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Fukudome Or Fukutome?

We already know that Japanese spellings rendered into English can be... well, not entirely precise. In this Sun-Times article, Gordon Wittenmyer notes what is possibly one of those misspellings... or not:
The Japanese media presented right fielder Kosuke Fukudome with a birthday cake in the dugout a few hours before the game. But it had his named misspelled (Kousuke Fukutome). Fukudome turned 31 on Saturday.
Now, you'd think the Japanese media would know how to render his name in English, right? I know there's a website out there somewhere with his first name spelled "Kousuke", but I can't seem to find it right now. So -- to dragonsfanatic or anyone else fluent in Japanese, did the Japanese media get it right?

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Technically there is no one correct spelling...

...of any word “romanized” from a foreign alphabet – it all depends upon the transliteration system used. I’m only familiar with the Revised Hepburn method for transliterating – that said, it’s been five or six years since Japanese 111 and I can’t say it was my best subject.

You run into the same problems with other languages with non-Roman alphabets – Arabic is one, which is why you’ll sometimes see Osama or Usama used for Osama bin Laden’s name. None of them are technically more correct than any other.

Kosuke and Kousuke both seem close enough that I would probably accept both of them as being legitimate. Fukutome makes no sense to me, but the traveling Japanese media has probably spent more time studying Japanese than me.

by cwyers on Apr 27, 2008 3:26 PM CDT reply reply   0 recs

Right, that's what I figured.

Also that the Japanese media would know more about how Ko(u)suke’s name is supposed to be transliterated than Gordon Wittenmyer would.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Apr 27, 2008 3:51 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I actually learned about this Friday.

“Oo” and “Ou” make exactly the same sound in Japanese, so while the “o” is not a long O, it’s basically the same sound.

Fukutome is also a very simple mistake. The Japanese alphabet is peculiar for a number of reasons, one of them being that by adding two small little lines (called a dakuten) towards the top of the character, you change the beginning consonant. It’s hard to explain over the internet, but here’s a link that shows a bit more what I’m talking about – http://www.magnifythelord.org/cma/Nihongo_files/image012.gif

Basically, the “do” in Japanese is written as a “to” with a dakuten towards the top of the character. So I can understand where the error came from!

(it’s kind of hard to explain languages over the internet)

CUBS WIN! CUE THE ORCHESTRA!

by Keith on Apr 27, 2008 4:07 PM CDT reply reply   0 recs

No, actually that's a really good explanation.

n/t

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Apr 27, 2008 4:27 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

The Washington radio guys

said yesterday he had a cake in the club house that was spelled wrong. One of the radio guys said “Let me guess, they put a C in front of the K.” Then he went on to ask his fellow radio coworker if he took a slice of the cake that had the C in front of the K. The co-announcer said no, they spelled it F-U-K-O-D-O-M-E.

"Stay thirsty my friends....."

by Keystone80435 on Apr 27, 2008 4:50 PM CDT reply reply   0 recs

Oh great

Don’t tell me I have to make a new sign….

Fukudometer: Created 3/31/08 Wrigley Debut 4/5/08 WGN and Japan TV Debut 4/6/08 Sun Times Debut: 4/20/08

by Fuk-U-Meter on Apr 27, 2008 5:41 PM CDT reply reply   0 recs

I checked with my dad...

since I didn’t pay attention to the Japanese language classes I went to, as a child. According to my dad, both Fukudome and Fukutome are acceptible. It is a regional thing. Fukudome is from Kagoshima, in southern Japan. In the Kagoshima area it is pronounced as Fukudome. In other areas, further north, Fukutome is the accepted pronounciation. My dad’s family is from the Kagoshima area. Our family name is in the same situation. In Kagoshima, it is pronounced as Sameshima. Further north, it becomes Samejima.

Regarding his first name, my dad recalls that Kosuke would be the more traditional translation. Kousuke may be a modern update of the name. Something like the name Karen becoming Karin.

By the way, I share the same middle name as Fukudome. It is Hiroshi. It transulates to honored one. Of course my brother ’s middle name is Toyoshi. He is the great one.

by holy mackerel on Apr 27, 2008 7:43 PM CDT reply reply   0 recs

Very interesting, thanks for your insight!

(and, as always, your photos)

Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager

by northsider on Apr 27, 2008 9:11 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

So that would explain...

... why the cake had the name on it that it did. It wasn’t “wrong”, it was just a different regionalization of the spelling, probably based on whatever Japanese reporter ordered it. Thanks!

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Apr 27, 2008 9:17 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

NO, it's wrong

I will add my 2 cents lator….

I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.

by dragonsfanatic on Apr 27, 2008 9:18 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Well the reality is....

Kosuke Fukudome is Fukudome, not Fukutome. The kanji characters for Fukudome can be read either as Fukudome or Fukutome, but Kosuke is Fukudome. Nobody in any region is allowed to call him Fukutome. As holy mackerel says, most of this family name in Kagoshima area is spelled as Fukudome, and in other region Fukutome is majority, but you can NOT spell one particular person in different way. This famous commentator (who is known as our public enemy Tokyo Giants fan) is Fukutome. He will immediately make correction if he is called as Fukudome.

Kosuke/Kousuke/Kohsuke is very different – this is Japanese-to-Alphabet conversion issue. You can spell the same Japanese spell of his name either Kosuke or Kousuke or Kohsuke. Dome should be using one of them when he writes his name with alphabet (his official website uses “Kohsuke”), but he won’t be angry nor try to collect it if other person spells it in other way – it’s almost free. People in baseball industry tend to use Kohsuke with some admire for Sadaharu Oh (he start using OH on his back) by the way. Monthly Dragons magazine’s special issue for Dome farewell spells his name “Kousuke”.

That’s my 10 yen…

Monthly Dragons Mar.2008 - Special Issue "BYE KOUSUKE"

I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.

by dragonsfanatic on Apr 27, 2008 9:55 PM CDT reply reply   0 recs

Back on birthday cake issue

So the spelling error on the birthday cake should be done by Japanese confectioner who understands this Kanji can be read as Fukutome but didn’t know Kosuke is Fukudome, and not very interested in baseball…

Here’s photo of the cake…

I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.

by dragonsfanatic on Apr 27, 2008 10:21 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Thanks for the further explanation and the photo.

Wonder why that photo didn’t wind up in any American newspapers or websites!

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Apr 28, 2008 3:27 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Wow...

...what a crappy cake. Those bats look more like fried chicken legs.

On another note, are birthday cakes an American tradition, or do Japanese have the same tradition?

"I'm petrified of nipple chafing. Once it starts, it's a vicious circle." Andy Bernard

by TXCub on Apr 28, 2008 8:17 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Yes

This tradition was imported after WWII.

I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.

by dragonsfanatic on Apr 28, 2008 9:39 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Thanks as always, dragonsfanatic!

I was waiting for you to weigh in. Thank goodness we have you and holy mackerel on the board.

Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager

by northsider on Apr 28, 2008 9:07 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

thanks

It’s a little hard to look at the cake with the pic of the volleyball player! Wow I love womens volleyball!

"To know that I know what I know, and that I do not know what I do not know. That is true knowledge" - Confucious as quoted in Walden

by toaster on May 5, 2008 12:59 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

My big question is

why would the Japanese media celebrate a Japanese player’s birthday with a cake written solely in English?

Okay, "Wendy: hot and juicy redhead."

by neverAcquiesce on Apr 28, 2008 9:16 AM CDT reply reply   0 recs

Maybe...

... they couldn’t find a bakery in Washington that could do the greeting in Japanese?

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Apr 28, 2008 9:19 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I thought that,

but they do personalized illustrations all the time. All the Japanese media would have to do is draw out the characters for “Happy Birthday Kosuke Fukudome!” and have that illustrated on said cake.

Okay, "Wendy: hot and juicy redhead."

by neverAcquiesce on Apr 28, 2008 9:33 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I just realized...

it was not in Chicago but in DC. Do you folks have better patisserie in Chicago? ;-)

I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.

by dragonsfanatic on Apr 28, 2008 9:48 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Back when I lived there...

...my two favorite bakeries were German. Dinkel’s, in the Lincoln/Belmont/Ashland area, and Lutz, an outstanding pastry shop in the North Side.

Dinkel’s had the best chocolate donuts I think I’ve ever experienced as a sleepy, rushing-to-work caffeine hound.

by MN exile on Apr 28, 2008 11:03 AM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Dinkel's is still there.

You can order from them online, if you really miss them.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Apr 28, 2008 12:56 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Something tells me...

...the donuts might be a bit stale by the time they got here.

There was also a killer little Filipino place on Lincoln south of Belmont I used to go to for lunch two or three times a week. I know they’re long gone…

This was during a few years when i worked at Allied, on Belmont just by Southport.

by MN exile on Apr 28, 2008 11:19 PM CDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Thanks for the corrections....

to my previous post. I oversimplified my dad’s explanation, in my haste to post my comments. Since my dad’s family is originally from the Kagoshima area, our family goes by the name Sameshima. Some of my dad’s cousins, elsewhere in Japan go by Samejima. The names would not be considered interchangable. The Sameshimas go by Sameshima. The Samejimas go by Samejima. From what I understand, it is just a regional thing.

According to my dad, Fukudome and Fukutome can be confused, but they are different, like with my family name. Have I confused everyone even more? Nothing like cultural differrences. Thanks again dragonfanatic for giving us the real Japanese perspective. I can only give the Japanese-American perspective, with very little on the Japanese side.

by holy mackerel on Apr 28, 2008 10:54 AM CDT reply reply   0 recs

That might be the reason why...

...Dome flashes some ironical smile on the cake as he is so used to be initially called as Fukutome by who don’t know him well, but it should not happen frequently in recent days after he became a star player….

I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.

by dragonsfanatic on Apr 28, 2008 7:47 PM CDT reply reply   0 recs


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