does anyone else think that maybe this wouldnt have happened if they didnt send him down at all?

he was 1-0 with an ERA/WHIP around historical averages at the time of the send down. But Ross is right, his control’s been garbage since spring. The difference between 2008 Rich Hill and 2008 Barry Zito is about $120 million.

Now, if Hill can get on the HGH and start cranking home runs, then I’m all for him going Ankiel. ;)

This is an example of why when things are going very good for a pitcher, you don’t change his friggin mechanincs.

That’s really too bad. Hopefully he’ll get whatever is wrong straightened out and get back to pitching again at the ML level.

Best wishes to you, Rich Hill!

If you haven’t seen my other posts on this topic, or don’t know who Blass was, take a look at his career numbers. Blass was a World Series hero (1971) who had been a solid starter for several seasons. The year after the WS, 1972, he won 19 games and finished 2nd in Cy Young voting.

The following season he almost literally could not throw a strike. 84 walks and 27 strikeouts in 88 innings with an ERA of almost 10. (No, those numbers are not a misprint. What’s amazing is that the Pirates, who won the NL East, stuck with him that long.)

There was nothing physically wrong with Blass - no injury of any kind. It was all in his head. I saw the last game he pitched - against the Cubs on April 17, 1974. He threw five innings and walked seven and threw a wild pitch and again, almost literally could not throw a strike. It was really sad.

I am not a psychologist, obviously, and can’t make a diagnosis. But it appears Rich Hill, who has a reputation for “overthinking”, has succumbed to this. It’s nearly impossible to fix, because baseball people look to fix physical or mechanical problems, not things like this.

The best thing they could do for Rich Hill is shut him down from pitching the rest of the year and have him see a sports psychologist, and maybe he can report to spring training in 2009 ready to go.

It’s really sad.

..... is to admit one doesn’t know enough about Rich Hill. I don’t think anyone will claim Rothschild is the second coming of Leo Mazzone (and even he got dumped in Baltimore, so sometimes all the coaching in the world won’t help), but there’s a reason it took Hill as long as it did to reach the majors. I watched this kid for years at Spring training, and as Al said, he’s not very receptive to coaching. Whether that’s overthinking on Hill’s part, or he’s listening to someone else (like Mark Prior with his dad and Tom House), he’s had this block every time he got to the MLB level. He fell in love with that curveball early on, and once the league knew to wait for it, he would just nibble, nibble, nibble. He’s never learned to trust his other stuff and to pitch to contact. Hence, many strikeouts, but even then, after the middle of last year and especially this year, it was as if it was against his religion to throw a strike. Morever, Rothschild isn’t anywhere near him right now and he’s done nothing but regress.

What’s happened is a shame, because talented left handers can make a fortune in baseball. Hill’s one of those guys, he just refuses to accept that, it seems. That, and trusting the eight other guys on the field. At the end of the day, he’s got no one to blame but himself.

I got his autograph at this year’s convention. I guess you could say I put the jinx on him. As with most of the active players I have gotten at the convention, he took a turn for a worse that very next season. Similar occurences have occurred this year with Pie, Howry, previous year it was Barrett, Before that it was CPat, before that it was Borowski (sp).

So far the only active guys to buck that trend are DLee and Dempster.

I guess you could say I am the cooler when it comes to our border line talent….

Kidding. Someone might take him as a throw in project though. He is of absolutley no value now. What an absolute shame!

Letting him pitch?

Pitching him every 9-10 days and moving him around so much probbaly isn’t helping him either. Let him take the ball every 5 days and figure it out, monster ERA or not. We already know he can pitch in the big leagues, he just has to start throwing strikes again.

Remember, in 2005 / early 2006 Rich Hill was terrible at throwing strikes (though not so awful as he seems to be now). After going to the minors after the Pierzynski game, when he came back again late in the year he was suddenly throwing strikes. Here’s hoping he re-figures out whatever he figured out in 2006.

if he was successfully last year why change his delivery just to hold on base runners. This is the nightmare of possibly ruining a pitcher’s career. But hopefully not, but the cubs management shoulda listen to the saying “don’t mess with something that works.”

And to think, a couple of years ago, Rich Hill was an “untouchable” in trade talks. Damn it.

This is going to sound awful but I think most of you will understand what I’m saying.

I almost wish they’d find something wrong that can be fixed with him physically. That is much easier to fix than if it’s a mental issue,

Yes velocity is good but if I remember correctly in 1999 spring training workouts Kerry was hitting the mid to upper 90s with his fastball but what was causing worries was he couldn’t hit the broad side of a barn, Then he got into a game threw a pitch about 20 feet over a batters head was taken off the field and had elbow surgery a week later.

I still remember that awful weather on that awful spring day and Dave Eanet breaking in on Kathy and Judy to announce Kerry had to have the surgery.

...Hill will be back.

Actually, that’s just hoping.

What doesn’t make sense to me is in amongst all his trouble, he actually had one pretty good start where he went 5IP and only gave up 1 BB. He threw 78 pitches and 47 were for strikes. I wasn’t there but I’m just wondering if he really is that far gone. I’d like to see him go back to AAA and stay there until something clicks. At this point with all the gloom and doom, what’s it gonna hurt?

JUST TO SEE if a new role allows him to think less and throw more. Just an idea…I know I may get flamed but hell, nothing else to do with the kid now.

If it hasn’t already started, that the arm-chair psychologists that all evaluated Felix Pie, will begin strong efforts to diagnose Rich Hill’s mental issues. Seems like its been a little muted…not that I am complaining!

I feel so bad for Rich. Best wishes Rich!!!

A seasoned veteran starter is always fixable, probably mechanical. What he’s most likely doing is dropping his elbow below his shoulder causing fastball elevation and many hanging breaking balls.

Jim Hendry needs to determine if he’ll consider keeping Hill within the organization in 2009. This is because Hill will not be of any use at the ML level for the remainder of this season so they need to determine if it’s worth setting up a long-term plan to try to rebuild him. If they don’t want to keep him around, then they can continue to tinker and yank him around while trying to deterimine if he has any trade value. At the end of the year, if Hill shows no progress and they can’t find a buyer, Jim Hendry can look Rich in the eye, shake his hand, and wish him good luck in finding a new organization. Or Hendry could do that any old time and free up Hill’s roster spot.

On the other hand, if the Cubs do decide to try to rebuild him, they need to set up a long-term plan immediately and then tell Hill exactly what the plan is for the remainder of this season.

There are two recent examples of pitchers that were initially successful in the majors, then completely lost it, but that eventually became quality starters – Roy Halladay and Zach Greinke. In each instance the organization set down and followed a long-term plan to help that pitcher slowly return to the majors. Greinke and Halladay had different problems and the two courses of action were different, so it’s not as if either of their cases can serve as a magic rosetta stone for Rich Hill. Still, it’s clear that constantly tinkering with a pitcher, moving him from level to level, and hoping that he suddenly regains form has not and almost certainly will not work.

So what would be a good long-term plan for Hill? Beats me. I like the idea of sticking him at level for the remainder of this season and letting him work pre-determined relief assignments. That’s not to say I favor converting him into a reliever but, rather, just letting him work an inning or two with greater frequency than he would as a starter. Put him in rookie ball or wherever and tell him he’s going to be pitching there for the rest of the year and if he shows no improvement then worst consequence is a few losses for the AZL Cubs.

Ultimately, I guess that I favor giving Hill time. While some other team might take a flyer on him, Hill just won’t fetch anything of value because his problems are so severe. Still, his past success coupled with his limited service time lead me to believe that it’s worth trying to fix him, even at the expense of a 40 man roster spot. I realize that Hill is 28 years old but that only means you lower your expectations for what he can still become – there’s a chance that he could still be a productive major league player even if he won’t be a candidate to win multiple Cy Youngs. Even if the odds are against a comeback, the outside chance to gain a cheap, league-average, lefty starter justifies using one roster spot…I can’t be optimistic but I don’t want the Cubs to give up.

I had forgotten about Smoltz and his psychologist. Maybe this isn’t a bad idea. Heck the situation can’t get any worse. Call up Smoltz and get the guy’s name and take it from there.

Smoltz is not the first and will not be the last to see a psychologist in the world of sports. I think someone mentioned Grossman is seeing one this offseason on a Bears blog. (hopefully he can teach him navy blue and orange means Bears, Other colors not Bears)

is that he’s shut down for the rest of the year and starts to see a sports psychologist-he’ll probably then be invited to spring training next year and given what will probably amount to one last chance (that is, if Hill even WANTS to try again at that point). If he still shows an inability to throw strike, I think that’ll probably be it for his Cubs’ (and more than likely his baseball) career. A true shame. i really thought about a month into last season that he was on his way to stardom.

Remember when many (including myself) were saying that the only way the Cubs should trade Hill and Pie was if they got Bedard and Roberts back? What a difference 3 months make.

Best strategy probably is to shut him down completely and let him do whatever it takes to regroup. Personal opinion is that the pressure of having a two pitch arsenal - a big curveball and a mediocre fastball - ate Hill alive. He knows if he can’t get the curveball over the plate then it’s curtains. The pressure of having to always get the curveball over the plate obviously has taken a big toll on his pysche.

Maybe his best strategy is to take a couple months off, then somehow figure out an effective third pitch that can lessen the relative importance of the curveball in his repetoire. Much easier said then done.

a matter of philosophy, but I can’t see the value in shutting him down. He’s not hurt. And I think giving him all that time off will just give him more time to think about it. Not too mention, all the side sessions in the world won’t help him throw strikes in a game.

he’s really funny and given the “quality” of most of the analysts today, someone would pick him up quick.