Why not Abreu?

by ambrosiadreams on Dec 31, 2008 5:32 PM CST

I, like many of you, are hesitant about the seemingly impending signing of Gameboard. I have read Al's "cases" for both Bradley and Dunn, but I haven't heard much more than a few rumblings and grumblings for Bobby Abreu. Since 1998, he's played in no fewer than 151 games, and has a career .300/.405/.498. Yes, I know his defense is suspect, but so is Dunn's. And, with Gameboard's injury history and knee problems, I don't see why he's such a better option.

The DeRosa trade today has upset me quite a bit. I had a bad feeling when I heard of the Miles signing that this was going to happen, but I just don't get it. Not unless JH has something else up his sleeve, i.e. Peavy. So have at it, but consider this my case for signing who I believe to be the best FA left-handed hitting OF on the market, Bobby Abreu.

Happy New Year!

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Abreu would be of no interest to the Cubs...

he stays healthy, is consistent offensively, will steal some bases, and is used to being on winning teams. Even if the defense is getting a bit shaky.

Move along. Nothing to look at here.

by Damen Jackson on Dec 31, 2008 5:45 PM CST reply actions

Abreu's career line is wholly irelevant.

Well, not wholly, but mostly. You get my point. Lets look at his last three years. He went from an OPS or .886 to .814 and then back up to .843. He’s going to be thirty five and while his bat will be solid, his glove is awful, even worse than Dunn’s. The only thing Abreu has over Bradley is durability. After factoring his atrocious glovework, FanGraphs had him worth only 5 million, which means he should be a DH. Dunn was worth 8.7 million and Bradley was worth a notch below 17 million. It’s clear that Abreu is the worst of the three and if Bradley can be had for a decent deal I would much rather go after him. Even if he misses thirty-forty games he should still provide just as much production as Dunn and probably more than Abreu, and if he were to play 150 games he would be the team’s most productive player.

by dakoose on Dec 31, 2008 5:46 PM CST reply actions

Worse than Dunn's?

Hard to believe.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Dec 31, 2008 5:48 PM CST up reply actions

I have to admit...

I’m snickering a bit at that one too.

by Damen Jackson on Dec 31, 2008 5:49 PM CST up reply actions

Abreu is a better fielder than Dunn

I’m not sure where you’re getting that from.

He’d be a better option than Dunn, but not as good as Bradley.

by Wreckard on Dec 31, 2008 5:52 PM CST up reply actions

I'm getting it from Dewan's plus/minus

and UZR ratings. They both are very similar in how they measure fielding and had Dunn as a -13.5/150 games in left field and had Abreu as a whopping -25.9/150 in right. Granted, that’s only one year’s worth of data but with Abreu getting older it’s more than possible that his fielding is worse than Dunn’s.

by dakoose on Dec 31, 2008 8:31 PM CST up reply actions

Bobby Abreu

is not the same guy we remember from his NL days. His defense has gone off the cliff. If it hadn’t the Cubs would be looking at him. Beyond all the other good things we can say about his bat and consistency, he adds the speed Lou wants, too. The fact that we aren’t looking at him should tell us something.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Dec 31, 2008 11:02 PM CST up reply actions

My understanding

…is that UZR is not position-adjusted. You can’t compare a left fielder’s UZR to a right fielder’s in a meaningful way.

I could be wrong though.

by Wreckard on Jan 1, 2009 2:34 AM CST up reply actions

True,

but A) the gap between Abreu and Dunn is huge and not easy to ignore and B) According to the Bill James defensive spectrum, left field precedes right, so that while right field is probably tougher, the difference doesn’t appear to be all that significant.

by dakoose on Jan 1, 2009 9:53 AM CST up reply actions

Was he ever that good out there?

I remember him being more of an offensive threat than a true 5 tool player

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jan 1, 2009 11:20 AM CST up reply actions

UZR is relative to the average fielder at the position.

That said, for corner outfielders, it’s generally pretty close – a +5 LF will generally be a +5 RF, and so on.

I has a blog. | Ask a sabermagician!

by cwyers on Jan 1, 2009 1:17 PM CST up reply actions

abreu

will/does want yankee type money.

Dear Santa:: All I want for X-mas this year is an official 2009 Jake Peavy Cubs Jersey. Oh and a Beimel one too. I've been a real good guy for the most part!!!

by cubsluver22 on Dec 31, 2008 5:51 PM CST reply actions

We just shed $9M in payroll

we should be able to get whoever we want in RF. Especially after giving up the heart and soul of the 2008 Cubs for 3 minor league pitchers.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Dec 31, 2008 5:55 PM CST up reply actions

Abreu may WANT that kind of money...

… but he won’t get it.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Dec 31, 2008 6:42 PM CST up reply actions

Hendry is nuts

I’m worried now that Hendry signs that pain Bradley that Reed Johnson will be the next one the door. The managment of this team to realize that it’s the meat loaf and mashed potato guys that win you championships, not overpriced pieces of garbage like Lee, Fukudome and Soriano.

Ya ain't lived til you've heard "Colour My World" played on an accordian.

by Da Alderman on Dec 31, 2008 6:32 PM CST reply actions

Doubt it.

Hendry LOVES Johnson, and so does Lou.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Dec 31, 2008 6:43 PM CST up reply actions

Why would Reed Johnson leave?

He’s half our CF combo

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jan 1, 2009 11:21 AM CST up reply actions

I agree...

I like the Johnson/Fukudome platoon. Good defense in center, and above average production overall offensively, much like the Edmonds/Reed platoon, but with less SLG.

Proud recipient of a hot dog shot from the Iowa Cubs hot dog gun.

by IowaCubs- on Jan 2, 2009 1:23 PM CST up reply actions

Great players win championships.

“Meat loaf and mashed potato” players are easier for fans to appreciate, because they seem more like average joes. It’s a better story.

"Baseball is like church- many attend, few understand." ~ Leo Durocher

by The Lip on Jan 1, 2009 1:54 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs

+1,000,000,000,000

"I don't know, I think the Bears should just defer so they don't have to put their offense out there to start" -Tony Kornhesier

by rea5661 on Jan 2, 2009 5:39 PM CST up reply actions

One good thing...

About Abreu is that he probably won’t get a longer-term deal like Dunn or Bradley would want, in the 3-5 year range. There’s been speculation that he might have to settle for a 1-2 year deal, I think we could all live with that.

Someday we'll go all the way...

by CubsBullsBears on Dec 31, 2008 7:54 PM CST reply actions

I'd take Abreu in a heartbeat.

100 RBIs in the middle of the lineup. Good guy, always healthy.

Frankly, I’d rather unload every major player for minor-leaguers and start a five-year rebuilding plan than sign Bradley. The Cubs would have a better chance at a championship with nine rookies than with the current team plus Milton Bradley.

Few players in Pro sports can single-handedly destroy a team internally like Milton Bradley. He’s a blue-light special every offseason for a reason, and I wish Hendry would lay off the egg nog long enough to realize there’s a reason this Katrina-flooded Lexus is going for $3000.

If the Cubs are interested in signing piss-poor, despicable human beings because the scouts like their tools, let’s sign Barry Bonds. He’ll be more of a weapon offensively, and a better person to have on the team (which says a lot about Milton).

Just sign Bonds if you can turn a blind eye to Bradley.

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Jan 1, 2009 11:04 AM CST reply actions

What?

Do you really believe the things you wrote? For starters, how is Bradley a piss poor, despicable human being? You have probably never met him and thinking about his (publicized) transgressions, they all seem to be between him and people outside of his organization. I could be wrong there, but again, that’s all I recall. It appears he has a simple anger management, one that can be lived with when the upside is an all-star type.
Also, I have a problem with people who think that a team has to be full of church-goers and boy scouts. When a GM tries to put together a bunch of do-good guys who go all out every day, you end up with the Chicago Bulls of a few years back, fun to watch and easy to root for, but not talented enough. Different sport, put the idea holds true. More often than not, the players that are scrappy and flying all over the field do it because they are very limited talent-wise, and just as often the really talented guys are somewhat ego-maniacal or flawed in some other way. Would I rather have a bunch of angels win a WS than some chain smoking hell raising freaks, yes, but that’s unrealistic and too idealistic. Sometimes you just have to take the bad with the good. Back to the basketball reference, as long as the right personalities are around, a nutty player here and there shouldn’t be too tough to live with. Rodman was held in check despite being an absolute freak show.

by dakoose on Jan 1, 2009 11:22 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs

Does your ENTER key work?

"I never drink water because of the disgusting things fish do in it" -W.C. Fields

by calicubfan on Jan 1, 2009 11:59 AM CST up reply actions

Usually I break up my posts fairly well,

but this was a bit of a rant.

by dakoose on Jan 1, 2009 3:28 PM CST up reply actions

lol..i was just kidding

"I never drink water because of the disgusting things fish do in it" -W.C. Fields

by calicubfan on Jan 1, 2009 6:27 PM CST up reply actions

Church-goers and boy scouts?

Gimme a break.

Along with the “upside is an all-star” comment…..

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Jan 1, 2009 12:09 PM CST up reply actions

Milton Bradley's career line:

.280/.370/.457. While playing in Texas definitely had something to do with his superb season last year(he led the AL in OBP), the opposite has been true for the majority of his career, as he has played several seasons in Dodger Stadium, McAfee Coliseum and Petco Park, all of which suppress offense considerably. Here are his wOBA’s since 2003: .397, .342, .363, .361, .405, .423. Without weighing for games played per season, that averages out to .382. Looking at players with at least 400 PA in ’08, only twenty-six players had a wOBA higher than .382. Only eleven outfielders ranked higher than him. That sounds like all-star material to me.

by dakoose on Jan 1, 2009 3:40 PM CST up reply actions

Bradley is talented.

He should produce. My only concern is whether Bradley can take playing in the Chicago media market and whether that affects his play. His mistakes/shortcomings will et magnified in the Chicago market and the big question will be how he responds?

by DudeVf11 on Jan 1, 2009 8:20 PM CST up reply actions

Riiiiight.

And Mark Prior sound like a perennial Cy Young winner, too.
I mean, as long as we’re ignoring the obvious………….

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Jan 1, 2009 11:12 PM CST up reply actions

I question your reading and comprehension skills

He didn’t say perennial all-star, he said upside of an all-star.

Everyone knows he hasn’t stayed healthy. Neither has Prior, who most would agree at one time had the upside of a Cy Young winner.

The difference is that Prior hasn’t been able to come back and play at his previous level. Bradley always has.

by Wreckard on Jan 2, 2009 11:09 AM CST up reply actions

I agree with original post..

I like Abreu..The consistency, stolen base ability and contact hitting trumps the shaky defense. The Cubs would still have Fuky as a late inning defensive replacement

The journey is the reward!

by wicubfan on Jan 2, 2009 10:27 AM CST reply actions

I just don't get the Bradley love.

Besides being a head case, the guy never plays a full season, hell 125 games, yet Jimbo deals DeRosa and lets Woody walk for a mental nightmare who is constantly hurt, great move.
Abreu, plays 150 games a year, .290, 20 HRS, 90 runs, and 90 RBI’s. Bradley wants 3 years at 30M, Wait it out and get Abreu for 1 year at 12M, just my hunch.
But Milton Bradley, no freaking thanks.!!!

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Jan 2, 2009 11:33 AM CST reply actions