What is taking so long with dealing Marquis?

by scottsdalecubs on May 8, 2008 1:52 AM CDT

The guy is clearly disinterested. Trade him with a hot Cedeno for CF or SP help for Gosh sakes. As it stands, we are subjected to watching Marquis waste everyone's time when he pitches, and I wonder what is going through his mind while out on the mound. I suspect Lou does also.

The Soriano in 1 spot may be running it's course also. Third is his spot, ad infinitum, and Ramirez will benefit b/c of that move, imo

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Marquis

In the offseason, Hendry wasn’t willing to eat much of his contract and wanted a decent player in return. Hendry I’m sure is still shopping him, but I doubt he’s going to give him away for nothing and eat 5-7m of his contract like some teams might be asking him to do.

So unless another team decides to give in, or Hendry is willing to lower his demands, I don’t see Marquis being traded anytime soon. Hopefully at some point Hendry and another GM will come to some kind of agreement. Like the Cubs paying a good chunk of Marquis salary but get a decent player or prospect in return. Hendry was able to pull off a trade like that in 05 when he traded Latroy Hawkins and paid half his salary, but got two pretty decent players in return(at the time) in Jerome Williams and David Aardsma. Marquis really isn’t that bad, he eats innings and is fine in the 4th and 5th spots. The Cubs just have better options in Lieber, Marshall and probably even Gallagher right now. So he’s kinda blocking a few guys who are probably better then he is, but he’s still better then most teams 4th and 5th starters.

by cubsfan25 on May 8, 2008 2:57 AM CDT 0 recs

well said

also, Marquis is our #5 earning #3 money. nobody wants that. Were more than likely gonna stick it out and hope he rebounds, which he probably will. He’s a middle of the road guy doing middle of the road stuff, whats the big deal? and why in the world would you get rid of ronny? he’s the man and is gonna replace theriot at short near or around the allstar break, at least i hope. He is a superb fielder that all of the sudden is batting like a maniac. He’s been hitting well all year, and has been great for us, kinda like last years derosa, but younger, and better. Dont really know why you would wanna dump him, he looks like he has put it all together. plus, keeping him we can develop a core of young guys that we might be able to keep around for the next 6-9 years: Soto, Pie, Cedeno, Marmol, Theriot and Fontenot.

P.S. See below. teams dont commit hundreds of millions of dollars to prematurely ship a guy off.

"This ball's got a chaaaaaance.....(YES!!! YESSS!!!!).....GONE!!! CUBS WIN, CUBS WIN!"

by FutureGroundscrewMember on May 8, 2008 4:45 AM CDT up 0 recs

Marquis

also, Marquis is our #5 earning #3 money. nobody wants that

Well number 3’s usually make more then 7m per year these days. Marquis contract was backloaded a bit so it makes the remanding part of the contract bigger then ti was. Marquis is a bit overpaid he probably should get around 5m per year instead of 7m.

by cubsfan25 on May 8, 2008 2:04 PM CDT up 0 recs

Good Point

We really need that one more good pitcher that can fill our rotation. We had it in 2003. We need to get rid of Jason. If we get one more solid starter we could be dangerous

by columbusOHcubsfan on May 8, 2008 7:16 PM CDT up 0 recs

Sigh...who? WHO?!

Nanika Ga Okoru!

Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.

by dat cubfan daver on May 9, 2008 10:09 AM CDT up 0 recs

Teams don't make trades like this in May.

Nuff said.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on May 8, 2008 3:19 AM CDT 0 recs

Throw-in

You have to figure Marquis will not be the center piece of a trade this year, regardless of how much the Cubs eat. Unless Dave Littlefield finds another job and makes another Matt Morris type trade, I don’t think we’ll see him go anywhere except as a secondary player in a deal.

by jax_cubs on May 8, 2008 5:36 AM CDT 0 recs

It takes two

What pitching do you want to trade for that is available?

The often injured Rich Harden who is still on the DL?

The 2-5 Joe Blanton? I don’t really want him but is he even available? Oakland is tied for 1st. I suspect he isn’t available right now.

by rlpete on May 8, 2008 7:34 AM CDT 0 recs

This is really the key point here.

I’m reading/hearing this constant whining from many Cubs fans about why Hendry isn’t going out and acquiring some decent starting pitching yet very few are willing to name names—the writer of this fanpost included.

And those who do name names are quickly shot down. Why? Because there is very little, if any, quality starting pitching available right now. It’s just not out there.

Oh, and the idea of putting Soriano in the three-hole is completely ridiculous.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.

by dat cubfan daver on May 8, 2008 9:24 AM CDT up 0 recs

Marquis

dat cubfan daver wrote:

Great point. Yet I will point out that an unhappy guy like Jason will cause more havoc within the team than we will ever know. I believe when you show your cards in Spring training like that, and let’s be honest here, show up Piniella, then you’re worth a bag of balls when you consider the overall direction of the team.

Selfish player.

"Hey Hey, Holy Mackerel, No Doubt About It!"

by scottsdalecubs on May 8, 2008 11:47 PM CDT up 0 recs

You're reading WAY too much into the spring training thing.

Marquis’ comments during spring training were certainly ill-advised, but that whole matter blew over relatively quickly. Lou backed down from his initial bristling, and I think Marquis eventually clarified/softened his initial remarks.

To be honest, I don’t think Marquis is particularly “unhappy”—I think he’s probably just a little paranoid about losing his place in the starting rotation and possibly on the team. And that’s certainly understandable seeing as how there have been trade rumors swirling around him like paparazzi around Amy Winehouse.

And I still don’t understand what you’re proposing here. Are you saying the Cubs simply DFA Marquis? That would be a total waste of a player who’s still, perhaps, marketable on some level—or may be in the future.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.

by dat cubfan daver on May 9, 2008 10:16 AM CDT up 0 recs

waiting..

maybe we are waiting for a team to get to the point where they ship us a superstar for cheap(like Ramirez, Lee trades)

After Lieber’s outing and Rich Hill not throwing the ball well, i dont think we can afford to lose another SP.

by ragamuffindaniel on May 8, 2008 7:35 AM CDT 0 recs

It was either the off-season or the deadline time frame for this deal...

...so we have to wait. I think tht this is the type of pitcher that the Cubs should have expected from Marquis, if they expected No. 2 type starter they were crazy. The contract is their own doing, too, but that seems to be a consistent weakness with Hendry.

by DudeVf11 on May 8, 2008 8:31 AM CDT 0 recs

...and every GM has more than a few bad contracts...

it’s part of the business.

by DudeVf11 on May 8, 2008 8:32 AM CDT up 0 recs

ask yourself before posting this

if the cubs dont want marquis—why would anyone else??

Go Cubbies Go!!!!!!

by cubsluver22 on May 8, 2008 8:59 AM CDT 0 recs

Simple math

Jason Marquis is being paid around $7 million this season and is due roughly another $8 million in 2009. What other team in their right mind is going to trade for a crap pitcher with that amount of huge dough still on his contract? Answer is nobody. Jim Hendry will have to eat a minimum of $10 million in salary to have any chance in hell of moving Marquis.

Lou, stop being obstinate...bat Soriano # 6.

by MDBNIU on May 8, 2008 9:36 AM CDT 0 recs

Thanks for that

Good to know.

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on May 8, 2008 9:36 AM CDT up 0 recs

Marquis

isn’t that bad and there’s no way Hendry would have to eat that much salary. Most teams I’m sure would be willing to pay 5m per year for Marquis. If a guy has a sub 5 era and can pitch 190-200 innings thats worth at least 5m these days. So paying 10m of it and nobody is gonna want him is a big overreacting.

by cubsfan25 on May 8, 2008 2:07 PM CDT up 0 recs

I'll tell you in simple terms...

...as with many Cub players he has tried to trade in the past, Marquis has lower market value than Hendry thinks he should have, and he is not willing to lower his demands.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on May 8, 2008 9:40 AM CDT 0 recs

There WAS some interest in Marquis during spring training.

There’s probably less now, but I imagine if Marquis starts pitching better, that interest will pick up.

At which time you’d have to ask, “Well, if he’s pitching better, why trade him?”

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on May 8, 2008 9:52 AM CDT up 0 recs

It's a conundrum...wrapped in a riddle...addressed to no one...and shipped anonymously.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.

by dat cubfan daver on May 8, 2008 9:56 AM CDT up 0 recs

It's important to keep one thing in mind...

...eating a bunch of salary on trades, will typically shorten the life span of a GM. Let’s put ourselves in Hendry’s shoes for just a minute, and think about his motivations.

I would imagine, he is rooting for Marquis to deliver more than anyone. He knows he will need to eat a good piece of what’s left on his deal and that doesn’t look good when new owners come onboard – especially when you have big dollars that are backloaded for 4-5 players with no-trade clauses. I am assuming he wants to remain the Cub’s GM for years to come, and they know he is going to be evaluated on how far the Cubs go this year, and also on the financial situation he has developed with the payroll.

Again, I don’t think anyone is rooting for Marquis more than Hendry, and there may be a little difference of opinion here between Hendry and Piniella on this one. Piniella has gone along with it for now, but if Marquis continues to struggle, it could develop a bit of a problem for Hendry.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on May 8, 2008 10:07 AM CDT up 0 recs

The thing about backloaded contracts

IMO, and Al has said this too, they look worse now then they will in the future. Besides the player getting older and producing less the going rate for everything keeps going up and up and up.

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on May 8, 2008 10:17 AM CDT up 0 recs

True Statement...

...but I still see the new owners looking at this quite closely when they evaluate Hendry. Unless the club is performing very well on the field, this type of stuff becomes pretty important to new management.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on May 8, 2008 10:21 AM CDT up 0 recs

True

Also, in the future the Cubs payroll will increase therefore making the % of money he is earning that season similar to today.

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on May 8, 2008 10:43 AM CDT up 0 recs

Because we know better?

I has a blog.

by cwyers on May 8, 2008 10:25 AM CDT up 0 recs

It's just like Soriano

Marquis and Soriano are priced at their market value. That means that if they were free agents today they’d get roughly what they’re owed (probably slightly less in both cases) on the open market.

That means that their value is what they’re being paid – not what they’re being paid + valuable pieces in return.

So if we were to trade them, we would likely get absolutely nothing of value back. Or we would have to eat a lot of the money, something that makes no sense to do.

Remember you don’t trade players, you trade contracts.

by Wreckard on May 8, 2008 10:53 AM CDT 0 recs

No way on earth

If Alfonso Soriano hit the open market right now he’d get nowhere near an 8 year, $136 million deal. He is proving conclusively that he is a second division star ballplayer. A guy that can put up wonderful personal statistics in situations like Washington and Texas where there is minimal expectation for winning and he can just hack his way to glory and not worry about it.

Marquis? He’d be lucky to get even a 1 year Kyle Lohse type deal at this stage.

Lou, stop being obstinate...bat Soriano # 6.

by MDBNIU on May 8, 2008 11:07 AM CDT up 0 recs

Havent heard this before

Hopefully this picture wont make me look like I dont know what Im talking about. Baaaaaaaaaaaa. We’ll see you on BCB next time the Cubs lose.

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on May 8, 2008 11:14 AM CDT up 0 recs

Is there a reason

you have to post the same stupid picture twice in the same thread?

by The E-Man on May 8, 2008 11:21 AM CDT up 0 recs

I'm gonna take a wild guess...

...and say Hammer is pictorially commenting on the repetitiveness of MDBNIU’s posts.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.

by dat cubfan daver on May 8, 2008 11:30 AM CDT up 0 recs

Correct

Ill look into other photos for someone “spewing” the same crap over and over again.

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on May 8, 2008 11:49 AM CDT up 0 recs

Hoo boy...this should be good.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.

by dat cubfan daver on May 8, 2008 12:01 PM CDT up 0 recs

What's the chance for a picture

of Cesar Izturis spewing?

by rlpete on May 8, 2008 12:24 PM CDT up 0 recs

I don't know about spewing...

...but you could probably find one of him groping.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

Oh, and remember, folks: Alfonso Soriano is NOT batting leadoff. He's batting first.

by dat cubfan daver on May 8, 2008 12:29 PM CDT up 0 recs

Reading is FUNdamental!

I didn’t say they would get the same contract they got, I said he’d get roughly what he is owed. (I even said probably less than that).

I don’t think that a 6 or 7 year, $110M dollar deal would be unreasonable for Soriano on the open market now. If you don’t believe me, just look at what Tori Hunter and Aaron Rowand got this off season.

Again, I don’t think that Marquis would have gotten 3 years, $21M, but 2 years, $14M wouldn’t have been out of the question for a league-average innings eater.

More importantly you missed the entire point of the post. Let me give you the crib notes version, which will only use 1 and 2 syllable words:

“These guys are priced at or above their market value. What we would get in return would be worth less to us than what they are. Therefore we are better off keeping them.”

by Wreckard on May 8, 2008 11:34 AM CDT up 0 recs

IAWTC

Besides, Soriano is going to get better. Marquis, well, I’m not as bullish on him.

2008: The year we put it all together.

by drewishdrewid on May 8, 2008 12:16 PM CDT up 0 recs

Funny, I never thought the Yankee teams he STARRED on had a minimal expectation of winning....

He had three or here, just for you MDBNIU 3, full seasons with the Yanks, was an allstar twice (that means 2 times) was third in ROY voting (that means two (2) players were ahead of him, won the Silver Slugger (that means he hit better than all second basemen) in his second year. Oh yeah, he was traded for A-Rod, thought by many to be the best (that means #1) player in MLB. So, I think I will wait to see a post from you when the Cubs lose and you think that Rami or DLee should be DFA’d (that means Designated for Assingment or DROPPED from the team) for not driving in 20 runs in that game….

by crazymountain on May 8, 2008 3:05 PM CDT up 0 recs

Soriano

Would ring the bell salary wise – he has largely been slotted in the wrong spot in the batting order, and this has seriously warped his talents, I expect this to be resolved by june 1

"Hey Hey, Holy Mackerel, No Doubt About It!"

by scottsdalecubs on May 9, 2008 12:12 AM CDT up 0 recs