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Pete Rose: Hall of Famer? (POLL)

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I recently went to the Baseball Hall of Fame, located in the wonderful town of Cooperstown, NY.  Walking through, I noticed how truly great of a player Pete Rose was.  However, as we all already know, he betted on his own games, as well as lied about it later on.  Should he be a hall of famer?  I think that 4000+ hits is enough to overlook the betting.  Its not like he cheated.  What do you think?

Poll
Should Pete Rose be in the HOF?
  • He should have been in on his first ballot.
  • It has been long enough. Overlook it, and let him in.
  • No, he broke the rules and he must pay for it.
  • He is an absolute disgrace on baseball!
  • He should have been let in if he had admitted it earlier.

  175 votes | Results

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation, Bleed Cubbie Blue, or Al Yellon, editor-in-chief. FanPost opinions are, however, valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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Elect Him or Ignore Him

I always find it funny when people say that Pete Rose is not in the Hall of Fame. As you say, when you went to the Hall that there are plenty of references to Pete and his accomplishments. Pete has not been ignored in the Hall. But Pete Rose the person did cheat. He did deny it for many, many years. I do not think that Pete belongs in the actual HOF i.e. a plaque.

by Chodes on Jul 16, 2008 11:59 PM CDT   0 recs

He'll get in

as his health begins to fail and gets older…while he made many enemies by betting, he still symbolized many different aspects of the game coaches may only dream of from thier players…also, if anyone is interested there was a good story about rose getting acquainted with A-Rod on espn.com not too long ago…after reading that story and seeing the way banishment has ruined his life, i say let him in before he dies

by sgerring21 on Jul 17, 2008 12:06 AM CDT   0 recs

Banishment ruined his life?

He could have simply TOLD THE FARKING TRUTH to Giamatti when he got caught in the first place and probably just served a long suspension. He was rumored to be close to reinstatement right before Giamatti died. Then ‘you know who’ took the reins, and….well….you know what a fabulous man our current Commish is.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 17, 2008 12:12 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Correct.

That’s what I voted for. Just as in the Clemens situation, baseball fans are pretty forgiving. When Andy Pettitte admitted what he did, people forgave him and moved on. Clemens, since he appears to be an arrogant liar, is being vilified.

Had Rose stood up and admitted the truth in 1989 when all of this was first coming out, my suspicion is that he’d have been given a one or two year suspension (since remember, he was still active in baseball at the time as a manager) and reinstated, and he’d be in the Hall now.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jul 17, 2008 7:51 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

And, by the way

Banishment didn’t ruin Pete’s life, Pete ruined Pete’s life. What you are asking is should mercy be extended. Pete absolutely deserves EVERYTHING that Pete is getting. Let’s not start down the “it’s not my fault, this woman you put here with me, she gave me the apple” road.

by Archie on Jul 17, 2008 11:18 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

They should let him in....

after he passes away.

He’d just try to make $ off his “HOF” status, and his acceptance speech would be nothing short of a joke. The man is a cartoon. I feel sorry for the way he’s wasted his retirement/banishment from the game, but he’s proven over and over what a greedy, selfish, pompous fart-knocker he is. Hey, he and Bud Selig have a lot more in common than I realized!

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 17, 2008 12:09 AM CDT   0 recs

Selig is a used car salesman....

I guess, in todayspeak, a pre-owned car salesman. IF a used car salesman can be the commish, then Pete Rose can be in the HOF….....

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 12:39 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Tis a shame he is not in the HOF........

SOMEONE got all those hits…...

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 12:37 AM CDT   0 recs

He's a first ballot HOFer

Look at his stats. He cheated as a manager but is definitely a HOFer as a player. Butt Selig should reinstate him so they can vote him in. Don’t let him manage again, though.

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. ~Voltaire

by Jettero2112 on Jul 17, 2008 6:22 AM CDT   0 recs

Burn the building down...

rather than let him in.

He is an absolute disgrace. Gambling is the one rule players know they can’t break.

Think of how stupid the average person is, and remember, half of them are stupider than that!

by DaBard on Jul 17, 2008 6:31 AM CDT   0 recs

unless

they’re playing for the team you like, and then, so long as they win, you don’t care, right?

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jul 17, 2008 10:14 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I believe you are looking for

consistancy. You won’t find any here.

by N Oakley on Jul 17, 2008 10:16 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

ah, that's right.

my mistake.

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jul 17, 2008 10:37 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

LSA!!

It’s amazing to me that so many fans don’t understand the depth of what Rose did. There is absolutely no way he should ever have a plaque in Cooperstown.

AND HE AGREED TO ACCEPT THE LIFETIME BAN!!!! In his own form of plea barganing with Giamatti, he overtly accepted the fact that he would not be allowed in the HOF.

But as the original post points out, he IS in the HOF due to his accomplishments. Pictures, artifacts, etc. of Rose’s baseball success are all around the HOF. That’s fine, but don’t raise a plaque in his honor.

"Happiness? A good cigar, a good meal, a good cigar and a good woman - or a bad woman; it depends on how much happiness you can handle." ~ George Burns

by tville on Jul 17, 2008 8:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

LSA to both of you.

You’ve hit the nail on the head.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jul 17, 2008 8:04 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I think

we should burn both these guys points into our skulls. Players engaging in gambling commit one of the worst wrongs…because it endangers the whole sport—not just them or their team.

by StevenABQ on Jul 17, 2008 9:46 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Absolutley True

Betting on baseball by its participants is worse than PEDs. Betting on the outcome of a game fundamentaly changes the way the bettor will play/manage the game.

Betting was ramapnt in baseball around the turn of the century and when the World Series was thrown baseball was right to come down hard so that it didn’t happen again.

I am usually one for forgiveness but in this case, he broke the rules, knew he was doing it and knew the consecquences. Sorry Pete, you were my first favorite player and you played the right way, but you tainted your own legacy. You should be an example for everyone else.

"There are no curses here...Games are won and lost on the baseball field" - Lou Piniella

by El Borto on Jul 17, 2008 8:08 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree.

I think it’s interesting how forgiving of Rose the majority of baseball fans (and baseball writers) are, and meanwhile say the accused steroid guys like McGwire and Bonds have no place in the hall.

Gambling nearly destroyed baseball’s credibility in the early 20th century; there’s no room for it in sports. Just look at what is happening in basketball right now – it will take them years to recover from the distrust that’s causing.

At least we know the steroid guys were cheating to win. Someone who has money riding on a game that they can influence the outcome of has a conflict of interest much larger than that. Rose says he only bet on his team, but his story has changed too many times for him to be believed.

I think the integrity issue in baseball is a little overblown; people only call on it when it suits them. But in this case, Rose’s ban is necessary to ensure the integrity of the game. He has to be made an example of.

by Wreckard on Jul 17, 2008 9:45 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Well said

The point about basketball is spot on. As well as what the integrity issue really is…integrity of the game. People too often think that when you argue that Rose should not be allowed in the hall that it is some kind of moral judgement that a person is passing on his character…it isn’t in my case…its like you said…integrity of the game.

by StevenABQ on Jul 17, 2008 9:51 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

There is no evidence...

...that he did anything as a player but give 100% and help his team win. For this reason and his gaudy stats, he should be in the hall for his contributions as a player.

If need be, put a note by his plaque that he was later banned as a manager for betting on baseball.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jul 17, 2008 7:47 AM CDT   0 recs

If Pete Rose gets in...

... then so should Joe Jackson, because there was never any evidence that he cheated.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jul 17, 2008 7:52 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Agreed.

For my part, based on what they did on the field, I think they both ought to be in.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Jul 17, 2008 7:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Couldn't agree more

in fact, I think he should get in period.

We never give up -- Aramis Ramirez

by Emelie on Jul 17, 2008 8:30 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Completely agree...

...and let’s face it, there is plenty of hypocrisy when it comes to the hall of fame and baseball in general.

Do I think Rose screwed up not coming clean much earlier – absolutely, but that does not change his performance on the field as a player and the fact there is 0 evidence he did anything but compete as hard or harder than 99.9% of the current HOF members.

Why can’t he go into the hall as a player, while still having a lifetime ban from getting back into the game? If the HOF wants to be transparant, give him a plaque for his player accomplishments and add a footnote for what happened to him later as a manager.

I love the sport of baseball, because it passes the test of time better than any other sport. But, the baseball establishment (current and former leadership) really need to get a clue.

To give one specific example; the one thing baseball has going for it, is the true test of the gruelling 162 game season. Like no other sport, the team that holds up over that time period should be rewarded for those efforts. To give WS home field advantage from an exhibition game, that has nothing to do with the 162 game test, just spits in the face of what a 162 game championship season should mean. And, Bud Selig adds to this mess by being a really bad liar.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jul 17, 2008 9:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Joe Jackson...

should be in. As far as I know, he didn’t throw the games, he just took the money.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." - Alvin Dark

by cubs199235 on Jul 17, 2008 9:27 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Absolutely.

both should be in the HOF already.

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jul 17, 2008 10:32 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What part of.............

.............LIFETIME BAN is so hard to understand?

Rose ACCEPTED this as part of a plea deal. Why on earth let him in when he, himself, AGREED to be banned for life?

As for Jackson, if you open that can of worms, Weaver should be up for consideration as well. And based on the comments from Landis at the time, there’s no reason for either of them to be spared of the lifetime ban.

"Happiness? A good cigar, a good meal, a good cigar and a good woman - or a bad woman; it depends on how much happiness you can handle." ~ George Burns

by tville on Jul 17, 2008 10:43 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Weaver wasn't a Hall of Fame caliber player.

Jackson was.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jul 17, 2008 10:47 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

He wasn't, Al, but............

............he would have to get his day on the ballot.

Most of the guys involved, save Jackson and perhaps Cicotte, were worthy of HOF consideration.

"Happiness? A good cigar, a good meal, a good cigar and a good woman - or a bad woman; it depends on how much happiness you can handle." ~ George Burns

by tville on Jul 17, 2008 10:51 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Jackson

and Rose should be in.

"Hey hey, kiss it goodbye! That one's in Milwaukee! Man oh man did he hit it. Isn't that something?" - Lou Boudreau, May 17, 1979

by danimal15 on Jul 17, 2008 11:04 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

banned from baseball

=/= banned from the HoF.

His performance merits it. The HoF, certainly for players, should be based on performance.

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jul 17, 2008 12:24 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

that is incorrect

HOF rules state banned from baseball – banned from HOF

by Shanghai Badger on Jul 17, 2008 2:10 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

they say it NOW

they didn’t say it THEN.

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jul 17, 2008 2:38 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

if I drive a car made in 1959

I don’t have to have seatbelts. Even though the laws say it.

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jul 17, 2008 8:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Wrong again

If the car was built prior to 1965, you don’t need to in Illinois.

Just because you don’t like the rule, it doesn’t mean you don’t have to follow it.

by Shanghai Badger on Jul 18, 2008 8:06 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Agreed, Joe Jackson never was proved a cheater....

If anything, MR. (emphasis added for sarcasm!) Comiskey should have been banned…..I know, someone will say it is the movie that I didn’t finish that blames Comiskey) but Meyer Lansky says the Sox could be bought because of Comiskey’s cheapness…...Since my grandparents and other family were involved in “prohibition”, I trust Lansky over ANY writer of Hollywood movies…...

Let Jackson in, and let ROSE in…..he was a true HOF player…he would NEVER have thrown a game.

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 8:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

+1

n/t

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. ~Voltaire

by Jettero2112 on Jul 17, 2008 8:06 AM CDT   0 recs

No, never ever into the Hall

Pete Rose violated one of the cardinal rules of baseball. A rule that expressly states that those convicted of betting on the game shall be banned permanently.

You don’t turn a blind cheek 20 years after the fact out of sympathy for Rose being a pathetic sad sack in life.

Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!

by MDBNIU on Jul 17, 2008 8:08 AM CDT   0 recs

You are a horse's ass MDBNIU

A blind cheek? Shit, you even mix your metaphors….You are a pathetic sad sack in life. I AM being nice to you, you pathetic, egocentric piece of dog dung…....get a f’ing life….

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 9:00 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Wow.

It’s not just the mountain that’s crazy.

Are you going to reply to every post of his in this thread? Aren’t you just giving him the negative attention that he so desperately seeks?

by Wreckard on Jul 17, 2008 9:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

How many screen names does Charlie Hustle have on here?

By the results it looks like about 50 and counting…

Rose deserves the consequences of his actions…a bitter old gambling addict he can’t even confess without blaming baseball else for not helping him.

Pete Rose gambled on baseball all the way to the present, handicapping that public sympathy and his greatness as a player would prevail over his actions. He lost that bet.

by DudeVf11 on Jul 17, 2008 8:16 AM CDT   0 recs

And, all the steroid guys are still playing....

OR in Bond’s case, the player’s union is suing baseball for collusion in not hiring him…..get a life

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 9:02 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

See, here's the problem:

the driving force behind the overwhelming public sentiment that keeps Rose out of the HOF is this insipid notion of the sanctity of sport.

It’s a fallacy, folks.

There is no purity to this game. There never has been and to insist that there is some pure sports here to be upheld is simply laughable. Baseball players have scuffed, cut, and spat on balls since the game came around; batters have altered their bats since baseball’s inception. Both batters and pitchers have filled their bodies with illegal controlled substances since at elast the late ‘60’s. In 1985, Tim Raines testified that 40% of MLB players were cocaine users. Some, Raines would say, including himself, carried and used it on the field of play. Ken Caminiti suspected the 50 % of MLB players were using some form of PED. The MItchell Report has brought down what was arguably the greatest living pitcher (I said “arguably,” Jessica;-) )

The bottom line is this: this is a child’s game, played by wildly overpaid grown men who will take any advantage they can get. It’s a dirty, just most sports are dirty. Soccer players bribe referees, the NBA has it’s own refereeing scandal, the NFL has turned a blind eye to it’s PED problem, but it’s there. Horseracing has racehorses breaking down because their ankles are too thin from the drugs they are administered….the list goes on, and baseball is no different. Rose broke a rule, and he accepted his punishment; if he makes it to the HOF, however, he only joins the cheats, liars, drug addicts, drunks, philanderers and God knows what elses that are already in there. And when I go there, I walk the halls knowing I’m no better than these guys, and that’s when i appreciate baseball.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Jul 17, 2008 8:47 AM CDT   0 recs

Gary, I often agree with you, but not this time

I’m not advocating scuffing the ball, corking the bat, etc. However, those actions are done in an effort to get an edge over the competition.

Betting on the game opens up the possibility of losing on purpose, which is an entirely different animal.

Again, the rules clearly state—bet on baseball, lifetime ban; lifetime ban, no HOF.

by Shanghai Badger on Jul 17, 2008 8:50 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Then change the rules...

...to allow a player in for past accomplishments (in Roses case as a player). I think most might agree, this is a very unusual circumstance with the issue happening after the players days on the field were long gone.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jul 17, 2008 9:36 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

No, don't change the rules

Rose violated a rule that he had full awareness of. His reckless and harmful action has meant a consequence, and that consequence is permanent ban from baseball. It is a consequence that would be brought down upon any player or coach regardless of their resume accomplishments. If Rose was too stupid and arrogant to understand the consequences of his actions then that is no defense on his behalf. He should never be allowed to step in a major league facility again.

Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!

by MDBNIU on Jul 17, 2008 9:46 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

And, MDBNIU....

according to your arguements, you should be banned from the human race.

Ever hear the expression “Some people are alive simply because it is against the law to kill them”? There is a t-shirt with that on the back.

It is against the law to do the right thing in your case…..man, you are such an asswipe….

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 9:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

You fail also to understand that even if Rose were allowed to be on the HOF ballot

...there is still extremely little chance the BBWOA would vote him in. But again, this isn’t the issue. He should never be permitted back again into baseball and he certainly should never be put on a HOF ballot.

Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!

by MDBNIU on Jul 17, 2008 9:48 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm not saying allow him back...

...in the game, that is his punishment, not being allowed back in baseball which he clearly wants. But, to completely ignore his playing career for something that happened after his playing days is stupid.

On the voting, I think you may be surprised as to how many votes he would get if he was on the balot.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jul 17, 2008 9:55 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

There again, with your total stupidity.....

thinking that the BBWOA had a brain…...they are the same folks that have NEVER had a 100% HOF vote…..YOU are totally brain dead…...it is sad that your parents never had children that lived….

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 9:12 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

LSFA!!!

Well said, Gary!!!

"Please move away from this vector and get into another coordinate pronto. There's no access for you in this quadrant." Mike Donnelly

by McRipper on Jul 17, 2008 9:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Rose broke the cardinal rule of baseball

A rule that is posted in big letters in every clubhouse in major league baseball. A rule that is part of the collective bargaining agreement between the Player’s Union and baseball. A rule that is included as language in every contract a player, manager or coach signs when he is employed by a MLB club. He violated the rule and was proved guilty. He suffers the punishment as a result. A punishment that is expressly stated right next to the rule….permanent ban from baseball.

Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!

by MDBNIU on Jul 17, 2008 9:24 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I can't find a good link beyond Wikipedia

but I thought the permanent ban from baseball was separate from ineligibility from the HOF. I thought the HOF voted after Rose was banned to make those banned ineligible from the HOF.

I always assumed Rose thought he was agreeing to the punishment, but believing the punishment would not take away the HOF.

After Rose’s ban was instated, the Baseball Hall of Fame formally voted to ban those on the “permanently ineligible” list from induction

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Rose

by N Oakley on Jul 17, 2008 9:42 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I believe you're right

As I recall, the HOF did change their eligibility rules after Rose was banned to not allow anyone on the ballot who is banned from baseball. Anyone else confirm/verify?

That’s always been one of my biggest beefs with this whole thing. Ban him from baseball? Sure, if that’s the deal he worked out with Bart, then he has to live with that. But a deal with MLB is and should have been separate from the HoF. Rose never got the chance to be on the ballot. The writers decide who goes into the Hall. If they decided not to elect him to the Hall, I would have thought them to be as big of idiots as MLB, but I could have accepted it better, because that’s the process.

Instead, they changed the process to fit the situation. If you’re not willing to make an exception for Rose to be considered under the present-day rules, I don’t see how you could support making a change (i.e. exception) to the rules back then for Rose’s situation.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jul 17, 2008 10:08 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If correct, it impacts my opinion.

If the HOF changed after Rose was banned, the argument that Rose knew what he was accepting is invalid. It would have Rose accepting a ban from playing, managing, administrating, and/or being affiliated with a team in any way. Accepting that and agreeing to a ban from the HOF would be different.

I would even go so far to guess Rose would have counted on induction to the HOF to clean his image.

by N Oakley on Jul 17, 2008 10:21 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

NY Times article

noting that the HOF changed the rules in 1991, two years after Rose was banned.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CE3DF1F31F932A25752C0A967958260

by N Oakley on Jul 17, 2008 10:33 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If this is the case.............

.............does this mean the Black Sox players were listed on the ballot in 1936? And if listed, the writers at the time essentially kept them out of the Hall?

"Happiness? A good cigar, a good meal, a good cigar and a good woman - or a bad woman; it depends on how much happiness you can handle." ~ George Burns

by tville on Jul 17, 2008 11:01 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Potentially...

don’t have time to research

by N Oakley on Jul 17, 2008 11:03 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The first class was 1936 and they were elected, but I don’t know the ballot rules or if the writers voted. I doubt the rules were as specific of who got on the ballot at that time.

Jackson was dominant when he played, but keep in mind the banishment kept his career total numbers from being comparable to the Cobbs and Wagners of the first HOF classes.

by N Oakley on Jul 17, 2008 11:38 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If this is the case, then it's ex post facto

and I can see an argument for Rose. Don’t have time to check at the moment—in fact, shouldn’t even be posting right now….

by Shanghai Badger on Jul 17, 2008 2:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

However, I would still disagree

The HOF isn’t the U.S. government and isn’t held to the same rules—ex post facto is legal in a private organization.

by Shanghai Badger on Jul 17, 2008 2:32 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The NY Times is not a newspaper....

a newspaper is something that reports the facts…The NYT makes them up as they go along….

The poem fails when it strays too far from the song, and the song fails when it strays too far from the dance ~ Ezra Pound

by crazymountain on Jul 17, 2008 9:14 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Once again, your failure to comprehend

simply nuanced claims, and parse one claim from another, coupled with seemingly bottomless capacity for imbecilic repetition produces another irrelevant, and factually incorrect rant. Well done, Blue Mike.

If you had posted this in reply to my reply to Al, you’d have a point, but here, your drivel complete missed the point. I was making a claim about the fallacious notion of the sanctity of sport, not advocating for Rose to be inducted into the HOF. Apparently, you failed to grasp even that simple, explicit point. No surprise there.

Secondly, if you’d actually read the document, you would see that apart from the “Existing Agreements” article, where the union agrees to abide by all previous agreements between MLB and the MLBPA (which I would assume includes the gambling rule) there’s no specific language in the MLBPA’s CBA concerning gambling.

Thirdly, it’s unclear whether the ban from baseball includes a ban from the HOF.

"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07

by gary varsho on Jul 17, 2008 9:55 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If a player is banned............

...............from MLB, they are not eligible for consideration by the Hall.

Pretty simple. That’s why the Black Sox remain on the outside.

"Happiness? A good cigar, a good meal, a good cigar and a good woman - or a bad woman; it depends on how much happiness you can handle." ~ George Burns

by tville on Jul 17, 2008 10:46 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Gary, I too agree with you almost everytime

However, in response to your post above (and in mortal terror that I am agreeing with Blue Mike) I must disagree. Y