Open Thread: Cubs vs. Dodgers, Sunday 6/8, 7:05 CT
by Al
on Jun 8, 2008 3:01 PM CDT
in Game Threads
Chicago @ Los Angeles
At last, Phil Rosenthal writes in today's Tribune, the books are being released to potential Cubs buyers:
The long-awaited, much-anticipated Cubs books, the ones with the team's confidential financial data that are a prelude to a sale, should land on the desks of potential buyers of the National League ballclub on or around Monday, sources said.
Those interested in the team who have Major League Baseball's blessing will get the deluxe volume with the confidential info on the baseball operations, the franchise's 25 percent share of the Comcast SportsNet Chicago cable channel and aging Wrigley Field.
Real estate types only interested in Wrigley will just get an abridged version with the ballpark numbers, not to be confused with a ballpark estimate.
What I can't figure out is why the headline on that column is "Cuban lays out strategy for Cubs bid". Mark Cuban is NOT the only buyer; there may be as many as nine individuals or groups bidding. So why doesn't Don Levin get a mention? Or John Canning? Or the Ricketts group?
We already know the answer. Because he's the one on sports talk radio talking up his bid, making it about him, while the others work quietly behind the scenes, doing their due diligence (this is not to imply that Cuban won't do that; I know he will) while keeping a low profile.
Tribune Co.: Pick Don Levin. Please. You won't be sorry. (And his AHL team is one win away from another championship.)
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Finally, a Dodger-Cub pitching matchup that isn't a rematch of last week. Brad Penny has struggled this year -- his last start was his best since April. And that was only against the punchless Rockies, and the Dodgers lost anyway, 3-0. Aramis Ramirez (.391/.417/.435, 9-for-23) and Derrek Lee (.455/.500/.727, 3 doubles) hit him well, but the only current Cub to have homered off Penny is... Jim Edmonds.
Fortunately for Jason Marquis, the two Dodgers who hit him best -- Rafael Furcal and Andruw Jones -- are both on the DL. Jeff Kent is 8-for-19 lifetime vs. Marquis. In general, he has pitched well vs. LA -- 2-1, 2.35 in seven career starts; the last one was last September 6 in a game where he allowed only four hits and two runs in seven good innings, only to see Ryan Dempster blow the game in the 9th.
But that was then and this is now, right?
Today's game is on ESPN. At least everyone can watch it; if Miller & Morgan get too nauseating, just turn the sound down. For Sunday's other games check the MLB.com Mediacenter.
MLB.com Gameday (2007 version)
MLB.com Gameday (2008 version)
Baseball-reference.com game preview
Today's overflow comment threads will post at 8:15 pm and 9:15 pm CT.
Discuss amongst yourselves.
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First !!!
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jun 8, 2008 3:03 PM CDT 0 recs
Need we ask?
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 3:17 PM CDT
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Same thing I do every game.
Close my eyes and think of England.
by cwyers on
Jun 8, 2008 3:18 PM CDT
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I prefer to smile and nod,
while, on the inside, cursing the perfidy of the English.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 3:21 PM CDT
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That's
“lie back and think of England”.....but close enough!
(and highly amusing)
"Let's not get too giggly." ~Lou Piniella
by JohnM on
Jun 8, 2008 3:43 PM CDT
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That quote from Lady Hillingdon was hilarous.
I knew about the phrase, but never knew the exact origin. Land Hillingdon had to think about England only twice a week, but poor cwyers has to think about england (instead of Theriot) every lineup card!
In April 2007 Lou explained: “The kid can swing the bat, and he has some energy. I like the way he plays the game. The problem is, where do you put him?”
by zevkalman on
Jun 8, 2008 3:55 PM CDT
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Seriously, though.
“We” don’t do anything – Lou fills out the lineup cards, and he’s the guy that does things. He couldn’t help but notice Theriot’s drops yesterday, but those are far from Theriot’s biggest problems defensively.
Lou’s had many opportunities to notice Theriot’s lack of range and arm for the position, and it doesn’t seem to bother him. I’d expect to see Theriot out there – and if not, it’s because Cedeno has hit Brad Penny well in the past. (And he has – .333/.500/.333. Which is something Lou cares about, even if I don’t.)
by cwyers on
Jun 8, 2008 3:50 PM CDT
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Ronny's 1-3 vs. Penny, while Theriot is 2-7,
so I’m not a bit surprised if Theriot’s back at SS tonight. However, Derosa is 6-24 vs. Penny, so we might see Ronny at 2B with Mark getting a rest.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 3:58 PM CDT
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Except Mark had a rest yesterday
So he won’t be benched two days in a row with an off day tomorrow.
"Let's not get too giggly." ~Lou Piniella
by JohnM on
Jun 8, 2008 4:17 PM CDT
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Good point.
I fully expect Ronny to sit.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:21 PM CDT
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He might play 3B though
with Cedeno or Fontenot at 2B.
Or 1B for DLee….
With DeRo, you just never know…
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
by DeRoMyHero on
Jun 8, 2008 4:53 PM CDT
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I doubt Rammy or Lee sits with the day off tomorrow.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:56 PM CDT
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Any truth to the rumor that your IQ has to be below 20 to work for ESPN?
"This is why Major League Baseball does not need instant replay, because then every single play will then be reviewed." -- Joe Morgan, 5/18/08, referring to an umpire ruling a Carlos Delgado homerun foul when replays showed it hit the foul pole.
by CubsBall2202 on Jun 8, 2008 3:18 PM CDT 0 recs
That's false.
20 is far too high.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 3:22 PM CDT
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Not all of them at ESPN are schmucks
Gary Thorne for one calls a good game. I know his sport is more of hockey than anything but he’s pretty good.
Jon Miller is OK, he does sound fake on some of the impact plays. It’s simply the utter hatred so many have for his “sidekick” that does in that broadcast.
I’m going all radio tonight. It just takes a few pitches to sync the sound (add delay) to the video.
by blackhawk24 on
Jun 8, 2008 3:27 PM CDT
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Ya the only reason I don't listen to the radio during the game
is because its about a 3-4 second delay between the radio and tv
"This is why Major League Baseball does not need instant replay, because then every single play will then be reviewed." -- Joe Morgan, 5/18/08, referring to an umpire ruling a Carlos Delgado homerun foul when replays showed it hit the foul pole.
by CubsBall2202 on
Jun 8, 2008 3:47 PM CDT
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Ain't first but am actually writing something
My Wolves looked clueless in their own end last night; baseball equivalent: A completely off-balance swing at the plate, or not knowing what the hell to do with the ball once you get it. Though that’s not what necessarily happened to the Cubs yesterday. Guess I have to wait to change that countdown note (currently at 15 down, 1 to go) on my office dry erase board.
The article is about Cuban, since he was on the radio. While he is more visible and outspoken at times, I’d rather have him than good ‘ol boy Canning and Reinsdorf confidant. The fact that Reinsdorf is even mentioned is aggravating. Isn’t he competing with the Cubs for business? Then why does he have a say in how the Cubs sale? Conflict of interest? I know the other 29 MLB owners are to have a say, but this seems rotten. I’m not actually campaigning for Cuban but want him to have a fair shake. The others can campaign too, they just are not doing so at this time.
I’d like to see Levin just because I know how he runs the Wolves.
The Cubs tonight just have to go out and play. Unfortunately, 4 things all happened in the same game yesterday (Theriot dropping that 2-6 SB throw, Aram throwing it away, Fukudome not shoe-stringing it with the glove and Z missing his spot on ONE pitch). Shit happens, now guys go out and have a winning road trip. We’d all like to have seen 5-2 or even 6-1, but it’s 4-3 at best. Just go out and do it.
by blackhawk24 on Jun 8, 2008 3:23 PM CDT 0 recs
I'm not suggesting Reinsdorf specifically should have a say...
.. but as you well know, the MLB owners DO have a collective say as to whether ANY prospective owner is approved. Reinsdorf was mentioned because he obviously knows Cuban due to them both being NBA owners. Sure, the others CAN campaign, but in reality, that’s not a great way to do business, is it?
It seems Cuban is the guy the MSM is campaigning for, and I can guess why. He’d give great quotes in an era when newspapers are in trouble. That’s a really bad reason to want a certain team owner.
I’m in favor of Don Levin for the same reason you are—he runs a fan-friendly operation that does its utmost to be a winner.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 3:42 PM CDT
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I agree with your assessment of the ownership situation. There is something
un-American about owning something an not having control of who you sell it to. Cuban seems like a perfectly good owner to me. If he has the financing in place and the Cubs want to sell to him, I don’t think the other owners have a right to block the sale for personal purposes. This is not like joining a country club. The buyer has rights too and they should be realized.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on
Jun 8, 2008 3:56 PM CDT
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So only Cuban has rights?
What about the other bidders?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 3:57 PM CDT
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Further....
... it is EXACTLY like joining a country club.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 3:57 PM CDT
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I think the point trying to be made is
if Zell finds Cuban’s offer to be the best, then the other owners should approve the deal unless they have legit reasons to block it., which I don’t think they have. Cuban for all his faults, has turned the Mavs into one of the premier franchises in the NBA.
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by DC Cubbie on
Jun 8, 2008 4:15 PM CDT
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My point is...
... that with Cuban being so public, that has raised the assumption that he is the only bidder, or the best bidder, already. That may or may not be true.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:22 PM CDT
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PENNY
Light em up
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip
by Hammer on Jun 8, 2008 3:32 PM CDT 0 recs
Crap.
Cardinals just won.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Jun 8, 2008 3:56 PM CDT 0 recs
As good as we've been lately...
...St. Louis has hung in there, too. Not something I like.
Dan
Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.
by dtpollitt on
Jun 8, 2008 4:00 PM CDT
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Weird.
Have a look at this screencap:
Yahoo thinks Houston tied the game in the bottom of the 8th. If only their boxscore could become reality!
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:04 PM CDT
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yea i saw that too and got really excited, only to check back later
and see that the score had returned to 5-4. i was mildly confused by that
by philadelphiacub on
Jun 8, 2008 4:07 PM CDT
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Yahoo has really had some hiccups this season.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:10 PM CDT
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True,
but they’ve also had two significant injuries to their pitching staff in the past two days: Wellemeyer has elbow inflammation and Wainwright has a finger problem. Also, Ludwick and Ankiel have cooled considerably. It’s just a matter of time until Schumaker does the same.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:05 PM CDT
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Yes
But Carpenter will be up again in a month or so, right?
by salparadise23 on
Jun 8, 2008 4:16 PM CDT
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Who knows.
He threw to hitters a week ago for the first time in a year. That’s encouraging for him, but it doesn’t mean he’s ready to face MLB hitters yet.
by cwyers on
Jun 8, 2008 4:17 PM CDT
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Laruss sais yesterday that there was "no timetable"
for either he or Mulder.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:22 PM CDT
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*Larussa said
gah.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:24 PM CDT
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"No timetable".
Where have we heard THAT before?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:24 PM CDT
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Yeesh.
Too true. Perhaps Duncan should have Mulder and Carpenter tossing towels, too.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:25 PM CDT
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MLB traderumors reporting today
that Mulder could be done. It looks like he needs another surgery. Also, take Bonderman off the deadline list. He had surgery.
by Rick B on
Jun 8, 2008 4:56 PM CDT
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Ryan Ludwig and Rick Ankiel have morphed into very good ballplayers
Get Rich Harden !! 7 starts, 3-0, 41 IP, 49 Ks, 2.61 ERA
by MDBNIU on
Jun 8, 2008 4:05 PM CDT
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Ummmm...
Ryan Ludwick:
Last 7 days: .241/.258/.448
Last 14 days: .208/.250/.354
Last 28 days: .264/.347/.563
Rick Ankiel:
Last 7 days: .000/.167/.000
Last 14 days: .080/.115/.200
Last 28 days: .200/.237/.400
You were saying?
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:09 PM CDT
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oh, sure
STAT-wise. But are they SPARKPLUGS? Are they SCRAPPY? Are they CAJUN NINJAS?
And did they play COLLEGE
Cause, you know, that’s WAY more important.
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on
Jun 8, 2008 4:32 PM CDT
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LOL
Don’t forget that they probably both used to be switch-hitters and that explains every time they have slumps. Failure at switch-hitting is one of the surest signs that you’re actually great despite your stats. If only Juan Uribe knew this secret.
by DGU on
Jun 8, 2008 4:38 PM CDT
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are you kidding?
The entire 1986 Mets were one big Scrap.
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on
Jun 8, 2008 6:14 PM CDT
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Ankiel and Ludwick
are both very streaky players. And while they may be struggling, Troy Glaus has awoken.
Proud President of the Unofficial Skip Schumaker Fan Club!
I don't care about your fantasy team.
by stltrav09 on
Jun 8, 2008 6:49 PM CDT
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The difference between Cuban and the other bidders so far...
...is that Cuban is actively soliciting media coverage, while the other bidders are keeping a lower profile. That’s why the media is mentioning him more; they tend to fish where there are the most fish.
by cwyers on Jun 8, 2008 3:59 PM CDT 0 recs
True enough.
My point is, that shouldn’t define who is the BEST potential owner.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:00 PM CDT
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If Zell has any say the club will go the one with the most green
by cubbierc on
Jun 8, 2008 4:17 PM CDT
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Depends on financing, too.
It’s not like someone just comes in with a wheelbarrow full of cash.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:22 PM CDT
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also depends on selling Wrigley
since he could not unload to ISA
by cubbierc on
Jun 8, 2008 4:24 PM CDT
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Well, not yet, anyway.
That deal’s not 100% dead, but I suspect whoever buys the team will want the ballpark, too.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:25 PM CDT
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They would be foolish not to want Wrigley.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:26 PM CDT
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A lot of dollars will have to go into Wrigley
just to keep it from falling down.Possibly one lost season at the friendly confines
by cubbierc on
Jun 8, 2008 4:30 PM CDT
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Not according to Crane Kenney.
He said in the interview I did with him that they could fix things in an offseason.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:55 PM CDT
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I remember that.
At this point, really, isn’t it just the grandstand and the men’s rooms? :P
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on
Jun 8, 2008 4:57 PM CDT
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No...
... there’s some structural work in the upper deck, especially.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 5:02 PM CDT
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Canning or the Ricketts' family
I would like to see Donald Levin win the bidding too. But I continue to believe the choice will be between John Canning or the Ricketts’ family. I hope and pray it isn’t Canning. I know too little about the Ricketts.
Get Rich Harden !! 7 starts, 3-0, 41 IP, 49 Ks, 2.61 ERA
by MDBNIU on Jun 8, 2008 4:01 PM CDT 0 recs
there are unknowns about many of the potential buyers
that is why I wouldn’t mind Cuban, you know what you are getting. Yeah he will act like an idiot once in a while, but he will invest money in the club and its players
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by DC Cubbie on
Jun 8, 2008 4:17 PM CDT
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You know what you're getting with Don Levin, too.
A local team owner whose team wins championships and who is a lifelong Cubs fan.
And who WON’T act like an idiot.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:23 PM CDT
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Mark Cuban has no shot
Sorry, but the major league owners DO have a big say in who they permit into their cozy little fraternity. There is no way Jerry Reinsdorf lets Cuban into the party. He despises Cuban and happens to be one of the most powerful and influential owners in the game.
The Cuban fans can talk in theory all they want by saying, “yeah but what if Cuban has the highest bid.” Fact is we the public will never no who submitted the highest bid for sure. Surely Sam Zell understands that he has to go with a buyer that not only offers up a very substantial bid but also will gain approval vote by the owners.
Get Rich Harden !! 7 starts, 3-0, 41 IP, 49 Ks, 2.61 ERA
by MDBNIU on
Jun 8, 2008 4:28 PM CDT
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Zell doesn't
strike me as the type of guy to keep his mouth shut. This is all about greed with him. So I think he will want the highest bid. And he will not be happy if the owners block that bidder. That said, I want Levin too. I think he would be the best owner, from a fans viewpoint.
by Rick B on
Jun 8, 2008 4:47 PM CDT
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Proposal....flip Kosuke and Derrek Lee in the lineup
Lee needs a couple days off. When he returns the move should be to flip Kosuke and him in the lineup. At least for awhile.
Get Rich Harden !! 7 starts, 3-0, 41 IP, 49 Ks, 2.61 ERA
by MDBNIU on Jun 8, 2008 4:04 PM CDT 0 recs
you really want the guy with the least amount of power in the everyday lineup
outside of Scrappy to be batting 3rd, yikes.
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by DC Cubbie on
Jun 8, 2008 4:18 PM CDT
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very true
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by DC Cubbie on
Jun 8, 2008 4:22 PM CDT
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Hey!
Do you guys hear? Joba Chamberlain only gave up 2 ER in 4.1.
I hope there will be some coverage of this on ESPN!
by salparadise23 on Jun 8, 2008 4:18 PM CDT 0 recs
Joba Chamberlain?
Never heard of him. Does he throw people in The Saarlac Pit?
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on
Jun 8, 2008 4:23 PM CDT
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LOL
That was headlined at Yahoo “Chamberlain improves in second start for Yankees”.
If a Cub starter “improved” like that, there would be screams to DFA him.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on
Jun 8, 2008 4:24 PM CDT
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