2003 Steroid Test Results
by Snake Plisskin on Feb 9, 2009 12:02 PM CST
57 comments
In the wake of A-Rod's alleged positive test being leaked the question as to whether or not the whole tests should be made public?
I was just watching ESPN and they were discussing this issue. The argument was that to make all the tests public would A) place the blame where it belongs and B) Remove the cloud of suspicion that now pervades every Major Leaguer that was tested at that time.
The counter is that these tests were done with the understanding that they would be annonoymous. And, that these tests were done five years ago. Could any punishment be given at this time? And, if so, what?
Not to mention that if the test results are made public...well, you know: everybody's name get's dragged through the mud. But, then again, they were the one's who screwed up.
So, what do you guys think?
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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One of these days Sam-ME Corky Steroid is going to get caught
I still can’t believe that Sosa hasn’t been thrown under the bus yet. Especially given how a number of his former Cub teammates couldn’t stand his guts. Maybe when Kerry Wood writes a book someday the truth will come out?
by BLou on Feb 9, 2009 12:05 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Maybe because he's innocent?
Breaking the “Sammy took roids and we have proof” story would be huge to any journalist. To think that people haven’t looked for evidence is naive. To think that maybe he is clean, considering there’s NO proof of anything, is getting more and more realistic.
by kanderber on Feb 9, 2009 12:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Then again...
…who thought A-Rod was guilty before, you know, 2 days ago?
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Feb 9, 2009 12:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Anybody who thinks Sosa is clean is living in the ultimate fantasy world
You have to first ignore the evidence that’s in front of your eyes-okay, all of the other overinflated sluggers who were suddenly hitting 50+ home runs were juiced, but Sammy was the one guy who did it all naturally?
by bluekoolaide on Feb 9, 2009 12:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's possible.
Sammy’s name hasn’t come up in reports, evidence (Mitchell Report), etc. or even been linked to steroid dealers like Bonds, Alex Rodriguez, Mark McGwire, Clemens, etc.
As of right now, and I stress that, Sammy Sosa shouldn’t be in the same sentence as the men listed above.
Nothing has implicated this man except for the usual “By golly, look at his HR totals. Where did this power come from?”
I have to give him the benefit of the doubt, like many of us should.
"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry
by EJThunder on Feb 9, 2009 12:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
and I am not going down this road again after yesterday…..
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 1:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not taking sides
Whether he did or not we may never know, and can’t label him unless there’s proof. However, because his name hasn’t come up means nothing. Do people think there is only one or two sources for steroids? That they all went to the same dealer? No. Balco was one company, one lab. Many players could have returned to their home countries in the off-season and received steroids there, where they may not be illegal. In which case the truth may never come out. I’m not saying any players did that, just that it’s possible.
I have nothing funny or creative to write.
by Canadian Cubs Fan on Feb 9, 2009 1:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Also
The sad thing is if he’s innocent he has no way of proving it.
I really feel bad for him if he is.
Barbara V. October 14, 1941 - December 19, 2008. A great lady who was a friend to all and like a second mom to her children's friends (she was my best friend's mom)
by cubstoseriesby100 on Feb 9, 2009 1:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Good post.
Sums up my feelings pretty well.
by kanderber on Feb 9, 2009 1:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think it's important to remember
most of the information that’s public now has come from a very limited number of sources (Canseco, BALCO, Radomski, etc.). They in turn have had contact in the context of steriods with a limited number of people and in some cases specific teams. Even with the release of the Mitchell report there was a sort of disclaimer that they had a hard time finding people willing to share what they knew, so I don’t believe they were claiming to have anything resembling a comprehensive list.
I’m NOT saying there should be a rush to judgement with Sosa or anyone else who hasn’t been named, but just because someone’s name hasn’t surfaced yet seems to me to be more a function of the limited nature of these contacts into the system than a suggestion of innocence.
by claypot33 on Feb 9, 2009 1:17 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
+1
I have nothing funny or creative to write.
by Canadian Cubs Fan on Feb 9, 2009 1:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The thing is, Sosa outsmarted everybody
Odds are he got his steroid back home in the DR. Odds are he paid cash. Therefore there is no paper evidence like has come out with these other guys. Somehow Sosa has managed so far to avoid actually being named. That will probably change later this week when the rest of those names leak.
Let the Blaine Gabbert era begin.
by nji232 on Feb 9, 2009 1:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
These test were done with a promise
that the results would remain confidential. What part of the phrase “results would remain confidential” don’t we understand?
The voyeur in me says yes, but the ethicist says no.
by leothelip on Feb 9, 2009 12:11 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
No...
… they shouldn’t be made public because MLB agreed that it wouldn’t. Of course the law supersedes MLB/union agreements. But aside from the leaks that are bound to come out, MLB needs to stand by the agreement they made.
by dmlichte on Feb 9, 2009 12:12 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Yes
anti-trust and illegal narcotics use over rule MLB’s agreement. in fact MLB should be held in contempt and obstruction for harboring felons IMO.
why should these players be allowed to break a federal law and get away with it, when if any one of us did a less crime, we are held accountable.
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 12:17 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Yes and no.
There was, as noted above, a promise of confidentiality. However, now that (likely) the most prominent name on the list has been made public, what justification do they have to keep the rest of the names hidden?
It’s a dilemma and I don’t have an easy answer.
"That's my opinion and if you don't like it, well, I have others." ~ Groucho Marx
by Al on Feb 9, 2009 12:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
it may
become public anyway, if Bonds/Clemens were failed that season since they are both in hot water.
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 12:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What kind of rationale is that?
“Well, one guys rights and trust were violated, so I guess we might as well just violate the rights and trust of everyone else now too.”
by Wreckard on Feb 9, 2009 1:48 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
How the heck did A-Rod's name arise?
He was on the list, obviously, but who decided to release his name? Why not release all of them?
I say No. I’m just curious as to how Rodriguez’s name got out.
Did SI pay a hefty price to get it? Are there going to be any legal ramifications because these results were not so confidential after all?
Ahhhh, questions….
"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry
by EJThunder on Feb 9, 2009 12:47 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Apparently
Several judges and many lawyers had access to the names, and the more there are, the better chance it will get leaked.
I have nothing funny or creative to write.
by Canadian Cubs Fan on Feb 9, 2009 1:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Novitzky's investigation has been leaky from the start
The man is trying to make a name for himself, and every time his team conveniently leaks “confidential” information out, such as the previously leaked grand jury testimony of Giambi, Bonds, etc, he gets the press he’s looking for.
You do realize that this is an IRS investigation right? One that’s been going on for 4 years and will at best get one man jailed for purgery?
Our tax dollars at work.
by Wreckard on Feb 9, 2009 1:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Another thing... this could even be another poll.
If these results were released, how would you feel if a well-liked Cubs player is on it?
I’d find it hard to completely cast them off. If this was a test prior to ‘03, I’d just hope that it hasn’t been done recently or no Cubs are currently doing it.
"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry
by EJThunder on Feb 9, 2009 12:50 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I must confess
I have not read Jose Canseco’s book, but it seems to me that everyone he mentioned eventually shows up as a steroid user. If anyone wants to know who used steroids the book would be a good place to start.
I feel some sympathy for McGuire and Sosa due to the fact that Bud and the rest of baseball looked the other way in ’98 when these two put baseball on their backs and revived it. Not a whole lot of sympathy due the the money made and the way they ducked the questions, but some.
by Chuck12570 on Feb 9, 2009 12:54 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Not an ARod fan, but...
it’s not right that he’s been singled out right now. 104 names on that list. Why do they get a free pass? Because ARod is more high profile, more disliked? Shagged Madonna?
I have nothing funny or creative to write.
by Canadian Cubs Fan on Feb 9, 2009 1:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I heard this on the radio
Someone called in the Score over the weekend and said maybe Sammy was off the roids by 03.
Barbara V. October 14, 1941 - December 19, 2008. A great lady who was a friend to all and like a second mom to her children's friends (she was my best friend's mom)
by cubstoseriesby100 on Feb 9, 2009 1:28 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
ESPN is now reporting that Rodriguez admits to using PEDs from 2001-03
He’s doing a 1-on-1 interview with Peter Gammons to air on Sports Center this evening. Tirico just broke the admission during “Tirico and Van Pelt.”
Honestly, I think putting all 103 remaining names out there will help people deal with the issue – like pulling a band aid off quickly. If names linger and slowly surface throughout the season, it’s going to be brutal.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Feb 9, 2009 1:31 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Good.
He sees what happened to Clemens and the others who still tried to take their own high road.
I have more respect for him, admitting it. May not give him brownie points for the Hall but he definitely earned some respect back.
"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry
by EJThunder on Feb 9, 2009 1:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It is good to hear an admission
He even used the words “I’m sorry” in the clip they just played. He said the “pressure to perform” when he got to Texas caused him to start using.
Now, I still don’t agree with what he did, but at least he’s owning up to it.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Feb 9, 2009 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Seems almost strange to hear an admission
But seriously, you would have to be an idiot not to admit it if it is true. The train wreck that Clemens and Bonds have made of themselves for not owning up to it is a pretty easy lesson to learn from.
"Ask Dad. He'll know. And on the off chance he doesn't, he'll make up something good"
by StevenABQ on Feb 9, 2009 2:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Whoever is doing his crisis management (and I'm sure a few people are behind it)
have advised him well. The first step in getting back in the public’s good graces is to admit it and seek forgiveness.
If he continues to produce at a Hall of Fame-level, then the fans will be back on his side.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Feb 9, 2009 2:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
he made a bad decision
and accepts his faults, I can accept that and move on. We did the same for Giambi and Pettite. Why not ARod. Too bad others cannot be man enough to own up to their actions.
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 2:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
it helps
eliminate the speculation of other players as well.
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 2:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
True
there will always be speculation of some players, but, I think in airing the names of everyone who has tested positive, it will put things in the open (at least for the 2003 season).
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on Feb 9, 2009 2:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not exactly on topic this topic exactly
But does anyone have any suspicions about D. Lee? Don’t get me wrong, I love him just as much as the rest of us. Even though everyone seems to believe he is underperforming and even when he struggles like he did the last year with GDP, he still is a great team player and by all accounts one of the best and nicest guys you’ll ever meet. Regardless, there seems to be a ridiculous spike in that 05 season. Not just with HR’s but with BA as well. Maybe he did just have a career year, and I know it was after mandatory testing was going on, it still seems odd. Not accusing, just wondering if anyone else thinks that sometimes.
by KButler on Feb 9, 2009 1:34 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Mann.... we can't be doing this.
I don’t like how, with steroids being out there, a players good stats over a period of time have to come in to question.
My point is that, unless there is evidence, I don’t believe in even thinking that way.
Hard work paying off vs. HGH paying off
We have to go with ‘hard work paying off’, first.
"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry
by EJThunder on Feb 9, 2009 1:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree
After seeing A-Rods name, I am firmly in the “everybody is guilty” camp. It may seem unfair, but I think its the reality of the situation.
Let the Blaine Gabbert era begin.
by nji232 on Feb 9, 2009 1:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Everybody is guilty
There you go!
Now, in the words of Sean Connery, “What are you prepared to do?”
Are you prepared to sell your tickets? Not watch games? Not support MLB in any way, shape or fashion?
If not, shut up with the moralizing. Everyone is guilty and you’re still here.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Feb 9, 2009 1:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't say I wouldn't watch baseball
I just said that everybody is guilty. People using steroids won’t stop me from watching baseball.
Let the Blaine Gabbert era begin.
by nji232 on Feb 9, 2009 1:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Good for you
Now we’ll see if the other moralizing hypocrites out here feel the same way.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Feb 9, 2009 1:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
People who say they won't watch baseball because of this stuff
Are the same people who still watch the NFL thinking nothing is wrong.
Let the Blaine Gabbert era begin.
by nji232 on Feb 9, 2009 2:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hypocrites?
how? to be hypocrites they themselves would have to be using performance enhancing drugs. I dont get why these “moralizing” posters would be doing that.
by KButler on Feb 9, 2009 2:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone who cheered for Sosa
and boos these guys is a hypocrite.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Feb 9, 2009 2:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Because TWWS
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Feb 9, 2009 4:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
if
proven to be a cheat yes, and again the key word is proven.
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 3:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I tend to agree
And I was not saying #25 was guilty of anything, I was simply asking if people get suspicious. Not only does Lee not seem like the type of guy that would do that, I would like to believe that he didnt/wouldnt. However, you could say those same two statements about hundreds of players. However, during the steroid era, it is EXTREMELY suspicious to see a batting average sky rocket to over 50 POINTS!! than your career average and almost 60 from the previous year. While having that sky rocket, he also hit 17 more HR’s than his career average, a statistic that he has not even come within 24 HR’s of since, as we all know. He slugged 158 points higher than he had before or has since. Obviously we could go on and on with those stats, and maybe it is simply his wrist injury that has taken that ability away from him, or maybe he just had one of those years that was an aberration. Still, I am just stating how suspicious it looks in this era and how sad it is that we have to think that way.
by KButler on Feb 9, 2009 1:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Its easy
to think that way, sure thing…but one thing that strikes me is how most of the people that have been implicated all seem to be connected in one way or another (former teammates, friends, etc). Indeed it may have been prevalent among these pockets of players on certain teams…I’m just not sure if I can buy that “everyone is guilty”.
"Ask Dad. He'll know. And on the off chance he doesn't, he'll make up something good"
by StevenABQ on Feb 9, 2009 2:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hard work paying off vs. HGH paying off
You say that as though people who use PED’s don’t work hard.
Steroids let you work harder, longer, and with more intensity. They’re not a magic muscle pill.
And HGH in no way whatsoever helps you play baseball. Steroids do.
by Wreckard on Feb 9, 2009 1:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Revision:
Hard work paying off vs. PEDs + hard work paying off
"It's hard to win 97 games, it's hard to win the division. Our attitude is if you get in every year, you get in most of the time, sooner or later you are going to knock that door down." -- Jim Hendry
by EJThunder on Feb 9, 2009 2:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess if there is one defense to be said for those who used
it is that PEDs do not allow you to see the ball better, and do not help with hand eye coordination.
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 5:10 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
If...
If this is anoither post , please let me know. Do we know if any Cub players are on this list.
ernie81
by ernie81 on Feb 9, 2009 5:14 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
this whole thing tells me that
you can’t trust the government to keep anything secret or live up to an agreement.
by cubswin on Feb 9, 2009 6:26 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Amen brother.
"They say we live and learn. Often what we learn is what damn fools we have been." ~Thomas Sowell
by Goodie1969 on Feb 9, 2009 6:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
was that ever an option, trusting the Gov.....after all they did have WMDs
"I like coconuts, you can break them open and they smell like ladies lying in the sun" Widespread Panic
by Cubbie-Tim on Feb 9, 2009 7:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
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