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Greatest Cubs Teams Ever?

There's an interesting article today over at The Hardball Times about the best and worst Cubs teams of all time as determined by simulating each team playing through their season 1000 times...Some good teams are left out, and some bad ones too, but it's pretty interesting to see what may have been...the link is http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/the-bad-century/ Go Cubs! Let's have a great road trip!

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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2004

Wow I was surprised to see that team did that well. I didnt really read all the methodology thoroughly, but they were a good team, also jinxed by the SI cover i believe with the “Hell Freezes Over” kerry wood cover.

i guess they dont take the latroy hawkins factor into account.

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jun 2, 2008 6:14 PM CDT reply actions  

Don't say the "L" word.

I went and did some quick calculations… turns out the 2004 Cubs would win 143 games w/o him.

by zm1217 on Jun 2, 2008 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Interesting...

Subjectively, I would’ve guessed that either the ‘29 or ‘35 team was the best since the Tinker/Evers/Chance dynasty. They didn’t come out on top in this series of simulations but they had to face the latter teams from that dynasty, which is a problematic comparison because both the game and the resulting statistics had changed so dramatically during the previous 20 years.

The ‘45 team fares very well but that should be discounted because they did so against inferior competition, with many of the real major leaguers being otherwise occupied with that World War thing.

I was surprised that the 69/71 teams didn’t rank that highly, considering the strength of the starting rotations.

I’d argue that the ‘99 edition was the worst Cub team since the 1960s, although ‘81 was ugly too. That team started 32-24 but wound up losing 97 games and treating us all to the spectacle of Andrew Lorraine. That was awful.

by LaddieRenfroe on Jun 2, 2008 6:32 PM CDT reply actions  

The worst team since the 1960s...

... was 2006. Despite the records being worse percentagewise in ‘80 and ‘81, that 2006 team was absolutely horrendous.

I was surprised the HT people didn’t pick 1970 as one of the teams to run in the simulation. I thought in many ways the ‘70 team had a better shot than ‘69, and was a better TEAM.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Jun 2, 2008 6:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd still argue that '99 was worse but...

..2006 was disappointing and frustrating like no other season during my lifetime. Even if you matched them up head to head, even if Dan Serafini and Jose Nieves et al would lose more games, nothing from 1999 could match the cruelty of 2006.

by LaddieRenfroe on Jun 2, 2008 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

The '99 team collapsed after starting 32-23...

... and being only a game out of first on June 8. From that date they went 35-74, which would translate to 52-110 over a 162-game season.

The ‘06 team was actually 14-10 on May 1. They then lost 8 in a row, and 21 of 25 to be 18-31 on May 28. From 14-10 to the end of the season they were 52-86, which projects to 61-101 over a full season.

Both teams were horrendous. Ugh. I have to go clean the keyboard now.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Jun 2, 2008 7:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah...

...trying to decide which team was worse makes me want to drink drain cleaner.

by LaddieRenfroe on Jun 2, 2008 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd still say

the 1980 and 1981 teams were worse. The 2006 team was disappointing and underachieved, but had some quality (healthy) ballplayers in Aramis Ramirez and Carlos Zambrano. Matt Murton and Michael Barrett had good years at the plate and even Jacque Jones was a productive player that season.

But those teams of 1980 and 1981 were really dreadful. In 1981, Ken Reitz, Pat Tabler and Ivan DeJesus were all “Starting” players with an OBP at .281 or under. Not only that, but they all had slugging percentages at .281 and under.

I could go on. The top end of the rotation wasn’t terrible with Krukow and Reuschel, but the rest wasn’t very good. Despite a young Lee Smith and a last hurrah from Rawley Eastwick, the bullpen was no good too.

The 1981 team was last in the NL in runs scored and last in the league in runs allowed (although their ERA was a tad better than Philadelphia—more unearned runs.) The 2006 team was second to last in runs scored and third to last in runs allowe.

Although the 1981 team was, as you and Lou Boudreau liked to point out, IN A PENNANT RACE!

It's a girl! Born 1-18-08. 2246 PST. 8 lbs. 1 oz.

by Josh Timmers on Jun 2, 2008 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

'81 was worse than '80, I think.

That team would have broken the club record for losses if not for the strike. Their full-season percentage was .368, which is 59-103 - that would have tied the record. But they were playing even more poorly before the strike - they hit the strike at 15-37, a .288 percentage, good for 46 wins in a 162-game season. And that’s after winning five of their last six before the strike. They were 1-13, 4-19, 5-27, 9-32 and 10-36. They had only one good player - Bill Buckner, and he had only a “decent” year, hitting .311/.349/.480. Mike Krukow led the team in wins - with 9. No other pitcher won more than five.

Ugh again.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Jun 3, 2008 4:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

2006 was a long year.

They came up with new and creative ways to lose regularly

by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 2, 2008 6:49 PM CDT reply actions  

one last thing...

...in the past, I’ve run simulated seasons (using Strat-O) matching the 2003 and 2004 teams against various good Cub teams from the past. While not as exhaustive as the ones from the article, my results were about the same – the 03 and 04 teams did very well. This happened because the simulator overvalues the enormous strikeout totals posted by those pitching staffs. For example, Matt Clement wouldn’t have rung up 200+ strikeouts if he’d been pitching in a different era but the computer has no way to account for that so he performs much, much better than expected in simulations.

by LaddieRenfroe on Jun 2, 2008 7:29 PM CDT reply actions  

Thank you for sharing this!

This is interesting! This has endless possibilities. Thank you again for sharing this. :)

by MiCubsFan on Jun 2, 2008 8:13 PM CDT reply actions  

2006 .. o Lord ..

Please never bring that train wreck again.

Please.

They weren’t the worse Cub team seen in recent years (like you guys said, remember 80 and 81), but they were the most EXPECTED to be far better.

I still have a bunch of 2006 WGN Cub schedules in the files. Wonder how they’d do on Ebay? I lost a ton of money running to games that year that they never won, so I wouldn’t mind selling pieces of history to recover my losses.

Course if I recovered all I’ve spent on the Cubs in my 47 years, I could retire tommorrow.

Well, Next Year is here .. and Jack's century's gotta end some time .. GO CUBBIES!

by cubnational on Jun 3, 2008 2:19 AM CDT reply actions  

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