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Pie traded to Baltimore

Here is the link to the article.  It doesn't look like the Cubs got anything useful in return for him.  Is he a bigger bust then Patterson?  At least the Cubs got a few productive years out of CPat.  It would not surprise me to see Pie have a decent year in the AL.  If Lou had just let him play last year I think he would have been just as productive as Fukudome.  How many ex-Cubs do the O's have now.  Maybe Pie and Montanez will lead the O's to the playoffs.

Link

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

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I disagree that they didn't get anything useful

I believe Garret Olson is the pitcher that San Diego reportedly wanted in a Peavy deal. So if that’s the case this guy could definitely hold some value

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 1:13 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Right

The Pie-Olson-Peavy deal was rumored in November. Not holding my breath, though…

Here’s the rumor link : http://mvn.com/chopnchange/2008/11/three-team-trade-rumor-peavy-to-cubs-prospex-to-os.html

by ju on Jan 18, 2009 1:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Iirc it was rumored in December

that it would take several teams to make a Peavy deal work. Hendry’s now made deals with Minnesota and Baltimore to set up a Peavy trade.. Now they probably need to sign Aurilla before being ready to move Cedeno…

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 3:02 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You Mean Cleveland...

…not Minnesota, right?

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh yeah. LOL

Just more evidence that Peavy will be a Cub soon.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 3:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Take a Peek at My Sig!!

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:06 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not much choice

Pie was out of options and we had little choice. The people you trade with understand this too. In retrospect we should have traded him a year or two ago. Hindsight is 20-20 you know.

by Goldenwheels on Jan 24, 2009 8:31 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

This is an outstanding trade.

As mentioned above, he could be a piece of a Peavy deal. Or, he could compete for a rotation spot. Olson has talent, and Pie had nowhere to play with the Cubs.

Pie doesn’t have much of a place to play with the Orioles, either — their outfield seems full.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 1:16 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

You do know Olson is a horrible SP...

In his two years wit the O’s, he has been horrible in the AL. I do hope the Pads find him valuable because I don’t.

by Geo4MVP on Jan 18, 2009 4:13 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Lefthanders sometimes mature late.

Olson is only 25. There’s a fair chance he will improve.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 5:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Please recommend this post so it gets to the top of the rec list.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 1:17 PM CST reply actions   1 recs

Olsen had a decent AAA season in 2007

but wasn’t ready last year. The best thing (unless he is traded) is to head to AAA for a refresher.

In 2007, in 128 innings, 95 hits, 120 and 39 BB’s. He could be as good or better than Marshall.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 1:18 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Text of official Cubs press release
The Chicago Cubs today acquired left-handed pitcher Garrett Olson and right-handed pitcher Henry Williamson from the Baltimore Orioles for outfielder Felix Pie.

Olson, 25, enters only his fifth professional season yet has 33 major league starts under his belt the last two years with the Orioles. The southpaw made his big league debut with seven starts for Baltimore in 2007 at the age of 23 and followed up with 26 starts in 2008. Olson went 9-10 with a 6.65 ERA (98 ER/132.2 IP) last year, ranking fourth among American League rookies in starts, fifth in wins and innings pitched and sixth with 83 strikeouts.

The six-foot-one, 204-pound Olson began the 2008 campaign with Triple-A Norfolk and went 1-2 with a 2.97 ERA (12 ER/36.1 IP) in seven starts covering two stints. He struck out 39 batters in 36.1 innings. Olson went 1-1 with a 1.85 ERA (5 ER/24.1 IP) in five April starts to earn a promotion to Baltimore. He also had a stint in Triple-A from August 20-September 1 before being recalled to the Orioles for the rest of the season.

Olson is 12-10 with a 2.96 ERA (126 ER/383.2 IP) in 71 career minor league appearances, 66 as a starter. He has struck out 380 and walked 125 in 383.2 innings, an average of nearly 9.0 strikeouts and 2.9 walks per nine innings. Olson has allowed only 27 home runs in his minor league career, an average of one home run per 14.1 innings.

Originally selected by the Orioles in the sandwich round (48th overall) if the 2005 June Draft, Olson quickly rose through the Orioles system, reaching Double-A Bowie by the end of his second professional season in 2006. He began the 2007 season in Triple-A Norfolk and later made his big league debut that year in his third pro campaign.

Williamson, 23, went 0-1 with three saves and a 3.72 ERA (12 ER/29.0 IP) in 20 relief appearances between Single-A Aberdeen and Single-A Delmarva. The six-foot-five, 233-pound Williamson struck out 42 and walked only five batters in 29.0 innings between the stops, an average of 13.0 strikeouts per nine innings, and limited opponents to a .221 batting average. He was originally selected by the Orioles in the 14th round of the 2007 Draft.

Pie, who turns 24 on February 8, batted .223 (58-for-260) with three home runs and 30 RBI in 130 games for the Cubs the last two seasons. He hit .241 (20-for-83) with one home run and 10 RBI in 43 games with the Cubs last season.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 1:21 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

What exactly is the sandwich round of the draft?
Originally selected by the Orioles in the sandwich round (48th overall) if the 2005 June Draft…

is that some kind of Subway promotion? LOL.

I'm not going to even bother trying to update this sig everyday anymore... that's what the standings column on ESPN is for.
Updated on May 25, 2008

by SackMan on Jan 18, 2009 1:47 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

The Earl of Sandwich round

New sig currently under construction

by JB 23 on Jan 18, 2009 2:08 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Picks

that are awarded to teams losing free agents coming after the first round but before the second. These are for Type B free agents and the additional pick for type A free agents. Officially, they are first round picks, but they are often colloquially called “sandwich picks.”

by Josh77 on Jan 18, 2009 2:47 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

really good move by Hendry

As Al said, Pie had no place on the 2009 Cubs. And Olson, I would guess, at least is a good option for the bullpen — especially if Marshall is in the rotation.

by elgato on Jan 18, 2009 1:33 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

After the Peavy deal supposedly died

many people believed that if was just Hendry wanting more time to gather the proper players and work through things on his own time rather than the Padres deadline. If that was the case, so far so good. Trading DeRosa for three guys and now acquiring the very pitcher most people believed the padres wanted. I never thought the Cubs were actually gonna try for Peavy again, but this really has to raise some eyebrows…

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 1:34 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

seems like Hendry

… is setting things up so the Cubs are in good shape to get Peavy AND in good shape if they don’t get him. Me likes.

by elgato on Jan 18, 2009 1:36 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:03 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I think Aurilia is the next move, now that Cedeno is signed

And then the ownership group is announced with that group signs off on the Peavy trade.

Cubs then deal Cedeno, Olson, Stevens, Hart, Rich Hill and Vitters to San Diego for Jake Peavy. SD gets what it wanted all along:

A real top prospect, a few good young arms, a reliever, a SS and then a throw in.

WOW this would be huge….simply huge…and it goes to the other Convention revelation regarding Harden. He has a tear, but is using PT to get through it and the Cubs are only planning on him starting 25 games….a fifth starter. Adding Peavy would make for 4 big starters….where Marshall is there for any of their or Harden’s injury.

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Jan 18, 2009 4:48 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

This sounds about right.

Hill to SD makes sense. I think they’ll add Wuertz to the deal.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 4:57 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

SD is one of the few places that might trade for Rich Hill.

Remember, he’s out of options and does not look like he’ll succeed, so I doubt there are (m)any teams lining up to give up real talent for him. He’s a candidate for DFAing.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm sure the Cubs do NOT want to do that.

They want to trade him; he’s lefthanded. He has some value.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 5:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You're saying that the Cubs

do not want to give him another year at Iowa (or below)?

Then why would anyone trade for him? Yes, he’s lefty and young, etc. But there’s a 98% chance he’ll have to be sent to the minors after 2 starts.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:10 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And not even that young

anymore. Rich’ll be 29 in March.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark

by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Jan 18, 2009 5:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

This is why Cub fans should not have their hopes up

that we will get anything for Hill.

It happens.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Hill is out of options.

He’s either traded or let go.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 7:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And I Bet He's Traded...

… even if he is DFA’d. I’m sure that there will be bottom feeder organizations that would be willing to snipe him.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:23 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

Hill could be decent in PetCo and the pitcher parks in the NL West. He might start throwing strikes eventually.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

For his sake, I hope so.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 6:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I Respectfully Disagree...

… that Aurilia is the next move…

I presume that Olson has to be on our 40-man roster, which means we are still at 40.

I think the Peavy deal is next. That will clear roster spots for Aurilia and Bako.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:21 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with dealing Cedeno,Olson,Stevens and Hart. But I dont think even San Diego will take a chance on Rich Hill. And as for Josh Vitters I dont think trading him is such a good idea.Peavy would be a great addition but lets remeber he has only one winning season in the last 3 years, I know he plays for the Padres but still.And back to Vitters he should be in Major league form in a few years, just in time to take the spot of Ramirez who has an option for 2011.I am just up in the air about it. Not sure if it would be a good or bad trade.Still looking at we gave away in Derosa if we dont trade for him though..

Telling it how it is

by Telling it how it is on Jan 19, 2009 1:42 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Good move

Garrett Olson has good stuff, and he’s appealing to the Padres because he’s cheap and under control for a few seasons before he becomes arb-eligible.

If the Cubs don’t get Peavy, keeping Olson isn’t the worst thing in the world either.

"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...

by Curtain Jerker on Jan 18, 2009 1:38 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

well

I’m dissapointed, of course. Pie could have been our starting centerfielder for years. He just never got a chance.

Hopefully, he’ll be able to thrive in Baltimore. I hope what we got for him pans out for us.

"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella

by drewishdrewid on Jan 18, 2009 1:40 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Plus, I think you owe Project 3000

I haven’t forgotten my debt, btw. Only saw Al once . . . I will pay.

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jan 18, 2009 10:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pleanty of chances

Pie might be as Big a bust as C. Patterson. He had 130 games to prove his worth. hitting .223 with 72K’s in 260 Abs.I just wish we would have traded him when he had more value.He has great speed and can man center very well but cant hit worth a damn..Sorry but I am glad he is gone. Dont have to hear about his great Minor League stats and nonexistent Major League stats any longer.

Telling it how it is

by Telling it how it is on Jan 19, 2009 1:56 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Ugh.

Traded Pie two years too late.

I'm not going to even bother trying to update this sig everyday anymore... that's what the standings column on ESPN is for.
Updated on May 25, 2008

by SackMan on Jan 18, 2009 1:41 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

We could have gotten so much more for him two years ago...

like actual established Major League talent. Do you think the Red Sox regret trading Hanley Ramirez in the package to get Lowell and Beckett? Sure, they’ve been talking about trading to get him back, but I’m sure they’re more than happy with the 2007 World Series win that both of those guys were key components of. Olsen is a nice get for Hendry to be sure, but who are some of the names that have been bandied that Hendry flat out said Pie is untouchable for. That said, I’m happy with the deal though TINSTAAPP.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 2:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly.

I'm not going to even bother trying to update this sig everyday anymore... that's what the standings column on ESPN is for.
Updated on May 25, 2008

by SackMan on Jan 18, 2009 2:28 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

I don't think Pie was given as high a ceiling as Hanley Ramirez

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

He wasn't

It is armchair GM-ing.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 2:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Still easy to say now

Should the Cubs trade Soto now? His value won’t be higher than right now.

You can’t pick and choose which prospects should have been traded and which ones shouldn’t.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 2:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I would say Soto is fairly established at this point...

And of course Pie didn’t have as high of a ceiling as Ramirez, that wasn’t the point.

  I’m not picking and choosing, I’m saying if you have the choice between trading minor league prospects for actual major league ballplayers, you make that trade(In other words, I’m saying trade them all, for the right price). A year or two ago we could have gotten somebody that could have put us over the top in one facet or another. Today, we get somebody else’s not-quite-ready for the majors AAA prospect. If Hendry is able to flip Olson for Peavy, I’ll be thrilled. Or, if Olsen lives up to the hype, I’ll be happier than a pig in slop. But the fact remains, we could have gotten far more for Pie (and Rich Hill, another untouchable) than what we get now. C

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 3:43 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

In other words...

If not trading Vitters keeps us from getting a guy that will help us win the World Series right now, then that’s a bad non-move. By all means trade him to help now. No-one should be untouchable. How many Cub prospects have actually panned out for us (or overall anyway). Soto? A years worth of Dontrelle Willis for the Marlins? Marginal success from Theriot, though he’s probably playing out of position? Zambrano and Marmol? Dempster, Lilly, Lee, Soriano, and Ramirez make up most of what I would call the key players on the team, not to diminish Soto, Z, and Marmol. Before Soto, when was the last position player the Cubs grew that hit? Other than Z, who is the last Cubs starting pitcher to hit? It’s not because we’re trading them away, it’s because we don’t have them.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 4:03 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Trading every prospect makes no sense

Show me anyone who has won with that strategy.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 4:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

For the right price.

We hang on to them past their expiration date, and the ones that are actually successful are the ones that aren’t necessarily the most highly touted. I don’t remember hearing much about Zambrano before he made it to the bigs, but Prior was The Savior from the day he was drafted ‘til about the 37th report of a simulated game/towel drill workout. Soto was an also-ran as a prospect until he put it together in his third year of AAA. Marmol didn’t really waste a lot of time coming up. But, Rich Hill, Mark Prior, Corey Patterson, Bobby Hill, Hee-Seop Choi, Jason Dubois, Based on sheer track record, it makes sense. Obviously you can’t trade them all, nor would you want to, but if you can get outstanding value for a prospect, absolutely you should trade him. It doesn’t make much sense to play the what if game if the goal is to win now, which I believe is the Cubs.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 4:42 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If you didn't hear much about Zambrano before

he made his debut, you weren’t listening very closely. Zambrano was highly touted. He played for the 1999 Lansing Lugnuts that Steve Stone was going on about during almost every telecast that season.

by Josh77 on Jan 18, 2009 4:54 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

To be honest...

I was still in high school in 99 and for at least the first part of the season, most of their games were during school. And during the summer, I was asleep most mornings. (I live in California.)

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 5:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't remember much internet hype about him

like Prior got, and most of the more recent guys.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 5:06 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Couldn't win many games with Cubs prospects.

The majority turn out to be busts. Fortunately, Florida, Oakland and Pittsburgh are willing to deal with the Cubs…

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:39 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And also...

for the right guy. You don’t trade the hot young prospect for the old decrepit former stud, you move him for less young major league talent/phenom. And maybe get the old decrepit stud as a throw-in.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 7:46 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If prospects are as useless as you suggest...

…why would anyone ever trade you anything like a “major league talent/phenom” for them?

by cwyers on Jan 18, 2009 7:48 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Um.
Do you think the Red Sox regret trading Hanley Ramirez in the package to get Lowell and Beckett?

Yes. Yes they do. Why would you even ask that question?

by cwyers on Jan 18, 2009 7:01 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And yet, Beckett helped win a World Series for the Red Sox.

Are you saying Boston would rather give that back?

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 7:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That trade was done during an odd point in the Red Sox's organizational history...

…after Theo Epstein’s short-lived resignation from the organization. I think Epstein would like to have a do-over on that one, yeah.

by cwyers on Jan 18, 2009 7:47 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I think if you ask Epstein...

… he’d take the WS. Sure, maybe he’d like Ramirez back, but you don’t give back championships.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 19, 2009 4:47 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Josh Beckett and Mike Lowell resulted in a World Series

Red Sox knew full well they were trading away an elite talent in Hanley Ramirez. It is a trade that worked out wondrously well for both organizations.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 7:25 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not necessarily.

Olson has talent — this could turn out to be a real good deal. I don’t know much about Williamson, but the Cubs got two live bodies for him, one of whom is major-league ready.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Two for Pie?

And it seems that both are good prospects.

Kudos to Hendry on this one!

by DrCrawdad on Jan 18, 2009 1:42 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

First Cherry.

Now Pie.

What’s next? The lack of foods on our team is troubling.

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Jan 18, 2009 1:44 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

They could have been teammates again, too.

Unfortunately, Cherry is now a Met.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I had to....

"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry

by EJThunder on Jan 18, 2009 2:28 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Olson is a good get

Olson should help the Cubs. He might start the season at Triple A, but I like his longer-term potential to contribute.

Not sure I understand why Baltimore wants Felix Pie and was willing to give up Olson to get him. Adam Jones is the future in center field and Nick Markakis is already among the best young outfielders in the game. Maybe he makes the Orioles as a 5th outfielder type, but probably more likely he is Triple A fodder. Suffice to say I live in no fear of him coming back to haunt.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 1:46 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

If I was a team like the Orioles

Pie is the exact type of low risk, high reward type of player I would be looking for. A player they can stash on their roster because they don’t have the same urgency to win. Even if they don’t necessarily have room for him now, they can find a spot for him if he begins to finally show his potential. It’s how the White Sox got Carlos Quentin last year.

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 1:53 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I forgot about Adam "Don't call me Pac-Man" Jones

Pie in Left isn’t really the answer either…he hasn’t hit well enough (although the jury is deliberating) to play left on an everyday basis.

Then again, Baltimore probably isn’t going anywhere anyway, so why not give Pie 600 ABs and see if he figures it out? Better than Ryan Freel.

"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...

by Curtain Jerker on Jan 18, 2009 1:53 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pie's a better defensive CF

so if he can hit you have Pie in CF, Jones in RF, Markakis in LF making a tremendous defensive OF, you DH Luke Scott and play Aubrey Huff at 1B

by DartmouthCubsFan on Jan 18, 2009 2:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Orioles are rightfully committed to Jones in center and Markakis in right

Markakis is already one of the best right fielders in all of baseball. Jones carries true elite prospect stature. Felix Pie isn’t going to disrupt the equation of Jones in center and Markakis in right. Those two are fixtures.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

They'll move Jones to a corner...

There was talk of this when he was in Seattle. Pie is the better defensive CF. I suspect Pie will be given a shot in CF. They’ll either move Jones to LF or to RF and move Markakis to LF (though I think that’s less likely).

This is, again, evidence that you don’t understand prospects’ trade value, as you consistently ignored the evidence that Pie actually had trade value.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 3:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Apparently...

…McFAIL is reporting that Pie will be in left…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:35 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That would be a mistake in my opinion...

as Pie is now the best defensive OF in their organization.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 3:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

He Just Can't Hit...

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That may be the case...

or it may be that he just needs time to adjust to MLB pitching.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 3:43 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Nick Markakis and Adam Jones are both excellent defense outfielders

In fact, argument can be made that Markakis is the best defensive right fielder in the game right now.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:51 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Prove it

And, all the defensive prowess in the world doesn’t mean crap if you can’t manage to hit major league pitching.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:59 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

Umm, that makes absolutely no sense...

First, I didn’t say Pie was a good hitter. I said he was the best defensive player of the three. Second, your ability to hit has no relevance to your ability to play defense.

IF they’re going to play Pie (and it seems like they will), they should play him in CF, where he’s a better option than Jones DEFENSIVELY.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:02 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Well...

If you can’t hit, you generally don’t stick around very long. But I agree with your point. Pie is a center fielder, that’s where he should play.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 4:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

No disagreement there...

If Pie doesn’t prove he can hit with the Orioles, he won’t be in Jones’s way in CF.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:06 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And I'd like to see YOU prove to me...

That Jones is better defensively than Pie in CF.

Yeah, that’s what I thought.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:03 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Regardless

since Pie is an unknown. Why move Jones who you know will be around and then move him back if Pie fails? It’s not like Jones is bad so leaving him alone makes sense to me.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 4:01 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Does this mean

Marshall’s definitely the swing guy now?

I know it was mentioned a couple days ago but this might wrap it up if the Cubs don’t go get Peavy. Olsen seems like he’d make a good callup midseason or in Sept. for us but I don’t know if I’d stick him in the rotation with that ERA.

Yikes…

Either way, this was a great trade IMO because Pie’s value had taken a nosedive off a cliff with the way the Cubs handled him. Gotta think Hendry pulled some strings on this one.

Sure hope Peavy’s in the cards now.

"Why do you always point to the sky when Zambrano starts?" My girlfriend.

"You just wouldn't get it...it's a Cubs thing..." Me.

by cubs2k8isnxtyear on Jan 18, 2009 1:51 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Marshall Is The Swing Guy...

… when we get Peavy.

What Piniella was suggesting was based on the current roster as-is. That can all change once a new player is added/moved.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 2:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

My read on the way the Cubs have been talking about Marshall

is that he’s going to get his starts this year, but they’ll initially be in backing up Rich Harden (and the other starters).

That arrangement will probably give him 20+ starts, unless we have unusually good health.

Olson will not leapfrog Marshall for the starting job, but what Olson gives, if he isn’t flipped, is precisely what Marshall doesn’t have: health certainity.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 4:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

The Orioles ...

certainly have become a resting spot for castaway Cubs outfielders. Maybe Hendry should have called them about Jacque Jones.

by elgato on Jan 18, 2009 1:52 PM CST reply actions   1 recs

My take

Olson has a very remote chance at developing into a 3, but he could definitely turn into a 4.30 – 4.90 #4. His minor league career was great, as he was a big prospect for a long time, and I truly believe that he just had to take his lumps in 2008.

I think Hendry won this deal, but I almost want to say that we can spare another pitcher with the way out minors is right now.

If Pie were to pan out, though, what would his ceiling be in the AL?

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 1:53 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Gold Glove CF

for years…25-30 SB’s…. .285/.355/.460 with 25 homers and 85 or so RBIs.

Should be interesting to see if Pie can adjust to pitchers if he actually gets a chance. He’s definitely got the skill set…we’ll see how it plays out.

"Why do you always point to the sky when Zambrano starts?" My girlfriend.

"You just wouldn't get it...it's a Cubs thing..." Me.

by cubs2k8isnxtyear on Jan 18, 2009 1:56 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

The thing is

I can’t see how Trembley will put up with a project like Felix in the outfield. We have Lou Montanez, who I’m sure you’re all familiar with, Reimold, a solid prospect, Luke Scott, who will probably move to DH, and now Pie.

If Felix played any position in the infield, then he’d definitely get a few hundred AB’s, but we don’t have much room in the outfield with two cornerstones in Markakis and Jones.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

O's forgot

O’s forgot to add Brian Roberts in the trade

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Eh

Hopefully this is a precursor to a BRob deal. Maybe Andy has enough faith in another failed Chicago outfielder to think that he can fill the leadoff spot. Keeping Roberts around this long is just stupid.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:07 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I keep hoping

Cubs get Brian Roberts .. could give them Fontenot and some prospects

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Fontenot + trash

Isn’t worth two draft picks. If Fontenot was 25, then it’d be a different story, but a guy going on 29 isn’t an ideal player for the O’s.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:11 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

these days

you can’t count on draft pick compensation

look at how things have worked out this year, would the orioles for certain offer Roberts arbitration?

by DartmouthCubsFan on Jan 18, 2009 2:14 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

In my opinion

Almost definitely. MacPhail is trying to give off the impression that he’s attempting to keep fan favorites, but in reality, he wants to get younger.

I wish the O’s would just offer BRob a contract so that he could decline and then get dealt.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:21 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

right but a number of teams wanting to get younger

decided not to offer arb this year because of the consequences of tying up that much payroll.

like the DBacks with Dunn

by DartmouthCubsFan on Jan 18, 2009 2:24 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Angelos is stubborn

And he wants to keep guys like Roberts and Markakis at all costs. The O’s have consistently been one of the top spenders in the MLB over the past decade, and Petey would be willing to fork over if Brian would accept.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

They're tenth

In average payroll over the past ten years

http://sports.espn.go.com/espnmag/story?id=3816824

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

no!

I live in VA, and I have a friend who is a diehard Orioles fan who extremely despises the man. They think he is the sole reason they are shitty now

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:36 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If by like

You mean utterly despise, then yes, I like Angelos.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:38 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

those numbers are WAY different than Cot's

unless the Orioles had a 200 million dollar payroll in 1998 and 99…. i don’t know how they’d average 100+ when Cot’s suggests they only broke 85 once in the last 8 years

by DartmouthCubsFan on Jan 18, 2009 2:36 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Nah

That can’t be right. I believe it was 2006 when the O’s spent $45 million on the bullpen alone, which subsequently turned out to be one of the worst in the majors.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:38 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I believe that is the total amount for the contract.

I believe they were all multi-year deals so the total amount of the contracts was something like $45 million.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jan 18, 2009 11:56 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I call that stupidity

He could have rebuilt the farm system up even more if he let go of guys like Roberts. Now he can enjoy getting spanked by the Rays for years to come.

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 2:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It seems odd that in rebuilding mode they would trade a good pitcher like Olson

I would figure they would be holding on to young pitching talent. Maybe he is their version of Pie: not enough time to prove himself.

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:10 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

The O's got the higher talent level and the higher ceiling

This is a good deal for them.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

just threw a name out

Would pay a lot for Roberts .. I in my opinion is the next major piece of the puzzle .. Cubs need a leadoff hitter .. And Roberts won’t resign

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:24 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

The Roberts deal is DEAD

this proves it without a doubt. Pie would have been used to get him. We have nothing left that the O’s need!

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:27 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'll take Vitters

And throw in some mid level prospects on our side.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

No thanks.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Hey

He said there’s nothing else we’d need.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Baltimo

 I like your thinking . Vitters , Cedeno , and some young prospects

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

no thanks

Vitters could potentially be a better player than Roberts..

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Cubs time is short

Cubs need to trade now for Roberts . our time is short to win it all .. PLayers ages , chemistry , expired contracts , etc .. Cubs are so close now . I would give up Vitters

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Please

This shows that Roberts is dead.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 2:48 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree.

This deal either stands on its own or is a precursor to a Peavy deal.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:49 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Every good horror story is alive.

Jason, Freddie, etc. BR can’t be dead!

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Jan 18, 2009 2:59 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

More "win now" fallacy

The Cubs have the payroll to consistently put a winner on the field. And the way Hendry is building the farm system is good for the long term.

Every time I hear this it’s from impatient people who don’t seem to understand that bad moves can handcuff a team for years to come. I’d rather build a team like the Red Sox and go to the playoffs year after year.

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:12 PM CST up reply actions   2 recs

+1

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

To get Vitters we’d need to give up Roberts and some prospects on our side.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:35 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

While I do think the Roberts deal is not being discussed/considered right now

we do have the pieces to trade for Roberts. Why, for one thing, should the price on Roberts be much higher than the less expensive comparable 2B, Mark DeRosa?

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 4:48 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

because the DeRosa deal is already done.

I mean, it’s not like you get a receipt when you make a trade, physical exams & medical reports notwithstanding.

The price on Roberts is whatever MacPhail sets it to be. And Hendry (or whoever) can either pay it or not. The only way they’re comparable is before the fact, i.e. someone wants to kick the tires and do a little comparison shopping.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jan 18, 2009 5:23 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If That Was The Case...

… then why didn’t the Cubs package Pie with others to land Roberts?

The Cubs are not going for Roberts now. I think this deal solidifies that. Also, we’d then have to let LBR go, which I doubt is in the cards. Roberts is getting out of his prime years. And trade all these guys for 1 year of Roberts, when we could trade the same guys for 5 of Peavy?

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:25 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I said I don't think the Cubs are after Roberts.

But this deal doesn’t solidify that – especially not, if you presume as many others, that Olson is part of a Peavy deal.

Rather my point is that Roberts, in the current trade market, should cost more than what we got for DeRosa plus Fontenot. Roberts isn’t that much better than DeRosa to merit a larger pricetag.

Reflecting on some of what Bruce Miles has written, I don’t think Jim Hendry would ask McPhail about Roberts again. I think that Hendry might listen if McPhail came to him, but otherwise, he’s not going to waste his time.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 19, 2009 12:09 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Thos point has been brought up elsewhere today

Why would the Cubs or any other team for that matter give up good prospects for one year of Brian Roberts, when Orlando Hudson is still sitting out there? Hudson is a comparable player offensively and a superior defender. And you don’t even have to deal with Macphail

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 2:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Would rather have Roberts

I think he is a better hitter and equal in the field

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree Roberts is a better hitter

but he generally has not been better in the field.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 4:50 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Is Roberts better than Fontenot?

Where would you rank Roberts (for the sake of curiosity)

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:13 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

A lot of it depends on how you value steals

CHONE gives the following triple slash 2009 projections:
Fontenot .270/.351/.422
Roberts .285/.370/.423

And that’s with Roberts playing in the AL East and Fonty in the NL Central.

Roberts is probably one of the top 5 2B in the majors right now and the rare breed of a lead-off hitter who both steals and has a high OBP. That’s where his real value comes in. While Mark DeRosa might out-hit Roberts, Lou wouldn’t bat him lead-off because of the running game. So, Roberts’ value can shoot up quite a bit if you value the steals and his lead-off ability.

Does that answer your question?

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:21 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

No, but I asked the wrong question

I meant in terms of defense. Although I am glad you added the other stats. I really hope Fontenot puts up numbers like that.

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:23 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Because Brian would resign

I don’t buy into this one year rental thing. If BRob is moved to a contender, then he’d willingly sign an extension during the season as he just wants to play for a winning team. Additionally, a guy like Brian really would put a team over the hump; Roberts is an elite second baseman.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:27 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You're correct

But Andy could still make a convincing case.

Brian isn’t going to leave Baltimore because there will be more money elsewhere, he wants out as he wants to win.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Baltimo

 Like your thinking again . B Rob would sign if he wanted to stay . Cubs are so close to winning it all

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic

But seeing as I’ve followed Roberts for the past ten years, I’m pretty confident when I say that he’d sign an extension. Brian is one of the few players in professional sports that wants to invest his time in a community and win baseball games.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Jan 18, 2009 2:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Numbers are a little high

don’t you think? WOW. 25 homeruns for Pie?

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Jan 19, 2009 8:57 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

When talking about his ceiling, I think those numbers are fine.

We aren’t talking about what’s expected of him, just what could be accomplished if he reached his ceiling.

I think of Pie’s ceiling to be a Mike Cameron type of player but maybe with a higher average. I don’t know if he’ll ever come close to reaching that ceiling though.

by SouthernCub on Jan 19, 2009 9:08 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Felix Pie is incapable of hitting major league pitching

I’m afraid you’ve acquired a dud in not too dissimilar mode of Corey Patterson. On the positive side Pie has a better attitude and work ethic than Patterson.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 2:01 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Man...

…I really thought the Peavy deal was dead. Now I don’t think so. Ugh, another few weeks of Peavy rumors…

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Jan 18, 2009 1:58 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

It May Not Be A Few Weeks...

… why wait until now to do this deal? It’s not like this helps clear some room on our 40-man roster or anything to land Aurilia or Bako. Perhaps this was ready to be done in December, but when you put in the McFAIL process steps, you add 8 weeks?

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 2:39 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Hendry has been consistent on the timeline of a Peavy deal for a loooooong time now.

He has consistently said the new owner would need to sign off. That doesn’t necessarily mean ownership has to be finalized, but that is the big remaining hurdle.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 4:52 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'd hope it would happen soon, if it did happen

Hendry tends to move fast when he smells blood.

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I Think Hendry Already Has His Answer...

… and thus he has set the wheels in motion to do the 4-way-deal as four 2-way deals (unload Marquis, deal DeRosa, deal Pie, and next the San Diego trade).

He needed to do this not just to lessen the complexity, but to also buy himself some time…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:28 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree that this seems very probable.

All the things the rumors at the GM meetings said needed to happen have started happening one by one.

But I’m not going to assume Peavy comes until he does.

Fwiw, I am in favor of getting Peavy although I am suspicious of his health.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 19, 2009 12:10 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'd say Hendry is putting us in a semi-rebuilding mode

He’s not trading away the core of the team (Lee, Soriano, Ramirez, Zambrano, etc.) but trading away the players that were bonuses in helping us win last year. He’s giving up enough players that won’t keep us from not repeating.

That being said, I think the Peavy deal may actually have life if this trade is true..

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:00 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Maybe he's finally learning that you have to plan for the future

This team is headed into 2006 mode if they don’t get any farm contributions in a couple of years.

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

heh, could this possibly set up a deal for Peavy to close out the convention?

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:04 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Oh, please.

You think a deal like that could be made within the next hour?

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

better work quick then!!!!

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Hope So

Towers is love with Garret Olson .. deal has to be struck . Cubs will add in some of the Indians picks from DeRosa trade

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:07 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

eh, I don't either, but all indicates seem like that is heading that way

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:10 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Cubs need

Peavey .. never have enough pitching

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:11 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Did I say that?

All I said is that it wasn’t going to happen TODAY.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:19 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Going with

the assumption that Padres want Olson, you mean to say that the Padreas have no one better than Pie to offer to the Orioles?

"You can't take life to seriously, you don't get out of it alive"

by wild bill on Jan 18, 2009 2:11 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

sadly no

their farm system is putrid as well

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not really

that sad. If they did not have anything to offer, at least the Cubs did. So if this deal happens for Peavy, and Olson is the key, good for the Cubs.

"You can't take life to seriously, you don't get out of it alive"

by wild bill on Jan 18, 2009 2:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Padres to give up no prospects

Padres are going to stockpile young prospects .. You know some of those pitchers from the DeRosa trade is coming over to the Padres along with Olson

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:15 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

IMAGINE

Imagine this starting rotation .. Peavey , Zambrano , Dempster , Harden , Lilly ,, Once in a while Marshall .. Winning starts with pitching

by CUBFANINAZ on Jan 18, 2009 2:18 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Of this

list, who do you have the most confidence in to repeat or exceed last years performance?

"You can't take life to seriously, you don't get out of it alive"

by wild bill on Jan 18, 2009 2:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Harden.

I think he’ll be healthy and have his best year in the major leagues (particularly since it’s a walk year for him).

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:25 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Good point

never underestimate the Contract Year Phenomenon.

"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...

by Curtain Jerker on Jan 18, 2009 2:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

yeahm I dunno if we are going to be able to resign him if he does very well

especially if we get Peavy, Harden is surely gone..

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Unless new ownership opens up its wallet.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

well if Ricketts takes over, do you think he'll be willing to do it??

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If there is a good reason...

If Harden does well and a new contract is within reason for the ballclub I dont see why not.

If Hendry makes a reasonable case.

"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry

by EJThunder on Jan 18, 2009 2:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:36 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If he stays healthy

I think that would be more important. Everyone knows the talent in that arm.

Man, typing that gave me flashbacks.

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:19 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

hmm... you mean something like this?

Main Entry: flash·back
Pronunciation: \ˈflash-ˌbak\
Function: noun
Date:1903
1: a past incident recurring vividly in the mind
2: a return to prior thoughts

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jan 18, 2009 5:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with Al

There is a strong chance that. regardless of the economy, will be willing to expand the current payroll. From a business perspective, I do not see a reason that this franchise could not be as profitable as the New York Yankees. I am not saying I want to see that, but the Cubs are a grossly profitable brand, with a growing following. It would not be hard for a new owner to expand the payroll by 20-30 million.

by PieFan08 on Jan 18, 2009 3:56 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Here's why

the Cubs can’t be as profitable as the New York Yankees.

NY Media Market: 7.3 million homes
Chicago Media Market: 3.4 million homes

The Yankees are also in markets like Buffalo and Albany which are bigger than the Cubs secondary markets like Peoria and Cedar Rapids.

Yankees own their own Regional Sports Network. Cubs share one with the White Sox, Bulls and Blackhawks.

It’s nice to say the Cubs could spend as much as the Yankees, but it just isn’t the case.

by Josh77 on Jan 18, 2009 5:03 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

The Cubs MIGHT start up their own TV network.

It’s been rumored.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 5:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I think the Cubs are more popular outside of Chicago than the Yanks outside of N.Y.

I may have pulled that straight out of my ass, but my travels seem to indicate a huge amount of Cubs fans outside of IL. They could certainly catipatalize on that.

Not that Yankee money has been much of a success for building a championship team, though.

by dr stabbingworth on Jan 18, 2009 5:21 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

For the wrong reason?

Oh yeah and I thought I could go a couple months without being remind how many years it’s been since the Cubs have won a World Series Championship.

WRONG.

Watching the football game today, all of the viewers were reminded that that “one team in Chicago” hasn’t won in, get this, 100 YEARS! The Cardinals have the second longest drought.

The cherry on top of it all? None other than Joe Buck had the honors of saying this.

"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry

by EJThunder on Jan 18, 2009 6:08 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I heard that, too.

We can’t even avoid that during an NFL telecast. Ridiculous.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 7:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not necessarily...

Depending on how good Harden does and if our ownership is resolved, Hendry could actually be able to keep him.

That’s the luxury of knowing who your owner will be..

"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry

by EJThunder on Jan 18, 2009 2:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I am

thinking Lilly will once again repeat his past couple seasons.

"You can't take life to seriously, you don't get out of it alive"

by wild bill on Jan 18, 2009 2:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Zambrano

I see him winning more than 14 games.

by elgato on Jan 18, 2009 2:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I see a big rebound.

If he doesn’t get 16-18 win I will be disappointed.

"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry

by EJThunder on Jan 18, 2009 6:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I would like to start out by saying two things.

1. Lou completely ruined Pies trade value. There was no reason to not let him play last year. I really am disgusted that we just killed the value of a once elite prospect.

2. That being said kudos to Jim Hendry. I didnt think we could get more than a bag of balls for Pie. WIth his options out I figured teams would offer us junk to get him or just wate and see if he made it through waivers.

That being said I like Olson. He reminds me of Marhsall a little bit but with higher upside. He was a pretty high prospect and lets be honest the AL East isnt the easiest place to pitch. This also gives us another arm to compete for the rotation which is good for our team. I also like the other guy because he seems to K people pretty well. THats important to me.

All in all I give an F to Lou for screwing Pies Valus
and an A to Lou for getting something positive for him.

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 2:36 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

You say ...

… Lou ruined Pie’s trade value, but Hendry got two good pitchers for him. Thus, his value wasn’t ruined. I think this got excellent value for Pie.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I consider it ruined becuase we could have gotten so much more

last offseason. We could have gotten the player from the O’s that we needed.

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 2:39 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I can understand frustration with Lou's banishment of Pie...

…but had Pie Pie performed as expected or met high expectations then we wouldn’t be concerned about his trade value….In other words, I don’t think his trade value was diminished, as the Cubs received good value in return, it was more that Lou ended Pie’s career as a Cub.

by DudeVf11 on Jan 18, 2009 3:34 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

THat being said I am happier with this package then I thought I would be

If we can get anything close to this for Rich Hill I will be ecstatic. I have faith though. We did give up Todd Hundley for Karros and Grudz and Jose Hernandez and Hill for Aramis and Lofton

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 2:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Hill will probably have to be traded in a package with someone else.

Although, since he’s lefthanded, maybe some team would want him just by himself.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:48 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

exactly

I thought Pie straight up for Olson would bee a stretch. This was a great trade. Pie’s “prospect” status really helped us in this transaction.

by PieFan08 on Jan 18, 2009 4:01 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Felix's value

Felix Pie was once a Top 30 BA prospect. Garrett Olson never made their top 100 list. So, Felix’s value took a real hit since he was first brought up to the majors.

Felix should be compared to Carlos Gonzalez who headlined the Matt Holliday trade. In 2006, Pie was #27 and Gonzales #32 on their prospect list. Gonzalez got half a season to try and prove he could hit. He managed a .242/.273/.361 line. That’s not quite as good as Felix’s career line in less at bats, at bats which also were scattered across inconsistent playing time.

What Jim got was good given the PR damage that was already done, but make no mistake, there was definitely PR damage done.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:08 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

I Disagree,,,

,,, I’d venture to say that Pie ruined Pie’s trade value.

The table is now set for a Peavy deal. Now, all we need is Ricketts to approve the increase in 2010 payroll, and we’ve got #44…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 2:41 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And thus the endless debate goes on

Was it Lou or was it Pie?

Well, thankfully, we’ll have an answer and the endless debate will end. Pie will have his shot and will either emerge or go down as one of those top 25 prospects who never made it.

Hopefully, part of the DeRosa package joins Olson in bringing back Peavy so that there isn’t hand-wringing later about Pie’s success (if he succeeds).

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 4:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

See Hee Seop Choi, Bobby Hill, Corey Patterson...

Felix Pie was a failure of the Cub system, not Lou Piniella. In the same way that Corey Patterson was a failure of the system and not Dusty Baker.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 5:01 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Do I sense a pattern here?

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jan 18, 2009 10:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

All one has to do...

…is look at the Cub’s position player track record for the last 15 years to understand where the problem has been – talent evaluation, scouting, player development and a flawed position player philosophy which fed what I just mentioned.

If anything hurt Pie’s chances of becoming a ML success with the Cubs, it happened before Lou ever laid eyes on him.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jan 18, 2009 10:43 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

that last sentence

is laughably incorrect.

bring up felix.

by kylejo on Jan 19, 2009 9:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And you base that on what exactly?

You have your opinion and I have stated mine. Neither of us can say for sure what the right answer is, but this is one thing I feel very strongly about. I really don’t think the Cub’s long track record of poor position player development is just bad luck.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jan 19, 2009 10:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Here's a good question on this topic

What went differently with Geovany Soto and Mike Fontenot? Both of those guys came out of nowhere in a sense. No one expected the kind of hitting they have brought to the major leagues. You have seen a pattern of failure. Is there something about those two which sets them apart and helps us see what the Cubs might start doing right?

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 19, 2009 11:06 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I Agree With You...

…although some had a thought about Soto after he went on a strict diet that Blanco advised him on. He had a great last year in AAA, and then a great September in 2007.

Nonetheless, given what you were trying to prove, I agree with you…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 19, 2009 11:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm actually not trying to prove anything with this question.

You can buy into MPH73’s premise that the Cubs have had an organizational tragic flaw in development/scouting for a long time that 1) has just started to change or 2) somehow didn’t affect Soto/Fonty or 3) something else.

It’s possible the Cubs have just been lucky, but the fact of the Cubs’ inability to follow all the way through on a position player prospect is there. I don’t think it’s scouting, because the Cubs have a lot of guys other teams’ scouts liked over the years (Cedeno, Dopirak, Harvey, Nic Jackson, Kelton, Hill, Montanez – all top 100 prospects in the 2000s). But it could very well be a lack of overall discipline or something else.

I respect MPH73’s perspective and am curious what he thinks may have changed, if anything, with Fontenot and Soto.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 20, 2009 7:55 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

15 years is a long time...

…and more than enouph time to factor out luck/bad luck etc. By accident, an organization should produce a handful of position players that excel at the big league level over that long a period of time.

Remember one thing, Fotenot was not a Cub’s draft pick and was a first round pick of the O’s and he spent his developmental years with in the O’s system. With Soto, I just think he is the type of guy who was going to succeed no matter what the circumstances and some players are like that.

I will say that I think the last 2-3 years has gotten better in regards to how prospects are developed in the minor leagues. The main reason for that; is the fact that Hendry has allowed quality people to take control of that and has been less hands on. Hendry has always been enamoured with a “5 tool” thought process and also has liked hitters who have been free swingers. For all those who think Baker was bad with ignoring OBP, Hendry put this same stamp on scouting, drafting and player development since he took over the farm in 94. Only in the last few years, has he backed off in this area and let others instill a more balanced approach.

Bottom line; I just don’t think Hendry had the right perspective on how to recognize ML hitting talent and how to develop each prospects own skills to give them the best chance to succeed. The long track record certainly indicates a problem, but I do think they are moving in the right direction.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Jan 20, 2009 9:24 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

"enouph" should be spelled "enough"

I agree that the organization has been too infatuated with “toolsy” guys. I disagree, however, that we’ve really gotten away from that in our farm system yet. Wilken was a toolsy guy too, and drafting guys like Colvin seem to suggest that the farm is still largely following the same format.

by SouthernCub on Jan 20, 2009 2:54 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Lou didnt ruin him

He just didnt play a kid who was not producing. Cannot fault Lou for wanting to win.

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 6:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Paul Sullivan's got stuff up now:
While Olson will get a chance to make the Cubs rotation this spring, the club is seemingly stockpiling pitching inventory in case a Peavy deal gets revisited after the club is sold.

Link.

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 2:38 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

That's pretty much what some of us are thinking, too.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 2:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly...

…someone above said it perfectly. We are in good shape if we swing the Peavy deal… and we’re in good shape if we don’t.

Well said.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 2:41 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Peavy Next?

If this deal goes down, can Hendry do it without Marshall and Vitters?

I think Towers was asking for 6-7 players before because Marquis was considered part of the package, and Towers likely asked for more if he’d have to take on half of Marquis’ salary. Now that this is no longer the case, perhaps we can do it for 5-6 players.

And… if we take Vitters our of the equation, perhaps we’re back to 6-7 players?

I think Olson would be a great substitute for Marshall (Towers kept asking for Marshall, Hendry kept saying no). How’s this:

(1) Cedeno
(2-3) 2 pitchers from the DeRosa deal (not Stevens)
(4) Hart
(5) Wuertz
(6) Olson

Is there any way Hendry can pull this off without Vitters?

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 2:46 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

5 players

Vitters, Olson, Cedeno, Stevens and Wuertz

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 3:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Hart Instead Of...

… Wuertz. And, let’s see if the Cubs can hold on to Stevens and offer up the other two…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:24 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Dealing Wuertz saves money.

..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 3:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Correct...

…and, he’s out of options and likely out a musical chair.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

the question is not what we want, we want Peavy---it is what SD wants

They—-meaning SD, (can walk away from the deal), and we want Peavy——what does SD want?

SS, so they can dump their current SS and get some value Kahill.
SP’g that is young—-Olson and lefty
SP’g that is young—-Stevens
RP’g that is young—-Hart
Prospect that is big——Vitters
Throw in——Rich Hill

Cubs keep Marshall, Wuertz,

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Jan 18, 2009 5:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Does Piniella Want...

…Wuertz, though? And, we can save $1M by dealing him.

And, instead of Stevens, throw in the other two from the DeRosa deal.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

24 recomendations?

geez thats gotta be a record!

Erm, well if we are going to call Milton Bradley nicknames, mine is Fischer Price: yes, you heard it here first..

by Chanman25 on Jan 18, 2009 2:47 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

It sure looks as though

Hendry is setting the table for a Peavy deal, things are starting to line up.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Jan 18, 2009 2:49 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Yea, plus I was reading quotes from Hendry, saying that he feels confident that

by opening day fans will feel they have a better team than last year. Sounds to me like a guy with a few more tricks uo his sleeve…

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 2:52 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

hey my bad about posing another one of these

but i like the move. It looks like Hendry is really pushing for Peavy to be in a Cub uniform. Also about rich harden, hopefully that tear will recover and no doubt with Peavy, the Cubs will have one of the better rotations in the big leagues.

by lexmarklover on Jan 18, 2009 2:51 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Is Hendry Aware

That Olson bats right handed?

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 2:56 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Doh!

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 2:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I really hope this leads to Peavy

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 2:57 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Felix Pie ruined Felix Pie

If the peanut gallery wants to take keeping cheap shots at Lou Piniella, then so be it. Its the same criticism that people showered on Dusty Baker when Corey Patterson was mercifully let go. And we all saw how that turned out.

Fact is Lou Piniella was right in his assessment of Pie. I trust his eye for talent far more than I do a bunch of sour ass fans.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:00 PM CST reply actions   1 recs

indeed

however, at some point, it might behoove the Cubs to determine why several of their “top prospects” are flaming out.

by dmlichte on Jan 18, 2009 3:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Bad scouting, player selection and development...

Look at the pattern the past 20 years. These “can’t miss” prospects aren’t flaming out because of bad decisions at the big league level. Rather they are flaming out because they were bad acquisitions right out of the gate. Luis Montanez, Ryan Harvey, Brian Dopirak, Corey Patterson, Felie Pie, Tyler Colvin…the list goes on and on and on.

Dusty Baker and Lou Piniella haven’t failed these kids. That is the greatest fallacy that exists among some Cub fans.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:42 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Can agree with this

The Cubs have awful scouting. Luckily teams still make deals with Jim Hendry..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:41 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Please.

“Awful” scouting. That’s a joke.

Brian McRae's 5 o'clock shadow

by PurpleLineToWrigley on Jan 18, 2009 7:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

We should

just send them all, the scouts, a nice hardcover copy of “Moneyball”. As our highly touted prospects have proven over and over again being “toolsy” or being an “athlete” isn’t as certain as many think.

by nick_reny on Jan 18, 2009 10:54 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That is the case with every club.

Having highly touted prospects that bust is not mutually exclusive to the Cubs. Look at the White Sox- Joe Borchard, Royce Ring, Brian Anderson (who essentially IS Felix Pie.)

Borchard was considered the top prospect in baseball for like 3 years from ‘02-’04.

Brian McRae's 5 o'clock shadow

by PurpleLineToWrigley on Jan 18, 2009 7:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Because he was dead on re Eyre and Howry

I was so glad we dumped a worthless lefty and kept such a good one as Howry, After all Lou said he sat down and had a talk with
Bobby and that of course solved everything.

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Jan 18, 2009 3:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I get it Jessica

You don’t like Lou Piniella. In your view he is a tired bloated crotchety old man who is clueless.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:49 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

yeh

and we get it…. felix pie can’t hit, lou is a savior, etc…

you’re seriously going to get on others for repeating their sentiments? REALLY?

you’re on your 6th user name of doing this

by DartmouthCubsFan on Jan 18, 2009 4:55 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Good move even if a Peavy deal doesn't go down ..

The Pie Experiment is now officially over. S’bout time ..

There are those who think Lou didn’t give him a fair shake.

I disagree. He had fair chances at showing what he could do and didn’t execute. Plain and simple. Had PIe played up to the potential he showed in AAA ball, there would have been no need to have signed an Edmonds or Johnson. Prospects are a dime a dozen in the game and Felix’s luster just wore off. I’ve never seen anyone on the Cubs who could tear around a diamond faster .. he was amazing. But while he had iffy OF skills, his bat and baserunning just didn’t add up.

I knew that after last year, he was gone.

Well, Next Year is here .. and Jack's century's gotta end some time .. GO CUBBIES!

by cubnational on Jan 18, 2009 3:05 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Desomnd?

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 3:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

WE GOTTA GO BACK KATE!

WE GOTTA GO BACK!!!!

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Jan 18, 2009 3:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I cant wait till Wednesday!!

I am super pumped

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 4:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Starts at 7 pm

Two new eps, “Because You Left” and “The Lie”, start at 8 after the recap episode.

JOHN LOCKE FTW

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Jan 18, 2009 5:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Benjamin Linus FTW

John Locke FTC

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 9:06 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm unfamiliar with FTC

But John Locke is the most important character in the show. Without him, we don’t have the heart and soul of the island…and the Oceanic 6 wouldn’t be screaming “WE HAVE TO GO BACK!!!”

Evey Hammond: Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici. V: By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

by dtpollitt on Jan 18, 2009 9:49 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Have you read Jeff Jensen's theory at EW.com?

He thinks that when Charlie told Hurley to tell Jack “You aren’t supposed to raise him” the “him” refers to Locke and not Aaron. Plus, when Claire says, “Don’t bring him back,” to Kate, she’s also referring to Locke, not to Aaron.

Anyway, one way or another, we’re “going back” this Wednesday…

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 10:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

For the coffin

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 19, 2009 11:33 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That goes...

“bretha”.

Kwa...Ki...Sur...Pee...Nee...Ku?

by Kinky Reggae on Jan 18, 2009 3:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pie Had Chances

And never turned them into anything more than a bench role player. He turned down guidance from Perry and Sarge, he erfused to make adjustments, and wanted to go strictly on sheer talent alone. The typical Million Dollar talent with a Nickle mind.

Good luck with McFail and the O’s. Maybe when he is a FA he can also join Dusty in Cinci, since he is following KPats lead.

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 3:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Am I missing something on Olson?

He’s been pretty awful in his short time in the majors-I hope this leads to another deal…but Pie is just another case of the Cubs mishandling their youth system

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jan 18, 2009 3:21 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Kevin Towers likes him.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 3:23 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

lets hope so

though Im really starting to see some more merit in forgetting Peavy and signing Sheets

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jan 18, 2009 3:24 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

he threw more inninngs last year than Peavy

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jan 18, 2009 3:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

yeah, but ...

And Peavy had way more innings in 2005, 2006 and 2007 than Sheets. Sheets hasn’t even pitched 200 innings in a season since 2004.

AND … Sheets is three years older.

by elgato on Jan 18, 2009 3:38 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

could mean that Peavy is starting become Sheets

and his breakdown is about to begin, where Sheets might be climbing out of his, and by throwing less breaking balls he might be doing just that

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jan 18, 2009 4:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

well, yeah

and monkeys might fly out of my butt.

by elgato on Jan 18, 2009 5:08 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

No,

I suspect that somebody is interested in him, and he’s just passing through. Young lefties are always in vogue anyway — no matter their stats. Somebody is thinking that they can fix him, Cubs or otherwise.

by Damen Jackson on Jan 18, 2009 3:25 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Olson is pitching depth for the Cubs

Former manager Dick Williams had a great axiom….“there is no such thing as a team having too much good pitching.” Olson comes in here and provides depth and insurance for the starting rotation.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:27 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Unless...

…he’s flipped.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:27 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Perhaps...

I’ve sensed that the Cubs were on the lookout for a lefty starter — not named Marshall — to fill out the staff.

But the profile on this guy doesn’t seem to quite fit with a Lou Piniella player, so I’m leaning toward a flip, until I hear different.

by Damen Jackson on Jan 18, 2009 3:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I Have a Feeling...

…our 5th starter will be Harden.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't disagree...

I’ve said numerous times that I think he’ll slot that way to start the season. But the Cubs are still looking for another starter.

by Damen Jackson on Jan 18, 2009 3:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You May Have Missed My Point...

… with Peavy, Harden may become our #5…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Ahh...

Well, fingers crossed.

by Damen Jackson on Jan 18, 2009 3:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I've Been Limping Lately...

… cuz my toes are crossed, too…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If that's the case, my 4.5 starter rotation could come to pass.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 3:49 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It's a lot more plausible in that scenario...

Four upper-tier starters and a guy who needs to be coddled to stay healthy.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 3:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Makes a lot of sense.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 5:05 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Al, your 4.5 regular rotation works with Peavy

Harden is in PT/rehab and could start the year on the DL, which would make real sense for April. Cubs then can carry 11 pitchers for the first month—-not until April 19th do they need a 5th starter.

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Jan 18, 2009 5:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 7:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

More Like 5.5...

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:41 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Just more support for Peavy...

Thanks for the Dick Williams axiom

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 3:35 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't see Peavy happening

On paper the Cubs remain the clear class of the NL Central. Coupled with these very bad economic times and the eventual sale of the Cubs I don’t see the wisdom of acquiring Jake Peavy. I also take to heart Jim Hendry’s glowing commentary on the future of Josh Vitters.

What Hendry has done with these moves is shed money in order to do other things (e.g., Milton Bradley) while stockpiling younger talent for the system.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 3:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Let's See...

… if he can swing a deal sans Vitters……………..

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 3:41 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I wouldn't

Without Vitters Towers is just getting a bunch of average pitching prospects. Vitters brings the upside that the others don’t have.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 3:49 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Still are stockpiling even if

they lose Stevens and Olson. They picked up 3 other minor leaguers from these 2 deals..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:03 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Olson is similar to Marshall

Look at Olson’s 2007 minor league numbers. He was rushed last year unlike Marshall who has been babied. If they were reversed, Marshall’s numbers could look like Olson’s.

They both are potential middle of the rotation starters.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 3:47 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Actually, I think Marshall was also rushed to the big leagues in 2006.

He was only with the Cubs due to injuries. He had never pitched above AA before making his debut against the Cardinals on ESPN’s Sunday Night Baseball.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jan 19, 2009 12:09 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 19, 2009 12:11 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Package for Pie vs. DeRosa?

Anyone else think that the Cubs made out much better in the Pie trade with Baltimore than they did with the DeRosa trade? It just seems a little odd that the trade value of Pie would be that much higher than DeRosa, in that we seemed to get a lot more upside and known quantities from Baltimore then Cleveland.

Don’t get me wrong – I trust Hendry and the guys in the front office have done their homework, but in terms of trade value, I can’t imagine many teams disagreeing that DeRosa > Pie and Olson/Williamson > Stevens/Gaub/Archer.

by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Jan 18, 2009 4:06 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

See Santana vs Bedard or Haren

Santana didn’t draw the best deal either.

DeRosa only had one likely destination with Cleveland.

by rlpete on Jan 18, 2009 4:07 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Wasn't Minnesota Interested As Well?

Though point taken on the other packages – I know this is where you have to be careful to look at deals independently. I guess it’s a bit frustrating that if we got this much for Pie, why couldn’t we get more for DeRosa 2 weeks earlier?

by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Jan 18, 2009 4:14 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

There were several teams interested in DeRosa

Remember, he could have been traded as 2B or a 3B in a year when there weren’t many 3B worth getting on the FA market.

Hendry (or Towers) saw something in those 3 from Cleveland and chose that deal instead of others.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Interesting...

But what if you take into consideration salaries of DeRosa vs Pie, and the age factor.

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 4:08 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Plus Team Expectations IMO

Cleveland seems to be in the drivers seat in the AL Central based on the rosters, while Baltimore is looking at NYY and Bos in a much tougher AL East

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 4:11 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pie will turn 24 in Feb.

Mark DeRosa will be 34 that same month. That’s mostly the reason why we got a little more for Pie, he’s still a prospect.

"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!" -Homer J. Simpson

by Whitebacon on Jan 18, 2009 4:08 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

And

About a $5 million difference in salary (correct me if I am wrong)

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 4:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You have to consider cost-containment when talking about these things...

Pie clearly hasn’t shown he’s the offensive player DeRosa is, and he may never show that ability. He’s shown defensively that he’s great in CF, though.

But the real key is that DeRosa is a $5 million player for one year, while Pie is cost-contained for the next few years. It all depends on how GMs value prospects versus cash.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Team Motivation

Every team has different needs – and a younger team such as Baltimore that isn’t going to be contending right away will likely view Pie as more valuable than DeRosa, but for as highly as DeRosa is regarded in relation to Pie among Cub Nation and DeRosa being relatively cheaply priced for a one-year rental, it’s a bit frustrating in hindsight to see what we received in the Cleveland deal.

Let’s just say as disappointing as my initial reaction was to the DeRosa deal, I’m pleasantly surprised to our return in the Pie trade.

by Hawkeye Hellraiser on Jan 18, 2009 4:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Moot...

… if the players combined are flipped to land Peavy, and we keep a A or AA player or two for ourselves…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pie = Olson

With both players having a similar history: very good minor league numbers and very bad performances in the bigs.

I definitely like this trade, as I’d rather give an oportunity to Olson than to Pie. And if this turns into a part of a Peavy trade then better still.

Btw, maybe I missed it being discussed, but I think one angle on the Peavy trade is that Hendry knows it’s possible Harden won’t be resigned (if he wants to many years with his health history, or if he has a bigger injury) and essentially Peavy would replace Harden in the rotation. It’s clear that if you lose Harden and don’t get Peavy that the rotation will become a lot more iffy. So, while Peavy would be outstading for 2009, Hendry may be thinking a lot of 2010 too.

by Luis on Jan 18, 2009 4:29 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Agreed

BTW McPhail said they are going to let Pie hit…. I really am intrigued to see how this turns out.

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 4:36 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It's the only thing they can do...

If you’re going to trade for Pie (and especially if you’re trading Olson and change), you have to be willing to put him in the lineup and see how it works out. Otherwise, it’s a completely pointless trade, as you don’t trade Olson for a guy whom you plan to use as a backup OF.

I agree though: it will be interesting to see how it works out.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:39 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If we get Peavy...

Harden will almost surely be allowed to walk after the season. There’s not likely to be payroll space for both. The Cubs would then have to replace two spots in the rotation, with Harden and Lilly leaving. Hopefully at that point some of our young pitchers would be ready to step into the back end of the rotation.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not so fast.....

That would depend on the pockets of the new owners (of course, that means we are actually sold by then as well)

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 4:39 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

True...

but the pockets would probably have to open quite a bit to retain Harden, considering that Lilly is pretty much the only guy coming off the books and the contracts do escalate next year.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:41 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Whoops...

you’re right. Makes it even more likely that Harden would be let go if Peavy is acquired.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:52 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Harden is gone regardless

they are grooming Atkins or Samardz for the role

I think Peavy is 80% now…..

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Jan 18, 2009 5:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I think Hendry

May be wary (and rightfully so) about another Wood/Prior situation with Harden. He has shown to have learned from his mistakes by not entertaining a multi-year deal for Wood.

And you definitely offer arbitration to Peavy, so you maybe you can get a nice first rounder for him.

by Luis on Jan 18, 2009 5:55 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Agree

That’s another reason why getting Peavy is important.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 6:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I do believe

It was a 4 year deal, meaning you are correct

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 4:52 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Right...

and because we then don’t get Lilly off the books, the payroll will already have escalated substantially without resigning Harden. Keeping him would mean the payroll would REALLY have to go up – and it’s already pretty high.

by SouthernCub on Jan 18, 2009 4:54 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Why Would Lilly Be Leaving?

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pie > Olson

Olson never had the ceiling that Pie has. Pie was a top 30 BA prospect twice. Olson never made the top 100.

You’re right about their similarities, but there’s a reason we got a second prospect in this trade, and there’s a reason you’ll be reading more articles like this one, saying Baltimore won this deal.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 5:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah and

Wasn’t Patterson considered at one time to be the #1 prospect in all of baseball? Pie’s minor league numbers mean squat to me since he has holes in his swing that pitchers in the minors don’t care much to exploit while in the majors and winter leagues he gets a diet of the stuff he can’t hit.

The one thing I’m the most happy about is that now Pie will have his 600 AB to show what he can do and we can all talk on real numbers rather than what would have been. I know there is a chance he can have a good ML career, but I think the overwhelming odds is that he is another Patterson.

by Luis on Jan 18, 2009 5:43 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Prospect ratings don't guarantee success

but they do give us a good measure of how players who haven’t established themselves at the MLB level are valued in comparison to each other.

I’m also glad Pie will get his shot.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 6:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

FLAMING OUT ..............

I know that I tend to live in the past at times that is not good .. For a few years we heard that BOBBY HILL would be a great young prospect ..Gone to Pittsburgh if I remember right ….THen Corey Patterson and now Felix Pie who were all good young prospects who would change the team …..( or so we were told ) …..I hope this trade works out for the best …But it makes you wonder …..

by cubs north on Jan 18, 2009 4:47 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

MacPhail on Pie

http://masnsports.com/2009/01/macphail-on-the-trade.html

Sounds like they expect him to play LF.

Lets not forget that Pie is out of options. I assume he’ll have every chance to prove himself and perform or underperform for quite some time. But if the time comes where the Pie experiment in Baltimore looks like it did here, MacPhail will have given up Olson and another minor leaguer for nothing.

by dmlichte on Jan 18, 2009 4:56 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

McPhail is looking at this the right way...

Adam Jones has a high ceiling in center and Nick Markakis is on his way to a great career in right field. Sounds to me that Baltimore is rightfully looking at Felix Pie as a calculated gamble. If he can earn playing time in left field, then great. If not, then they revert back to Luke Scott.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 5:13 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I like this deal only becasue we were never going to let Pie play

Even after he crushed he ball in ST we didnt give him a fair amount of PT i April… I thnk Olson can be good too.. Maybe we can now do something like Stevens Olson Marshall Castillo Cedeno and Hart for PEAVY.. I really dont want to give up Vitters but if we nee to to get Peavy, i think that means we can get a ring

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 4:57 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Jake Peavy

Josh Vitters has to be a centerpiece. Sorry, I’m not inclined to do a deal. Not with the Cubs remaining the clear favorite in the NL Central and not with our decent level of pitching depth.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 5:03 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

You rip the Cubs talent evaulation, but now

are against dealing Vitters for a known commodity. You like to have it both ways it seems.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't see the need for Jake Peavy

Not when the payroll is already very large in these bad economic times. And especially when I see the Cubs still the clear favorite in a watered down NL Central. Cubs have good quality and depth in the starting rotation. If something changes to alter that equation then we have the flexibility to make a mid-season deal.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 5:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

What the heck do "bad economic times" have to do with anything?

The Cubs just raised ticket prices in “bad economic times”.

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 5:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

LSA, my friend.

L-S-A.

"They say we live and learn. Often what we learn is what damn fools we have been." ~Thomas Sowell

by Goodie1969 on Jan 18, 2009 9:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

This from the guy who says

you can never have enough good pitching?? Harden’s fragile, Dempster may not be nearly as good….

Peavy’s a huge boost, if you’re trying to win a World SEries. Sounds like you’re content with winning the NL Center.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If it was maybe any other franchise in baseball

I could understand that line of thinking, but we’re talking about the Cubs here. Even if Peavy gives the Cubs the smallest of advantages in winning a world series, i’ll take that over some unproven 19 year old prospect.

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 5:13 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Mike said previously that Cubs talent evaluation sucks

but now wants to keep a 19 year old…

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

All the hype

For Josh Vitters does not mean he will meet the expectations, how many times have we been down the road of a young talent being touted as the next coming, to see anything but that happen as the kid moves up the ranks?

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:09 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Felix Pie, Corey Patterson, Bobby Hill

Hee Sop Choi,,,,, there’ s a longggggggggggggg list..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Why do we need Jake Peavy right now?

He isn’t going anywhere. Lets see how this 2009 Cub team plays out and the level of true competition we face in the National League. Then if necessary go after Jake Peavy midseason. At some point there needs to be some sanity to the amount of dollars committed to this starting rotation.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 5:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Just a few years ago

the Cubs were loaded with Wood, Prior, Z and Clement. 3 of those guys aren’t starters any longer. Starting pitching is the one spot you stockpile..

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:19 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

As the old saying goes

Why put off til tomorrow, what you can do today.

I say make the move and get out the gate hot.

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:19 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Why DON'T we need him?

Isn’t pitching king? I thought you could never have too much.

It blows my mind that anyone wouldn’t want the 5 best pitchers you can possibly get. If we have a chance to get him without harming our depth or handicapping our roster, than why the hell wouldn’t we?

by Wreckard on Jan 19, 2009 11:10 AM CST up reply actions   1 recs

Rec'd

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 19, 2009 11:21 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

heh heh, Wreckard got wrecked (Rec'd)... ;-)

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jan 19, 2009 12:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Wreckard'd, surely

"Who's Bob Brenly? The guy that used to be the manager for Arizona?" ~ Alfonso Guilleard Soriano

by JohnM on Jan 19, 2009 4:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

So....

If Vitters is needed to get Peavy, why not make the move? For every Dontrell Willis we have traded, we have kept five Feliz Pie’s and turned down MLB players in the process. Just my two cents.

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree completely on the value of prospects in the Cub system

All I’m saying is that I don’t see the urgency of trading for Jake Peavy if the pricetag includes Josh Vitters. I am far more inclined to let the season start and reevaluate later on.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 5:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

One Reason

If Vitters gets injured, or starts horribly, and Peavy starts out red hot, we will need to offer more, and once again shot ourselves in the foot.

Then again, same can happen with Peavy not producing or being hurt, so its a roll of the dice either way.

All things considered, take the sure bet in a former CY Young winner over a minor league prospect IMO.

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:22 PM CST up reply actions   2 recs

Exactly

Vitters breaks his leg or hits .071 and Pads may not deal.. Olson or Stevens could get hurt too. Do this now.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:24 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Jake Peavy will be there in June or July if we still want and/or need him

Sorry, but I don’t do a deal right now. Not when the payroll is already well north of $120 million and where the Cubs look strong on paper.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 5:22 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I'm sorry, but you have to bring it a little stronger than that for me to understand your argument

And what exactly is your fascination with the teams payroll all about? You’re not writing the checks. If the franchise feels they want to spend a little more on a team to help our chances you should be happy.

by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 18, 2009 5:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

With Peavy

our rotation is (no order)
Zambrano
Lilly
Dempster
Harden
Peavy

Marshall can be swingman if not traded…….

With Vitters. we have an uncertainity at the 5th spot, where neither Olson or Marshall have proven they can take the ball every 5th day, and this is where losing Marquis shows. He was not a great pitcher, but a very solid #5 who was over paid.

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:30 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Marshall is More Important With That Rotation...

… since you have 4 righties…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Now a budget hawk

I recall when you ripped the Cubs for not spending enough. Good luck getting Peavy if Vitters is hitting .071 and Olson gets hurt in spring training.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

and

is Peavy is 10-2 with an ERA around or under 2.50, the trade value just went up, and other teams will be in the hunt. At that point Peavy might expand his teans to include NYY, BOS, etc

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Door... ass

Get out, you freaking bust.

There is no such thing as an ugly female breast

by Worf on Jan 18, 2009 5:27 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Who helps you more in 2009

Vitters or Peavy?

Vitters might in trade value if he starts strong, Peavy can by taking the ball every 5th day

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:28 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I'm tired of the Cubs hanging onto alleged studs

They could have got better players if they dealt Pie sooner. If Vitters turns out to be good, who cares, Peavy’s a Cy Young winner. However, there’s a good change Vitters turns out to be another bust.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jan 18, 2009 5:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

+1

"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 18, 2009 5:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

interesting review

Padres need to reduce payroll more….and wanted Olson for Greene, they wanted Marshall as well, plus Hart and Vitters.

Wonder if they would take Olson, Hill, Hart Vitters and Cedeno……possibly a Gaub if they had to.

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Jan 18, 2009 6:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Good news for DLee and Project 3000

I’ll have to do some searching in the BCB archives to find out exactly how much, but since Pie was dealt BEFORE the end of Cubs Convention weekend, I owe a contribution to Project 3000.

Drewish, I think you were in on this as well, taking up my side. I just can’t remember who we bet with. Anyway, I gotta go find my checkbook now…

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jan 18, 2009 5:47 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

You could buy a BCB shirt if you want...

… $8 from every shirt goes to Project 3000.

"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx

by Al on Jan 18, 2009 7:18 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Prospects have 2 uses:

1) to play them
2) to trade them.
If you don’t plan on doing #1, and sticking with them despite their struggles, you may as well do #2 while they still have value. Too bad they didn’t heed this with Pie a few years back.
Hindsight’s always 20/20, but if we had traded Pie and Hill just 1 year ago, we’d probably have Roberts now. Sigh….

by reedjohnson on Jan 18, 2009 5:48 PM CST reply actions   2 recs

Rec'd and well said.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 6:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Well

That is certainly not a fair analysis, especially for Hill. Hill was under club control for a lot of year, had absolutely crazy numbers in AAA and a very very good 2007 season. I think the Cubs did the right thing in not trading him. Things just don’t work out sometimes.

Pie, on the other hand, I never liked. Hopefully this organization is getting rid of the toolsy types and starting a new philosphy. They traded Eric Patterson last year. Now Pie. I think Colvin will be a bust too, for the same reasons as the other guys.

by Luis on Jan 18, 2009 6:00 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Cubs do seem to be getting rid of the prospect crap

Which is good. Matt Murton, Eric Patterson, Felix Pie all mercifully gone. I agree that Tyler Colvin may be next on the list.

What I’d really like to know is how Oneri Flieta continues to maintain employment. It’s not Lou Piniella or Dusty Baker failing these can’t miss prospects. Rather it is these can’t miss prospects turning out to be colossal busts. And that is a failure in scouting, player selection and development.

by BLou on Jan 18, 2009 7:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Looking back Hendry has held pretty much to plan this off season

Fukudome is building his body strength
Harden is physical training/rehab’g his shoulder

FA acquisition of LH thumper in the OF in budget
Salary dump of Marquis

trade of DeRosa and FA signing of Miles
FA signing of Dempster

trade for late game reliever

now if he can pull off this spare parts/prospect trade for a Cy Young pitcher to complete his bullpen.

He then needs to solve the RH utility IF and back up catcher

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Jan 18, 2009 6:20 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Peavy To Complete His Bullpen?

Did you mean to say complete the starting rotation? In affect, you are completing the bullpen, as you can put Marshall in as the long lefty. Is that what you meant?

I agree, then Aurilia and Bako, and we are ready to rock and roll… unless we need a LOOGY.

All that done with a payroll around $143M. Right on target. And, he could push some players to shed another $4M if he needed to…

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:38 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

actually I think Marshall emerges as the best lefty out of the pen

Much will depend on Harden and the other’s health.

Look Gaudin can be the swing just the same allowing Marshall to concentrate on his role. As for Peavy of course I mis applied my fingers…..he anchors an already strong rotation. The whole stable allows Samardz to go to AAA and perfect his splitter, slider and change up for next year.

The key is that a strong rotation of 60% quality starts will take off the pressure of the bullpen where players can work on their roles and rhythm.

Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."

by Ivy Walls on Jan 18, 2009 10:51 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Jim Hendry on Pie

From Bruce Miles:

He (Pie) certainly shows you the skills from (age) 18-22 why he was kind of a hot-ticket guy. He’s a great outfielder. He can run well. At this point in his career, he hasn’t been able to shorten his swing enough to make it conducive to when you play part time, it’s hard for him to make the adjustments.

For those who still want to carry on the debate of whether or not it was Lou or Felix who “ruined” Felix (as if he didn’t end up showing improvement over 2008 and isn’t still young enough to be a successful major leaguer), Jim Hendry clearly says, “Both.” Felix didn’t do what his manager told him to do and Lou didn’t give Felix the chance to do it.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 7:57 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

It could be a good idea to keep Olson

His numbers weren’t good last year, but he had some very good starts, and a few really short 6 or 7 run outings against the Yanks and Red Sox. The NL central isn’t the AL east, and he might realy develop into a good starter.

by wfree0104 on Jan 18, 2009 8:17 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Pie SPEAKS!

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/sports/schmuck/

Good luck kid…. I dont care if you turn into a superstar.

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 9:19 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Good link

The quote most interesting to me from that:

How he describes his game: "I can bunt, I can run, I can steal a base and play defense and I can hit. Late in the game you need to steal a base, I can do that. I have a lot of things I can bring to the game. Now I can play every day and make adjustments.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 18, 2009 10:18 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

As Long As...

… the O’s don’t trade him to the NL Central after he does so.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:39 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

True

i think he is going to hit though, I am glad he will get the opportunity

"I played with one of the best pitchers in history, Greg Maddux," Zambrano said"

by fischisgod on Jan 18, 2009 10:49 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Personally...

… I think he’s stubborn. Similar to Corey Patterson. Those big, sweeping swings did them both in. I heard Eric Patterson was a lot more willing to listen and learn.

That’s my opinion.

My 2008 Christmas wish list includes this jersey. In Hendry We Trust! Current 2009 payroll.

by initram on Jan 18, 2009 10:52 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pie wasn't stubborn (at least to my eyes)

He tried to make the adjustments. I remember him watching a lot of borderline pitches, trying to adapt to Gerald Perry’s patient approach. It’s just hard to make adjustments to major league pitching, even when you’re getting to play every day.

I think people are quick to see Felix in Corey’s mold because they are speedy, left-handed centerfielders with power potential who did not find success with the Cubs – but that’s really all that is similar between them and their careers. People forget, for example, that Patterson had a half-year of success with the Cubs before Dusty’s ill-conceived lead-off experiment.

The author of this post is not a certified scout, doctor, agent, statistician, manager, or journalist, nor was he ever a very good player, though he tried very hard to be like Ryne Sandberg and was about as scrappy as it gets (in T-ball). Any opinion expressed above should in no way be confused with fact, truth, or reality and is hereby qualified in the following ways: 1) The author does not know as much about baseball as Lou Piniella. 2) The author does not know as much about baseball as Jim Hendry. 3) The author does not know as much about baseball as either Dusty or Darren Baker.

by DGU on Jan 19, 2009 12:15 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

On at least a couple of occasions in 2008.....

umps were ringing Felix up on Glavine-esque “borderline” pitches. It was particularly infuriating because, as you note, Felix was out there trying to make adjustments, and he was getting the “rookie treatment”.

MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown

by D98 on Jan 22, 2009 2:59 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Poor Felix,

the article said his mother died very recently.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jan 19, 2009 12:23 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I saw that too.

It is very sad. I wish him the best.

by sue369 on Jan 19, 2009 3:43 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You mean Elmer Fuld?

Be vewwy vewwy quiet.

I hitting changeups!

by northernsails on Jan 22, 2009 7:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I have to say good riddens...

I have a hatred of Felix Pie stemming from last year. Me and some guy friends of mine took a road trip to Vegas and we stopped by in Arizona where the Iowa Cubs were luckily playing. We went to the game and had an awesome time even though we lost the game. After the game, a bunch of kids and me were trying to get an autograph, Felix points to me and tells me to go towards the locker room area. I go over there, and Felix is talking to this larger woman giving her his phone number. All these kids are trying to get an autograph and he walks away into the locker room. It’s triple A, the least you can do is be good to your fans. Ever since then, I hope he failed and I’m sticking by that. I hope he never gets the chance to play in the majors.

by aznsensation on Jan 22, 2009 12:37 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

pie

unfortunately for felix there is no on the job training in chicago. if we were the same sorry ass 06 team he might have had a chance for playing time. not with lou.

by NOMAR on Jan 24, 2009 11:15 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

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