What's wrong with Soto?
A week ago I was thinking about him as a genuine r.o.y. candidate and now, suddenly, visions of Rick Wilkins are dancing in my head.
I know it's only two games and, hopefully, it doesn't mean all that much but is anybody else as worried about Soto as I suddenly am? The last couple of games he's looked completely lost up there. I'm wondering if the league's already caught up with him which would be kind of discouraging considering the season's not even a month old yet.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation, Bleed Cubbie Blue, or Al Yellon, editor-in-chief. FanPost opinions are, however, valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
0 recs |
34
comments
Comments
Nothing
every player has a bad game every once in a while.
"Stay thirsty my friends....."
by Keystone80435 on Apr 26, 2008 10:14 PM CDT 0 recs
it really is a bad stretch, 8 straight K's....
but I’m not worried, he’s had a great year thus far, and it hasn’t affected his ability to call a game. I’m confident he’ll work out his kinks soon…seems like he’s thinking too much
Chuck Norris is a Cubs fan...
by Walker71421 on Apr 26, 2008 10:17 PM CDT 0 recs
And
as long as his play behind the plate is solid I dont care what he does with his bat.
"Stay thirsty my friends....."
by Keystone80435 on
Apr 26, 2008 10:18 PM CDT
up
0 recs
Hmm...
Leads the majors in OBP and OPS. Second in BA and SLG. (All that for catchers, of course)
Hitting way above his expectations…he was bound to come to earth a little bit. He’s a rookie, which means pitchers are getting a better feel for pitching him as the season progresses.
Chill. Out.
by Kansas25 on Apr 26, 2008 10:18 PM CDT 0 recs
Seconded.
Pat and Ron were talking about Soto’s had some difficulty with left-handers, but seemed to agree that he’ll be fine, with perhaps a minor adjustment. No big deal.
"Hey! If the moon were made of ribs, wouldja eat it? I know I would!"
by cubs0505 on Apr 26, 2008 10:22 PM CDT 0 recs
He should get the day off tomorrow
(day game after a night game). Let him clear his head and bounce back Tuesday in a big way against the Brewers. He’ll be fine. (But I will admit, he looked so ugly the last 2 days…)
It's gotta be the shoes, folks, it's gotta be the shoes...
by Schwa on Apr 26, 2008 10:39 PM CDT 0 recs
Yeah, he’ll be fine. Obviously he wasn’t going to be dominant like he came out of the gate; i expect by the end of the year we will all be very happy with his end-of year stats.
by Canseco's Roid Party on Apr 26, 2008 10:45 PM CDT 0 recs
There is definitely something wrong
it’s not just a regular slump, and I don’t think it takes a scout to see there is something that he can’t do. His problem: he can’t hit the breaking pitch that starts out in the lower strike zone and drops out of it. From the past two days, it has been the same. He consistently swings over the top of the pitch and can’t even seem to connect.
I was actually thinking of posting about this yesterday after the game after the 3 strikeouts because I saw this consistent pattern, and I have watched his at-bats closely since his third strikeout of the seven. It’s really is the same pattern: the ball starts out heading into the strike zone somewhere around the lower thighs, then it drops out into the catcher’s mitt around the mid/lower calves. He swings over the top, as if he expects the ball not to break so sharply. Look back over the footage.
That is the pitch he has trouble with, everything else is fine. However, today he knew he had trouble with that pitch, and thus was much too hesitant. In his second at bat today, he did not swing at any pitches. 3 of them were balls, and were the same type of diving pitch that he swung at. Improvement? probably not. He was just plainly more hesitant. The strikes in that at-bat were not those sharply breaking balls, yet he did not make any motion even to swing. The last one was actually pretty flat, with a little side movement, something that he is easily capable of at least fouling away, but instead he was frozen. This would imply he has difficulty picking up the difference between straight pitches and sharp breaking pitches in that zone, and is possibly overthinking. His last at bat, the pitcher didn’t actually throw the breaking pitches for the first three and threw them mostly straight and up. He was able to foul them away with relative ease. But the last pitch, the ball broke and he swung over the top. All five of the swinging strikeouts, he swung at the same type of pitch.
For those of you saying how it is “just a slump”, it clearly isn’t. I am all about making sure sample sizes are big enough to make judgments on stats, IF there is no other outside information. If I just saw the line, 7 SO 1 BB, i would also say it is a just a fluke. However, this is one specific type of pitch with specific characteristics that he repeatedly does the same thing on.
This is not at all to say he can’t improve. He needs to work with the hitting coach and find whatever mechanical part of his swing or mental part of his pitch selection he is having trouble with. He needs to adjust to this, and he probably can if he works hard. However, just saying that this is a regular slump and waiting for it to pass is not going to work. Until he actually adjusts to the pitching (which is mostly just laying off pitches as they are mostly balls) he will continue to fail with that pitch.
by ecbc on Apr 26, 2008 10:58 PM CDT 0 recs
Then
what took ML pitchers 159 AB’s to figure out Soto had such a hard time hitting that pitch? There’s no doubt he was struggling with that same pitch over and over again. But I find it really hard to believe he has always struggled with that pitch that bad, and pitchers have just figured it out the last two days. Who says that Soto just had a harder time then usual picking up that pitch, or his bat was a little slower and tired compared to usual, so he struggled to make contact with that pitch? When something is 8 AB’s, it’s still a small sample size, even if he has struggled with the same pitch in 8 AB’s. Plus lets not forget Soto went 5 for 8 AB before the last two days. If this keeps going on next week, then I think we can say something is wrong, but two games is too early.
by cubsfan25 on
Apr 27, 2008 12:58 AM CDT
up
0 recs
well
it’s not just that he has struggled to make contact with the pitch. He has consistently swung at the pitch in the same exact way. Every time, over the top, not making ANY contact. Of course, I don’t really expect him to make contact. Most of the pitches are actually balls.
In terms of bat speed, I can’t really tell from the TV angle, so don’t quote me, but I would say he’s actually a bit out in front. Those pitches were only in the lower 80s, so I would be surprised if he was really that tired this early, even if he has had a lot of long innings. But that doesn’t even matter, because his bat has not even been in line with the pitch.
What took ML pitchers 159 at bats? I don’t know. Is that an anomaly? Do you know the normal amount it takes to find a hole in a batter’s swing? I know people have talked about “sophomore slumps” where pitchers figure the rookies out, so there’s something if those have basis in fact. If he had not faced a pitcher like Perez who seemed to specialize with that pitch, it would not be noticed as easily, and I don’t think Soto had an experience with a pitcher that threw that pitch the majority of the times this year like Perez did. It is worth asking why this hadn’t been picked up in the minors, but I don’t know enough about the minor league experience to say anything. Certainly, players come up from the minors with holes in their approach, so its not 100% impossible that this could have been glossed over in the minors.
He went 5 for 8 when pitchers didn’t concentrate on that specific pitch, in that specific height location with that specific breaking action. I want to emphasize that I’m not just looking at the 8 SO line and saying he is struggling. It really was that one specific pitch.And when it is that specific, and he has made no contact and barely any adjustment (I though in his 3rd at bat of the first game of the series, he actually made a little improvement, as he took one of the pitches for a ball… but he still promptly struck out on another one of them afterwards).
We will have to watch the next few games to see. Remember, though, concentrate on that one pitch, and how he reacts, not just how he does overall. I think He is fine so far with everything else, so even if he goes 3 for 5, it doesn’t prove anything if he isn’t pitched as I described. Look to see if he lays of the balls, if he is able to at least foul off the ones that are borderline strikes. Look to see, if he lays off the breaking pitches, that he also goes back and swings confidently at the “regular” strikes that he hasn’t struggled with this season. I’ll watch too.
by ecbc on
Apr 27, 2008 1:50 AM CDT
up
0 recs
also
one thing I forgot to mention but I do remember noticing, Soto has less trouble with those pitches middle/in than outside. I specified the height of the ball, but not the horizontal location. He still struggles with not swinging at those outside breaking pitches, but does seem to be able to lay off them a little better if they are outside than if they are pitched inside to him. That would make sense to why his deficiency hasn’t been found yet, as there are less left handers than right handers, and left handers have the tendency to pitch with an outside-in sweep to right handed batters. So add that with the necessity of being breaking ball pitcher with large break for some evidence to why Soto’s flaw hadn’t been noticed much.
by ecbc on
Apr 27, 2008 2:25 AM CDT
up
0 recs
MLB
teams have scouts, and people who watch tape to look for hitters weakness for a living. If there was a major flaw with the way Soto hits, I really believe it would have been figured out by now. I agree pitchers, scouts and coachs will probably find weakness in Soto hitting, and he won’t hit 320 this year. But I don’t think it their will be a pitch that ML pitchers can throw Soto consistently to get him out. He will have weakness like any hitter, but I don’t think he’s consistently going to struggle with breaking pitches either. Sure he many never hit them really well, but I think he will hit them well enough to get other pitches. I wonder if there’s anyway to find out how Soto did off breaking pitches in the past? I can’t imagine this is the first time ML pitches have throw him those type of breaking pitches. He must of had some success or hit them well enough in the past. But for now ML pitches will throw him nothing but breaking pitches, it’s up to Soto to adjust, and only time will tell if he will.
by cubsfan25 on
Apr 27, 2008 2:46 AM CDT
up
0 recs
I agree
What took ML pitchers 159 at bats? I don’t know. Is that an anomaly? Do you know the normal amount it takes to find a hole in a batter’s swing? I know people have talked about "sophomore slumps" where pitchers figure the rookies out, so there’s something if those have basis in fact. If he had not faced a pitcher like Perez who seemed to specialize with that pitch, it would not be noticed as easily
that pitchers find holes in a batter’s swing. But seeing if a hitter can’t hit or lay off breaking balls in the dirt doesn’t take 159 AB’s for pitchers to figure that out. Especially with the way he has struggled with it the last two days. So he must have done a decent job hitting that pitch or laying off that pitch in the past. Or pitchers wouldn’t throw him anything else, but those pitches. It’s almost to much of a common pitch for pitchers not to notice by now. I agree that it could become a weakness in Soto game, but he’s also not going to struggle that much on that pitch as he did this weekend.
by cubsfan25 on
Apr 27, 2008 2:33 AM CDT
up
0 recs
IT'S NOT SOTO!!!! IT'S AN ALIEN!!!
Soto has been replaced by an alien. Unfortunately this alien is not particularly adroit at baseball. He is quite good at table tennis, but it was his misfortune to kidnap Soto.
You must believe me. I have proof…
(Or it could be a combination of fatigue and scouts doing their job and finding holes in the swing of a young player. Either that or the alien thing.)
In the middle of a good time, Truth gave me her icy kiss. Look around, you must be joking. All that way, all that way for this -Oysterband
by Ross on Apr 26, 2008 11:32 PM CDT 0 recs
Soto Stinks!
Put ONEDEC behind the plate!
"Stay thirsty my friends....."
by Keystone80435 on Apr 27, 2008 12:09 AM CDT 0 recs
It's too early to be concerned.
I’m sure he has seen his share of curveballs in his 159 career AB’s. So I can’t imagne big league pitchers are just throwing him curveballs now. I’m sure he has seen curveballs before and has hit them well. So it’s way too early to say he can’t hit a curveball and everybody knows it. It’s very possible this could just be two bad days, and he could be a little tired. Lets not forget Soto has caught a lot of innings in 26 days. Going 0 for 8 with 8 strike outs is ugly, but it’s just two bad games, and only 8 AB’s. In his 8 AB’s before that he went 5 for 8 with a double and HR, so it’s too early to be concerned right now. Soto is gonna get tomorrow off, and we have a off day Monday, if these struggles continue next week then we could start to get concerned. But give the guy a little time, and lets not forget he’s still hitting 316/415/959 with 3 HR and 14 RBI’s.
by cubsfan25 on Apr 27, 2008 12:49 AM CDT 0 recs
My guess
Lou might move him to #8 and Cedeno to #7. I wouldn’t move the #1 or #2 hitters only because they have a good tendency of getting on base their first at-bats more often than not. Cedeno seems to be more of a late inning hitter.
by ak123 on Apr 27, 2008 12:59 AM CDT 0 recs
Getting Too Confident
I think he was just getting TO confident. What I mean is he was doing good and got the idea that I got this down so I can now swing for the fences all the time, he just needs to get back to basics.
by Djanvk on Apr 27, 2008 1:44 AM CDT 0 recs
Can't have it both ways...
You say you’re “suddenly worried”, yet you also admit “it’s only two games”?
Look, either you’re jumping off the ledge or you’re not – you don’t get to hang in mid-air. Only the roadrunner gets to do that.
Beep beep!
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Apr 27, 2008 4:13 AM CDT 0 recs
LOL
What are you doing up at 4 am? At least I’m at work.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Apr 27, 2008 4:21 AM CDT
up
0 recs
Just got back from Easter midnight services
I’m of the Eastern Orthodox variety, so our Easter was later this year. According to the Eastern calendar, we can’t have Easter until after Passover, so I guess I have you to blame for being up so late… ;-)
Christos Voskrese! to any Russian Cub fans out there, and Christos Anesti! to our favorite Greek baseball owner, Peter Angelos.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on
Apr 27, 2008 4:37 AM CDT
up
0 recs
Thanks for the explanation.
You sure you want to take “credit” for Peter Angelos?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Apr 27, 2008 4:48 AM CDT
up
0 recs
Three hot dogs washed down with a couple of Harps
That’s why I’m up…
"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"
by lostinthevines on Apr 27, 2008 5:15 AM CDT 0 recs
My fault, my fault!!
I had him benched for the last couple of weeks in my fantasy league and activated him 2 games ago since he was so HOT! FYI, he is now benched again.
Rip it up GEO!
"Man, this is fun!" - Len Kasper
by ryno HOF 2005 on Apr 27, 2008 7:32 AM CDT 0 recs
If he does well in his next start....
... you better keep him benched!
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Apr 27, 2008 12:35 PM CDT
up
0 recs
soto
everyone hits a slump in his career.hell soriano was hitting 175 and how long has he been playing???
by NOMAR on Apr 27, 2008 7:43 AM CDT 0 recs
What's wrong with Soto?
Nothing. Have you seen that gorgeous…....wait…...ohhhhh, you were talking about his batting. ;-)
He’ll be fine. He’s just in a slump.
by sue369 on Apr 27, 2008 9:50 AM CDT 0 recs
Soto needs to adjust like any Rookie
If the BCB board sees his weakness than an advanced scout saw it and now the league. Simple recognition, recognize a low breaking ball and lay off.
He also has not traveled like this regularly, 3 time zones and played night then day then traveled two time zones. Lot of adjustments…..
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on Apr 27, 2008 11:43 AM CDT 0 recs
Lou is not
worried about him. He talked to him last night and Geo said he had just helped his pitcher with a shutout and that was big to him. Lou said he has a great attitude and Lou not worried.
by sue369 on
Apr 27, 2008 12:28 PM CDT
up
0 recs
One word folks...
adjustment. The league is adjusting to Soto’s weakness, off speed stuff in various locations. Now….it’s up to him to adjust to that. We’ll now see what the kid is made of, both offencively and defencively. Will his defence lack because of the plate struggles? Only time will tell.
by blackhawk24 on Apr 27, 2008 12:12 PM CDT 0 recs
Nothing at all
If you have played baseball you know that once and a while you are going to have a bad game. Soto’s numbers this year have been magnificent highlighted by a .316 batting average 3 home runs and 14 batted in. I think you cannot judge a player on 2 bad games just like you cannot say that the cubs suck just because they lost 2 out of 3 to the nationals.
by columbusOHcubsfan on Apr 27, 2008 3:28 PM CDT 0 recs
Whats wrong with Soto?
Dont know you tell me.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/s/sotoge01.shtml
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip
by Hammer on Apr 28, 2008 3:25 PM CDT 0 recs

















