Getting greedy - Imagine if....

by berselius on Jul 8, 2008 8:25 PM CDT Comment 59 comments

We just gave up a pupu platter of prospects to get Harden...but do we still have the stuff to get Burnett? If we could send Cedeno + Marquis + some minor prospects to the Jays we could have a rotation of:

Harden

Burnett

Lilly

Dempster

*makes goggly eyes*

And we still would keep Pie and Vitters, our top two prospects. Of course, we would need a backup SS for Riot, but they are a dime a dozen. Maybe we could get one of their scrapheap SS (who are all suited to be backups anyway). Just so long as we don't get Eckstein back...there would just be too much Scrappy on this team.

H/T to GROTA for first suggesting the idea, thought I would move it over here...

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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Please No...

One injury risk is enough. With Dempster pitching the way he has, I don’t really think we need Burnett.

Marquis ain’t good, but as a #5 he is where he should be.

Greedy would be acquiring another bullpen arm…although as I say that I must admit I do not know much about Gaudin and his potential.

Free Ronny Cedeno

by Kansas25 on Jul 8, 2008 8:30 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

And we have Marshall...

to share that #5…and he’s been pitching decent for awhile.

Free Ronny Cedeno

by Kansas25 on Jul 8, 2008 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Burnett >> Marquis

Even with the injury risk. Subtracting marquis from the rotation would be a big boost for the Cubs, and he loses all value both in trade and to the team if he gets moved to the bullpen

Zambrano viciously attacked a pair of watercoolers for the crime of being within his line of vision. It was a classic battle of man versus inanimate object.

by berselius on Jul 8, 2008 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

almost everyone>>Marquis

for a pitcher who isn’t even doing well this season, I’d rather not gamble unless we pay under value.

by ecbc on Jul 9, 2008 1:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Right now

Burnett can be acquired for a set of used baseballs. He’s pitching terribly.

So yes, we have enough. Why we would want to is unclear.

It's a girl! Born 1-18-08. 2246 PST. 8 lbs. 1 oz.

by Josh77 on Jul 8, 2008 8:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm more interested in seeing if the Mariners want Pie plus something else (Veal?)

for Bedard.

(I think I’m kidding about this.)

I has a blog.

by cwyers on Jul 8, 2008 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

That would be pretty awesome

Bedard has some red flags too, though I take all of the ‘Bedard is a wimp’ talk with Milton’s-Mai-Tai-sized grains of salt. He was injured earlier and I would not be surprised if he still isn’t even 75%

Zambrano viciously attacked a pair of watercoolers for the crime of being within his line of vision. It was a classic battle of man versus inanimate object.

by berselius on Jul 8, 2008 9:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Three Canadians

Maybe Bedard would feel more at home with his fellow Canucks, Dempster and Harden?

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jul 8, 2008 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yet, I'd rather have Bedard than Burnett.

Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager

by northsider on Jul 8, 2008 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What about our buddy Maddux?

Sure, at this stage, he’s about as good as a No.4 or 5, but he’s a great influence for young pitching ( i.e, Marshall in 2006). Besides, who DOSEN’T want to see Maddux give one last hurrah with the Cubs, with a WS run to boot?

Rock Over London, Rock on Chicago!

by Bolsterman on Jul 8, 2008 9:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Also...

The Pads might see some intrest in Marquis or Perhaps a prospect with some upside.

My proposal:
Marquis and Pie for Maddux.

Yea or neigh?

Rock Over London, Rock on Chicago!

by Bolsterman on Jul 8, 2008 9:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

No way

That would be highway robbery by the Padres. Pie is too big of a trading chip to be used on a sentimental trade for the shadow of Greg Maddux

Zambrano viciously attacked a pair of watercoolers for the crime of being within his line of vision. It was a classic battle of man versus inanimate object.

by berselius on Jul 8, 2008 9:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sentimentality-wise

If we can replace Marquis with Maddux without giving up anything major, I would be cool with getting him. But, Marshall is a better pitcher than Maddux at this point

Zambrano viciously attacked a pair of watercoolers for the crime of being within his line of vision. It was a classic battle of man versus inanimate object.

by berselius on Jul 8, 2008 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're Right

but still, I wish he was with the Cubs.

Rock Over London, Rock on Chicago!

by Bolsterman on Jul 8, 2008 10:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Highway robbery for the CUBS

ALMOST ANY deal in which they could trade Marquis and his 13 million dollars owed would
be a good deal. The Padres are VERY cheap and would not have much interest in Pie.

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Jul 8, 2008 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Why wouldn't the Padres be interested in Pie?

I agree that they wouldn’t want Marquis, and Pie for Maddux would be overpaying to a ridiculous degree (Maddux isn’t worth anything more than a mid-level prospect at this point in his career).

But the Padres would be all over Pie – he’s exactly what they need. Keep in mind that they have no center fielder, and there won’t be many available next year via free agency.

by Wreckard on Jul 9, 2008 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

They've had rumored interest in Pie in the past;

I believe there was a Greene-Pie rumor pre-season.

They may have interest in Marquis if we eat salary. I’m not sure. It’s hard for Cub fans to be objective on Marquis.

by DGU on Jul 9, 2008 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You are right

They would take Pie , I just meant we would not have to give him up UNLESS
we are also trying to dump Marquis.

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Jul 9, 2008 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Holy crap, may you never have Hendry's job!

No offense, but YIKES.

Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager

by northsider on Jul 8, 2008 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ok, then consider this.

Instead of giving up a more tradable prospect like Pie, how about Marquis and Veal for Maddux. Hell, lets throw in Jake Fox just for kicks.

Rock Over London, Rock on Chicago!

by Bolsterman on Jul 8, 2008 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just give it up, dude.

Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager

by northsider on Jul 9, 2008 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

get to know our

minor league system first….

veal for maddux = no

by ecbc on Jul 9, 2008 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

get to know Jessica too

who has already explained several times that the cost of acquiring Maddux would be negligible - something equivalent to Cesar Izturis - but even then it would only happen if he told the GMs he wanted to make the move.

''Listen, losing Soriano is no box of chocolates.'' ~Lou Piniella

by JohnM on Jul 9, 2008 4:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

err

you do know that I’m saying Veal is GREATER than Maddux right? The cost of getting maddux is way less than Veal’s high potential as a #2 starter. He’s basically our top pitching prospect now

by ecbc on Jul 9, 2008 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nay X 10

Nanika Ga Okoru!

by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2008 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maddux

is perceived as a good postseason pitcher but his overall record is below .500. And that’s when he was in his prime. Not interested.

"Whoo, boy! Next time around, bring me back my stomach!" -Jack Brickhouse

by Goodie1969 on Jul 8, 2008 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

a pitcher's won-loss record is the worst way to evaluate a pitcher

I’m by no means a sabrematrician, but if you look at his pitching stats, not won-loss record in the playoffs, Maddux was pretty damn good in the playoffs. It’s not his fault his team didn’t score any runs for him.

I will give you that that was when he was in his prime though. I would love to have him back just for the effect he would have on the rest of the pitching staff.

"Dad gum right this games gonna be played under protest. . . I guarantee this is gonna be one protest that's upheld." --Hawk Harrelson, 6/24/07

by RynoHoF on Jul 9, 2008 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Burnett would be cool...

but a left handed stud out of the bull-pen would probably be more useful, and i dont know if we will ever be able to move marquis. considering he is owed about 20 times what he’s worth. On the upside… Marquis is a decent pinch runner, and can lay down a bunt (to be glass half full).

by cubbieson44th on Jul 8, 2008 9:14 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

We're good

I spoke to Cardinals, Mets, Brewers, Yankees and Red Sox fans today. They all agreed Cubs right now have the best rotation in baseball. That even came from a Brewers fan.

Then the Brewers fan made the point that even if Brewers 1-2 might stronger than The Cubs…Cubs players can hit aces…and have hit them hard. No need to be greedy. Just hope our players can be patient at the plate all year.

by ak123 on Jul 8, 2008 9:32 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

No love for the west coast teams?

The Angels, Giants, and Diamondbacks have decent rotations as well. Your point about the Cubs batters being able to hit aces is the real point though – and is the real difference maker.

Zambrano viciously attacked a pair of watercoolers for the crime of being within his line of vision. It was a classic battle of man versus inanimate object.

by berselius on Jul 8, 2008 9:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just remember....

they didn’t hit those west coast aces last October….YES …. this is a different offense (most of the time anyway)

The best defense is a good offense

by kcjones on Jul 8, 2008 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Let's not think October yet

Let’s think how to win more games than Brewers and Cardinals.

by ak123 on Jul 8, 2008 10:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

TODAY......

I think a lot of us BCB’ers will think this team underachieved with anything less than 100 wins….if the Turds and Suds can win more….more power to’em

The best defense is a good offense

by kcjones on Jul 8, 2008 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Even against their aces, we can probably outscore their hitters.

Those are all really, really bad teams.

I has a blog.

by cwyers on Jul 8, 2008 10:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Brewers offense is terrible

Every Cubs starter has a higher OBP than every other Brewers starter except for Soriano.

by IllinoisCubs on Jul 8, 2008 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Cubs have the best offense in the NL

So of course any team you compare it to will not look good in comparison. I think the Brewers offense is decent – Braun Fielder and Hart are great, but Weeks, Hall and Hardy are underperforming.

Zambrano viciously attacked a pair of watercoolers for the crime of being within his line of vision. It was a classic battle of man versus inanimate object.

by berselius on Jul 8, 2008 10:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

hardy had picked it up recently

So far in July (8 games) he’s hit 6 HRs, 11 RBIs and raised his BA by 30 points and his OPS by almost 100 points

by otherones on Jul 8, 2008 10:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hardy's July Line

.571 .613 1.321 —- OPS = 1.934

Yikes – off to a great july

by otherones on Jul 8, 2008 10:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is hardy underperforming

or was he overperforming for the first few months last year? I mean, he’s doing better overall this year than overall last year. He’s already improved, why is he underperforming?

by ecbc on Jul 9, 2008 12:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

omg

are u serious??? underperforming yes but that lineup is stacked and flat out good!!

Dear SBnation, We need our own server here at BCB seeing how its became very slow due to enormous amounts of traffic. P.S. Impeach Bud Selig!!!

by cubsluver22 on Jul 9, 2008 1:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So maybe the Mets have grown tired of Johan Santana?

Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager

by northsider on Jul 8, 2008 11:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Opposite

I would guess he’s tired of them. They don’t give him run support half the time!

by ak123 on Jul 9, 2008 6:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Twins

didn’t much either so he went out there and shut out everyone.

Go ahead, Z me.

by tony412 on Jul 9, 2008 8:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

1. Zambrano
2. Santana
3. Harden
4. Lilly
5. Dempster…..

kidding, kidding

Alan Trammell: Assistant (to the) Manager

by northsider on Jul 9, 2008 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think...

No one has said anything about getting Kevin Millwood from Texas, he was great when he was in the Nat. league, and with the right manager(Lou) he would be tough. What do ya think?

Grant Earnhart

by ernie87 on Jul 9, 2008 3:54 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

More trades for pitchers?

Forget it. I think Hendry’s done dealing. He got a top starter (if healthy) and a solid bullpen arm.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jul 9, 2008 4:10 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

A team can NEVER have enough pitching

That’s a rule from time immemorial. There’s too much at stake for Hendry to be done already. It’s only July 9. He might not do any more deals, but if he has quit answering the phone or making calls, he’s frankly an idiot. And Hendry’s really not an idiot.

Santo Forever!

by BeerCub on Jul 9, 2008 7:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, I can agree with that.

Sure, he’ll answer the phone. But I doubt he’s out there being really active right after making this deal. Will he listen? Of course.

But this deal solidifies the pitching staff in a way, I think, that the Cubs don’t NEED to make another move.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jul 9, 2008 8:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

If Maddux wants to be here for the WS win

we have nothing stopping him from being our 4th starter (ahead of Lilly).

by DGU on Jul 9, 2008 7:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He'd be the 5th starter but no problem

You never have to worry about ego with him. The problem though remains A. Marquis. B Marshall
Lou HATES Marquis but his contract makes him untradeable. Lou loves the lefties. Per above
and MANY other posts if Maddux wants to leave and Hendry can convince Lou it is a good idea the Cubs are not going to have to give up much to get him because it won’t be a trade it will be a favor for a friend from both Hendry and Towers. With Murton gone I would say maybe Cotts or some decent young reliever in Iowa. I just don’t know all the players that well. I think it would be funny to make it Ceda but I doubt Towers would see the humor in it. Anyway one servicable reliever plus at PTNL or something like that. If this keeps coming up I will post my VERY long theory on how to get Marquis out of the way to make it happen which I sent to Al yesterday morning before the Harden trade.

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Jul 9, 2008 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Interesting stuff.

OK, maybe I could see the Maddux thing happening then. Perhaps Wuertz and PTNL? I must say, a rotation of :

1. Big Z
2. Harden
3. Dempster
4. Lilly
5. Maddux

Now that’s the feel good hit of the summer.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2008 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gah, that brings up bad memories of shattered expectations for

Prior
Wood
Clement
Zambrano
Maddux

We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look.
Ronald Reagan

by snley on Jul 9, 2008 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

inxay on the emoriesmay!

The tragedy that was 2004 is trying to RIP

''Listen, losing Soriano is no box of chocolates.'' ~Lou Piniella

by JohnM on Jul 9, 2008 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Um and WHO stayed healthy in that rotation ?

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Jul 9, 2008 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

True...

...but maybe third time’s a charm (for Maddux, that is)?

Nanika Ga Okoru!

by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2008 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not Wuertz

They will want somebody young. Not like they have much hope this year.
I think the whole thing is remote but basically things may happen before the deadline
so you never know.

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Jul 9, 2008 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree.

I think Hendry is done, too. This team is pretty much as good as it’s going to get and, let’s be honest, Hendry doesn’t have all that many bullets left to fire. He’s done what most of us here have been clamoring for – brought in a frontline starter (at a huge gamble, but…) and bolstered the bullpen. Sure, every major league team can always get a little bit better. But, for now, I think Hendry is ready to go to war in the second half with the army he’s got – and so am I.

Nanika Ga Okoru!

by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2008 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Take with grain of salt

Marquis
ONEDEC
Wuertz
Random position prospect of their choice not named Pie or Colvin. (Maybe we can convince them Andres Torres is 20 not 30.

for

Greene
Maddux

They get the SS to “replace” Greene, a starter (who we’ll have to eat salary for), their set up man for when Bell is the closer next year and some other hoo ha that the Padres can develop into a guy who can’t hit.

by jbertram on Jul 9, 2008 11:19 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

only

if we can somehow guarantee that Greene starts. There’s no point in trading that package for Greene & Maddux if Theriot is still in the lineup to ground weakly into right.

"We expect to win. We go out to win. So we're just living up to our own expectations." Derrek Lee, 5/29/08

by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2008 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs