Z out 2 to 4 weeks?
by jeff_pico on May 4, 2009 12:18 PM CDT
430 comments
According to Levine that is the case.
http://espn.go.com/chicago/columns/blog?post=4135612&name=levine
Looks like we will get to see one of the Iowa starters (Atkins, Wells, or Asciano) make a couple of starts. I guess Samardzija is a possibility also.
All in all this is happening early enough in the season that it shouldn't be a major disaster or anything.
It says I need nine more words in order to make this a post, hopefully this works.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
4 recs |
430 comments
Email
Print
Comments
Hopefully that's not the case...
If it is the case, then I’m disappointed that we brought up Samardzija to the bullpen, now, as he had the best stuff of the options down there.
Hopefully the injury bug will stop biting us soon.
That said, it sounds like they might be taking the right approach to protect the mechanics. Keeping Zambrano’s arm healthy is the most important thing.
by SouthernCub on May 4, 2009 12:35 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Yep, a situation like this is exactly why...
…Samardzija was in Iowa in the first place – as rotation insurance. It still seems like the Cubs cashed in that policy way too early. It’ll be interesting to see how Hendry and Lou handle this.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I completely agree...
Especially because Samardzija has come up and pitched almost exclusively at the end of blowout losses. Vizcaino (or just about anybody) was capable of filling that role adequately enough.
But, oh well, what’s done is done. I agree – it’ll be interesting to see how this plays out.
by SouthernCub on May 4, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you blame them?
People were calling for Hendry’s head with the bull pen that he assembled. It was good to bring him up, get a little stability, considering it is too early in the season to get help via trade. Randy Wells is a fine solution for the time being.
If you really want to get mad, blame Hendry for not getting a better bull pen or trading jason marquis
"If I were playing third base and my mother were rounding third with the run that was going to beat us, I'd trip her. Oh, I'd pick her up and brush her off and say, 'Sorry, Mom,' but nobody beats me." ~ Leo Durocher
by Musicdude10 on May 4, 2009 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How has Samardzija provided stability?
He’s barely pitched.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 4:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
the bullpen has stabilized, and without the Shark. Guzman is really doing well, Heilman has become a gold-mine (that one day excepted), and Gregg is fine.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 4:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What a wonderful decision he made...
Missing 3-4 starts, potentially screwing up his delivery.
Yesirree, I’m always thrilled when Zambrano thinks up a new thing to do.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 12:47 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh come on...
… Z could have hurt himself running the bases, fielding, or tripping over his cat while getting out of bed this morning.
Anybody who asks me (and others, judging on the previous threads) to begrudge him for essentially TRYING HARD isn’t going to get far. When he’s starting, he represents 1/9th of the teams chances to cross home plate. Those runs count just as much as anybody else’s and if anything, his ability to hit well and the fact that it was a close game makes this even MORE justifiable.
He may miss a few games, and if things go poorly, this may result in a few more L’s than we’d have had if he hadn’t gotten hurt. Don’t tell me this is any worse than Dome or Sori getting hurt in terms of W’s and L’s. Should THEY not run hard on the bases?
If you want to cheer for a team that doesn’t expect its pitchers to run the basses as hard as anybody else, change leagues.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
typing through that rear view mirror...
"If it's obvious, it's obviously wrong." - a well known stock market guru
by LAcarl519 on May 4, 2009 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well I'm sure when he gets back he will
heed your – and many others – word and no longer engage in any of those antics thats might detract from his pitching prowess – if only we had the dh!!!
by doofus cubs guy on May 4, 2009 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
beating a dead horse
But Z could have pulled that hammy running out a grounder. He’s a maximum effort player and he gives maximum effort. Too many fans want it both ways, boo guys for jogging to first base and hate guys for running hard.
by jeff_pico on May 4, 2009 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, I am angry with him for doing something stupid
And costing the team at least three starts and possibly endangering his pitching motion.
I’m sure it was all worth it though, for the priviledge of watching a pitcher run hard.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you don't know
that he’ll miss three starts. You don’t know if his pitching motion will be effected.
Z’s bunt is like the Swine Flu of BCB. Cmon.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
2-4 weeks is at LEAST three starts
And the whole reason they are holding him out so long is because they are afraid he’ll screw up his pitching motion.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If it's a 15-day DL stint
he could miss just two starts. Zambrano is scheduled to pitch May 8, which he would miss, along with a start on May 14, if the Cubs don’t juggle the rotation with an off day on May 11.
Zambrano would be back on May 19, just in time for the St. Louis series. He’d miss starts at Milwaukee and versus San Diego.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on May 4, 2009 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or they keep him there for another stint
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
cmon
let’s not over-react here. Geez.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll admit that they could.
And I wouldn’t want Zambrano to be rushed back at the expense of his mechanics.
Now, I don’t know the results of the MRI (and it’s not clear that Bruce Levine does either), but I could see the Cubs seeing how Zambrano reacts over the next four days and then deciding on Friday whether or not to skip a start and/or DLing him.
But, this issue seems far less ominous than his sore shoulder last year.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on May 4, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's
IF they put him on the DL at all. All we have is speculation so far.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since you seem to be fixated on results
We won that game. We don’t know the results of the games without him yet. And since we won’t know whether his was a good decision until after we’ve won or lost those games, I don’t see the point in your lamentations.
by redward on May 4, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll gladly take it...
… for the privilege of watching my team win while PLAYING HARD.
Nobody is denying the unfortunate nature of the situation. But asking players to play less hard in situations where they can directly influence the outcome of the game is asinine at best.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Z has the most impact on a game
by pitching, not by hitting. And certainly not be baserunning.
He main job description is to take the ball every fifth day and pitch 7+ innings. Everything else is secondary
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Untill you show me the Cubs employee handbook...
… where it clearly states “our pitchers are pitchers only, and their attempts to do anything else on the field are discouraged”, i simply can’t buy in to your view.
Winning games is the goal. Sure, Z pitching well is one fairly obvious way he can help reach that goal. But he has clearly demonstrated his ability to hit. Using this second tool to help win games shouldn’t even be WORTH discussing. Hes as likely to get hurt running the bases as anything else. The reward outweighs the risk, and whining and moaning about it the next day after an injury is pointless. It was a freak injury that resulted from a guy doing something he’s PAID to do.
Its a pointless argument anyways, i suppose, as nobody who really MATTERS in the world seems to take the view that he shouldn’t be trying to hit, and trying to reach base when he does. Z doesn’t care, Lou doesn’t care…
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right, I hope he,
or anyone else on the team for that matter, never hustles again. It’s just too damn dangerous.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on May 4, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's see if Ramirez can break his neck
Diving into the stands for a foul ball! Won’t the hustle impress us all!
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, no, no
I’m with ya. In fact, let’s not even put our best players on the field anymore. Just too risky…
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on May 4, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also, they should live in Wrigley
So they can avoid the inherent risk in driving to the stadium.
by redward on May 4, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lets just call up everyone in iowa...
… to save our good players for October!
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
we may need AAA players in October,
it is too cold to use MLB players, so bring up AA now instead for safety
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, in that case...
… it seems fairly inevitable that all the trips out to the mound pose a risk to Lou’s health. We may need to sit him a rest ’till October as well…
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Worf,
I think it’s time you dropped this, these analogies don’t even make sense. this topic has been exhausted and it’s clear that you are in the minority of people who are whining about our players giving their maximum effort.
by wewantwood on May 4, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed. And, as for your user name,
TWSS
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's entitled to his opinion
Especially if he’s in the minority. But you are correct that his analogies are a bit stretched.
by Arbusto on May 4, 2009 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree he's entitled to his opinion
but he’s making some pretty outlandish statements to support his argument—not to mention the fact that he has probably accumulated close to 100 posts rehashing the same tired opinion.
by wewantwood on May 4, 2009 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hustle without intelligence
is slapstick.
Given Zambrano’s disregard for his body, I wonder if he even stretched Sunday.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Probably not
He was prolly hungover too.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on May 4, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And tragedy + time = comedy.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who did he kill in your family? Worf this is obviously a personal intense dislike to question whether or not he stretched?
I was at the game he did in fact stretch.
Jay is our Quarterback. I REPEAT JAY IS OUR QUARTERBACK. Did I mention we have a Quarterback who happens to be named Jay?.
by cubstoseriesby100 on May 4, 2009 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seeing as though this happened in the 5th...
I don’t think that point is valid.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." - Alvin Dark
by Fishbone2 on May 4, 2009 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fine, so let's have the outfielders crash headfirst into the ivy
Because there is a 10 percent chance they will catch and hold onto the ball.
Raise the pitch count to 200. Let’s see how tough and hard they are!
You say unfortunate. I say preventable.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
IIRC
Sam Fuld made an amazing catch into the bricks a few years ago late in september. He was lauded.
Dome made two good catches yesterday — one into the wall, and one a diving catch to end the game. Should he do neither because of the danger of injury? After all, it’s his job to stay healthy, apparently.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, that is their job
If Dome ever gets called on to pitch and starts snapping off screwballs and breaks his wrist, that would be the equivalent comparison.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
sigh.
this is a never ending debate.
This is the national league. He’s expected to bat, he’s expected to run, he’s expected to go all out to win.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Philadelphia Phillies
won the World Series last year. That means they beat the entire National League to win the pennant.
Somehow, their pitchers managed to providing winning baseball without stealing a single base. Seriously, no Phillies pitcher stole a base last year. No Phillies pitcher hit a home run or a triple. Only one pitcher, Hamels, had a batting average over .200 in at least 10 AB.
However did they manage without their pitchers being well-rounded baseball machines?
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow! And just think what it may have been like...
… if they had an athletically capable guy like Z batting 9th every 5th day, freaking out pitchers and putting runs across the plate! Even easier, right? That would have been FUN to watch.
Although I’m sure the Phillies would have the good sense to tell a guy of Z’s intensity to just not try when he came up to bat… and he’d go along with it, right?
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know what's even more fun to watch
A World Series victory parade.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Move to Philly.
Z’s injuries from running the bases aren’t the reason for the 100 year drought. And your indignation over him doing so isn’t getting us any closer.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wasnt Julian Tavarez
booed for NOT hstling on a hit in the infield, now Z is being ripped for huistling and trying to win?
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm ripping him
for pulling a completely unnecessary stunt. It’s the equivalent of a fielder diving into the stands for a ball five rows deep.
And I’m ripping him for being unavailable for the next 2-4 weeks.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
1) it wasn’t a stunt. It was an at bat that he took advantage of to do something unexpected.
2) You don’t know how long he will be out. You have Bruce Miles’ speculation.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
you mean Levine, but same difference.
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh, right
too many Bruces, eh Bruce?
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't bring me down!!!
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're lookin' good
Just like a snake in the grass
One of these days
You’re gonna break your glass
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
not to be an ELO nazi or anything
But the lyrics say “gruss” not “bruce” :P
by daeviant on May 4, 2009 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There is a big difference.
Bruce Levine talks out of his butt most of the time.
Jay is our Quarterback. I REPEAT JAY IS OUR QUARTERBACK. Did I mention we have a Quarterback who happens to be named Jay?.
by cubstoseriesby100 on May 4, 2009 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Attention, no photoshop here. Please?
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
by N Oakley on May 4, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
Huh? Photoshop? If you’re referring to my avatar I think it’s inconsequental. If Al asks me to change it or remove it I gladly will.
Jay is our Quarterback. I REPEAT JAY IS OUR QUARTERBACK. Did I mention we have a Quarterback who happens to be named Jay?.
by cubstoseriesby100 on May 4, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's not talking
about your avatar. He was talking about your saying Bruce talks out his butt.
by sue369 on May 4, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow . . . and I thought it was bad when I needed Allie to explain "Itchu" to me
I’m glad you had the patience for that, Sue!
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks
Thanks right after I responded with that I realixed he was probably referring to something else.
Jay is our Quarterback. I REPEAT JAY IS OUR QUARTERBACK. Did I mention we have a Quarterback who happens to be named Jay?.
by cubstoseriesby100 on May 4, 2009 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
dont know much
about Levine, but Miles seems to write very well and I enjoy his insight. The only other Cubs beat writer I’ve heard much from is Sully and I’m not convinced he doesn’t also pull stuff out of his butt.
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just
got the name wrong, that’s all.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Additionally, i'm going to go ahead and assume from your comment...
… that the Phillies pitching staff suffered no injuries last year, be it from running the bases or otherwise. Right?
Oh god, Z tried to hard while batting, our season is over.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They had four guys
Make at least 30 starts, including a 45-year-old man. Make of that what you will.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I will make of that exactly what it means...
… they got lucky and possibly have some good staff keeping their players healthy. Teams don’t go the entire year without injury. This is common sense.
Z got hurt doing his job. His plate appearances aren’t just for show. The phillies had a good year, but i doubt any of their pitchers were mailing it in when they got up to bat. Just because they aren’t as good at is as Z is doesn’t mean we should blast him for getting hurt while doing it.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seems to me the Cubs won a big game in Houston a few years ago
With a Zambrano homerun keying the comeback.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your logic means nothing in these parts...
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you won games based on pitchers hitting homers
The 2003 Cubs would have been in the World Series.
The sun shines on a dog’s ass once in a while. That doesn’t mean you should count on it.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pitchers get hurt running the bases once in a while...
… that doesn’t mean you should count on it.
Z has been a valuable offensive weapon for us of late.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Won't be for the next 2-4 weeks
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And that was my point.
But as you say, the logic means nothing around here….
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
07 Rockies
No SB, No HR, NO 3B. Two guys over .200 in 10 AB.
The 06 Cardinals did have some pop. No SB. Two HR (Mulder and Wainright) and one 3B (Marquis)
05 Astros — No HR. Brandon Backe did steal a base and hit two triples.
You don’t have to have pitchers being hitters to win the NL.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You don’t have to have pitchers being hitters to win the NL...
… but it certainly wouldn’t hurt.
You are missing the point. Just because its been done doesn’t mean we should try. You are never going to convince most of the rational universe that Z shouldn’t run the bases hard. You CERTAINLY aren’t going to convince him or his manager.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, let's try to reinvent baseball!
That’ll break the drought!
Pitch counts – 250!
Have 3-4-5 hitters bunting for base hits
Tell Fontenot to swing for the fences
Shake it up! Try something new!
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Worf
dood. Cmon. You’re going over the top again.
Pitchers batting in the NL is a decades-long tradition. And Fukudome, as a #3 batter, has bunted for a hit before. Fontenot has hit several home runs. Lou told Riot to try to drive the ball more, and we’ve seen him hit two home runs in two days. Lou told Lee to stand more upright at the plate, and HE’s hit two home runs in two days.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
worf dont waste your time... they are here to see the sideshow know as Z the hitter
by Reed's Johnson on May 4, 2009 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Piniella has had to use his bench in an unconventional fashion, but said he probably won’t stop using Zambrano as a pinch-hitter when he returns. The Cubs invested $91.5 million in Zambrano so he can pitch, but Piniella isn’t worried about risking another leg injury on the basepaths.
“Look, we had no choices,” he said. "We’re trying to win baseball games, and he’s a good pinch-hitter. That has nothing to do with him getting hurt… He laid down a good bunt, it was a 2-2 ballgame. I know a lot of people say ‘Why did he bunt?’ Well, if he had hit a ball off the wall and hurt it trying to go into second with a double, (would they say) he should’t have hit a double?
“I don’t get the reasoning.”
Zambrano, who felt it pull three steps from the first base bag, referred to it as “my flat tire.” He also doesn’t understand why anyone would consider it a risk to let him pinch-hit when he doesn’t start. He said he’s an all-around player, and will do anything he can to help his team win.
“This is the National League,” he said. “In the National League, you have to be athletic and have to be able to do everything… Pinch-hitting had nothing to do with this.”
But pinch-hitters have to run to get on base.
“Well, I wasn’t running hard,” he said. “I pinch-hit three times. The first time I had a base hit, it was a 3-2 count and I wasn’t running hard. The second one was a fly ball to centerfield. I didn’t run hard. The third time I struck out. So it was not running.”
So he thinks Piniella will still use him as a pinch-hitter?
“I don’t know,” he said. “It’s up to (Piniella). But I will be able to do whatever they need me to do.”
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 5, 2009 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Um, Fontenot does swing for the fences.
There’s only one other player on the team with more home runs.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe he meant Theriot?
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on May 4, 2009 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
maybe
but Riot has had some powah too.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
LSU
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
proposal
From now on every Cub pitcher intentionally strikes out or takes all pitches in order to try to get a walk. Its just not worth the risk to let these guys up there possibly throwing out arms swinging pitches or hamstrings running the bases.
j/k
by jeff_pico on May 4, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, can't take a walk. Then he'd be on base.
However, a swing risks injury. So, in the unfortunate event that a walk DOES occur, the pitcher is to very slowly start walking twoards second, so as to be an easy out, but avoid the pickoff throw hitting him.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hope it's still funny
When we’re watching Shark’s fourth start.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lighten up Francis.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on May 4, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The only funny thing going on here...
… is the continued insistence that Z was wrong to run the basses at 100% effort.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, apparently
He can’t run from here to there without pulling a muscle and losing the chance to do his primary job for 2-4 weeks.
Some pitchers are also athletes. Rich Harden comes to mind. Jason Marquis comes to mind.
Zambrano is four cheesburgers away from being David Wells.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are really becoming tiresome. You know that?
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on May 4, 2009 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are right...
… everything we’ve seen this season has shown that Z is incapable of stepping up to the plate without injury.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
with or without the WS rings?
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How many of those rings
Did Wells win by running all that hard in NL parks?
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're suggesting
that Z is more fragile than Harden?
Somebody has jumped the shark, and I don’t mean Spellcheck.
by chitownhawkeye on May 4, 2009 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How many starts has Harden missed in a Cub uniform?
He doesn’t seem to get all crampy either
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really? Harden rarely
takes the ball every 5th day and you think he’s never missed a start as a Cub.
Cripes, he frequently goes on 6 and 7 days rest and by definition misses his start if the standard is 5 days.
You’re off on your rant, but this point won’t help.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
by N Oakley on May 4, 2009 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Carlos Zambrano
had 28 hits in 2009, four of which were home runs, so you expect he didn’t have to run too fast around the bases for those. So for 24 hits, he was running as fast as he could, legging it out. How many muscles did he pull in his legs that year?
Zero.
In 2008, he had 20 hits, two of which were home runs. Putting both years together, he had 44 hits. How many muscles did he pull in his legs in 2008?
Zero.
This is a freak occurrence. Carlos Zambrano is ABSOLUTELY an athlete. He’s a better hitter than either Harden or Marquis, and he lives to win.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
2009=2008
Or can you see into the future? If so, what are tomorrow’s lotto numbers?
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
by chilango2 on May 4, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are tottally missing the point
It happened this year as a freak accident. Proving it was a freak accident drew should how he hit just as much the past 2 years without injury running the bases.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by jkobus on May 4, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm simply putting the concept
that Zambrano can’t run the bases without injuring himself to the test of his stats, which do NOT support the concept that he can’t run the bases without injuring himself.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
one bunt is a small sample size
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was referring to this:
had 28 hits in 2009, four of which were home runs, so you expect he didn’t have to run too fast around the bases for those.
Because he hasn’t hit that many this year… That is all. I find myself always agreeing with you and didn’t mean to bring your point down.
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
by chilango2 on May 4, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it was a typo
My apologies. You caught it. :) Yes, I meant 2008.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No one thinks what happened is funny
With the probable exception of the Brewers fans.
The point that no one in the “He shouldn’t have done it” camp wants to accept is, that could have happened doing any kind of running.
BTW — guess who runs the most in spring training? Hint: It isn’t the catchers . . . .
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But what if they pull a hammy...
… on their way up to the plate?
Maybe we should have the bat boys carry them out there?
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Come to think of it, they shouldn't cover first base, either
How about a designated fielder for grounders to the right side?
Someone short, like Doug Dascenzo, so as to avoid getting in the way of the pitcher.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Selig
Time for Selig to step up and legalize the batting practice cage for games.
by jeff_pico on May 4, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about if one gets through, though?
I mean, the pitcher shouldn’t have to waste a toss on a play at first. I still see a spot for ol’ Dougie.
Or Darren Baker.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but he can get hurt walking to the mound to pitch
so we need to use pitching machines
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't the guy that loaded the machine then be too valuable to risk?
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very true
we must use an auto loading macing with a ball scoop to keep it loaded.
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but who loads the scoop?
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no no
its an auto loading scoop, thus eliminating need for fielders.
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but
who loads the auto loader auto loader?
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gnomes.
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
local SIEU Underground's
gonna have a field day with THAT contract.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Migrant gnomes even
take that union…they load autoloaders during the summers here and perform for winter ball in the Dominican…
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
who will
witness the plight of the poor migrant gnome pitching machine autoloader autoloader loader?
Of course, they all get into the business because they think they can get close to their greatest achiever… Mike Fonetnot…
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They will be led
By a migrant gnome ‘Cesar Chavez’ who will lead them out of their low wage auto loading career and demand better wages and more rights.
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cylons.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ah-hah!
They have a plan! And it’s to play Koyie Hill as the back-up third baseman!
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
AUGH
you are correct. Maybe we should use whiffle balls and nerf bats then
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hey
Max hit me with a whiffle-ball line drive in batting practice the other day. It left QUITE a mark. We need to keep people SAFE, MISTER!
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really then, is the only option...
… to just simulate the entire season on my Play Station with injuries turned “off”?
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Carpal tunnel
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that is not environmentally friendly
using all that energy to simulate
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Obviously, all that caution made Hamels injury-proof.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on May 5, 2009 10:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
also
but it’s not Rami’s job to catch foul balls?
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, how DARE he refuse to stumble blindly around the bullpen mound
Or refuse to jump into the dugout headfirst after a ball!
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the funny thing is
I’ve seen you go after players for not going all out.
I just don’t get it.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dome isn't asked to pitch every 5 days...
… Zambrano IS required to step up to the plate.
Dumb comparisons aren’t gonna help your case.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Todd Hollandsworth did also
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Something stupid"?
Wow, I just don’t get that. Trying to take advantage of a Third Baseman was playing back is now considered something stupid? Makes perfect sense.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on May 4, 2009 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It is when you run like a dump truck
And miss 2-4 weeks.
It’s always something with this guy. Not drinking enough water. Breaking his bat over his knee.
He could win 20 games a season if his head wasn’t in the way.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
one of these things is not like the other
one of these things is not the same…
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
The bat-breaking, the hissy fits, those are all signs of immaturity and selfishness.
Trying to reach base? Not so much.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is probably
the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard. Zambrano is one of the best starters the Cubs have had in a long time. And you’re trying to cut him down because of one small injury. Moron.
by tizzle on May 4, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Worf is being bombastic
and inflammatory, probably on purpose to get a reaction, but can you please refrain from calling names.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
by N Oakley on May 4, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There you go again
name calling. Really, this needs to stop.
by sue369 on May 4, 2009 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry I
confused you with another poster but name calling is still not cool.
by sue369 on May 4, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they are very close names, aren't they...
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh-oh
Could I have an arch-enemy?
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
er?
Sometimes I don’t get what I’m saying.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shanghaimambodaverdrewwmhg vs. tvilletizzle(addusershere)?
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
WAT.
Judd Sirott is responsible for Carlos Zambrano's injury.
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
One username to rule them all.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And in the OT bind them, apparently.
Judd Sirott is responsible for Carlos Zambrano's injury.
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
oooh!
CAGE MATCH!
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
See seperate fanpost and y'day's game summary...
….if you want to see all the “logic” on this subject, ad nauseum……
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on May 4, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I now
I saw the good majority of ’em.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on May 4, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pitcher bunting = stupid?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OMG
you’ve no idea what it’s been like, SWL…
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Havent been here long
but this has been the worst argument I have seen so far….by far
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by jkobus on May 4, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe it's all just one big Neifi flashback?
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hindsight
is 20/20.
We’ll see what happens.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let the record show
I was putting this out there when there was a chance he would just miss one start, or even no starts.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And by your logic
You are more right with every start he misses.
by redward on May 4, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which in turn makes you more wrong.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think this qualifies as a topic
that’s been beat to death on this site.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on May 4, 2009 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes
seems like only one guy is really p*ssed about Z bunting? Anyone else? Buehler?
by jeff_pico on May 4, 2009 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There were 2 other in the post game...
But yeah this topic isnt going anywhere anymore.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by jkobus on May 4, 2009 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree.
I’m choosing to abstain.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There seems to be no MRI results mentioned here
so isn’t this just speculation by Levine?
"If it's obvious, it's obviously wrong." - a well known stock market guru
by LAcarl519 on May 4, 2009 12:50 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
supposedly Levine's source forked over the results
at least that’s what I gathered from Levine’s post.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on May 4, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We'll see when the facts come in.
Right now all we have is speculation.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on May 4, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
precisely.
my guess is we’ll all know more prior to tonight’s game.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Trey2317 on May 4, 2009 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not true.
We have RAMPANT speculation!
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that make it official.
three of us have called this (various degrees of) SPECULATION.
therefore it is SPECULATION.
Off with there heads (or take the batteries out of their keyboards…or their heads)
"If it's obvious, it's obviously wrong." - a well known stock market guru
by LAcarl519 on May 4, 2009 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
make = makes (nice English!)
"If it's obvious, it's obviously wrong." - a well known stock market guru
by LAcarl519 on May 4, 2009 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
legs are critical for a pitcher, mechanics and otherwise power
I bet four weeks, I also bet Samardz gets the 6 starts through the month. Atkins pitched last thurs. I bet he is recalled in that he could relieve tonight.
too many injuries already, not a good omen
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on May 4, 2009 12:59 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Well that's what happens
When you pay $91 million for a bunter
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on May 4, 2009 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ballplayer.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
bruce miles
seemed to think that if Carlos hit the DL then Wells would be the guy. But that’s just speculation from a beat writer.
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What we know so far.
1) Zambrano was trying to show off. If he hadn’t tweaked his hammy, he would have followed through with his intended backflip back onto the bag.
2) Unless you are a position player, running out a bunt is a 100% guaranteed hamstring strain, at the very least.
3) Running out a bunt is the only way to injure your hamstring if you are a pitcher.
4) If Z had not run out the bunt, we would have won 5 – 4.
by redward on May 4, 2009 1:11 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
Also...
… Z’s frame of mind as he selfishly, recklessly, put the entire season at risk while he ran to first base after laying down a bunt was EXACTLY the same as his frame of mind the time he broke a bat over his leg.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+10 to both of you
And an extra 10 for AJS’ avatar.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're both welcome.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and he is too fat to run the bases
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is so true!
That’s why he’s got a pulled hammy. If he was in shape, this moronic argument never would’ve gotten started,
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
by Itchy on May 4, 2009 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm actually surprised
He didn’t try to break Cantu over his knee once he realized he’d hurt his hamstring.
by redward on May 4, 2009 1:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
was Cantu
within reach? We wouldn’t want him walking around.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
this is a reply to AndrewJStone
because I am bad at internetting.
by redward on May 4, 2009 1:20 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Internetting CAN be hard. All is forgiven.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on May 4, 2009 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You do know
you can use the reply feature to reply to comments? Not sure if you knew that or not. :-)
by sue369 on May 4, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I do
But after three failed attempts to do so I just gave up in a pile of shame.
by redward on May 4, 2009 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Aw, don't give up.
Keep practicing. We’ll help you. :D
by sue369 on May 4, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
TWSS
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'am not surprised
that Z is already hurt this season. I mean did everyone honestly think he was going to go the entire season without being hurt??
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 2:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Well, last season aside...
…he actually doesn’t have a long injury history. He’s had only two 15-day DL stints in his entire career. Um, thus far, of course.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Blame
Z is to blame for everything. In fact the Bulls lost game 7 because they had psychic visions of this happening and couldn’t take it.
Jay is our Quarterback. I REPEAT JAY IS OUR QUARTERBACK. Did I mention we have a Quarterback who happens to be named Jay?.
by cubstoseriesby100 on May 4, 2009 2:04 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Didn't you know?
Z is a head case that could win 30 games a year if he wasn’t so emotional. Oh yea, and he has no business running hard to first base, I mean, thats not what baseball players are supposed to do.
by tizzle on May 4, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pitchers shouldn't run hard...
Just like centerfielders should sprint around the bases when they hit a HR, and catchers should crawl back to the dugout after striking out looking.
by kanderber on May 4, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We need to rein in our pitchers.
Dempsters heroics attending that Blackhawks game could have resulted in all manner of injuries.
Walking on ice is an unnecessary risk and not part of his job description.
by redward on May 4, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well
that Jacket COULD cause put an eye out. And you know it’s all fun and games till someone’s jacket puts out an eye.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And his windup with
the hockey stick could have ruined him forever.
by sue369 on May 4, 2009 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll give him the benefit of the doubt since
he’s a native canook and probably came out of the womb with a pair of super-tacks on his feet.
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
by blackhawk24 on May 4, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The logic (or illogic) of the "Z's an idiot" contingent
Might be the most tortured in BCB history.
This is what ticks me off about some Cubs fans sometimes. Some are dumber than a box of rocks while simultaneously being whiny, arrogant and imbued with some mysterious sense of entitlement.
I wonder if this debate would be raging with, say, the Cardinals. Were Cardinals fans whining non-stop when Carpenter got hurt while batting? No, they just plug in someone else and keep winning games.
To the vocal minority that’s all over Z’s case about playing baseball the proper way: Stow it. And sack up.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 4, 2009 2:16 PM CDT reply actions 6 recs
Well said
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by jkobus on May 4, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I second Not Bruce....by the way I once was warned of being ejected from Wrigley heckling the guy
as for Z hustle is always the right thing to do…my thinking is that much of the moaning is that many have Z on their fantasy league
Piniella: "This is a tougher job than I thought it would be, I'm going to be honest with you."
by Ivy Walls on May 4, 2009 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hear, hear!
How long should we give sig lines at the bottom of the comments?
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well the common
misconcept is that Z is an Ace. An Ace is someone who you can usually always rely on. With Z that is almost never the case. He has ace talent, but he does not preform like an Ace. The facts of the matter are:
1: you have to worry about something stupid like him being dehydrated.
2.. You have worry about his performance after a bad at bat effecting his play on the mound the following inning.
3. He is one bad at bat away from breaking his bat over his knee running the risk of him being put on the DL.
4. Z’s K:BB ratio is declining.
5. Him doing something UNECESSARY. The bunting thing was agressive but not necessary. It caused him to get hurt
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Um...can you please put the cuckoo back in the clock and stop this riduculous argument?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please do............
……….because only those supporting Z’s wonderful move are allowed to comment here.
And comment………and comment………..and comment………
"I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." ~ Frank Sinatra
by tville on May 4, 2009 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
holy hell.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
sigh.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Z's WHIP and K:BB since becoming a starter
2003: 1.318, 1.787 (32 starts)
2004: 1.216, 2.320 (31)
2005: 1.146, 2.349 (33)
2006: 1.294, 1.826 (33)
2007: 1.331, 1.752 (34)
2008: 1.293, 1.805 (30)
2009: 1.421, 2.357 (6)
So, no, his K:BB isn’t declining. His WHIP is creeping up, but he has started better this year than his past three years would indicate as far as K:BB.
How long should we give sig lines at the bottom of the comments?
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that was
my bad on speculating that. But what about the rest of the statements I made???? Its easy to call me a cuckoo, but the fact of the matter is these are the real reasons why Z will not win a Cy Young
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well
the fact of the matter is that you think these are big issues.
I think it’s a little ironic that you were wrong on the one stat-supported “issue” you raise.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not to make too big a deal of this, BD...
…but you really shouldn’t speculate about stuff like K:BB. Just look it up on Fangraphs.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
1. It happened once. It’s not really indicative of a pattern of behavior outside the game.
2 and 3. He’s a very tempermental guy. When he can harness and direct that energy, he can make it work to his advantage. The rest of the time it hurts him. I would agree that until he can control his emotions a bit more he is a long shot for a Cy Young season.
5. The bunt was a good call because it confused the offense, and he hustled down the line. He did everything he should have and just happened to get injured on the play. Injuries happen. If he had been injured in any of his prior appearances in this series, people would be jumping down Lou’s throat for having pinch-hit him. Since it happened on his start, it “must” be Z’s fault. Somebody has to be “blamed” for some people to be happy. If there was a way to pin this on Judd Sirott, we’d all be doing that instead.
How long should we give sig lines at the bottom of the comments?
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no no no
please stop. All I was saying with Z is that it was not necessary for him to bunt. The way he has been hitting there is no need for him to bunt. I would think that him bunting and hustling down the way he did is a much more greater risk then him swinging as he usually does.
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he hustles
when he hits it to the centerfield wall, and he hustles when he hits a bloop single into right, and he hustles when he bunts.
That’s what we’re SUPPOSED to want our players to do.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
honestly
ask me this..was it necessary for him to bunt. Do you think he bunted because of what happened earlier????
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So what if he did?
He hit the ball and got on base. That’s what you’re supposed to do. He got injured on the play, sure, but injuries can and will happen at strange times (Soriano last year, for example).
Now if you’re really just worried that the loss of one of our starters is insurmountable, then just say that. But we have other guys we can bring in to stop the gap for a few weeks.
Judd Sirott is responsible for Carlos Zambrano's injury.
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
define "necessary".
He was the batter. His job is to get on base. The scouting reported that the infield plays him back, and further more, the guy playing third is actually a second baseman. Therefore, we can assume he knew that if he bunted for a hit, it would be unexpected.
He got on base. Yes, he came out of the game injured. That sucks. But his bunt started the rally that won the game.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It was the 5th inning was it not
Then it is definitely Judd’s fault
Oriole by nurture. Cub by marriage.
by wax eagle on May 4, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wait
we can blame this on Sirott? I can do this… it was the fifth inning…
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gonn have to change my sig...
and done.
Judd Sirott is responsible for Carlos Zambrano's injury.
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
lovely!
+100 BCB points!
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OMG
Z is in decline? Will we have a post about the muyth of his decline, his not being in deline, then one putting the two together?
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on May 4, 2009 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
not that he is in total decline
but he is not an Ace. I’m sorry but his head stops him from becoming that.
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kinda like the way some of your posts keep you from being a good contributor to this site.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no SWL
I don’t post alot. I guess im not a BCB groupie like you are . I actually go out and live my life..
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not talking about quantity....
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ok...
well you can live in ur fantasy world. MY argument is that Z is not an Ace. The bunt was not necessary…
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree that Z isn't an ace, but I fail to see what the bunt has to do with it
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that was to support
that he does stupid things…he is the Ace of this staff. He is susposed to limit the risk taking he does because his performance is highly detrimental to our success.
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
his performance is highly detrimental to our success.
I don’t think that means what you think it does.
He got on base. That’s his job when he’s the batter. If he’d pulled the hammy running to first to cover the bag on a defensive play, what would you be complaining about then?
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
whoops
sorry I was in a hurry to type that out. I didnt detrimental lol
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
my point was
we need Z on the field as much as possible. Because this guy is needed for our success.
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So he isnt supposed to be smart at the plate?
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by jkobus on May 4, 2009 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree totally.
he is susposed to be smart..he is susposed to hustle. But the bunt was stupid. Come on man…he did it as an “I can do better than what you can do.”
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How do you know why he did it?
It has been said over and over, infields play him back because he can hit, why not lay down a bunt, especially since it was to someone who doesnt play 3rd a lot
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by jkobus on May 4, 2009 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
when
does Z ever bunt!?!?!?!?!?! I’m done beating a dead horse. Cause everyone has their own views on this situation. He is hurt and it sucks. Im over it. And my little comment made everyone explode..and SWL to wet his pants cause he could make another one of his pictures…
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, that'll settle things down
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
first of all
that picture was made long before you.
Second of all, Zambrano bunts when he thinks it will help.
Third of all, we ALL think it sucks that he’s hurt.
Fourth of all… don’t think you’re responsible for this brouhaha.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'am responsible
I actually laughed when everyone got frustrated. pure entertainment. just no need for the personal attacks when I didn’t call out anyone for their views.
by BadDecisions on May 4, 2009 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no
he did it as a way to start a rally that won the game.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What does that even mean?
Judd Sirott is responsible for Carlos Zambrano's injury.
Bradley watch -- out 8 games of 24
by znohitter on May 4, 2009 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
padding his own stats
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Guess-bunting hack
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hack runner
no less
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
batting
is just as much on the field as pitching or playing third.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I actually saw positive signs yesterday re: ace
He didn’t flip out over the tying run scoring — he just bore down and got the next batter.
The bunt was doing what he thought was right to help the team win. He didn’t try to hit the ball to Sheffield, for example.
The injury is unfortunate, but as williemayshayesgloves said yesterday — that could happen covering a play at first.
I really like the attitude that Zambrano showed yesterday. Also, I thought he got squeezed on a few pitches, but he kept his cool.
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
indeed
I’m not entirely sure this team HAS an ace. Harden can’t pitch consistently on five days rest. Demp is walking too many people. Z is emotional (although we disagree in how much we like the emotion).
Lilly is VERY consistent, and get great wins, but isn’t exactly dominating, except in regards to a particular catcher.
Dunno. As long as we win, I’m not entirely sure I care.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 4, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree.
This team doesn’t have a true ace – at least not according to my criteria. But the thing is, very few teams do.
In fact, looking at the NL Central right now. The only true ace I see is Roy Oswalt. No other team really has one. Chris Carpenter might qualify if he could stay healthy, but he can’t. Volquez will need to put together at least a couple more seasons like last year to lay claim to the title. You probably could’ve argued for Aaron Harang until last season. Maybe Gallardo will turn into one.
Bottom line: Big Z is a great pitcher. That’s all that really matters. Pining for him to become an ace is really just self-defeating.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess it's a pitcher that starts 40 games a year...goes 32-2 with an ERA of 1.65 a WHIP of 1.10
and never bunts for a base hit.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, as mentioned, these are just my own criteria:
1. Great stuff.
2. The ability to throw that great stuff consistently for strikes.
3. The ability to throw deep into games regularly.
4. The ability to come up big in big game situations.
5. The ability (good fortune?) to stay healthy and make about 30 starts a year.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 4, 2009 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is the pitcher an ace while making those 30 starts?
by ol Pete on May 4, 2009 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, I should probably add another point about...
…a pitcher establishing these traits over, say, at least three seasons. (See my comment on Volquez above.) Once a pitcher establishes himself at that level then, yes, he is an ace while making those starts.
Look, I’m not claiming my criteria here are perfect. But these are the things I look for in a truly elite pitcher. And, as mentioned, true aces are an exceedingly rare species.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 5, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The ability to win without said great stuff
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 4, 2009 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right, I should probably add this point...
…to my third point above:
The ability to throw deep into games regularly – even when he doesn’t have his best stuff.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on May 5, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, I bet there are Cardinal fans who would do the same thing...
I think every fan base has its share of intelligent folks and morons.
by SouthernCub on May 4, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Perhaps it just seems like the Cubs have a higher percentage of them sometimes.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 4, 2009 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
However
I live in an area where there are about as many Cardinals fans as Cubs fans. I never heard this kind of talk when Carpenter went down. Not once.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 4, 2009 2:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
My roomate is a Cards fan
Even when I brought it up, he was like yeah he’ll be out for a bit, hope our call up can do an ok job.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by jkobus on May 4, 2009 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OF COURSE NOT!
Because he went down in a truly freak accident. He took a swing and pulled something.
Trust me, had he tried to lay down a bunt for a hit – even if he didn’t pull up lame – Cards fans would have been wondering why he had foolishly done so.
You are right about the ignorance and arrogance of many Cubs fans, problem is, you’re not aware that you might be on the wrong side of that very fence.
"I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." ~ Frank Sinatra
by tville on May 4, 2009 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
please enlighten us as to what our position should be Mr. Tville....
so as not to offend you by being on the wrong side of said fence. Sheesh.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 4, 2009 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because fans can be...........
………..on either side of the fence at any given time, based on the topic, it simply doesn’t make sense to open with remarks that imply the other side is ignorant.
A change in subject matter would likely see the cards shuffled, so those not seeing eye to eye on this topic might be arm in arm on another.
Agree to disagree, but don’t imply ignorance because the other side states its case.
"I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." ~ Frank Sinatra
by tville on May 4, 2009 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
You are right about the ignorance and arrogance of many Cubs fans, problem is, you’re not aware that you might be on the wrong side of that very fence.
riiiiiiiight.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 5, 2009 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you just stir the pot..............
too much kool-aid my friend
If you had to choose just one characteristic that would get you through life, choose a sense of humor.
by Clutche on May 5, 2009 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
just because you're following me
you’re not going to convince anyone we’re together.
"That’s the great thing about baseball, you never know what’s going to happen till you get the final out." — Lou Piniella
by drewishdrewid on May 5, 2009 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
thank god..........
I wouldn’t want our friendship misconstrued
If you had to choose just one characteristic that would get you through life, choose a sense of humor.