If I were Jim Hendry and trying to find a RF'er...
Everyone knows the list of candidates out there. And with each candidate brings a thousand different opinions. I've been absorbing all these opinions and stats and everything. As a concerned Cubs fan, I think this slot is a huge thing that can't be filled by some nobody. After watching the Cubs lose their NINTH playoff game in a row this October, it became obvious to me that yes, the pitching was terrible, but also there was no hitting. Which is why I think the Cubs need to go after someone who swings a big bat.
Here are some things that need to be taken into consideration when going after this right fielder:
Defense: Defense becomes a factor because of the (IMO) lack thereof in right field. Look we all know that Soriano isn't going to be winning a gold glove any time soon. I know most fans out there aren't ok with that. But I know also that we'd be happy (well, just not as ticked off) if he didn't do the hop every time a ball comes towards him. I don't think that there's much need to worry about center field, given two players with great defensive skills, given that Piniella sticks with the platoon of Reed Johnson and Felix Pie. One thing to consider also, is that in close games, Fukudome CAN come in and play right field. Right field at Wrigley, as we all know, is considered one of the hardest places to play defense, along with center field in Houston and left field in Boston.
Speed/RBIs: Speed is a factor of defense yes, but this is more in reference to on the basepaths. The Cubs don't have a clear cut basestealer. Theriot is good for some but he is almost just as likely to get caught then to successfully steall a base. And we all know that Soriano isn't healthy all of th time and Lou doesn't like to risk injury with him. A good basestealer is important to getting men in scoring position and scoring more runs. The tradeoff to all of this is that the right fielder can drive in a bunch of runs. If this right fielder can't get on base and steal bases, then maybe he can drive in runs through home runs.
Leadership/Intangibles: Al has suggested many times that we go after somebody like Kevin Millar, who can provide leadership and stability when the team is in a tense game or the playoffs. Someone who is good at doing that is able to keep the clubhouse loose and probably has been there before. Think about it: someone who has been to the playoffs and on winning teams knows what it takes to be successful. That person can transfer that knowledge over to the Cubs. It doesn't seem like the Cubs have much of a problem keeping the clubhouse loose during the season. They seem to have a lot of players who are funny guys, and there were many times over the season where the cameras would go over to the dugout and everyone would be laughing. Dempster and DeRosa are two guys who stand out in my mind (common knowledge, I know). So maybe just having that experience of winning is good. And obviously not someone who hates his teammates or avoids them (Barry Bonds anyone?).
I leave hitting out actually. I know hitting is important but we don't NEED a 30 home run guy. We had the best record in the league without having a single player hit above 30 home runs or .310. The team seems to be good at driving in runs in many ways, and as it has been said many times before, there is no clear MVP of the team. I'm saying we do need someone who fits that mold, someone who can hit on a consistant basis but doesn't need to be an MVP candidate by any means. Just not someone like Fukudome or Alex Gonzalez of the 2003 team.
So given this information, who do you think fits the mold? My vote has and still is for Adam Dunn. Minus the experience of being on a playoff team, he is consistant and a fun guy in the clubhouse. He does hit well and gets on base often, which does go against what I say but who's going to turn away 30 homers a year? My second candidate would be Hermida. I like his youth and speed and athleticism and I think his hitting is strong and could become much better at Wrigley. Again, this is just my opinion though. i write this post to hear your opinions.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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105 comments
Comments
This makes no sense...
…you say that you need/want good/great defense in right field and then suggest Adam Dunn? Hmmm.
I think Adam Dunn is the player to go with because of his power and OBP, and to be honest I could care less about his defense. He’ll help the Cubs score more runs than he’ll cost them and solid corner outfield defense is somewhat overrated. The Phillies won a title with Pat Burrell. The Red Sox won two with Manny Ramirez and Manny didnt hurt the Dodgers as much as he helped them.
As far as I’m concerned, the positions with the most chances should be the positions you should worry about. Stash the power in the corner outfield spots and reap the rewards on the scoreboard.
One thing you learned as a Cubs fan: when you bought you ticket, you could bank on seeing the bottom of the ninth.
Joe Garagiola
by Ryan at Cubshub on Dec 2, 2008 4:28 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Left field...
All 3 players that you have named here play left field. Left field is easier to play at Wrigley than right. We already have the defensive liability in left field, so I don’t think that we need another defensively challenged left fielder out in right field.
by airmidget1 on Dec 2, 2008 7:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
My point was that all sucked in the outfield...
…and all would be equally bad in right field as left. I think the Cubs need a hitter and should go after the best hitter, regardless of defense. Just so long as he’s capable to run, he’s just as good as hoffpauir.
One thing you learned as a Cubs fan: when you bought you ticket, you could bank on seeing the bottom of the ninth.
Joe Garagiola
by Ryan at Cubshub on Dec 3, 2008 12:37 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
You say, “Which is why I think the Cubs need to go after someone who swings a big bat.” But then you say, “I leave hitting out actually. I know hitting is important but we don’t NEED a 30 home run guy.” So which is it?
And you make points about defense and speed – and then pick Adam Dunn? And who is “this left fielder” you’re referring to? We’re talking about right field, no?
I don’t get it. This is a very confusing read.
"I see I'm not the only one around here who can't hold his water." - Last words of the leaky pipe in the visiting team dugout, Dodger Stadium, October 4, 2008.
by dat cubfan daver on Dec 2, 2008 4:29 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I completely agree
just move fukudome over to center with rj. Soriano is in left. Therefore, the cubs don’t really need a lead off hitter cause i think soriano does a pretty good job except in the playoffs. Dunn gives them the power, protection, rbis, and very good obp. Ibanez still wants big money. and if the cubs are even thinking about giving big money away give it to the younger player. Abreu is obvious is declining so he’s out of the equation.
Soriano
Fonty (SS)
Lee
Dunn
Ramirez
Soto
DeRosa
Fukudome
I still think that adding dunn, peavy, and a setup man isn’t too much. Just get rid of Marquis.
by lexmarklover on Dec 2, 2008 4:29 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
lee
I really think derek lee is better suited for the 2-hole. as far as a setup man i want beimel bad. I also think we match up perfect with a team like the texas rangers in terms of dumping marquis. real good FA pitchers dont seem to ever go there. they have a ss I would love to have and a youngster to take his place if traded.
as far as dunn i’m not a big fan at all. he looks real stupid at the plate alot with his pitch selection. his defense his horrible. trying not to be too negative but I’m beginning to think that the FA’s out there are not much better as a whole than what we have in house.
if it were my choice right now i would dump marquis and cedeno if possible.
get a stop gap like millar or huff.
get peavy and sign beimel.
my lineup would look something like this:
soriano(dont like it but its gonna happen)
lee
soto
ramirez
huff/millar/dome?
dero
fontenot
huff/millar/ reed/dome??
rotation:
peavy
big z
dempster
lilly
harden
gregg,beimel,marmol for the 7th,8th,9th
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 4:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, Dunn's stupidity has earned him...
…100+ walks in each of the last FIVE seasons. Maybe he could distill into pills and each of his teammates could take one.
"I see I'm not the only one around here who can't hold his water." - Last words of the leaky pipe in the visiting team dugout, Dodger Stadium, October 4, 2008.
by dat cubfan daver on Dec 2, 2008 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I wish Soriano was more stupid.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 2, 2008 5:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
dont forget
his 164 strikeouts and his award winning .236 avg. his horrible horrible horrible defense in left field. I can only imagine what he would look like in right. if were gonna pay for dunn why not just give hoffpower a chance??
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 5:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Because when you take into account his OBP...
when you take into account his OPB .386 SLG .513 you get an OPS of .899 which would tie him with Ramirez for the team lead….his offense is better than virtually everyone else’s on our current roster. Oh yeah…he also only GIDP 7 times in 517 ABs. Compare that with the rest of our roster.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 2, 2008 6:13 PM CST up reply actions 5 recs
that still
dont justify giving him a big contract given his k’s, avg, no speed, no defense,no arm, and no where to play him.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 6:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
if you can't justify giving your biggest offensive threat a big contract...
…then who do you give it to?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Dec 2, 2008 6:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
unfortunatley
we are in the national league which dont have a dh. we have lee at 1st and sori in left. looking at the big picture dunn isnt much of an upgrade over dome as a rightfielder for the type of contract he will command.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 6:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
As ballhawk said...
“if you can’t justify giving your biggest offensive threat a big contract…then who do you give it to?”
Free Ronny Cedeno
by Kansas25 on Dec 2, 2008 6:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
maybe
one that dont strike out 160 + times with a .236 avg and isnt a disasterous fielder.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 7:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The biggest pitching threat:
CC
OK, I know he’s a 1/1,000,000 chance of coming here but I’d spend major dollars on a pitcher that can carry a team versus an OF like Dunn.
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
by blackhawk24 on Dec 3, 2008 1:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, I think Dunn could carry a team...
or at least the starting lineup on days Z doesn’t pitch. ;-)
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Dec 3, 2008 3:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sigh...
1)His K total isn’t much of an argument….aA K is an out…just like any other out, with the exception that a runner cannot usually advance or score when the batter K’s. Dunn walks so much, it’s not that big of a deal…..look at his numbers (very simplistically)
517 AB – (122 H + 122 BB) = 273 OUTS
273 OUTS – 164 Ks = 109 OUTS
So…you’re telling me that 109 non K outs are just not enough?
2) Batting average is not a very complete measure of offense: see R. Theriot
3) No Speed…ok…Dunn isn’t fast. Slow men in the outfield don’t always kill your baseball team.
4)No Defense….I’m skipping this because the No Speed and No Arm arguments are kinda what Defense is.
5) No Arm….he had 5 Assists in LF last year….and 7 errors in 119 games. So he’s sort of a liability on defense.
6) Nowhere to play him….if Dome and Johnson are platooning in CF, Dunn plays LF or comes off the bench with Derosa in LF against tough LHP, and he can even fill in @ 1B or RF if needed. If there’s an argument to be made for not having a place to play a guy it’s Theriot…but that’s a different story.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 2, 2008 6:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
exactly
my point!! we have a left fielder, we dont need a left fielder. he had 7 errors in left just imagine what he would have in wrigley ‘s right field. I’m not on the sign dunn bus nor will I ever be.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 6:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Point?
He said LF was open, with Derosa an option against LH pitchers.
“nowhere to play him” was quoting you, and then refuting your statement.
Free Ronny Cedeno
by Kansas25 on Dec 2, 2008 6:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
whats you point???
you have given no evidence to support you claim that dunn would help the overall make of this team without hurting the overall team in more areas. we don’t need another big money player with numerous holes in his game.
we have this problem now because dome was great in the field and horrible at the plate. so you guys tell me that getting a glorified dh that cant play a lick of left field will solve our problems in right field which is 10 times harder to play at wrigley?
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 7:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So...
are you for or against signing Dunn?
Free Ronny Cedeno
by Kansas25 on Dec 2, 2008 9:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
adamently
against
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 9:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Please enlighten us as to what bus you are on?
I pray it’s not the short one.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 2, 2008 6:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
With all evidence...
to the contrary.
Free Ronny Cedeno
by Kansas25 on Dec 2, 2008 7:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
bang....
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 7:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't disagree with your point that K's are not a big deal, but...
…just for your information, walks don’t count against a player’s at-bat total. Plate appearances is the stat which accounts for at-bats, walks, hit-by-pitch, etc.
Again, it doesn’t really change your argument, but I thought I’d point that out. :)
by MarchHare on Dec 3, 2008 12:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
you are right....I overlooked that and I should have known better.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 3, 2008 9:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
"He looks real stupid at the plate alot"
Helluva an argument. You cling to your BA (most overrated stat) and your Strikeouts (I think they still only count as 1 out, not 2. Was there a rule change?) and I’ll stick with imagining his sky-high OBP hit in front of Ramirez and Soto and his RBI totals on a real team.
I think everyone who likes Dunn has conceded he is bad defensively. We get it. I believe the common thought is that his offensive production would outweigh his defense.
Free Ronny Cedeno
by Kansas25 on Dec 2, 2008 5:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I dont agree
his offensive production would not out weigh his horrid defense. we can argue the stats all day long with no outcome. I watched at least 50 of his games. I saw numerous games in which the game was out of hand one way or another and dunn “padded” his stats. He goes through long spurts with free swinging at only God knows what. He has absolutely no speed. We already have a right fielder who we’d love to choke out 3-4 times a week,whose defense is far superb to dunn’s. Why do we need him?? 40 hr’s 122 walks, at least 164 k’s, .236 avg, horrible defense player(also no place to play him), no speed, and no arm. Is that really worth 10+ million a year over 2-3 years?? Is it that much more if any of an “all around” player than fukudome to justify signing him? no way!!
if thats all we can get I would rather go the safe route and get peavy and beimel. Sign a real cheap 1yr guy and hope for a lightning in the bottle type season.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 6:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
if that's your plan
then that better be white lightning in your bottle – and lots of it ‘cause you’ll need it.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Dec 2, 2008 6:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately I have no stats as evidence, but most of the times that I saw Dunn strike out with the Reds it was looking at pitches and not swinging.
by Villeslgr on Dec 2, 2008 8:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I love how you ask "Why do we need him?"
And then immediately cite his 40 home runs and 122 walks ,which are both really freaking awesome.
CUBS WIN! CUE THE ORCHESTRA!
by Keith on Dec 2, 2008 9:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yes they are
but the point i’m trying to make is that he has far more bads that outweigh those two goods. I mean look at dome. great defense,good arm. speed. game saving plays. works the count and at times has flashes of brilliance at the plate. do we really need another high priced player with as many or more holes in his game than positives??
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 9:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Adam Dunn draws tons of walks.
Isn’t that working the count? And isn’t hitting tons of home runs more than flashes of brilliance?
I think you’re arguing against Dunn for defensive reasons. If the Cubs acquire a power lefty bat to play RF, their defense is going to be subpar. So why not go out and get the best hitter possible?
CUBS WIN! CUE THE ORCHESTRA!
by Keith on Dec 2, 2008 9:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree about Lee
His power seems to be gone but his contact is still there, which would be good for the 2 hole. Set up Ramirez and possibly Dunn, it could work.
Beimel seems unlikely, but he is good. Not sure the Rangers would be interested in Marquis. The team that might want him is more of a Colorado type, where they love groundball pitchers.
"If I were playing third base and my mother were rounding third with the run that was going to beat us, I'd trip her. Oh, I'd pick her up and brush her off and say, 'Sorry, Mom,' but nobody beats me." ~ Leo Durocher
by Musicdude10 on Dec 2, 2008 6:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Better Balanced Lineup if...
… you flip Ramirez and Lee, and then bat Fukudome either 6th or 7th…
In Hendry We Trust
by initram on Dec 2, 2008 4:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't too much
I’m guess you mean “too much [to ask for]”? Geez, I’m still trying to figure how declining arb for Wood, will free up enough money for bullpen help. Your suggesting 3 players (one of which is named Peavy). Seems like High Apple Pie in the Sky Hopes — Just sayin’
by StevenABQ on Dec 2, 2008 5:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
wood
is gone. get over it.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 5:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I never had a problem with it
So really there is nothing for me to get over. Your snarky comment aside — My point was that acquiring the 3 players lexmarklover suggested was a little far fetched. That is to say, if JH was unable/unwilling to offer arb to Wood (assuming as reported: due to salary constraints), then how could they sign another bullpen arm, a top of the rotation starting pitcher, and a outfielder? Talk me down on the point I make if you want, but I’d appreciate it if you wouldn’t attribute any bleeding heart sentimentalism to it.
by StevenABQ on Dec 2, 2008 8:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
because
we have enough money apparently for a LH hitter. if marquis’ 10 million is cleared then we could afford beimel at about 4 million or so and have about 6 million towards a peavy. being a little creative could create the rest.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 8:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
A little creative?
I see the logic, but again it seems like a longshot, IMO. Clearing Marquis’ 10 mil would seem to be the most problematic. The Beimel wish is a good one and attainable…Peavy on the other hand — like you said — it will take them being “a little creative”.
by StevenABQ on Dec 2, 2008 8:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
beginning
to think upgrading this team is near impossible given the budget constraints. all of the FA hitters I see are not really overall any better than what we already have. I cant see giving up anything for teahan when we have pie. give me 5 good good reasons why we sign dunn,abreu, or ibanez and I will give you 5 bad ones. I doubt hermida is available. at this point only way I see too upgrade this team is to add Peavy and Beimel.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 8:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
On the FA hitters deal, thats for sure. I’ve probably seen at least 5 of your reasons on Dunn alone. I know your not the biggest Pie fan, and I’ll admit I was pretty enamored with him. But, what I saw this in September coupled with the Piniella interview I read in Vineline indicates he has made improvements and Lou has noticed (to some degree). All I can hope is that the three FA stooges you mentioned are left alone. As I said before Beimel would be a nice addition, I guess I lack the faith that we could land Peavy.
by StevenABQ on Dec 3, 2008 9:13 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Definitely Dunn
D is terrible, but he fits perfectly otherwise.
I also would not mind Abreu, IF he would go for the $8M per that has been suggested by Olney.
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=3738618&name=olney_buster
by jbertram on Dec 2, 2008 4:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I Think Abreu Is The Best Bet...
… but at what cost? $8M sounds low….
In Hendry We Trust
by initram on Dec 2, 2008 4:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It is quite possible...
… that in spring training, if no one has been acquired, that Fukudome will win the job back. Then Hendry will have to go find a platoon partner for Reed Johnson in CF.
Maybe DeJesus?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 2, 2008 5:04 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Um, how 'bout Felix Pie?
Assuming he isn’t traded, of course.
"I see I'm not the only one around here who can't hold his water." - Last words of the leaky pipe in the visiting team dugout, Dodger Stadium, October 4, 2008.
by dat cubfan daver on Dec 2, 2008 5:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
True dat.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 2, 2008 5:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Pie deserves a chance...
…he’s got skills, he’s got speed, and if the Cubs would just give him a few months to learn the ropes I think he’d be just as good as anyone available in spring training.
And lets not forget his defense is amazing.
One thing you learned as a Cubs fan: when you bought you ticket, you could bank on seeing the bottom of the ninth.
Joe Garagiola
by Ryan at Cubshub on Dec 3, 2008 12:39 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sounds good to me.
Now convince Lou of that.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 3, 2008 4:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It very well could be Soriano, Pie/Johnson, Fukudome in spring training
and I’d be comfortable with that. If one of those spots didn’t pan out, then I can see Hendy looking to make an acquisition. The ownership situation should be stabilized, hopefully, which would give Hendry a better idea as to what he could acquire.
Plus, if Lou wants to get younger and faster, Hendry could hold him to it and tell Lou to put Pie out there on a daily basis.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Dec 2, 2008 7:41 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That'd work for me, actually.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 2, 2008 7:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i'm not
pie fan but I would rather do that then waste money on adam dunn.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 8:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
None of the available options seem to fit the needs/wants of the Cubs
and, as we’ve seen in some of the “Cubs Can of Worms” features, trying to fit the square peg into the round hole usually has poor consequences. Dunn, Ibanez, Abreu to an extent all seem to be polygonal, to varying degrees.
Yes, it’s relying on some big “ifs,” but I think it’s too early to give up on Fukudome, and if Lou truly wants to get younger and faster, he’s got someone on the roster in Pie who is both, and who seems to have figured it out, to an extent, based on his September call-up and work in the Dominican League (though I will readily admit those samples are small).
Save money and draft picks and give the guys already on the roster a chance; if they don’t pan out through April & May, then explore some trades. Hell, Jim Edmonds will probably be available still.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Dec 2, 2008 8:05 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Rec'd
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 2, 2008 8:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This is what I was trying to say earlier Al
None of the options out there match up well with the Cubs. If we don’t go out there and get someone new, this is essentially the same team that got swept from the playoffs two years in a row (actually one could argue it’s worse).
Therefore we need to improve somewhere. I think the best thing to do is trade for Roberts and move DeRosa out to right field.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
by cubswynn on Dec 2, 2008 9:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
We don't have to improve in the offseason.
And, in fact, giving certain players a larger opportunity to become the answers we are looking for can’t hurt a team who was so good last year. Give the team a few months to play, then look for the answers at the trade deadline.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 2, 2008 10:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sitting and waiting is a fair point
And I think that’s what Jim Hendry is doing. However I guess my original point stands, I don’t believe that bringing back the ‘08 Cubs is going to yield better results than before. Something needs to change and so far that hasn’t really happened.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
by cubswynn on Dec 3, 2008 8:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So far...
… almost no teams have made any deals. The Vazquez deal is the first one of any consequence.
I feel confident the Cubs will make changes. It is only early December. The economy is causing teams to re-evaluate some of their needs and how they can fill them.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 3, 2008 8:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Rec'd
This is my current preferred option, or similarly, to add a low-cost guy like Teahen into that mix, giving him, Dome, and Pie all time to win an everyday job.
If 2 out of Pie/Dome/Fontenot/Teahentype turn out next year, we don’t have a LH problem and we still have our trade chips and budget flexibility to add something else.
The one free agent I would seriously look at is Furcal, who fits a real need, although, even there, I’d prefer to go low-cost like Maicer Izturis or Brandon Wood, if I thought Lou would give those guys a shot.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 2, 2008 8:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
rosenthal says...
braves close to aqquiring vasquez from the white sux link good news for those of us that want peavy
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 5:22 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
That is good news...
Free Ronny Cedeno
by Kansas25 on Dec 2, 2008 5:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It helps for sure
But Im pretty sure they wanted to add two starters, but giving up Reyes and Lillibridge means they cant let go of Escobar.
Interesting (strokes beard)
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 2, 2008 5:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
This is where....
the haul for Peavy starts to drop into the surprising.
Rosenthal says Vasquez is on a plane to Atlanta now for a physical. Personally, I think Towers would do well to intercept this deal, and try to get that rumored package for Peavy.
Either way, this is about to get really uncomfortable for the Padres.
by Damen Jackson on Dec 2, 2008 5:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think the Braves were firm in their stance on NTC
Not guaranteeing Peavys once he got there, and Peavys seeming desire to go to Chicago anyway. In the end, I think thats a good play by the Braves as I dont see how theyre gonna compete with Philly and NYM anyway….so might as well hang onto Escobar and stick your guns as far as contracts go.
I guess things will start heating up all over the league…..finally.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Dec 2, 2008 5:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I wish I had a beard to stroke.
Stupid anti facial hair work policy.
by kanderber on Dec 2, 2008 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's OK. I don't have a beard either.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on Dec 2, 2008 6:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Looking better
for Peavy..
SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!
by CubFaninCA on Dec 2, 2008 8:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I know its a different sport
But I disagree with the argument “the team this year won 97 games, therefore keep it like it is.” WRONG. This team is similar to another Chicago team, the Bears. Bears in 05 started off kind of slow but become a pretty decent team, and the team excelled the following season. The fans thought they would do extremely well the next season because the team was the same as the Superbowl team, but they ended up going a mediocre 7-9 because of an aging team.
I have to say that the Chicago Cubs are somewhat similar. They have an aging offense, and I worry about the productivity of players such as Lee and Soriano next season.
To see your idol player whom you have grown up watching be cast aside by his loyal organization can make even a grown man choke up...We'll miss you #34!
by Chanman25 on Dec 2, 2008 6:40 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I don't find them similar at all.
The 06 Bears made the Super Bowl partly on luck — they weren’t that good, especially with Rex at QB.
The Cubs shouldn’t stand pat — NO championship team should. But you’re suggesting an overhaul. All they need are some tweaks.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 2, 2008 7:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Who on the Cubs would equate to Rex Grossman?
I don’t see it – the Bears relied on a solid defense and opportunistic offense, while the Cubs were the most well-rounded team in baseball, at least until Oct. 1.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Dec 2, 2008 7:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
howry
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 7:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Nah.
Probably Marquis… you know, the guy who everyone loves to hate, but who occasionally does just enough good that you think he’s going to be better, and then he isn’t.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 2, 2008 7:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's whom I was thinking
he’s tantalizing enough to make you think he could be a No. 4 or No. 3 starter, but he probably shouldn’t be.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Dec 2, 2008 8:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Except Grossman was flippin' awesome sometimes.
Marquis had a few really good starts. Grossman was generally really awesome except in games like at Arizona, home against Green Bay, etc. His only poor start in the playoffs was the Super Bowl, unfortunately, but I see Marquis as more of a Cedric Benson-esque character – not a top of the line guy, just mediocre.
CUBS WIN! CUE THE ORCHESTRA!
by Keith on Dec 2, 2008 9:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I can't see Dunn on this team,
at least I hope not. I would take my shot with Abreu. He is not great in rightfield, but not bad, solid OBP, .300 hitter, who would knock in runs.
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
by Grockcubs on Dec 2, 2008 7:37 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Dunn is Dave Kingman reincarnate from the left side
he belongs in the AL as a DH
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Dec 2, 2008 9:00 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
glad
someone agrees with me on adam dunn
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 9:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
but
***sarcasm****he hit 40 hr’s and had 100+ walks!! his strikeouts just count as 1 out, all 160+. his 230 avg dont matter. neither does his horrible defense and no speed. he would be the best hitter on our team!!! so says some posters above!!
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 2, 2008 9:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
you just refuse
to believe that 40hr and 100+ walks will help? or what? I really don’t get it. and no. his .236 avg doesn’t matter. neither did his .264 average last year (same obp). average doesn’t really mean much at all, not nearly as much as 40! hr per year matter. . how does 40 hr on a team that doesn’t lead off corey patterson not a good thing?
and he would be the best left handed hitter on our team. by far.
by doug dascenzo's change-up on Dec 2, 2008 11:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
and you
refuse to realize that all his flaws would make those null and void.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 3, 2008 5:22 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I realize I'm a little late to this discussion...
…so perhaps this will end up a rhetorical question but how the hell do you make 40 home runs null and void? What, those runs (and the many runs they’ll likely drive in) don’t count?
Your position on this issue is patently ridiculous and the sooner you drop your obsession with batting average and strikeouts and start looking at OPS, the greater the likelihood that you’ll avoid further embarassment.
"I see I'm not the only one around here who can't hold his water." - Last words of the leaky pipe in the visiting team dugout, Dodger Stadium, October 4, 2008.
by dat cubfan daver on Dec 4, 2008 10:21 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Amen Daver
Does he seriously think that Dunn’s defensive liabilities will negate his offensive production?
by McRipper on Dec 4, 2008 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That is what he keeps saying....so I guess he must actually believe it.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 4, 2008 12:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
By no means do I like Adam Dunn
But if we sign him, we can try at the trade deadline to try and move Derrek Lee, and if not, definately after the 09’ season and move Adam Dunn ( or any other defensively challenged RF we sign this year)
Derrek has a limited NTC for his last contract year, we probably won’t get much for him but at least we can dump the salary.
In a dream world, we dump Jason Marquis, pick up Jake Peavy. We also sign Furcal, and then platoon /Reed Johnson/Micah Hoffpauir/Kosuke Fukudome/Mark Derosa for the two spots. Mike Fontenot and Ryan Theriot would be in a true platoon at 2nd base.
I think this could really work out, and if it doesn’t, we can make a move at the all star break! What do you guys think?
by MrShowtime on Dec 2, 2008 10:52 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
if
we dont derek lee at 12 million, why would anyone else??
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 3, 2008 5:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just a question....
with a runner on 1st and 2nd and one out….who would you rather have up? Lee or Dunn?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 3, 2008 10:03 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Probably Dunn, actually.
Since he’s more likely to strike out, that’d be only one out. Plus, he’s also more likely to walk.
Based on last year, D-Lee would be more likely to hit into a DP.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Dec 3, 2008 10:09 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Just imagine how good our 2009 offense will be
if Derrek Lee rebounds, even just a little.
He’s never had DP rates like that before in his career. Either something was off last year and he couldn’t adjust to it or age and skill deterioration have taken hold. While the latter is definitely possible, I think injury and the former are the case and am looking forward to a Fully Armed and Operational Derrek Lee in 2009.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
by DGU on Dec 3, 2008 10:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought I saw where Lee
had more opportunities to GIDP than any other player in MLB. Just asking, because I haven’t seen the stat, is his rate per GIDP opportunity that much higher than anyone else, or just his totals?
If his rate is similar to others, putting a player with a little more power in front of him should limit the GIDP. Slappy the OBP machine creates the opportunities and Lee grounds into them.
I like the idea of Lee in #2, especially if Soriano continues to lead off.
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Dec 3, 2008 11:31 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
So Dunn is more likely to K, walk, or hit a HR than Lee....hmmmm.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 3, 2008 10:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
and...
more likely too have a defensive blunder in the next half inning that leads to a huge inning.
Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!
by cubsluver22 on Dec 3, 2008 2:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I have to admit...as long as Theriot is our everyday SS....
Dunn should NEVER play 1B.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 3, 2008 2:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Correction
We could move Adam Dunn or any other defensively challenged RF we sign to 1b when D.Lee is gone
by MrShowtime on Dec 2, 2008 10:53 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
A quick question
has Dunn ever played first base before?
by Bardusk87 on Dec 3, 2008 11:36 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Yes, in 127 games and he started @ 1st 97 times.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 3, 2008 11:42 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but was he at least as good as
Mo Vaughn? Hell, Fred McGriff stunk in the field at the end of his career, Emansky be damned. Was Dunn better than geezer McGriff at first?
Inquiring minds want to know.
But the wind blew me back via Chicago, In the middle of the night
by N Oakley on Dec 3, 2008 11:56 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's at least as good as Howard....and the Phillies don't seem to be too awful.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Dec 3, 2008 12:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i love adam dunn..
that is all..
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
by fischisgod on Dec 3, 2008 2:23 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

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