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Reflections On The 2008 Season

Before we move on to the Division Series against the Dodgers -- and I'll have some thoughts on that posted either later today or tomorrow -- I thought it would be nice to take a deep breath, a few steps back, and think again about this remarkable baseball season we have just experienced.

I've renamed the box on the right sidebar that contains the Cubs' record in their best seasons, that I've maintained on a daily basis since May, "Most Cub Wins In A Season". In the entire 133-season history of the Chicago National League Ball Club, this year's 97-victory bunch won more than all but eight of the previous editions. Of those eight, seven of them won pennants and the other one, the 1909 team, won 104 games and finished second (and likely would have also won the pennant, which would have given them five straight pennants, if Johnny Kling, their fine catcher, hadn't stayed home in Kansas City all year in a contract dispute). There is no doubt that this is the best Cub team in decades, likely since the 1935 Cubs won 100.

The 2008 Cubs led the NL in runs, and by a substantial margin: 855 runs scored; the next-best teams, the Mets and Phillies, tied at 799. They led the league in doubles, walks, OBA and SLG. They finished tied for second (with the Brewers) in ERA, and second to the Dodgers -- and this will likely come into play starting Wednesday -- in fewest runs allowed. They lost six in a row once, and apart from that the longest losing streak of the season was four. They had winning streaks of nine, seven, six and three five-game streaks. Their mission now is to win eleven of the next nineteen.

We all have our memories of our favorite games, performances and players this season. Personally, I love this team. There isn't a single player on the 2008 Cubs that I dislike -- although I'd prefer that Bob Howry not make the postseason roster, I think he's a standup guy who's doing the best he can, it's just not good enough. So to end this brief review, a few notes on how pre-season (or pre-POSTseason, if you are inclined to do so) analysis or looking at early-season performance isn't necessarily the way things are going to turn out.

  • When the Mets traded for Johan Santana, many in the mass media ceded the NL East, the playoffs and the World Series to the Mets. I asked, "Yeah, Johan and who else?" Santana did have a fine year for the Mets; he won 16 games and led the league in ERA. But despite his clutch shutout on the season's penultimate day, the Mets will be watching the playoffs on TV for the second year in a row.
  • When the Diamondbacks started the season 21-9, many of you here were worried that "those great pitchers" would once again shut down the Cubs in the postseason. I said, "They're not that good." They weren't. Despite picking up Adam "Me See Ball, Me Hit Ball Long Way" Dunn, the D'backs finished ninth in the league in runs scored and had to sweep their final series vs. the Rockies just to finish over .500.
  • When the Tigers started 0-7, I pointed out here that no team that had started that badly had ever made the postseason. I said, "They're done." Many of you disagreed. Turns out, they were done. They managed to squeak to three games over .500 on July 23 (55-52) and to within 5 games of first place, but have gone 19-35 from that day to today, when they will visit the Cell to try to deny the White Sox a tiebreaker game tomorrow with the Twins. You can bet Freddy Garcia is going to want to beat his former team and Ozzie Guillen, his close friend.

Speaking of the makeup game today, it is the first such game played since 1973. I posted this in the recap thread from Saturday's game; if you missed it, here are the circumstances surrounding the 1973 Padres/Pirates makeup game, courtesy of Mike Emeigh of SABR:

In 1973, the Mets were 81-79, the Cardinals were 81-81, and the Pirates were 80-81. The Mets had two rainouts with the Cubs to be replayed at Wrigley Field, while the Pirates had a single game to make up with San Diego. Had the Mets lost both games and the Pirates won their game, there would have been a three-cornered tie for the NL East title. As it turned out, the Mets defeated the Cubs in the first game of the scheduled doubleheader to clinch the division, while the Pirates were losing to the Padres. The scheduled second game of the Wrigley Field DH, being no longer necessary, was cancelled.

To expand a little on that, the two Mets/Cubs games were rainouts that had occurred on the season's final weekend, when the weather in Chicago was dreary and cold, but the Mets were already in town. The Pirates/Padres game had been rained out in April, and San Diego had to make a special one-day trip to Pittsburgh, much as the Tigers have to do today. The 1973 Padres were a terrible team; they lost 102 games, but their win that day helped to deny the Pirates a shot at a tiebreaker.

This has been a fascinating and joyful baseball season, filled with marvels. May those marvels thrill us as Cubs fans for four more weeks.

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Best Cubs Team I've Seen

I’ve never seen a Cubs team with as good a starting rotation as the 2008 club. There aren’t any big holes in the lineup unless you count Dome in the second half of the season. Marmol and Wood provide the best 1-2 punch I can remember the Cubs having in the bullpen. I think this team is a little better than the 1984 club. Let’s hope the 2008 team does better in the playoffs. I sure am glad there can be, at most, 2 games, not 3, in California in this Dodgers series.

"The big possum walks late." - Harry Caray

by memphiscub on Sep 29, 2008 8:45 AM CDT   0 recs

Comparison with 1984.

That was a terrific team. This one has a deeper rotation, a FAR better bench (I mean, Tom Veryzer was the backup SS) and a much better bullpen.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 29, 2008 8:48 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The fact that the Cubs were able to field a competitive team

against two of the NL contenders while using backups bodes well for the post season. This team is extremely deep and if the pitching holds up they should go deep into the playoffs. Ted Lilly performance in September is extremely positive. To have a #4 starter perform like he has is almost unbelieveable. He is a real luxury. Big Z is probably our 4th best pitcher and he threw a no-hitter 3 starts ago. I can’t wait till wednesday.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Sep 29, 2008 8:56 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The '84 bench may have been weaker but I'd sure like to have the '84

versions of Bosley and Hebner to pinch hit.

My main fear is that Cubs are built more for 162 game success and not 5 game series success. I agree it’s amazing to have such solid number four and five starters but that’s more important over a season, not in a five game series. The starters don’t go deep enough into games and the bridge to Marmol is weak and creaky at best. I imagine Lou and Hendry have thought about taking Gaudin out back of the ballpark and shooting him for the “accident” that injured him.

If they can get past the five game series I like the Cubs to go to the WS.

by the nth on Sep 29, 2008 9:47 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Weak and creaky? Marmol is one of the most dominating relievers in the

game right now. It’s funny how we can be so tough on our own players. We expect them to succeed every time and if they don’t, they suck. Take a poll of how many managers would take that weak and creaky arm over what they have in their bullpen, you would be surprised.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Sep 29, 2008 9:54 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That wasn't an insult to Marmol

“the bridge to Marmol” would be those who come in before him (and after the starter)

by GoCubbies34 on Sep 29, 2008 9:59 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

My mistake, I misread it.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Sep 29, 2008 10:02 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

There' no room for politics here

but it is sad that Howry was once for it, but now he’s against it.

Join the BCB Flickr Group: http://flickr.com/groups/bleedcubbieblue

by tony412 on Sep 29, 2008 10:11 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

AGREED....

Never been so excited for the playoffs to get under way!! This year’s team has easily been the best Cubs team of my lifetime and I am ready to watch it continue on!!

All things great in 2008!!

All things great in 2008!!

by By Santo's Grace on Sep 29, 2008 8:46 AM CDT   0 recs

Reflecting on Howry

Did any of the past Cubs teams with great records have someone who sucked as bad as Howry on their playoff roster?

by adam316 on Sep 29, 2008 8:50 AM CDT   0 recs

If they did, he probably never saw the field.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Sep 29, 2008 8:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Couldn't Lou find someone better to put on the roster

So they can never see the field just to make us all feel better? Because I am very nervous. Lou has continuously given Howry the perfect opportunities to blow games for us all season long, and I am seriously concerned that this trend could continue in the playoffs.

by adam316 on Sep 29, 2008 9:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I would go with Wuertz. I know he has a tendency to walk people when he gets under pressure,

but his slider can be nasty and he can get a big strikeout. He has good velocity now and I would take a flyer on him. He certainly wouldn’t be worse than Howry and he usually doesn’t give up home runs.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Sep 29, 2008 9:29 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd go with Angel Guzman.

He throws hard and has good breaking stuff. Yeah, he lacks experience, has been oft injured and could get lit up just as easily as Howry but, used judiciously, he’s a (relatively) young, fresh arm.

The Chicago Cubs: 2008 Central Division Champions

by dat cubfan daver on Sep 29, 2008 10:47 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Angel was looking nice the other day

hopefully Lou looks to the ‘hot’ arm

Cubs Karma: Don't take anything for granted.....

by Andre Fonseca on Sep 29, 2008 11:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Hopefully

but I doubt it :(

"Pounding sand since 1982...."

by cubswynn on Sep 29, 2008 11:04 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes.

The 1984 Cubs had Dick Ruthven. Ruthven had gone 6-10, 5.04 during the season and should have been left off in favor of Rich Bordi, who had thrown much better during the season and was better suited to bullpen duty.

But no. Dallas Green had liked Ruthven from the Phillies days and wanted to reward him with a roster spot. He never did pitch in the NLCS; the Cubs could have used Bordi during that game 5 meltdown.

Sigh. Let’s hope Lou comes to his senses before the roster is made official.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 29, 2008 9:10 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

well last year's Red Sox team had their own Howry in Gagne and won it all

2008 Cubs: Who needs nine innings, when you only need a 7th?

by Chanman25 on Sep 29, 2008 6:21 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Best season in my lifetime

and this season is only beginning. Round one is over, three rounds to go. I’ve enjoyed every day of this season and I’m looking forward to enjoying October even more!

Now if I just get tickets to the NLCS…………….

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Sep 29, 2008 8:52 AM CDT   0 recs

Except for the sixty year-olds around here

We can all make that statement. And honestly, the Cubs really were only that good in 1945 because so many of their players were 4-F. So really, anyone who isn’t in their seventies can make that claim.

Happy days, happy days.

by Josh77 on Sep 29, 2008 12:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That's a misconception Josh.

VE Day was in early May, (7th & 8th), and most MLB players that left to serve were either already back in uniform for the beginning of the ’45 season, if not soon thereafter. Many of the players that served in WW II were stationed state side playing baseball for military teams as well. Not all that served in the great war were state side though; for one example, Bob Feller was at Iwo Jima.

Many men in that time didn’t go to war, but not all of them because of a 4F designation. Some had brothers in the service and were prevented from sending all male children of service ago to war, (so as to not leave the parents without at least one son at home). Some of these men were simply deemed too old to serve in the capacity in which they were needed.

My father, (too young to serve by a year & a half, and with his only older brother in the Pacific Theater), attended 2 games of the 1945 WS at Wrigley with his father. My dad, (80 yrs. old now), was, and is a die hard Cubs & Sox fan, as his father before him. My dad has told me many stories about the 1945 Cubs, which featured many good players. Among them; pitcher(s) Claude Passeau, Hank Borowy & Hank Wyse. Infielders Phil Cavarretta, Stan Hack & Lennie Merullo. Outfielders like Andy Pafko, Peanuts Lowrey & Eddie Sauer. The ’45 Cubs were managed by Charlie Grimm, (no slouch of a manager).

Make no mistake, there were a number of 4F designees in MLB at the time. However, the Cubs were good that year, because, well… they were good. They had 98 wins against 56 losses, (a .636 clip). They also had the WS title almost in their hands, before losing game 7, by a score of 9-3. According to my father, and my grandfather, the 1945 Cubs were one of the best teams in the Major leagues in the 40s, including 1945.

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 9:04 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Old fans talking

My father turned 81 yesterday, 63 years ago he was going to Loyola U in Chicago via the old North Shore RR and was able to attend a number of WS games.

We talked about this team since he later became a Am. Legion Manager and I played to HS. we both lamented that Judge Prentice Marshall was not alive for he was also big Cub fan and once the competitor for Commissioner of Baseball.

This year’s club has by all aspects enveloped the personality and approach to the game from their Manager and Bench Coach. Both Piniella and Trammell played the game correctly, pitch by pitch and situation by situation. This is why they suddenly changed their offensive make up to the plate and walked—-taking pitches and attempting to gain a situational advantage both at the plate and game on.

Trammell played one of the steadiest gloves at SS the club defensively for the most part does that. What people fail to really understand is that getting an out is so big and giving another team 4 or 5 outs in an inning is killer. What the club added when they got Edmonds and Johnson were two gloves in the OF and also two guys that complimented each other. I have to say that Theriot is not Ozzie but he sure holds his own.

As for pitching we both agreed that if Dad were the manager that the Cubs need to win on the mound especially against the Dodgers. Dempster will do well, and Piniella will have a quick hook with Z…..Marquis will be ready early. We will not see Howry unless there is a real blowout either way, what we will see is a lot of Samardz, Cotts, Marmol and Wood, they throw strikes and get outs.

We both agreed when challenged this year situational situations this team responded. In fact look for DLee and Ramirez to have big games unlike last year. We both agreed Lee wore down and another rest will move his warning track power to over the wall.

Also figure that Edmonds might have a couple big contributions thumbing his nose at the Cards and Padres.

This team should make it to the WS—-period and Piniella’s no nonsense will prevail. Finally the guy who might be a situation hero could be Fontenot who is a better hitter than Walker every was.

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Sep 29, 2008 8:55 AM CDT   0 recs

Trammell

should be in the Hall. He was pretty much an equal to Ryne Sandberg throughout his career. Maybe if he hadn’t gotten jobbed in the 1987 MVP voting (George Bell? What were they thinking?) he’d be getting more consideration.

by Josh77 on Sep 29, 2008 12:12 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I completely agree.

Disposable dixie cup drinkin... I'm hiding out in the big city blinking...

by N Oakley on Sep 29, 2008 1:17 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Me too.

I watched both Trammel and Lou Whitaker play a lot of years in Detroit. As with Ron Santo, there is no doubt in my mind that ALL of them belong in the HOF.

Trammel and Whitaker were great in their own right and together, they were quite something to watch. Offensively, defensively, they did it right. They respected the game, their teammates, their opponents and each other.

Quite simply, the embodiment of the HOF in my mind.

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE! (#13031 on the Cubs season ticket waiting list...)

by Zeke on Sep 29, 2008 2:00 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Good morning everyone.

It’s almost my favorite month of the year, (October), my birthday, the leaves are changing, MLB post season, FB getting into full swing… This is going to be a great year. Bring on the Dodgers! Don’t worry about Manny, they can pitch around that fool. I hope they make him try to field his position. Soriano is a not a good OFer, but Manny isn’t much better, he doesn’t have the arm that Soriano has. The only one thing I don’t like is that the Brewers are the Wild Card. It doesn’t bother me, I didn’t care if they played the Dodgers or the Mets. It’s the NLCS I’m concerned about. If the Cubs have to face the Brewers in the NLCS, it will be unfair, the Cubs beat them in 161 games, (162 for the Brewers), and then they would have to face them again, just because they were the best SECOND PLACE TEAM! Does anyone really think that either the Mets or the Brewers deserved to be in the post season- they are both poor teams, who are incomplete, held together by band aids. Please MLB, get rid of the Wild Card now.

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 9:00 AM CDT   0 recs

-1

I don’t think Manny is a better fielder than Soriano and I completely disagree about the Wild Card.

But yah, BRING ON THE DODGERS! They were my preferred opponent in the playoffs and they don’t scare me one bit.

"Pounding sand since 1982...."

by cubswynn on Sep 29, 2008 9:04 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The only reason I think Manny might be a better outfielder...

is that he came up playing the OF. As far as the Wild Card. How much sense does it make for the Cubs, (or any team for that matter), to play hard all year to win their division- only to have to beat the second place team in the playoffs, again! The Brewers should not be given the opportunity to beat the Cubs again, they didn’t win the division. I hate that Selig instituted a way for a losing team to actually continue into the postseason. (I mean that they didn’t win their division, not that they didn’t have a winning record.) They shouldn’t be called the wild card, they should be called the best of the losers…

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 9:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

And yet...

… the Brewers had a better record than the Dodgers. So the only reason they are “losers” is that they were arbitrarily assigned a different division than LA.

This system isn’t perfect, but it has produced some memorable postseason ball.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 29, 2008 9:32 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Not to mention the Dodgers

have a worse record in the WORST division in baseball, while the Brewers played in arguably the best division in baseball.

"Pounding sand since 1982...."

by cubswynn on Sep 29, 2008 10:04 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

what would they have done

had they still be in the AL (which I think is where they belong)?

Set the Stats-back machine, Wilton!

Why, they would have won the AL Central division, pushing the White Sox completely out of contention, and keeping Boston in the WC slot.

"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella

by drewishdrewid on Sep 29, 2008 10:18 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Someone brought up an interesting point on WGN yesterday

If the Indians had kept Sabathia, they might have won the AL Central, and the Brewers wouldn’t be in the playoffs.

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Sep 29, 2008 10:19 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

rarely

does one guy make such a big difference. Think the Indians are kicking themselves right now?

"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella

by drewishdrewid on Sep 29, 2008 10:20 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Maybe

I think they have to see how the return players pan out.

If you’re the Tribe GM this morning, you have to tell yourself that you acted on the information that you had. That’s all anyone can do.

But yeah, it’d be hard not to wonder at least a little bit.

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Sep 29, 2008 10:21 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Strange but true.

CC Sabathia made his first start for Milwaukee on July 8.

The Indians had the 2nd-best record in the AL from July 8 to the end of the season. They very well might have won the Central if they had kept him.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 29, 2008 10:25 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Possible

but don’t forget, they got a treasure trove for Sabathia from the Brewers (LaPorta is going to be very good) and even with Sabathia, it seems hard to believe that the Indians could have competed with the Rays, Angels and Red Sox in the playoffs.

But we’ll never know, I guess.

by Josh77 on Sep 29, 2008 12:15 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

They probably believed

they were gonna suck the 2nd half as much as the first half. CC also pitched out of his mind with so much on the line for him personally. Wonder if the Indians will be players for him in the offseason.

The amazing thing for me is that from the Brewers perspective, making the trade for him worth it came down to a couple innings there at the end. If they lose yesterday and the Mets win, it was all for nothing.

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by tony412 on Sep 29, 2008 10:24 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Not for nothing --

They’ll get two compensatory draft picks if they don’t keep him.

All in all, it was a decent gamble for the Brewers.

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Sep 29, 2008 10:25 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

So, if the Cubs hadn't used Howry yesterday...then getting CC would have

not helped the Brewers, and the Indians would have won…and…wow, the Butterfly Effect!

"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.

by zevkalman on Sep 29, 2008 10:25 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Howry

just ruins everything.

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by tony412 on Sep 29, 2008 10:28 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That's why I've always liked the wild card system.

When there were no divisions, then only the best team from each league made it to the World Series. Once divisions were established it was inevitable that a # 2 team in a strong division would be left out of the postseason. Instead a division winner with a worse record would get in. The wild card corrects that inequity. It was maligned, like other innovations, due to the NFL. There, a wild card usually has a slightly over .500 record. But after seeing it work and produce champions, I think most have come to realize the value of the wild card in MLB.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 29, 2008 11:23 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The value of the wild card?

You’ve got to be kidding me. Once divisions were established, it was inevitable that a #2 team would get left out of the post season? Of course it was inevitable, they didn’t win their division! If Bud really wants to make it equitable, then they should do away with divisions, set it up geographically, and then the top 8 teams make the play offs- just like the NBA. The wild card really doesn’t correct anything. It was created by Bud, because of his expansion gone wild, (he didn’t have the cojones to contract anyone), and also for money. No one can convince me that a second place team deserves to go to the post season to potentially have a chance to beat their division winner, when they already had 162 games to try to win the division.

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 12:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That 2nd place team deserves it as much as a first place team with an inferior record.

They don’t control that another team in their division has a better record. If the object is to have the better teams make the postseason, the wild card contributes to that.

By the way, in any divisional system, it’s also possible for the # 2 team to beat the # 1 team in their region even though they didn’t beat them in the regular season. And in the NBA the winner of a division always makes the playoffs, regardless of how their record compares to other teams. Divisions in baseball are geographically divided, too. The difference between MLB and other sports is that there are only 2 wild card teams in total. That’s why is not as easy to make the postseason in baseball as it is in the NBA or the NFL.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 29, 2008 12:23 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

They don't control whether another team in their division has a better record?

That doesn’t make any sense at all. If they beat the other teams in their division more head to head, (i.e. the Cubs & Brewers), then they most certainly have control over whether they have a better record than another team in their division. If the Brewers took all the games that they played against the Cubs this year, they would have won the division. They have direct control over whether or not they have a better or worse record, (every team does), by virtue of playing a 162 game schedule and by beating that particular division foe more head to head. It’s really rather simple…

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 12:32 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yawn.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 29, 2008 12:34 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yawn right back.

I know I’m a traditionalist, and that no one on here agrees with me. (Well, I do know of one person on here), and many in the circles that I run in. Indeed, I have a book half-written regarding Bud Selig that encompasses this & his sad reign as commissioner.

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 12:38 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I haven't said it for months now...

and I’m stopping now. Everybody loves the wild card!!!

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 12:53 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Satisfied, SWL?

"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.

by zevkalman on Sep 29, 2008 12:59 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

TWSS

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 29, 2008 1:01 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

No, no, no.

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Sep 29, 2008 6:23 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

As a traditionalist

should MLB go back to no divisions and the best team in the AL faces the best team in the NL in the WS?

The Wild Card should not be eliminated but there should be a “penalty” for being the Wild Card team. I think it was Mike Scioscia who first advocated that the first game of the 5-game NLDS should be played in the Wild Card’s home while the other 4 should be in the division winner’s home. This gives the division winner the advantage they earned.

Football and basketball are just things to do between baseball seasons.

by MetsSuck on Sep 29, 2008 1:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Not necessarily.

If a team beats their division leader but loses against everybody else, but meanwhile the division leader wins more consistently against others, the division leader will have a better record.

You logic is more against any kind of playoffs. Any playoff system carries within it the risk of a team with the better record in the regular season not making the World Series.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 29, 2008 12:35 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That would be correct if the schedule wasn't set up with playing...

division foes somewhere between 16-19 times a year, depending on how many teams are in your division. In your scenario, the “division leader” wouldn’t likely be the leader, due to the fact that they lose more to teams in other divisions. It’s logic & simple math. My logic is not against any kind of playoffs. My logic is simple, they played the teams in their division more, and could not win their division. They were second place.

With all this said, I know I won’t win anyone over to my logos regarding this. That’s ok though. I’m steadfast. People can like it, or dislike it. Cest’ la vie.

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 12:43 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm talking 2008 NY Yankees, for example.

They split their season series with Boston (9-9). Yet they finished behind Boston because the Red Sox played better against other teams.

The Yankees also won the seasons series against Tampa Bay (11-7). But the Rays won the division because they played better against everybody else.

In summary, the Yankees played better against the leaders of their division. But their record is not good enough to make the playoffs.

And Boston had the 3rd best record in the AL. Surely they deserve to be in the postseason over those other teams that didn’t win as many games. It is not the Red Sox’s fault that they play in the same division as the Rays.

by Fraggin Judge on Sep 29, 2008 1:02 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Al,

They weren’t arbitrarily assigned to any division, they hardly could have been assigned to the West! So, in fact, the only reason that they are the best SECOND PLACE, LOSER OF THEIR DIVISION team; is because the Cubs proved it over a 162 game schedule. That’s it.

Jimmyeatworld

by Jimmyeatworld on Sep 29, 2008 12:01 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Right, but the point is...

… ANY second place team COULD have won.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Sep 29, 2008 1:56 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I think you are a bit off about the wild card Jimmy. The wild card has given one team a shot to

make the post-season if they have a really good year and the first place team has a great year. It has kept interest in the races late into year and I think that is a good thing. As far as us beating them again, if we are the best team then we should beat them. We will have home field and all things being equal, we should prevail. If we can’t beat them in a seven-game series, we don’t deserve to make it to the WS. If we had been the wild-card team, I don’t think anyone would be advocating turning it down. These are the top 4 teams in the NL. The tounament starts now and may the best team win it.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Sep 29, 2008 9:36 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs