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A Quick Guide To Realistic Options To Fix The 2009 Cubs

What will it take to keep this guy smiling all year and into October?

More photos » by Nam Y Huh - AP

What will it take to keep this guy smiling all year and into October?

Since the next game isn't till Tuesday night, and instead of harping on the tired old Sox/Cubs things that we'll no doubt see in the traditional media, I thought I'd take a bit of Monday to examine what the Cubs could realistically do, if management decided to start making moves right now, to improve the team's chances to make the playoffs in 2009. (And you'll see by the length of this post, why it wasn't finished this morning!)

I say "realistic" because at this moment, there are 23 teams within six games of a playoff spot. Why would any one of them trade a useful piece to their puzzle on June 15? (And consider that up until the 1980's, June 15 was the trading deadline. Can you imagine trying to finalize a team's summer today? Now? No way.) There are some players making big dollars that are dealable; one of them happens to be a Cub. More on this below.

This isn't going to be one of those "DFA! DFA! DFA!" posts, because yelling that is rarely productive. Also, for those of you who do say that, I think you really mean "Unconditionally release the bum rightfreakingnow!", because DFA, which is short for "Designated for assignment", actually means the player has some value. The DFA process gives the club ten days to either waive him (within the first seven days), trade him, or release him. If he clears waivers, he can be sent to the minors (unless he's a five-year veteran or has been outrighted to the minors before, in which case he has to give his consent). The DFA process is generally used only when a team wants a player off the 40-man roster, which happens immediately when a player is DFA'd. You can learn more about this and other MLB procedural moves at the very useful ESPN Transactions Primer, which is permanently on the left sidebar of this site under "General Baseball Links".

Case in point: I don't think any of you who are shouting "DFA Miles!" really want him any more -- you just want him off the team. Right? And besides, this isn't going to be one of "those" posts -- just blowing off steam because the team has been so -- well, average the first sixty games, after expectations were much higher. The Cubs have scored 253 runs and allowed 245 for a Pythagorean W-L record of 31-29, just one game better than reality. The 245 runs allowed is good -- third-fewest in the NL. The 253 runs scored is bad -- also third-fewest. Part of both of those is having played the fewest games in the major leagues -- 60. (Five teams have played 65 already.)

Go below the fold to find my realistic suggestions.

Star-divide

  1. Give Aaron Miles his unconditional release. The Cubs have already eaten two contracts this year: Luis Vizcaino's and most of Chad Gaudin's. Both of them apparently had issues beyond poor performance, which is what earned their release. Aaron Miles' problem has been bad play; he's been poor in the field and at bat. With a little more than 1/3 of this season gone, the remaining portion of his two-year deal (absolutely ridiculous to sign a guy like that to a two-year contract) amounts to (approximately) $3.5 million. The Cubs are paying Vizcaino that much. Miles is an automatic out in the lineup and the shoulder problem that presumably was "solved" by putting him on the DL is clearly still bothering him. I'd rather see Bobby Scales back -- Scales, at least, has shown he can produce off the bench (4-for-7 as a PH, with a triple and 2 HR). Or Nate Spears. Even Darwin Barney could probably give the Cubs better than what Miles has. Or see point #3 below.

  2. Offer Rich Harden in trade. This was already brought up in SackMan's FanPost this morning, but I had also thought of this over the weekend. I'm guessing about half of those 23 teams would be lined up outside Jim Hendry's office if the Cubs made Harden available. While he had a strong return from the DL on Friday, the Cubs managed fine -- at least starting-pitching-wise -- without him. They have a starter, Sean Marshall, languishing in the bullpen. It's unlikely, with the emergence of Randy Wells, that Harden will be re-signed for 2010. The savings of getting someone else to take the remainder of his $7 million deal would make up for eating Miles' contract. Get prospects in return. Here's one contending team that might be interested: the Angels, whose rotation has been in turmoil all year. Maybe Hendry could finally pry Brandon Wood away from them. If you could do that, Wood could play 3B. Or SS, moving Ryan Theriot to 2B -- unless you make move #3 below.

  3. Send prospects and Aaron Heilman to Cleveland for Mark DeRosa. I know I'm going to start a firestorm here because of the long discussions we've already had about DeRosa. Look -- I'm NOT being sentimental here. DeRosa, who homered again last night and whose 44 RBI are already half of his career high set last year (and are also 17 more than any Cub has), would be a useful replacement for Aramis Ramirez until he returns, could sub in at several other positions, and if A-Ram isn't 100% on his comeback, could also play 3B for extended periods the rest of the year. Sending Heilman to Cleveland would give the Tribe a major league pitcher -- and perhaps give Heilman the starting rotation slot he's been coveting -- and mitigate some of DeRosa's contract. Also, this gets the two additional pitchers the Cubs don't really need (13? Waaaaaay too many, Lou!) off the roster.

  4. Put Kosuke Fukudome in the #2 hole and leave him there. This seems counterintuitive, but Fukudome is hitting .310/.388/.569 batting 2nd and only .271/.428/.402 batting 3rd (and 0-for-12 in other lineup slots). The guy seems to thrive on consistency. Stop messing with him and maybe the helicopter will vanish.

  5. For now, leave Milton Bradley alone. I've been a critic of this signing from day one, and have only shaken my head at the controversy that seems to hang over his head whether he wants it to or not. Since May 22, he is hitting .302/.373/.453 in 17 games (14 starts), so his bat is (apparently) starting to get together. Whether you like Gameboard or not, the Cubs need him to produce. With Aramis Ramirez out, he really has to hit third. After A-Ram returns, drop him to fifth, which seems a better slot for him.

  6. Give Angel Guzman more eighth-inning responsibility. Guzman has been the Cubs' most consistent reliever all year and in his last 13 appearances, has allowed only eight hits and one run for a 0.71 ERA. If Carlos Marmol is struggling or has been overused, let Guzman throw the eighth, setting up Kevin Gregg.

  7. Let Micah Hoffpauir start in left field occasionally. Alfonso Soriano will never say he needs a day off -- but right now, he absolutely needs some days off. You never know when Soriano will take off on a hot streak, but with his average below .230, maybe it's time. Or try Soriano at 2B for a game or two; the defense can't be worse than what Miles has done, and if he starts hitting, that improves the offense.

That isn't the total solution, nor are any or all of these perfect. But they are, I think, realistic -- things the Cubs could actually do within the next week or two, rather than some pipedream we conjure up here. Let's hope they do some of them. When other players begin hitting the way they should, that could make the Cubs a playoff team again.

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I actually agree with most of this, Al

Not with No. 3, of course, but let’s not start that merry-go-round again. :)

Harden probably is a luxury the Cubs can’t afford right now. Although I’d like to see a little more from Wells before I’d pull the trigger on it. I think he’s the real deal, but …

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 12:56 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I see what you mean.

Still… Harden has real trade value. Maybe they have to take a chance and do this.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Do you think the cubs would really deal him?

with the team in contention he would be a very nice piece of the puzzle down the stretch and in the playoffs……….and who knows what randy wells will do. He could end up coming back down to earth.

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think Harden's value will rise if he makes a few more starts

to show he is healthy. Along with other difference making pitchers that are now off the market due to injury (Peavy and Bedard), his value will keep rising.

It’s worth exploring. Jim Hendry will need to make the decision if the team will be better with Harden or with whatever he could bring in a trade. It’s hard to say right now.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Trade now on some guys while they are hot/not injured

Harden is a risk to hit the DL at any moment. If you can get legitimate prospects for him, then this is probably the optimum time to do so.

DLee has had a mini-bounce back this year. However the power is simply no longer in his bat. At least not to the level where he is a legitimate power threat at 1st going forward.

My ideal scenerio would involve

1. finding a new home for DLee
2. Selling high on Harden right now.
3. Hitting up the Padres for Adrian Gonzalez with the prospects from 1 and 2. Maybe a Kouzmanoff can be added in that deal to fix the 3rd base black hole of succubus

Oh, and DFA!!! Aaron Miles PRONTO!!!!!

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

whut?

The Pads are desperately looking to drop salary, not pick it up. Why would they take Harden? With Peavy on the DL, they must be in full rebuild mode.

Why would Derrek Lee go to San Diego? You have to make a realistic argument for that, because of the NTC.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not reading what I wrote clearly

These are 3 seperate moves to be made. But in and of themeselves each and every one can be made. Example

1. Trade DLee to the Angels, or M’s? Maybe eat a smallish portion of the contract this year. Should net a couple of mid tier prospects

2. Trade Harden to whomever. Should net at least as good of a haul as the Cubs gave up last year.

3. Assuming you accomplish 1 and hopefully 2, turn to SD and try and pry Gonzalez and Kouzmanoff loose. This team is built to win RIGHT NOW. Trade Vitters,Jackson, Castillo, Prospects from deals 1 and 2. If Hendry is serious about moving this thing forward, he needs to be more proactive than he ever has been in the past.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Apparently you arent familiar with the concept of a no trade clause

Lee isnt going anywhere, the Cubs didnt give up jack to get Harden either

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jun 15, 2009 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Guys get traded with NTC every year

If the Cubs chose to move Lee, Lee would move.

I’d think the threat of Sitting behind Adrian Gonzalez would be enough for him to waive the clause.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That didn't work with Jake Peavy.

And, again, it seems unlikely the Pads will part with AGonz. They have to hold on to something. CEO Jeff Moorad has said as much.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

fwiw

there was apparently discussion about moving Lee in the offseason, and he declined.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Really?

Despite the fact that its been mentioned on here a million times and Lee has given no indication of ceding his NTC, nor the team floating his name around in trade talks.

He wouldnt sit behind Gonzalez b/c the Cubs dont have anything remotely valuable to attain one of the top power hitting 1B in the game.

Your way way off base on this one

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jun 15, 2009 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry, I have to ask:

Are there a lot of you with that avatar, or are you one person with multiple accounts?

by Orval Overall on Jun 15, 2009 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

alright

I see what you’re talking about.

The question would be (other than getting Lee to waive his NTC): are the Pads buying…

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And the Angels will stop playing Kendry Morales, why?

Derrek Lee: .278/.360/.444, 7 HR
Kendry Morales: .271/.322/.495, 10 HR

The Angels would be giving up a switch-hitting first baseman with about 40 points less OBP and 50 points more SLG. Kendry is also cheap and 26; Lee is expensive and 33, with a significant injury history.

Not happening.

Witty .sig goes here.

by scareduck on Jun 16, 2009 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why would the Padres trade away one of the best hitters in the National League?

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

2. Selling high on Harden right now.

Harden is hurt. He has .5 years of club control left and is very injury prone.

I don’t think “selling high” means what you think it means.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Selling before he goes down again

As opposed to waiting until he’s back on the DL. That will be considered selling high. Especially with 23 teams still in contention.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok fine then

Tell me: if we were to “sell high” on him right now, what would you realistically expect to get back for him?

Before you answer consider what we gave up for him 1 year ago. Also consider that his value is now 66% lower than that (in terms of actual value measured by service time).

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

With 23 teams in contention

I’d think we could net something close to what we gave up last year.

At the time it was

1. An MLB 3/4th OFer with a career MLB OPS of .800ish
2. An MLB ready 2nd baseman and potential leadoff guy
3. Our #1 Pitching prospect
4. Our #3 or 4 hitting prospect

With hindsight those pieces have diminished in Oakland. However at the time that was the haul they got.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well I guess you're welcome to believe that

Never minding the fact that there were just as many teams in contention at this time last year and Harden was more valuable.

I don’t think anyone considered that package “quite the haul” – Gallagher was the only truly high-value piece in that package; Murton and Patterson are both players without positions.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

As of now...

… that deal looks pretty bad for Oakland, unless Donaldson comes through.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

true

However you have to base the deal as of last year when it happened.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

okay

Last year when it happened, I thought it looked pretty bad for Oakland then and nothing has happened since to change my mind. Somehow Hendry turned spare parts into gold.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jun 15, 2009 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The thing that looks worst for Oakland to me

…is how the Cubs have been able to keep Harden out on the mound so much more than Oakland ever could. Oakland’s taken some heat for having a subpar training staff and I can’t help but think that this just reinforces that.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is the real world

Why on earth your “ideal” ever happen? Esp #3.

Is my sarcasm detector broken?

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree re: Wells

As much as I hope he’s not a flash-in-the-pan pitcher, he needs at least 15 more starts to prove himself as the real deal.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I want to see 2 more Wells starts before im 100% sold

The Sox tend to have issues with facing a new pitcher, so that might not be the best indicator.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

True dat

If/when Wells faces Philadelphia and New York, and shows consistency, I’ll be sold.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

'scuse me?

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It doesn't have to be an elite team

I just want to see how he responds to having a bad start. I don’t think a White Sox start for sure shows me because they have issues with new pitchers.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

but if Wells fails, you still have Marshall right?

"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Jun 15, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes

but both marshall and wells would be in the rotation if harden was gone

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

True, but...

… if you have traded Harden, you’re a pitcher short. The Cubs would need both Wells and Marshall to succeed in order to replace Harden.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Unless you can pry one loose in a trade.

In a possible Harden trade, the Cubs probably need a bat and a live arm, either to supplement the bullpen (in which Marshall goes to the rotation) or to slide into the 5th spot in the rotation.

Getting a 5th starter and a bat for Harden is probably asking for too much, IMO.

I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg

by Trey2317 on Jun 15, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe we can package a lesser bat along with Harden

to pick up a better bat and a 5th starter type? Maybe someone like Fontenot?

by madcow256 on Jun 15, 2009 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Miles?

I’m not sure I’d part with Fontenot if it meant that Miles was the everyday 2B with Ramirez back.

I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg

by Trey2317 on Jun 15, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ideally, it would be Miles

Although, maybe we’re getting a more established 2B/SS in return and we won’t miss Fontenot so much. Finding someone willing to take Miles with his current contract seems unlikely at best . . . things would be a lot easier if we had another few million in wiggle room with the payroll.

by madcow256 on Jun 15, 2009 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It'll take three teams I think to unload Miles

and there are some interesting three-team proposals floating around in the threads.

The wiggle room in payroll could come in a Harden & Miles deal.

I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg

by Trey2317 on Jun 15, 2009 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

But don't forget about Shark at AAA,

I believe he’s been pitching well lately and it wouldn’t surprise me if he makes a significant contribution in the 2nd half.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe a Harden trade is a possibility...

and maybe thats why the cubs have looked at pedro martinez

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

agreed...

but i can’t see another reason why the cubs would look at pedro

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's why I don't see any team

signing him for much more than the minimum.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's a good point.

I hadn’t thought of that.

Makes sense to keep your options open. Pedro would essentially have to sign close to the minimum for that to make sense. I don’t see him getting much for the minimum as I see little demand for his services for anything much more than the minimum.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

even if it was a couple million

he would take Harden’s spot and we’d get other players from the Harden deal to help us.

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I kind of think trading Harden would require a 3 team deal.

You’d be trading Harden to a contender who would be unlikely to trade players from their MLB roster. You likely would need to get a 3rd team involved that would take prospects back and be trading a veteran hitter.

That would be complicated but Hendry has shown the ability to put together a deal like this in mid-season. (Nomar deal in 2004.)

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think the Cubs could only deal for a player

that would not increase their 2010 payroll.

The problem with Freddy is he is close to vesting his 2010 option.

With the team having no one to approve any budget increases, I think Freddy is not an option unless they can shed payroll from the 2010 budget and I don’t see that happening.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah that is true

But we do have Shark in AAA

"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Jun 15, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Samardzija hasn't been overwhelming in AAA though...

and he doesn’t have much of an MLB track record either (none as a starter).

by SouthernCub on Jun 15, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Does he have more than 1 1/2 pitches, yet?

Until that happens, he’s not going to contribute at the bigs consistantly.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Great Post Al!

I agree with all of this. Indeed you are the wind beneath my wings.

"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Jun 15, 2009 1:00 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Woah! Someone cue the Bette Midler music!

And get the hankies girls!

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 5:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I HATED that movie. Then again I'm a guy and, you know, straight.

NOT THAT THERE’S ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT!

I don’t mean to offend anyone.

It was just a DUMB movie.

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well,

I wasn’t referring to the movie but a line from a Dilbert strip.

Manhood, check

"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Jun 15, 2009 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with a lot of this

Number 1 needs to happen ASAP. I don’t see a DeRosa deal working out, but I can hope.

This Fukudome thing is going to become an issue again. I agree with leaving him in the 2-spot for a while and see if that helps. I just fear that he is becoming the black hole that he became last year. He may be destined to sit in the 8 hole.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 1:02 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

The reason I think there is no chance no 1 happens

is Miles is under contract for next year. With the team essentially without an owner, I doubt anyone has the authroity to throw money down the toilet for next year.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Miles is “undumpable.”

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I dunno.

Even if you do that, it’s still not that much — especially if Harden can be traded.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Now, if the reason his play has dropped off so much

is because of his injured shoulder (which happened in spring training), they should put him on the DL and bring a healthy player up. I subscribe to the theory that this is the root of Miles’ offensive drop-off.

I do think it’s possible for Miles to bounce back if his shoulder heals but I suspect this is the kind of injury that will only heal in the off-season.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Miles never has been a great (or even a very good) hitter, but it’s hard to believe he could be this bad (sub .500 OPS) unless he was hurt.

by Jody Jody Davis on Jun 15, 2009 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I dunno. Whenever I see Miles in the lineup I feel like excusing myself and hitting the can.

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 5:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Then have Zambrano beat the crap out of him

I’m only half kidding about that.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Aaron Heilman Sucks Fan Club, through its President, approves of point #3

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 1:03 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Realistically...

I like the Aaron Miles idea, I feel Cubs nation is more than ready to let him go after talking to a lot of people at the game yesterday. Also, at the game yesterday it appeared to me that
Marmol was not falling off the mound towards 1st base during his follow – through, which is very good news. Al, Who is your some prospects for DRO? I think that is too general seeing that the Indians could be asking for top guys. It just doesn’t seem that simple. I would see them asking for a Guzman or Kevin Hart instead of Heilman. If they took Heilman they would be crazy. I COMPLETELY agree with the Milton statement. Yesterday looking in the Cubs dugout it was him who was up appearing to rally the troops before the 9th inning and he was the first one out of the dugout to mob theriot. I really think as the Cubs pick it up Milton will become a fan favorite. The guy has to much will to win hopefully he stays concentrated.

by cliffyhoops03 on Jun 15, 2009 1:09 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

You might need to send...

… a Brandon Guyer, or a Steve Clevenger, along with some pitching.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You'd have to figure

a team could get him back for roughly 2/3 of what we got for him in the offseason. He’s performed about as well as he has last year, and he’s only got 2/3 of a season left on his contract (vs. a full season when we traded him).

Maybe I’m oversimplifying things?

by madcow256 on Jun 15, 2009 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You probably are.

He’s second on his team in RBI. The Indians are fourth in the AL in runs, and 2nd to last in runs allowed. They need pitching.

Harden for DeRosa (and maybe a prospect) might not be a bad deal for both teams.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

you're going to need to be more specific.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Clevenger was pretty good when he was in Detroit.

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I figured it out...the Cubs need offense.

The traditional spots in the field to play your big hitters would be LF, RF, and 1B. With the Cubs, that means Soriano, Lee, and Bradley. This will be the core of the offense, with which the team shall sink or swim. Are these guys seen as dangerous? Would you trust any of them to carry the team in the playoffs? I honestly think the Cubs would need to change out two of the three to actually have a shot at winning the pennant, but as we all know they are un-movable due to their contracts.

Just for fun, and maybe to make a point, I would give equal opportunity to Hoffpauir and Fox among this group and just continue to play whoever puts up the numbers on offense. Of course this could very likely result in benching, say, Soriano for the playoffs, but no one really expects him to come through in the postseason anyway.

by Jerry Mumphrey on Jun 15, 2009 1:10 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Needless to say... as Al referenced my post... I'm in agreement.

Roster moves need to be done here.

DeRosa is proving to be the glue that held everything together last year, when faced with injuries and adversity. We didn’t properly replace that versatility and production when we dealt him away.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 1:14 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

How about

seeing if anyone is willing to take fukudome with his contract? Let reed johnson take over in center and use the fukudome money to make a couple other moves.

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:14 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

that exposes Johnson

a lot, and Dome is not a black hole.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What team would do that?

With virtually all teams watching every penny they spend, I don’t think that is a risk any would take, at least during the season. Maybe it would be possible in the offseason if you traded a bad contract for someone else’s another bad contract.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That would be the trouble with dealing him

thats why I said see if anyone is willing to take the contract. If no one wants it then the idea is no good.

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nobody is going to take a guy who makes 12 mil a year

and is only productive for April and May. What team could possibly be dumb enough to take Fukudome?

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Perhaps contacting an NHL team would work. Those are good months for hockey.

Then you can send him back to Grand Rapids.

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Heilman and Prospects to Cleveland for DeRosa

Uh. well, I’d love to have DeRosa back, but do you really think Cleveland would take Heilman and prospects for him? I don’t know what prospects would be involved. How about Jeff Stevens as one of them? Getting DeRosa back should be a priority.

"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray

by memphiscub on Jun 15, 2009 1:14 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Derosa would be a "rental" player

his contract is up at the end of the year so his value won’t be too high.

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think DeRosa's value will be determined

by the number of teams bidding on him. Injuries to key players on contending teams will determine how many teams bid on DeRo and also the economy. Some teams, no matter if they have a serious injury, will simply not be able to add to their payroll.

I think the trading deadline will involve a whole lot of nothing this year as a direct result of the uncertainty with the economy.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And the fact that so many teams may still be in contention.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Including the Indians

they are not “out of it” yet. they have played better of late than their horrid start. DeRo moved up to #2 in their batting order, they may not be willing to trade their hot hand. It would have to be one of those trades viewed positively by both parties.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Jun 15, 2009 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No one is is out of it in the AL Central.

The Tigers (and this is a TIGERS FAN SPEAKING) are “paper” Tigers. I’m not convinced they can sustain it for the whole year.

Frankly after seeing the Twins this weekend against the Cubs and playing against the Tigers (the Tabbies are 1-4 against the Twinks), my money is on them (if the Tigers can’t bring the division title home). The WC won’t come from this division.

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You have the best pitcher

and the best hitter.

I don’t know that I’ve seen a better fastball than Justin Verlanders.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's the real deal. Not sure what happened to him last year other than the ole' "Sophomore Sump"?

Along those lines, “Mr. Soto? Your table is ready…”

That’s all I can figure …

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Interesting comparison

Bc Verlander was bad last year. Hopefully it works out the same.

I hope the Cubs don’t have to face him.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I kinda hope they do 'cause I wanna see him pitch in person when we go to the 3 game series...

It’ll be exciting!

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It would be a perfect game

If his stuff was half what it was against the White Sox

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah

he’s nasty.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

So which is better?

Nasty or Filthy?

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Kinda

6 of one, half dozen of another.

I prefer “nasty”, but filthy is fine.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wasn't his sophmore year.

ROY in 2006. Soph year would’ve been 2007, not 2008.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ah. You are right Allie. My mistake.

Hmp! There goes my whole premise! ;(

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe a "Junior Jinx"?

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry!

I really did like your theory though.

Hope Sunday got Geo some confidence…

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Me too!

Come on GEO! We need you buddy.

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Noooooo

Damn for like 3 minutes there I was less upset about Soto.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: DeRosa's value...

…according to this article dated today, the A’s asked about DeRo but:

….the team believes the asking price is probably too high for a player who is in the final year of a deal.

Take it FWIW.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It doesn't say what the asking price was.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, the wording is very unclear.

Saying “the team believes the asking price is probably too high” implies the A’s never got a clear answer on what the asking price is. I was just trying to add some detail to this particular aspect of the discussion, but I fear I’ve only made it all the more confusing.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

CURSE YOU MEGATRON!

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LMAO!!!

I <3 Optimus Prime and Rodimus Prime

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cleveland would want more

Heilman isn’t worth much.

by elgato on Jun 15, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If they trade back for DeRosa

They shouldnt immediately fire Hendry, that would be ridiculous. Not to mention the fact that Heilman can barely survive in the NL, why would Cleveland want him?

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jun 15, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

How does getting rid of our best pitcher make us better exactly?

Dumping him for “prospects” at that? Why would a contending team salary dump an amazing player for prospects?

Oh….

3.Send prospects and Aaron Heilman to Cleveland for Mark DeRosa.

…so that Derosa can ride back in on his holy unicorn and save the day.

The A’s backed off because they felt Cleveland was asking too much for him. I’m not sure why a non-contending team would want Heilman, who has been terrible, is moderately expensive, and only club-controlled for 2 more years.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 1:16 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Wait.

You just called the Indians a contending and a non-contending team in the same post.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No I called the Cubs a contending team

I asked how the Cubs, a contending team, would be made better by getting rid of their best pitcher.

Then I asked why the Indians, a non-contending team, would be interested in 1.5 years of a bad and moderately expensive Aaron Heilman.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry, I misread your post.

I thought you were referring to DeRosa.

The indians aren’t non-contending. They are six games out of first place in the mediocre AL Central.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let me rephrase then

Why would anyone want 1.5 years of a bad and moderately expensive Aaron Heilman?

And again I’ll ask, how does it help the Cubs to get rid of their best pitcher?

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Rich Harden is the Cubs' "best" pitcher?

In what universe is that true?

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Are you going to answer any questions or just give one-line pedantic replies?

Harden is inarguably the most talented pitcher on the staff. When healthy, he’s one of the most dominant pitchers in the entire MLB. He led all MLB starters in ERA and K/9 last season, and was 3rd in the MLB WHIP.

When he is on the mound, he is their best pitcher.

But that’s not the argument here – you’re dodging the questions:

How does trading their best pitcher the extremely talented, incredibly effective, and absolutely dominant Rich Harden help the Cubs win this year?

Why would a non-contending Indians team anyone want 1.5 years of an overpriced an ineffective Aaron Heilman?

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's our best 5 inning pitcher bar none.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 15, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

We have an abundance of talented pitchers

What we severely lack right now is offense.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And dumping Harden for prospects fixes this how?

Because you’ll spin these “prospects” for Derosa?

While Derosa’s holy unicorn of awesomeness solves a short-term need (no third baseman), Harden’s departure would create a long-term one (worse starting pitching, worse bullpen because whoever now starts opens up a bullpen slot).

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The bullpen that is full of pitchers who never pitch?

Maybe it would force to use them or move them.
I dont feel like Harden should be traded for prospects, unless a 3 team deal is happening. We need a bat of some sort.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

They never pitch because they suck

If you pull Wells (who will end up there when our starting 5 are back) and / or Marshall out of there, you’re left with a very shallow pen.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Lou has already put Marshall in the pen.

If Harden stays, Wells remains in the rotation.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

if they traded Harden

Marshall would come out of the pen.

I think he’s pitched, what, twice? Three times? Since he went into the pen. Several other pen pitchers have done fairly well — even Marmol did ok.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because you're trying to equalize contracts.

Did you read the rest of the post? You send prospects as well, perhaps major-league-ready prospect. Heilman isn’t making THAT much money. Further, he has been more effective of late.

The Cubs have surplus pitching. They need a bat. This is a way to get one.

FWIW, Ted Lilly has been the Cubs’ “best” pitcher this year.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I did read it and it didn't make much sense

You were saying that trading Harden somehow offsets the Miles contract:

The savings of getting someone else to take the remainder of his $7 million deal would make up for eating Miles’ contract.

….which doesn’t make sense because Miles’ contract’s a sunk cost – it’s already being counted against the team’s payroll, whether or not he plays another game here.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sure, but...

… getting someone else to take Harden’s would at least clear that payroll room, right?

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I guess if you needed it for something else

If you don’t need that payroll room for something else, then all you’ve done is made the team worse in exchange for a savings of $3.5M.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You and I disagree on whether the team would be better or worse.

I think you could use the savings to get some hitting help.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What is this Harden crap?

He has been god awful every other start this season and already spent some time on the DL with plenty more to come.

Ted Lilly is the best pitcher on this staff, and Carlos Zambrano is the most talented.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Harden is awesome at baseball

I’m not sure what else to tell you.

Even if you won’t concede the fact that when healthy he’s one of the most dominant pitchers in baseball, you have to look at the marginal cost: is he a significantly better pitcher than those who will be taking his place in the rotation? (hint: yes) If you answered “yes” to the previous question (hint: you should have) then you’ve made the team worse by dumping him for prospects.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He was, presumably, healthy before the DL stint this year.

Those starts weren’t dominant.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Am I?

The Cubs’ starting pitching did just fine while Harden was on the DL. The losses weren’t because of pitching problems. They need a bat.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mike? That you?

Yes. Harden is very talented when healthy.. but that doesn’t mean he’s a good pitcher. It means he has good stuff.

He’s injury prone, good for 5 innings tops consistantly and too dependent on the strike out.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Look you can call me whatever names you want

but that’s a pretty low blow.


but that doesn’t mean he’s a good pitcher. It means he has good stuff.

Again, this is pedantry.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Is it?

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes. It's an arbitrary distinction that has nothing to do with the argument.

I’m reposting and bolding the clause that everyone missed.

Even if you won’t concede the fact that when healthy he’s one of the most dominant pitchers in baseball, you have to look at the marginal cost: is he a significantly better pitcher than those who will be taking his place in the rotation? (hint: yes) If you answered "yes" to the previous question (hint: you should have) then you’ve made the team worse by dumping him for prospects.

A little help here, since people seem to be having trouble with that one:

“Even if you won’t concede” means “even if you don’t agree”. It means “let’s forget about this stupid pedantic argument about whether he’s the best pitcher or whatever, and look at the meat of the issue here”.

You literally missed the point of my post if you’re getting caught up in how to classify Harden as a pitcher.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Where did you learn a word like "pedantic"?

Since this discussion is going nowhere, I was curious and thought I’d ask.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

College?

No idea. It’s a great word though.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Also, I'd be more complimented by the kudos

…if I hadn’t misused the word “literally” in my post. Tsk, tsk, tsk Wreckard.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm often amused when...

some of my friends will say something like “I literally exploded with laughter!”

Why people think that the word is merely some sort of emphasis word I don’t know…

:)

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I literally

agree with you.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I literally

saw what you did there

Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2011

by heine41 on Jun 15, 2009 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He has not been what you say he is this year

Look at these 2 games. April 15th
May 1st
Or just look at this year for him in general.

I love Harden. But he has not been that dominant this year.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

jkobus's todo list

1) Do laundry
2) Buy Fiddle-Faddle
3) Learn what the term “small sample size” means

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know what small sample sizes are

Im just pointing out he isnt being the dominant pitcher this year, which is why everyone has been saying he isnt the best pitcher the Cubs have.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Also, thanks

I forgot I need to do laundry

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No problem.

Don’t forget the fiddle-faddle. It’s a delicious snack.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Never heard of it.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

tastes

pixely.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Now with 10% more pixels!

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Jun 15, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

mmmm Poppycock

Great, now I miss the AFL. Thanks

by chitownhawkeye on Jun 15, 2009 6:43 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Dugg for "Poppycock".

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 15, 2009 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just think maybe I define "dominate" differently

You can’t be dominate by averaging less than 110 IP/yr.

Santana is dominate. Halladay is dominate.

Not to be pedantic.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

"dominant"

to be pendantic. :P

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

also

pedantic.

And pedatnic.;

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Seems to be a growing pedantic pandemic

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Jun 15, 2009 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And my spelling sucks

Dominant?

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I guess the question then is

has Harden really pitched better than Wells/Marshall?

I’m not entirely sure the answer is yes. W/L is no way to judge a pitcher’s record.

It depends on whether or not we’re ready to trust Wells full-time in the show.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There's also another reason to keep Harden

and keep the depth the Cubs have at starting pitcher.

What is the likelihood a starting pitcher gets hurt? If you trade Harden, who wold you replace that pitcher with?

Of course, Harden would likely BE the pitcher gets hurt. LOL

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it's a fair point.

There’s disagreement on how well the Shark is doing in AAA.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No, the question isn't "has he"

That’s a question that’s easily answered.

The question is “will he”. His career stats and MLB track record indicate that yes he will, by a significant margin.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wells

has an amazing set of stats. ERA under .100, right?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes

Again, that’s answering the question “has he pitched better”. We know the answer to that question – Wells has, no doubt about it.

But do you really believe Wells will keep that up? Given his minor league stats?

I’m not saying Wells doesn’t have a quality major league career ahead of him; but expecting he’ll keep this up is unrealistic, likewise with Harden.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't expect Wells to have a career as good as Harden's to date.

But we’re not talking about the past. We’re talking about right now. Can Wells keep this up the rest of the year? That’s the key question.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's what I keep saying....

When trying to project the future (asking, “will he pitch better”), you look at a guy’s full career stats, not their season-to-date.

Those would suggest Harden will return to form and Wells will regress.

That said, I do think Wells will be a quality major league pitcher, just not this good.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Explain, then...

… why the non-injured Harden wasn’t dominant the first two months.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

sunspots

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 15, 2009 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Best explanation I've heard so far.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Um.

Let me answer this the way you would: “Because numbers don’t play the game”.

My earnest answer: small sample size. You’re talking about 7 games – that’s not enough information. There’s so much random chance in baseball that when you look at a sample that small you’re going to see huge aberrations in the stats. And I guarantee you, Randy Wells’ season so far definitely looks like an aberration.

Let me put it this way: let’s say I was going to make a bet. Someone was going to bet me $100 dollars as to who would put up the better statistics from this point on in the season. Would I have the best odds if I based my bet on the small sample size of the 7 or 8 games that Wells and Harden have pitched in this year? Or would I be better off looking at the full scope of their careers and try to use that to make my prediction? What’s the over / under I’d be right if I did that instead?

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Your point is taken.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Now that could be argued

because Harden has been hurt so much. If Wells stays healthy, he simply may have the better career because he pitches effectively every 5th day.

It really depends on what numbers you think are the most important.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

They feel like two VERY different things to me

Lots of guys have great stuff, that doesn’t mean they can pitch.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I would argue Harden is both a good pitcher and has good stuff.

He’s just been hurt a lot over his career but when he has pitched he’s been pretty darn good.

He has a record of 45-23 with an ERA of 3.33. Most of his innings were in the AL too.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed...

Harden is a very good pitcher. He might ultimately be a bad value, but he’s a good pitcher (and has good stuff).

by SouthernCub on Jun 15, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think he's a good thrower at this point

A pitcher can get outs without always relying on stuff.

Getting by with stuff is great, but I’d like to see him do more.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

FWIW

I’ve said the same thing for years about Zambrano (being able to get a K when you need it is fabulous, but I like him better when he’s getting ground balls).

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

that innings pitched is definitely an important stat for evaluating a pitcher.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not sure how you can look at Harden's career stats...

and seriously argue that he isn’t a good pitcher, let alone dominant pitcher.

Yes, he’s injury-prone, but the guy has put up ridiculous numbers throughout his career. If you want to argue that he will (for reasons that I hope you’d elaborate on) no longer pitch to his demonstrated career talent level fine, then elaborate on that. Merely citing his numbers this year is an proof of that is nothing more than a “limited sample-size” error though.

Anyway, I think you can make an argument against keeping Harden (though not a very good one, to my mind). But arguing that he was never very good to begin with is asinine when you actually look at his numbers.

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Once you attach that "when healthy" tag on him

He can no longer be considered this awesome dominate pitcher. I don’t understand the love people have for these pitchers who can’t stay healthy. Its a joke, leave that crap up to other teams. Harden has been average this season, not even close to this god walking on the baseball diamond once every five days.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

One of the biggest problems around here

…is that so many people here can’t get past the fact that injury-prone players can be extremely valuable and effective. Sure, if they were always healthy they’d be even more effective than they are, but you have to take players for what they are, not what you wish they were.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well If I was running a team

I would avoid the injury prone crap whenever possible with pitchers. They are too important to break down all the time. I’ll take a Halladay or a CC over Prior or Harden every single day.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, of course you would.

But I might take even a lesser pitcher over a Harden. Last year’s Harden stayed healthy. This year’s version hasn’t.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Would Ted be considered lesser?

Somebody at his level is also way better than Harden, but Ted has been miles better this season.

What about Dempster? Though I don’t know my feeling about him, he stays healthy so he should also be considered above Harden.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

Harden’s “healthy” year yielded 148 IP.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

148 IP of dominating baseball

So what if you have to fill in 100 IP with someone lesser when what you get is so damn valuable?

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Feels like

robbing Peter to pay Paul, to me.

But whatever. I’m obviously not going to convince you.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 4:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I am the Frito Bandito

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow, reply fail!

Supposed to be in response to Al

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's actually funnier as a reply to what Allie said.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know . . . I actually laughed at work

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 6:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

literally?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have to admit, it was only figuratively

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

FIGURATIVIST!

get him!

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LOL

Random, much?

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe I should start doing that on purpose

Instead of just saying, “Peavy”

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 6:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wholeheartedly support this notion.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 16, 2009 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, I see you've taken action on it already

However, I’m going to mix it up a little bit.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 16, 2009 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's really not that hard to understand

Pitcher A is really good but gets hurt all the time.

Pitcher B is the guy who’d be playing if you didn’t have Pitcher A. Pitcher B is very healthy, but isn’t as good as Pitcher A.

150 IP of Pitcher A + 100 innings of Pitcher B is more valuable than 250 IP of Pitcher B.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 4:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ah, I see.

The Milton Bradley argument for pitchers. Sorry, you’ve lost me here. Adam Dunn would have been far more valuable to the Cubs this year than Milton Bradley.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And even Halladay is hurt right now and has had some

injuries in his career. Such as that line drive he took off his leg right before the All-Star game a couple of years ago.

Pitchers like Maddux that were never hurt are as rare as anything in baseball.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Except that is just a strange occurance

and even if a guy gets hurt because his arm was beat down for years (Big Z) thats okay. Guys like Harden were fragile from day one. We don’t need that.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That would only make sense...

If their replacements during those injury periods negated the value of their production.

You judge a player based on his overall production. It doesn’t matter what the time-period is that he does it in.

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Harden is not Prior

Prior is post-op. Guys are never the same after that.

So far, Harden has never had a major surgery and consequently always comes back at top form.

I’ll take a Halladay or a CC over Prior or Harden every single day.

And of course you’d take CC or Halladay over Harden – who in their right mind wouldn’t? And if the suggestion was “trade Harden for CC” then what you said would be relevant. It isn’t – you’re not talking about replacing Harden with a pitcher who’s never had an ERA in the minors below 4 until this season.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

When exactly has Harden been so awesome this year?

He’s got a 4.53 ERA, been on the DL twice, and has been the benefactor of the Cubs actually scoring a bunch of runs in his 4 wins. Not to mention, he’s given up a whopping 9 HRs in just 49 2/3 innings.

Not exactly “dominant.”

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 4:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's pitched 9 games this season

This is another textbook example of people rushing to judgment based on a small sample size.

by Wreckard on Jun 15, 2009 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Randy Wells? Really?

A few good starts doesnt signal he’s arrived, it certainly doesnt make him reliable building block for the future, nor does it make him a replacement for Harden.

He could simply be having a great six week stretch never to be repeated, it happens all the time

Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.

by bren on Jun 15, 2009 1:16 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

If you make Move No. 2

There’s no need for Move No. 3. And Move No. 2 is much more realistic, anyway.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 1:18 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Perhaps so.

Depends on what you get for Harden.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think he was referring to your suggestion of getting Brandon Wood...

in which case, I’d agree. You don’t need both Wood and DeRosa.

That said, I’m not sure if I’m ready to rely on Wells and Marshall as the #4 and #5 starters just yet – especially for a gamble on an upside player like Wood.

by SouthernCub on Jun 15, 2009 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Love the DeRo idea.

Hate the Harden idea. The only reason this club isn’t out of it is our starting pitching, part of that is Harden. We did “okay” with Wells in instead, but I’m not convinced he’s that good over the long term, I am convinced that Harden is.

Believe or Leave ~Cubswynn 9/9/2008

by slcathena on Jun 15, 2009 1:21 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Agreed

We need our starting pitching to be as strong as possible this year

by cubsmania on Jun 15, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

4,5 and 6 seem the most realistic

With 1 being somewhat realistic, but not likely.

I am an American aquarium drinker...

by HoodooMan on Jun 15, 2009 1:21 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Exactly.

I have simple logic behind my thoughts.

I am an American aquarium drinker...

by HoodooMan on Jun 15, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let's focus on #1 right now :)

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1 trillion

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have wonderful dreams at night

Where I turn on the cubs and there is no Aaron Miles.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There was just two glorious weeks

Where that dream was a reality. Then Miles came back.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think most of this is fine

although I don’t know why Cleveland would take that deal.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 1:35 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

My Thoughts

1. Concerning Miles, I wouldn’t mind if the Cubs released him. I cringed when they signed him, and I cringe every time I see him because I was right. He was a bad signing. Though I wouldn’t mind if Hendry lets him go, I doubt he will. I figure the Cubs are hoping he gets some sort of hot streaking going, swallow his money, and will use him as a 3rd – 4th player in a trade later in the season. I hoping this is the reason he is still around.
2. I’m cool with trading Harden… I just hope Hendry doesn’t blow it and give him away for nothing.
3. DeRosa will not be coming back to the Cubs. If we were going to get him, he’d be here now before Aram gets better. Still, Hendry let him go for a reason. His days with the Chicago Cubs are probably over. Hendry won’t bring him back because he want anybody to rub his deal from the offseason in his face.
4. Kosuke… I’m down with whatever works. I love watching him play when he’s on… but, I am slowly beginning to think he really isn’t MLB material. I hope I am wrong.
5. I am also a critic about Bradley’s signing. Regardless of the controversy he brings, he can’t stay healthy. That was the number one issue from the get go. I wanted Dunn… Anyway, you’re right with this one. Leave him alone. The Cubs do NEED Bradley to produce. Finger of Shame goes to Lou and Jim for making Bradley a "key ingredient" to us winning because he isn’t reliable. Still… Griping about it isn’t going to keep him healthy. One thing, I doubt this would happen, but I wouldn’t mind to see him traded if something good comes along. Bradley is better suited on an AL team. Maybe somebody… yankees?… .BoSox?…would be interested…
6. Sounds good.
7. Define "occasionally." Soriano does need a day off or two. But, I don’t think this needs to become like a catcher type deal where your main starts a bunch of days, then backup, etc… I have a feeling most or Soriano’s problems are because he is trying to hard to pick up the slack. I’m sure he’s feeling the pressure of his large contract, mix that together with the facts that come with getting older and his knee… well, I think Fonzie needs somebody to just come in and settle things down for him.

These is my thoughts on your opinions Al. Thanks.

by TheHawkRules on Jun 15, 2009 1:37 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Soriano's problem

is not feeling too much pressure. He just isn’t a very good baseball player.

He has never done well against good pitching and he isn’t going to start now. He’s the kind of guy who hits two HRs and drives in 3 in a 10-3 win. At the end of the year, he looks like a slugger, but really he hasn’t helped the team win games. He has never been a good baserunner and has always been a terrible fielder. He should be a DH batting 7th. He’s grossly, obscenely overpaid and he’s over the hill, deteriorating numbers and injury prone…I’d try like hell to pawn him off on someone, but he’s burned too many teams already. the Cubs will have to eat his contract….if we can’t trade him, I’d bat him 7th.

by seesdifferent on Jun 16, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Do you think that

trades involving some financial involvement will be approved by the current owner?

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 1:37 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

In today's Tribune...

… and I can’t find the link right now, Hendry said he had not spoken to Crane Kenney lately about adding any payroll. This implies that he might do so before July 31 if he felt the right deal were in place.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks

for the answer and for not linking to the Trib.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, I really should post article links when I find them.

But I can’t find this one. I read it in the dead tree edition.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You're credible enough

and we trust you’ve vetted your sources.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think this is

the article you were referring to.

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark

by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Jun 15, 2009 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks.

That’s the one.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

All very sensible

Except the Harden trade. I think we’d be selling low on a guy who looked very much like the ace of our staff for a period of time last July & August. When healthy, Harden is capable of great things. While I know its probably foolish to count on his being healthy, the Cubs really aren’t doing that. They have enough capable starts in reserve to keep the rotation strong, so getting a healthy Harden back is a bonus.

Bottom line is I just can’t see the point in trading a guy who could easily be #2 in a playoff rotation, unless you’re getting a lot back in return. Right now, we won’t get that. The rest of your post I agree with.

by Orval Overall on Jun 15, 2009 1:43 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

That's how I look at Harden as well...

The Cubs are one of the few rotations that can afford the luxory of a pitcher like Harden: High impact pitcher when available, but frequently unavailable. Any team that needs him to be a continual presence will get burned.

The Cubs staff is so strong though that we can afford to enjoy his productivity, but then absorb the loss when he’s unable to play. Sicne there’s not a lot of teams like us, I’m not sure who would be a viable trading partner…

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sell high and buy low

As much as I love Wells performance so far, I still have a nagging suspicion that the NL will begin to figure him out as he pitches more innings. Since he doesn’t have dominant stuff he may be relegated to an historical image of a guy who pitched his heart out and never got a win. With that being written, it makes a point to see what he’d bring on the open market. Dangle he Jim.

If you like Selig's handling of the steroid issue, you'll love his choice for next Cub owner.

by tharr on Jun 15, 2009 1:45 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

That's my thought also.....

I think we know what we have with Harden. Wells on the other hand?? Time will tell.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Jun 15, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Al, I appreciate the thought you put into this post.

I think the thing that would help most is for the ownership situation to be resolved.

It’s ridiculous for the Cubs to essentially have no one with the authority to make any financial decisions that differ with the current budget. Only the Cubs would have an ownership change drag into a 3rd year. LOL

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 1:46 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Unfortunately, that's not likely to happen before the season ends.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good Post

Miles must go, I believe that is a unamious decision here at BCB.
Even though I would love to have DeRosa back, I see another team making a big push to get him, the guy is having a good year and Cleveland will hold out and get a good return on him.
Dome in the 2 hole, great, just start hitting the ball. No one would take Dome in a trade.
Harden is our chip. He is the most likely to go so the Cubs can get a good bat in return.
I am not a Bradley guy, however as mentioned by many, we need him to hit for this team to win.
I hope this is Lou’s last year, that is my opinion.

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Jun 15, 2009 1:47 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I think a good poll, simply to see if it would be 100%

would be asking if Miles should be removed from the team.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The never-ending Cubs/Wrigley Sale

may preclude more “Contract-eating” as you suggest in item 1.

Not that I don’t want to see Miles go, it’s just that the economics of the situation may prevent management from burning more dollar bills. Which means we’re stuck with Miles until Hendry can bamboozle some other team to pick up his absurd contract.

However, this can be solved by packaging Miles with Harden in a trade; in other words, use Harden to get rid of Miles and solve two problems at once.

by JFCubFan on Jun 15, 2009 1:49 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

That might work.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

+100 if you can find a way to get Chone Figgins in the return package.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

How about getting Rob Deer out of the leadoff spot?

Oh wait, I meant Soriano. I know, this topic’s been beaten to death, but come on. He’s hitting .230 now, with no speed any longer. Seriously, it’s like having Rob Deer lead off. No wonder we can’t score any runs. It just pisses me off that the whole lineup can get shaken up any given day, but Soriano must lead off no matter what. Drop the guy in the order until he gets out of his funk, already.

I agree with everything else wholeheartedly, especially on dumping Miles. Yet another player who looked a helluva lot better in Cardinal red than he’s looked anywhere else. Cut him loose, please.

by reedjohnson on Jun 15, 2009 1:53 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

No, having Rob Deer lead off...

… would at least give you a guy who walked fairly often. Deer’s lifetime OBA was 104 points higher than his lifetime BA. Soriano’s is 48 points higher. If Deer had even been able to hit .250 instead of .220 he’d have been a superstar.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Two Words

Adam Dunn

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 15, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LOL...with what?

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 15, 2009 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm sure we could get him if we wanted him...

…but, it doesn’t matter. If he were to be a Cub, then he would have been signed in the offseason. We sure could use him…

by TheHawkRules on Jun 15, 2009 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd love to have Dunn.

But unless you are willing to have Alfonso Soriano play 2B every day, there’s no place to play Dunn.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hmmm... Soriano at 2B or Miles at 2B...

Sadly… Soriano might be an upgrade there.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

is Miles

THAT bad?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

how does a guy regress

THAT much in a year?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Injuries are likely a big part of it.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He was NEVER good

Ever. This is what Aaron Miles is. Jim Hendry and three hillbillies in St. Louis think he is a useful player.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And those hillbillies are "morans"!

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hope somebody has the pic handy

bc that is the guy who is sitting a Busch every night wondering where Miles is.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

except

he did hit .300 last year. And he’s way below his career norms for this year.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That .300 is a mirage

His OPS+ was 99. That was his career season. He wasn’t even a league average player in his career season.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's worse than bad.

Not sure how he regresses or if he got off on the wrong foot but I have seen nothing that makes me believe he can help us. Maybe it’s injuries, but what we see is not good.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Jun 15, 2009 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

the only beneficial thing aaron miles did for the cubs was flying out to jim edmonds so the cubs could clinch the division title

by jesus christos on Jun 15, 2009 3:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think I could stomach watching those games.

We’d be exchanging excurciating offense for horrendous defense.

It would be solving one problem by creating another problem.

Watching a bad defense and bad baserunning are thing things that most want me to fling my show through the TV.

Will it lead to more wins? I don’t know. I just know it would’t be very ugly to watch.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

We could get some good defense guys to play the bench...

…and come in later in the game. I would rather have bad starting defense than an overall horrible offense.

by TheHawkRules on Jun 15, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just as ugly as watching Miles fail to turn a DP, or

Drop a line drive, or
Leap as high as he could and just miss a liner, or
Fail to hit the ball out of the infield in every at bat.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wait

Miles takes the bat off his shoulder?

"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by jkobus on Jun 15, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Of course he does

If he didn’t, he might walk.

by madcow256 on Jun 15, 2009 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

"Fling my show through the TV"?

That’d be interesting to watch.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Show was funnier

:)

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Blog Bloopers?

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Weaking the defense is the wrong thing to do, IMHO

I’d rather go extreme on the defense to help out the pitching (how many fewer cheap hits/runs would we give up with plus defenders out there?)

Giving up fewer cheapies means having to scrap less offense, at least in my none baseball playing mind.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd rather have that...

..happening right now than what we are currently seeing.

by TheHawkRules on Jun 15, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You think Soriano's strike outs are bad at the top

Why would that be any “better” somewhere else in the lineup?

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

If you don’t lead him off, bench him. I don’t want to see him striking out in the 6 hole any more than when he leads off. I don’t think moving him down will help his bat and I don’t think it will produce any more offense either.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jun 15, 2009 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

his rbi totals might go up

and his OBP doesnt hurt so much in 6 or 7th spot. but really, your point is well taken, he hurts the team in the field and on the bases also. You should also be wondering what kind of manager continues to write his name in the leadoff slot.

by seesdifferent on Jun 16, 2009 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Excellent post Al

and I’ll agree with all of these except Harden. Here’s why. I’m confident he’ll be in the rotation at least as much as out, if not say about 2/3rd’s of the season. With him in there and Wells doing so well, I’d really like to see Marshall come out of the bullpen instead of being in the rotation.

Of course there’s the “hope” factor with Rich’s health but he’s downright filthy when he’s on. And the intangeable to this is I believe he’s learning how to pitch, not just throw hard. It’s taken time but I believe he’s morphing into a true pitcher where he is learning how better to mix up the flame throws with the offspeed stuff, in an effort to save his arm/shoulder.

Marshall is the only lefty option in the bullpen now and can also be the long-relief guy, especially if (as you also stated), Heilman can be sent packing for DeRo.

I too am not sentimental, I really thought there was going to be a “2nd piece” of that trade puzzle after 12/31 when DeRo was dealt; it didn’t happen.

Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.

by blackhawk24 on Jun 15, 2009 1:54 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Boy, are the Padres in trouble.

They had the chance to trade Peavy and all of the money owed to him in the offseason and they didn’t make it happen. They got greedy wanting more prospects than either the Cubs or Braves were willing to offer on top of taking on all of that money.

Now Peavy is done for at least a couple of months with no chance of trading him until the off-season. There’s no chance the Padres will find a better deal for Peavy than they were offered last year.

Talk about a francise that is a total mess.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I actually think the injury may have been good for SD

I may be totally wrong, because I don’t quite know how the insurance portion of baseball contracts work, but I would guess that Peavy’s contract was insured. If so, they would get compensated for his salary and can delay the decision until the off season.

by jerry morales rules on Jun 15, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wouldn't mind...

If the Cubs could pry Howie Kendrick from the Angels, since they’ve sent him down to Salt Lake.

At the least, in the event that the Cubs tried a trade with the Angels for something else, it’d be great if we could attach him as well. (Or Maicer Izturis, though he’s now starting in Kendrick’s absence).

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 2:10 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

If the Cubs are going to deal with the Angels...

… I’d rather have Brandon Wood. Bigger upside.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah and considering he's riding pine in LA

bring him over

Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2011

by heine41 on Jun 15, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hit post to quickly,

I meant to say, I simply don’t understand why the Angels won’t play Brandon Wood.

Mayvbe he needs blackmail pictures of someone to get playing time?

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I dave

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i robot

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jun 15, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I yi yi yi yi....

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i sleepy,

is it naptime yet?

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know much about Wood...

But projection wise, it seems like Kendrick is the better player (his numbers appear low this year only because his BABIP is uncharacteristically low. But his peripherals are all still strong).

What have you seen about Wood that you find intriguing? (I’m actually asking, as I don’t know much about him).

In a quick glance at his stats, I also notice that Wood’s a poor defender…

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wood has the chance to be a real good power hitter.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And he'll be ready to resume baseball activities in 5-7 days

Whoops — wrong Wood. Force of habit . . . .

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ha!

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No he doesn't

Enough about Brandon Wood. He is on the cusp of being chalked up a bust. 4 years at Triple A and he STILL can’t crack the infield situation in Anaheim?!? Please. He’s their version of Felix Pie.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wrong.

He is the victim of too many infielders with the Angels. He still is looked at as a good prospect by the Angels. Many out here can not figure out why they won’t just let him play every day… If he was so close to being a bust, as YOU say, then he would be gone from the Angles system.

Once again, just because you say something is so, doesn’t mean that it is.

I'm a truth teller, I'm a risk taker, I'm like Johnny Cash - I walk the line...

by Jimmyeatworld on Jun 15, 2009 4:05 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And.....

just because you say something is so, doesn’t mean that it is…….

You arguing with BLou (IMHO) is over the top. Everyone has an opinion. His may be wrong, but he is entitled to it. Enough already.

by timeforachange2009 on Jun 16, 2009 2:16 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd rather have Chone Figgins...

Who effectively replaces the versatility that DeRosa gave us…

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 4:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree.

Brandon Wood at best, is Adam Dunn offensively.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Harden is not worth much and DeRosa is not coming back

If and when Harden has 3 straight decent starts than he might have value to high payroll contending teams but you won’t get that much for him. Heilman plus prospects to the Indians is a joke unless the “prospects” are named Marshall & Ascanio. Braves , A’s and other teams who have far better prospects than the Cubs have sniffed at DeRosa and found the price to high. We can’t offer our “junk” for good players.

"I daydream just like everybody else, I just do it with my body facing the field, so everybody thinks I'm paying attention."- Greg Maddux

by Doggie Stalker on Jun 15, 2009 2:11 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

But Jessica, that's the way this works. We offer our crap and

some team feels sorry for us and gives us a superstar. We are the Cubs and every other team is our farm system, right?

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jun 15, 2009 5:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pittsburgh

would like a word…

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You know I'm a believer and feel the Cubs will make a solid run at the NL Central title

but….for the sake of discussion….in a worse case scenario….the Cubs fall out of the race and become sellers….

what pieces do the Cubs give up to rebuild for next year and beyond?

"I knew we were in for a long season when we lined up for the national anthem on opening day and one of my players said, 'Every time I hear that song I have a bad game.'" - Jim Leyland

by flachimesa on Jun 15, 2009 2:13 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Well, clearly, Harden is the first to go in that scenario.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

the ones they can.

Bradley (if anyone will take him)
Dome (if anyone will take him)
Riot
Fonty
Harden
Marshall
Wells
Soto

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why would you trade Marshall, Wells and Soto?

Those guys are under team control for several more years before they hit free agency, at reasonable cost.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know

I’m just saying that there’s a limited number of people was CAN easily part with. Marshall, Wells and Soto are three of them. Lee, Soriano and Z are not. For example.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There was a rumor on SI

that the Giants want Derrek.

(which would be the worst trade ever, but it might be a place Derrek would go)

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Phil Rogers "whispered" about the DLee to SF notion in the Sunday Trib.

Personally, I dont’ see it. First, If I’m not mistaken, DLee is from San Diego, not San Fran. It’s not like the two cities are all that close to each other. They’re at opposite ends of a very large state.

Second, even though the Giants have been playing some good ball this year and they have one hell of a rotation, it still appears pretty unlikely they’re going to catch the Dodgers.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

But the Giants can definitely be in the wildcard hunt with that pitching

And Sandoval is going to be a superstar in this league at some point. Plus Buster Posey is close to being ready.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, I admit, I hadn't considered the Wild Card.

Indeed, the Giants are currently leading the NL Wild Card. On a sidenote: I can’t believe it’s June 15 and I just checked the Wild Card standings. Is there a speeding bus nearby?

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I thought he was from Sacramento

and had his home there.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Correct.

Northern California MIGHT be a place he’d agree to go, IF he would waive the NTC.

Until then it’s just more mindless Phil Rogers speculation.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Derrek Lee would cease the opportunity to get out of this mess

I really do believe that. He’s been part of the problem, but that said I think he would relish a clean start. If a deal could be structured with San Francisco then I can’t see Lee objecting one iota.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

For future reference

Cease
Seize

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

All this is mindless Phil Rogers speculation...

I don’t think that Derrek would waive his NTC to go anywhere. He likes being a Cub, and is close to his daughter’s doctors in Iowa City.

I'm a truth teller, I'm a risk taker, I'm like Johnny Cash - I walk the line...

by Jimmyeatworld on Jun 15, 2009 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think

he’ll go. He wants to contend with this team.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Given option

A) see a drastic reduction in his PT and role on the club

or

B) Accept a trade somewhere else

You would have to imagine that he would choose B.

Of course that would require Hendry to confront a player and make an uncomfortable decision. Not something he has really shown the ability to do up to this point.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

But why on earth would you sit Derrek Lee?

Ugh. My head.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ideally you don't

However, if you want to trade him and he refuses. Then you will have to make some threats.

Example,

“Derrek, we are trading for Adrian Gonzalez and we want to trade you to San Fran. You can stay and back up Gonzalez or go and start in San Fran.”

What do you think Derrek chooses to do?

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

HAHAHA!

Can you please cite one example of that happening, just for my amusement? Thank you.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fred McGriff in 2001

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 4:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

How?

After another solid season in 2000, McGriff got off to a good start in 2001. He was heavily pursued by the contending Chicago Cubs around the trade deadline, and the soft-spoken McGriff waived his no-trade clause to allow himself to be dealt to Chicago on July 27, 2001. He hit a respectable .282 with 12 homers in 49 games with the Cubs, but the team did not reach the post season.

From wikipedia.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

McGriff didn't waive his NTC for almost a month

It wasn’t until Chuck LaMarr told him that they were going to play “younger players” over him to build for the future that McGriff moved on.

This isn’t the ideal situation obviously. However if you’re GM gives NTC’s to everyone and their cousin, then sometimes you have to deal with unpleasant circumstances sometimes.

Point is, a NTC doesn’t mean as much as it’s made out to be. End of the day 99% of these guys want to go where they can play and earn their NEXT contract.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah... the McGriff trade talks dragged on and on forever

And, I remember waiting for his approval… much like the recent proposed Peavy deal to the Sox.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And in the end,

it sure didn’t end up being worth the wait.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I imagine he wakes up from a horrible nightmare

and remembers that no GM would make that deal, ever.

Adrian Gonzalez is cheap, under team control, and REALLY good. The Padres don’t trade him for anything.

We wouldn’t trade Lee to someone who looks like our competition for the WC. Especially not when he’s been the only bright spot on the offense this year.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

DLee is trending the wrong direction

Try thinking logically and in some sort of future tense here. Sure Dlee has had an average season so far this year. This is probably the best chance for the Cubs to get out of the rest of his contract. Better to trade a guy 2 months too early than 2 years too late.

As for Gonzalez, he absolutely could be had. The Pads are in dire need of financial relief. Start with

Vitters
Jay Jackson
Wellington Castillo
Whatever prospects lee and or Harden nets

And go from there. Guaranteed the Pads would listen.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sure they need financial relief

but taking Gonzalez doesn’t do that.

He’s making $3.1 million this year. Find me a superstar that cheap.

Even Joe Mauer on the Twins makes 3x that.

They’re not trading Gonzalez.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Even Henley Ramirez

on the cheap Marlins makes 5.5 mil.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There is a point where a guy is so good

That even a cheap team will accept paying a little extra for them.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 5:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree completely

But saying Padres would trade Gonzalez to dump salary when he makes pennies….

I just don’t understand.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 5:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah its dumb

Adrian Gonzalez isn’t going anywhere.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 5:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

threats?

seriously?

I mean…

seriously?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think

it’s an a or b situation. It’s C:

c) Play Derrek Lee most of the time, with days off while Hoff plays.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just because you think he is part of the problem doesn't mean that he feels that way. He

may want to stay here and try to help turn things around. He has said on several occasions that he still likes playing here. I think the chances of him sticking out his contract are just as good as him leaving.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jun 15, 2009 5:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh, my bad.

I thought it was San Diego.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 15, 2009 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Al,

Is it anymore mindless than the chatter going on here? ;)

by timeforachange2009 on Jun 16, 2009 2:12 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, that's the point.

We’re not getting paid to write about baseball – though my tip jar is open for contributions.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 16, 2009 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Phil Rogers whispers

and I automatically know the opposite will happen. Remember the Astros were going to sneak attack us this year by signing Adam Dunn

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Twitter
SI_JonHeyman pitching-rich #giants will go for it. the wild card can be had. they just need a hitter: tejada? hawpe? holliday? d. lee?

Why on earth equally hitting poor Cubs would give up their only currently hot hitter is beyond me… but there you go.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It could happen

if the Cubs implode in the next few weeks and management decides to pack it up.

One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.

by chilango2 on Jun 15, 2009 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pittsburg dealt McClouth

And they are one of the 23 teams within 6 games, but I don’t think they really think they are in it..

DeRosa will not be availible. Cleveland will be in the mix for the AL Central. They are treading water and will get much better once Cabrera, Sizemore, Laffey, and Westbrook come back.

by jerry morales rules on Jun 15, 2009 2:31 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

By dealing McClouth the pirates

freed up a spot for McCutchen who’s a stud.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 5:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

do all their players

have an Mc in the front of their name?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Only the ones they don't give to us

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If McDonalds ruled the world...

In 2003, we would have traded for Kenny McLofton and Aramis McRamirez.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Trading partners

to make a trade, we need a partner that has whatever player that may improve us. While we may have junk to get rid of we need someone that views our junk as treasure. There are so many teams that still are thinking luck and prayer is the way to get to the playoffs with their current team that they will not trade key parts to us.

I would love to see a trade, especially a few weeks ago, to solve our 3rd base dilemma. We survived Aram’s loss so far and I’m betting our GM has the same view, whether we agree with it or not. I think Aram will be pushed ot be back before the all-star break and that may not be a good thing but it will make our lineup more stable.

So after reading everyone’s thoughts, remember we need a partner that has what we want and will take what we got. Easier said than done. I hope it would happen, just trying to be realistic.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Jun 15, 2009 2:33 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Smells like

a job for the Pirates to me. We always seem to really fleece them in trades.

by hmlee on Jun 15, 2009 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

My thoughts...

1. won’t happen, though I think it could be in the best interest of the team
2. I’m not sure I’m ready to anoint Wells as a sure-thing as a replacement for Harden. when we’re essentially looking for a one-month solution at 3B, that seems excessive. It would really depend on the return on investment (obviously).
3. much like #1, I think this would help, but it won’t happen either.
4. agreed. Should happen now. When Ramirez returns, move Bradley to #5 and Lee to #3.
5. yup. just roll him out there and hope he starts/keeps hitting and stays healthy.
6. I’d be fine with that.
7. perhaps. I’m not for or against it. as you said, you never know when Soriano will get hot again.

by SouthernCub on Jun 15, 2009 2:51 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

you do know

it will be against Washington or Pittsburgh, not against contenders/top 3 starters.

by seesdifferent on Jun 16, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

To me Al...

This is almost a post about Jim Hendry’s failure to build a good team. I am just looking at all the gaffs that you have listed and 1,3, and 5 are/were pretty predictable at the beginning of the season were they not? (5 is more in regard to Miltions struggles and the options that were available over him).

In regards to #2 i really think you might be on to something here, but i have struggled with this for a while, it seems that everday we have a different lineup, i dont understand why we can stick with a lineup and get people comfortable.

"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"

by HIGGY on Jun 15, 2009 2:57 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Every year Hendry dips into free agency to overpay for an outfielder

And every year that strategy has turned snake eyes. Jock Strap Jones, Alfonso Soriano, Kosuke, Miltion Bradley….

This is what happens when your farm system continues with the fundamental inability to develop viable major league positional talent.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok...

I am going to go at this lightly because the difference between us, is you have given up but i have not.

I agree with what you are saying. Hendry has built this team by overpaying for Outfielders and taking what was left when he should have gone after other players, players that many of us thought should be wearing Cubs jerseys.

I personally think it all started with Carlos Beltran. He we was must for the Cubs to sign when he became available, he offered everything the Cubs needed, but yes at a high price. Well we ended up spending a ton on Soriano so in the end it was the same, even though with the needs the team had Carlos Lee was a better signing than Soriano.

Fukudome, i didnt mind this signing, i thought it was a good one and i still do. I will determine at the end of the season if he was a bust or not. And personally, Milton didnt need to be signed if the Cubs would have stuck behind Fukudome, i think they gave up on Fukudome too early.

Milton Bradley, i think there were much better options out there, but again we went with the guy who could do a little of everything but has baggage.

I am not saying this is an awful team, i am just saying with the things that were available this past season we could have build a better team. We made moves in hopes of other moves being made, or we made moves because it seemed right. Yes, DeRo would be solid on this team no doubt, and i understand the logic behind it, but i find it difficult when people tell me that Miltion Bradley has more value on this team than DeRo did. I just dont see how.

I dont agree with your farm system though, if you would have said we dont give our farm system a chance i would have agreed, but to say the inability to develop viable major leaue postional talent isnt complete mainly because we trade all of them away.

"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"

by HIGGY on Jun 15, 2009 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't share the view that this can be a good ballclub with tweaking

I just don’t. And no, I don’t buy into the “silver bullet” solutions of 1) get Aramis Ramirez back and 2) dump Aaron Miles.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with the Beltran signing

I wanted him badly. I know he played above his head in the playoffs for Houston and got injured not long after signing with the Mets, but he had everything the Cubs needed in a center fielder. I think at the time though they were still convinced Corey Patterson could play.

Carlos Lee would look pretty good in left field and you just know he would kill the Sox and Brewers when we play them. I am stunned at Sorianos streakyness and inability to learn how to play the wall in Wrigley. He cna never be trusted to produce.

Jim Hendry has his hands full.

by Mapmaker on Jun 15, 2009 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Carlos Beltran is way better ballplayer than Alfonso Soriano...NOBODY sane would dispute that

Yet Jim Hendry went out and gave Soriano more money than what Beltran got from the Mets.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 3:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe that's because Soriano signed 2 years after Beltran?

Until last off-season, salaries and contracts went up every year. Comparing contracts from 2004 and contracts from 2006 are like comparing apples and oranges.

Both Soriano and Beltran were top free agents in their free agent classes and were compensated accordingly.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Or, Hendry just blew the curve up

With his contract to Soriano

Similar to what he did with Eyre and Howry, Milton, Dempster and arguably Ted Lilly

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jun 15, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Marquis...

"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"

by HIGGY on Jun 15, 2009 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

is going to end up out producing his contract

Shocking, but true.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wish Milton Bradley was.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 15, 2009 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Like Kevin Garnett said

Anything is Possible.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And they've all been valuable pieces to playoff teams

Or am I confused again?

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Haha...

Really? I hope you are not serious about that list of players being valueable to the Cubs during the playoffs.

"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"

by HIGGY on Jun 15, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

During?

No, because no one’s been a valuable piece DURING the playoffs.

But they all helped us GET to the playoffs.

Yay heartache!

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well played, well played...

I’m going to keep an eye on you Allie…

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Jun 15, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sure that is true...

But getting Beltran when we needed him would have changed the complexion of this team greatly. Point being is we spent money at the wrong time on the wrong people.

"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"

by HIGGY on Jun 15, 2009 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I would like to point out

that Jim Hendry spent money when the money was available to him to spend. He couldn’t sign Beltran in 2004 because Andy McPhail wouldn’t ask for the money.

After McPhail left and the Tribune Co decided they needed to put a product on the field worth watching, the money was available for Hendry to spend. You can argue if the Cubs should have signed someone other than Soriano in 2006. Context is important when looking back.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hindsight with perspective and context?

Impossible!

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

heh

Soriano was exactly the kind of player people were screaming for.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

except the people who knew him

seriously. I watched this guy play in Texas and would never have signed him for a quarter of what the Cubs gave him. I think the Cubs management decides who to sign by reading the back of baseball cards.

by seesdifferent on Jun 16, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have been down this road before...

But again, Carlos Lee was a better option than Soriano.

"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"

by HIGGY on Jun 16, 2009 7:40 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

But he wanted to play near his ranch in Texas.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 16, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He likes his siestas on his ranch.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

A smart GM cashes in his chips and rebuilds

Objective analysis says this isn’t a good ballclub. Certainly not a ballclub that is going to compete for a World Series Championship against the likes of the Yankees, Red Sox, Dodgers, Phillies. The payroll is badly bloated with bad contracts too.

Will this happen? Of course not because Jim Hendry isn’t the brightest bulb in the box and has literally his entire career riding on this ragtag collection of ill-fitting parts working out before his new boss Tom Ricketts makes a determination on his fate.

So hey, lets just go out and add a few more million of bad contracts to the books and cross our fingers. Problem is everytime Hendry spends he digs the whole a little bit deeper.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 2:58 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Rebuilds?

Sure, the Marlins rebuild.

But when you have the revenue stream the BoSox, Yanks, Cubs, Mets, etc have there should be no excuse to go into full tilt rebuild mode.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hmmm

Seems to me the Marlins “rebuilt” themselves into the 2003 World Series Champions having conducted a salary purge after being the 1997 World Series Champions.

Look, if people want to put their head in the sand over this Cub team and say we are only another Jim Hendry spending spree from greatness, then whatever. This Cub team is going nowhere as currently constructed. An objective minded organization would begin the purge.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 6:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This division

keeps the Cubs from “Blowing the whole thing up” There is no real big market team, except the Cubs. What team in this division looks like a true contender for the next 3 years? There is no L.A. or Phillies in this division and for that matter the Mets.
 Cubs need to retool, not blow up. We all know they have some bad contracts on the books, we understand that. Hendry needs to dump Miles and bite that contract, and then maybe when Ramy comes back see what trades can be made.
 No one in this division is going to run and hide, 86-88 wins will get the division.

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Jun 15, 2009 7:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wrong. Again.

They had to dump all the salary that Huizenga took on for the ‘97 season just to stay afloat financially. They by no means “re-built” themselves into a WS champion. They snuck into the playoffs in ’03 as the WC, and were lucky to get by the Giants. To portray the Marlins as an example of a team that purposely rebuilt themselves into a champion is just wrong. Furthermore, to suggest that the Cubs are going nowhere, is wrong. You don’t know that. A trade, or call-up, Ramirez coming back- could all have significant impact. So, really, in reality, an objective minded organization, (as the Cubs are) would not begin a purge in mid June, only 2.5 games back, in a division that is winnable.

That won’t matter to you though, you are always right in your own mind.

I'm a truth teller, I'm a risk taker, I'm like Johnny Cash - I walk the line...

by Jimmyeatworld on Jun 15, 2009 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree.....

that the Cubs in no way should “blow this up”.

I do think you are wrong when you look at the Marlins. They did build themselves into a WS champion. No matter what reason they dumped salary, it shows that a team can trade it’s talent/ high priced players for prospect and start over. However, many, many more teams have failed when trying to do this.

by timeforachange2009 on Jun 16, 2009 2:07 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

which means we stay where we are.

one game back in the loss column.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I consider myself.......

to be too negative when looking at this team.

You put me to shame. There are few (if any) teams that would blow this up.

IMHO, you do not understand the state of the Cubs and MLB. Even if the Cubs wanted to dump payroll and start anew they couldn’t. The contracts that Hendry agreed to over the past few off seasons are all back loaded and not team friendly. In today’s economy I doubt there will be many takers, especially the way the players you want to move are performing.

by timeforachange2009 on Jun 16, 2009 2:02 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Cubs.....

will not be in the class of the teams you mentioned until the ownership situation is resolved……..

by timeforachange2009 on Jun 16, 2009 2:08 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

objective analysis

says this team is one game back in the loss column.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

Excellent. I agree with every point.

by Papa zoo zoo on Jun 15, 2009 3:00 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Well thought out post...

I like the idea of getting back DeRO for obvious reasons! The harden trade is what gets me though…Not sure what brandon wood really will be able to contribute to the 2009 cubs. In addition, without finding a legitimate replacement for Hardens spot in the rotation will only create another hole down the road. Randy Wells has been a great addition, but I’m not confident that he will continue his brilliance. I do feel that getting this offense going is the #1 priority, so you make the deal for bats now (DeRO). However, the real reason we are slumping is our big hitters just arent hitting (Soriano, Soto, Bradley). Getting those guys on track should help more than any trade will. If the cubs are fortunate to get to the 2009 playoffs, we are going to need another top tier SP especially if we trade Harden.

by babybulls on Jun 15, 2009 3:33 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Heilman

has less value to the Indians than the sandwich pick they would receive if they kept him and he left as only a Type B free agent. Get real people.

by MickS on Jun 15, 2009 3:37 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I kind of think DeRo may be a type A free agent

with the numbers he put up last year and his number so far this year.

I would imagine if he is type A or B will impact the asking price for him.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 15, 2009 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Either way

Heilman would be an insulting offer to the Indians for De Rosa.

by MickS on Jun 15, 2009 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Home Run Heilman!!!!

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

After last night's game, the Indians might just take him...

… along with a couple prospects. The Tribe’s bullpen is horrendous.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 16, 2009 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well thought out Al

and worth the wait. What about Freel? I agree with getting DeRo back. He was the glue that covered up a lot of issues that may have made last year look more like this year (had he not been around) I would let go of Freel/trade and get Fox back on the bench. He has shown he can pinch hit, and his bat stays hot no matter what.

I still worry about our closer situation, but I like your idea.

Good Guys Wear Blue

by Cubskingdom on Jun 15, 2009 3:38 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree with everything but Dome

its a bit ridiculous to think his problems are all because he’s been moved around in the lineup.

by WanderingWanderer on Jun 15, 2009 3:42 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Not all because

But giving him the spot and just letting it ride would allow you to see what the whole problem is.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 5:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Much Better Than the 1983 Team

I think the Cubs are going to play much better baseball in the second half of the season. I don’t see a repeat of the 1983 season, when the Cubs played okay in the first half of the season and contended in a weak NL East before completely falling apart in the second half of the season and finishing fifth.

I believe the Cubs will win the division with a 91-71 record going 61-41 the rest of the way.

"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray

by memphiscub on Jun 15, 2009 4:48 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Wow, I sure hope you're right.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

wow, 91?

that may be more optimistic than me! :D

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Refresh my memory...

…What did we get in return for DeRosa?

If Hendry brought him back now for more than what we got for him, wouldn’t that make Hendry the laughing stock of the NL?

"I always tell the truth -- Even when I lie"

by calicubfan on Jun 15, 2009 4:52 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

3 minor league pitcher

Stevens: Major league ready hard thrower who profiles as a middle reliever
Archer: A-ball starter who can’t find the plate
Gaub: Hard thrower, often injured, old for his level

by MickS on Jun 15, 2009 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mark DeRosa for a middle reliever

and two clowns. yikes

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 6:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Payroll dump...

…for you know who

"I always tell the truth -- Even when I lie"

by calicubfan on Jun 15, 2009 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This guy?

The monopoly man Pictures, Images and Photos

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Al,s points

1. Miles……..agree……….dump his sorry ass. Huge mistake by hendry
2. Harden…..disagree. you need him in the rotation to have any chance. Plus, whomever would want him in a trade is’nt going to give up major league talent as it would certainly be a contender that would og after him
3. DeRosa….while we’d all like him back……it just ain’t happening………everyone just needs to get over that one
4. Fukudome……..agreed…….2 hole is worth a shot
5. Bradley…..right again……..leave him alone……keep fingers crossed
6. Guzman…….yes…….he’s our BEST reliever right now
7. Hoffpauier needs to play more……..Sori needs a break………although i do think he’ll get hot again

One more thing………….GET FREDDY SANCHEZ!

by plenz on Jun 15, 2009 5:20 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Who's makin' fun of Scottish people?

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You know, I've found that there's not much difference between

Impersonating an Irish accent and an Indian one.

I don’t know why that is.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 6:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

As an Irish-American...

I have to ask….

WHAT IN HELL!?!

If I was drinking coffee, I would’ve just spit it all over my screen…

:)

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It loses something without the audio ;-)

If you were drinking coffee, would it have been Irish coffee?

A phrase that originated at an airport, btw . . .

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

aye and begorrah is what I am saying.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Al, nice post. Thoughtful and it certainly generated discussion.

And a nice way to look at different things other than the “mail it in” stuff the MSM will write in the next few days about the Sox series (and this is coming from someone in the MSM)…

OT, are you going to hit any of the Tigers games at Comerica?

Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!

by Zeke on Jun 15, 2009 5:59 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Not this year.

I was in Detroit in 2001 — can’t make it back this year.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Al

You know how much I’d like to see DeRo come back, but it won’t happen without Lou’s blessing — and I think I’ve made myself clear that I believe that DeRo was traded at Lou’s request. Assuming that Lou does give it his blessing (or is fired, which I highly doubt), I don’t think your trade proposal would work for the following reasons:

1. The Indians have several Aaron Heilmans on their roster (Huff, Sowers, S. Lewis [DL], J. Lewis, Saarloos, etc.) They don’t need another one.
2. The Indians are at least marginally in the race and are struggling at the gate, so they can’t trade DeRo without getting what at least appears to be greater help for the current club than they are giving up.
3. They have several position players on the DL.

Having said that, DeRo is on the block for the “right” return. How could the Cubs get him?

To start with, the Cubs would have to offer Harden for DeRo straight up. The Indians would reject that because they are already over their payroll budget for the year. As good (and AL proven) as Harden is, they can’t handle the extra $1.5M.

Hendry could counter by offering Harden plus (pro-rated) $1.5M to the Indians for DeRo. The Indians would likely accept that since that would create a stir which would increase attendance, though Hendry may not have the cash to do it.

If Hendry has some extra cash, he could offer Harden plus $3M to the Indians for DeRo and one of their excellent OF prospects (LaPorta, Brantley, Weglarz). He would essentially be “buying” an extra prospect. I think Shapiro would go for that since he has serious budget issues.

Does this really help the Cubs? Both guys are FAs at the end of the season. Both guys might be Type A FAs. Would Hendry be willing to offer arb to either guy to get the draft picks? What happens if the Cubs trade Harden then suffer an injury to Z, Lilly, or Demp? Is it time to take that chance?

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Jun 15, 2009 6:00 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I believe it is time to take that chance.

Teams don’t often make deals like this. I’d like to see it.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 15, 2009 6:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

She's got good points, Al

So do those who point out that Wells isn’t proven yet.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 6:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Half a year of Rich Harden and $3 million for Mark DeRosa and Matt LaPorta.

Uh huh.

Any GM who would take half a year of a very good pitcher (when they’re not guaranteed contention, btw) for an above-average 2B and quite possibly the best ML-ready prospect in their system is a moron.

"Those are my principles, and if you don’t like them, well, I have others." - Groucho Marx

by Keith on Jun 15, 2009 6:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why in the world

would Lou have a beef with DeRosa?

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Jun 15, 2009 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Lou never forgave him for hitting into that DP in Game 3 of the 2007 NLDS

Not that I agree with Lou…I’m just saying that’s what I’ve heard.

by CaliCub on Jun 15, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

drama, much?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jun 15, 2009 11:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If there is a rift there,

I certainly hope it isn’t because of that.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wow

One AB, how about Ramirez and Soriano the last two postseasons Lou? Take a look at those wonderful numbers.

"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"

by Grockcubs on Jun 16, 2009 7:52 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mmmm...that seems a bit of a stretch.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 16, 2009 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why.....

would Cleveland give up a prospect when they are looking to the future?

I want DeRosa back too but we have to be realistic.

BTW, do you really believe Hendry has $$$$$ to give away?

by timeforachange2009 on Jun 16, 2009 1:56 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Indians have 3 "top prospect" OFs

and they have Choo in RF and Grady in CF. Even if they play LaPorta at 1B and Brantley in LF, where do they put Weglarz when he is ready?

Weglarz is more likely to be available than LaPorta and Brantley.

I’m not sure that Hendry has “money to burn”, but he could probably convince Ricketts that spending $3M extra to get Weglarz would be good for the organization’s future since they don’t have many position player prospects right now.

"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007

by DeRoMyHero on Jun 16, 2009 5:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll buy the Harden scenario but

no way the Indians part with their minor league crown jewels. Cheap, young, controlled players are the lifeblood of small market teams in depressed rust belt cities like Cleveland. La Porta, Brantley or Weglarz are going nowhere.

by MickS on Jun 15, 2009 6:16 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Maybe deal Harden and Kosuke to

New York. They’ll have a surplus of bats when Nady returns.

SORIANO! YESSSSSSSS! JIMBO!!!

by CubFaninCA on Jun 15, 2009 6:27 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Yankees won't do that

Not with a rotation that includes Sabathia, Burnett, Chamberlain, Hughes and Pettitte, with Wang trying to figure things out and Kennedy soon to be ready. And not with a loaded outfield situation that also includes hotshot prospect Austin Jackson waiting in the wings.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let's see

They have Damon, Melky, Gardner, Swisher, Nady, and Mastui, along with Jackson in the minors. Next year it should be Damon at DH with AJax in LF, Gardner and Melky in CF and Swish in RF. Kouske still has no spot there.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sori to 2B with Hoff in the outfield is a no brainer.

I can’t believe it hasn’t been tried yet. I can’t believe i didn’t think of it.

"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"

by AndrewJStone on Jun 15, 2009 6:32 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Cubs don't play in a softball beer league

Alfonso Soriano at 2nd base? Hell, why not cut to the chase and put Jake Fox at shortstop.

You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?

by BLou on Jun 15, 2009 6:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Though...

I wouldn’t mind if they started keeping a keg at second base.

(Btw, your post actually made me laugh out loud.).

by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 15, 2009 9:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think that seriously underestimates Soriano’s lack of infield ability.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Career: -10.2 UZR/150 @ 2B

Career: 8.4 UZR/150 @ OF

He’s a LOT better in the outfield. A lot. Like, 18.6 runs better. And he’s played 300 more games at second than in the outfield.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 15, 2009 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If it gets Miles off the field, i'm open to it.

There is no silver bullet, and i’m not a stats geek so i’m sure there are twenty numbers to prove why this is bad idea… but what is the downside, the team loses some games due to poor defense instead of lack of offense? The fact is, with the solid starting pitching we’ve had keeping opposing runs down, and with the lack of offensive power we’ve exhibited in order to squander those opportunities, its one semi-feasible solution. It gets power in the lineup, trades a crappy fielder in Miles for an only slightly crappier one in Sori, and could possibly be a decent enough band aid till either Rami comes back or the bats pick up and we don’t have to care if the team has got Miles looking a fool at the plate four times a game.

As Al said above:

Or try Soriano at 2B for a game or two; the defense can’t be worse than what Miles has done, and if he starts hitting, that improves the offense.

Take a chance, give it a try. Its not like it can get any worse. I’d like to lose because the team tried new things and they didn’t work out rather than because the team sat pat knowing full well it wasn’t working.

"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"

by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Soriano wouldn't be "slightly crappier" than Miles - he's be "much crappier."

Yeah, he’s that bad. And it’s important to remember that part of what makes starting pitchers successful – beyond their pitching – is good defense. You can pretty much forget about double plays with Soriano at 2B, and you can expect to see a multitude of balls booted or allowed to dribble into right field for hits.

I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.

by dat cubfan daver on Jun 16, 2009 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Its not like it can get any worse.

I don’t think I believe that.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

if the cubs can make some moves

I wouldn’t just consider this year. I know the angels can’t find a place for Brandon Wood, but they need pitching, which is something that we have alot of. This will allow Theriot to go to second where he belongs, and Wood’s numbers shouldn’t be worse than the numbers that we have been getting from 2nd base. Not to mention he can play 3rd until Aram gets back. This guy has alot of potential.

Also, since Andy McPail and Hendry deal often anyway, I would see what it would take to get George Sherril from the O’s. This would really help to solidify the bullpen, and he is a lefty with closer experience.

by wfree0104 on Jun 15, 2009 8:08 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Soriano Harden and DeRosa

Soriano should be rested more and, depending on his leg, maybe stay out for a while. I would play Johnson in left before Hoff. Soriano isn’t getting on base enough. This, given some signs of Lee and Bradley’s bats coming around. So, I would drop Soriano in the lineup to somewhere below 5th.

If there isn’t intent to sign Harden for next season, then it is a good idea to trade him. What the Cubs can get for him isn’t a question though because Harden would be headed for FA. In particular I’m not sure the Cubs could pickup a player who can make a difference this season. If the Angels would hand over Wood in exchange, I’d say thank you very much.

For DeRosa, we might not have to give prospects and Heilman. Less might do.

This team is hanging around because of the starting pitching and we have to hope the lineup just comes around and prime pitching performances continue.

by AboutTheCubs on Jun 15, 2009 8:25 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

For DeRosa, we might not have to give prospects and Heilman. Less might do.

Less? Isn’t DeRosa basically their best hitter?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If they want DeRosa

If Cleveland wants DeRosa, they won’t trade him. If they don’t, then DeRosa is a rental for the team that gets him. Cleveland probably would want a pitcher with potential and a low salary.

by AboutTheCubs on Jun 16, 2009 12:47 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dero goes yard again

bring him back now lol

by LT on Jun 15, 2009 8:26 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

with the exception of one or two people

I think we all agree that trading DeRosa was the biggest mistake of the offseason. He is going to put up better numbers this season than he did last year.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The only thing keeping the Cubs

from a World Series, no doubt. How did the Cubs end up last year when they had him?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 9:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Whats wrong with having a nice piece to the puzzle?

A piece that happened to save our ass last year when Soriano got hurt. A piece that would have helped lower the hurt from Aramis being out. A piece that would have saved us all from watching the piece of crap known as Aaron Miles every night.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I can feel the tears hitting the computer screen

with each sentence you type.

Recapturing the magic is a futile endeavor.

He isn’t coming back. Get over it.

Although if he did come back, I guess it would save me from having to read the piece-of-crap testimonials devoted to him every night.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This post is inappropriate

I think everyone knows how you feel about bringing back Dero. It’s not your place to respond to every post in favor of Dero being here/coming back. Especially calling other peoples posts P.O.C’s and making fun of the post.

by LT on Jun 15, 2009 9:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not worried about it

I’m 99% sure its Jim Hendry here to defend what has so far amounted to one hell of an offseason disaster.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 9:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

DeRosa

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Whoops. Meant to reply to NBF

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 11:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Profligate!

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have had enough of this crap now. Your tirades are getting old now

We all know your position on bringing DeRo back and others seem to have a different opinion. Is that really hard for you to understand? Your ego must be really hard for you to carry around and so you choose to dump it over here. I don’t understand why you constantly demean posters who have differ with you.

Let it Go!

by cubsnlinux on Jun 15, 2009 9:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

DeRosa

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 11:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Side note:

Alvarez is trying to get Notre Dame on the schedule in the upcoming years. He used to work under Holtz, ya know, and really wants to start a pairing up with them.

Just somethin’ I read in the UW paper recently.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 15, 2009 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wish they would do it

Not a big ND fan (sorry, Domers) and would love to see Bucky pound ’em.

Plus, it would quiet some of that non-conference schedule whining

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

dood

all anyone is saying is that DeRosa is playing well, and his versatility would have been nice to have when Rami took a header and hit the DL for two months.

I never thought it was a great idea to trade him, and I never thought we needed Peavy. I also think it’s unlikely that DeRosa comes back to the Cubs.

But that doesn’t make him a bad fit. It just means it’s economically unlikely.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 15, 2009 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I didn't hate the trade then

I wish we’d gotten MORE for him, but I don’t regret the trade.

Now, would he be a nice piece at the moment? Sure.

But so would a healthy Rami and hitting Soriano & Bradley.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly

and those are more realistic options.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 16, 2009 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

We all miss DeRosa. I’ve used the “dumping a hot girl” analogy more than once here. But she’s gone and we’ve gotta get over her and make do with what we’ve got now.

Until there is a substantiated rumor that DeRo has any remote possibility in suiting up in Cubbie Blue again, it’s much more productive to ponder the options that are… you know… actually available and feasible.

"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"

by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 12:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And the Brewers just won 14-12.

Grand Salami for the big man.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 15, 2009 10:13 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Reed Johnson wasn't there to steal it away? Damn.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.

by SackMan on Jun 15, 2009 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Man the Indians bullpen sucked today

Hopefully they can be that bad when we see them.

"I daydream just like everybody else, I just do it with my body facing the field, so everybody thinks I'm paying attention."- Greg Maddux

by Doggie Stalker on Jun 15, 2009 10:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think the Indians bullpen

sucks every day. Just today more than it does on some other days.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's an accurate statement.

Tom Hamilton has been beside himself this year with his calls of the bullpen meltdowns.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 16, 2009 12:51 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Tom Hamilton

is beside himself on almost every call, but your point is well-taken. :)

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 16, 2009 1:06 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Seems like it

I listened to the 9th inning and after a leadoff single, he made a swing and a miss, foul ball and fly to right all sound like game-tying homeruns.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 16, 2009 5:29 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't forget about Prince Fielder

He’s another one who’s beside himself on every play… and when he’s on the bench, too. ;-)

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jun 16, 2009 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Did anyone see the box score? Fielder and Braun had 2 HR, 11 RBI and 14 total bases between them. That's

a week’s production for the entire Cub team.

"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris

by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jun 15, 2009 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

a week?

2 HR might be a whole month, and 11 RBI, that might be even more time.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

11 runs

7 days.

Sounds about par for the course.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 10:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What if the 6 run game against a 5 starter is taken out of the equation?

Because our offense only tends to show up when Brian Moehler is the other pitcher.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 10:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You'll usually run into a 5 starter

in a 7 week span.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 10:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Since Lou wants us to look at the positives

Its been a while since we’ve thrown a fifth starter, I don’t think we’ve done it all season.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Jun 15, 2009 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wells is our 5, right?

And his worst start of the year… he gave up, what 4 runs? God. AWFUL!

LOL.

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

not true

Marshall and Wells have both pitched from the 5 spot.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you want to manipulate everything

to cast it in its worst possible light, go ahead.

BTW, Moehler actually pitched pretty well at Wrigley last month.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 15, 2009 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Some times I wonder, "What the hell did I DO when baseball's not in season?"

Because these off days and night-day lapses seem like a looooong time.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 15, 2009 11:20 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Get up and go to work?

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 15, 2009 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LMAO

There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons

by Allie on Jun 15, 2009 11:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, but then what'd you do once you got there?

"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"

by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Read BCB?

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Jun 16, 2009 12:52 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Late-night brainteaser time...

DeRo, Woo-Woo, and Maddux walk into a bar and in unison, they all shout “White Sux”.

For 5000 BCB points, who is the first BCBer to respond?
a) NBF
b) AL
c) Doggie
d) Crawdad

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jun 15, 2009 11:38 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I choose E

Me

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 16, 2009 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

but but but... I don't know what your button to push is, dan

Maybe if WooWoo was wearing a KU jersey???

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jun 16, 2009 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Woo-Woo and KU

A perfectly awful combination.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 16, 2009 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I canoot envision a scenario where KU is not pre-season #1.

Us and Michigan State have, far and away, the best two teams in the country. It’s not even close.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 16, 2009 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh, that's all fine,

but from a Mizzou standpoint, which is mine, I stand by my original statement. :)

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 16, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Uhhh!!

DUKE! Even without Henderson, we’re number 2. Williams has shown that he can be exactly what Henderson is. We also will have the Plumlee brothers down low providing size and scoring presence. Singler and Scheyer are potential All-Americans. Even Nolan Smith coming off the bench has the potential to make a huge impact.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Duke won't even be top 3, maybe not top 5.

KU
MSU
Cuse
UNC
??
Duke

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 16, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

What are you smoking?

UNC should be around 7. Cuse around 5. MSU at 3.

Henderson’s loss actually helps us because Williams is a better sparkplug. Duke is the legit #2.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Okaaaaaaay...

I’m well versed in everything Duke, I was @ Cameron last year for the 40+ point blowout of Maryland. I don’t give a crap who’s 2-25, KU is the best team in the nation by a long margin. And that was before we stole the Henry brothers away from that slimeball Calipari.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 16, 2009 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with you.

KU is the #1 team. I’m not a fan of Bill Self, but you have the talent. I wouldn’t be suprised if Duke and KU met in the National Championship since now we finally have some inside presence.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

My old roommate is a PhD in biomedical engineering @ Duke, and we talk college ball shop frequently. I flew out there for the Maryland game at Cameron, and he came to Allen for the Tennessee game. I don’t know if you can find two more magical college basketball places than those two.

How can you not like Self? Everything he’s touched has turned to gold. Oral Roberts he turned around, Tulsa he dominated with, the Illini team that lost to Fatty-Mc-Fat Sean May and UNC, and the national championship with KU. That’s 3 different Elite Eight schools and a national championship.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 16, 2009 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well before the Championship year I just never thought he could do it.

I thought he wasn’t really a tournament coach. I mean he’s shown me more now, but now his team is just stacked so if he doesn’t at least get the runner up he’s doing something wrong.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's kinda a short-sighted assessment.

Getting the players that stack the cards are apart of the game. That’s half the battle. How bout last year? We let SIX PLAYERS get drafted, tied for the most ever in NBA Draft history, and yet we still won the Big 12 and made it far in the tournament. That’s coaching.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 16, 2009 10:53 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Zing! Katz’s rankings today.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Jun 16, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you want to back this up with Andy Katz...

I should throw in Dick Vitale.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If I am Jim Hendry................

I need to see more of Wells before I even consider trading Harden. Al, I bet you have seen a ton of pitchers start off hot and fizzle quick. Slow down.

As for your proposed deal with DeRosa, Cleveland would laugh at that. They are in last place. They have no need for Heilman. They will want prospects (and good ones too). Someone will overpay for DeRosa because of his versatility.

As for the rest of your “suggestions” I tend to agree.

Unfortunately (IMHO) the team will not make a big move. Help will have to come from within.

by timeforachange2009 on Jun 16, 2009 1:53 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Trade Sean Marshall for a bat....

With the emergence of Randy Wells, Sean Marshall is only useful in the Pen and frankly if we dont score more runs and Marmol doesnt stop walking/hitting batters, the rest of the Pen is not that impt. We need someone to do what Milton “counting to three is hard” Bradley has been unable to do. The bottom line is this team is not a playoff team right now. Hendry must do something prior to the All Star break.

by TRock on Jun 16, 2009 7:39 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

And who pitches from the fourth to the seventh when Harden goes down, or Dempster has no control?

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That would be

Waddell, AFAIK. Marshall isn’t a LOOGY.

I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.

by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Please refrain from using acronyms.

I’m already out of it as it is lol

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You mean PRFUA

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 16, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

IAOOIAIIL

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Randy Wells

Before we trade Harden because of this kid, I’d like to see more than 6 good starts, and did you see his last one? His current homer rate, 2 in 42 innings, is unsustainable and a third of what it was in the minors last year. As a 25 year old in his 2nd year at AAA he put up a 4.02 ERA. I doubt his true ability is better than a 4.50 ERA over a full big league season. Obviously this isn’t bad, and he is a solid pitcher, but we take a hit with him in place of Harden in the long term. Furthermore, he’s never pitched more than 120 innings in a pro season, so he’ll face the same late season fatigue Sean Marshall has experienced. It’s not all roses.

by alwaysacub on Jun 16, 2009 8:37 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Not Happening

Rich Harden is going nowhere…unless this team is out of contention. Every team knows his fragility, just the same as every team knows how effective he is when healthy. His own health risk minimizes his value as a trade commodity for the Cubs but his effectiveness increases their chances of winning the division. All told, those add up to him staying for the duration of 2009….unless the club is out of it.

While Hendry has proven capable of turning perceived prospects into legitimate players, I’m not certain he’s got the ammunition to do that again this year. Unless you’re going to move Vitters for a proven run producer, something I want them to do but others believe that somehow this kis is Joe Dimaggio reincarnate, you’re not going to get a solid run producer with the inventory of spare parts. In fact, without moving Vitters you may as well sit tight and sink or swim with the guys they have because doing otherwise just continues the cycle of trading in disappointments for other peoples’ disappointments.

Marshall is a decent trade option and perhaps he could garner an Aubrey Huff…someone that is available right now. The rest of the lot is all in the eye of the beholder…and for this beholder, the talent isn’t very good.

Aaron Heilman has zero value. He’s a mopup bullpen guy that makes noise about starting. He’s no more a SP than he is a bullpen stalwart. He’s back-of-the-bullpen roster fodder, with zero trade value…nothing more.

You see why Brian Roberts dominated the discussion for the better part of a season and a half. He’s exactly what they needed…a legitimate leadoff hitter, a 2B, someone that can run and someone that you can rely on. Those guys aren’t a dime a dozen. Guys like Miles are but guys like Roberts aren’t.

I want Hendry to grab another hitter but quite frankly, I think he’s trying to push water uphill on that end. It’s going to be extremely difficult to land someone of difference-making ability with the player inventory the organization currently has…provided of course that the golden boy Vitters isn’t dealt.

Who needs a stinkin' tag line? What are they for anyway?

by krummy12 on Jun 16, 2009 8:39 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Jake Peavy!!

Oh…wait…nevermind…

Al – it would be great to get Crane Kenny once more to allay our concerns about the Cubs going after ANYONE. Sam Zell could give a crap about the fans, the custodial responsibility of his owning the franchise, the Cubs winning for that matter.

You and I and many others come up with serious coin every year, good or bad, and deserve to be heard.

by The E-Man on Jun 16, 2009 8:48 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Kenney was on WGN last night

And commented that taking on salary the likes of DeRosa’s wouldn’t be out of the question.

FWIW. He was asked the question and answered it. NBF will now go beserk . . . .

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 16, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nope

If they’re willing to take on salary, I think that’s very promising.

And it would be even better to take it on for a younger, decent bat.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 16, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That plays shortstop

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 16, 2009 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

But who would that be?

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al on Jun 16, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know who it isn't.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 16, 2009 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I kinda like my Reyes idea

Even though it ain’t happening

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Jun 16, 2009 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Teix-A-Rod effect on Milton?

Say we hit Milton 3rd and have DLee at 4 and ARam at 5, by the way we’d need a lefty at 6. That would give Milton some good pitches to hit and let him get some better swings in.

Get Peavy already! I want my #44 jersey!

by Cub Style on Jun 16, 2009 1:12 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

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