Lessons Learned
by Al Yellon on May 11, 2008 8:21 PM CDT
in Chicago Cubs Recaps
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PrintAnd just what did we learn today from today's 6-4 Cub win over the Diamondbacks, their second come-from-behind win in a row, completing a sweep over a team that came into Chicago with the best record in baseball?
First, mea culpa to everyone I was talking to in the game thread saying "CALL THIS GAME NOW!" I figured there was no way they'd play this afternoon, given the horrendous weather all morning -- pouring rain, strong winds, feeling like it was 2003 again; so I stayed home during the morning hours (had lunch, did the Sunday Tribune crossword, kept track of weather radars) instead of going to claim my bleacher seat. Watching the webcams (thanks, ballhawk!) we saw that the seats were claimed by about 12:30, so when I arrived Mike, Phil & I sat with, appropriately, I thought, on Mother's Day, some longtime bleacher season ticket holders who are moms, Judy & Colleen, in their seats in right-center field next to the concession stand. Judy's daughter is in her 20's and married, but Colleen had her three young kids in tow. They spent most of their time slopping hot dogs, cokes and cotton candy all over the place, calling each other "idiot", and racing in and out so many times it made my head spin. (The oldest, to her credit, at least attempted to keep score.) Mike said it was "almost as good entertaiment as what was on the field, and free!"
Well, at least before the Cubs mounted their two comebacks, it might have been the best entertainment of the day (No, I'm not including the idiot who ran onto the field, jumping out of the bleachers -- the last guy who tried that broke both his ankles -- who was tackled by security and the off-duty cops who patrol for those sorts of things). But the Cubs, who had given the lead to Arizona in the first inning after two were out and no one on base (I hate those!), took it back with some small ball in the second -- a walk, a single, a sacrifice by Sean Gallagher, and a wild pitch.
The long-ball gave them the lead in the third, in the form of Derrek Lee's opposite-field HR, his tenth.
The lead was coughed up in the fifth, with yet another lesson learned: here was a textbook example of how certain statistics mean absolutely nothing, in this case pitcher ERA's. Sean Gallagher, who I thought threw pretty well before running out of gas in the 5th, gave up hits to three of the first four batters he faced in that inning (after allowing only two hits and two walks through four), and then intentionally walked Chris Young to load the bases while Chad Fox finished his warmup tosses.
Fox shouldn't have bothered. He walked the first two hitters he faced, Conor Jackson and Justin Upton, forcing in two runs. After that Fox settled down and retired the next two hitters, and threw a scoreless sixth, even while issuing another walk.
Thus Fox's ERA goes down, and Gallagher's goes up through no fault of his own. Fox, I think, really doesn't belong on this roster. He's a feel-good story, but that's about it. And I was beginning to be of the mind that Lou didn't know what he was doing, NOT using Fox in a five-run blowout in the 9th inning yesterday, then using him in a key situation today.
Which leads to another lesson learned, and this one was taught both to me and D'backs manager Bob Melvin. After Reed Johnson tied the game with his first Cub HR (hit into the teeth of a 25-MPH wind blowing in from LF), Lou brought in Carlos Marmol yet again (I thought he could have stuck with Michael Wuertz in the 8th; Wuertz threw exactly four pitches in dispatching the D'backs in the 7th) -- I swear, Marmol's arm is going to fall off if Lou keeps this up -- Marmol took care of Arizona easily, and the Cubs came up in the last of the 8th down by two runs.
After Aramis Ramirez singled... well, something happened, and I'm not sure what. Did someone miss a sign? Or did someone not give a sign? Aramis took off for second base and surprised everyone in the ballpark, most of all Arizona catcher Miguel Montero, who nearly flung the ball into the center field ivy; Ramirez was safe for only his 12th career SB, his first since 2006 (and only his fourth since becoming a Cub nearly five years ago).
That's when the fun began. Kosuke Fukudome laid down a perfect bunt that hugged the wet grass down the 3B line (hey! a use for rainy days after all!), which put Ramirez on third with nobody out. After Geovany Soto's "swinging bunt" advanced Dome to second, Lou schooled all of us. Daryle Ward had been on deck to pinch-hit for Marmol, the seemingly "obvious" PH move, but instead, Lou sent up Alfonso Soriano (who got a huge ovation; I suppose, for yesterday's 4-for-5).
Bob Melvin ordered Soriano intentionally walked to load the bases. Then, Ward batted for Felix Pie. Melvin either forgot to have a lefthander up or doesn't trust his bullpen lefties, because Ward slammed Tony Pena's second pitch in the gap right in front of my Sunday perch, winning the game. Sometimes Lou appears to be not-so-slick because, well, some of his postgame comments may not seem as articulate or funny or pithy as some other managers. But oh, he's smart, thinking two steps ahead of the other guy. Bob Melvin and the rest of us: lesson learned.
Kerry Wood hit another batter (didn't he do this a lot as a starter, too?), but got out of the inning with a slick DP turned by Ryan Theriot, Mike Fontenot and Derrek Lee.
Learned my lessons today: never question Chicago weather, because there was no typhoon today; after it stopped raining it wasn't too cold, though quite windy. And never question Lou Piniella. He's the right guy for this job.
Finally, maybe a lesson learned for some of you who questioned me when I picked the Diamondbacks to finish fourth in the NL West. Yes, they're a good team with good young talent. But they sure didn't impress me this weekend. Savor this sweep; the Cubs just gave notice that they will need to be reckoned with as this season continues what is beginning as a fascinating one.
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It was a fun game to listen to hopefully they keep this up!
Am I first???
by Madison Cub Fan on May 11, 2008 8:27 PM CDT reply actions
first
reply. :P
I’m thinking Fox may be who is sent down when Marshall comes back up.
No way Marmol pitches tomorrow; maybe Lou thinks that he won’t be needed for the Padre’s series?
It was a great game. And did anyone else notice that we had the three scrappiest guys on the team batting in a row—Fonty, Riot and Reed…
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 11, 2008 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Fox
I think some Cubs fans are being a little hard on the guy. Yes he might be older, and have a history of injury problems. But when the guy has been healthy he has been a pretty good pitcher. Sure it only has been 4 seasons from 1997-2005 due to injuries. But his stuff is still pretty good, and he was throwning around 94 miles per hour today. He’s really hasn’t pitched that bad so far, and actually better then I expected.
The point is, the Cubs have other options.
Where’s Jose Ascanio?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
I don't think
the Cubs feel he’s ready to be a quality ML reliever yet. As long as Fox keeps pitching the way he has with his stuff as good as it has been, I’m fine with him on the team. Obviously the Cubs feel Fox is more ML ready then any of our other relievers. I could understand some upset with him on the team if he was throwing 88 and his pitches weren’t good. But the guy has thrown well and with good velocity.
Sigh
If figures that my work schedule for this weekend has me miss a truly awesome a sweep and a terrific job done by our pitching. The Best Buy gods are frowning upon me.
.... Edit #6: We're gonna go 156 and 6 this year, I can feel it!!!
Not that it's a big deal, but IIRC...
that last DP was the Cajun Connection (Riot/Fonty). Hell of a game though, and I couldn’t agree more about Fox – this feel good story has had it’s time.
It's gotta be the shoes, folks, it's gotta be the shoes...
You are, of course, right.
I forgot DeRo had been double-switched out. Nice DP, though.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
You're being a bit hard on Fox,
don’t you think? He had a New York minute to get ready in the pen, and once got a few extra pitches on the mound to settle down, he got out off the inning, and pitched a clean sixth. He’s not a terrible 12th man on the staff, especially until Hart can throw strikes again—or Lieber can be restored to long man duty.
Then maybe Lou didn't school us well enough.
If your starter is in trouble, get the guy ready earlier!
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Gallagher
lost steam REALLY fast.
But Fox should be able to throw strikes. All he had to do was throw strikes. Not that I mind coming from behind, but I’d rather not have to do it in the first place.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 11, 2008 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Those 1st few at-bats...
went by really quickly. Fox is older, has a history of injury, and was trying to get loose in some fairly cool weather. This was probably not the guy you wanted to go to in that situation, but what you gonna do?
by Damen Jackson on May 11, 2008 8:45 PM CDT up reply actions
pitch Wuertz?
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 11, 2008 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions
It was really early in the game...
somebody had to get you into the later innings, and like it or not, Fox is your long man right now.
by Damen Jackson on May 11, 2008 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Lieber could have done it.
They knew his start (tomorrow, right?) was going to change because Z was already benched and going to pitch tomorrow.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 11, 2008 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Lieber start
was scheduled for Tuesday, and still might start. But most likely if he’s going to start he will start Friday. But also remember Lieber is a starting pitcher, and takes even longer to warm up then most relievers. Since the fact that Fox struggled probably because he didn’t have enough time to warm up. There’s no way we could have went to Lieber that fast. Thats why in that game against the Cardinals when we pulled Hill out of the first inning, we went with Wuertz before Lieber.
I thought
he should have went with Wuertz at the time, but for all we know the outcome could have been the same. On another board Lou was hitting hammered when he put Fox in the game and he gave up the lead. Many fans were saying Lou is as bad as Dusty and should be fired right now. I was ready to pull my hair out with the overreact by Cubs fans in some of these game threads. I’m glad Lou made a smart move in the 8th to shut many of these fans up.
I agree
didn’t Lou just start warming up Fox right after Byrnes hit the double? So he had pretty much had just the AB to Jackson when they walked him on four pitches to warm up. All I know is Fox didn’t have much time to warm up and that could have been a factor in with some of his control issues to the first two batters.
too bad that fan didn't jump out of the bleachers at this point instead of when he did
the extra delay might have been the perfect tonic for Fox’s initial wildness.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
True that...
which reminds me….which one of you was it??
by Damen Jackson on May 11, 2008 11:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Neal Cotts
I think I’m going to start the “Free Neal Cotts” campaign. I have no idea why Fox is pitching in the majors and Cotts isn’t. Actually, I do know why. I just don’t agree with the reasoning.
And Al, if you think the Diamondbacks are unimpressive, wait until you get to see the Padres tomorrow. Or the Rockies or Giants. (Heck, everyone’s predictions of 100 losses for the Jints isn’t likely to come true because of their weak competition.) Even the Dodgers aren’t very impressive. The D-Backs are a good team in a terrible division. They fought us hard all weekend and remember, we didn’t face Brandon Webb or Micah Owings (or even Randy Johnson, although he’s a #3-#4 pitcher at this point.) They’ll take the division fairly easily.
It's a girl! Born 1-18-08. 2246 PST. 8 lbs. 1 oz.
Oh, I agree with you.
There’s no reason the Cubs shouldn’t win at least 3 of 4 from SD, and maybe sweep.
This could be a REALLY good homestand.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Assuming
The Cubs have kicked that pesky playing-down-to and playing-up-to the level of competition.
by Brett Taylor on May 11, 2008 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions
We lucked out by not seeing Owings or Webb
but we don’t make the schedule. I’ll take the gift
"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"
by lostinthevines on May 11, 2008 9:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Owings obviously is swinging the hot stick,
but he’s not pitching all too well. I’m supposed to be studying for a Finance exam so I’m not going to go dig up stats, but I don’t think facing Owings is that big of a deal, certainly not like seeing Webb/Haren.
It's gotta be the shoes, folks, it's gotta be the shoes...
Owings
has a 4.33 era but is 4-1 in 7 starts
Because when Owings pitches
the D-Backs play with the DH. Big advantage.
It's a girl! Born 1-18-08. 2246 PST. 8 lbs. 1 oz.
by Josh Timmers on May 12, 2008 12:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Not that this matters....
...but didn’t Fontenot help with the DP in the 9th instead of Derosa?
Bleeding Cubbie Blue since 1985.
missed the post up top . sorry
Bleeding Cubbie Blue since 1985.
by Bricks and Ivy on May 11, 2008 8:34 PM CDT up reply actions
he did
My 08 Cubs record 4-0
My 08 W.Sox record 0-2 (I havent seen a sox win in 3 years)
Updated April 26th
I'll fix the post.
Thanks.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Got to watch the first game of the series for me!
And it was great to see the cubbies do what those “good teams” do we’ve heard about comeback from being down time and time again.
warm feeling
Go Cubbies!
My 08 Cubs record 4-0
My 08 W.Sox record 0-2 (I havent seen a sox win in 3 years)
Updated April 26th
Al did the guy make it from the bleachers onto the field and for how long before he was massacred
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
Yes, he did.
He was tackled right away.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
jeez.....
thats a big jump.. Like what 11 feet… WOnder how drunk he was
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
I remember discussing this debauchery...
...last year. In the second game thread, I posted a link to the punishment for the last guy that did it. Convicted of a FELONY of trespassing. Ouch.
Dan
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
The felony wasn't for trespassing...
... it was for confronting Bob Howry. I suspect this guy may get by with a misdemeanor.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Agree about Lou all the way...
He may not sound like a Northwestern grad on an interview, but his baseball IQ his high indeed. He misses nothing on the field.
BBWAA's name should be changed to "Power in the hands of Fools"
he played his cards perfectly...
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
AU contraire -
he DOES sound like a NU grad. Exactly like one.
- lostinthevines, Illini class of '94"I got mad hits like I was Rod Carew!"
by lostinthevines on May 11, 2008 9:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Marmol
Did pitch the last three days, but he only throw a total of 43 pitches this weekend, and only 43 pitches since last Saturday with the Cardinals. I think Piniella used him this weekend so much because he didn’t have high pitch counts or high stress innings.
he will probably be unavialable tomorrow but ready on tueday
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
A-Ram's Steal???
Does anyone happen to have a link to a video of this? I missed the game but would love to see a video of such an historic moment.
almost had a heart attack
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
It wasn't
that impressive, it looked like a messed up hit and run play and the Diamondbacks catcher just made a awful throw. I almost wonder if Soto or Ward could have been safe with the throw their catcher made.
Agreed.
Not mention that the next baserunner Montero throws out stealing will the first baserunner he has thrown out stealing. Nevertheless, Rammy didn’t let up and got it done.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
Forget Soto or Ward...
Larry Rothschild could have beat that throw (Sweet Lou would have been out by a hair)
Bonus Win!
Is it just me, or did today’s win feel like a Bonus Win!? Lou pulls Z and Soriano, Cubs come back to steal one. During the late innings I remember thinking, ‘oh well, at least we took 2 of 3 from them’. And then we come back with some great moves by Lou.
Now we get Z tomorrow on an extra days rest.
Maybe they should let him sport the pink shoes tomorrow night!
No kidding.
Reed Johnson hits a HR, Rammy steals a base, and Theriot makes two Web Gem-esque plays, all on the heels of Soriano getting GW hits two days in a row. Hopefully, this string of odd/good luck forecasts a nice long hot stretch coming for the Cubs.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
Hopefully
they just didn’t update it yet. Len Kasper said during the game a few times that Zambrano is suppose to start tomorrow.
At 4:15 am...
... it’s updated, Cubs website says Z is starting against Randy Wolf.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Great win!!! We swept the friggin D-Backs (wish we did that last October)
But… gotta agree with Al… Marmol’s arm is gonna fall off.
Didn’t we use him yesterday… to finish off a 7-2 ballgame? WTF?
Cubs 2008 (18-14)
Home (11-6) | Road (7-8) | 1-Run Games (4-3) | Extra Innings (4-2)
Updated on May 5, 2008
Marmol didn't have much work this week
He didn’t pitch for five days. I suspect he’ll sit tomorrow and perhaps Tuesday as well.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 11, 2008 8:54 PM CDT up reply actions
He's still pitched 24 innings already...
That’s a tough pace. We need to have him at around 35 by the All-star break… to keep him around 70-75 innings for the year.
Cubs 2008 (18-14)
Home (11-6) | Road (7-8) | 1-Run Games (4-3) | Extra Innings (4-2)
Updated on May 5, 2008
I think
it’s unlikely he will be at 35 by the Allstar break. Being around 40 innings pitched in the next month and half is more realistic. I’m pretty sure Marmol will throw around 75-80 something innings this year. Which is still 30 innings(110 innings) less then last year when you factor in he throw 69 innings in the majors and 41 innings in the minors. But there’s no doubt Marmol will be one of the leaguers in innings pitched out of the pen this year. But if any team that had a weapon like Marmol would pitch him probably that much anyways. I think once Howry gets fully to his second half form, then we will start cutting down on Marmols innings some.
count the pitches
not the innings.
It’s a lot, but I don’t think it’s unsustainable. Besides, Howry and Wuertz are getting visibly better; Marmol should have some more rest soon.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 11, 2008 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah...
look at the fact that a lot of those 24 innings had
------ TheRiot Squad ------
by RightFieldSucks on May 12, 2008 3:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Exactly!
Wuertz threw FOUR pitches in the seventh. Why not leave him in for the 8th?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Right of course
Al, of course your right about Wuertz. But Carlos Marmol is what, 25? I know we are all gun shy about pitchers but from what I can see the guy is a horse like Zambrano. Seems too that Carlos has also had a lot of “very efficient” innings. I’m just saying that he is a young strong guy and can handle the work.
BTW, during the rain delay WGN showed a 1965 game where a Red’s pitcher had already thrown over 170 pitches in 10 innings. Maybe we worry too much.
I want my Macias!
Actually, he started the inning at 177. I didn't count
but he had to be close to 190 when he finished and they said his fastball had a lot of pop. Those guys were horses back then.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on May 12, 2008 8:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Well
I would have brought Wuertz in instead of Fox.
Again, I think Lou brings in Marmol because he KNOWS Marmol isn’t going to get beat, and he really wanted to sweep.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 12, 2008 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Cubs home/road
Over the Cubs last 11 games at home their 9-2(easily could have been 10-1 if Wood doesn’t blow that save against the Brewers). But in our last 11 games on the road were only 4-7. The funny thing is were 5-0 at home against two of the NL best in the D-backs and Mets. But found away to go 2-4 against the Nationals and Reds. I love the way were playing at home, but hopefully we can start playing a little better baseball on the road.
The schedule didn't do us any favors.
Flying out to Colorado for two measly games… then all the way to DC to play the Nats.
Cubs 2008 (18-14)
Home (11-6) | Road (7-8) | 1-Run Games (4-3) | Extra Innings (4-2)
Updated on May 5, 2008
Great post Al
‘Hope you have a good agent for compilation of posts for the World Series season….....
The Ward/Soriano move
With 1 out and runners on 2nd and 3rd, Melvin was likely going to walk the next batter (unless it was Pie or a P). It was also obvious from the way that Lou has handled Pie that someone would bat for Pie. Therefore….
If Ward PHs first for the P (in DeRo’s spot), Melvin walks him and pitches to the next batter, likely Sori PHing for Pie.
Sori batted for the P, and Melvin walked him to get to the PH, Ward.
What does it mean? In a big situation, Lou has more confidence in Ward than in Sori against RHP. Remind me again, which one makes $8M and which makes $1.5M?
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
I was wondering about this
I think it had to do with the fact that if Ward was on first, he would more likely get caught on a DP ball than Soriano. Does this make sense?
I don't necessarily think that at all
Doesn’t Sori bat RH and Ward LH? Lou was gaming the DBacks, making them second-guess their pitching. And he played them very well indeed.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 11, 2008 9:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Correct!
That’s how he outmanaged Melvin. It had little to do with matchups. Lou correctly figured that Melvin would walk whoever was PH for the pitcher to load the bases, and as cwyers says below, Ward’s better off the bench, he didn’t want the bat taken out of Ward’s hands.
It worked perfectly.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
And a VERY nice move
to leave Pie out there in the on deck circle while Soriano was going to the plate so that Melvin didn’t look over and wonder whether they should just pitch to Sori.
All in all, I was VERY impressed.
It's all match ups
and the contact favor since we didn’t need a hit and just a fly ball. If the Diamondbacks had a LH pitcher warming up in the pen, Piniella would have let Ward take the walk. But since he saw that Pena was going to face Ward no matter what. Piniella felt more comfortable going with that match up, and it worked out. One AB against one pitcher doesn’t mean Piniella trust Ward more then Soriano though.
Because remember
Ward was on deck at first, and planning on pinch hitting. But Piniella saw that Melvin wasn’t going to make a pitching change. So he made the last minute switch and Soriano came to the plate.
Another question to consider is that...
...the question wasn’t simply Soriano vs. Ward, it was Soriano vs. Ward coming off the bench. Players tend to lose a lot of their effectivness coming off the bench – off the top of my head I’d guess more than .200 points of OPS.
The whole reason we have Ward on the bench is because Ward doesn’t seem to lose his effectiveness sitting on the bench. Soriano would have to be more than .200 points better than Ward to where you’d rather have Soriano pinch-hitting than Ward.
Good point
plenty of very good hitters struggle pinch hitting in their careers.
ESPN RECAP
...says Ward is #3 most hits amongst active pinch-hitters.
Dan
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
Al
One small correction in your recap:
Reed Johnson’s homer tied the game at 4 in the bottom of the 7th. Therefore, the Cubs started the bottom of the 8th tied, not down by 2.
Otherwise, great recap as always!
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
Which might be why Marmol pitched the 8th instead of Wuertz
It was a tie game and Lou thought that he had a chance to steal one…which he did.
True, but...
... again, then why use Marmol on Saturday with a five-run lead?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Exactly...
I have no problem using Marmol in a close game (being mindful of workload, of course). But pitching him in a 5-run game, and pitching him for two innings in a blowout win earlier this season is silly and taking an unnecessary risk.
Yes Marmol is young. Yes he seems to be resilient so far. But why tempt fate when you don’t NEED to do so?
We really need to take 3-4 from the pathetic offense
known as the Friars
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
Chad Fox is quickly becoming my least favorite Cub...
...and I’m not sure it’s his fault. We can argue over whether or not he deserves a roster spot more than Kevin Hart/Neal Cotts/etc., but that’s really irrelevant – to the extent that Cotts/Hart/whoever are better than Fox, over the course of sixty to eighty innings it shouldn’t matter; if a team misses the playoffs because of the last man in the pen then there are bigger issues.
But it does matter, because Lou doesn’t seem to understand reliever levredge in the slightest. When you have a bases loaded jam like that, in a tied ballgame, that is the most important moment in the ballgame you’re going to face, and it does not matter what inning you’re in. (The only moment in the ballgame that was more crucial to deciding who won or lost was the Ward at-bat.)
Marmol needs to be coming in for those situations if he’s availble – there’s no point in saving him for the later innings if the game might be out of reach by the time he could come in! Instead Marmol came in for the much less important eighth inning – the game was tied agian, but it was a much less pressure-filled situation than coming in with the bags loaded with inherited runners.
It’s really inexcusable that we have two pitchers being brought into high levredge situations more than Marmol. Turning him into the setup man doesn’t do this team any favors – he needs to be the fireman, and if the most crucial moment is in the first inning, assuming you’re pulling the starter out, Marmol needs to be the one going in.
by cwyers on May 11, 2008 9:23 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Should add that...
...Lou seems to understand levredge very well when it involves pinch hitting. So it’s very frustrating that he doesn’t bring Marmol into the game when he’s needed the most.
Thats what Lou
did alot last year with Marmol. I think the main reason he hasn’t done it more this year is because of the struggles from Howry/Wuertz. Last year when Marmol was pitching, Howry was already over his early season struggles. I wonder if Lou will do that more often in the second half, when Howry pitches well.
Howry had a higher levredge than Marmol last season, actually.
As did Dempster, Rapada, Cotts and somehow Jason Marquis. This seems to be a real blind spot of Lou’s.
It really baffles me – I’d have to look to be certain, but I was under the impression that Lou was a lot better about these things when he was the Reds manager.
Okay...
...first I thought you were spelling “leverage” wrong, now I don’t think so after it’s thrice been used. Also, I’ve never seen these fangraphs before. Care to inform lil ol me?
Dan
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
I am spelling leverage wrong.
It’s been a loooooong day.
The graphs are basically a function of Win Probabily Added, which is a summation of how each plate appearance contributes to a team’s chances of winning. In WPA, a walk-off homer has a higher win probability than a home run to lead off the ballgame. It’s a function of base/out state, inning and score, basically.
Leverage, then (really Leverage Index) is simply a weighted average of the WPA of ALL possible events. It lets you look at when the most crucial moments of the game, and who was “clutch” and who wasn’t, if that’s what interests you.
There’s a lot of “entertainment value” to these stats – most of the analytic value comes from looking at reliever usage, in my mind.
I dont know
about all of that… But Marmol is very valuable and i agree that he needs to be in the tightest spots… I think next year we should seriously see if he can start again… Or would most of you think it wouldnt work since he has really two pitches. Hes just too good for only one inning hich is why he should never close..
Look if he keeps this up he will be an all star. Every manager knows that he is the LAST Cubs pitcher they want to face and will get voted without a horrible May/ June
I think Cotts might need to come up and we release Fox. Although I guess he pitched a decent 6th.
Good to see Wuertz back on
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
Sooooooooo...
...why move an all-star set-up/closer away from what made him an all-star?
Dan
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
I say look at it in ST
if it works it works.. If not let him do what he does… He has been a starter before and had decent numbers starting at AAA last year if I remember. Just imagine what he could do if he was going 6 or 7…. I know this is a radical thought but i think Cubs management needs to least explore it…
I agree with your sentiments though of why move him when hes comfortable there. I also feel like he has a rubber arm…
I always felt he was the best of all the ridiculous people we had starting games for us in 06….
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
That really depends on the answer to three questions:
1. How valuable is Marmol as a reliever?
2. Does Marmol have the stamina/stuff to be a starter?
3. How valuable would Marmol be as a starter?
I can answer the first, or at least I think I can. I can approximate the third, although I’m a lot less confident of whatever answer I’d come up with. The second is a pure scouting/medical issue, and I’ll go ahead and defer to the Cubs’ best judgements on that. My “hunch” is that given his lack of a real third pitch and the way he got gassed his first season in the majors, he’d be unlikely to be an effective starter over a whole season.
But that’s just a guess – I really don’t know.
good post...
Most of that is how i feel i just feel like we need to see if he can do it. No one is coming close to hitting him right now.
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
Marmol...
... has already shown (in 2006) that he really doesn’t have the stamina to be a starter. You can go through his game logs for proof, but my recollection is that he’d be lights out for two or three innings, then start to run out of gas.
For an inning or two as a setup man, he’s perfect.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Marmol starting
could be something the Cubs look into or consider in the future. But they would never make that change midseason. Why release Fox, what did he really do wrong? He was rushed into a game, that had bases loaded one out, and walked the first two batters he faced. Thats already a tough spot for any pitcher, especially one who had a whole 2 minutes or so too warm up. I’m not a big Fox fan but his stuff does actually look pretty decent, and I don’t see any reason to dump him from the roster right now. As for Neal Cotts, I hope he keeps pitching great in the minors. But after the way he pitched the last year and this spring I have no confidence in him at all.
Just to clarify.. I was never implying that we make him a starter this year
Secondly I think your assesment of Chad Fox is pretty straight on. His slider was working pretty well today… He was just nibbling a bit too much.. His FB hit I believe 94… He might be alright…
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
cwyers, while I agree with your Marmol assessment in principle, answer me this.
If you use Marmol more as a fireman (i.e. bring him in at the most crucial moment even if it’s earlier in the game) than as the setup guy, isn’t the potential for arm abuse (i.e. more innings) much higher?
I would imagine most games will have a “Marmol” moment early on, regardless of whether the eventual result is a win or a loss. Whereas I suspect there would be fewer games having a setup situation because games would be a lot closer to being decided one way or the other later in the game. I don’t have a guess as to what this fireman/setup ratio is, just seems logical to me that it would be greater than 1. So the higher the ratio, the more times Lou has to at least think about using Marmol, thus more innings and more potential for abuse.
Is my logic flawed?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Who...
..is this Lev Redge you speak of? Is he some new hot LOOGY we have down on the farm?
by BartlettBob on May 11, 2008 10:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Did that last summer when they were at Wrigley.
It was pretty much the same show, slightly different set list. The only really big difference was that this time, Sting actually seemed to be enjoying himself.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Stinging
It was pretty much the same show, slightly different set list.
I was not at that show, but I remember reading a review (either yours or perhaps it was DeRogotis) who made the show sound almost boring. Saturday’s show certainly was not boring to me. How did the tempo and playing compare to you?
The only really big difference was that this time, Sting actually seemed to be enjoying himself.
Yeah, Sting was counting the dollars raked in on this final farewell tour. If I were Sting (or Andy, or Stewart) I would smile too.
Speaking of smiling, I didn’t think the 65 yr old Andy Summers smiled during the show. But from my perch in the balcony it would have been easy to miss. The Sun-Times in it’s review looks like they captured Summers shooting a smile in Stings direction.
Somewhere I have a cassette tape of a WXRT broadcast of a Police concert from 1980 at the Aragon Ballroom that I recorded “live” off the air. Then I got to see them at the grand old Comiskey Park in ‘83. Good times…
I enjoyed the show. Glad to have been there for their last show in Chicago.
I agree with your mini-review here.
Andy Summers didn’t smile. Isn’t it true that he and Sting really don’t like each other much?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Sorry I missed it..
They’ll be in Milwaukee in July. I may try to make that one.
"The one constant through all the years, Ray, has been baseball"
of dusty and men
I think there is a fine line between Dustying your pitchers and just being aggressive with them. I always think of the old pitcher throwing 25 complete games a year and 10k pitchers and on and on. Pitchers now a days are so weak.
Anyway I think Lou throws Marmol because he feels he can handle it. Same with Zambrano. That guy is just a horse and could probably start a game, double switch him to LF, and then bring him back in the 9th to close it. Some guys are tough and some aren’t. Lets hope Lou knows something we don’t about the staff.
by louisiana lumberman on May 11, 2008 9:34 PM CDT reply actions
The difference is that when
Dusty does it he’s ruining a pitcher. When Lou does it he’s just stretching out a guy he knows can handle it. Maybe we are a little biased? I know we all want to blame Dusty for all of the pitching injuries when he was here, but the fact is pitchers just get hurt. What about the pitchers that get get hurt that never throw more than 100 pitches a game? The correlation between number of pitches thrown in a given game and injuries is not as straightfoward as everyone likes to believe. There are a lot of factors that play into it. Like the number of pitches in the previous or next start, if the pitcher was under a lot of stess during the start, and so on.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on May 12, 2008 7:21 AM CDT up reply actions
That's one more than he hit for the Cubs, IIRC.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.
Think we need to give Soto a day off tomorrow.. Or against Peavy...
He seemed to be pressing most of the series…
Anyone else as gald as I am to have Gallagher going again!!!! I think his arm will bounce back strong.
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
I'd rather have my tonsils removed than sit Soto against Peavy unless I absolutely had to.
Peavy is one of the best pitchers in all of baseball right now, and I don’t want to leave one of our best weapons on offense on the bench.
your right i am stupid
I am not being sarcastic either. You are correct… Unless Hank has decent splits against him
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
Not only that...
Soto is great at blocking pitches in the dirt, he calls a great game, and the pitchers respond well to him. The kid seems to want to play every day, let him play!
yeek.
the very thought gives me the flop-sweats… :P
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 11, 2008 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Marmol has given up
only 3 hits in his last 11.2 innings…. and three walks.. Fricking unbelieveable
"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"
Fox
What frustrated me about Fox’s appearance was that it just didn’t look like he was capable of throwing a strike. Obviously it is a fine line to walk in that situation.
That said, he wasn’t a horrible choice. I think people tend to hit his slider into the ground. If they swing. He just couldn’t produce.
I dislike having even a 12 pitcher staff, but if we have to have one, I would rather have the 37 year old guy who isn’t going to get any better who pitches once in a long while than a younger guy who can still improve with work sitting in the pen.
In the middle of a good time, Truth gave me her icy kiss. Look around, you must be joking. All that way, all that way for this -Oysterband
Didn't Ward hit the first pitch?
"I'm petrified of nipple chafing. Once it starts, it's a vicious circle." Andy Bernard
You're correct.
I must have been frozen by the cold and thought there were two.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Lou says Gallagher may stay in the rotation, pitch Friday
This from the Cubs.com game recap:
With Zambrano now starting Monday against San Diego, Piniella said the 22-year-old Gallagher is likely to remain in the rotation and start Friday against Pittsburgh. That means Jon Lieber is probably the odd man out and will return to the bullpen. Jason Marquis will go Tuesday, pushed back from Monday, and Ted Lilly and Ryan Dempster stay on schedule to finish the San Diego series.Gallagher made eight relief appearances with the Cubs last year and was 2-2 with a 3.10 ERA as a starter in Triple-A Iowa this season. Piniella is keen on using Gallagher because he’s already stretched out to start.
“I’m not exactly sure,” Piniella said of his decision. “I want to talk to my pitching coach. But I think that we’ll probably keep him in that rotation and probably Lieber stays in the bullpen.”
by John Q Freejazz on May 11, 2008 10:08 PM CDT reply actions
I found this interesting
I heard lou say this after the game….and it just sounded to me like he’s got some changes in mind. Lou has a lot to ponder about the rotation….he wants to give gallagher another start, lieber was thrown in the mix, and eventually hill will come back from AAA
and personally
I would like to see lieber get one more start to prove himself again….he deserves it after the way he pitched in long relief.
I think it depends on
him needing a long man in the bullpen or not. With Gallagher pitching almost 5 innings today, the Cubs don’t really have a long man for the next 3-4 days. So if a starter gets knocked out in the 4 or 5th innings, or we have a long extra inning game were gonna need Lieber. Personally I think Lieber deserves another start, and it’s a little unfair he will have his start skipped due to todays weather. But I hope Gallagher can surprise me and pitch well.
OTOH
Lieber only pitched a couple innings the other day, so if the Cubs need a long man in the next few days, he could probably fill that role, so long as his second inning in relief isn’t anything like his second inning in that start.
by John Q Freejazz on May 12, 2008 12:38 AM CDT up reply actions
Best Win of the Year
I was pretty nervous on Friday thinking the cubs could be going into the Padres series 20-17 or 19-18. Instead we swept the D-Backs and are 21-15!! It seemed like the Cubs played like the D-Backs of 07 (timely hits, timely plays, patching wins together) and the D-Backs played like the 07 Cubs (lack of timely hits, bullpen implosions, pressing and playing stressed).
I know it’s still early but this was a huge series and a serious statement to the NL that the Cubs will be competitive and that Wrigley will be a formidable task for the opposing team. Spot on Al with your analysis, let’s hope the Cubs keep it going.
I felt
the same way. Coming off of a 4-8 record in the last four series, I wasn’t looking forward to them trying to right the ship against the D-Backs, but they did it. I wasn’t panicked about the losses; losing streaks and rough patches are going to happen during the course of a 162 game season. I just thought it would be a tough series, and it was with the come from behind victories. Feels really good to have the sweep right now.
Ward seems to be heating up, which is a good sign, and Howry and Wuertz seem to be getting it together as well. The future looks bright.
SD Matchup
Are we going to miss Peavy in this upcoming series?
"What a great call! Your doing a fantastic job, but people expect me to come out here and be upset. So I'm gonna kick some dirt, you understand?" - Lou Pinella
Considering we are playing 4 games..
It is going to be hard to miss him…
Just checked, he is scheduled for Wednesday. I think that is against Lilly.
by GoCubbies34 on May 11, 2008 10:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Thanks
Thought we might get lucky in missing Webb and Peavy….
"What a great call! Your doing a fantastic job, but people expect me to come out here and be upset. So I'm gonna kick some dirt, you understand?" - Lou Pinella
by Lou In Blue on May 11, 2008 10:40 PM CDT up reply actions
According to Pat Hughes...
On today’s broadcast, he said the SD rotation for this series would be Wolf, Estes, Peavy and Maddux.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Great game..
Nice recap Al. How was the concert?
"The one constant through all the years, Ray, has been baseball"
Loved it.
Had never seen Elvis Costello in concert, either… enjoyed that, and the show itself was pretty similar to the Wrigley Field show last summer, except, as I posted above, that Sting actually seemed to be having a good time this time.
Sorry you couldn’t make it.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Just saw Tony Romo's rendition of the 7th inning stretch
on SportsCenter….Hilarious.
Brian McRae's 5 O'Clock Shadow
by PurpleLineToWrigley on May 11, 2008 10:53 PM CDT reply actions
Of pitch counts and arm abuse...
All this Marmol overuse talk has reminded me of something I’ve always wondered about. First off, I agree that pitch counts is a better indicator of arm abuse than innings pitched. And what I’m about to ask is probably geared more towards starters than relievers but here goes…
Do pitchers really need all of those 7-9 warmup pitches before each inning? I realize warmup tosses aren’t the same as game situations, but they’re not exactly lobbing them in there either. If you reduced your warmup tosses by 2-3 pitches, that’s at least an inning’s worth for an average start, maybe more. I guess my thinking is, once you’re warmed up enough to start the game, it shouldn’t take much to get you loose again when you go back out there – unless of course, your teammates have batted around and you’ve been sitting on the bench for a long time.
Full disclosure – Last time I pitched was in high school/legion ball where I would dazzle them with my changing speeds (slow, slower and slowest) and knuckleball. And although I did play college ball, it wasn’t at UGA ;-), and I didn’t pitch – I was your basic OF/DH type.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
All I have to...
...say is I predicted the sweep with a post sometime on Friday.
Anyway, I almost posted that Gallagher would throw a complete game shutout today, but I backed off on that one at the 11th hour.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Scoring
I noticed you score strikeouts as K2, as I do. No one else seems to bother to give the catcher the PO. What do other people on this site do?
On Questioning Lou
“And never question Lou Piniella. He’s the right guy for this job.”
Well, Lou’s done some good things, I won’t deny that. I was very impressed last season. But there are plenty of things he is also doing this season that are very questionable. Several of them were already brought up in this thread.
I think we can categorize many of them under a general heading of short-sightedness. Is Marmol going to hold up under this kind of usage over a full season? Will Soto hold up playing so many games? Is it really smart to throw away the high-ceiling chips we have in Pie and Cedeno?
For example, the pinch-hit for Pie move that is getting so many kudos – look at it from this angle – Pie was in a situation where all he had to do was hit a flyball and his manager took the bat out of his hand. We won this game, but we lost an opportunity to build Pie up, to let him be a part of a big win, to increase his confidence. If Pie got that hit instead of Ward – it could have been a season-turning moment.
Another example – Lieber was brought in to the rotation for Hill and although Lieber was very good in every other outing besides his last start, because it was a bad start, now Lieber’s out and Gallagher’s in. And somewhere Marshall is supposed to fit in here since he was sent down to stretch out. Where’s the long-term vision for how this club fits together? Where’s the development plan for Gallagher and/or Marshall? Where’s the sense that baseball is a marathon? Where’s the sense that since the playoffs in their current form are a crap shoot, it’s best to develop your rookies and ensure that your team lengthens its window of contention as much as possible?
It’s like Lou is overreacting to the criticism he got after last year’s playoffs sweep by the D’backs, trying to do whatever it takes to win every game, ignoring the potential long-term consequences. It looks good today, and looking at our NL Central competition, it looks like we’ll make the playoffs again. But how will we do in those playoffs if Soto’s knees are shot and Marmol’s out of gas and we’re all regretting that Pie for Burnett trade since Burnett’s on the DL and Reed Johnson hasn’t gotten a hit off of righty since August?
I don’t want to end on a down note because we swept the D’backs who are a good team. Our team is good despite questionable management decisions. And Lou deserves some credit for this. Gerald Perry deserves a lot of credit. Jim Hendry has brought together a lot of talent. Let’s hope the talent stays healthy and the season ends with all our questioning being irrelevant.
...this just into the WGN Sports Desk....
Felix Pie STILL sucks and will never hit his way out of a paper bag.
Lou, stop being obstinate...bat Soriano # 6.
wah waahhh wah waaah waahhh waaah waaaaah....
What’s that, Ms. Othmar?
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 12, 2008 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions
So, Blue Mike/Technohawk/Mike/MDBNIU,
now that Sori has handed you a gigantic plate of crow, you’re moving on to spew the same ignorant rhetoric about Pie. How original and refreshing.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions
Ye gods.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Notice how he doesn't respond? Sad.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.
Not really.
I’m on the Blue Mike Officially Ignored Poster List, along with Hammer. cwyers has been warned; he’s sure to follow.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
Yes.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
Damn, that sounds like a pretty cool club to be in
Care to share your tips, tricks, and techniques for gaining membership? ;-)
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Cubs wanna win
Is Marmol going to hold up under this kind of usage over a full season? Will Soto hold up playing so many games? Is it really smart to throw away the high-ceiling chips we have in Pie and Cedeno?
I believe Marmol will get a good amount of rest at some point this season, but lets not forget he threw 110 innings last year. So if he throws 75-80 innings this year, I don’t really think he will be all that burned out. As for the high ceiling chips, that doesn’t matter to Lou. Personally I would like to see those guys get more playing time, but I really think Piniella is playing the best players that give him the best chance to win. I guess Piniella believes when their ready, they will hit so well to take the job, much like Soto did when he got called up last year.
For example, the pinch-hit for Pie move that is getting so many kudos – look at it from this angle – Pie was in a situation where all he had to do was hit a flyball and his manager took the bat out of his hand. We won this game, but we lost an opportunity to build Pie up, to let him be a part of a big win, to increase his confidence. If Pie got that hit instead of Ward – it could have been a season-turning moment.
Winning baseball games is important then potentially building up Pie confidence. Pie has had big hits against the Pirates and Mets to already build up his confidence, And even though I would like to see him play more, he still hasn’t been a good hitter at the plate. Pinch hitting Pie in that situtation was the right move and a very good move.
Another example – Lieber was brought in to the rotation for Hill and although Lieber was very good in every other outing besides his last start, because it was a bad start, now Lieber’s out and Gallagher’s in. And somewhere Marshall is supposed to fit in here since he was sent down to stretch out. Where’s the long-term vision for how this club fits together? Where’s the development plan for Gallagher and/or Marshall? Where’s the sense that baseball is a marathon? Where’s the sense that since the playoffs in their current form are a crap shoot, it’s best to develop your rookies and ensure that your team lengthens its window of contention as much as possible?
Lieber lost his spot due todays weather conditions. We don’t have a long man in the pen for the next 3-4 days, with Gallagher pitching today. Sean Marshall hasn’t been stretched out or started a game in Triple A since being sent down to start yet. If Gallagher sucks on Friday then we will either start Lieber or Marshall next week and make a roster move. As for the long term development plan, well that is what it is. Pretty much the young guys will start in Triple A and get there chances here in the majors, if they show to be better then the guys we have then they could stick in those spots. Lou isn’t going to be around 2 or 3 years most likely, he only cares about winning right now and will do what it takes to make it happen. We knew this when bringing in Lou, and signing Soriano was to win now. Sure the Cubs could be pretty screw come 2010 or 2011, but how many would mind if we win a World Series? Of course if we don’t win a WS it could be horrible. But I right now winning is number 1, and trying to develope young players and all other stuff is bonus, but not their main goal.
and Reed Johnson hasn’t gotten a hit off of righty since August?
Johnson isn’t that bad against RH pitching. He’s been in a bad slump lately but he’s still a 260s/320-330s type hitter against RH pitching, which will probably be better then Pie this season in all honestly.
And Lou deserves some credit for this. Gerald Perry deserves a lot of credit. Jim Hendry has brought together a lot of talent. Let’s hope the talent stays healthy and the season ends with all our questioning being irrelevant
Lou, Perry and Hendry deserve a ton of credit, when you look at were this team was two years ago to were they are now. Sure Lou might use Marmol too much, but if you were in his shoes it would be pretty temping not to. He might over manage some situations, but overall he gets those situations right alot more then wrong IMO. But when a team has one of the best records in baseball, that tells me the guys in charge have done their jobs. Hopefully we can keep it up all season, hopefully having a huge lead in September, will allow us to rest Marmol, and give some young players more playing time.
Do the Cubs want to win a few games in April or the last game in November?
“When a team has one of the best records in baseball, that tells me the guys in charge have done their jobs.”
I think the record tells us Jim Hendry has done his job. I think the upswing in OBP tells us Perry has done his job. But my chief complaint about Lou is that he is playing to win in April and May at the cost of this team’s effectiveness in September and October. So, the current record tells us nothing in regards to my complaint.
Johnson hitting for a .325 OBP against RH pitching is absolutely not better than what Pie could be if developed, especially since where Pie really gets an advantage is in SLG and defense (two stats you ignored).
This has been the issue over and over again –
Consider that Player A is going to be a .200/.250/.350 player for the first two months, but a .280/.340/.440 player over the course of the season and Player B is going to be a .260/.320/.380 player for the first two months and the whole season, doesn’t it make a ton of sense to stick with Player A if you want to win in October and November?
well, at the risk of offending Mr. ObviousMan fans everywhere...
if you don’t win in April and May, you may not have the chance to even play in October and November, let alone win.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Are you serious?
You did watch the game right? We are talking about the Cubs game on Sunday May 11th 2008!!! What are you smoking? Share it with the rest of us
DGU & the rest of you Lou haters Listen up.
When it was evident Melvin was going to stick with his righty in that spot with the game tied, the question is who gives us the best chance to drive in some runs. With Soriano already in the game defense positioning isn’t an issue so you can freely remove pie if you choose to. So, now the question is what left handed bat, do you want opposing the righty with game tied at 4-4 bags loaded 1 out? Daryle Ward is our most powerful left handed bat, & second best left-handed hitter behind Fukodome. He is much more of an RBI threat than Pie. Ward is a lot less likely to strike out than Pie and Ward does not chase pitches with the propensity that Pie does. Ward has made his living coming off the bench as a pinch hitter who provides a big left-handed bat with great power along with good command for an RBI man. When are pinch hitters with big bats generally used late in game situations with games on the line up/or down a run or 2. Ward has made a career coming up and performing in spots like these. You want to know how valuable Daryle Ward is, especially to our team that is heavy with right handed bats, read what his former manager Bobby Cox thinks about Ward. When Cox learned Atlanta could not re-sign Ward and that Hendry snatched up Ward, Cox got the news while driving and drove off the road he was so angry. Daryle Ward gave us an advantage in the match up facing the pitcher and Ward gave us the best chance for success in that spot. Meaning he gave us the highest percentages of not striking out, and at least driving in 1 run(the go ahead run) with a sac fly or even a bases loaded walk while any hit would drive in at least 1 and most likely to. It turned out that’s exactly what he did he jumped on first pitch fast ball for a 2 run RBI double for the win. Lou made a sequence of great decisions by out thinking Melvin and thinking ahead to put his ball club (our CUBBIES) in the best position possible to try to win a ball. Every pitcher, manager, & opposing player would have rather faced Felix “free swinging” Pie with the game on the line than Daryle Ward because it is very easy to get Pie out after getting ahead and there are many times you do not even have to throw a strike to get Pie out & most of the time all you need is 1. Felix Pie still has a lot of potential for great success, and the ability to make substantial offensive contributions to help this team win this year. He needs to continue to work hard, like all of us have been hearing. If he listens to sweet swinging Lou, and Gerald Perry and shortens up his swing while developing a better eye, and focusing on fundamentals he can really help us out in a stretch of the season. We have already seen him have some nice pressure filled at bats that have helped us win ball games or put is into a position to win ball games, the hit in Pittsburgh, we all know about the homerun at home against the Mets, but even in a losing effort in Cincinnati he had a nice at bat in the top of the 9th down 5-3 facing Francisco Cordero. One of the leagues most respected closer who typically locates well and has a very solid fastball with some nasty off speed pitches, and with tools like this you would imagine he would have had his way with Felix especially in the 9th inning. As I recall Fontenot singled with 1 out right in front of Pie, and Pie quickly fell behind 0-2 and at this point I though he had no chance against the high heat, anything off speed, or a fastball low & away because he tries to pull everything. But to his credit Felix fouled off a couple and took some nasty pitches for balls that he normally would have swung at, and soon worked the count to 2-2 I believe before lining a low and away fastball to left center gap just over the shortstop because his head stayed on the ball he shortened up his swing a little bit and instead of trying to pull everything he stayed with the pitch and hit it to opposite field to get on base and help us get in a position to win the game, even though we did end up winning that game Fontenot at home, D lee’s ground out, Felix helped his team get in a position to win. And we all know at 23 he’s still young and needs at bats to improve but when you have the quality of team we do with the line up we have when your ultimate goals are much higher than just developing young talent and improving Pie’s approach at the plate there are times he’s going to have his bat taken out of the game or be out because of a double switch. We all know his defense is special and looks like he possesses a lot of the same tools & talents defensively that Andruw Jones used to win himself all those gold gloves. That caliber of defense in Center Field is hard to come by and is an asset to have especially at Wrigley Field with the wind. Coupled with the fact Pie has nothing left to prove at the minor league level, he hit well over .300 at triple AAA every time he went back down last year yet he could barely sustain .250 in the bigs. That’s just the MLB, and the fact Felix got away with a lot of his bad habits at Iowa because he is so athletically gifted and possess so much raw talent. Lou did the right thing reconstructing his swing and approach at the plate because he was not going to sustain success at the highest level at his old approach. We all know the more at bats a youngster like Felix gets the better he will get and the more comfortable he will become at the plate. I think the more Major League at bats he gets the better or just a short week or two in AAA with that hitting coach that came up to Wrigley that understands Pie’s tendency and understands the new swing that he needs to master. I think the AAA Iowa is not ideal and only should be done under an emergency of pitching arms, and if it is done should be very brief. Me included wants to see what Pie can do with all his god given ability, and yes at times it is a little frustrating at times when he gets limited at-bats when he’s working hard to improve but I am sure he is learning more and more with every passing day in the bigs and with every at bat he does get. However everyone in the Cubs organization wants to see Pie develop including Lou, if he didn’t he wouldn’t have spent his own attention to work specifically with him I do no think he is in a pissing war with Hendry and the cubs front office over the use of Pie. Lou himself has said Pie has proven himself in AAA at the plate & that its time for him to learn & come into his own at the Major league Level. Once again everyone’s goal’s and wishes throughout the cub’s organization is Winning Championships, Division, N.L., & World Series. When winning is your main concern there are many times the process of developing young talent is slowed down a little bit just to win. Look at Soto as an example & last year with all the catcher problems we had with Blanco’s, neck the fight & trade of Barrett for Bowen, then Bowen for Kendall & having Koyie hill up. Koyie Hill is not a major leaguer, Soto is but we where in a tight playoff race and there where some kinks Soto had to work on & he still does this year but at the time bringing up a kid in the June & July and throwing him in the middle of a tight playoff race is a tough call to make. It did however work out he came up in September and blew Lou’s socks of and got two starts in the NLDS. It looked like he should have been up earlier but with a position as pivotal as a catcher and with our organizations goal of winning it was a tough call to make. Although Pie & Soto’s situations are a lot different they are similar because Lou is weighing the task at hand of Winning Now versus Pie’s development, and I think it is the smart thing to do. In a perfect world we could have both but it is not and we are forced to trade off a little bit wouldn’t you rather be winning than be losing and have Pie starting everyday & have to endure many mistakes that young kids make? With what the moron said above what if we were focused primarily on developing Pie and we let him take the at bat and he struck out or hit into D.P. and game stayed tied at 4 and we wound up losing in extras and wasted Marmol n Woody? Everyone on here would want Lou’s head. Remember Upton’s play on Saturday taking his time? And by the way baseball is a team game there are times it is better for your team if the bat is out of your hand and that’s how it is with Pie right now and I cannot honestly believe that you can say with a straight face that you would rather have Felix “free swinging” Pie up in that spot yesterday than Pinch Hitter deluxe Daryle Ward? If you do your crazy and should stop posting and start watching the games to learn something. With what I said above that’s not to say Lou is giving up on Felix Pie it is just that his emphasis is on winning now as it should be with our current lineup & situation you only get so many chances to win & you have to do what ever you can to capitalize on those and take advantage of those in an effort to get in the best possible position to win. So, after that lets please try to tune down the Lou Bashing at least on the Felix Pie situation—god knows nothing can stop the Fonzi lead off talk but halting the pie nonsense would be nice. I think there are still plenty of people here that cannot forget and escape Dusty. Lou has won 3 World Series rings, two as a hitter, and one as a manager. He has been Manager of the year two times in his career, and had a case to be made for last years. He has been to the post season as a manager 6 times and has taken three different teams to the post season. He tied a record winning 116 games I think. How many of the so called manager experts on here that beat Lou like a school boy can compare to those accomplishments on any level. Lou know his team better than any of us, he knows information about them that is important & that we the fan does not know about. Just because he does not sound like a Scholar in post game press conferences everyone on here thinks he’s a moron and they think they can manage the Chicago Cubs because they manage their sons little league team or watch every single game like we all do. Lou is just about as good as they get we are lucky we have a manager like him there are plenty of games from last year we won as a result of him the 2-1 win at the cell with the squeeze play, that last series at Wrigley at home when Dempster got in a jam in the 9th turned out to be a big game, changing rotation to get Big Z an extra start by using the all-stark break to his advantage, Managing a bullpen, not scared to make moves or bump veterans for younger kids that were playing better JJ and Cliff Floyd among many others. It took a full season but Lou has finally exterminated the Dusty free swinging approach and implemented the patented Lou Piniella patient offense. Lets cut this guy some slack and praise him he has done a lot of good for our beloved Cubbies, lets not lose sight of all the good that he has done keep in mind nobody is perfect and nobody can predict the future and what’s going to happen with 100% certainty. Lets enjoy the ball club that he has help molded, lets sit back and enjoy this summer, I am willing to let his track record, resume, accomplishments, and more importantly his 3 world series rings speak for themselves as opposed to some blogger with limited baseball experience and knowledge who thinks he knows more than Lou Piniella.
Ock.
So many words….
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
Well...
It’s hard to say really. I mean the way it’s all run together with no discernible breaks or pauses. It sort of looks like you just cut and pasted it from some html page source somewhere else. But hey, I’m not saying you did’t. It’s just slightly odd that someone could type that amount of text into a comment field on an internet blog and never once bother to hit the "enter" key. I for one, believe you when you say that you are the original author, but don’t be shocked at the others here who are calling you out on it. Add the fact that you even posted it in more than one thread and put up a completely seperate fanpost using the exact same text, and you are just asking for what you’re getting. I understand you feel strongly about Lou, and I happen to agree with you that he is the right man for the job. Just try and be a little more "web" conscious the next time you decide to post a lengthy comment. Plus also, using the "preview" button will help you to see just how your comment is going to "flow" in the thread. Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not you English Teacher here. Just wanting you to understand where some of us are probably coming from. Take care, and remember, we’re all on the same team here. Or at least we all root for the same team. Right Guys? We all like the Chicago Cubs, and we want them to win a World Series THIS YEAR! So everyone just calm down a little and understand that Mikey was just showing his support for his team. Albeit, he took a little longer than most of us would have to express his thoughts and opinions, the essence of what he was trying to convey to us remains unchallenged. He like the Cubs and wants them to win, I like the Cubs and want them to win, Al likes the Cubs and wants them to win, and heck, even MDBNIU probably like the Cubs, or most of them anyway, and wants them to win, most of the time anyway. So now that we’ve established these facts and I’ve given Mikey my advice, allow me to add the text transcript of the Gettysburg Address, only I have replaced the word "we" with the word "Doughnuts". This is purely for sock value and in no way has anything to do with the Chicago Cubs or my addiction of said Doughnuts. Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal. Now Doughnuts are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. Doughnuts are met on a great battle-field of that war. Doughnuts have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that Doughnuts should do this. But, in a larger sense, Doughnuts can not dedicate – Doughnuts can not consecrate – Doughnuts can not hallow – this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor poDoughnutsr to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what Doughnuts say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us – that from these honored dead Doughnuts take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion – that Doughnuts here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain – that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 12, 2008 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Lesson learned? Dave Otto sucks and I actually miss Ron Santo
Hurry back Ronny lest I blow my brains out having to listen to Dave Otto filling in. Seriously, who does Dave Otto have pictures of at WGN?!?
Lou, stop being obstinate...bat Soriano # 6.
Ahhhh...
...welcome back.
Dan
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
Wasnt he ripping on Ronnie the other day????
by Madison Cub Fan on May 11, 2008 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I think so.
At any rate, Santo is one of his regular whipping boys.
People MDBNIU hates:
1.) Soriano
2.) Rich HIll
3.) Pie
4.) Santo
People MDBNIU adores:
1.) Caesar Izturis
2.) Koyie Hill
3.) Ryan Theriot
4.) Himself
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Stuff like this
is the best attention an attention-seeker can get. You’re spending your time talking about him (pure attention), rather than about his arguments (which he probably doesn’t care much about, really).
Just saying.
"Is there anything he can't do?" ~Len Kasper, 4/5/08, on Kosuke Fukudome
Stop being right.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Don't forget David "Ice-water in his veins" Aardsma!
"Baseball is like church- many attend, few understand." ~ Leo Durocher
I liked Aardsma.
He’s throwing well for Boston this year.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Just referring to the BlueMike list....
....no indication of my opinion of Aardsma. Last season he was talking up Aardsma with typical irrational exuberance. Something like the next day, David had a melt down. That’s all.
"Baseball is like church- many attend, few understand." ~ Leo Durocher
Surely
he puts himself above Theriot. Maybe even Hill. Not above Izturis, of course.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 12, 2008 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Ironically...
BlueMike did NOT like Theriot last year. Sometime between last year and this year Theriot became one of his faves.
Also, add Cedeno, Murton, Marshall, Samardzija and Veal to his list of “hates,” and Tyler Colvin and Gallagher to his list of “adores.”
by SouthernCub on May 12, 2008 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Blue Mike didn't like Theriot because...
...he DID like Cesar the Wonder Out, who the Nintendo players didn’t like.
Now that we basement dwellers don’t like Theriot, he likes Theriot.
A day when the best you can do is ripping on the radio broadcast is a very good day for the Cubs and Cub fans.
Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager
Good Point
Before you rip on Dave Otto how about Tony Romo’s 7th inning stretch. LOL
by Madison Cub Fan on May 12, 2008 12:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Why on Earth would they invite a Dallas Cowboy?
Yeah, I know, he went to EIU. But Bears fans know him as a Cowboy. Of course he’s going to get booed. What did they expect?
The guest singer thing—waaaaaaaaaaay past time to retire it.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
I think
they should just pass the mantle to Santo. Just let him do it every day.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 12, 2008 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Agreed.
And when Ronny can’t do it, they should just play a tape of Harry, or let Len handle it.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions
Wood hit batsmen
To answer the quasi-rhetorical question in the post, Kerry did hit lots of guys as a starter, leading the league in 2002 (16) and 2003 (21), was third in 1998 (11) and sixth in 2005 (11). His 85 career hit batsmen ranks him 13th on the active list (Randy Johnson, 185) and 98th all-time (Walter Johnson, 203). (BTW, thank you, baseball-reference). The four for this year put him in a five-way tie for first, impressive for a reliever.
You don’t tend to notice the hit batsmen for starters but as a reliever, they do seem to be magnified. Obviously, Opening Day’s HBP and the one against the Brewers about 10 days ago (both stupid Craig Counsel, am I right?) stand out.
I don’t care. I still love Kerry as a closer, even if his entrance music is lame and cliche.
The entrance music isn't his choice...
... and yes, it IS lame and cliche. Wish the marketing department would have listened to Kerry when he said he didn’t want a song.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Kerry on my Wayward Son!
There’ll be peace when you are done!
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 12, 2008 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm kidding...
I believe it’s ‘Thunderstruck’ by AC/DC….
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 12, 2008 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
I've been to one game
And it was “Welcome to the Jungle.” A buddy said that’s been his music all year; I suppose he could have been mistaken.
Yeah, this is the song I've heard on the audio of most games.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.
A great weekend for the Cubs
No doubt about it. Three biggest positives for me?
1. Kerry Wood getting his act together and pitching like a dominant closer.
2. The talent and majesty of Kosuke Fukudome. The more I watch Kosuke in person and on TV, the more I am blown away with his ability. He is an absolute wonderful ballplayer at bat, on the basepads and in the outfield.
3. The arrival of Sean Gallagher. I have really liked this kid for awhile. He is going to be a quality starting pitcher in this league and his time to start proving that might be now. Very exciting to have him up with the big club.
Lou, stop being obstinate...bat Soriano # 6.
There's a guy, by the name of Alfonso Soriano...
...heard of him?
Friday: RBI double, biggest hit of the game
Saturday: 4-5, 2 R, RBI
Sunday: Walk, set-up Ward
Dan
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
I think your meant to say...
Guess Hitting Hack.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 12, 2008 12:11 AM CDT up reply actions
Huh?
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
That's MDBNIU/BlueMike/Technohawk's
label for Sori’s hitting approach.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions
Don't forget "stats whore."
Nanika Ga Okoru!
Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.
Hack Wilson is back from the grave?
Of course, back then MDB’s grandfather probably called Hack a guess hitting alf…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
HAHAHA
It’s really sad that he hates Soriano so much, that he can’t even mention his name in a postive way. I dunno what he’s going to do when Soriano is red hot, and is carrying the team.
You mean
kinda like he did this weekend with two game winning hits? ;)
Soriano seems to finally be getting things together. Maybe it just took those two ugly little hits he got on saturday (the two off his hands that somehow found the grass in shallow right field). While watching Soriano on the basepaths is a bit excruciating at times (only because it was looking like he was going to pull something again with the way he was running), you gotta love his aggressiveness.
"Very adroit in the outfield." - Lou, on Dome
Yes
And you know what’s bizarre? This morning, driving through the main street of the village in Ireland where I live, I saw a guy jaywalking and he had on this blue t-shirt. As I got closer, I spotted the cubbie bear logo on his chest. This never happens – I might see a Cubs hat twice a year, but never a Cubs jersey or shirt. Anyway, as the guy cautiously ran across the street through rush hour traffic, dodging cars, I saw on his back the number 12…..and the legend SORIANO emblazoned across the top.
I’m taking it as a sign.
"Is there anything he can't do?" ~Len Kasper, 4/5/08, on Kosuke Fukudome
That is a cool story.
You should’ve hit him with your car then invited him to the pub for a pint.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.
Do you like Dome bunting?
I love it – sometimes when the opponents forgot about it.
He should have done it with Dragons… but he had enough OBP so may not.
I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.
by dragonsfanatic on May 12, 2008 4:17 AM CDT up reply actions
That bunt was great.
Perfectly timed and perfectly placed. What a fundamentally sound, smart player Dome is. It seems to be rubbing off on his teammates, too.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
I haven't
seen a bunt that perfect in a long time. A few inches in either direction and it is more likely to have ended up foul. My favorite part about bunts like that is watching the defense pick the ball up and be all dejected about it.
"Very adroit in the outfield." - Lou, on Dome
Just watched the bunt
on a TV news show. That was great and perfect one.
I'm bleeding Dragons Blue.
by dragonsfanatic on May 12, 2008 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Don't forget
4. Both Kyle Lohse and Braden Looper losing over the weekend. I guess the Cards might not run away with the division.
5. Alfonso Soriano guessing right all weekend.
6. Cesar Izturis now hitting .229 and slugging .271. How could the Cubs have missed that he was another Ozzie Smith?
anyone else notice
that in another thread he said he a charter member Sean Gallagher Fan Club
creepy?????
by Madison Cub Fan on May 12, 2008 12:19 AM CDT reply actions
Sean needs to get
those glasses with the mirrors on the inside of the lens, so that he can see behind him.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 12, 2008 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Dusty asleep again - Reds bat out order
I don’t if this was already discussed but Dusty screwed up a double switch again and the Reds batted out of order: The Reds batted out of order in the ninth inning after a double switch, as David Ross batted eighth instead of Corey Patterson, lining out. Willie Randolph told the umpiring crew of the mistake and, after a delay of more than 10 minutes, Patterson was credited with the out and Ross batted again.
Willie Randolph asleep even more
Randolph should not have raised the issue – that way Corey would have batted. Instead, Ross gets another at bat…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
maybe
he thought that Ross would be better. :P
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 12, 2008 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions
It was a great
weekend. Very happy to see Soriano get into the groove. I worry about his legs though. We need him to be healthy.
Looking forward to a great week of Cubs baseball.
More Sun-Times flattery
Hasn’t the Sun-Times, or even Marriotti, “borrowed” ideas/headlines from here before? If not, it seems like a copy editor has today. The columnist’s latest has the headline “Complaint-free Zone” – which sounded kind of familiar until I realized Al had a post just the other day with almost the same headline….
"Is there anything he can't do?" ~Len Kasper, 4/5/08, on Kosuke Fukudome
I still think you're wrong about the D-Backs, Al...
I don’t think they are going to finish fourth in their division, or even come close to that. So no lesson learned for me there. And as you’ve said about some of our lost series, it’s a long season. I wouldn’t use this sweep as evidence that they’re not that good.
One thing that the AZ announcers said on TV yesterday
The D Backs have been swept 2 times this year-by the Rockies and the Cubs. Interesting. Teams they may be playing again in October.
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
I also think
the Cubs were more patient than the D Backs at the plate all weekend. Seemed like their hitters were more aggressive and we were very disciplined.
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
has anyone read
the DBacks blog here? Their frustrations sound very familiar.
2008: The year we put it all together.
by drewishdrewid on May 12, 2008 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
I know this is kinda late
but was anyone else annoyed by the fact that Fox used Mark Grace for the broadcast on saturday. I know that he has historical ties to the Cubs and all, but for some reason I was really bugged by the fact that Fox would use AZ’s regular broadcaster to do that game.
"Very adroit in the outfield." - Lou, on Dome
I don't know about this year...
...but at last year (and probably previous years), Grace was actually employed by Fox to do the Saturday games, in addition to his regular gig with the DBacks. Not sure who his regular Fox broadcast partner is/was, but I think they were like the 3rd string team for Fox’s regional game of the week coverage.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
It's Kenny Albert.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions
Annoyed maybe because he's kind of a blow hard
although not as bad as some say. But not because he’s an AZ broadcaster. It kind of makes sense to get a guy like that who is well versed in both teams and has ties to both. Plus, he sounded like a much bigger Cub fan than D-back fan, I thought.
"Is there anything he can't do?" ~Len Kasper, 4/5/08, on Kosuke Fukudome
Agreed.
He’s a bad baseball announcer, but not because he’s a D’backs guy. He’s bad because he prattles on the entire game (many times about his own career) and talks over the action way too often. He was way more gracious to the Cubs than McCarver and Buck ever are, and like you say, has ties to both clubs.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on May 12, 2008 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I know most on this blog
dislike Gracie as an announcer, but, he is one of my all-time favorite Cubs and I enjoy him here. During the Fox Saturday broadcasts, he may go overboard, but I think he’s better on our local D Back games. He did sound kinda homerish for the Cubs this weekend, and that’s ok. Like he said, all his game memories are with the Cubs, but his team memories are with the D Backs.
When the D Backs won game 7 of the WS, I was yelling that it was an ex-Cub that started that exciting 9th inning and it was another ex-Cub that finished it. One day it will be THESE Cubs putting the finishing touches on a WS title!
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
Something strange..
about that Saturday game. Besides the announcers, the picture and sound seemed all screwed up to me. I thought it was my tv, but friends of mine, and posters here during the game said the same thing.
"The one constant through all the years, Ray, has been baseball"
I learned that.....
Ivan DeJesus is a good luck charm at 1B.
"In all the categories that you pay the most attention to, except the loss column, we're doing very well" - Jim Hendry
I was thinking
Man, how long is Lester Strode’s daughter’s graduation ceremony anyway? But after this weekend, the Strode can let Sinatro full in for him anytime, and let DeJesus work his charms at 1B.
"Is there anything he can't do?" ~Len Kasper, 4/5/08, on Kosuke Fukudome
Agreed.
But I was also wondering why DeJesus didn’t just sub for Strode in the first place. It seemed more logical to me but maybe Sinatro has previous bullpen coach experience?
"In all the categories that you pay the most attention to, except the loss column, we're doing very well" - Jim Hendry
I think Sinatro just wanted to be closer to the Pink Backpack with the candy in it.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 12, 2008 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions
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