How The Cardinals Could Lose (And The Cubs Gain) Albert Pujols
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 1:10 PM CDT
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PrintI normally don't get too deep in to this stuff unless it is imminent and feasible, but these long off periods make me stir crazy at work and this one is just interesting enough to be worth a read. Check this article from Deadspin, which is actually a fairly well written and thought out article by Will Leitch (based on this article from Bernie Miklasz of the StL Post-Dispatch) on how the Cards are likely to lose LaRussa if the they don't turn it around this season, and that Pujols would follow at the end of his contract in 2011.
So if La Russa decides these new front office folks don't have The Right Stuff, that they're not as brutally committed to winning as he is, he will leave. (Until this contract, he always worked under a one-year deal, the Don Draper of managers.) I'm not sure where he'd go next — maybe he'd just co-manage the Tigers with Jim Leyland; awesome idea for a bromantic comedy! — but he would, without question, leave. Every game the Cardinals lose 3-0, every solo homer Pujols hits, every heralded Cardinals prospect that disappoints (the "Faberge Eggs," they're called), brings him a little closer.
And then...
And have no doubt: If La Russa leaves, Pujols probably isn't far behind, because the only reason La Russa would leave is the same reason Pujols would leave: This Franchise Does Not Have What It Takes To Win. The Cardinals simply cannot afford to pay what Pujols is worth on the open market, something Pujols is aware of; he's always said as long as the Cardinals remain "committed to winning," he'll stay.
And later...
If you want Albert Pujols to be your first baseman — and, of course, you are a fan of the Red Sox, Mets, Cubs (gasp!) or, if Mark Teixeira dies, the Yankees — you need to start rooting against the Cardinals, right now, this second. We'll know very soon.
As if we needed any more reason to root against them this season, with the division so tight.
Honestly, Hendry has shown a history of bringing ex Cards to the team, and some have done well (Edmonds) and others haven't (you know). I think Pujols is pretty much guaranteed to perform no matter where he is, and while i don't envision the Cards going truly small market on us, if there was one Cardinal i'd love to see here, it'd be a professional both on and off the field like him. The timing would line up right, as even with D Lee's resurgence of late (and yes, i was one of the few hating on the idea of benching / DFA'ing / sending him to AAA during his early season struggles, and i have the utmost respect for the man) you can't deny he is getting a bit long in the tooth.
I realize this is all very abstract 'pie in the sky' stuff, but hey... we don't have baseball for another 6 hours!
Have a great afternoon everyone.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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All this is based on the presumption that Zell will have sold the Cubs by then, so I doubt it could ever happen.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 16, 2009 1:14 PM CDT reply actions
Haha
Actually that’s really sad that it’s entirely plausible that he won’t have sold them by then…
"If I were playing third base and my mother were rounding third with the run that was going to beat us, I'd trip her. Oh, I'd pick her up and brush her off and say, 'Sorry, Mom,' but nobody beats me." ~ Leo Durocher
One of my buddies... a Cards fan
Has been under the belief for past 6 months or so, that there’s no way the Cards will be able to re-sign him. They simply can’t offer the contract that Boston, New York, or LA can.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
One of the best hitters of all time on the Cubs?
Man that would be a dream come true.
But a couple of things
1. Pujols has a full life set up in St. Louis, I think it would take a lot of bad losing from the Cards for him to want to change.
2. There would be a revolt like no other from Cardinal fans. I kinda wanna put this “dream” past my roomate and see how he would feel as a Cards fan without Pujols.
3. SWL said it, this sale would need to go through before we have any money.
4. Lastly Pujols is gonna take a serious hometown discount for the Cards.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
All true, but...
… $25 mil a year makes it pretty easy to “set up life” elsewhere, and the article seems to imply a lot of that bad losing may be coming.
And as drawn out as this Cubs sale is, it’s gotta be done by 2011, right?
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions
We can only dream it right now.
it’s gotta be done by 2011, right?
With the Cards and La Russa you never really know when or if that losing will happen though.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
God, if we are still talking about this in 2011...
… at some point, you’d have to believe bankruptcy court would intervene. I know it wasn’t part of the filing, but that was based on the fact that it could be done independently. At some point if Zell’s crazy financing demands are keeping the credit holders from collecting, they will intervene, right?
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, the creditors aren't going to wait too much longer
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 16, 2009 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions
The Cardinals have been more budget conscious with their payroll than we have over recent years.
If they were to sign Pujols for let’s say, $25 mil/year… he could be taking up more than 30% of their annual payroll. They’d sell tickets to see Pujols… but, they’d likely fall out of contention, since they wouldn’t have the resources to build around him.
Their best bet might be to deal him at the deadline in 2011, and load up on prospects.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Regarding #4...
When has Albert given any indication whatsoever that he’s going to give a hometown discount?
Pujols signed his deal
After three years in which he finished 4th, 2nd, and 2nd in MVP voting and he was only 21-23 years old.
He signed through 2011 and is only making $14 million a year.
But thats just my speculation. There is no spoken indication of it.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
With the kind of contract Albert would command...
….and the fact that he’ll be going on 32 (if you believe he’s actually 29 right now) I’m not so sure I’d want him. He has to break down eventually…right?
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
Manny got 2 years for $45 mil from the Dodgers.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
on Fertility Drugs, er, Steroids...
… Let’s just call that a “wind aided” contract.
Proud recipient of a hot dog shot from the Iowa Cubs hot dog gun.
Sheesh.
I’m still worried about 2009. I’ll worry about 2011 or 2012 when we get there.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Fair enough...
… just thought it’d be interesting for discussion. I’m tired of talking about how Miles sucks, personally. A little ray of sunshine to think about, however far in the future and unrealistic it is.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed
But you gotta admit, the idea of this is pretty tantalizing.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 16, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure it is.
But who knows where MLB will be in 2011, and how much it will take to sign such a player then?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
True...
the Government might have to bail out MLB by then and give 20% ownership of the League to the MLBPA. That could affect the average price of a contract.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 16, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Are you saying I will own my own piece of MLB?!
I choose Ryan Braun! I will bench him every game and only use him to pinch run and bunt.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
and stare
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 16, 2009 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Assuming we had both DLee and Pujols
Could either one play a position other than 1B or 3B, so we could get both of their (and Rami’s) bats in the lineup at the same time? Or would Lee have to go?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Assuming we had both DLee and Pujols
Am I on drugs?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
No...
Soriano LF
Fukudome CF
Pujols 3B
Ramirez 1B
Lee RF
Fontenot 2B
Soto C
Theriot SS
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 16, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions
seriously?
can Lee play right?
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Dude, if Hoffpauir gets to try...why the hell not?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 16, 2009 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
If we have all three on our team
I’d have Lee play catcher. The bats would make up for any amount of errors/passed balls/whatever could happen
"If I were playing third base and my mother were rounding third with the run that was going to beat us, I'd trip her. Oh, I'd pick her up and brush her off and say, 'Sorry, Mom,' but nobody beats me." ~ Leo Durocher
Please confirm sarcasm.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
I didn't LOL until I saw that you kept Riot @ short.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
We wouldn't have both Lee and Pujols..
I’ll be surprised if Lee is re-signed after next year. And on the off-chance he is resigned, the team wouldn’t go get Pujols.
The only way I think Pujols leaves is if St Louis makes it clear that they can’t afford to pay him for his next contract.
Also, my feeling is...
… that after Lee’s contract is up, Aramis Ramirez moves to 1B and Josh Vitters takes over at 3B.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Maybe not immediately, but within a year of that...
I’ll be surprised if Vitters is called up in 2011. He’s only in low-A ball right now. I can’t see the team pushing him three levels in 1.5 years.
Maybe they go with a stopgap for a year and call up Vitters in 2012 though.
I'll be very interested to see....
… where Vitters goes when he’s promoted. He’s done well enough at Peoria that a promotion to Double-A (instead of Daytona) could be justified.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
+1
Not sure how he’s doing defensively but offensively he’s earned the right to a call up
"If I were playing third base and my mother were rounding third with the run that was going to beat us, I'd trip her. Oh, I'd pick her up and brush her off and say, 'Sorry, Mom,' but nobody beats me." ~ Leo Durocher
stop gap will be at 1B
see Hoffpauir, Micah or Fox, Jake
Aramis will stay at 3rd, then when Vitters is ready depending on who is better defensively that player will play 3rd
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jun 16, 2009 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Right - that's what I was saying
Lee leaves, stopgap at 1B for a year, then Vitters comes up and they move Ramirez to 1B. Sorry if I wasn’t clear.
It may or may not be Hoffpauir or Fox, depending upon whether either is still a major factor with the team in 2011. But that’s the type of player it would be.
I doubt Fox will be with us then
I see us moving him to the AL
"If I were playing third base and my mother were rounding third with the run that was going to beat us, I'd trip her. Oh, I'd pick her up and brush her off and say, 'Sorry, Mom,' but nobody beats me." ~ Leo Durocher
I'm ok with that, too
My assumption from the main article was that Pujols may be available as early as this off-season.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
I read it as he'll be available when his contract expires...
which is after 2011 – MAYBE after 2010, if the club for some reason declined their team option on him).
I get the impression there is no way in hell they DON'T pick up the option.
So he’d likely be available after 2011, unless they were attempting to dump him before the deadline of that season for prospects.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree...
November 2011 is the most likely point at which he becomes available.
Pujols came up as a 3B
But Scott Rolen was entrenched at third so Pujols moved to first.
Go State!
And has since had elbow problems...
He is pretty much resigned to 1B from here on out.
Worrying about where to play Lee
if we got one of the top 5 offensive players of all time (in 2011) might be the most ridiculous display of hand-wringing I’ve ever seen on a blog.
DEJESUS!!!
by tomas21 on Jun 16, 2009 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
If we do sign Pujols in 2011
Consider the war between Cards/Cubs won by Cubs permantly.
We could lose every series against them but getting their icon…well that says it all.
Pujols
has Red Sox’s all over him, Yuk moves to third and Albert to 1st.
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
Very true, and far more likely.
Well played, sir.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, I must admit, that does have a ring of truth to it.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
This is probably the most likely outcome
Especially since Yuk can play third.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
Pujols to the Cubs
is about as likely as Ozzie taking over for Lou. If we were The Cubs, but weren’t named The Cubs, we’d have a much better shot.
Join the BCB Flickr Group: http://flickr.com/groups/bleedcubbieblue
I thought about him too
but he didn’t come up w/the RedSox, was instead his 3rd team. He did have 4 good years w/them but Pujols was drafted by the Cards and now has more time w/them than Damon w/the Red Sox and Yankees combined. Money does often do a lot of the talking though. But first, we have to believe this club isn’t as cash strapped as some people think the Cubs are.
Join the BCB Flickr Group: http://flickr.com/groups/bleedcubbieblue
+1
And +Asshole
"If I were playing third base and my mother were rounding third with the run that was going to beat us, I'd trip her. Oh, I'd pick her up and brush her off and say, 'Sorry, Mom,' but nobody beats me." ~ Leo Durocher
But... but...
Aaron Miles signed with us!
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Okay I'm buying a lottery tocket too.
I can’t see any way Pujols landing on the Cubs lap. But I’m with you, its nice to dream.
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
Good plan...
… win the lottery (three or five times), intervene in this mess of a sale, buy the team, and land Pujols.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Only if we can keep
most of our other problems so we can continue to obsess about things that Hendry and Lou drive us nuts over and make us want to blog about.
Join the BCB Flickr Group: http://flickr.com/groups/bleedcubbieblue
Not so far out that it can't be considered
AP has made it known that he will leave if he feels the Cards are not committed to winning- he has also said that Chicago is one of his favorite places to play, so it would not be imposible, if the Cubs pony up the money. I doubt BLou would even have a problem with that signing.
My brother the Cardinal fan has lived in fear ever since hearing that statement.
"I still don't know what happened"- Fergie Jenkins on '69
i've always
personally had a problem with other fan-bases pining for players this far away from FA. I don’t know… it feels kind of creepy to me… like a “wait till she gets to 18” kind of feeling
i don’t know maybe its my “small-market mind” that doesn’t like it, but whatever it is….
i think we can safely delay this discussion till 2010 at the earliest
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jun 16, 2009 2:38 PM CDT reply actions
Boy, I'd love to violate that contract.
lol
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
That would just about be the most awesome thing ever
But you cant compare him to the signings of over the hill Cards like Edmonds (though he was very good for us) and Miles, which never should have happened
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Wasn't comparing, per se...
… just establishing Hendry’s history of signing ex cards players.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Gotcha
though I find it hard to believe theyd let him go, there was just a post yesterday on mlbtr asking whether they should extend him now or wait….its going to be an interesting situation to monitor, Im not sure how old he’ll be when that deal is up, but Im sure it’ll be another 9 figure deal
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
With Lee's contract already expired
and Rami’s with a year left (no options exercised) IIRC, then all they have to do is get rid of that albatross of a contract given to the LF’er and they’ll be able to afford an A-Rod like deal.
Sweet Lou for Mayor in '11.
At their current payroll, they'd be able to afford it WITH Soriano...
Lilly, Fukudome, Bradley, Miles and Lee would be off the books. That’s over $45 million in cut costs, which would be more than enough to pay Pujols and pick up another few players.
The key would be whether the team keeps the payroll as is, how well our farm produces guys, whether Hendry (or possibly another GM) avoids overpaying wildly for mid-level talent, and of course whether Pujols would be interested.
But it certainly seems financially feasible even without shedding Soriano’s contract.
maybe our plan all along has been NBA style
for the Year of Pujols
hand out as many huge contracts as you can for years to come that all expire just prior to Pujols FA, thus allowing you to have the most money to go after Pujols….
its brilliant! until Pujols isn’t available…
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jun 16, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions
I refuse to belive Hendry is capable of that sort of advance planning.
He couldn’t even make it through last off season with a well executed plan.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm sorry...
I like Hendry… even after this mess of a year of signings…
but he’s just not that sneaky or brilliant…
Maybe this guy but not Hendry…
- Over? Did you say "over"? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!
- Germans?
- Forget it, he's rolling.
While we're at it, let's go after Sizemore, Lincecum, Zobrist, Wright and Papelbon...
We’ll have a unicorn play second base.
Proud recipient of a hot dog shot from the Iowa Cubs hot dog gun.
I'm going to need to see an advanced statistical breakdown of said Unicorn before i'll comment.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 16, 2009 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions
That's two unicorns.
I guess we signed one to play right field, too.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
unicorn
luuuuuuuuve.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 16, 2009 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I will name him...Matt!
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Zobrist
in that category is fascinating to me
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jun 16, 2009 4:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Your sarcasm is off base
If we’re talking about Albert Pujols as a free agent, why wouldnt the Cubs have a chance? They have more money than the Cards, an easier park for him to hit homers, more national exposure etc etc. Id say theyre a strong player if he ever hits the market, the only thing holding him back would be if he has a strong attachment to the Cards and therefore wouldnt go to their biggest rival, but his aint Jackie Robinson being traded to the Giants we’re talking about here
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
I don't see even the Cubs being able to afford him...
To me, only the Red Sox or a New York team could pay Pujols what he’d command on the open market, which I would guess today would be $30 million x 10 yrs. If he ever leaves StL, he’ll end up nowhere but those places IMO. Would be nice though…
The Cubs would be able to afford him...
They’ll have $40-45 million in salary freed up by 2011 with a number of key players coming off the books, assuming Hendry doesn’t go and blow that money early. That would leave $10-15 million to spare. The problem isn’t going to be the money.
You're forgetting one thing
A lot of our regulars would be free agents that year and I’m sure Cubs want to obtain some them. Guys such as:
-Theriot
-Soto
-Marmol
-Hoff (maybe 2012 actually)
While none of those guys will take a gigantic contract, I’m sure they will combined each a chunk of freed up salary.
Actually, none of those guys will be free agents that year...
They’ll each be arbitration eligible (at various stages). That may only be a technical distinction from what you meant. But yes – I was simplifying the analysis, assuming no payroll increases in the next three years and the increases in salary for Zambrano and Soriano
There will be a lot of financial changes, but I think if the Cubs want to do it they’ll easily be able to afford Pujols given the number of contracts coming off the books. They just wouldn’t be able to pay a bunch of guys in the $10-13 million range like they are doing now.
Except...
one of those 4 is about as likely to get a FA pickup and big
contract as I am of playing in the NBA…
and I don’t mean Theriot, Soto or Marmol…
- Over? Did you say "over"? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!
- Germans?
- Forget it, he's rolling.
True but you never know
Anyone can make the most of injuries and have a dominating year. He just hasn’t had that prime opportunity yet.
Well, then it's not really an *open* market, is it?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Albert Pujols IS the St. Louis Cardinals
One of the proudest and most successful franchises in American baseball is not about to let Pujols wear another uniform at any point in his career. I’ve spent a lot of time in St. Louis on business the past five years and Pujols deeply respects Cardinal fans and the people of St. Louis.
He ain’t going anywhere.
You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?
agreed. they'll be trotting him out there when he's 80 years old
in some gaudy, fireenginered blazer. what i like about this situation is that it’s kind of a lose, lose situation for the cardinals—well, maybe not that bad. however, in order to sign pujols, they are going to have to pay the man; he’ll give them a huge discount, but i still expect the contract to be in the order of 22-25 million per year. even if pujols continues his amazing play through the length of his contract, it will be difficult for the cardinals to field a team much better than their current one, and i like that. basically, they’d be paying the man in order to come watch his sort of sideshow and lock up his hof/retirement/ride the beer car status, which if that’s what they really want, it’s cool with me. la russa isn’t going to manage forever, and i think that once he’s gone it will be much more difficult for the cardinals to be competitive with a team of pujols and a bunch of other guys. basically, this will be a good contract for the cubs, unless the cards trade him and end up with handful of future hall of famers or something. make em pay.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 16, 2009 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Did you even read the article?
You are arguing basically the opposite of the writer. Now, maybe you are right, but to be fair you have far less solid reasoning than what i’d posted a link to.
Pujols is fiercely competitive. It seems fair to reason that if his contract handcuffs a team to the point that they can’t compete, he won’t want to be there. If LaRussa is gone, all the easier to leave.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 17, 2009 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions
i hope he is so fiercely competitive.
and i hope the cards muck it up and allow him to enter free agency. however, i think’s it more likely that his loyalty to st. louis and to the cardinals will win out. their entire show is trotting out hall of famers; i don’t see how they can let pujols get away.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 17, 2009 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep
Albert Pujols isn’t going anywhere.
You mean, let me understand this cause, ya know maybe it's me, I'm a little messed up maybe, but I'm funny how, I mean funny like I'm a clown, I amuse you? I make you laugh, I'm here to amuse you? What do you mean funny, funny how? How am I funny?
Did your business
involve talking to Albert Pujols about how he feels deep down about St Louis and their fans? If not, I don’t think you have the first clue what Pujol’s intentions are.
DEJESUS!!!
Of couse, all of this talk is premature, however..........
……….current ownership has shown a penchant to be cheap, and the initial author of this stuff, writer Bernie Miklasz, has been watching all of this go down for the past few years as he’s toiled for the Post-Dispatch in St. Loser.
Some facts………..ownership got a $45 million loan from StLu County to back the building of the new stadium; they appeared in the post-season 6 times in the last 10 years, including two World Series, winning one; they have the All Star game coming to town this year, an absolute cash cow event. In addition, ticket prices have skyrocketed and a large beer at Busch is more than most Cards fans’ trailer payments.
So with all this revenue pouring in, what has Cards management given back? Nothing. Nil. Nada. Their 2003 payroll was just under $84 million and six years later it’s less than $89 million.
There are some who believe present management is milking the system dry, cashing in on the All-Star game, and then looking to flip the club. If that happens, new ownership could come in and provide the necessary funds to retain Pujols’ services. But if the current group stays the course, there is nothing in their history that indicates they would pony up to retain him.
"I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." ~ Frank Sinatra
or maybe they are saving up in order to pay Albert.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 17, 2009 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Anything saved............
………..was lost in the market over the past 18 months!!
"I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." ~ Frank Sinatra
Money talks
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Probaly too late to get any further response to this....
However, my membership did not become fully active till a day ago. I am a Cardinals fan over from the Vivaelbirdos website and I have been itching to make a point about this topic since I first read it here a few days ago. As good Cub fans you are all thinking a certain way about this and I just wanted to point something out.
Albert has made it abundantly clear that he is less concerned about money than he is about winning. This man is consumed with winning. He expands his zone when the rest of the team is hitting to try and shoulder more of the load (at the expense of his own numbers), he consistenly runs through stop signs from the third base coach Jose Oquendo, etc… etc…
I make this point because it seems that the Cubs are in a similar situation that the Cardinals were in at the end of the 2006 season. The window had closed as the veterans were aging and their contracts were beginning to weigh heavily on the already large payroll. Do you all honestly think that the window for the Cubs won’t have closed by 2011 (which is what many of my Cub fan friends here in Peoria, IL seem to think as well as some of the opions I have read on here). I would wager that the Yankees, Angles, or Red Sox would be more attractive targets than the Cubs in pure terms of winning first and money second.
I love reading your opinions on here and just wanted to let you all know that I am not a rabid Cub hater (anymore) as I have recently wed a cub fan. :)
SlamalamaJackADongWick cares very little about your draft pick standing-by gdm426
by FredbirdisaDork on Jun 24, 2009 11:43 AM CDT reply actions
Probably*
SlamalamaJackADongWick cares very little about your draft pick standing-by gdm426
by FredbirdisaDork on Jun 24, 2009 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions
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