Feast or famine offense of the past decade makes its very ugly return
by MDBNIU on Jul 21, 2008 11:09 PM CDT
92 comments
For whatever reason the feast or famine offense that has alternatively gifted and killed the Cubs over the past decade has made it's return. First couple months of the season it was like watching a brand new ballclub. Taking pitches, working the count, hitting the other way, laying down the bunt, being aggressive on the basepads.... Lots of us pointed to the addition of Kosuke having some magical transformational powers.
But now what? Well, all I know is that going back to a feast or famine offense is sad recipe for major disappointment (again) in 2008. Cubs have got to get back to being a diversified offense. Two things I would do.
1. Coincidence or not neither Ramirez or Kosuke have been the same hitter since the later was moved up in the lineup. Therefore with Soriano coming back lets put Kosuke back in the 5th hole hitting behind Ramirez. Ramirez is the absolute most important member of the Cub lineup. He is our best and most clutch run producer, a title that he has held since his arrival in mid-2003. Getting back to offensive consistency starts with getting Ramirez back on track.
2. Ryan Theriot needs to stay at the top of the lineup. And when I say top of the lineup, I mean leadoff spot. Lets try something bold and put Soriano in the two hole. It's not like Theriot steals bases (or at least should be stealing bases). But he does run well and Soriano would surely see a heavier dose of fastballs given the fact that Theriot is always on base.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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The first pitch swinging................
................is now back to where is “used to be”.
I thought Johnson was only going to need 3 pitches to get through the 5th, but amazingly Cedeno forced him to throw 8 after DeRo and Edmonds hacked at the first offering.
Just one example over the past few weeks of how the offense has been “aggressive” at the plate. Seems like they’ve learned little from their success early on.
The patience is gone and it’s likely to get worse if the team continues to struggle.
"Happiness? A good cigar, a good meal, a good cigar and a good woman - or a bad woman; it depends on how much happiness you can handle." ~ George Burns
by tville on Jul 21, 2008 11:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
It seems like the heat of the race is getting to them a little
Most people have been saying for 2 months that the Cards and Brewers would fade into the sunset. Guess what, folks, they aren’t, didn’t think they would. They both look hungry, especially the Cards. This will go to the last weekend, you watch.
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
by BigJohnAZ on Jul 21, 2008 11:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Coming to a Cubs team near you...
third place in the NL Central!!!
This offense reminds me so much of the 2004 team. All or nothing. Painful. Take some freakin’ walks already!!!
How about first pitch swinging FINES in the clubhouse?
Demp and Rich: proof that people that live in igloos and say "eh" can contibute!
by Canadian Cubs Fan on Jul 21, 2008 11:26 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Okay Blue Mike bashers...
nows where you criticize everything he’s saying…oh right, you can’t!
Demp and Rich: proof that people that live in igloos and say "eh" can contibute!
by Canadian Cubs Fan on Jul 21, 2008 11:28 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.
Yeah, I can’t criticize someone for overreacting to four games. Obviously you can learn everything you need to know about a ballclub in four games. Obviously the first four games to start the season after the All-Star Break are much more indicative of a team’s talent level than the first 95 games of the season.
Remember the start of the season, when everyone freaked out about our slow start? Remember how at the end of April the Diamondbacks had the best record in baseball?
Nobody does remember these things. Everybody, please, relax. This is four games. Four games. Any baseball team can have a few bad games in a row. Any team – good, bad, indifferent.
And you know what? Don’t tell me “they look flat.” Well of course they look flat. Players and teams in slumps look bad. It doesn’t mean anything.
You want to go ledge-jumping? Be my guest. But don’t act like unfettered pessimism is the only rational option available.
by cwyers on Jul 22, 2008 12:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, he couldn't be Mr. Doom and Gloom
after his Harden wish was granted, so now he has to find another bad thing to hitch his wagon to.
Pathetic. Pathetic. Pathetic.
And so are all you other lemmings/bedwetters that agree with him.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 22, 2008 1:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well look who it is....
I would’ve bet a $100, after this brutal loss that I could come here and read a few posts from Not Bruce Froemming about how we shouldn’t feel bad about the loss because we got beat by a good pitcher. Randy Johnson isn’t a good pitcher anymore.
That’s all I ever read from you, each time after a loss you chime in and tell everyone “other teams are allowed to have good players”, and so on.
People handle losses differently, you see what I did there
by TheRamZamDLEE on Jul 22, 2008 1:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's won his last three starts
and if you really read what I said, you’d know I said getting schooled by Johnson is one thing but getting schooled by Brian Moehler is quite another.
If I’m drinking Kool-Aid, you’re drinking Jim Jones Kool-Aid, chock-full of cyanide.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 22, 2008 1:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Goooood one...
Wait, weren’t you supposed to leave us all cause you just couldn’t take the negativity around here anymore?
by TheRamZamDLEE on Jul 22, 2008 1:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just can't quit you
Something about dopey Cubs fans just turns me on.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 22, 2008 2:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I knew it was something
I’m not sure who those “dopey Cubs are”, maybe they’re the ones that resort to name-calling. For someone who preaches positivity, you sure spew some negativity of your own: calling people pathetic, lemmings, and bed wetters. Then you tell me I’m drinking cyanide-laced Kool-Aid. You’re on a roll man, don’t let hold you down.
by TheRamZamDLEE on Jul 22, 2008 2:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is what I meant NBF,
you just needlessly piss people off. There’s no reason for it.
Don't blow it boys!
by Mr W on Jul 22, 2008 2:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just out of curiousity
why do you feel you have to call people names and be so in-your-face anytime you disagree with anybody?
Is this the way you do things in real life too?
by bluekoolaide on Jul 22, 2008 8:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You get what you deserve
If you make a logical, rational argument, then I’ll respect it. If you’re a flying-off-the-handle moonbat, then I won’t. Simple as that.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jul 22, 2008 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I only hope
these four games turn out like the first several games of the season. Time to get on a roll!
Calm down.
by Kinky Reggae on Jul 22, 2008 8:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very well said cwyers.
Carlos Zambrano and Rich Harden. Now that's a pair of Aces.
by sue369 on Jul 22, 2008 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure I can.
but even I can only put up with his f@ckery for so long, then I have to take a break.
I read this last night, and clicked away, shaking my head. You’d think he could find a team that he wants to, you know, actually win. I love it when the Cubs win. Know why? I’m a cubs fan, that’s why.
Of course, I also like it because he stays away from game threads where we’re winning.
Huh. Why is that, do you think?
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I applaud your use of the word "f@ckery"...
...as does Amy Winehouse. Well, she’s too stoned to applaud. But, if she was conscious, she would. Trust me.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
thank you
kind sir. It’s a very flexible word, almost on the level of “Dude”.
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I learned a new word today.
Thanks Drew. :D
Carlos Zambrano and Rich Harden. Now that's a pair of Aces.
by sue369 on Jul 22, 2008 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
where did the walks go
something my dad said on sunday….it kinda looks like someone in the organization made a concious decision that they need to be more aggressive at the plate….i laughed it off after how much we’ve heard about walks being key to this team….but after a couple more games, i’m worried there was some idiot meeting of the minds over the break.
if they keep the approaches from the last 4 games (and a little bit before the break), they will not make the playoffs.
by GreenLantern411 on Jul 21, 2008 11:31 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Blue Mike is right on about everything he's said here
this is starting to get painful. You can just see how much they’re all pressing right now. First game back after the all-star break it started with them hacking away and, if anything, it’s just gotten worse. I’ve thought for a long time that the worst enemy the Cubs have is the pressure they must feel over constantly being reminded of the years of futility. The pressure really seems to be getting to them now. Our middle of the order is pathetic.
Anybody who isn’t worried right now hasn’t been paying attention for the last 100 years.
by bluekoolaide on Jul 21, 2008 11:36 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
oh give me a break
“anybody who isnt worried right now hasnt been paying attention for the last 100 years” thats absolutely laughable. the past 100 years have nothing to do with right now. so the cubs are pressing a little, who doesnt go through stretches like that? theyll get back on track, like normal baseball teams. do you really think aramis will go 0-for the second half? soriano is coming back in a couple days, we have a great rotation. no worries here folks.
Soriano - Dome - DLee - Aramis - Soto. If that doesnt turn you on you're not human.
by kylejo on Jul 22, 2008 7:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Zambrano, Harden and even Dempster
What’s frustrating also is the ineffectiveness and inconsistency of the offense when our best pitchers are on mound. Case in point is tonight. You walk into this game with Rich Harden on the mound and a good sense that he won’t be giving up much of anything. So why then go up there hacking away against one of the all time greatest pitchers in the game in Randy Johnson? Why not try extra hard to manufacture a run or two instead of grippin’ and rippin’ it? Granted this is a major over-simplification to make a point. But the same argument can be made for Zambrano’s starts. Particularly on the road you don’t sit back and play for the 3 run homer when you are throwing a Zambrano or a Harden out on the mound.
Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 21, 2008 11:40 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
grippin' and rippin' it? Really?
cause is seems like…and I’m going to use statistics here, so hang on….the Diamondbacks were the ones “grippin’ and rippin’” tonight.
Cubs Strikeout Total = 4
Cubs HR Total = 0
Diamondbacks Strikeout Total = 10
Diamondbacks HR Total = 1
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 22, 2008 1:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was very surprised
to see that stat.
Then I remembered every fly ball that was hit directly to a fielder…
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It seems like most people stopped reading
after the first paragraph. Yeah, lately the offense has looked bad, but Blue Mike’s points 1 & 2 are both actual constructive ideas, not just woeful hand-wringing. And yes, I agree with both of them, although, I doubt that Soriano will ever be moved from that top-of-the-order spot, much as any of us would like to see it.
"Whoo, boy! Next time around, bring me back my stomach!" -Jack Brickhouse
by Goodie1969 on Jul 21, 2008 11:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
But it DOES make a lot of sense
Here’s where we see if Lou is willing to think outside of the box a little bit.
by bluekoolaide on Jul 21, 2008 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
and he may very well have to try something different. He certainly seems to often have little concern for people’s feelings, just expects them to be professionals, as he should. Stay tuned…
"Whoo, boy! Next time around, bring me back my stomach!" -Jack Brickhouse
by Goodie1969 on Jul 21, 2008 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
im not sure
fukudome as protection for aramis? dont opposing pitchers WANT to pitch to fukudome right now? i would say soto is the best protection aramis is going to get. the theriot point is a good one but i just dont think its at all realistic that sori goes to the two hole so its not really worth talking about.
Soriano - Dome - DLee - Aramis - Soto. If that doesnt turn you on you're not human.
by kylejo on Jul 22, 2008 7:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't watching...
....but from the radio call it sounded like in the later innings the Cubs hit a lot of balls very hard but not quite hard enough. Which isn’t much consolation, to be sure….but it sounded like they were making contact.
In any case, I’ll just agree with the sentiments here…..
"Eighty-five percent of the world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here." - Lee Elia, 1983
"The only thing that bothers me is that I would never want to destroy the love and what the fans of Chicago are to the Chicago Cubs. I mean, God knows. If there's one pure thing in baseball, it is the fans of Chicago." - Lee Elia, 2008
by CaughtInTheVines on Jul 22, 2008 12:29 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
They hit balls hard the entire game.
They just wound up being hit right at people. Plus, Chris Young made a couple of nice catches on balls that might have fallen in.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Jul 22, 2008 4:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Totally agree.
They were making solid contact throughout the game, but every deep flyball seemed bound and determined to land in Chris Young’s glove. I thought Aramis had tied the game on the deep flyball to left in the late innings, too.
I know this is completely irrational, and perhaps even lame, but I just don’t think the Cubs were meant to win this one. I think they tried very hard to win, but it wasn’t going to happen. And I’m not going to wish ill on Randy Johnson, but I really wish he’d retire. I’m sick of seeing his ghoulish, skeletal, spectre-of-death mummified remains own the Cubs at every turn. Just sick of it.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Randy Johnson looks great.....
for the Joe Dirt epilogue. “Joe Dirt, sundamaged.”
PC load letter!?!? - What the f*** does that mean!?!?!
by N Oakley on Jul 22, 2008 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
someday
he’s gonna retire to his hut in the forest, with his overalls, his shotgun and his coon-hound…
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It isn't over yet
.... they’ll turn things around. Lou and Hendry will not let this team fall apart. They’ll get their groove again someway. Besides, even IF… a big IF… we don’t finish first, it appears who gets second in this division will get the Wild Card. If something horrible does happen, and we fall from first, we still have a great shot for the Wild Card. Personally, I do not believe it will come to that. We’re pressing a little… that’s all.
by TheHawkRules on Jul 22, 2008 12:49 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Very good post MDBNIU!
I like your suggestions, but will Lou? Soriano has said, on more than one occasion, that he wants to stay in the top spot. What’s Lou to do? He is a multi-millionaire with a long term contract. What makes any of us think Lou can order him to do anything he doesn’t want to do?
Don't blow it boys!
by Mr W on Jul 22, 2008 1:56 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Lou does
what he wants, because what Soriano has said, on more than one occasion, is that he will DO WHAT LOU WANTS HIM TO DO.
Amazing that it never occurs to people that Lou knows Sori hits better in the 1hole, and therefore leaves him there on purpose. It’s always gotta be the whiney, complaining all-star’s fault…
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is Soriano in the leadoff really still a topic of discussion?
This is insane. The guy is our leadoff hitter. Lou just has to figure out where everyine else goes. I think Riot in the 2 hole and Dome in the 5th. DeRo, Soto, and Edmonds can hit wherever as I don’t think their performance depends on their spot in the order.
Calm down.
by Kinky Reggae on Jul 22, 2008 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I think I swore off lineup discussions...
...sometime back in April. Let’s talk about something fresh, something exciting. Here I’ll start: Ryan Theriot, good shortstop or bad? Go ahead, guys. Have at it.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
this post should've been made after the first two games in Houston
not after we score 9 runs on Sunday and then last night if you actually watched the game you’d realized the Cubs hit 4 balls to the warning track, and had 8 line outs…
they weren’t as patient at the plate because they were getting good pitches to hit and they were hitting them really hard. they just happened to be right at people….
it would be one thing if the Cubs hitters were getting themselves out or if the cubs were dominated by another great SP, but since none of that happened we have to attribute it to a new horrifying approach? Why can’t we just open our eyes, watch the game and realize they hit a ton of balls on the screws that just happened to be right at people
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 22, 2008 7:44 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Ledge jumping Cubs fans make their ugly return
by Wreckard on Jul 22, 2008 7:55 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
And them some.
Carlos Zambrano and Rich Harden. Now that's a pair of Aces.
by sue369 on Jul 22, 2008 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And besides...
I thought it was “better to get a bad streak out of the way now”?
How is it possible to have polar opposite opinions about something within 3 days of each other, and still be wrong both times?
by Wreckard on Jul 22, 2008 7:57 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
utterly hilarious
the difference is this time it was personal!
This time it impacted his boy toy Rich Harden from getting a W, now it’s gone too far
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 22, 2008 8:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're absolutely right
It IS better to get a bad streak out of the way right now. But if you refuse to see the troubling signs on offense after watching this team frustratingly play for the 3 run homer the past 10 years, then by all means bury your head into the sand and say it will be okay in the morning.
Yes, I am troubled by what I have seen from this offense the past few weeks. And I would like to proactively address it ! So shoot me.
Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 22, 2008 8:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because WE
certainly have the power to address it? The Milwaukee bats were cold for a good while there but they have good professional hitters that found a way to work their way past adversity and find themselves in a much better position now. The Cubs have similar professional baseball players that we have to believe can and will do the same. There is still a lot of baseball left people!
Go ahead, Z me.
by tony412 on Jul 22, 2008 8:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No disagreement
Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 22, 2008 8:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
of course not
he was praising the Brewers, and we all know how you feel about them. Fan.
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't say that, you said that
If I was saying something, it would have been reasonable such as “It’s better to not have a bad streak.”
Or if I was talking about last night’s game, I would point out that there was a lot of bad luck there – it was one of those games where we were hitting the ball way harder than the other team, but just through bad luck it was going straight to their outfielders.
I would think someone who used to play would understand that some nights that just happens.
Now if you really wanted to make a case, instead of making broad generalizations and huffing and puffing you’d actually back up your argument with, crap, what are those things called… oh yeah – facts!
The Cubs’ team batting average is down 30 points in July, though that’s more in line with their road numbers anyway (and they’ve had 10 road games vs 5 home games this month).
Cubs team July (avg / obp / ops)
.251 .317 .724
Season to date
.279 .355 .794
Away (season to date)
.254 .325 .715
I’d suspected that we’d been getting a little unlucky but I was wrong (this is why you test your theories….) – our team BABIP for July is .303 so that’s not it either. At any rate the depression for the last 3 weeks isn’t huge and is mostly drug down by their miserable post-All-Star-break performance.
So definitely – our last we’ve been a little slumpy. But panicking now is like hitting the eject button because you’ve hit a little bit of turbulance. It’s not nearly as bad as you’re making it out to be.
by Wreckard on Jul 22, 2008 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Despite what sabermagician Cwyers claims, this isn't reaction to 4 games
Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 22, 2008 8:11 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
right it was a reaction to 1 game
as Wreckard noted above
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 22, 2008 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What it comes down to is that there's always going to be a contingent
of people on this site who can’t wait to jump down the throats of anybody who ever voices any misgivings about the Cubs. I don’t mind the disagreements-as I’ve said before, that’s part of the fun of a site like this. What I don’t get is the anger and name calling. I mean, lighten up-everybodyy here cares about the Cubs-we might disagree but is that any reason to get so angry and personal?
by bluekoolaide on Jul 22, 2008 8:22 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Ive been converted on Soriano's leadoff ability
I think he should stay, afterall he only “leads off” once a game. And with the 7 or 8 guys getting on, especially if we’re down, Id rather have Sorianos power coming up as opposed to Theriots lack thereof.
Im not so sure about Fukudome batting 5th again, I think his struggles have more to do with him hitting a “rookie wall” and the league getting adjusted to him, but he played great in the last game at Houston, and if Edmonds can keep it going, he can protect Ramirez. He just doesnt have the slugging to hit 5th
But the middle of the order does seem to be pressing a bit, which is worrysome (sp?)
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Jul 22, 2008 9:10 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
*
Fukudome doesnt have the slugging ability to hit 5th…but if he doesnt win the Gold Glove, Id be flabbergasted
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Jul 22, 2008 9:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whether or not he has the "slugging ability" to hit 5th...
... it’s clear that he has had success batting 5th.
That said, I wouldn’t move Soto out of that slot. I’d consider moving Fuludome down to 7th.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Jul 22, 2008 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kosuke thrived at # 5 hitter AND the evidence suggest that Ramirez hasn't been the same since the move
Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 22, 2008 9:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What evidence?
Could you explain this more clearly, please?
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 9:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he can't
that would require looking at the statistics, you see…
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Trolls
Do you come here just to troll MDBNIU? If you don’t like him you should ignore him instead of fanning the flames.
by sfoulkes on Jul 22, 2008 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pot meet Kettle
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip
by Hammer on Jul 22, 2008 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kosuke
Hitting # 1, # 2, #5.
AB AVG OBP SLG OPS
Batting #1 50 .260 .362 .360 .722
Batting #2 55 .145 .217 .255 .472
Batting #5 193 .316 .427 .466 .893Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 22, 2008 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, no...
...I was asking for evidence that “suggest[s] that Ramirez hasn’t been the same since the move.”
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
See below
Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 22, 2008 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ha ha...I gotcha using stats.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
MAGICIAN!
burn him.
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just to be fair...
...let me just say that the two ideas you suggest, MDBNIU, aren’t all that bad. Having said that, putting Soriano in the two-hole isnt’ exactly “bold.” IIRC, Lou did it several times early in the season—with less than favorable results.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 9:22 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Kosuke statsaplooza
Overall
340 ABs
.276 BA
.377 OBP
.406 SLG
As # 5 Hitter
193 ABs
.316 BA
.427 OBP
.466 SLG
As # 2 Hitter
55 ABs
.145 BA
.217 OBP
.255 SLG
April, May, June, July…
BA….305, 293, 264, 179
OBP…416, 388, 387, .220
SLG….421, 409, 402, 286
And what’s happened to Aramis Ramirez since Kosuke was moved out of the # 5 hole?
58 ABs
.188 BA
.276 OBP
.458 SLG
Rich Harden Fever, Catch It !!!!!!!!!!
by MDBNIU on Jul 22, 2008 11:05 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You're using stats to back up your opinion. I just peed a little.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 22, 2008 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OMG
thankfully I didnt pee a lil… but I did gasp
"We have a pretty strong belief that we are going to win those types of games. It's our confidence. "--Cubs pitcher Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jul 22, 2008 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, he's dumping numbers.
Anyone can use numbers. Sabermagic is derived from figuring out what the numbers mean.
by cwyers on Jul 22, 2008 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Baby steps, my friend. Baby steps.
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but did this SLG you mention
play college ball?
alright alright that was a cheap shot
The samples are pretty small and I do think ultimately Kosuke makes more sense as the #2 hitter, but given how everyone’s kind of slumped recently injecting some energy by trying something different wouldn’t be a bad idea when Fonzi returns
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 22, 2008 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Daver starts a slow clap...
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it won't last, you know
just like offensively over-achieving short-stops, Blue-Mike will return to mean.
"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08
by drewishdrewid on Jul 22, 2008 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now now
let this man have his moment and when he reverts, we’ll mob his ass. Wait that sounded kinda off…anywho.
Calm down.
by Kinky Reggae on Jul 22, 2008 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
58 AB's is an awfully small sample.
There’s really not much we can take away from those numbers, but it’s something to keep an eye on. Edmonds was protecting Ramirez for a bit when he was hot, and Soto has a couple hot stretches in there hitting behind Ramirez, as well, so I’m reticent to ascribe Ramirez struggles solely to Dome being moved. I don’t know what exactly is causing, and lineup construction could be part of it, sure, but to chalk his struggles up solely to Dome moving up the order would be oversimplifying the cause to too great a degree.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on Jul 22, 2008 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's also been since Aramis had his kid
Maybe we should have him put it back.
by Wreckard on Jul 22, 2008 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Put the kid back?
Nanika Ga Okoru!
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 22, 2008 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Soriano in the 2 hole--LMFAO
GREAT IDEA!!!!
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip
by Hammer on Jul 22, 2008 2:31 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Theriot should stay near the top right now.
I agree. But why would you suggest moving our 2 hitter to the 5 hole and moving our leadoff hitter to the 2 hole to move what would be our new 2 hitter to the 1 hole.
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip
by Hammer on Jul 22, 2008 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
All teams go through these stretches.
It’s a downswing in the offense, not a big deal. It was bound to happen, and now this team just has to ride it out. Getting Soriano back will help, and Ramirez, Lee, and Dome will figure it out. They’re too good at what they do to not come out of this funk.
"I've always felt that starting pitching is the most important part of the rotation." - Joe Morgan, Sunday Night Baseball 8-12-07
by gary varsho on Jul 22, 2008 3:11 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
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