NL Central Turnaround

by MorePiePlease on Jun 23, 2008 7:31 AM CDT

Has anyone else noticed that, as of today, the 3 best teams in the NL(record wise) are in the Central? The Cubs, Cards, and Brewers come in 1st, 4th, and 5th/6th in all of baseball as well.

My point?

It seems to me, not living in Chicago, that the Cubs didn't get much respect for winning the weakest division in baseball last season. This year, should things go as we all hope and now expect, the haters won't be able to make that argument. This is a good, albeit top heavy, division. Even the Pirates are playing decent ball and the Reds are capable of kicking teams in the teeth every now and then.

I would also like to ask you all to weigh in with your opinion on this: Can the Cards keep up their unexpected performance? They are reminding me a little of the '04 team when I kept telling my Cards fan neighbor, "there is no way that pitching will hold up all season". Of course, as we all know, they kept it up for the next 2 seasons. Or will Milwaukee, as expected, become our main competition down the stretch? Their bullpen still shows signs of suckitude and a tendency to crap the bed, but that Brewer offense is starting to look like it should.

Thanks and happy off day.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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Well...

... Milwaukee should be the main competition, what with their talented position players, but, while I hate to say it, never underestimate LaRussa. He gets more out of less than any baseball manager I’ve seen.

Santo Forever!

by BeerCub on Jun 23, 2008 7:58 AM CDT reply actions

There was a reason the Cubs didn't get much respect last year...

They barely won a very weak division.

I don’t think this is entirely accurate, but it’s interesting… The cubs were 14th in a crude RPI last year for the whole MLB. The Brewers were 19th. The NL Central wasn’t good last year, and the Cubs got the respect they deserved.

This year is an entirely different story. It’s definitely a very solid division, though fairly top heavy.
As far as the Cubs competition, I don’t think that STL can keep it up, with injuries and lack of depth. But they have good young players, which can be surprising. So who knows. And the Brewers still don’t have a positive run differential. They have talent, but who knows.

This is the Cubs division to lose, plain and simple. They have talent, and a LOT of depth, which is vital over the long season.

by jtlight on Jun 23, 2008 8:24 AM CDT reply actions

I still don't see the Cardinals keeping this up.

One thing this should do is really put the lie to the so-called experts, who were granting the NL pennant to the Mets before the season even started.

Just where is that juggernaut Mets team right now? Playing .500 ball, and having fired their manager in the last week.

Those same “experts” were calling the NL Central the worst division in baseball. They had the right league, but the wrong division—looks like the NL West takes that “title”.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Jun 23, 2008 8:42 AM CDT reply actions

It wasn't just experts

There were numerous people here that said Hendry had to do something otherwise the Cubs were going to lose in the playoffs to the Mets with Pedro and Santana leading the way.

by rlpete on Jun 23, 2008 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions

Right.

And that’s why they actually play the games.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Jun 23, 2008 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions

2 points

1) you present contradictory arguments on the opinions of “experts”. First you disparage them by proving how difficult it is to predict such things and then write them off by saying “that’s why they play the games”, but then you’re giving them credence by initiating the discussion of the picks. So which is it? Do you not care at all what experts predict? Or do you just have some massive chip on your shoulder that you need to feel better about by disparaging the “experts”

2) It’s June 23, at this point last year the Cubs were 34-39. Its a LONG season….

by DartmouthCubsFan on Jun 23, 2008 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions

On point 2, I agree with you.

I’m not sure what you are saying on point one.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Jun 23, 2008 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions

i'm saying

on one hand you’re railing against the experts for not seeing how bad the Mets would be to this point and saying that this is why they play the games and you shouldn’t pay attention to so-called experts

on the other hand YOU’RE the one bringing up the experts as a source

So while you’re discrediting them on one hand, you’re also lending credence to them at the same time by citing their predictions

So it would seem contradictory if your message is to ignore supposed “experts” because they don’t know what they’re talking about, but then you’re the one bringing them into the conversation. Just seems like you’ve got an axe to grind with “experts” and thus you’re citing the poor predictions to highlight their inadequacies

by DartmouthCubsFan on Jun 23, 2008 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions

Slightly OT

Did anyone else hear this? IN the 13 years Pat Hughes has been with the Cubs, this is the furthest (or farthest, I dont know) the Cubs have been in first place? 4.5 games. Lets make it 10

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on Jun 23, 2008 9:35 AM CDT reply actions

That's not quite right, actually.

The Cubs had a six-game lead in the NL Central from June 12-17, and June 21-23, 2001. That’s the largest lead since the previous division title in 1989.

The last time they led the Central by MORE than the 4.5 game lead of today was June 29, 2001, 5.5 games.

You’re right. Let’s make it 10. Or more.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al Yellon on Jun 23, 2008 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions

So....maybe I heard it wrong.

But lets make it 10

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on Jun 23, 2008 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions

That 2001 team

I have never seen a worse team carried by one player like that and I probably never will again.

Other than Sosa, the only regulars on that team with an OPS+ above 100 were Matt Stairs (barely) and two guys who got injured: Bill Mueller and Rondell White. McGriff came in late and hit, but by that time the rest of the team had faded.

The idea that team could win 88 games is mindboggling and a tribute to Sammy Sosa, who probably had the greatest season in franchise history that year.

It's a girl! Born 1-18-08. 2246 PST. 8 lbs. 1 oz.

by Josh Timmers on Jun 23, 2008 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions

Agree

probably the best season in the history of the Cubs, and 2nd in MVP voting too.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/s/sosasa01.shtml

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on Jun 23, 2008 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions

Lieber's Record; Sosa Better than '98

If you take away Lieber’s 20-6 record, the Cubs were only 68-68 in 2001. Sosa’s 2001 season was better than his 1998 season.

"The big possum walks late." - Harry Caray

by memphiscub on Jun 23, 2008 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions

like I said

we’re 8-10 games up by August 1.

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jun 23, 2008 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions

I'm Surprised With Division Strength

They do play the games for a reason. At the beginning of the season, I predicted the Cubs to win the division with 90 wins with Milwaukee having 88 wins. I thought all the other division teams would have losing records. I predicted St. Louis to win just 77 games. The Cubs, Brewers, and Cards look like they are win more games than I predicted at the beginning of the season. The Cardinals and Brewers could have a heated race for the wild card.

"The big possum walks late." - Harry Caray

by memphiscub on Jun 23, 2008 10:17 AM CDT reply actions

I worry about both St. Louis and Milwaukee making moves to get better

Milwaukee owner Mark Attanasio has come out and said he will do whatever it takes to win. So that might mean they get into the serious bidding for Rich Harden, AJ Burnett, CC Sabathia. And the Brewers have a well stocked farm system that enhances the ability to make a big deal.

The Cardinals have significantly pared payroll the last few years. But with players like Ryan Ludwig and Rick Ankiel developing very nicely and with LaRussa doing his best job in years, well then the Cardinals may too be in the bidding for big names.

GET Rich Harden !!! 10 starts, 4-0, 59 IP, 72 Ks, 2.44 ERA !!!

by MDBNIU on Jun 23, 2008 3:12 PM CDT reply actions

Hopefully they get Burnett

and their team ERA goes up, he sucks.

"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip

by Hammer on Jun 23, 2008 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions

Ahem...

—-—-—-—-—-BA -OBP -SLG OPS+
RAnkiel 2008 .251 .327 .481 111
Alfonso 2008 .283 .332 .547 124

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 23, 2008 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions

Huh?

Who compared Rick Ankiel (or Ryan Ludwig) to anybody? Both Cardinals are having solid seasons. And both have bright futures it would appear.

GET Rich Harden !!! 10 starts, 4-0, 59 IP, 72 Ks, 2.44 ERA !!!

by MDBNIU on Jun 23, 2008 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions

I just did.

You’re applauding one and you’ve always hated the other.

And it’s Ryan Ludwick...just sayin’

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 23, 2008 4:40 PM CDT up reply actions

St. Louis won't keep it up

There’s no way. Like you said, the pitching won’t continue, although Pujols is coming back soon.

"Check the magic of a winning season and there are always reasons beyond the talent." Ned Colleti

by wrigleyrocker12 on Jun 23, 2008 3:44 PM CDT reply actions

Well...

I used to think that too. But it’s hard to ignore what St. Louis has been doing. They aren’t a great team by any stretch. But they do have talent. Ryan Ludwig, Rick Ankiel and Todd Wellemeyer can no longer be considered fluky. They get Albert Pujols and maybe a pitcher or three back from the DL?

GET Rich Harden !!! 10 starts, 4-0, 59 IP, 72 Ks, 2.44 ERA !!!

by MDBNIU on Jun 23, 2008 4:25 PM CDT up reply actions