Overflow Thread: Cubs vs. Rockies, Thursday 4/24, 2:05 CT

by Al Yellon on Apr 24, 2008 3:30 PM CDT in Game Threads

No RAM failures (or A-RAM failures!) today!

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Al,

change back to the old BCB.

"I think Hendry still has a few years to serve on his 'grand larceny' sentence before he can shop in Pittsburgh again" - ballhawk

by NittanyCub on Apr 24, 2008 5:09 PM CDT reply actions

It's a shame. Seems like SBNation just wasn't prepared. I'll stick it out though as this is the best cubs site on the net.

by Ilan on Apr 24, 2008 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions

We're back up.

Tomorrow, there will be a game thread as usual. Stick around, we’ll be just fine.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Apr 24, 2008 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions

I think we lost...

...because BCB broke.

Dan

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Apr 24, 2008 5:16 PM CDT reply actions

I think we lost

because of poor defense and Aaron Cook pitching on hell of a ball game.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions

I think...

...it was a joke.

Dan

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Apr 24, 2008 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions

Theriot's play at 2nd was a joke...

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Apr 24, 2008 5:22 PM CDT up reply actions

Yes,

yes it was, as was Fontenot’s baserunning. Those two put the “crappy” in “scrappy” today.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions

I know.

Just frustration coming through. Didn’t mean to be an ass. All apologies.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:24 PM CDT up reply actions

To be fair...

Fontenot getting doubled off 1st was just a tough play…but he should have known Theriot’s tendencies and been a little cautious.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Apr 24, 2008 5:28 PM CDT up reply actions

they’ve been playing together for 5 or 6 years. If that was Ronny Cedeno, he’d be getting roundly castigated across Cub fandom; I seriously doubt scrappy, gritty, grinder-rific Mike Fontenot will receive the same treatment.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions

I missed all video of the game...

...a few bad plays??

Dan

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Apr 24, 2008 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions

Well,

No one was really impressive at the plate today, save for Pie and Soto. Cook pitcched realy well, but in the top of the 8th, the Cub find themselves with bases loaded, no one out and Fonty up. FC, run scores, one out. Theriot up, line out to first, but Fonty is halfway to second, and is double off. Sparkling play all around. Bottom 8, runner on first, one out, grounder to second, Ronny goes and gets it, flips to Theriot, who drops it, everyone safe, go-ahead run scores, Cubs lose. Ugly.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:40 PM CDT up reply actions

Fonty wasn't halfway to second...

he had taken he secondary lead off first and was leaning toward 2nd base when Helton caught the ball. Helton was over toward the line about a yard infront of the bag…Fontenot was probably no more than 10 feet off, but he didn’t have a chance in hell of beating Helton back to 1st. Don’t make it sound worse than it already was.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Apr 24, 2008 5:44 PM CDT up reply actions

He looked pretty far down the line to me,

but you’re right, it wasn’t halfway. It was still bad, and at this point we’re just arguing about what degree of crappiness to which we might ascribe this baserunning blunder.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:48 PM CDT up reply actions

You mean you don't want me to make a Fanpost Diary...

to discuss and dissect this one play?

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Apr 24, 2008 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions

LOL!

Definitely not. I’m trying my best to drown the memory of it in a glass of Glenfarclas. Please do me the favor of letting it pass away.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions

I didn't see the play...

...seeing as how I’m at work, but if you look at the combined performance of our Cajun Connection today, it was not exactly inspiring.

And yes, nobody was really all that inspiring today except for maybe Pie on the hitting side of things. It probably is a bit unfair to nitpick at every little possible failing of those two while leaving guys like Lee, Ramirez and Dome off the hook for their collective 0-fer.

But it’s a little frustrating watch the team continually giving more and more chances to guys like Theriot and Fontenot, who lack both a track record of success or a hint of future potential. I fail to see how Patterson could be much worse than Fontenot, and I see how he could be better. The same with Cedeno and Theriot.

I has a blog.

by cwyers on Apr 24, 2008 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions

Yeah.

I harbor no special dislike for Theriot and Fontenot, but the disproportionate number of chances they’ve been given compared to the chances that pie, Cedeno, and Patterson have been given is really beginning to grate on me.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions

I'm not convinced about Patterson.

However, Cedeno has clearly earned more playing time.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Apr 24, 2008 5:59 PM CDT up reply actions

Patterson give the Cubs

more flexibility that Fontenot and I think he can mange at least as much with the bat, but again, how are we to know? Fontenot’s here and Patterson only had a two-day callup. It’s time to divorce ourselves from Patterson’s foolishness of last season and see what he can do.

Cedeno hits a GW GS and gets a pinch runner/defensive replacement gig; Theriot makes the rally killing out and the game-losing error. I should hope we don’t see Theriot starting tomorrow night. Johnson in LF, Derosa at 2B, and Cedeno at SS.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions

I realize it wasn't techincally a game-winner.

hopefully you can surmount my hyperbole…

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions

Now who with any baseball knowledge could argue with that? Words well-spoken but Lou loves Theriot just as Dusty loved Neify!

by muffman on Apr 24, 2008 9:46 PM CDT up reply actions

I'm not trying to convince anyone about Patterson.

But Fontenot is hitting .206/.229/.353 so far this season, and it’s hard to argue that Patterson could be that much worse than that. That’s not praise for Patterson, just recognition that it’s hard to do appreciably worse than a .582 OPS.

So long as we’re going to get horrible production from a player, we really may as well use Patterson (who can also play more positions, unless you believe in Fontenot as a SS/3B) and at least is young enough that he has SOME potential.

It’s not a matter of earning playing time, it’s a matter of allocating it where it will do the most good. Fontenot hasn’t earned any playing time either – his career .267/.328/.393 batting line is pretty bad for a poor defensive second baseman, and I fail to see any reason to think he’ll get much better.

I has a blog.

by cwyers on Apr 24, 2008 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions

Well then...

...is the argument for Fontenot that he gets to play with his LSU buddy? I agree with you, but am trying to figure out why he IS playing.

Dan

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Apr 24, 2008 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions

I've been trying to figure that out

since his bat went cold last season. I have reached no conclusion. This has proven a most frustrating field of inquiry.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions

I think you're failing to recognize

how scrappy Fontenot is; I mean, he’s gritty, has heart, and grittiness and is a very scrappy, gritty player, the type of guy who grinds out every play. Just a gritty, scrappy guy with sneaky power.

Okay, so maybe that was little thick on the sarcasm. What I meant to say was: agreed.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions

I know Lou likes Fontenot.

If Patterson is going to be on the roster, he has to play. The callup last week - which essentially was done just so he could play in the same game with his brother - was pointless.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Apr 24, 2008 6:29 PM CDT up reply actions

We all know Lou likes Fontenot.

We’re all just left wondering why at this point.

I has a blog.

by cwyers on Apr 24, 2008 6:35 PM CDT up reply actions

Yeah, I have to agree with this.

Since Lou usually plays the hot hand, if Fontenot continues to not hit, he’ll sit.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Apr 24, 2008 6:50 PM CDT up reply actions

From your lips

to Lou’s ears, Al.

Fontenot and Theriot are essentially redundant, save for the fact that Fonty is a lefty. The team is winning now, but I don’t know how long this team can afford to have two reserve IF with limited position flexibility on the bench. At least Patterson can man some OF positions.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 7:01 PM CDT up reply actions

It's pretty simple...

Fontenot had a really hot first month of his career. That, and his grittiness, got him in Piniella’s good graces. I don’t agree with it either, but that’s pretty much what happened here.

I agree though. I don’t think that Patterson is necessarily any better, but he can at least be as bad at multiple positions.

by SouthernCub on Apr 24, 2008 6:29 PM CDT up reply actions

But I'm going to go with the positives here.

Marquis pitched a good game and gave the bullpen a much needed rest. Pie looked better-I’ve never been a big Pie-backer but I’d love to be wrong.
Cook was unhittable for much of the game-this happens. Even the best teams cool off occasionally. We kept it close up until the end. One of the things I love about this current Cubs team is that I’m always thinking that, as long as they keep the score relatively close, they can pull it out in late innings-past Cubs teams rarely inspired this kind of optimism.
All of that being said though-it WAS tough to lose the way we did; Theriot dropping a double play relay that, if completed, would’ve ended the inning with no scoring.
The more I see of Theriot defensively, the more I’m convinced we’re going to need an upgrade at some point.

by bluekoolaide on Apr 24, 2008 5:26 PM CDT reply actions

Marquis did pitch well

and the performances we’ve seen from he, Lilly, and Hill this time through are definitely encouraging.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:29 PM CDT up reply actions

Amen to that.

Our biggest concerns – starting pitching, and depth once Soriano went on the DL – seem to be irrelevant after this big week.

Dan

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Apr 24, 2008 5:41 PM CDT up reply actions

True.

That makes the loss today sting just a bit less.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions

It couldn't last forever

had to lose sometime, but it sure has been a nice run lately. They didn’t play all that well today, didn’t hit and still had chance to win late.

by qccub on Apr 24, 2008 5:31 PM CDT reply actions

We're back...

... and I’ll have a recap up in a little while. I can only imagine what this overflow thread would have looked like in the 8th inning.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Apr 24, 2008 5:35 PM CDT reply actions

Visually...

most of us probably looked like this…

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Apr 24, 2008 5:37 PM CDT up reply actions

Dad?

n/t

Dan

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Apr 24, 2008 5:41 PM CDT up reply actions

LMFAO!

Well played, well played.

Baseball is an allegorical play about America, a poetic, complex, and subtle play of courage, fear, good luck, mistakes, patience about fate, and sober self-esteem. -- Saul Steinberg

by bluebythebook on Apr 24, 2008 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions

Holy crap.

That’s frightening.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:43 PM CDT up reply actions

They should use that slogan....

Canadian Football…”That’s Frightening!”

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Apr 24, 2008 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions

Yes,

yes they should.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions

I think you jinxed us on both accounts ;-) j/k

by John Q Freejazz on Apr 24, 2008 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions

Just got back from Rocky-land

Cubs looked flat, no doubt about it. Day game after an emotional night game after traveling on the road they looked one millisecond slow.

Tough breaks at the end of the game. Cubs should have gotten out of the inning and gave away a probable DP and the game would have moved on at 2-2, although I didn’t see them making another strike.

Marquis surprised me (AGAIN).

Good things; Fontenot got a hit and Pie two hits. Fukudome has that natural fluid sense, he made a nice play in RF where he took the wrong path, easily adjusted and threw in the dime to 1B to force Holliday back.

Now they travel across 2 time zones to play Washington. If they can get 2 of 3 it will be a very nice road trip.

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Apr 24, 2008 6:36 PM CDT reply actions

Marquis had a nice

game. Hope he can carry this longer than he did last season.

I knew they would lose sometime so I’m not all that disappointed about today’s game.

by sue369 on Apr 24, 2008 6:45 PM CDT reply actions

Marquis had a really nice game.

Hopefully he can keep it up until he’s moved at the ASB to make room for Gallagher!

(wishful thinking)

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Apr 24, 2008 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions

good team

even though we lost today, I would have to say being a cub fan is a lot of fun right now. Last year around this same time, we weren’t so happy. So I will take 2 loses out of every ten games played.

Careful Son, They will break your heart. And then stomp on it. But I will be a Cubs fans until I die. Its your fault Harry!!!

by deployedcubfan on Apr 24, 2008 6:47 PM CDT reply actions

All we have to do is keep winning series...

I’ll take a split in Colorado-as long as we take two out of three from Washington (a sweep would be great but, even against a team as bad as the Nationals, that’s not easy to do) and come back 3-2 on the trip, I’ll be happy. of course if we came back 4-1, I’d be ecstatic.

by bluekoolaide on Apr 24, 2008 7:01 PM CDT reply actions

Bob Brenley

In the post- game show BB was showing the botched double play in the 8th inning and said Ronny`s throw took Theriot off 2nd base. Did anyone see the play that way? Theriot flatassed dropped the ball. How could you see it any other way?

by muffman on Apr 24, 2008 9:52 PM CDT reply actions