much play on the trade market
because once Towers overplayed his hand with the braves it was obvious the Cubs were the only team left. Since towers decided to play this all out in the media, he lost all leverage.
"Enough foreplay- let's get crackin'"- Fred Garvin
by davidalanu on Dec 10, 2008 9:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
except
we keep giving up more (in the rumored proposals)… so while it would seem obvious that he’d lose leverage, it doesn’t seem to be playing out that way
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 9:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
We keep "giving up more" in rumors
because as different teams get involved they want to pick our pocket. This Jayson Stark piece is must reading – almost worth posting another fanpost :) –
According to two sources with knowledge of the discussions, the Cubs have dug in firmly on what they’re willing to give up. And when you think through their side of this, you can understand why.
In this piece, we also learn that Hendry “does not want” to trade DeRosa and has been “bombarded” with calls for DeRosa once his name leaked. That sounds a lot more likely than what we were hearing before, that DeRosa would go for two lesser prospects. I didn’t think so. DeRosa has great trade value. So, wait and see. I think we’ll be pleased with how this all turns out.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 9:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Like Peavy and a true RF lefty powerhouse
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 10, 2008 9:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And he can pitch, too.
But to get him you have to deal with the people in Baltimore, so…
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 10:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah that damn owner probably would want
trouble is all are past their primes
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 11, 2008 9:18 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't that Jack Quinlan in the middle?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 11, 2008 9:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
Mainly because of the emotional issues.
I just don’t think that he’ll ever grow up.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Dec 10, 2008 3:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just have to say
Excellent signature. That is all.
by dbaltman on Dec 10, 2008 6:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
no so much
i like getting peavy but i hate the fact of losing DeRo! i dont think you can put a price tag on him! he was way to valuable last year to this team! and with no help as of yet in RF how do you get rid of him? i think trading DeRo will be a big mistake and taking a big chance on getting a RF or leaving it to Dome
by bizzle4 on Dec 10, 2008 12:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
DeRosa...
…would actually be the first major league player I can recall Hendry trading while his value was at it’s peak.
I agree, you do this deal, the Cubs have been in a “win now” mode for 2 years and you can’t stop now.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Dec 10, 2008 5:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
"Hopefully last Peavy post"
LOL
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 11:54 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
not a fan
we gave up the two pieces i wanted to avoid giving up most: Vitters and DeRosa
Marshall, Pie, and Cedeno were the obvious pieces we needed to move in this deal and save DeRo or Vitters
Pie isn’t going to play with pineilla around so he needs to be dealt (unless Fukudome is dealt), and without having spots open in the rotation for years to come Marshall is now a redundant piece.
This isn’t what i was hoping to see….
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 11:54 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I agree.
Does this make our farm system the worst in the league?
Also, now we have a very weak hitting double play combination. Fontenot was good when he was utilized correctly last year, but I don’t see him being as good over a full season.
by dakoose on Dec 10, 2008 11:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think the Pie/Cedeno
pieces could end up being used in a 3-way w/ B’more for Hermida.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 11:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
even so
we’ve completely emptied the cupboard without allowing the opportunity to restock through draft pick collections on FA’s that leave
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The fact that we didn't get a draft pick off of Howry, Eyre, or Wood utterly stinks.
And we know two of those are totally Lou’s fault and the third looks like Lou’s fault, too. That’s where we are with Lou. He’ll try his best to win now, but he does not care about the long-term health of this organization.
There are worse things. At least we’re strong and competing now. I’d rather be competing now than filled with a promising farm system like Baltimore but with plenty of obstacles to winning.
Hopefully, post-Lou we can start rebuilding from the ground up.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i hear ya
i just don’t think the two (being strong now and rebuilding the farm system) were mutually exclusive…. and it seems we’ve treated them as such
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I definitely agree.
Things could have been so different last year and I think we would have been more likely to win in the post-season had we brought our higher-ceiling youth along. It was a double failure, in that way, for Lou-and-six.
But Lou doesn’t see the long-term health of the Cubs as even relevant to his job, so for him, it was zero failures, and all on Dempster.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Lou doesn't...
…make the deals, Hendry does. Blame Hendry or no one. That said, I don’t blame Hendry. This franchise is in a 100-year title drought. The farm system is good but not great. These trades won’t decimate us, not by a long shot. In fact, getting Peavy for a long time allows us the necessary time to build up the system.
Stop blaming Lou. – TL
[In 2008] Kila Ka’aihue had the best on-base percentage of any hitter in the minor leagues. - Joe Posnanski, 11/9/2008 ... Ergo, let's give him a shot at first base in KC in 2009.
by timlacy on Dec 10, 2008 1:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Whoah there...
Yes, Hendry ultimately makes the deals. But if you don’t think Hendry relies HEAVILY on Piniella’s opinion, I don’ think you’ve been paying attention. Hendry takes what Piniella thinks/wants and works to make it happen.
by SouthernCub on Dec 10, 2008 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, I think Hendry relies heavilly on the opinions
of the scouts he hired for the organization.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 10, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Surprisingly
The managers have less say than it seems — at least according to an answer that Bruce Miles gave me in his blog a few weeks ago.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Dec 10, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
When it comes to assembling a roster...
…I sure as hell would rather rely on Piniella’s input than Hendry’s. All you have to do is look at the track records.
Lastly, in your scenerio, Hendry should never get credit for player acquistions when they are good, or blame when they are bad. If he simply does everything Lou says, that would be the case.
Good GM’s don’t always agree with good managers in regards to assembling a roster, and the utlimate responsibility is and always should be with the GM – that’s his job.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Dec 10, 2008 5:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sure, Hendry has a TERRIBLE track record (sarcasm)
I think a little perspective is necessary when analyzing the job of a GM.
Acquiring D-Lee, Aramis Ramirez, Kenny Lofton, Rich Harden, Michael Barrett are just a few of the players he’s acquired via trade that turned out to be very productive players.
Of course, he’s also made some deals that haven’t worked out (cough, Juan Pierre, cough), but he’s been GM since 2002 and is now one of the longest tenured GM’s in baseball.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 11, 2008 1:02 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You're wildly misrepresenting what I said...
I didn’t say Hendry does everything Piniella says. I said he relies heavily on Piniella’s opinion. I’d say the two are jointly responsible for the moves that are made. They work together to identify players that they want, and then Hendry works with other GMs to make it happen.
I my scenario, both Hendry and Piniella deserve credit for good acquisitions and blame for bad ones. I agree that Hendry ultimately deserves MORE of the credit/blame because he’s Piniella’s boss, but I think it’s incorrect to say Piniella deserves no credit/blame.
by SouthernCub on Dec 11, 2008 7:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
we really ...
should have offered arbitration to Kerry.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not likely
As theyre supposedly going for someone like Johnny Cueto or Andy Sonnanstine for Hermida, we have no shot
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 12:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Who they ask for
and who they get are two different things.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well obviously
but the asking price is out of the Cubs range, particularly if the Peavy deal goes down…..If the Marlins were nice and had any sense of gratitude they would just give him to the Cubs for a hill of beans, they owe us
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 1:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I would have preferred to keep DeRosa around...
assuming this goes down — but I can’t argue with four years of a pitcher of this caliber for a year of DeRo, and basically a good prospect. Especially at below-market prices. If they’re not eating more than half of the Marquis contract, I think it’s a good deal.
And don’t worry too much about second base. I really think some guys are going to lose big in FA this year, and be available at big discounts.
by Damen Jackson on Dec 10, 2008 12:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Need to quit worrying about 2011 and beyond.
A lot can happen in the next 3 years. Hendry’s proven to be quite competent.
SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!
by CubFaninCA on Dec 10, 2008 12:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
that's the right idea....
no long-term planning, forget it all!!!!!!!!!
i forgot that’s how “successful organizations are run”
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
adding a 27 year old ace
with a cy young doesn’t help.. He’ll be washed up at 29.
SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!
by CubFaninCA on Dec 10, 2008 12:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
with a pitcher you never know
they can go from cy young to washed up that quickly….
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 1:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
and
vitters could be hee sop choi.
SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!
by CubFaninCA on Dec 10, 2008 1:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well once Lee and Ramirez deals are up, don you think they'll continue to spend?
They have the means to be players in FA every year, so I dont see a precipitous drop off after 2012 or so, that money will be off the books and hopefully put back into the team. Josh Vitters wont save the franchise by himself, so I dont see it as a big loss.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 12:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i don't know
our 2011 commitments are as follows (if we acquire Peavy):
Peavy – $16 Million
Zambrano – $17.875 Million
Soriano – $18 Million
Dempster – $13.5 Million
Fukudome – $13.5 Million
That’s almost $80 Million for 5 guys. You figure by that point Soto will be making quite a bit in arbitration (hopefully), let’s say $8 million (being conservative) and we’re around $87 Million for 6 guys.
If our payroll stayed in the same range, we’d have 53 million left for the remaining 19 guys or just under 3 million per player
that’s why you need farm guys to take up a big chunk of that space (if we intend on being competitive) so you get a bunch of ML minimum type guys that allow you to keep spending
if we don’t have that, we’re either going to be (barring big payroll jumps):
a) shopping in the FA bargain bin
b) fielding a completely non-competitive club
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 1:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If we win this year or next
i doubt i’ll even be aware of the 2011 team… floaty happy. :-P
by halfblindcubbiegirl on Dec 10, 2008 1:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
can always deal someone...
it’s a long ways off. try to enjoy this year and the next.
SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!
by CubFaninCA on Dec 10, 2008 1:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
those players
all have no trade clauses…
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 2:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll bet we're only paying half that Fukudome salary.
Of course, that exacerbates the payroll issue, as his replacement will probably be making eight figures too. But if Kosuke doesn’t figure things out quickly, he has to be shipped out.
But to quote Craig Finn, we gotta stay positive. Maybe the new ownership will create a Cubs Network and start bringing in Yankee-YES-type dollars.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Dec 10, 2008 2:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
2011 will be Soto's first arbitration year
(unless he qualifies as a super 2)
I doubt he will get $8 million in his first year of eligibility.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 10, 2008 2:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i bet
he’ll qualify as a super 2
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 2:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How is that determined?
Is it solely based on service time? Does September service time count?
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 10, 2008 2:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
"Super Twos"
All players with at least two, but less than three, years of service time are ranked in order of service time. The top 17% qualify as “super twos”.
I’m not sure whether or not the list includes players like Troy Tulowitski who have had their arb years bought out.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Dec 10, 2008 4:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks!
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 10, 2008 4:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Vitters was our best prospect.
Of course, that statement is entirely relative. He’s still very young, but he’s spit the bit every time they’ve tried to let him play regular A-ball. He hasn’t shown any power (or strike zone control) at short-season Boise.
I’ve been a huge Vitters defender, but even I have to admit that the 13 BB / 45 K in 60 games at short-season ball, for an “elite” offensive prospect, is… interesting. Not concerning, yet – especially in light of his solid OBP and average, but something you’d want to pay attention to. That and his pretty weak LD%.
Granted, spending last season at A ball would have been ahead of his age level, that’s exactly what Felix Pie managed to do – and then he played excellently at A+ ball at 19, and awesomely at AA at 20, and so on. Vitters is still playing at an ‘appropriate’ age level, but with only the very early returns in, he’s tracking about a level behind the “elite” prep players in his draft class.
That could be the result of his ticky-tacky injuries, and it could change, and quickly. Or it might not.
He certainly could develop power ala David Wright. And while “David Wright with less defense” probably remains Vitters’ best case scenario, the worst-case scenario is just as likely.
If this deal goes down as predicted, I’ll miss DeRosa, and I’ll regret losing a prospect like Vitters. But I’d feel a whole lot worse about losing Vitters if there was a bit more production mixed in with all his potential.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Dec 10, 2008 2:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The road to hell is paved with "potential".
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 10, 2008 2:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, the road to hell is paved with good intentions, but potential sounds just as good.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Dec 10, 2008 3:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The road to hell is paved with potentially good intentions?
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 3:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The road of intentions is paved with hell?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 3:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I-74 is paved? Like hell!
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
To hell with potential and intentions!
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Dec 10, 2008 3:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
To hell with potential and intentions!
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Dec 10, 2008 4:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow!
You had to do that twice! It must be potentially, intentionally, hellishly important!
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 5:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How did that happen....
from a small quote….
Ah what the hell :)
by cubsfaninatl on Dec 10, 2008 9:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
"A deal is about to go down"
LOL
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 11:55 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I'm gonna let that one pass. It's just too easy. Just like a Howry fastball.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Dec 10, 2008 3:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm really not sure
that giving up DeRosa is a good idea. He was part of the bailing wire that held this team together when we had several starters go on the DL consecutively.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on Dec 10, 2008 11:56 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
i didn't see the "trading for a RF"
part.
If Pie and Marshall are used in a deal to acquire a RF that would make more sense I suppose, I still don’t like losing DeRo and Vitters in the same deal
DeRo has tremendous value not only on the field but in the fact he’ll come with Type A tag next year and if we simply offered arb to him, we’d have two more chances to replenish the system
It seems we’re emptying the cupboard on the minor league system without allowing ourselves the opportunity to replenish it (not offering arb to Kerry or Howry, trading away impending FA’s who might bring back picks, etc)
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 11:57 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
you REALLY want to take the risk that Howry accepts arbitration?
by HereComesASpecialBoy on Dec 10, 2008 11:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
he had already been talking extensively with SF
so yes….
Howry would’ve caught on somewhere
and i’d rather have offered him arb than offered Ceda for Gregg (who will basically make the same money)
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 11:59 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He wouldn't have gotten a deal with SF...
had they been forced to give up a draft pick
Proud recipient of a hot dog shot from the Iowa Cubs hot dog gun.
by IowaCubs- on Dec 10, 2008 1:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Why not?
He had already been talking to SF. If the Giants don’t make an offer (due to giving up a 2nd round pick), Howry accepts arb and the Cubs trade him to SF for a prospect.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Dec 10, 2008 4:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The issue is I think the Cubs would have to eat some of the money.
Howry would have been due for a raise in arb.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 10, 2008 4:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think I'd be more inclined
to hang onto Pie and Marshall as opposed to DeRo and Vitters. I know this is just another in a long line of possible trade scenarios, but I do like this one better than previous ones theorized.
Also, you mentioned missing out on possible comp picks next year if we lost DeRo this year, but adding Peavy, in my book, is better than adding potential prospects next year.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 12:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
my point
was that you could add Peavy AND those potential picks if you built a deal without moving DeRosa
not Peavy OR potential picks
What’s the point of hanging onto Pie or Marshall? Marshall is now our 6th starter on a team with rotation contract commitments for the next 2 years and he’s likely behind Samardzija as well in that role since the Cubs have made it clear they’d like to give him that opportunity
and for Pie, Lou has shown a complete unwillingness to hand the reigns to him. Since he’s out of options, he’s just become a 5th OFer behind Reed Johnson. What’s the point?
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
But it seems to be
a problem completing a deal without adding DeRosa. It sounds like he is needed (and kinda the perfect canidate) to move to a team (be it the Phillies, Twins or anyone else) who will then provide to the Pads that extra pitching prospect or two.
As much as I like DeRo, if we have to sell high on him this year to get a deal done, then so be it.
And having Marshall around, as someone mentioned above, is not really a bad insurance policy to have in case one of our starters winds up being shelved for any period of time or needs to be skipped a time or five (Harden) during the course of the season.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 12:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
the only reason he's needed is salary relief
notice the evolution of this trade changed slightly and the only big differences were payroll related
originally we were going to send Pie to Baltimore for Garrett Olson who would be shipped to SD and we were going to include Marshall (supposedly, who knows for sure)
So originally we were going to give something like:
Vitters, Pie, Marshall, Hart
and the Padres would get
Vitters, Marshall, Hart, pitching prospect from 3rd team (in this case Olson)
Now we’re talking about giving:
Vitters, DeRosa, Hart
and they’re getting:
Vitters, Hart, two pitching prospects from other team, Marquis
so we just subbed out Pie and Marshall for DeRosa, Marquis
DeRosa and Marquis not so coincidentally were the only two salaries which we could possibly shed and gain relief
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
There are other possibilities for shedding salary
they aren’t necessarily likely or easy, but there are possibilities.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, again
it’d be a bummer to lose DeRo, but I got no problem with that deal. Whatever the reasons may be for the swapping of the trade pieces, that’s not really a trade that I would balk at.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 12:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And who knows
maybe, if he doesn’t wind up getting dealt at some point, Pie shows up to Mesa and tears it up this Spring and wins Lou over. Maybe this is the year that everything finally clicks for Felix. Eh, I can dream, right?
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 12:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
he did that last year
and got a week’s worth of AB’s before he was full-time platooned
Pie had the big spring last year and it meant nothing, i’m not sure why it would mean something this year
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, no I know that
There’s just still a part of me that is holding out hope when it comes to Felix. I know it’s not likely to happen, but sure would love to see him get some consistent PT.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 12:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No, I don't think so.
I think the reason the Cubs have found a way to work this deal w/o Pie is because they want to trade Pie elsewhere. Let’s see… who do we know likes Pie…. and we’re short a 2B….
quick someone start a Brian Roberts fanpost before Al sees!
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, that's prolly the
more likely scenario ~ Pie winding up in a different deal. And if we were somehow able to land both Peavy and Roberts, well, that’d be ridiculous. Ah, but I digress, I don’t wanna open that can of worms.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 12:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree, sort of...
…in that if Pie is not included in this deal (assuming it happens) that the Cubs have another destination in mind for him.
If, however, this deal goes down I am even more enamored with the idea of keeping Pie in lieu of a LH-RF’er. I think with that pitching staff, I can live with superior outfield defense/slightly less power as opposed to more power/crappier defense.
I know that’s probably not likely, all things considered, but I think that it would make for an acceptable line-up/rotation combination.
"...the internet is not something you just dump something on. It's not a truck. It's a series of tubes." - Sen. Ted Stevens
by bobby h on Dec 10, 2008 12:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You can live with it.
Lou cannot.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And therein
lies the rub.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 1:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Looking at the last...
…two playoff series, I don’t blame Lou for not wanting to go down that path.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on Dec 10, 2008 5:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The problem, of course,
is that this past series we did have some of the best LH bats in Edmonds and Fontenot. Oh well.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 7:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
There was a time
when the marlins had a thing for Pie as well.
"Enough foreplay- let's get crackin'"- Fred Garvin
by davidalanu on Dec 10, 2008 2:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
GOTTA KEEP VITTERS
TRADE PIE MARQUIS EVEN DERO BUT NOT VITTERS
HE IS OUR FUTURE AT 3B HOW BOUT TRADING MEGHEE
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy."
- Dodgers, Astros, Brewers, A's & Angels pitcher Don Sutton
by CubFreak on Dec 10, 2008 11:59 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Except That Casey McGahee was claimed off waivers from Milwaukee last month
n/t
by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Dec 10, 2008 12:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
shhhhhhhh!
don’t tell the Padres
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Let's Throw in Kerry Too...
They need a closer, right? :)
by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Dec 10, 2008 12:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Nice
Like I said I didn’t know we lost the Mc!
My point was that I would NOT like to see us lose Vitters.
Can you add something to that besides my overlooking that Mc! is a gone?
Vitters really is our future at 3b!
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy."
- Dodgers, Astros, Brewers, A's & Angels pitcher Don Sutton
by CubFreak on Dec 10, 2008 2:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
not if we trade him to the Padres.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 10, 2008 2:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How can you say that with any certainty?
He had an above average year at 18 years old for a short-season A- club, didn’t hit a lot of line drives or show a lot of power, struck out quite a bit, and didn’t take any walks.
He could develop into something great. Or, he could completely flame out. I don’t see any reason to assume that either scenario is a given.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Dec 10, 2008 2:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I Get It
Look, Vitters is a great prospect right now, but the point is that it seems many players seem to reach their peak trade value when they are top prospects and fall as their true value becomes evident.
Take a look at all of the hot prospect players that teams refused to part with just last season – guys like Felix Pie, Phil Hughes, Ian Kennedy – and the return on those players is far less this season than last.
If you can use an unknown quantity like Vitters to land a Cy Young candidate like Peavy, I just don’t see how you pass that up, especially when you’re in win-now mode.
by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Dec 10, 2008 2:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OR MYBE LES WALLROND
For your information, the Supreme Court has roundly rejected prior restraint.
by Less is Walrond on Dec 10, 2008 12:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Vitters' future
Everyone keeps saying, “We have to keep Vitters, he’s the future.” One player does not a future make. Now is the time to go for it. 2011, when Vitters arrives, if we’re still any good, we’ll trade him then. If we’re not, he won’t suddenly make us good. There will be a time for rebuilding when this run is all over. Vitters may actually arrive before that time.
Now, if we trade for Hermida or give Pie a shot, things could be different and there could be a Soto-core to build around. But it doesn’t look like that’s what we’ll do.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Or To Put It Another Way
Has holding on to our top prospect increased or decreased his perceived value in the next season?
Felix Pie?
Angel Guzman?
Corey Patterson?
Sure, Vitters could turn into the next A-Ram, but if you have the chance to trade him for a Cy Young candidate today, you do it.
by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Dec 10, 2008 12:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Or even more so
he could turn out to be the next Johnny Bench. But if Peavy helps bring the Cubs the coveted WS, who here is going to care?
I just hope Hendry can use the remaining trade pieces to get the Cubs other key players they need. I’m not sure the ‘pen is complete, we don’t know RF yet and if DeRo is p/o the Peavy deal, 2B may be unsettled too. There’s also that leadoff guy thingy…
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
by blackhawk24 on Dec 10, 2008 3:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
OR RONNIE WOO-WOO
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy."
- Dodgers, Astros, Brewers, A's & Angels pitcher Don Sutton
by CubFreak on Dec 10, 2008 12:01 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
If this is true
Then I think you can say that right now, that barring injury this is going to be the best starting rotation baseball has seen since the Braves of the late ’90s.
Maybe better, in terms of depth.
I don’t think this package looks like too much to give.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 12:03 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I think ...
Lou and Hendry did this deal in part because they figure one of Z, Harden and Dempster will get hurt next year. That, and the price was right.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Let´s not get too excited
Saying the price was right makes it seem as if the deal is really almost done… after so many rumors I think I will wait until something more “official”.
by Luis on Dec 10, 2008 12:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well said...
I think I like the idea of that trade, but I’ll believe it when I see a press conference.
by SouthernCub on Dec 10, 2008 12:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Best rotation since the 90's Braves until...
The Yankees sign Sheets, Lowe, and Burnett to go along with Sabathia and Wang, sending Joba back to the Pen. Hell they may even add Manny while they are at it.
by jbertram on Dec 10, 2008 4:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Remember Wood, Prior, Clement, Zambrano, Maddux?
only good for 89 wins….damn.
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Dec 10, 2008 12:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah --
Prior and Wood won 14 between them, and Clement flamed out.
Remember when we were counting our blessings that we had Glendon Freaking Rusch?
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Prior was sick in the stretch run though
by Luis on Dec 10, 2008 12:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Clement was pretty good that year...
3.68 ERA, over 9 K/IP, solid WHIP. He just had bad luck.
The problems that year were:
1. Wood struggled a bit and was hurt;
2. Prior was pitching hurt; and
3. The bullpen was terrible.
by SouthernCub on Dec 10, 2008 12:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That was certainly a good rotation, but
Wood was overrated as a starter and Maddux was not the Maddux by that time. But if it wasn’t for the offense that rotation could certainly have taken the Cubs far.
by Luis on Dec 10, 2008 12:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If this is the deal, I like it
I have advocated keeping Vitters but of course there is no way to get Peavy without giving up Vitters. That´s just reality.
One thing that still makes this sound strange is Hart in the deal. Why Heart? He seems like nothing special at all, so why is he in the deal?
by Luis on Dec 10, 2008 12:08 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
cost-controlled reliever
with few years of service
the Pads like those
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 12:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
WHERE DO I SIGN?????? get 'er done jimmy!!!
"next year" is finally HERE!!!!!
by ryno4ever on Dec 10, 2008 12:11 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
here's a link online...
also mentions the thing I said about the RF…
http://stations.espn.go.com/stations/espnradio1000/blog?id=3738908
by Rezze21 on Dec 10, 2008 12:11 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Oh ...
makes it sound a lot less done.
by elgato on Dec 10, 2008 12:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ok - here's a quote
Mark DeRosa to Philadelphia for pitcher J.A. Happ and a second pitcher. Then the Cubs would send Happ, Kevin Hart, Jason Marquis and Josh Vitters to San Diego in exchange for Peavy.
Does that second pitcher come to the Cubs or go to the Dads? There are some pitchers in the Phillies system, I’d sure like to get in addition to Peavy if that’s possibile.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 12:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Am I missing something?
From the title of this post I assumed that it is almost a done deal, but that Levine blog and the lack of noise being made on FoxSports, MLBTR and ESPN makes it appear that this is anything but a done deal.
by dakoose on Dec 10, 2008 12:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I logged on to ESPN1000 online
and they made it sound like just another update with speculation. I too then felt cheated by the tone of this post.
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Dec 10, 2008 12:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I agree.
Sounds like more breathless speculation to me.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 12:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Same here
They described it as “closer” to happening, not “close” to happening.
Big difference. This is why you never trust the report from some guy on the internet who heard it from some guy on the radio. It’s like a game of telephone that you always lose.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 1:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe a new rule is in order....
How about no new “the deal is almost done” diaries? It ain’t done till it’s done.
by 10 14 23 26 on Dec 10, 2008 12:25 PM CST reply actions 5 recs
+1
Brian McRae's 5 o'clock shadow
by PurpleLineToWrigley on Dec 10, 2008 1:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How about just using the
daily winter meetings threads?
"It's probably similar to being in New York City and having a cab driver behind you and you're driving too slow. It's not the most pleasant thing."
Barry Sanders, on what defensive backs who played against him compared him to.
by Jettero2112 on Dec 10, 2008 12:30 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Because people don't have time...
to read every thread every time there’s a new post? This is news. It’s worthy of having it’s own thread. What’s the harm?
by kanderber on Dec 10, 2008 1:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You mean like
This one?
or this one?
or maybe this one?
Those don’t include the winter meetings posts by Al or this post. And that’s just in the last 2 days.
No harm in it, it’s just not breaking news that hasn’t been beaten to death in multiple posts. It’s easier to read new threads in one post than have to sort through multiple posts to see the same thing over and over again.
Just making a point, not trying to be a jerk.
"It's probably similar to being in New York City and having a cab driver behind you and you're driving too slow. It's not the most pleasant thing."
Barry Sanders, on what defensive backs who played against him compared him to.
by Jettero2112 on Dec 10, 2008 1:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
...and
the reason you don’t have time to read through all postings is because of all of these types of postings.
by 10 14 23 26 on Dec 10, 2008 1:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
punch the z button
hit ctrl f.
you don’t need to read every post (lord knows i don’t) to get the idea that peavy is being talked about elsewhere.
by halfblindcubbiegirl on Dec 10, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So many rules!
I confused. What to do?
by lamentir on Dec 10, 2008 2:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Seems to me..
…to be a decent deal, but I would’ve liked to have kept DeRosa.
The Cubs’ middle infield is going to be awfully weak if this happens.
"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez
"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."
by The Jade Scorpion on Dec 10, 2008 1:12 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
LOL true.
And at least one lefty, for a change. ;-)
"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez
"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."
by The Jade Scorpion on Dec 10, 2008 1:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Stark says the two teams could get it done alone
so nothings definite yet…..I think that was Jayson Stark anyways
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 1:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's not past tense yet...
these are all still rumors of potential deals.
by SouthernCub on Dec 10, 2008 1:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How bout bringing back Mark G?
He batted 299 w a 345 OBP last year and the previous year was nearly identical
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 1:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Grud's eh?
That ain’t a bad idea and he bats lefty, correct? Hmmmm, and a 2B’er and possibly higher in the order, hmmmm, hmmmm….
Very good idea.
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
by blackhawk24 on Dec 10, 2008 1:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's a righty
For your information, the Supreme Court has roundly rejected prior restraint.
by Less is Walrond on Dec 10, 2008 1:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Thats why they went with Todd Walker over him after 03
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 2:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And we saw how well that worked
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Dec 10, 2008 2:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Dear Lord
Let’s see, we currently have DeRosa, Theriot, and Fontenot, so I have no idea how Grudz would fit here. The thought brings back horrid memories of the three-headed second baseman experiment of Grudz/Walker/Hairston under Dusty.
by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Dec 10, 2008 3:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I meant that in the context of DeRosa being gone
read b/t the lines
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 3:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Peavy
We might get Peavy. We might not get Peavy. There could be a 3 or 4-team deal involving the Cubs and Peavy. There might not be any deal involving the Cubs to get Peavy. The world will keep turning if Peavy doesn’t go to the Cubs.
"The big possum walks late." - Harry Caray
by memphiscub on Dec 10, 2008 1:24 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
over under
on Peavy diaries after this?
1?
2?
3?
4?
5?
100?
by plenz on Dec 10, 2008 1:27 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Over 5
but less than 100.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 1:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
depends if the cub get him..
n/t
The journey is the reward!
by wicubfan on Dec 10, 2008 1:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
although im upset we would lose DeRosa, im feeling good about Fontenot…maybe similar to pedroia? small dude with some pop, who knows
by mattpsu on Dec 10, 2008 1:30 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
if this is the deal
sign me up. I love me some Vitters but he has never played above the NWL. DeRosa ( me loves him but we are selling high better that then the reverse) Marquis is meh. and Hart cant throw strikes. Great deal. We get to keep one dec pie and marshall and hopefully we can get the board game. I am also high on lil babe ruth
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
by fischisgod on Dec 10, 2008 1:37 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Well....what I've heard come from some reports is
the Cubs didn’t want to deal Font & Marsh, well I guess that appears to be happening.
Now on DeRo, who is going to fill that spot? Who’s the primary 2B’er? Fontenot? I know who won’t be the 2B’er even though I’d want him. Trade for RF’er? DeJesus?
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
by blackhawk24 on Dec 10, 2008 1:38 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
fonty/cedeno/aurillia
i think fonty will be good
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
by fischisgod on Dec 10, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think as long as they use a platoon at second
and give Fontenot all the AB’s against right handers they should be set at the keystone. If the Cubs end up keeping Cedeno they can just rotate Theriot, Cedeno and Fontenot. Something crazy could happen and Hendry could acquire Orlando Hudson, but that not likely.
by dakoose on Dec 10, 2008 1:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hudson eh???
interesting
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
by fischisgod on Dec 10, 2008 1:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
no thanky u on hudson
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
by fischisgod on Dec 10, 2008 1:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Cedeno doesn't hit lefties.
I know this seems odd to hear since Lou played him mostly against leftys and Lou always maximizes the talent of every player on his roster, but it’s true.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 2:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't believe this yet
I mean I have heard reports the past two days that this was going to happen. Towers also said we wouldn’t know until Thursday at the earliest anyway..
"Charles Tillman is one of the best strippers in the NFL" - John Madden 11/30/08 Chicago Bears vs. Minnesota Vikings game
by Chanman25 on Dec 10, 2008 1:42 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
i think we will see after the Rule V draft
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
by fischisgod on Dec 10, 2008 1:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just get Peavy already
keeping DeRo, Hart, or any of the others wont help soothe my pain from losing in the playoffs last year but getting Peavy just might help me turn the corner.
Join the BCB Flickr Group: http://flickr.com/groups/bleedcubbieblue
by tony412 on Dec 10, 2008 1:43 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
*Yawn*...
Somebody wake me when this deal happens.
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 1:56 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
What else is there to talk about?
If you’re bored by the subject, then stop reading.
by dr stabbingworth on Dec 10, 2008 2:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
There are a lot of other important baseball topics...
…to discuss in the middle of the offseason!
by cwyers on Dec 10, 2008 2:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That, and
HEY HERES 30 PEAVY POSTS THAT ARE 90% RECYCLED RUMORS AND ARGUMENTS OMG HERES ANOTHER ONE. HEY I THINK WE SHOULD TRADE THESE SIX GUYS OMG UR SO DUM NO IM NOT HEY HEY HEY HEY HEY.
I have nothing against Jake Peavy, but I’m going to if this deal doesn’t either happen or die soon. Playing armchair GM is cool, but at some point, pretty much everything intellegent that can be said about the deal has been said, and then it just get tedious. I’m following these posts more for the insight that can be gleaned from off-topic discussions than for any actual Peavy information. I figure if and when the deal happens, somebody will put up a fanpost, and then Al will put up his post, and we can all have one big Peavytastic discussion and debate about whether the decision was a good one or not. And then I won’t feel compelled to follow four different threads in seperate windows.
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 3:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
"Peavytastic" LMAO
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 3:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You should use tabbed-browsing.
Much more efficient.
Brian McRae's 5 o'clock shadow
by PurpleLineToWrigley on Dec 10, 2008 3:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I should get a new computer.
What you said.
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 3:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
10 BCB bonus points for the 90% recycled content on the rumors.
We can never be too green.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Dec 10, 2008 5:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Mr. Levine is generally pretty accurate...
I guess it could still fall through, but I am starting to get my hopes up. Not gonna lie…
This could be a very good day for Cubdom.
by smitster2008 on Dec 10, 2008 2:09 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
He is?
I can’t remember the last rumor I heard from him that actually happened.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 3:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He was sure about Roberts last year. Enough said.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Dec 10, 2008 3:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't remember him ever saying that deal was close
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 3:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He did. On a couple of occasions.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Dec 10, 2008 3:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Impending Cubgasm looming......
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 10, 2008 2:11 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Expelliarmus!
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Dec 10, 2008 2:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ewwww...
somebody go get a towel.
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 2:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Or a mop
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
by blackhawk24 on Dec 10, 2008 2:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Here is the transcript of what's going on in Las Vegas
Media: You’re close to a deal
GM: No we’re not
Media: Ok fine you’re not
GM: We’re close to a deal
Media: No you’re not
GM: Yes we are
Media: Ok, then, you’re close to a deal
GM: No we’re not
Media: Oh yeah, we forgot
GM: But we are
Media: You are?
GM: No.
by daeviant on Dec 10, 2008 2:14 PM CST reply actions 5 recs
Hilarious.
Rec’d
Brian McRae's 5 o'clock shadow
by PurpleLineToWrigley on Dec 10, 2008 2:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I am reminded of Dark Helmet from Spaceballs...
“Hah hah! Fooled you!”
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 2:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
DeRosa
According to the MLB hot stove blog, He’s not going anywhere.
by Jayjayblue on Dec 10, 2008 2:34 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Muskrat
Reports DeRosa is staying put:
http://hotstove.mlblogs.com/archives/2008/12/cubs_derosa_is_staying_put.html
by JimboJet on Dec 10, 2008 2:39 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
And we all know Carrie knows her stuff....right?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 10, 2008 3:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No kidding.
I was skeptical that DeRosa was really a part of these trade scenarios. Now that Carrie “Wood Will Be Offered Arbitration” Muskat has spoken, I’m not so sure.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 3:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
haha
man, she gets skewered on every single Cubs blog Ive ever read
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 3:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I bet she does, say no more...wink wink, nudge nudge!
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 10, 2008 3:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ew! Have you seen her?
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Dec 10, 2008 4:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I cannot, in good conscience, post the reply that come to mind.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 10, 2008 4:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So that means he is sure to be gone.
Brian McRae's 5 o'clock shadow
by PurpleLineToWrigley on Dec 10, 2008 3:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My thoughts exactly...
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Dec 10, 2008 5:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's more
than the Mets gave up for Johan Santana. And Peavy won’t waive his no-trade for anyone other than the Cubs.
Just saying.
by Josh77 on Dec 10, 2008 3:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
maybe they should swap Hendry for Minaya
i think its different b/c Peavy is already under control whereas Santana wouldve been a FA and was sure to leave Minnesota, so they had to deal him and had little to no leverage, where the Padres can theoretically keep Peavy, but would be better served to shed his salary and rebuild.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 3:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You know, I still don't understand how Minays still has a job.
He put together teams that fell apart in back to back years and got a contract extension.
Go figure!
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 10, 2008 3:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
To be fair, that was only for one year of Santana
…followed by however many years (6 is what it ended up being) of Santana at market full price.
Peavy comes at 4 years slightly below market price (in dollars).
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 3:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That is true
Peavy is under contract for four more years. Santana was only under contract for one.
by Josh77 on Dec 10, 2008 4:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Right, but...
…. the Mets wouldn’t have made the deal as a rental. They signed him, so essentially, it was “taking” a contract.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 5:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Santana also had a no trade clause
and required a contract extension to approve any trade.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Dec 11, 2008 1:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I would say
Peavy is well below market price right now.
"I'm petrified of nipple chafing. Once it starts, it's a vicious circle." Andy Bernard
by TXCub on Dec 10, 2008 5:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
JC Bradbury disagrees
He details Peavy’s value here.
Long story short: he estimates Peavy’s value is about $3M / year below market value over the course of the contract.
by Wreckard on Dec 10, 2008 6:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I seem to remember saying a zillion times
Marquis will be in this deal. Let alone the 50 zillion times I said this deal was a certantity. We overvalue our minor league talent. Do this, now.
And it’s dinner time for me on BCB.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Dec 10, 2008 3:42 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, you're buying.
There’s no way the Padres take Marquis.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 3:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Might happen.
If they get Hendry to pay $4M, they can do one of two things:
1. Get 200 innings and a draft choice out of him in 2009
2. Wait until the market thins out a bit, then flip him to someone else
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Dec 10, 2008 5:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
TWINKIES GOING AFTER PEAVY?
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy."
- Dodgers, Astros, Brewers, A's & Angels pitcher Don Sutton
by CubFreak on Dec 10, 2008 3:47 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
No.
Brian McRae's 5 o'clock shadow
by PurpleLineToWrigley on Dec 10, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ummm, I dunno
What makes ya ask?
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 10, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not if...
Peavy, and his no trade clause have anything to say about it.
by EamusCatuli23 on Dec 10, 2008 4:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Remember sources saying that we needed a left-handed power bat before this deal?
SOLUTION:
by EJThunder on Dec 10, 2008 4:58 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Venus Williams?
She can hit the crap out of a tennis ball, but playing baseball is an altogether different sport.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 10, 2008 5:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
LOL...........Good one.
Hey Lou, we're long overdue.
by deadcatbounce on Dec 10, 2008 5:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, that's just wrong.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 10, 2008 5:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i think
this deal will be dead within a week.. i think we should pull it off but i dont think jim will do it…thats my guess
by cubbiepride on Dec 10, 2008 6:40 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I looked all over and didn't see this story mentioned anywhere...
Mega-Trade to land Peavy proposed.
Phillies
Get: DeRosa
Give: either Minor League pitcher J.A. Happ or Carlos Carrasco plus shortstop Jason Donald
Padres
Get: the two young Phillies players along with Jason Marquis, Felix Pie and Josh Vitters.
Give: Jake Peavy
Cubs
Get: Jake Peavy
Give: Jason Marquis, Felix Pie, Mark DeRosa and Josh Vitters
Too expensive unless the Cubs could keep Jason Donald instead of sending him to the Fathers.
"It's probably similar to being in New York City and having a cab driver behind you and you're driving too slow. It's not the most pleasant thing."
Barry Sanders, on what defensive backs who played against him compared him to.
by Jettero2112 on Dec 10, 2008 7:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Thanks goodness Muskat is always wrong.
I much prefer the deal where someone pretends Kevin Hart has value.
Oh, and didn’t she tell us that DeRosa wasn’t going anywhere earlier today?
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 7:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
no doubt
is she in PR or what?
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 10, 2008 8:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
She's in a different state.
The state of confusion.
"Well, we're out of cake! We only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush! So what do you want?"
"What, so my choice is 'or death?' Well, then I'll have the chicken, please."
--Eddie Izzard
by znohitter on Dec 10, 2008 8:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
PR is a Commonwealth and home of our catcher....don't know the capital of Confusion
Led Zeppelin was “Dazed and Confused”
As for Muskrat writing for the store has its limits….like writing for a company newsletter.
So it is almost as good as writing from P.R., that said….
interesting how this is working out.
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 10, 2008 9:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Appears things have stiffened
Greater value for DeRosa makes the Cubs now take the Phillies proposal off the table—-could it be that the Cubs have found a LH bat they really want?
My guess is that Levine and Muskrat have parts but not the real picture.
Before the deal was set with Phillie Cubs got calls from a few teams who want the versatile 2B/OF/3B I wonder I wonder I wonder…..
Okay so Muskrat’s report of Pie back on the plate and possibly it could be no Philly lefty…Cubs probably realize that as long as Peavy says NTC or Cubs they got the leverage…even if Tower takes his bat and ball home.
So wondering which team wants DeRosa?
Minnesota? California? Seattle? Philly?
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 10, 2008 8:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It sounds like a ton of teams want DeRosa
which they should, especially if his price was what the earlier rumors suggested.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 10, 2008 9:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
TWSS
I haz blurg: hotbeans.wordpress.com
by digitalbenjamin on Dec 11, 2008 9:40 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
good lord...
how do we keep giving up more?//
by DartmouthCubsFan on Dec 10, 2008 9:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
9 hours
since this post, and no deal in sight. Just read espn.com and they said TWO sources indicated the Cubs were digging in their heels on who they were willing to deal.
Demp and Rich: proof that people that live in igloos and say "eh" can contibute!
by Canadian Cubs Fan on Dec 10, 2008 9:13 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Thats good
At least they realize they have the upper hand. I still want this to happen, but its good to see theyre using what advantages they have, DeRosa is important to the team, so he’d be tough to lose w/o a ready replacement available…..Aurillia would be the closest thing on the market
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 10, 2008 9:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So
Is there any room for Brian Roberts in this deal?
(ducks)
by 08Cubs on Dec 10, 2008 10:02 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Did anyone else hear Levine say this?
Normally he’s a reliable guy. Yet everything you read runs contrary to this report. Was there any kind of follow up on it?
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 11, 2008 7:37 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
The report on ESPN 1000's site said
…that the deal was closer to getting done – not close to getting done.
I think Levine’s update was misrepresented by the diary poster.
by Wreckard on Dec 11, 2008 10:34 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Today is the Towers deadline
He wants the deal, or at the very least a framework in place today. I think Hendry has the leverage here, of course, but if it relies on unloading Marquis while trying to get the new team to take on as much of his salary as possible, then in that instance, hes got very little leverage b/c the rest of the league knows he has to get rid of Marquis
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 11, 2008 9:12 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
everything is dynamic in the realm of each team's particular circumstance
It is probably known that the Cubs will pay $3M for Marquis so his liability is $6.8M for 170-IP and 12-12 record. Now what you want to do is watch the middle starter market as NYY sucks out the top with CC and AJ. Teams like Detroit, CO, Balt, Tex, Sea, AZ, ChiSox might be interested at a spare part cost.
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 11, 2008 9:16 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Right, but thats not going to happen by close of business today
I really really want Peavy, but if Hendry sticks to his guns and uses his leverage and refuses to give up Marshall or DeRosa, well then I think we can all be proud of him for not caving in or giving into temptation.
besides, if they really want to ship DeRosa, they can do so separately and get more out of the Twins stocked farm system
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 11, 2008 9:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not gonna happen...
Why would they do that? They’d get a year of a more expensive DeRosa and give away a young, inexpensive, cost-contained and productive player like Span in return? Makes no sense for the Twins.
I’d love to get Span, but I have to believe that’s a non-starter for the Twins.
by SouthernCub on Dec 11, 2008 10:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think
they’ll leave today with a “framework” in place. Seems Hendry may still want to shop DeRosa and Marquis some more.. Towers has to make this deal at some point…
SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!
by CubFaninCA on Dec 11, 2008 11:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I suspect youre right
today deadline seems like a farce
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 11, 2008 11:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Marquis has been a 170-IP 12-12 pitcher on the Cubs, Cards or Braves
Is he as good as that on CO, Balt, SD, SEA, AZ?
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
by JohnM on Dec 11, 2008 10:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
peavy
i think this will get done.hate to lose derosa though. with peavy in the rotation the pressure to win it all will be sick in 09.
by NOMAR on Dec 11, 2008 10:40 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
THATS
AGOODPOINT.THANKSFORWEIGHINGIN.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Dec 11, 2008 10:49 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
One question
If the Cubs would have gotten Peavy, who would have been the number 1 guy? Zambrano or Peavy…
Discuss
" We got "The Rod"...What you got? "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Dec 11, 2008 4:20 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Who cares?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 12, 2008 9:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Haha
+1
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on