Carlos Zambrano Update
670 The Score is reporting that Carlos Zambrano will be having an MRI on his shoulder tomorrow.
If you ask me this sounds like June all over again. Z has the MRI, Z misses 15 days and then Z comes back and dominates.
Hopefully the MRI is just precautionary which I really thinks it is. Better that he wants it checked and is being cautious rather than trying to tough it out and lose him for certain in the playoffs.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, editor-in-chief (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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Ugh
But apparently if he goes down, Marshall will take his slot. My question, why not Gaudin?
"Check the magic of a winning season and there are always reasons beyond the talent." Ned Colleti
by wrigleyrocker12 on
Sep 3, 2008 4:55 PM CDT
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why Guzman?
too bad Hill never recovered this year…..funny how an injury can unravel the best laid plans.
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on
Sep 3, 2008 4:59 PM CDT
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Well since Gaudin is having back problems
he doesn’t sound like a good option.
by rlpete on
Sep 3, 2008 5:47 PM CDT
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OMG!
Theriot, Fonty, and Johnson = The Scrappy Pyramid of Victory
by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on
Sep 3, 2008 6:53 PM CDT
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Gaudin was a great spot starter for the A's, right?
But as someone said, the back problems might preclude him.
by AceCubbie on
Sep 3, 2008 7:46 PM CDT
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What's wrong with Sean Marshall?
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 3, 2008 9:23 PM CDT
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Nothing
I’m just saying that Gaudin had a sub 3.50 era with the A’s as a starter.
"Check the magic of a winning season and there are always reasons beyond the talent." Ned Colleti
by wrigleyrocker12 on
Sep 4, 2008 7:44 AM CDT
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My bad
His ERA was 3.59. Close enough.
"Check the magic of a winning season and there are always reasons beyond the talent." Ned Colleti
by wrigleyrocker12 on
Sep 4, 2008 7:45 AM CDT
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marshall...
…..has yet to prove he can be a consistent starting pitcher….i think he’ll be a decent replacement for the time being, however i think people will be more appreciative of marquis after this
by cubswynn on
Sep 4, 2008 7:56 AM CDT
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My one problem with Marshall pitching
Is that the last two years it seems like he just doesn’t get run support. Granted there has been little run support the last few games but that’s been the case for a lot of Marshall’s starts.
He went into the 7th, 8th inning in a few games last year but had little run support. Hopefully that can reverse in Cincy…
by ak123 on
Sep 4, 2008 8:14 AM CDT
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I have a bad feeling..
that the news after this next MRI won’t be so encouraging.
I’m staying optimistic, though.
My vote would be to have Chad Gaudin inserted into Zambrano’s spot for the sole reason is so we won’t have 2 pitchers [Lilly, Marshall] that are pretty much the same.
DeRosa: And who is the best and who is the worst card player?
Dempster: I think the best is yourself. [ . . .] I think the worst player is D-Lee. I think he bets every time just to bet.
by EJThunder on
Sep 3, 2008 5:02 PM CDT
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Im sure Lou wants two lefties if he can
Reed Ballgame - best CF in the MLB
by californiachicagoan on
Sep 3, 2008 6:08 PM CDT
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Well considering he didnt show up for it today..........
Hopefully tomorrow when it’s rescheduled he does go so that the Cubs can figure out whats wrong with him physically.
"A catchers biggest concern behind the plate is to make his pitcher pitch a little better than he can" Roy Campanella
by Madison Cub Fan on
Sep 3, 2008 6:08 PM CDT
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So what does this mean?
What could be ruled out from a Doctor visit?
What sort of thing does an MRI look for?
by ak123 on
Sep 3, 2008 5:07 PM CDT
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I'll try to help...
…the doc would run him through a series of movements to try and detect what is triggering the pain. If he can narrow down a certain movement that causes discomfort, these guys are real good at determining what muscle structure, ligament or tendon is causing the problem.
What the MRI will show that a physical exam can’t – the specific location of any tissue inflamation, tearing and the degree in which it is disturbed. With this said, shoulders can be tricky and MRI’s have been known to miss stuff that is going on, but it’s more than likely they will have a high degree of confidence how long he is out after those results.
One thing I question is why he didn’t get it done today. It could be because the doc detected fairly signifcant inflamation in the shoulder and an MRI will reveal more after that swelling subsides. Several hours of icing between now and tomorrow could get that accomplished. It also could be that his exam was very straight forward and he was able to pin point (with a high degree of confidence) what the issue is, and they didn’t feel it was critical to get the MRI today.
This thing could go a whole bunch of different ways. At the minimum, I would bet the Cubs rest him for a week or so, or it could be more significant and cause him to miss a longer period of time. You just don’t know until you get the facts and find out how he feels in a couple days.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on
Sep 3, 2008 6:42 PM CDT
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Zamrano
Visited the doctor, was supposed to take an MRI today, the exam is incomplete and there is no info according to Lou. When asked if in pain, Lou said you could ask him since he hasn’t talked to him.
Question Asked
Is it the should or elbow?
Lou says Zambrano said what he said about his injury on Sunday. The interview was strange as all hell. Lou apparently has not talked to him at all. Zambrano declined the MRI? Thats very weird.
Lou hasn’t talked to the doctor either.
by niuhuskie224 on
Sep 3, 2008 5:09 PM CDT
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Little OT:
niu do you go to northern currently?
DeRosa: And who is the best and who is the worst card player?
Dempster: I think the best is yourself. [ . . .] I think the worst player is D-Lee. I think he bets every time just to bet.
by EJThunder on
Sep 3, 2008 5:17 PM CDT
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Yeah, I do too.
DeRosa: And who is the best and who is the worst card player?
Dempster: I think the best is yourself. [ . . .] I think the worst player is D-Lee. I think he bets every time just to bet.
by EJThunder on
Sep 4, 2008 10:31 AM CDT
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I graduated from NIU in '95.
Meet you guys at Otto’s.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 10:38 AM CDT
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I did
Graduated from there in December. I now go to Judson University in Elgin. Do you still go there Thunder?
by niuhuskie224 on
Sep 3, 2008 5:57 PM CDT
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My question is
what the hell is going on ? LOL, I mean really, this is pretty confusing.
Lets just no serious damage and Z can throw the last week of the season.
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
by Grockcubs on
Sep 3, 2008 5:59 PM CDT
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if that's the case
hopefully by then we will have the division wrapped up, fingers crossed, and we can just sit z until game 1……although now that i say that, maybe getting him one “warm up game” before the playoffs probably makes sense
by cubswynn on
Sep 3, 2008 6:07 PM CDT
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130 pitch outing vs. the Dodgers
and two MRI’s later….
this news with the ominous news about Harden getting skipped completely is starting to worry me a bit
by DartmouthCubsFan on
Sep 3, 2008 6:44 PM CDT
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Slight difference between Harden/Z's situations:
Z has looked like absolute crap recently, and complained of that dead arm crap that apparently is an actual injury now. Harden has maintained his filthyness and says he feels good. Giving him extra rest was probably some of the advice Beane gave Hendry about how to keep Rich healthy. As someone pointed out, while Z was putting up that monstruous August ERA over 7, the Cubs went 20-8 (IIRC). My only concern is a short 5 game playoff series. No matter what I want Z shut down and DLed, with hopes he can return for maybe one start before the playoffs (knock on wood).
Ron Santo should sing TMOTTBG everyday. Period.
by Schwa on
Sep 3, 2008 6:51 PM CDT
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It was a fellow Badger that mentioned that . . .
As long as they have 1 of the 2, I still like their chances. Just not as good as with both.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on
Sep 3, 2008 11:14 PM CDT
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Enough with the 130-pitch BS
That hasn’t anything to do with this.
by Not Bruce Froemming on
Sep 3, 2008 7:23 PM CDT
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of course not...
it just so happens he’s had shoulder problems IMMEDIATELY following it and his command numbers have fallen rapidly…
no… no correlation at all
by DartmouthCubsFan on
Sep 4, 2008 2:55 PM CDT
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Re: Harden
You might have heard on the game tonight. Harden clarified he’s OK but does have soreness and will pitch. That was an update from one of the guys at Comcast Sports that spoke with him. Please feel free to clarify anything I might have mixed up.
by ak123 on
Sep 3, 2008 8:10 PM CDT
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He threw a buck-thirty against the Dodgers?
Must have missed that.
Yeah, high pitch count and injuries starting to have higher correlation in recent years. Of course, the games’ economics may just have some affect on that.
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
by blackhawk24 on
Sep 4, 2008 11:01 AM CDT
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Braced for the worst with Zambrano
Something is not right, and I think Zambrano knows it and was trying to gut through. God I hope he isn’t out for two years ala Chris Carpenter and Tim Hudson.
by MDBNIU on
Sep 3, 2008 9:17 PM CDT
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According to Sports Nite:
They are SPECULATING that Z feels like he did when he went down in June; and that if that’s the case (they said something about an injection that was to accompany the MRI, but I am not a doctor, so I’m not sure about the correlation there) that he probably wants to take it day to day, and see how he feels (without the complications from the injection delaying his return to the rotation).
Just to clarify: I did not catch all of the segment on Sports Nite; I came back from the fridge to the end of the piece, so this paraphrase may be inaccurate, or incomplete. Fair warning. Anyone who caught the complete segment, feel free to correct my inaccuracies.
Update: I guess it was the dye they use to do the MRI, and that if he had the Injection, it would mean that he’d miss two starts, and he didn’t want to miss two…so he nixed the MRI.
by Jimsil on
Sep 3, 2008 10:59 PM CDT
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Odd
I’ve never heard of that before (a dye). Well perhaps he was feeling better today?
I do find it bizarre that no one in the clubhouse has heard from him. However, places like Baseball Tonight are not making a big deal out of this so maybe we shouldn’t either. I know ESPN loves this sort of drama.
by ak123 on
Sep 3, 2008 11:23 PM CDT
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They use the dye
so that the can see things better on the MRI. It will show them areas of concern as those will be shaded differently.
From what i understand, it is fairly invasive and does cause some swelling in the area of the injection…
"Aw, how could he (Jorge Orta) lose the ball in the sun, he's from Mexico." -- Harry Carey
by TheRiot Police on
Sep 3, 2008 11:41 PM CDT
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thanks
Appreciate the info.
In all seriousness I just want us to clinch October. For me personally I’m watching these games, starting to lose sleep, I just want the clinch and then have a week or 2 where I don’t need to be on this site or the web reading on the Cubs every day (no offense to Al—-I just spend way too much time on the web in regards to the cubs in general).
by ak123 on
Sep 3, 2008 11:56 PM CDT
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To get a better look...
…they inject him with a contrast (like a dye) to help show “hot spots” (areas of damage) in his shoulder.
They could also be referring to injecting him with cortisone, if his issue was the same as June, which I believe was tendinitis. I had several of those babies when I played in college. They work pretty well, but how long you need to rest depends on the severity of the inflamation.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on
Sep 3, 2008 11:54 PM CDT
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When they inject the dye, it feels like your arm is going to explode..
Does anyone think Z didn’t show up because he’s pissed at Lou?
Devin Hester, you are ridiculous! -Jeff Joniak
by ARAM FOR MVP on
Sep 4, 2008 1:00 AM CDT
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Score was reporting
Jesse Rogers had reported that the injection would shelve Zambrano for two weeks, and that’s why he didn’t want that.
by rgonzale on
Sep 4, 2008 8:52 AM CDT
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Yeah, someone called Dave Kaplan's show last night...
…and said the same thing. Kap was also speculating that perhaps Big Z is claustrophobic and refused to get in the tube for the MRI.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 8:59 AM CDT
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Doubt it...
…for a shoulder, you usually don’t have to go in the tube the entire way (like for a spine MRI).
The injection side effect could be a legit reason, but that sidelining him 2 weeks seems a little over the top. There is some irritation from the injection of contrast, but he should get over that in less than 2 weeks. Believe it or not, a lot of athletes can’t stand needles, and this may have played a role in him choosing to skip the contrast part.
The other thing is this, the contrast will give the doc a much better image of what is going on in the shoulder. It could also be an indication the doc may have had an indication he found something he didn’t like during the exam, and wants to get the best image he can to rule out tears etc.. On the upside, the doc could also be going right to the highest level diagnostics, just to overly conservative he has left nothing on the table.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on
Sep 4, 2008 9:51 AM CDT
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Yeah, that makes more sense than the claustrophobia theory.
The worrier in me wonders whether Carlos had an anxiety attack right there in the doctor’s office and took off. Maybe he feels something is wrong, knows an MRI would reveal it and just isn’t ready to face a setback of that magnitude at this point in the season. I really hope that’s not the case.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 9:56 AM CDT
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so you're trying to tell me
carlos freaking zambrano would risk further injury bc he’s afraid of dye? sorry i just don’t buy it….he’d man up, even if he was “scared”
by cubswynn on
Sep 4, 2008 12:01 PM CDT
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Well Zambrano WAS in the clubhouse
So perhaps after the post game he and Lou spoke and Z spoke to some reporters?
by ak123 on
Sep 4, 2008 8:59 AM CDT
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He was?
I thought I heard that he wasn’t at the game last night at all.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 9:02 AM CDT
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Lou said after
the game that Z was not there.
by sue369 on
Sep 4, 2008 7:40 PM CDT
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That's what I thought.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 8:39 PM CDT
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The die and the MRI
It does take you out for 2 weeks when you have that die put in. That’s probably why Z was hoping it would feel better in a day or two. Which makes me believe maybe it’s not so bad.
Also I think I saw him in the dugout last night on TV briefly.
Go Cubs
by cubstoseriesby100 on
Sep 4, 2008 9:22 AM CDT
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I think
What I think will happen is he’ll have the regular MRI and then take another one with the die if deemed necessary.
Go Cubs
by cubstoseriesby100 on
Sep 4, 2008 9:23 AM CDT
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You know it's spelled "dye", right?
I just don’t like seeing the word “die” associated with Big Z. He’s got enough problems as it is.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 9:35 AM CDT
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Didn't he already have...
An MRI with the contract DYE the first time? I thought they reported that the shoulder was structurally sound with no leakage of the dye.
"Remember each day this year, where you were, what you were doing, who you were with, how you felt as the Cubs win their way through it. Because if this does turn out to be the promised land we have all been waiting for, you will want to remember, savor, cherish every moment..."
by CubsBullsBears on
Sep 4, 2008 11:21 AM CDT
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*contrast dye
"Remember each day this year, where you were, what you were doing, who you were with, how you felt as the Cubs win their way through it. Because if this does turn out to be the promised land we have all been waiting for, you will want to remember, savor, cherish every moment..."
by CubsBullsBears on
Sep 4, 2008 11:21 AM CDT
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I don't know...
…whether he had contrast the last time or not. I believe they said he had tendinitis, but I am curious as to whether they injected him with cortisone at that time or just gave him oral medication.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on
Sep 4, 2008 11:30 AM CDT
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LOL, "contract dye" - talk about a Freudian slip!
And, yeah, as I recall, he did have the dye injected earlier this season and it showed no structural damage. That doesn’t mean something hasn’t changed, though. (Or the first MRI didn’t miss something.)
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 11:31 AM CDT
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Hey guys
Early, early, early (can I stress that this is early?) indications from the Sun-Times are that Z will not miss the rest of the season.
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/1145318,earlyzam090408.article
by SplintChesthair on
Sep 4, 2008 1:30 PM CDT
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Initial news suggests Zambrano will miss 2 to 3 weeks
We don’t know yet if he had a cortisone shot or was injected with MRI dye. Regardless it would be 2 weeks minimum before he would get medical clearance to throw under either procedure. Or so the reporting goes.
Still don’t know the results of the MRI scheduled for today. And I imagine the Cubs and therefore we won’t find out those results until this weekend or Monday.
by MDBNIU on
Sep 4, 2008 1:35 PM CDT
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Hendry says rotator cuff tendinitis
According to the now-updated article I just linked. Next start could be in Houston.
by SplintChesthair on
Sep 4, 2008 1:39 PM CDT
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Depending on how things go, might as well DL him and bring him back on the 18th.
No sense in rushing him back for the Houston series, unless it’s very minor.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on
Sep 4, 2008 1:42 PM CDT
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I hope they shut him down for 2 weeks minimum
There’s no need to come back for the Houston series. A playoff spot is assured. I could really care less if we win the division or settle for the wildcard.
by MDBNIU on
Sep 4, 2008 2:08 PM CDT
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You may not care about the division...
…but I would guess Lou Piniella does. The recent home losing streak aside, this team has owned Wrigley Field this season. Plus, surrendering the division to Milwaukee would bring with it a certain degree of humiliation that would no doubt chap Lou’s ass. Home field advantage: It still matters.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 2:25 PM CDT
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Sure the division matters...
…but tendinitis can keep flaring up if not given enouph rest. If it does flare up, you can kiss him good bye for the playoffs and I don’t think anyone wants that. They need to err on the side of caution with this.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
by MPH73 on
Sep 4, 2008 3:08 PM CDT
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Yeah, I actually wouldn't mind...
…if they didn’t use Carlos again for the rest of the month unless absolutely necessary. I was just disputing the notion that whether the Cubs win the division or wild card doesn’t matter.
"I see the playoff schedule posted in the paper, and that stuff makes me nervous because you can't take anything for granted. We have a great team. We have a really good team. We're playing well, but we haven't won yet." - Jim Edmonds, 8/31/08
by dat cubfan daver on
Sep 4, 2008 3:10 PM CDT
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