Edmonds flipping the bat? Blowing off reporters?
by DaBard on Aug 9, 2008 6:59 AM CDT
Email
PrintThe story also says that Edmonds told two St. Louis reporters, "I'm (bleep) done with St. Louis"
If all this is true...
I...freaking...love... it.
For too long, Don Tony has tried to paint players who dare leave as horrid traitors. Now, his childish acts are coming back to haunt him. The St. Louis media is acting as if Edmonds killed their kittens, slapped their children and ravaged their wives.
Edmonds was never a Cardinal. He was a Cub waiting to happen.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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I think he enjoyed being a Cardinal until near the end...
Towards the end, things went sour. He and La Russa did not part ways on good terms. I’d guess that that’s why he’s (bleep) done with the Cardinals.
LaRussa seems to have a habit of
ticking off his star players. Kinda odd that Rolen, Pujols, and Edmonds have all had a beef with him at some point or another. I can only hope that he drives Pujols out of there too!
Kwa...Ki...Sur...Pee...Nee...Ku?
If I were Albert,
I’D do the driving. LaRussa’s driving record – not so clean.
CRAFTY BEAVER!!!
by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2008 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well done sir!
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
Word around StL is
that TLR is really PO’d that they did not even try to make any moves. If the seaon ends up going down the toilet, many believe he is likely to walk at years end.
"I still don't know what happened"- Fergie Jenkins on '69
by tommy veryzer on Aug 9, 2008 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
that would be fine with me.
give oquendo a shot!
"I wouldn't be a part of any club that would have me as a member" : Groucho Marx
by Dave Pendleton on Aug 9, 2008 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions
He's been threatening that for years...
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
I don't think the new GM would mind.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
I suspect LaRussa's headed to Cincinnati this offseason.
The Baker experiment is clearly a failure. With Jocketty in charge, IMO they’ll buy out the last two years of Baker’s deal and hire TLR.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Why in the world would he want that job?
The guy is an ass IMO but he is a “winning” manager. That place is laden with problems. Some young talent yes but not a winner anytime soon I don’t think.
Kwa...Ki...Sur...Pee...Nee...Ku?
'cuz it's Jocketty
the two of them would probably be married by now if that was legal in Missuori.
But still, i can actually see La Russa taking the Cinci job, they got the kind of young players he likes to groom, and the kind of depth in the farm system that he loves to trade away.
But Larussa
has a WS ring, he is getting older, and he has said before he has considered retirement. The Reds are not a win next year team the way the Cubs were when Piniella decided to come here. They have years of work before they will contend and I am not sure TLR has it in him…Jocketty love or not.
Kwa...Ki...Sur...Pee...Nee...Ku?
by Kinky Reggae on Aug 10, 2008 9:17 AM CDT up reply actions
Don't forget Ozzie Smith
Mr. Cardinal, who LaRussa pissed off and drove into retirement.
To be fair to LaRussa though, Ozzie was done by the time LaRussa took over the Cardinals. But Ozzie was not happy with the way LaRussa treated him.
Borowy . . .Sutcliffe . . .Harden?
by Josh Timmers on Aug 9, 2008 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Hmm LaRussa pisses off another one of his star players.
Like Kinky Reggae said he has done it before. It started with Ozzie Smith years ago. Him and Rolen never really liked each other. Him and Pujols had their little spat after the All Star game last year.
I think its a lot like Belcheck (sp?) of the Patriots. Damn fine coach/manager, but an awful person who very few people actually like on a personal level. Which would explain why those two are best friends.
Missouri Tigers 2008 Cotton Bowl Champs
Edmonds will always be a Cardinal
As well as he’s doing and as much as he has done for our team, I still can’t like the guy. He’ll always be a Cardinal in my eyes. I’m sorry, I wanna like him but I just can’t.
I hope he makes a game saving catch in the World Series.....
....just for you. Dude, the guy is a Cub. Hustles, plays hurt, multi-homer games, wins games, good clubhouse guy, says all the right things. What else do you want!???
He is a Cub now, and a good one. End of story.
Good Guys Wear Blue
And his attitude in the clubhouse
was everyone’s biggerst concern – it was all “He’s a prima donna, he’s a loner, etc.” He has shown that he is a good teammate to his players here. Maybe he just needed a change of scenery.
CRAFTY BEAVER!!!
by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2008 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions
While I'd like any play...
to win the World Series, my guess for most fans would be for Kerry to strikeout whoever on a nasty 0-2 slider. Geo grabs the ball, and no nonsense like the Red Sox gives it to Kerry for a while who then gives it to the team/hall of fame.
Huh?!?
He was an Angel first, why won’t he always be an Angel?
"Why does that man drop his club before he runs? I would bring it with me." ~Stewie Griffin
I know he was an Angel first
but I’ve seen him so much in the last 7-8 yrs I think of him as a Cardinal.
Uh why can't you like him now?
Atlanta game did it for me, and this war he is at with STL right now. He said himself yesterday that he “is f$%$@#$ done with the Cardinals.” So lets forget him as a Cardinal.
Missouri Tigers 2008 Cotton Bowl Champs
he just basically
beat them single handed yesterday. What more can he do?
Our 2008 Chicago Cubs -- FINDING WAYS TO WIN!
by drewishdrewid on Aug 9, 2008 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions
We cheer a team.
A TEAM. Now, I can understand not wanting to cheer a player because he’s not a good human being, or cheats to perform better, but refusing to cheer a guy on your own team just cos he was a member of your biggest rival? That’s stupid.
make/art
by neverAcquiesce on Aug 9, 2008 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions
I can still dislike him and root for him.
In fact I really dislike the guy ( per previous posts this has NOTHING to do with his being
a Cardinal and everything to do with his crappy hitting and fielding with Padres and Maddux in April) but when he is a Cub I will root for him.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2008 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
are you of the opinion
that he was intentionally tanking for the padres and your beloved maddux??
the pink hat guy is my father
I never said I wouldn't cheer him on.
I didn’t really like Sammy, but still cheered him and the team on.
you didn't like Sammy??
in ‘98?? the corked bat didn’t happen until June ‘03.
the pink hat guy is my father
We cheer for the 'laundry.'
Jerry Seinfeld
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 9, 2008 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Lee was a Marlin
in 2003. Get over it.
My fiancee and I had this argument when it looked like Favre might go to the Bears. She said the Bears wouldn’t want him because “he is the enemy”
I said, “If Pujols wanted to be a Cub, I’d drive him to the airport myself. If Urlacher wanted to be a Packer, I’d offer to mow his lawn.”
Rivalry is fine. Winning is better.
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
...and our getting edmonds
...is why i like the cubs now better than the bears.
let’s look at their positions in may
in a vital position (qb/cf) that we have had limited success at for about fiddy years, we have the guy we ‘really want’ to make it (grossman/pie) and a guy who is a good clubhouse guy/scrappy/overachiever (orton/reed).
a guy bacomes available who has humiliated us time and again at that important position (favre/edmonds). to bring him in may admit that our hope for the future was a pipedream.
what happens?
lovie smith: ‘we like our guys. we don’t need him.’
piniella/hendry: ‘he could help us win some games. sign edmonds.’
chicago fans support their teams. i’ve been critical of the cubs ignoring their minor leagues before. but with the apparent lack at ss (and cf in the future, maybe) hendry will do anything ti win this year, even if it means demoting pie and trading eric patterson.
while similar...
they’re not exactly the same. It would be different if the Packers had released Favre and then the Bears made no play for him but they didn’t and you knew they weren’t going to. Especially with the chances that his first choice was Minnesota and second was probably Chicago.
I still don’t understand the “don’t trade within your division” phobia many GMs have and again chalk it up to the information era where everyone gets ripped for every move. If you honestly think you’re team is better trading player X away for players Y and Z then it shouldn’t matter. If you see X again, great, but if Y and Z help you beat them then what does it matter?
nor is edmonds
in the same category as favre by any stretch.
but the cubs are trying to put the best team they can on the field. and making transactions along those lines.
many organizations (and the cubs have been there) are willing to put ‘any old kind of a team’ on the field.
what if the cubs had dealt for a centerfielder in 1969 for joe decker, ken rudolph, or somesuch?
Let's hate a guy
For doing his job really well. And that’s exactly what he did as a Cardinal. Now he’s working as hard as he can for the cubs. If anything, we’ve learned that Edmonds is a true professional in baseball.
wow hatred that deep......
when he has done everything accepted of him and then some. You entitled to your opinion but for me it’s so much more fun watching him do good against the Cards. I view it as he’s come over from the dark side.
"We've had our ups and downs, but as long as you have a reason, something to fall back on and a plan, that's all there is to it," Soto said.
by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 9, 2008 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I repeat: I never said I hated him.
Are you kidding me? I loved watching him destroy the Cards yesterday. Good for him, the Cubs, and his personal vendetta.
Wow, didn't expect so much negative reaction
I never said I hate the guy. I know he’s played great and was an amazing pick up on Hendry’s behalf, but I can’t have a personal opinion on someone? I don’t really like Cedeno, but he’s been more than an incredible bench player this season.
You said you can't like him
How are we supposed to react?
Root for the name on the front, not on the back. You’ll be happier.
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
It's because I root for the name on the front...
that I’m happy he’s on the team overwhelmingly filling a huge hole.
root for the laundry
not random individual millionaire athletes that go from port to port
the pink hat guy is my father
why do you "dislike" so many Cubs?
Sosa (in ‘98)? Cedeno? What’s not to like?
the pink hat guy is my father
I hope he does make a game saving catch in the WS.
That would be great to see, and would mean we make it to the WS. I don’t want any more from him. He’s played stellar.
that is such a silly viewpoint to have
your post subject says it all:
Edmonds will always be a©ardinal
uhhh, no, he’s a Cub. do you live your life like this, refusing to deal with or even acknowledge actual facts, or is it just sports?
and please do not capitalize the c in cardinals. ; )
the pink hat guy is my father
La Russa
His results speak for themselves. It is his team against the world and if you are not on his team you are against it.
I am certain Edmonds will see some chin music today or tomorrow, more likely today and probably middle of the game…depending on the situation. With Z on the mound La Russa will want to see if he can get Z out of his emotional control and the Cubs.
Trouble is I expect the Cubs to be wary of this and let the game speak for response. If the Cubs win today, especially a big offensive game look out tomorrow as La Russa will try to change the momentum and tune and make it hot.
What people don’t understand is Tony is about his team winning. And I enjoy my team winning. Lou knows this also. It will be a tense game today.
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
If a ball comes near Edmonds
We need to hit four Cardinals.
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
We need to be the bigger team...
... and not start a beanball war. Do you want to get some of our important guys suspended?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
You're right...
I was angry. Two Cardinals would be fine :)
Seriously, though, I don’t think the team should just roll over to a division rival and say, “Throw at us at will.”
LaRussa has made a career of ordering bean balls and acting the victim when someone dares to retaliate.
And let Howry do it. We can afford to lose him for a game or two.
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
i don't like tony either but
i’ve been watching him for about 10 years and i don’t think he orders up bean balls, seriously.
sometimes i wish he would. if he does it’s very seldom.
"I wouldn't be a part of any club that would have me as a member" : Groucho Marx
by Dave Pendleton on Aug 9, 2008 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions
You need to read
“Three Nights in August” by Buzz Bissinger (aka the author of Friday Night Lights). It follows a three game set between the Cubs and the Cardinals from 2003 from the Cardinal POV (with many TLR moments). There’s a huge section all about LaRussa making the decision to bean a Cub (can’t remember which one though).
Tony LaRussa amounts to a great baseball mind who cannot manage his players. As noted above, he seems to piss off his stars frequently. Furthermore, in a clubhouse frought with alcohol problems (Spezio, Hancock), he shows why he belongs at the helm by himself picking up a DUI. If I had been Edmonds as a Cardinal and seens that, I would lose all respect for him.
Jim Edmonds deserves an “attaboy” and a slap on the back for wanting to be ”^**$%# done” with the Cardinals right now. A great franchise is being tarnished by a drunken, crass manager.
"Hey! If the moon were made of ribs, wouldja eat it? I know I would!"
I did read Three Nights In August.
I didn’t say he NEVER did it. I just said seldom.
But I agree with everything else you said.
"I wouldn't be a part of any club that would have me as a member" : Groucho Marx
by Dave Pendleton on Aug 9, 2008 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree
The White Sox were the victims of a one sided bean ball war last week. A KC player essentially took exception to being hit with the bases loaded and charged the mound, I don’t know the ramifications but it could hurt the Sox in a pennant chase.
The critical thing to understand is that major-league pitchers don't appear to have the ability to prevent hits on balls in play. There are many possible reasons why this is the case, and I don't really have a concrete idea as to why it is.
But the one thing I do know is that it is the case.
--Voros McCracken
And Ozzie went nuts...
But the ump did apologize for throwing White Sox out, so that makes me think there were no suspensions…
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
I think Ozzie was suspended two games
but it may have been for bumping the ump
The critical thing to understand is that major-league pitchers don't appear to have the ability to prevent hits on balls in play. There are many possible reasons why this is the case, and I don't really have a concrete idea as to why it is.
But the one thing I do know is that it is the case.
--Voros McCracken
Right, there were no player suspensions...
... but why take the chance?
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
Have Howry throw it.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
If a pitch hits Edmonds
Geo knocks the next one out of the park.
That’s how you get revenge.
make/art
by neverAcquiesce on Aug 9, 2008 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions
And then you throw at the next guy's ribs...
If the Cardinals do this, they must be told that it is unacceptable. The worst a suspension will be is 2 games. The message will last a lot longer.
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
But I still see no reason for the Cardinals to start it.
Edmonds wasn’t showing anybody up. And it’s a travesty if you get plunked for hitting two homeruns.
With out lineup, though, I’ll take the baserunners if they wanna give em to us.
make/art
by neverAcquiesce on Aug 9, 2008 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions
that's baseball
if you kick our hindquarters long enough, we put one at your earflap.
I think...
you see what the situation is. Obviously Zambrano shouldn’t do it. But I think if it happens and the game is at hand one way or the other, you go get Pujols right in the back or ribs. You NEVER let guys throw at you. Leave it to Howry or someone to peg him. But you go after their biggest horse.
Its funny, you spend most of your life gripping a baseball. And in the end, its almost always the other way around.
How about
a Cubs win with no beanball shit. Kick their asses. Thatll piss em off.
"Hey.....Cubs win!!!" ---Harry
"Swung on belted!!!"---Chip
Yeah,
obviously you want to win. But having the back of your teammate isn’t crap. At all. Thats having that swagger everyone wants the Cubs to have. You never leave you teammate out to dry. Ever.
Its funny, you spend most of your life gripping a baseball. And in the end, its almost always the other way around.
Absolutley
I’m not saying you gotta kill a guy or even hit him. Drop the plow at the plate. Slide a little late into second. Throw behind Albert. Something that says “Hey. We’re not letting you push us around.”
Its funny, you spend most of your life gripping a baseball. And in the end, its almost always the other way around.
i sort of agree with this viewpoint
as well as the “lets not start a beanball war” viewpoint. it is a delicate balance, which is why it’s the subject of such controversy and lore.
the pink hat guy is my father
i'd rather have marmol or harden or someone
snap of a silly breaking pitch right in a cardinals eye, making him hit the deck and dropping in for a strike (or at least just a normal inside breaking ball)
the pink hat guy is my father
You don't really mean that, do you?
In the eye?
I’m sure you don’t really mean that.
I’m never in favor of throwing at a guy’s head.
Ribs, Back, Butt, Thigh….that’s all that’s needed.
"I wouldn't be a part of any club that would have me as a member" : Groucho Marx
by Dave Pendleton on Aug 10, 2008 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Especially considering....
How Juan Encarnacion’s career came to an end last year…
by mattisnotfrench on Aug 10, 2008 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions
I think he means
one of those nasty pitches that comes in high and tight but moves in on the plate and the bottom drops out. Those pitches tend to alarm batters because at the moment when they first se it out of the pitcher’s hand, it looks like it’s coming in face-high. Halfway to the plate, it still looks face-high. The understandable reaction to such a sight is to duck and cover, so when it catches the corner of the zone, they look foolish. Though they may never have been in any real danger, this type of pitch tends to piss hitters off, precisely for the reason that they look silly diving out of the way of a strike. I doubt he was advocating headhunting…that’s only funny in one place:
"Why does that man drop his club before he runs? I would bring it with me." ~Stewie Griffin
On good thing about Dusty
is that he didn’t take any shit from LaRussa.
Borowy . . .Sutcliffe . . .Harden?
by Josh Timmers on Aug 9, 2008 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
H*ll yeah
I remember the infamous shot of Dusty screaming across the field from the dugout:
“F_ you too, Tony! F_ you!” One of my favorite moments from that series, except obviously for taking four of five from them…
"Why does that man drop his club before he runs? I would bring it with me." ~Stewie Griffin
Edmonds will be remembered as a Cardinal
but right now he is a Cub, a damn good one. I just think he wants to avoid the media/La Russa BS storm, not necessarily separate himself from what he did for the Cardinals or Cardinal fans. I never loved Edmonds before he put on a Cubs uni, but can you really think they would be where they are today with out him?
The critical thing to understand is that major-league pitchers don't appear to have the ability to prevent hits on balls in play. There are many possible reasons why this is the case, and I don't really have a concrete idea as to why it is.
But the one thing I do know is that it is the case.
--Voros McCracken
He's been cold to chicago reporters too for bringing up his ex-cardinal past too
The critical thing to understand is that major-league pitchers don't appear to have the ability to prevent hits on balls in play. There are many possible reasons why this is the case, and I don't really have a concrete idea as to why it is.
But the one thing I do know is that it is the case.
--Voros McCracken
You can't blame the guy.
It’s akin to Mark Hamill promoting his next project and only being asked about Luke Skywalker.
make/art
by neverAcquiesce on Aug 9, 2008 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions
That's a fair point...
Hamill gets irritated too, though.
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
Or asking Susan Sarandon
about the Rocky Horror Picture Show. :-)
Borowy . . .Sutcliffe . . .Harden?
by Josh Timmers on Aug 9, 2008 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't care where Edmonds is playing...
I’m a big fan of Edmonds. He’s close to the best if not THE best CF we’ve ever had here.
He’s a team player and was always scandal free and good in the clubhouse. What’s not to like? I’m glad he went to the Cubs. Wrigley is taylor made for him and he still has some gas left in the tank. Good for him! Shame on Tony & the St Louis media.
"I wouldn't be a part of any club that would have me as a member" : Groucho Marx
Shame on Tony & the media
I’m impressed. Most Cardinal fans don’t grasp that Tony and the St. Louis media are one and the same. He’s got his own little p.r. service working there.
Pluto will always be a planet to me!
NIce
“Edmonds was never a Cardinal. He was a Cub waiting to happen”.
Only thing is, Edmonds metamorphises lasted a little to long. But hey, man he has done one really nice job for the Cubs. That is the bottom line.
"You can't take life to seriously, you don't get out of it alive"
I personally dont even remember him with the cards anymore...he is a Cub through and through
"Okay, just so I understand it...in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil."- Jim Halpert
You know,
we were all saying he is done, and now, I love him to death. One of my favorite players on the Cubs right now. And he should be batting fifth, always.
My new life, my new world, and my beautiful daughter:
Tamia London Davis: Due date (8-11-08)!
Speaking about a potential beanball war
Remember when Derrek got thrown at and didn’t look at the pitcher but turned to LaRussa, pointed his bat at him and told LaRussa off? I loved that.
The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.
Temporary phenomenon
The “feud” between LaRussa and Edmonds is vintage LaRussa. It’s been this way with lots of his ex-players. But when playing days are finished they always come around to being best buddies. Edmonds will forever be associated with the Cardinals, and for good reasons obviously. When his playing days are over his relationship with the Cardinals will be patched up and he will become ambassador for the ballclub ala Ron Santo, Billy Williams and Fergie Jenkins are with the Cubs.
I personally doubt it. Just read Bernie's column today in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch
Cards fans are beginning to look at Edmonds as someone who has turned into someone “blowing kisses to his adoring blue toadies” and has turned himself into one of the enemy.
That's only true if you equate "Bernie M" with "Cards fans"
Which would be the same as saying “Jay Mariotti = Cubs fans”
My next sig line quote will also be from Lou Piniella, and the first word will be either "Look", or "Listen", followed by a comma.
If he helps the Cubs win a World Series
I think he’ll be remembered as a Cardinal AND a Cub.
Our 2008 Chicago Cubs -- FINDING WAYS TO WIN!
by drewishdrewid on Aug 9, 2008 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions
He just reminds me...
Of Gary Gaetti. Except he’s a better player.
by mattisnotfrench on Aug 10, 2008 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions
i agree to a large extent
but it is possible that if Jimmy plays an important role in winning the WS for the Cubs, he would always be remembered for that instead. and for good reasons obviously.
the pink hat guy is my father
OK, Carlton Fisk played more games
for the White Sox than for the Red Sox.
But most people in MLB seem to identify him with Boston, evn though Fisk has kissed and made up with Jerry R.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 9, 2008 10:49 PM CDT reply actions
Jimmy being Jimmy
these guys can do whatever they want when they are performing well individually and winning as a team.
you play. to win. the game.
the pink hat guy is my father
Jimmy will always be a Cardinal
but I think since he has played in Chicago against the Cubs for so long he understands the importance of ‘winning now’ from the fans. Although if the Cubs make it to the playoffs and Edmonds hits a historic homer or hit you never know.
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