Cubs Reach New Low In 6-0 Loss To White Sox
by Al Yellon on Jun 28, 2009 6:49 PM CDT
in Chicago Cubs Recaps
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PrintI barely know what to write any more about these defeats. The Cubs' 6-0 loss to the White Sox was about as listless an effort as I have seen in a Cubs team since 2006.
Three times in the first six innings, the Cubs had a runner on third base with less than two out. And three times, that runner stood there, unable to score. Get a couple of those guys home, and the dribbling of runs -- one here, two there -- by the White Sox might not have happened.
This team is walking around as if it's already defeated. Which, perhaps, it is. Now, I'm usually the one saying, "It's still early!" And, there is still more than half a season remaining, 90 games as of today, and 50 wins in those 90 games -- a .556 percentage, not unattainable -- would make 85. In this year's Comedy Central, that might still take it. The Brewers lost 7-0 today to a guy making his major league debut -- see, the Cubs aren't the only team that guys like that make look silly -- and the Cardinals lost to the Twins 6-2 with the newly acquired Mark DeRosa going 0-for-3 (hooray!). Thus the Cubs still remain only 3.5 games out of first place, heading into a series in Pittsburgh, a place where they have gone 11-7 since 2007.
Getting Aramis Ramirez back will not fix this team. He'll help, but he likely won't be 100% for most of, if not all of, the rest of the season and thus the Cubs need another bat. I have to believe Jim Hendry is working his cellphone overtime trying to find one, if for this reason alone: he's trying to save his job. The 2009 Cubs were, in my opinion, poorly constructed to begin with and with absolutely no depth to help out with injuries -- do you think the Cubs could have used Reed Johnson the last two days? Kosuke Fukudome can't hit lefthanders at all. Including today: 4-for-20. Jake Fox has come back to Earth -- 0-for-8 the last two days against the lefties he's supposed to crush (he did draw a walk against John Danks, and had a nice at-bat, one of the few the Cubs had all day).
About Carlos Zambrano's antics -- well, I don't think he was throwing at DeWayne Wise, do you? He had just allowed Chris Getz to steal home by throwing a ball away on the previous pitch, and knowing Carlos, he was steaming on the inside and just threw a ball kind of wherever he wanted, and it wound up on Wise's body. Incidentally, I realize plate umpire Brian Runge was just trying to get Carlos out of the way, but he put his hand on Z's back. Isn't this what Paul Schrieber had to apologize to Magglio Ordonez earlier this year for doing? The game, unfortunately, was well in the Sox' hands by then -- 3-0, on its way to being 5-0 in that inning -- and I think Z was simply letting his frustration get to him.
No one hit today, particularly with runners on base, so it would be unfair of me to single out Milton Bradley. But Bradley didn't look good striking out twice, and I repeat what I said the other day, trying to be fair here: I simply don't think the Chicago Cubs and Milton Bradley are a good fit. He told Paul Sullivan of the Tribune that he doesn't crave attention, and would rather do his job and just go home. That's great, but the Cubs don't afford him that luxury. This is a place where attention comes with the job. As a couple of people here have suggested, perhaps the pressure put on players and managers here because the team hasn't won in 100 years is too much for any individual to bear. I don't know what the answer is to that, and I'm not sure anyone does.
What I do know is that this team doesn't appear built to win the way it's currently constructed. Jim Hendry can fix that. There's still time. Go do it, Jim. At 3.5 games out, the division can still be taken.
As I noted in the preview post, I left in the 6th inning to sign, along with Kasey Ignarski, copies of "Cubs By The Numbers" at the Book Cellar in Lincoln Square. As a result, I was treated to the last three innings with Pat & Ron. They began discussing the spelling of Tigers pitcher Joel Zumaya's name. Ron couldn't quite get it. Then the name reminded Santo, somehow, of the campfire folk song "Kumbaya". If you didn't hear it, Santo started singing "Kumbaya". Pat was nearly rendered speecheless.
It's been that kind of year. Let's hope the baseball improves, or we're going to get more of that.
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It was fun.
Sold a few books, talked to some other authors. Sorry you couldn’t make it! (Yes, I know you don’t live here.)
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Pat & Ron gave up on the team today too
…as you heard. Pretty much all day it was props for the Sox who were doing well (like Danks), and restrained dismay over the Cubs’ performances.
Classy guys that they are (Pat & Ron)....they give kudos to the better team....
Do the Cubbies look listless to everyone? I can’t figure out if it is just me or if they really are listless….
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Unfortunately, they look pretty darn listless to me.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Hawk
When the Cubs are doing well against the Sox, all he says is nothing….just dead air. He is by far the worst and most biased announcer I’ve ever seen.
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
Bias is one thing
Uecker is biased… but classy, endearing, and professional.
Hawk is biased… and… not so much.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
i'd rather miss the game
entirely than watch it with hawk calling it.
DEJESUS!!!
The guy
flat out ruins the game for any fan of an opposing team. And listening to Stoney have to play second fiddle to that bumpkin makes it even worse.
Frito: What's the minus of thirty and twenty?
Joe: Uh, it's eighty. It's eighty billion dollars. That's a mighty big minus isn't it?
Frito: Yeah. I like money.
I wondered
don’t they have two “color” guys calling their games? I think that is the problem.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
Calling Hawk a "color" man is like calling a Nazi a nice guy.
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
Fair enough
And that’s funny.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
or calling a Cardinal fan a humble person!
Go Cubs Go! Go Cubs Go!
Hey Chicago what do you say,
The Cubs are gonna win today!
Personally...
I do think Zambrano was throwing at him. We’ve seen this before (the game where Edmonds hit 2 HR’s off of him in 2004 I want to say) where he makes a mistake and then takes out his anger with a fastball to the backside of the hitter. If it helps him to cool down, then so be it. I don’t have a problem with it.
I can’t help but wonder if Fukudome’s struggles against LHP are because he never gets to face lefties. Ever. So they’re so foreign to him when he finally does. I can’t imagine he was a platoon player in Japan — not many MVP’s are. Does anyone have his splits over there?
He faced lefties most of last year here.
Hit .276/.371/.354 against them, a higher average but less power than vs. RHP.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Also...
I’m getting so sick of Soriano’s lollygagging in the field. I posed this question in the game thread, but I’ll ask it again… when’s the last time he dove for a ball? Has he ever as a member of the Cubs? Like, a legit dive — not where he makes a shoestring catch and falls to the ground. He gives up on WAY too many balls.
We've been told Soriano is playing injured....
…the alleged reasons for struggling at the plate and in the field.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jun 28, 2009 6:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Then he needs to go on the DL.
Because he is not helping the team this way.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
That's what I'm thinking
This “slump” is going on a lot longer than normal for Sori
by LT on Jun 28, 2009 7:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Nice running catch today
I agree he probably needs a break though.
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
i really think if he doesnt go to the DL he should be put down in the DL, i mean he cant do worse lower in the order, right?
by jesus christos on Jun 28, 2009 7:05 PM CDT up reply actions
I thought you were calling for him to be
put to sleep
by LT on Jun 28, 2009 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, this the has put ME to sleep for most of the year...
Go Green! Go White! GO STATE!
King Leonidas: Spartans! What is your profession?
Spartans: HA-OOH! HA-OOH! HA-OOH!
One nice running catch, sure....
3 others he either judged wrong or totally gave up on.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions
exactly...........
and Lou needs to make a change
"We got some pretty good chemistry here. We got some toughness, and it's starting to show." - Lou Pinella
Maybe if not on the DL...
Then at least a few days off. If Reed wasn’t hurt, we could put him in there for Alfonso.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:05 PM CDT up reply actions
That's the GM's decision,
isn’t it?
The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
he almost killed himself on the wall
against the Indians, near the same place where DeRosa ran into the phone box. Not every player has to dive.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions
So you don't remember one instance...
of him diving for a ball here in two and a half years he’s been here?
I rest my case.
And I remember that play, it was a nice catch. He actually ran hard for the ball — something else that you don’t frequently see from him.
he ran hard for the ball today.
We’ve seen it a lot this year. He’s been improving as a fielder.
You can’t blame him for not moving when Riot dropped that pop-up.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions
You really think so?
I think he’s regressed as a fielder big-time this year. He’s misjudged so many routine fly balls.
I've seen him go back to the wall
with much more ease, and I’ve seen him run for the ball flat out. I do think his knees hurt, and I think he doesn’t want to go on the DL because he feels that he can play his way out of it, but that’s utter speculation on the latter part of that.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:15 PM CDT up reply actions
And again...
No one can seem to recall ONE TIME where he actually dove for a ball! How is that possible?!
so what?
I don’t remember Sammy diving for the ball all that much. If you’re fast enough to get under it, you don’t have to dive.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Late September, 2003...
Game Sean Estes started and tossed a shutout, against Pittsburgh I wanna say… Sammy made an incredible diving catch. He used to dive when needed, that’s a pretty poor comparison.
And you’re REALLY doing a bad job of defending Sori here. “So what?” Seriously? So what if your players don’t give 100%?
Your last statement is just absurd. We’ve seen Soriano give up on balls countless times.
I remember that play
Sosa was like a dolphin on the DOWNHILL side of the curve when he caught the ball. It was an absolute perfect play.
I’m not sure I could name another one though.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I'm not sure why Sammy's name was even brought up...
he is irrelevant to a discussion regarding the effort of Soriano. But I don’t ever remember anyone questioning Sammy’s effort. Ever.
an example of another player
who didn’t dive much.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Again, so what?
I’m not saying that Soriano is the only player in baseball who doesn’t give 100%. You don’t have to try and think of other players (though again, Sammy was a terrible example) who can dog it from time to time.
why is Sammy a bad example?
you just got through saying that no one questioned Sammy’s effort. But you would — because he rarely dove for the ball, right? And that’s an indication that he didnt’ give 100%, right?
Cripes.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions
You're impossible.
It’s not just about diving for balls. It’s about lollygagging out there. The diving for balls was just an example of Soriano’s poor effort — considering he NEVER does it.
you haven't made
a compelling case for him being lazy. But then, no one ever really has.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll agree he's not lazy...
But just lacks outfield instincts. I don’t doubt he’s trying.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
this
I agree with.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree with this. And so did the Sox radio announcers.
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
I don't think
a player has to dive to prove that he’s giving 100%. Shrug.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions
When the alternative...
is to pull up and let it bounce in front of you, yes, it’s a matter of giving 100%.
I don't think
he’s doing that. He may be getting a late jump, taking a bad route. Or, you know. The ball is dropping in front of him, because that’s what base hits do when they’re not going over your head.
It’s not like this is easy. if it were easy, everyone would do it.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Good grief.
The dude hasn’t dove for a ball in 2.5 years and you’re gonna sit here and tell me you think he’s giving 100% on every play? Seriously, man?
yep.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL.
Okay then. Thank you for at least confirming your incredibly absurd logic. I suppose this discussion is more or less over then.
it was over
before you started. You’ve never been able to prove that Soriano is lazy, and you won’t be able to — because, you know. He’s not.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Soriano isn't lazy
he’s just a really poor outfielder. You gotta live with it though because his bat seems to be heating up a slight bit.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 7:29 PM CDT up reply actions
he's a perfectly fine outfielder
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:29 PM CDT up reply actions
he's a below average fielder.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I disagree.
well, this year, so far, fine. But as a ball player, he’s a fine left-fielder.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Cmon Drew
seriously you can not think that Soriano is a FINE left fielder..he is easily one of the worst in the game..end of story no one should ever argue with that..and if someone does then they just have a man crush on that guy..cuz he is terrible in the field
I continue
to disagree. Someone put the stats up in another post. He was second only to Braun.
It’s not like Left field is where you put your best defensive players.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:00 PM CDT up reply actions
What the hell kind of stat...
Has Ryan Braun as the best defensive left fielder? And what kind of idiot actually puts stock into that stat?!
Seriously, do you watch the games? Anyone will tell you that Ryan Braun is a terrible LF.
you keep asking that question
and I keep answering it.
Who said I was ranking defensive left-fielders?
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Well...
Considering that’s what the entire discussion has been about…
Alfonso Soriano isn’t second in anything this year. Not offense and certainly not defense.
no one is arguing
that he’s playing well this year, although he’s shown flashes.
I’ve been talking about his history as a left fielder. He has been a good one.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions
I never said he was 2nd best in baseball.
I never said he was 1st best in baseball.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Ummmm, yes, you did. Look up!
“I continue to disagree. Someone put the stats up in another post. He was second only to Braun.”
are you saying Braun is the best LF in baseball?
because I did not say that.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Are you mentally retarded?
I don’t mean that as an insult, it’s an honest question. What I quoted was your words a handful of posts above this.
Christ, man.
find where it says
“best in baseball” above. It doesn’t.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
you keep asking that question
and I keep answering it.
Who said I was ranking defensive left-fielders?
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Do you think he's dreamy?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:17 AM CDT up reply actions
inappropriately
fixed that for ya.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions
no, you think he’s dreamy in an inappropriate fashion.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Why is that?
Would groovy have been a better term?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Cool - we agree on something
I find Braun inappropriate, too.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions
thanks for the chuckle
Braun is excellent at fielding, so you make some weird personal attack on me. heh
No, I made fun of your choice of words, not you
I don’t even know you.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:24 AM CDT up reply actions
♫You know, you acting like you don’t know
I tear the club up fo’ sho’
This flow is gon’ bring mo dough
And you know but you acting like you don’t know
♫
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions
♪♫♪♫
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions
c'mon now
the word “excellent.” You don’t have to actually meet me to make personal attacks, as well you know.
Yes, you're correct.
My comment about knowing you wasn’t substantive evidence.
However, I meant nothing personal by the original comment. I was merely being silly.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions
he loves gazing into
his big large enormous AMAZINGLY HUGE GOOGLY EYES!
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions
he's got big ears
and he can’t throw his fastball over the plate.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Sure.
Those ears make him look like a car with the doors open.
How’s that?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions
and not just any car
a car with REALLY BIG DOORS. Maybe that’s the problem — the wind is blowing in at Wrigley when he pitches, and it’s pushing him over on the mound.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions
I think you're on to something there
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions
someone give Larry Rothschild
a crate of duct-tape!
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:24 AM CDT up reply actions
The circular logic here...
Is astounding.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions
He's pretty bad Drew...
Even Brenly has had enough of watching him out there.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions
You're wasting your time
He’s convinced Sori is the best LF in the NL
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions
I can see where he's coming from...
Because when Sori is on offensively, I think people can stomach the defense.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure, the hot streaks are amazing
But there isn’t much consistency.
He’s an above average offensive player when he’s right, but he’s not the best LF.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions
agree
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Statistics....
would indicate that he’s actually a pretty good LF…and ranks pretty well with a number of metrics.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions
He didn't have
a particularly great day, although he made a good running catch today.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions
that is an absurd statement
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
Try watching a game sometime...
the case will present itself.
What about the leadoff hit into the gap that the freaking CF-er had to chase down, spin around, and fire into second? How on earth was that not a double?
I watch and/or listen to
almost every game that’s played, save the ones on the west coast.
Have you stopped reading the bits where we talk about how he’s playing with a hurt knee?
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
right.
because playing the exceedingly athletic game of baseball is easy.
Why aren’t you doing it, again?
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Who's talking it being easy?
The dude makes almost 20 million dollars. He could freaking give 100% on a daily basis. But he doesn’t.
except
for the part where he does. Because, you know. Proof. You ain’t got none.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions
sure.
but I’m not the one questioning him. You are. Burden of proof. You know. On the accuser. But you got none.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions
If you come claiming one thing
I expect you to prove it. If you don’t…..bro….it kinda discredits anything you say
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
Ummm, that goes both ways... bro...
I can’t prove that he doesn’t give 100%, as I claim, just as you can’t prove that he does, as you claim.
you're the one
making the claim, “bro”.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions
this is asinine....its like me calling you gay
can I prove it? No. But I guess you can’t really prove to me otherwise….so I guess you are gay?
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
no
it’s supposed to be an example of being unable to prove a negative.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:58 PM CDT up reply actions
not at all, just an example of poor logic
But apparently, I’m a 12 year old, so what do I know
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
nothing
again, you’re the one who is making the accusation, but you’ve got nothing to back it up. So I adeptly and adroitly parry your accusations with “no, he doesn’t” and don’t need anything else.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I've got my eyes to back it up...
Try stepping away from your computer for ONE GAME… just actually (crazy concept coming) WATCH THE GAME once rather than reporting to the blog what happens after every pitch. Maybe then you will see what is so obvious.
again
I watch games all the time. There are these things called laptops, you know.
What’s obvious is that you’ve got an anti-Soriano bias. I won’t speculate as to why. I don’t particularly care. You’re wrong. You have no proof. You’re welcome to your opinion, but it carries no weight.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions
See that's the thing...
I don’t have anti-Soriano bias at all. I’m a fan of his. The only Cub I dislike is Miles. You, on the other hand seem to have the blinders on. But that goes for every Cubs player. You constantly defend every single player on this roster. Which, of course, diminishes what small amount of credibility you had to begin with.
not at all
but you consistently rag on Soriano, and you’ve got no reason to do so. So, whatever. You’re the one making the accusation. Back it up, or drop it.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions
none of which
is evidence of anything other than an extended slump, and certainly no evidence of being lazy.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions
it's all built
on your house of cards that he’s lazy.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions
very well said
"We got some pretty good chemistry here. We got some toughness, and it's starting to show." - Lou Pinella
He really does have knee trouble
And should be on the DL
I don’t question Sori’s desire. I do question his instincts as an outfielder.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Drew - forget Kanderber for a second and reply to Shanghai (or me) here
because as Soriano’s staunchest defender on BCB, I’d love to know your thoughts on what Shanghai says.
If Soriano is hurt as you claim, then don’t you think he should go on the DL? If no, then why not? Can you honestly tell me that you’re pleased with Soriano’s entire body of work this season? If not, then what would you suggest to improve it?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
I’ve said several times in the past few weeks that I’d like to see him sit. But I wouldn’t want Hoff or Fox out there for an extended amount of time. When RJ comes back, if Sori need to sit for a week, then by all means, sit him. I think he needs the rest.
I wouldn’t mind if he picked up a lighter bat, either.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:46 PM CDT up reply actions
That's a much better and more concise argument...
… than going back and forth with several people contentiously.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
you are arguing someone needs to dive for a ball in order to display hustle or effort
its just not his game.
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
The other thing you have to remember
is that he started out as an infielder not an outfielder. If you don’t know what you are doing on a dive you could be on the DL in a hurry
by LT on Jun 28, 2009 7:29 PM CDT up reply actions
That's a terrible argument...
He’s 30 something years old and has been playing baseball since he was a little kid. He knows how to dive.
Okay?
I’m just saying, what you said it’s just flat out silly. He doesn’t know how to properly dive? Come on.
why is DIVING so important to you?
Soriano sucks cause he doesn’t make the highlight reels?
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
Am I talking to a 12 year old?
Why is diving important? Do you honestly not know the answer to that?
I understand the importance of diving
But it is no secret it isn’t a part of fonzi’s game. I can’t blame him for knowing that and taking a ball on the hop instead of misplaying it and it leading to a triple
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
I've got to disagree with you on this
My favorite player of all time rarely dove, yet consistently led the league in total chances at his position. He prided himself on being in position to make a play without having to dive.
He also won nine gold gloves and is the reason why my softball jersey has “23” on the back of it.
Diving isn’t the be-all end-all way to judge a fielder.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Ryno would dive for balls...
both up the middle and in the hole. He was my favorite player as well, and is the reason I’m a Cubs fan.
I know diving isn’t the end all be all. But I think it’s pretty representative of a player’s effort when he hasn’t dove for a ball in over two years. Wouldn’t you agree?
Not necessarily
I’m sure you’ve played some kind of ball at some level. I never was great, but I can tell you this — the times that I have dove for a ball, it just happened. It wasn’t a concious decision; I was going for the ball and that’s what my body ended up doing to get there.
Sori’s instincts are bad . . . and I think the instincts are what makes a player dive. You may disagree; what do you think from your own experience?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I haven't played...
organized baseball since little league, so I really can’t add much from personal experience.
Well, again - I'm not that good
But that’s been my own experience on the softball diamond.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions
yep
and have you ever had guys who have played infield most of their life play some outfield in a blowout game? They have a hard time getting a read on the ball coming to them. It takes a lot of instincts and time playing out there. Now Sori is a pro athlete, but I don’t think he looks comfortable out there. Luckily he has a cannon for an arm.
by LT on Jun 28, 2009 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed. Forget diving for a second and think about sliding.
Actually don’t think about sliding because if you do, you’re going to mess yourself up but good. Whether you go in feet first or head first, it’s the same thing. You just do it.
[cue Maverick quote]
“If you think, you’re dead.”
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
we train our kids on the LL team
to slide when we yell SLIDE! Without fail. I got Max to slide into a puddle doing that the other day. Like, at the park, not during a practice. He was running and playing, and just to test him, I yelled SLIDE! and there it was.
Too bad we can’t train them to get a double when we yell HIT! :P
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions
if his instincts are bad
wouldn’t that mean he would have to dive for more balls?
i don't really consider a raspberry from sliding into home an injury
by U-God on May 31, 2009 4:22 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions 0 recs
by Where Triples Go to Die on Jun 29, 2009 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions
So he can make an out?
Instead of a single. Getting to the ball…either by getting a good jump, pure speed, climbing a wall, or diving for a ball is important to ANY outfielder.
Fonzie doesn’t appear to have (m)any of those skills.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions
My 0.02
Ryne Sandberg didn’t dive that much, but that’s because he was terrific at being in the right position to start with. Now I’m not saying that Sori is the LF equivalent of Ryno; however diving for a ball isn’t necessarily an accurate way to measure range – or desire.
I was teasing
And people shouldn’t ignore it . .. I don’t have an exclusivity patent on that point! Your paragraph is no less valid.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Is there an echo in here? ;-)
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions
I've played basketball my whole life...
But I’m 5’11" and I suck at dunking. Just because he’s played his whole life doesn’t mean one aspect of his game can’t be lacking.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions
so you are equating
your physical inability to dunk a basketball to soriano’s lack of desire to dive for a baseball? that doesn’t seem to make sense. You CAN NOT dunk, Soriano WILL NOT dive. There is a major, major difference between those two
Maybe he lacks...
The physical ability and coordination to dive for balls in the outfield. Coming up as an infielder, he probably didn’t do much full sprinting in on balls, having the opportunity to dive.
He’s in his 30’s now, his legs aren’t what they used to, why should he try to pick up a new skill with the risk of injury? If the rim was lowered a foot for me, I’d be able to dunk. However, I’d still be bad at it and risk injury because it is not in my skill set.
I know the analogy is a stretch, but you get my point.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 9:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Soriano is 30..
And how old was Edmonds last year? It’s just nice to see the extra effort every once in awhile..thats all.
by BadDecisions on Jun 29, 2009 1:07 AM CDT up reply actions
Some guys...
…just don’t look like they are going full blast when they indeed are in their mind. I realize Soriano is not Mr. Hustle, but I also don’t think he intentionally loafs around either. He is what he is, and the Cubs should have known that when he was signed.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
This is true...
How many times to you see players roll over there wrists awkwardly. A broken wrist by Soriano and bye-bye bat speed.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think he gave 100% yesterday
when he lead off the game with a single in the gap… Which should have been a double but was still standing at first when the ball finally got thrown back to the infield. Bob and Len called him out on that.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." - Alvin Dark
So you dive and miss the ball.....
and its a triple. If you can’t make it, you can’t make it
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
Obviously he's not fast enough then...
By the amount of balls dropping in front of him lately. And comparing him to Sammy, yeah… not helping your case much.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions
only because
people have a biased view of Sammy Sosa. I was using him as an example.
If, as has been noted, his knees hurt, then he’s probably struggling to get under the ball. One fly ball, he definitely misplayed today.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions
I seem to recall Lou saying...
That Soriano may have broken up some scar tissue in his knee or something rounding 1st a few weeks ago, and the pain he had went away. Obviously something is still lingering.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions
1st off
do you know how hard it is to dive while hopping for the ball…..???
by cozmotaylor123 on Jun 28, 2009 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
now that was funny...
he doesn’t dive cause he doesn’t want to hurt himself, but I believe earlier this year, in maybe Milwaukee, I think, he did make like a half dive… and caught the ball. First time I ever saw him leave his feet. But if the Cubs didn’t have Theriot (or Blanco) running out there on every fly ball getting in his way he may be a better fielder, he never calls them off though, probably because the coaches told soriano to yield to the other players whenever possible… so he just lets the ball drop.
What game were you watching?
"We got some pretty good chemistry here. We got some toughness, and it's starting to show." - Lou Pinella
same game everyone else was
except for you and Kanderber. Sori plays hard, and he tries hard. Everyone understands that he’s slumping right now. You can’t sit out a slump on the bench.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Soriano
Like you say Drew, isn’t the best but the pissing and moaning is bewildering.
Soriano’s UZR in LF:
’06: 8.1
’07: 1.2
’08: 2.5
UZR isn’t the end all be all of defense stats but it’s a good indication. Soriano isn’t worth all the pissing and moaning, there are other things wrong with this club that are far far more important.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Interesting thing about that...
… compare that to other players in the same position and their UZR… all below have at least 15 games in LF:
2008 UZR: Reed Johnson 4.5, Sori 2.5, DeRo 0.2
2007 UZR: Cliff Floyd 4.6, Matt Murton 1.2, Sori 1.2
Not taking in to account this doesn’t really measure dude’s arm / ability to turn double plays / throw runners out (and other general things we appreciate Dome for), he really isn’t that bad.
Diving / flailing / falling down doesn’t necessarily signify good catch. I see comments here all the time celebrating circus catches and think to myself “well, sure… that looked cool, but if he’d played it a step quicker he’d never have had to leave his feet and risk losing the ball on impact with the ground / wall.”
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 28, 2009 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Interesting
The only exception I’ll hold is DeRosa in ‘08 other than that I’d say Soriano’s offense makes up for the lack of defense next to those other names. Soriano has had a few Outfield Assists that I recall, no?
Kinda like what Moneyball talked about with Jeremy Giambi.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 11:58 PM CDT up reply actions
he's had so many
that runners don’t try any more.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Bradley not being a good fit...
…is definitely spot on. This is the wrong place for him to be if he “just wants to do his job and go home.” This is Chicago, and the Chicago Cubs we’re talking about here. This team gets more media attention than every other team besides the Mets and Yankees.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 6:56 PM CDT reply actions
he is not lazy
just sucks at fielding, and so far this year hitting
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
sorry meant for below, too much sun and beer today
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
Oh no..... it's a ball hit to Soriano
Today had to be the worst performance I have seen by a left fielder in a long long time. (since Dave Kingman ) he was lazy uninspired and an embarrassment to this team. I have stood up for him for to long, either he needs to get it together , or get the %&% outta town
LouPrules
The worst part is...
He actually appears to be regressing in the field.
by Damen Jackson on Jun 28, 2009 6:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Is that possible?
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 6:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Where exactly can he go?
With his contract, age, indifference in the field, and continued slump who would take him? Teams are not in the business of eating contracts, especially mammoth ones like his. Same with Bradley and Fukudome. Hendry has literally painted himself into a corner.
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
I don't think it's indifference...
In the field. I think he just legitimately takes horrible routes and gets bad jumps. On the one that dropped in today, he took about two steps back then had to run in on it and have it fall. I won’t knock his effort, he just doesn’t have an outfielder’s instincts.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:13 PM CDT up reply actions
That's what the Sox radio announcers were saying...they also said something like
it’s always a “bonus” when Sori can make a catch in the OF.
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
that's
unfair to the extreme. Sori is a competent fielder.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes,
I think Zambrano threw at Wise. He was embarrassed, and I felt like he thought the Sox showed him up on that suicide/steal.
If that's the case
Then he’s an even bigger idiot than I thought.
Only in Z’s mind can a team show you up by trying to win
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
If he did...
I would think it more an emotional reaction from an emotional player. But lord knows he’s done dumber.
by Damen Jackson on Jun 28, 2009 7:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I disagree....
Plus, Geo missed the squeeze play. Z threw it outside (maybe a tad too much), like he’s supposed to and Geo was still behind the plate. Not his fault and the next pitch just looked too much inside on Wise, who does crowd the plate.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:10 PM CDT up reply actions
July 2nd-12th is HUGE.
A 4 game set with the Brewers, a 4 game set with the Cardinals during that time. All at Wrigley. Those games are what the season comes down to, IMO. We win those series, we definitely are right in it. However, the way we are playing now, I don’t have too much faith in us winning either one of those series.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 6:58 PM CDT reply actions
CAPTION
“Wow, Geo. That’s a HUGE zit on your forehead!”
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
Perhaps Bradley wouldn't be drawing so much "attention"
if he had been simply “serviceable” offensively year to date and not on an RBI pace trailing Cincy PITCHER Micah Owings. There are plenty of games left but a team that can’t go more than two games in a row with a strong offensive performance is probably due for a .500 year in 2009.
I wouldn't have thought it earlier.....
but this Pirates series Is HUGE. Andrew McCutcheon appears to be the real deal.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
Yep.
Not like it’s some big achievement to do this, but they just took 2 of 3 from the Royals.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions
and only 1.5 games behind us...
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:04 PM CDT up reply actions
They're also 21-14 at PNC this year.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions
[Bradley] told Paul Sullivan of the Tribune that he doesn’t crave attention, and would rather do his job and just go home. That’s great, but the Cubs don’t afford him that luxury. This is a place where attention comes with the job.
I’m pretty sure Milton Bradley understands that being a ball player comes with attention. He just doesn’t want any EXTRA attention. LIke, you know. Articles asking if he should be booed before his first at bat at Wrigley.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
Tough
The extra attention comes with the territory of playing in the 3rd largest market in the country, for a team that hasn’t won it all in 100 years.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions
no one wrote an article
asking if Aaron Miles or Kevin Gregg, or Fukudome would be booed before their first at bat at Wrigley.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Here we go again.
It’s the big, bad, and apparently racist media.
How is it that Michael Jordan, an admitted philanderer, is the most beloved figure in Chicago sports?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Not to mention Ernie Banks...
…Billy Williams, Andre Dawson or for that matter Derrek Lee. Jacque Jones and laTroy Hawkins got the same treatment Todd Hundley did, and for the same reason: lack of production.
Just so I'm clear
it appears as though you’re justifying racial slurs being thrown out because of lack of production. Please, please tell me it’’s a misunderstanding.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 10:25 PM CDT up reply actions
It's a misunderstanding --
Racial slurs are never appropriate. The context of the question, though, was why was about players being “booed”. It was asked of MB and not of other (non-black) players. But the answer has everything to do with his track record.
My point is that the fans and media have a long history of embracing successful players of any color, and disdaining underperforming players of any color.
Gregg has been mercilessly booed...
Howry was booed and even almost attacked by a fan running onto the field. His race has nothing to do with this.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:44 PM CDT up reply actions
This really wasn't a helpful comment.
It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with the size of his contract and the size of his reputation.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
It's well known
Wrigley can be racist. Ask Hawkins and JJ. The media may not but the element is still there.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 8:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I take issue with such...
I’m sure you don’t mean the stadium… and surely you don’t mean every person that attends Cub home games is racist.
Sure there will be ignorant people, but I would hope that such behavior would be quashed posthaste
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
Absolutely not
I’v’e been to games where Sox fans (surprise!) have yelled some really obnoxious things at the ushers in Wrigley.
The inuendo I was suggesting was that of the fans, not be confused with the actual field, though I don’t know how Wrigley Field could be considered racist but whatever.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions
What does that have to do with the insinuation?
The behavior to JJ and Hawkins – and Baker was reprehensible, but that’s got nothing to do with the media.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Dusty too?
I know people were letting him have it in 06 but honestly I thought it was because the team was sucking, he wouldn’t play rookies, he said walks clog the bases, etc..
He got racist mail, yeah.
Sickening.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Totally uncalled for
I had a lot of problems with Baker and admittedly I need to let go of a lot of frustrations during his time as manager, but I would never do something like that.
It gets worse
Reportedly, some people wrote that they hoped his cancer came back. Stuff like that makes me worry about humanity.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Overboard.
There may be a lot you may not like about a person, but hoping that they relapse with cancer is just wrong.
Cubs record since April 2004: 4-0
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 28, 2009 9:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Reading is a skill
The media may not but the element is still there.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions
So is diplomacy
Which you have consistently shown to be lacking in.
Beyond your snarkiness, the min-thread was a discussion about the media’s treatment of Bradley.
Yes, reading is indeed a skill.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions
no no
I merely contributing to the thought of racism. Wasn’t talking about Bradley I was talking about racism and how it is prevalent, that’s it.
I’m glad you agree reading is a skill though.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions
It is more prevalent than I'd like, yes.
I don’t argue that one bit.
My point, however poorly worded it may have been ,was tomas21’s claim seemed dubious at best.
Kudos to you for the tone of your reply – seriously.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I worked in retail
for years man before I do what I do now, it’s not always easy. Haha.
I see what you mean now. Like I said I was just pointing out the prevalance of the racism. I’m pretty indifferent to Bradley altogether.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 8:23 PM CDT up reply actions
I still think he'll hit, but I'd like to see a little less of him playing the victim
And I did mean it about the kudos….I do sometimes overreact to statements like that, which I may have this time. You could have easily taken this down a bad road. I’ll keep that in mind.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:25 PM CDT up reply actions
his babip
is about .50 off. When he comes out of it he’s gonna rake, it’s only a matter of time though.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, it is still very prevalent.
Just look at Vermont, for instance. Only around 2% of the people here are from minority groups. We’re one of the whitest states in the US.
Cubs record since April 2004: 4-0
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 28, 2009 9:51 PM CDT up reply actions
And the element
is in NY, LA, Hou, Cinn, StL, etc. No one would disagree with that. However, when it is brought up, it suggests that the element of racism is exceptional in Chicago. I would take exception to that.
The city of Chicago has always respected players who play hard, black, white or brown. It seems unfair to suggest there is rampant racism is to denigrate millions of decent people who couldn’t give a damn about race based upon the absurdities of a minuscule number of jerks.
If you like Selig's handling of the steroid issue, you'll love his choice for next Cub owner.
Right
I wasn’t referring to the media so much as the way under-performing Cubs that happen to be black get demonized WAY more than white guys. Everyone in the stands isn’t racist, everyone on this board (hopefully noone) isn’t racist, but the collective mentality seems to have some racist elements to it.
I am not saying that there haven’t been very unpopular white players (Hundley comes to mind). But nobody gets vilified like a poorly performing black player, and nobody gets deified like an over-performing white guy.
DEJESUS!!!
I think Scottie Pippen is WAY overrated
Almost deified when he was playing.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:27 PM CDT up reply actions
2 things
1. Nobody said anything was absolutes, you are using the exception to try to prove the generalization wrong
2. Scottie Pippen is widely regarded as one of the top 50 players ever. Just because YOU think he’s over-rated does not make it so.
DEJESUS!!!
Badger badger badger
Scottie Pippen was the 2nd best player in the NBA when he played.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
snake!
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 9:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Perhaps you can explain
why only white pitchers get vilified. This year it’s been Heilman and Gregg and Cotts. Last year it was Howry, Marquis and Eyre. How about Farnsworth? So maybe position players who are black and pitchers who are white have been categorized by racists. Is that possible? Of course it isn’t.
Bradley isn’t getting jumped on because he’s black. His performance and actions have made him a target. He put the bullseye on his back. And he can remove it.
If you like Selig's handling of the steroid issue, you'll love his choice for next Cub owner.
"He put the bullseye on his back"
True, to a certain extent. Well put.
Marmol hasn't been villified?
I’m not agreeing that it’s racism at all, but Marmol has gotten some crap this year.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 8:55 AM CDT up reply actions
And why has Marmol gotten crap this year?
His performance.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Is that allowed?
/sarcasm
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Again, tough
Crap happens. Life’s unfair. If that’s the sole reason that he’s having a bad year, he would have been useless, anyway.
You think the fans at Miller Park ask him how things are going? Do they greet him with a “hi, there” in St. Louis?
Professional athletes need to have thicker skins than that. They perform on the public stage.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think it's the sole reason he's having a bad year.
I think it’s the reason he’s been the focus of this blog so much, tho. And I think he hasn’t been given a fair shake, and I don’t think that “tough” is fair, either.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Really? That article is why he's talked about on this blog?
Not the outbursts or the poor offensive output?
Hmm.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:44 PM CDT up reply actions
I think
the inordinate media attention is a big part of it, yes.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Two things
You insinuated it was that one article . . . I don’t think that’s what you meant, so I won’t harp on that.
However — this is a BLOG. People come here to discuss the Cubs. Of course they’re going to talk about what’s in the MSM.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I understand that
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Then why crusade against it?
It’s a losing battle.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:52 PM CDT up reply actions
because
it’s the right thing to do. I don’t pick my battles based on how likely I am to win.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, if you think so, carry on
But I think you’re giving it far too much importance…and your case gets weakened when you ignore contradictory evidence.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I think his past had a lot to do with it...
And I think the whole DeRosa misconception played a part as well.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions
certainly
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think Miles, Gregg nor Dome have the somewhat checkered past that Bradley does as well.
At this point in his career, Bradley has to expect stuff like that, and based on what I’ve read in the last few days, I think he does. Of course, he’d rather not have to see/hear all that stuff all the time, but it’s his bed – he’s made it and he has to lie in it. I think he understands that.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jun 28, 2009 7:52 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think the racist angle is being incorrectly mushed in with booing
Two separate conversations:
1) Several african-american players have reported hostile environments in Chicago whether it is via hate mail, uttered slurs, etc. Enough players have mentioned it for us to discount there is some validity there.
2) This is different than the booing. Cub fans boo mercilessly with little regard to color and are pretty good gauges on when prolonged bad performance warrants booing. Farnsworth, Howry and Cotts got it just as bad as Bradley, Patterson, etc.
by BeltwayCubsFan on Jun 29, 2009 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Soriano cont....
I’ve heard no word that he is injured…. If so I take back my words…… but he was just awful playin in the wind today, and totally looked unispired… If that is the best he can do injured, he needs to sit out till he can hustle again
LouPrules
I've been looking thru all three Chicago papers
..can’t find anything. But, Len and Bren have mentioned this — that Soriano has been playing hurt most of the season, but he (Soriano) says it’s not enough to disable him or keep him on the bench. (I believe they’ve discussed leg/knee problems)
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jun 28, 2009 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I've heard knee from Len and Bob.
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
Just read your whole post, Al.
The Bradley stuff is getting a bit old. You had a pretty controversial (for lack of a better word) post about him the other day, and your feelings are more than well documented here. Of all people to write a paragraph about today, you choose him? Why not Theriot and his 0-4 day with 2 K’s and the dropped pop up? Why not Soriano and his brutal defense along with a ball hit into the gap which he didn’t wind up on 2B?
Besides, Bradley could’ve easily been 0-2 with 2 BB’s. That called third strike was certainly debatable.
On Theriot
Don’t forget the horrible attempt to tag out Wise, who would have been out by 3 feet had Riot not chased him with the ball, instead of waiting for him to slide into the glove.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:39 PM CDT up reply actions
For the love of Mike Myers
Can we please stop with the “He touched him! He touched him! Cooties!” when it comes to umps and players.
The White Sox were coming out of their dugout and the Cubs were coming out of theirs. The umps have every right to keep the players from getting into it.
How about this? If a player, manager, general manager, broadcaster or owner calls attention to a bump, touch, brush, or excessive heavy breathing, then it’s fair game. Otherwise, let’s just assume the men on the field know what is over the line and what isn’t.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Z's quote
Zambrano said the ensuing pitch that hit Wise was a cutter that "cut too much."
"In that situation, I don’t want to get more in trouble. I want to get out of the situation and pitch my six or seven innings," he said.
"I wasn’t even looking at him (Wise). I heard what he said, but I didn’t understand what he said. I just said, ‘What?’ The umpire was good (getting in between) because it was starting to get a little hyper."
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/recap;_ylt=AiiM18NQapU7fvt.Rkm1ZBw5nYcB?gid=290628104
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Hyper?
Yes, and then Zambrano taunted Wise. I don’t believe the Cubs WGN broadcast showed that nor mentioned it.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
Did that poster boy for cousin love, Hawk Harrelson, tell you that?
Or did you come with that all by yourself?
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Watch it yourself...
… watch it yourself, Zambrano was waving him over.
Other than that I’ll ignore your taunts and insults.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
Oooh... ignoring me
that NEVER works. Ask around. I’m unignorable. I’ve just not bothered with you before.
But I’m in the mood for White Sox meat.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I'm Drewishdrewid
and I approve of this message.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Cubbie bear meat...
Detroit feasted on.
Sox feasted on too this weekend.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
and of course
there’s the whole part where Denks OBVIOUSLY threw at Freel.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:49 PM CDT up reply actions
And of course...
… there’s the whole part where Zambrano OBVIOUSLY threw at Podsednik and Wise. Sox got the ultimate revenge though as Zambrano left the game with a loss.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
not at all
Lou doesn’t play the retribution game.
Crazy Ozzie, on the other hand…
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Right...
… and Lou controls what Zambrano does with the ball. Sure.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
What do you want him to do?
(Note: I am waving my arms after I hit post)
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions
dood
today, Zambrano didn’t control what Zambrano did with the ball. It wasn’t intentional. Remove the chip from thy… wait, the skin has grown over it. SURGICALLY remove the chip from thy…
I command the demons that have cursed this chip on this shoulder to GET OUT in the name of OBJECTIVITY!
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Drew, please don't take offense, but when it comes to objectivity about the Cubs
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 10:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Noted Cubs Hater Todd Hollandsworth...
… says that he believe Zambrano hit Wise on purpose.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
Whoop de do
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 7:03 AM CDT up reply actions
That's as good as it gets
"We got some pretty good chemistry here. We got some toughness, and it's starting to show." - Lou Pinella
It's my observation and ...
… from what I heard Bob Brenly seems to agree with me. Or at least I didn’t hear Brenly say it was all an innocent accident.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
I expect
Bob Brenley has not made a comment about the JFK assassination. Conspiracy!
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Ok...
… it’s a wild JFK Assassination-like conspiracy to think that Zambrano threw at Pods and Wise. Right. If you believe that, fine, go on in that.
I just happen to believe that Zambrano did throw at those two today (and that Danks rightfully stepped up for his team and threw at Freel.) You’ll not be convinced by that but you’re quite confident though that Danks did it on the other hand and with just as much evidence.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
that's good.
because that’s EXACTLY what I believe. Z had no control. He was wild. He hit Wise by accident. Denks was ordered to, because that’s exactly the guy Ozzie Guillen is.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:26 PM CDT up reply actions
It is overwhelmingly likely
you’re wrong, bro.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
right
because while Carlos didn’t have enough control to keep Ramirez from hitting a home run, but he had enough control to hit Pods and Wise.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions
I have no desire
to embark on a urinary olympiad here, but the facts seem to be these.
You may very well be right.
However, Z is a head case. He’s been known to hit people who hit him well. He gets made when the other team beats him, and he has been known to plunk ppl in retaliation.
Z did not execute on the squeeze. The run scored, and it is at least possible… if not likely that Z took out his frustrations on Denks.
A rational person must admit it is possible Z did it on purpose.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
actually
Soto didn’t execute on the squeeze.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions
No...
… I don’t think Danks was “ordered to because that’s exactly the guy Ozzie Guillen is.” I think Danks stepped up and did exactly what was needed w/o an order.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
because Guillen
has made it clear what is and isn’t acceptable.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Noted Cub haters...
Todd Hollandsworth, Les Grobstein & Brian Hanley all agree that Zambrano threw at Pods & Wise.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
all the more reason
to think he didn’t.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Neither more nor less
Doc’s argument is specious and ill-formed (shocker), plus misplaced when he replied to me above when I was essentially agreeing with him (another shocker).
Hollandsworth works for the Cubs.
Anyway, there actually are people who are able to objectively discuss the merits of an event/comment, etc. despite their personal feelings regarding the people involved.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Hollandsworth works for Comcast Sports Net, not the Cubs.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Yeah, I realized that after I hit post
But the club does have some influence, I would think.
Point was, I doubt he’s a “Cub hater”. And if he is, that weakens Doc’s argument, anyway. There were a lot of things wrong with his argument.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Sarcastic
Hollandsworth is a former Cub and the pre & post Cub game guy, hardly a hater which I thought would be clear.
Todd Hollandsworth, Les Grobstein & Brian Hanley all agree that Zambrano threw at Pods & Wise. All three are Cubs fans, outside the putdowns of drew.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
I don't think Z threw at Wise
I do think Denks threw at Freel, tho. Why no mention of that? Freel handled it perfectly.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
Man, that was awesome...
“Getting that dirt off his shoulder” and then blowing it towards the mound… definitely loved seeing that!
especially when the Cubs were down 5-0
I thought it was bush league on Freels part, " Hey Freel how about getting your average above .180"
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
Bush league...
on Freel’s part?! He just got plunked for no fault of his own! I would’ve done the same damn thing!
I think he should do it more often
Maybe he can get is OBP up to .300
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
hes been on the DL for the majority of the season
by jesus christos on Jun 28, 2009 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions
wow.
he’s just back off the DL, just called back up with the club, he steals two bases, gets hit by a pitch, is the Cubs player of the game… and you fault him for that?
Ok.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions
No, that definitely wasn't bush league...
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I played
in a different time. When your team is traiing and sleepwalking through a game, and whether Freel is hitting .140 or .340, to brush his shoulder and act like a bad ass, I would of hit him again.
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
Very funny!
I liked Freel’s smart play yesterday when he ran in from 3rd on the ground ball to Alexei Ramirez. That was a very smart play on his part and I love when guys play like that. Of course I didn’t like that it happened to the my favorite team, but great play nonetheless.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
Freel is easy to like. He plays baseball like it should be played.
And yes, Sori, I wish you did also….
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Cubs can't do anything, and seem to be doing nothing about it
I took that from RosenBlog. Sori, Bradley, Dome how many million & years tied up in these guys ? Dome holds the record for a centerfielder playing with his back stuck
to the wall. How many catchable balls fall in front of this guy ? Al is right about Bradley
not a good fit . Hendry must have been drunk when he thought this was a good idea.
Z I said last year this guy shoulf be traded . He is Mental Board Jr. He was just itching
to get into it today. He will be in a full sized magilla b4 the season is over. It’s over fellas
heading South just past Memphis all aboard !
Most people
on here, like myself, thought the Cubs should’ve signed Dunn instead of Bradley. What a colossal mistake by JH.
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
Abreu, but definitely not Bradley.
I’m also a big believer in clubhouse chemistry though. I know that not everybody is though, but at this point I think anyone of us would rather have Dunn or Abreu instead of MB.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually,
for the record, I was higher on Bobby Abreu, or acquiring Nick Swisher.
by Damen Jackson on Jun 28, 2009 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions
i personally dont see what hendry saw in bradley that dunn ibanez or abreu didnt have
by jesus christos on Jun 28, 2009 7:17 PM CDT up reply actions
especially considering Abreu was much cheaper.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Younger than ibanez and abreu
better defense than dunn.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions
When he can get in the lineup...
for more than 120 games, which he can’t unless he’s able to DH at least some of that time.
by Damen Jackson on Jun 28, 2009 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Dunn is never hurt
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
Bradley
is a better all around player. You have to play defense in the NL.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:17 PM CDT up reply actions
With all due respect, Drew
Bradley has NEVER played more than 30 games in the outfield. How can you call him a better all around player than Abreu?
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Well. I don’t know much about Abreu, but I was thinking about Dunn.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:26 PM CDT up reply actions
ah, gotcha.
well Abreu, he has never played fewer than 151 games, is a serviceable outfielder (good arm), and is a career .300 hitter. He was signed by the Angels for 1 yr, $8 mil. And best of all, he’s a class guy. Definitely a winner, and I think it’s obvious that the Angels got a hell of a better deal than we did this offseason.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Well
Those are certainly nice numbers. However, I’m not going to judge any deals till after the season is over. It’s June 28th. Lots of baseball left to play.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:28 PM CDT up reply actions
fair enough.
and for what it’s worth, I very much hope you’re right. Sadly though, I think I am. :(
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Hindsight.
There was no reason going in to this year to believe Bradley would be worse than Abreu.
Abreu 2008: .296 AVG with .843 OPS
Bradley 2008: .321 AVG with .999 OPS
Now, the amount better might not be worth the extra time or millions Bradley got, and you certainly have to wish they’d taken injury history / rage issues in to account, but claiming we screwed up because Bradley isn’t hitting as well as Abreu this year is purely a hindsight argument. There was no way to see the production being so bad.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 28, 2009 11:58 PM CDT up reply actions
More and more...
… that .999 OPS Bradley put up last year looks like the outlier in his career, not something we could have expected.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Fair enough, but that is still an hindsight argument.
At the time of his signing, the injury issues and headcase history were known and could have been forecast to continue in to the future, as many rightly did at the time.
Nobody could have forecast the catastrophic drop off in production.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 29, 2009 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions
No
but the length of his contract, and money guaranteed to him could’ve been a big warning sign though. I’d much rather have Dunn’s awful defense on a one-year deal.
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
Bradley never played more than 30 games in the OF?
Actually… http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bradlmi01.shtml
2000: 40 in CF, 0 as DH
2001: 60 in CF, 13 in LF, 3 in RF, 1 as DH
2002: 94 in CF, 1 as DH
2003: 93 in CF, 8 as DH
2004: 93 in CF, 31 in RF, 17 in LF, 0 as DH
2005: 73 in CF, 0 as DH
2006: 94 in RF, 1 as DH
2007: 40 in LF, 15 in CF, 4 in RF, 0 as DH
2008: 19 in RF, 1 in LF, 97 as DH
2008 is the only year Bradley was used as a designated hitter very much; he’s appeared in almost 7 times as many games in OF as DH over his career, many of those in center.
Thank you!
It’s refreshing when stats make an appearance. Sadly, that’s far too rare around here…
This place is like an Oprah episode with everyone sitting around talking about their feelings….Ugh.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I should note...
I’m not singling out AmbrosiaDreams here. I meant this entire thread. AD seemed to be trying to use stats; s/he just got them wrong.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions
JER-RY! JER-RY!
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions
You're right of course....
Jerry Springer is more apropos. :)
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Yup... sure showed it!
The man is a born DH and you say he’s a better fit for the NL?
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Ding!Ding!Ding!Ding!
Give that man a prize!
by Damen Jackson on Jun 28, 2009 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions
And when Bradley does play in the outfield, he doesn't exactly make the case for a gold-glove award.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not on one side of this argument or another
But Bradley has been MORE than a pleasant surprise in the field. He hustles on every play that I see and aside from throwing the ball in the stands, seems to make the better decision.
This wouldn’t even be a topic of conversation if he was hitting.
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
Did I say he hasn't been a pleasant surprise...?
Nope, sure didn’t.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions
I am saying he has. I feel confident with Bradley in right.
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
I'm not questioning his effort. He definitely gives it his all out there.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions
but he frequently dives for the ball
that, according to kanderber, establishes that he’s giving 100%.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Inappropriate
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
And not really fair from a logic standpoint.
If kanderber wants to apply the argument to one play, why can drew not apply it to another?
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jun 28, 2009 11:49 PM CDT up reply actions
The biggest mistake wasn't just signing Bradley...
It was giving him the 3 years (the 3rd year is pretty much a lock). If Bradley wanted to play here so bad, and given his checkered past, sign him to an incentive laden 1-year deal with an option or something. Dunn and Abreu probably could’ve been had for 1-year deals.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Abreu was had for a one year deal...
the Angels got him for 1 yr, 8 mil
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Right...
And I’m sure Dunn would’ve taken one year with the Cubs over two with the Nats.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions
really?
Worf would disagree with you — he thinks baseball players are all about money.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions
In some cases it may be true...
But Dunn’s numbers in Wrigley were great, he talked about wanting to be a Cub… I just don’t think he turns down a fair 1-year deal with us. Plus there was talk because of the lack of interest, he was going to take only a year anyway and hope to cash in next off-season.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Peavy
wanted to be a Cub too. I dunno.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:42 PM CDT up reply actions
But we all want to be Cubs!
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Dunn said he really wanted to be a Cub
"I'm not so mean. I wouldn't ever go out to hurt anybody deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something." - Dick Butkus
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
The only thing I can't wrap my head around
is what JH is waiting for. This team has looked listless for the better part of almost 2 months now. Luckily for us, Milwaukee and St. Louis are keeping us in this thing, but St. Louis is already wheeling and dealing and are rumored to be hot after Matt Holliday. We are NOT going to win the division with this team, and there’s no sense in waiting until the trade deadline to add the missing pieces. Get it done Jim, get it done.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
Exactly....
….which scares me into thinking that we make not make ANY moves, if we haven’t already, and think that the return of Rami is going to cure everything.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:13 PM CDT up reply actions
yes, i'm starting to think we won't make any real moves.
and i think the ownership situation might be the problem.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 28, 2009 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm just frustrated because I want to make my team better
and there is absolutely nothing I can do about it. Normally, I don’t mind this. Except now, when I have lost 90% of my faith in our leadership. Come on Jim…time to work for your job. It’s not too late.
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
I don't think this teams struggles have anything to do with Lou
other than his advocating for a LHB in the offseason
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
And I don't even think that is a problem
Getting more left-handed isn’t exactly a radical idea.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I could argue that it is a rational idea
Just the pieces we moved and the moves we made in order to do it is where the mistakes were made
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
In hindsight
perhaps. The jury still is out on that.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Correct.
I say that standing here on June 27th, Hendry very well could look like a genius on Oct 17th, and I pray thats the case
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
From our lips
to the baseball gods’ ears.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions
To a certain extent, though
all Lou can do is make out the lineup card. He can’t go on the field and perform. I think if half of our lineup was hitting over .245 would help much more than dumping Lou Piniella.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep.
Lou can’t hit for the players with RISP.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Unlike some other years, the right players are in place
but they aren’t doing their jobs. That’s the bottom line.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions
exactly.
and that’s why it’s so rediculous to call for Lou’s beheading. What more can we expect the man to do?
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions
agreed
I’d hate for them to make Lou a scapegoat like Gerald Perry.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:32 PM CDT up reply actions
By that logic
By that logic a manager should never get fired. The team isn’t prepared. That’s the managers problem. I haven’t liked Lou from the beginning and as time goes on he hasn’t done anything to change my mind.
yeah.
he’s only won the division both years he’s been here.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions
so you admit your biased..
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions
The Cubs have never made the playoffs two times in a row in my lifetime. So he's done one hell of job.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Prior to last year.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Sometimes...
… a manager has to go, to make a statement. Look what it did for the Rockies this year.
It may be getting toward that time.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Wasn't that Gerald Perry's dismissal?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Not enough is right, but
Why not remove the more guilty party?
You want to make a splash to save your job, Crane? Fire Hendry.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Who would you replace him with?
Serious question.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
That's probably more
than a “off the top of your head” question, but I think there are plenty of very smart young minds out there that could spend 130 mil much more efficiently than Hendry. Kim Ng is supposed to be brilliant, for example.
I don;t think Hendry goes anywhere until ownership is resolved, but that in no way means I think he derves the job at all. I think he is a below-average GM with top financial backing.
DEJESUS!!!
tomas' suggestion isn't a bad one
I’d give Randy Bush an interview to gauge how he’d correct the course, too.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 9:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Are you seriously advocating
the Cubs fire Lou? Seriously?
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, I just might be to that point.
Something has to happen to REALLY shake up this team. Maybe that’s it. I’ll reserve judgment till the All-Star break.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
In the words of Hall and Oates
I can’t go for that. I don’t think the situation is nearly dire enough for that. Plus, I think Lou knows what he’s doing.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I used to think that, too.
But I’m beginning to wonder. And yes, I DO think the situation is getting toward “dire”. This team should be winning more games than this.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Hall and Oates reference?
wow. Awesome. :D
I’m not ready to give up on Lou either.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know
about that. Doesn’t he have another year on his contract after this? If this is his last year, and he’s retiring after this, and he’s given up, then maybe.
But I think Lou has proven to me that he knows how to manage, and the guys in the clubhouse need to get themselves going rather than waiting for Lou to yell and scream them into performing.
I also suspect that Lou’s hands may be tied into keeping Soriano in the lead-off spot, which might be hurting the team offensively as much as anything.
DEJESUS!!!
It's Happening?!?!?!?!?!
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions
no, he can also try to force the issue a bit on offense.
we are absolutely dreadful at bringing runners in, especially when we have them at third with less than two outs. lou can put a squeeze on every once in a while, and he should. he could also put on some hit and runs, etc. instead, he just lets these guys swing away, hoping they’ll break out of it. i’d like to see lou start to micromanage a bit.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 28, 2009 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree
when you have a bunch of guys not driving in runs on their own, it’s typical of a manager to play hit and run or run and hit, squeeze plays, whatever to get the guys concentrating on simply putting the ball in play instead of trying to hit 5 run home runs. We have had a fair amount of chances to drop a squeeze play to try and generate some runs. But , to be fair, we don’t bunt very well as a team.
I say, if what’s been happening isn’t working, gotta try something else. If the guys aren’t driving in the runners on third base at all, you have to force the issue. I would love to know how we rate as a team in sac flies. It seems we never get them when we need them.
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
if we are not one the worst in the league at getting in a runner from third base or with less than two outs, or at least in the bottom 3 in the league, i will eat my hat.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 29, 2009 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions
You may be right...
But I don’t think that Lou signed on to try to win games for two months with the like of Andres Blanco, Ryan Freel, and David Patton.
Honestly, at 136 million in payroll, and a new owner coming on board, I’d expect anything less than a playoff appearance ensures that Jim Hendry is shown the door, not Piniella. Just my opinion.
by Damen Jackson on Jun 28, 2009 7:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Could be worse
I’d say if this team finishes more towards the cellar, Lou would probably retire and it wouldn’t be long before Jim Hendry is shown the door. What incentive would Lou have to stick around? What incentive would an owner have to keep Hendry around with how he bloated the payroll and drove a first place team into the ground?
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
maybe lou needs to go,
but if we lose him now, i certainly don’t see this team turning it around. i’d rather wait until the offseason.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 28, 2009 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Right...
If anything, I see this team just packing it in without Lou. He still instills some element of fear into the players, without him, I think it could only get worse.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Often...
… when a manager with a “hardass” reputation is replaced, the team goes on a hot streak simply because they relax.
Best example: 1982 Brewers. Fired noted hardass Buck Rodgers when the team, which had made the split-season playoffs the year before, was floundering at 23-24. Harvey Kuenn, noted nice guy who owned a bar near the ballpark, took over and the Brewers took off, going 72-43 the rest of the year.
There are others, but that’s the top one I can think of. It happens.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Wasn't Torborg the same hard-assed guy for the Marlins in 2003?
I remember reading that Jack McKeon’s first words to his new team was “Have some fun!”
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Buck Rodgers' career didn't recover
for 500 years.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Looks like
first team to 85 wins, claims the division.
Pittsburgh will give us problems. I get the sense that this team believes it can turn it on when it wants. They see that they are only 3.5 back, and figure that is nothing, we will get it going. Time is running out.
I don’t know it just looks like one of those years to be frustrated throughout the whole summer.
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
this year reminds me so much of 2004.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:17 PM CDT up reply actions
IIRC
2004 was not a fun year… and I’m pretty sure I remember correctly.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
high expectations
“in it” for most of the summer. Had a 1 game lead in the WC in the last week of the year and then lost like 8 of 11 or something like that. It just felt like that team thought they SHOULD win, and didn’t seem to put forth 100% effort all of the time.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jun 28, 2009 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed
And with 2004 in mind… I remember a big mid-season trade, and thinking Nomar was going to march us to the promised land.
This year, there’s a good chance a trade won’t fix things. But better play might.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
and don't you think a big trade....might.....induce better play?
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
Sure! Hope springs eternal.
I’m just saying after the Nomar trade in 2004, I was sure the play would improve. It did not.
And I agree with AD… this season does feel like 2004.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
It didn't improve in 2004
because a lot of the players were no-account idiots (Sammy, Hawkins, Alou, Mercker) led by a no-account manager who allowed the inmates to run the asylum.
This manager is better, and these players are better, both in ability and in demeanor (the Bradley incident aside).
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I really don't think that's true
In fact, I think they’re trying too hard.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:18 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
i agree, and since almost no one will be going to the ASG this year hopefully theyll relax and make a push for the division title
by jesus christos on Jun 28, 2009 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree 100%.
The question is, how do you get an athlete to STOP doing that?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
well, for one, i'd like to see lou start taking some of the decisions out of their hands.
instead of letting them go play the game, swing away, etc., how about putting on more plays (hit and run, squeeze, etc.)? force them to think small.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 28, 2009 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree
I’m not a big fan of the sacrifice bunt, but sometimes something different needs to be done.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep
If we aren’t moving runners over the traditional way, you have to do it any way you can. How many times have we complained about the hitters not having productive outs? Their situational hitting comes and goes.
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
Time is not running out when you are 3.5 back
Unless it is September
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
If I saw ANY progress with this club, I'd agree...
but when you don’t, you have to wonder.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, it's not a light switch
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions
I believe it is.
See the 2007 Chicago Cubs, or the 2007 Colorado Rockies
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
See the 2003 Chicago Cubs
That team was muddling along at .500 until Ramirez and Lofton showed up.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions
with the key being: "acquiring 2 exceptional players"
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, one of those players
is coming back soon, perhaps even later this week. The other one? We’ll see what JH has up his sleeve.
The other thing is that this team doesn’t necessarily need an outside jolt. The right players are there. Remember, in 2003 Mark Bellhorn and Lenny Harris were playing third base.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions
I'd rather
not rush Rami. If we can keep up with the Cards and Suds for the next two weeks, that’s early enough for him.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Those two weeks say a lot about IF they CAN keep pace
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 8:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I hear you
But if he’s feeling OK, I’d bring him back ASAP. Those Suds and ’Birds series before the ASB are looking pretty big right now.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 8:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, indeed.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 8:01 PM CDT up reply actions
surely we're not going to expect him to hit
when he gets back. he’s going to be weak and rusty.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 28, 2009 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Of course I'm expecting him to hit
Maybe not hit .350 or whatever, but yes, I’m expecting him to hit.
I’m also expecting him to restore order to the lineup.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm expecting him to be really bad for a month or so
and then respectable, with a few hot steaks. i don’t expect to see a lot of power.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jun 28, 2009 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Honestly
Expect him to blow chuncks…he had a dislocated right shoulder – I dont think we will see the normal Ramirez this year at all
I saw you in that coffee shop, breaking the fifth commandment. Congress passes these things for a reason, Lois.
by hansman1982 on Jun 28, 2009 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think he will suck
or be the 2nd coming of Albert Pujols. He’ll probably be in the middle. I hope the added pressure of him having to be the savior won’t affect him, have him trying to much and putting even MORE pressure on the others who are stifling under it.
How many times does a player have a major injury and simply pick up where they left off? The first 2-3 weeks will be like ST again. I hope he can drive in some timely runs and help this team relax. Just by having back at the hot corner wil be a big plus.
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
see Houston Astros of 05 or Marlins of 03
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 7:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Astros and Marlins
I remember that Jack McKeon being named manager started the Marlins on their tear, but did anything happen to the Astros in 2005 that got them going?
Yep.
Rockies won 17 of their last 20 games.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Recall in 2007 that the Rockies were 4 behind San Diego
on Sept 20 – and won the division in a playoff game after the season ended. They then swept Arizona & the Phillies in the Division & Championship Series. This from a mediocre team that spent most of that season in 4th & 5th place.
As far as I am concered it ain’t over ‘till it’s over, cause crazy shi*t always happens in this game.
Rockies won 21 of their last 22. If that isn't flipping a switch, I don't know what is
And this years Cubs are a better team, with a better manager
Albert Pujols for Cubs Starting 1B in 2012
Rockies were an exception, not the norm.
But, sure, it could happen.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jun 28, 2009 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Especially with that avatar
Was it over when the Germans attacked Pearl Harbor?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Forget it, he's rolling
Boy oh boy oh boy
by BleedsbluinMI on Jun 28, 2009 7:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Classic Bob Brenly today...
1. “How can anyone complain or be concerned about Jake Fox playing left field, when that’s the type of defense we get every day out there?” (After a play Fonzie seemed to give up on)
2. “The White Sox say he’s the SS of the future, but Ramirez is absolutely terrified of contact around second base and will do anything to avoid it.”
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
Actually, the White Sox radio announcers said the same thing about Ramirez and about Fonzie....
So it is obvious to the most casual observer :-)
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Not really sure
While my head says the 2009 Cubs are pretty much shot despite being only 3.5 games back, my heart says it’s not insurmountable. This division is up for grabs, but the Cubs have not shown they can do what it takes to make gains. You can fill a team with All-Stars, but you can’t always expect good things to happen. Instead, what you’ve got is a giant payroll with just about nothing to show for it. The Cubs are skidding towards a fourth or fifth place finish in the division, but that may not happen if they actually play up to their level of talent. Just remember that their record shows more about what kind of team they are than the level of talent on the field.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Is this Ace from ESPN.com?
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions
The one in the same head case
Often imitated, but there’s only one Ace Venom.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Lol. It's me, TyHoward24.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Well ain't that somethin?
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Lol, yep, it sure is. Too many damn trolls, so I left.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
See...
The Yankees of the last 10 years.
I saw you in that coffee shop, breaking the fifth commandment. Congress passes these things for a reason, Lois.
by hansman1982 on Jun 28, 2009 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Hope for Bradley
consider the 2004 season: Bradley was traded to the Dodgers just days before the season after getting into a fight with the manager. Expectations were pretty high after a .321/.421/.501 the year prior. He was switching from the AL to the NL.
In April and May, Milt put up a .246/.343/.402, then things got worse in June with a 120/ .185 /.200 line and had the infamous ball-throwing meltdown.
However, after that, Uncle Milty put up a 406 /.465 /.656 in July and finished with a respectable, while unspectacular season line of 276/ .370/ .447.
NB: his season ended early after another tirade tore his knee up. But still, he has struggled early with new teams/leagues and come out ok. So maybe there is hope. I guess I’ll be patient, because booing/lamenting won’t help, and we’re stuck with him for 2.5 more years.
DEJESUS!!!
Well then, maybe some other team knows this and can trade for him.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I don't think
trading him now would be a wise move.
DEJESUS!!!
Why?
He has shown ZERO signs of turning things around.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Unless he forgot completely
how to play baseball, or he’s injured, he’ll turn it around. He has way too much track record of being a very, very good hitter to think this is his new norm. I posted above that in 04 he had a very similar April-June and then had a monster July and played relatively well the rest of teh way.
If we traded him now, we’d be paying most of his salary and getting nothing of substance in return. If we wait, maybe he’ll improve and we can either trade him for something better or take advantage of his production. If he has forgotten how to play baseball, we can trade him for nothing and pay his salary in another year or so.
DEJESUS!!!
I'll re-examine my thoughts about Bradley after the All-Star break.
That gives him 13 games to show me something.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I don't think he has forgotten anything and he's a very talented player.
But he may not be able to deal with the pressure here and to me that’s the issue (and that was the issue with him before they signed him). He’s going to have his injuries and miss some games but if he can’t put it together mentally here then he may never produce here like he is capable. He should have sought $30 million from a market with less pressure but there probably weren’t any $30 million sure thing offers from small markets.
This would be a stunning turnaround for MB.
I hope tat it happens but I am not counting on it. He doesn’t appear to want to play in the Chicago pressure cooker and he doesn’t have to produce for his next contract.
Any word on when Aramis starts minor-league rehab?
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
hell probably start sometime this week, he just took some more BP today
by jesus christos on Jun 28, 2009 7:39 PM CDT up reply actions
enough with the frickin bp
get his ass out there…and yes I know this irrational but its how I really feel.
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
do that before he's ready
and you risk injuring him even more significantly.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed on that
If it’s irrationa, DC, why the hairy frick are you suggesting it? Do better next time.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
We still have some hope that he'll be back before the ASB. Doubt it, but it's possible.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Can the Cubs please start a winning streak tomorrow?
that would make me extremely happy.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
Chemistry vs. Numbers
I’m starting the think that the two might go hand in hand. Having “the right mix” may bring out a little extra in players, and conversely having a lineup full of .800 or better OPSs makes for positive, “pick each other up” dugout and clubhouse. Chicken and egg stuff.
Another interesting thought I had – supposing there are two players available with similar career numbers (again, let’s use OPS). Let’s say their ages are relatively similar, give or take a year or two. Let’s even say for the sake of Lou that they both bat from the same side of the plate. Given all that, does it still make a difference which one of the two you pick for your lineup? Can Player A be a better fit despite his statistics being identical to Player B?
Part of the reason why the Cubs did so well in 2008
It seemed as if everyone clicked at the right time and everything went right up until September and crashed and burned in October.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Let's get this crash and burning out of the way now...
And heat up around July through October.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
All we need
Is our version of the Manny trade. The big problem is that our outfield is loaded.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Yes, all we need
is to get the best hitter in baseball.
DEJESUS!!!
I like that idea...
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions
This year
someone new seems to step up to be the goat every day. If the starting pitching is good, the bullpen blows it. If the pitching is good, nobody hits. That, and everyone is having a reverse-career year.
Last season many played at career-best levels, and there was a new hero daily.
Whoever compared this season to 04 nailed it.
DEJESUS!!!
I compared it to '05...
But I’m staying optimistic and hoping 2009 plays itself out in it’s own unique and hopefully positive way.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 7:52 PM CDT up reply actions
And we hit with two outs, something this years team has a lot of difficulty doing.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:53 PM CDT up reply actions
You can do that?
I didn’t get a copy of that memo. I’ve been having problems with my TPS reports too.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Caption
Z: I don’t know Geo, the girl behind the backstop looks like a 10 to me.
Geo: No, she’s definitely an 8.
"Check the magic of a winning season and there are always reasons beyond the talent." Ned Colleti
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jun 28, 2009 7:49 PM CDT reply actions
thats too chill. even for me
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions
My Caption
Zambrano: What do you mean I have something caught between my teeth?
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Cubs Run Differential is currently 0
We’ve given up as many as we’ve scored.
Apologies if saying “we” gets on your nerves.
Bryce Harper here we come?
kidding of course, but this does not look like a playoff team despite many in the media reassurance we’ll still win the division
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
I read Wojo's column on ESPN yesterday and he said...
…even though we are struggling, we will win the division. He went on a soap box in the entire article, then proceeded to say the Cubs were going to win the Central. Made no sense to me.
Chicago Cubs > Milwaukee Brewers
by CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry on Jun 28, 2009 7:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Ive read that a few places
like its a forgone conclusion, mostly b/c of our pitching, so they say.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Caption
No, I had no idea where the hell that ball was going. But I did save money on car insurance by switching to Geico.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 7:56 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Win!
I’m not Al, but I think we have a winner.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
+1 rec'd
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm sure Toronto could part with Kevin Millar
He’s no DeRosa when it comes to changing water to wine, but I hear tell he helps keep the clubhouse loose. ;-)
Sigh.
Yes, I did. His performance, clearly, wouldn’t make him worth it.
But someone suggested the Blue Jays might be willing to part with Marco Scutaro. Might be worth it.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I saw the Scutaro suggestion, and it's not a bad one
Another guy having a quiet but decent year is Adam Kennedy with Oakland. .285 BA, .350ish OBP, can play 3rd, and OMG he bats lefty!
Interesting.
Kennedy is almost certainly available.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
really hot start
cool last month though. It would be a reverse DeRosa (as in ex-Card who they probably should have kept).
Well, that didn't take long... ;-)
“This will be the last time Mark DeRosa will be mentioned by me on this site, until the Cubs play the Cardinals.”
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
I was at the game and I thought........
Soriano’s play in left was shaky at best again
"We got some pretty good chemistry here. We got some toughness, and it's starting to show." - Lou Pinella
PHOTO CAPTION
Zambrano:
“I’m not sure if I feel anything yet, man. How fast does this stuff kick in?”
Geo:
“It’s creeper, man. Give it a minute.”
"You have to have short-term memory, no matter who you are in this game. There's always tomorrow." ~Derrek Lee
It's creeper... Ha. LOL.
I'm a truth teller, I'm a risk taker, I'm like Johnny Cash - I walk the line...
by Jimmyeatworld on Jun 28, 2009 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe the Cubs should do their annual rookie "hazing" now instead of waiting for the end of the season
That ought to loosen things up a bit.
FWIW: here’s what the Reds did to their rookies on a getaway day at Wrigley back in 2004.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Really need to
get that collapse function back.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
I can think of six guys that would agree with you...
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
hahaha...excellent
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on Jun 28, 2009 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Caption
Z: Who took this picture of us?
S: Huh.
Z: I said, "Who took this picture of us?"
S: Huh!
Z: What?
S: Huh.
Z: If you can’t hear me, take your mask off. Who is the photographer?
S: Who is on first.
Z: I don’t know.
S: Third base!
"Any old kind of a run wins it!"--Jack Brickhouse
The day the Cubs start to chilax is the day they will start to play and win consistently
I have a feeling that they just want to prove to everybody that all the hype was deserved. Easier said than done though.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
I think you're right.
So exactly how are they going to accomplish that, with players and a manager as tightassed as they come right now?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Gotta change things up a bit.....Some teams change managers. Some teams trade for
players (e.g., Manny). Some teams get rid of players (e.g., Barrett).
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
we made several trades and where did that get us?
"We got some pretty good chemistry here. We got some toughness, and it's starting to show." - Lou Pinella
If Bradley is as bad as people think he is
i guess he’s gotta go. Hendry is a really creative GM. I think he can find something in his bag of tricks if it ever gets to that point.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions
They should all got out
and get drunk together. Seriously.
DEJESUS!!!
make sure to do it
in a dumpster-free zone.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Tightassed...
Thanks Al, that’s the first time I’ve laughed in a while. Although, it seems Lou would be looseassed because all he does is sit on the bench with his thumb up there waving his arms saying “What can I do?”
Maybe we better not ask where that thumb has been.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I'm not giving up on Bradley just yet but if there's a way
to get rid of him and somehow get Dunn, I think the move has to be made. I’ll admit i was a bradley supporter from the get go, but I totally overlooked Dunn’s consistency. 40 HRs and 100 RBIs are pretty damn good, and you could probably add a few more to the totals playing at Wrigley. :( I wish Hendry saw this.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
I like MB...but let's say that he's bad for "chemistry"....in that case....
who in MLB will take him away from us? Anyone have any ideas?
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
I don't know what we would get in return but
the teams i see trading for Bradley: NYM, NYY, DET, LAA
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions
well people said he was bad for team chemistry
before the cubs signed him, but that didn’t stop hendry from overpaying him. i don’t really have any good answers to your question of who exactly would take him, but i should think that there has to be some team out there willing to take the chance
plenty of people
said he was an excellent team player as well.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions
If MB wants to be in a place...
where no one will pay attention to him. DC would be the perfect fit.
Visit bloggingthebracket.com, SBNation's bracketology/hoops rambling site!
by Chris Dobbertean on Jun 28, 2009 8:47 PM CDT up reply actions
the only thing would be the money
i could actually see the nats do a dunn for bradley swap with the cubs giving them some young pitching
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree.
It actually makes some sense. Bradley, presumably, would hit with the pressure off him in DC. The Nats could get some young pitching, which they need (Ascanio? Stevens?). And the Cubs would get a RF who would rake AND stay in the lineup every day.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
anything is possible.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 8:58 PM CDT up reply actions
The big issue with the Nats...
is the GM situation. When Bowden was running the show, he was willing to take on troubled players (Elijah Dukes, anyone?), but with him out of the picture, maybe the philosophy’s changed.
Then again, it is the Nats…
Visit bloggingthebracket.com, SBNation's bracketology/hoops rambling site!
by Chris Dobbertean on Jun 28, 2009 9:03 PM CDT up reply actions
I think Bradley has burned enough bridges
No one is going to want to take him now. The worst case scenario is to just pay him to play somewhere else.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
I Think MLBT
has an article stating the Nats are trying to get rid of their players that carry baggage?? MB might not fit there.
I can see the Mets taking him ….
by cozmotaylor123 on Jun 28, 2009 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions
It appears
they are trying to change the philosophy here in DC then.
It’s so hard to tell with that franchise.
Visit bloggingthebracket.com, SBNation's bracketology/hoops rambling site!
by Chris Dobbertean on Jun 28, 2009 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe because they could equalize contracts getting rid of Dunn...
… and pick up a couple of pitching prospects.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Still...
I cannot see anybody wanting that guy with the way he’s played, and his history. He should have stayed in Texas, he seemed comfortable there. Plus, there’s the DH.
Agreed.
Still, there are always teams that say, “We can fix that”. They’re never right, but they say it anyway.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Yes, I agree that here are teams that will say they can fix it...
…or try and deal with it. But the issue is the contract term and salary to me, so it’s more whether the Cubs will et that contract for the other team or one of those other teams has a similar bad deal that the Cubs will swap.
and we can save money
by not buying Dunn a glove, either. Because there’s no point.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I wish MB would hit a walkoff HR
soon. I think that would go a long way to relax him and the team, AND the fans.
But then again, I thought the last laugher we had would relax us. We went right back to scuffling the next game.
This year’s Cubs are really hard to figure out. I hope the starting pitching will hold up long enough for us to sort this out and put a stranglehold on the division.
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
Lou wants to manage a team, not 25 guys
he wants them all to be journeymen, no issues, just go out on the field and do your job. And in an ideal world, that would be the way it is.
But some of these people are kids, or if not kids, people who need a mentor. Somebody who would make the difference just with a couple guys and knit the fabric of this team together so that in the end whether going through injuries or the personal challenges, they can deal with anything and win.
Maybe that person was Ramirez, he’s in his 30’s, been around for awhile, been in Chicago for awhile. I would like to think that Derek is that guy, too, but maybe not for everybody.
Read this blog post by the Seattle Times beat writer and tell me that the difference between the Mariners and the Cubs right now isn’t their managers, and/or that the Mariners have somebody like Griffey. And I hate to say it but right now, watching both teams, the Mariners have a worse team, but more character than the Cubs. And they’re winning, for now, maybe not for long, but certainly progress, building, and they’ll contend.
Lou has to deal with it or winning will be all that much harder. This may be a stretch, but it sure seems that for all Lou’s experience, Don Wakamatsu in his first year is out managing him by what he’s getting out of his team.
Fundamentals are a crutch for the talentless. -- Kenny Powers
I think Phil Rogers is a horrible writer.
He should just cover everything except the Cubs.
I know Zambrano is crazy but seriously
I offer this proposition for Jim Hendry: First thing Monday morning, put Zambrano on waivers. If anyone claims him and the $62.75 million left on his contract which runs through 2012, immediately trade him for whatever is being offered, from a bag of balls to a 32-year-old minor-leaguer.
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
Phil Rogers wrote that?
That’d be a -1 on his plus-minus ledger.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
yup
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 28, 2009 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions
You can read the full article
And Rogers starts his proposition by saying
Proving that I did not attend Kellogg, Wharton or even the Acme School of Business, I offer this proposition for Jim Hendry:
Further, I will go against this grain here, and say that Rogers point is dead on. It seems obvious to me from the tenor of his op-ed that his suggestion to waive Zambrano is slightly tongue-in-cheek… but his larger point about how Z has continually let us down… let us down much more than he has saved this team’s neck… is valid and well made.
We needed Big Z today. He failed to keep his mind on the task. Typical.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
To his defense...
We got shut down today. He could’ve pitched 9 innings of 1-run ball and we still would’ve lost.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 10:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I nominate that for the most useless suggestion of the year award
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Dumbest. Idea. EVER.
Maybe not…but it’s damn close.
Visit bloggingthebracket.com, SBNation's bracketology/hoops rambling site!
by Chris Dobbertean on Jun 28, 2009 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Just covering myself...
as I am prone to hyperbole. :)
Visit bloggingthebracket.com, SBNation's bracketology/hoops rambling site!
by Chris Dobbertean on Jun 28, 2009 9:06 PM CDT up reply actions
What?
Really?
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on Jun 28, 2009 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions
He gets progressively worse...
Like Sam Smith. Just stick to your “power rankings” and ridiculous trade scenarios.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 9:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Is he as bad on radio...
as Sam is? Smith always used to put me to sleep when he would go on Tony Kornheiser’s show.
Visit bloggingthebracket.com, SBNation's bracketology/hoops rambling site!
by Chris Dobbertean on Jun 28, 2009 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
He's pretty bad on Chicago Tribune Live...
Especially when he starts applying his absurd logic and ideas to the Bulls and Bears.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions
whut?
seriously? that’s utterly asinine.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Just wonderin'....
Is Phil Rogers aware that teams cannot place players with full NTCs on revocable waivers without their prior written consent? (It is regarded as the same thing as a trade, which can’t be made without the player’s consent.) The only thing Hendry can do is put him on unconditional release waivers; no waiver-based trade is possible.
I agree with the concept that the double-standard Lou has between Gameboard and Z must be stopped, but it would be nice with he would offer Hendry a suggestion he can actually implement.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
Read the article.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
I did.
That’s why I made the comment I did — he is suggesting something that violates MLB rules.
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
I don't believe
the point of his article was to highlight the intricacies of MLB transactions and their accompanying rules.
I believe his point was more about Zambrano’s glaring inability to provide leadership to this team.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
Then he should talk about that
instead of coming up with idiotic ideas.
by jerry morales rules on Jun 29, 2009 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions
Perhaps...
or maybe he finds the indignation above to be no more than pedantic quibbling.
Obviously I wouldn’t speak for Phil, but it does strike me as a possibility… because that is exactly what I would call it.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
Who else could we possibly trade for...
Some people mentioned Scutaro, how about Adam Kennedy? Putting up some decent numbers, he’s a lefty, possibly lead-off, and is in the last year of his contract with the A’s.
Someday we'll go all the way...
Risky.
Kennedy’s having the best year of his career, by far. Risk: he’ll stop.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
apply
that same logic to Bradley, and that’s why I don’t want to trade him.
DEJESUS!!!
That's reverse logic.
Much easier to STOP hitting than to START.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Scrappy.....
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 28, 2009 10:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Al
Are you aware that Tony LaRussa benched Kennedy last year in favor of…
Aaron Miles???
"I've never complained about it. I'm thankful to have a jersey." Mark DeRosa, 22 Aug 2007
I was unfortunately at todays game.
We looked awful. Todays crowd was very rowdy compared to Fridays. We had a big fight break out in the section behind us in the upper deck. Two Cubs fans kicked the CRAP out of a Sox fan. Another fight broke out below us, right behind the Cubs dugout. At one point someone throw a beer at someone else in the crowd and it landed in Cubs bullpen. Marmol got soaked and did not look happy.
Everyone has bad apples in their fan base, certainly we do. But of all the games I’ve ever been to, Sox fans are the worst. They seem to take more joy in the Cubs losing than their own team winning. It seemed like 1 out of every 3 shirts was anti-Cubs. My gf (Sox fan) was pretty embarrassed by her fellow fans, I couldn’t blame her.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
Hmmm.
Where I was, in the RF corner, it was pretty peaceful. Yesterday, in the LF bleachers, there were so many drunk idiots — both Cub AND Sox fans — who simply refused to sit down, it was ridiculous.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
No excuse to throw beer on someone
But it’s not like fans are lining up to buy Marmol a beer either.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Yeah I don't think it was aimed at Marmol.
But for a split second there, it looked like things could get out of control and the Cubs bullpen was going to get into it with the fans. Luckily security ushered them under some cover quickly.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
"they seem to...
take more joy in the cubs losing than their own team winning"…that is because they are completely aware that their team will forever play in the shadows of the chicago cubs. it does not matter what either team does, the white sox will always be lower on the totem pole of chicago power. if you think about it, that would be extremely frustrating as a sox fan
Oh it's classic little man syndrome.
Sorta sad because they’ve got some good long history, a nice stadium, and some passionate fans. Really makes me appreciate Cardinals fans (I can’t believe I just said that). Although we have a bitter rivalry, they seem to be a little bit mature about it.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
i have lived in saint louis for five years now
and i definitely appreciate cardinals fans so much more than white sox fans (and almost more than fans of any other team in mlb). cubs/cardinals is a great rivalry. that being said, screw the redbirds
I think it starts with Pujols...
He’s probably the best player in baseball, he plays the game the right way, and he’s actually a likeable guy (except when he’s killing us).
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Totally agree
rumors around here, though, are that pujols has voiced some frustration with the cardinals franchise since the departure of jocketty. he has apparently said some things about keeping his options open once his contract runs up
Probably just a front...
By getting “that guy from Cleveland” and now rumors of Holliday or Dye, it seems like they’re trying to do what it takes to win.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 9:20 PM CDT up reply actions
well
except that guy from cleveland is, at the moment, a four month rental. Let’s see if they resign him.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions
neither do I
which is why I don’t think it affects Puhjol’s long-term plans.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 9:45 PM CDT up reply actions
If that happens
We’re doomed.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Cardinals fans are much more tolerable
than White Sox or Brewers fans.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions
There are some good ones
I’ve met them at Miller Park. Great folks. But they’re outnumbered but the drunken, frat-boy, “Cubs Suck” fans, unfortunately.
There are many meathead Cubs fans, too, and when they get together with the meathead Brewers fans, it ain’t pretty.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I always thought...
Brewers fans were just borderline Cubs fans until their team started to get better. Taking trips up to Milwaukee in ’04 and ’05, I remember Miller Park being overwhelmingly Cubs fans (locals too).
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jun 28, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions
i didnt even know the brewers had fans until 2007/2008
by jesus christos on Jun 28, 2009 9:26 PM CDT up reply actions
my roommate in college was a brewer fan
he says the older generation in milwaukee likes the brewers, but there are really very few die-hards amongst the younger milwaukee/wisconsin crowd.
Hey, that sounds
like a typical Cubs/Padres tilt at Petco.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jun 28, 2009 9:55 PM CDT up reply actions
My two cents
I just finished watching the game. I missed it live as I was out scouting Carmen Pignatiello today as he faced the always tough Kansas City T-Bones. Pignatiello got beat up badly, but no I wasn’t actually there to scout him just there for family fun.
I’d like to think that this series win will propel the Sox, but as evidenced by all the talk of how the Cubs coming back and beating the Sox would propel the Cubs has been extinguished. I’ll believe it when I see it. These Crosstown games are intense for the fans and teams but the lasting effects and how they propel teams, I’m not sold on that.
Both teams are frustrating. The Sox defense is indefensible. The Cubs defense is better perhaps (but was sure ugly today.) Both teams love to strand runners on base.
The good news for the Cubs is that the teams in front of the Cubs don’t have the pitching the Cubs do. IF the Cubs could only start hitting and get improvements in the bullpen they will easily overtake those in front of them. The Cubs on paper have the best team in the NL Central and hopefully for my Cub fans friends things turn around, quickly.
The bad news for the Sox is that Detroit is better than the Sox this year, at least so far. IF Detroit stumbles and IF the Sox fire on all cylinders then yes the could win the division but I’m not betting on it at at this point.
Can’t say I feel bad about watching the Schaumburg Flyers with my family today. Interleague is over except for the make-up game. Good.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
I'm also glad interleague is over...
Back to games that actually affect the division and/or wild card standings.
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on Jun 28, 2009 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions
I've been kind of meh about this series this year.
There’s been a couple of classic games in there (yesterday’s Sox walkoff and the Cubs comeback at Wrigley), but for the most part I think these two teams look about the same this year, so it’s hard to cheer about who is the tallest midget. I look forward to meaningful divisional games.
"You have to have short-term memory, no matter who you are in this game. There's always tomorrow." ~Derrek Lee
Yeah that great Cub pitching really showed itself the last two games!
I think Dempster needs to walk a few more guys! What a joke! Not a big game pitcher by a long shot and we’re paying him $13 million for 3 more wonderful years. Zambrano is no ace or stopper either, he’s never consistent or levelheaded. The fact is, we have no ace on this staff, just some 2s and 3s. The bullpen is even worse. Can’t wait to see DeRosa driving in big runs for STL to drive us further down in the standings, thanks for nothing, Mr. Hendry!!
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:00 PM CDT up reply actions
There's nothing about this team besides Jake Freakin Fox to get excited about!
Is there?
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
3.5 games back
on June 28th. I think that’s something to be somewhat satisfied with.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Having gone through
as much shit luck as they’ve gone through, I’m certainly thankful.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions
amen
I keep hoping that one day, Bradley, or Sori, or Fonty will wake up and say “huh. I just need to do THIS.” And it will all come together, just like an A-Team plan.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Fonty?
Mna, I forgot about him. When was the last time he drove in a meaningful run?
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
each and every run
is meaningful. There is no reason to make a distinction.
" I hate that lady , but would totally do her. So strange is this mind of mens." - Skisgaar Skwigelf
by Rage and Grace on Jun 28, 2009 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe, if we had shown any inclination to play a weeks worth of games once
without dumb walks by both starters and relievers and without lousy at bats and dumb baserunning. This team has shown no killer instinct and will rue the day they traded DeRosa since he’s now a Redbird.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
RUE THE DAY!
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh, Christ
I’m ruing the day you learned to use a computer, Itchy.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Jun 28, 2009 10:29 PM CDT up reply actions
I rue reading your comments!!
And, I was writing software for these things before the internet existed.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
Zambrano is no ace or stopper either, he’s never consistent or levelheaded.
Zambrano does have the pitching “stuff” to be an ace and a stopper, however I’m not sure he has the mental stuff to fill that role or roles.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
You nailed it.
How long do we have to wait for him to be a #1 pitcher?
by PalatineRol on Jun 28, 2009 10:05 PM CDT up reply actions
tough trade
Teams wait and hope to develop a talent like Zambrano. It would be awfully tough to trade that type of talent away.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
You need a 1
I’d rather have a true #1 and 4 #3s.
You’d win a lot of games that way.
There is no infinity button for failing in sports. At some point, things turn. They always do. - Bill Simmons
Good commentary.
Dr. Crawdad. “Proving that while slow and dangerous behind the wheel, White Sox fans still do serve a purpose.” :)
Just kidding of course. I think you’re probably right about most of that. We’ll see what the Tigers do. They have issues like everyone, but are playing pretty well.
And I agree: I’m glad inter-league is (mostly) over. I want to divisional games so we can start to hash out the races….
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Obviously the soccer game was way more entertaining
So what else is going on? Things good on your side?
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
Names that I think could be available (some names have already been mentioned on this site):
Randy Flores, Clint Barmes, Ryan Spilborghs, Kevin Kouzmanoff, Scott Schoeneweis, Jon Rauch, Chad Qualls, Chad Tracy, Jonathan Sanchez, Randy Winn, Fred Lewis, Adam Dunn, Joe Beimal, John Lannan, Christian Guzman, Jorge Cantu, Dan Uggla, Jeremy Hermida, Kiko Calero, Brad Ziegler, Orlando Cabrera, Adam Kennedy, Russell Branyon, Mark Lowe, Matt Herges, Rafael Perez, Juan Cruz, Mark Teahan, Ron Mahey, George Sherrill, Aubrey Huff, Melvin Mora, Ty Wigginton, Luke Scott, Kevin Millar, Marco Scutaro, Jason Frasor, Brian Tallet,
Some of them are questionable
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
If obtaining any of these bums means trading away any of our few minor league studs,
just forget it!
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
trades
Really there are only a few teams that are out of it and looking to trade right now—Cleve., Wash,. Ariz.
We should be looking to them and ummmm, there isn’t much there to trade for.
One name that came up early last off season in the right field/bats left discussion and then disappeared was Mark Teahan. That could have really helped us when Rami got hurt. He doesn’t make a lot of money and he could still help.
by PalatineRol on Jun 28, 2009 10:02 PM CDT up reply actions
correction
MOST of them are questionable
by PalatineRol on Jun 28, 2009 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions
nah
Milton ...... see the ball hit the ball
by lexmarklover on Jun 29, 2009 8:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Outside of Vitters...
only Josh could tell us who’s untouchable. I don’t remember that many studs.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jun 28, 2009 9:57 PM CDT reply actions
Don't trade Vitters, please!!
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
Time for Some Bold Moves: 3 for sure, and 4th and 5th even bolder moves to build a future pitching dynasty.
I wholeheartedly agree that this version of the Cubs is fast sinking and stinking ala the 2007 and 2004 Cubs.
1. Replace Lou with Alan Trammell and bring up Ryne Sandberg as bench coach.
2. Trade for Carl Crawford. Give the Rays almost anything they want, but include Milton Bradley.
3. Get the Ricketts family in Wrigley as new owners NOW!
This season has already all of the earmarks of a disaster. Last place is not out of the question with the current performance, and lack of team cohesiveness. Sloppy defensive play, and lack of hitting with RISP is going to insure a last place finish, unless some bold moves occur now.
Expendable with Bradley for the Crawford trade: Jeff Smardzja; Jake Fox; Sean Marshall; Rich Harden; Aaron Miles; and possibly Carlos Marmol. Let the Rays take their pick of Bradley and Harden plus any of the others, except Marmol; If they want Marmol too, then negotiate for one of their best prospects, or spare infileders.
The Rays are close to the Wildcard spot, and probably will not make it without some changes. Bradley already considered Tama as his off-season choice. Considering a Cubs last place finish on the horizon, none of the above trade possibilities would be greatly missed, given a Cubs turn-around for the Wildcard or Division title.
The clubhouse with Alan Trammell’s leadership, and Ryno’s presence would improve 2000%!
Lou has not proven the strategic giant that was thought when he was hired. The last six playoff game fiascos
prove his inability to move this team to the next level. Even Dusty had the Cubs on the brink of going to the WS!
With the Rickett’s family in charge, the nonsense of the Trib circus will be over. Hendry would have to prove his worth by completing this bold trade, and if not would also be on his way out. Bob Brenly could easily takeover as GM for the remainder of the season.
4. & 5. My final and most controversial last changes would be to hire Mike Marshall as our pitching coach – Larry R. needs to follow Lou out the door too.
A genuine post-season championship team can still be assembled. The Rickett’s family can usher in the new era of Cubs baseball with a World Series Championship. This is whay they are purchasing this team. How can they afford to do anythng less than get this job done ASAP.
Someday…: a few BOLD moves away or another season of great hope and promise wasted due to wrong moves and even worse leadership!
Someday…
by GeneticCubsFan on Jun 28, 2009 10:33 PM CDT reply actions
so, after you've crippled the bullpen
and violated the bankrupcy proceedings, what bold moves will you make next?
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 28, 2009 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions
pick up papelbon, pujols, and the zombie of babe ruth
by jesus christos on Jun 28, 2009 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions
The bullpen is crippled by default with Hendry, Lou, and Rothschild in charge!
Mike Marshall can and will be able to assemble and coach what we already have into the most effective pen in the League!
Violated the bankruptcy proceedings?! I thought that was already done by Hendry, Zell, and the Tribco brass that signed off on the Bradley, DeRosa, and Wood moves!
In case you haven’t been around the Cubs history too long, there was also the era of P.K Wrigley and his bankrupt College of Coaches!
The Cardinals won the 2006 WS with a much weaker pen, and probably will march toward another post-season opportuity unless the Cubs wake up and “bankrupt” their current leadership!
Someday…
by GeneticCubsFan on Jun 28, 2009 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Ok...
Your ideas arent the best…
1. While We havent won the World Series we have gone from jokes of theNL Central to back-to-back NL Central titles – hell 12 more and call the team the Atlanta Braves and people will love sweet Bobby…err I mean Lou.
2. Getting rid of Wood was a great move – he had his career year and we sold high as so many people are wanting to do with Harden just we have a bit of a sentimental connection to Wood, hell I love Prior too and hated to see him go.
3. Are we going to platoon Crawford and Soriano?? Only 54 career games or 136 career innings at cf and none elsewhere.
Basically if we have any hope we need Jake Fox and Sean Marshall. Ramirez is going to suck for at least 2 months after he gets back if not the rest of the year.
4.
I saw you in that coffee shop, breaking the fifth commandment. Congress passes these things for a reason, Lois.
by hansman1982 on Jun 28, 2009 11:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Mike Marshall?
No way. First of all, most baseball teams blackballed him years ago. He is 66 years old — older than Lou — and probably ready to retire.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
YES! "Doc" Mike Marshall!
OK Al, you scoff at his age, and probably effectiveness.
I have posted Jeff Passan’s Yahoo article from May 2007 before on BCB. I was at Mike Marshall’s 2nd Annual Pitching Research Clinic when Passan had just written his article, and the young pitchers there were reading and discussing it.
I talked extensively with Doc and Jeff Sparks. I saw Jeff Sparks pitch effectively when he had just finished an 8 hour security guard job with the flu, and show up Sunday morning due to his loyalty and devotion to Doc, and the commitment he made to be at the clinic!
Sparks was the best relief pitcher I saw anywhere in 2007! He could have been effectively pitching in ANY MLB pen…ahh but then there is the stigma, and blackballing by MLB.
My signoff, ‘Someday…’ not only refers to my beloved Cubbies, but also Doc’s methods becoming mainstream as an accepted scientific, effective, injurious-free approach to pitching.
BTW:
Bobby Cox is 68; Casey Stengel managed until he was 75; Connie Mack was 62 when he won the WS in 1930; Jack McKeon was 73 as WS manager in 2003; Leo Mazzone was 60 when he left the O’s; Ron Perranoski finished as pitching coach with the Giants at age 63; Mel Stottlemyre was 64 as pitching coach for the Yankees, and 67 when he ended his coaching with the Mariners in 2008.
NONE of the above managers or pitching coaches have the scientific plus applied pitching skills and knowledge that Mike Marshall possesses.
And WHY was he blackballed? First, due to his scientific approach to pitching that flies in the face of “traditional non-scientific” pitching coaches. Second, because he offered a fair settlement to MLB labor negotiations when he was pitching for the Mets; but his settlement ideas were threatening to the free agent lawyers who did not want to get cut out of their 10 or 15% cut for representing players in negotiations. Oh, and one of the top law firms involved in representing players just happened to be a relative of the MLB Players Union President!
The contract was settled without any of Mike’s ideas included, and the next day, the Mets released Mike – he never played for another MLB team after that.
Here is Jeff Passan’s article link:
Someday the Cubs will have a new owner; and just maybe, Someday a baseball owner with guts and an open-minded scientific view of baseball will bring Mike Marshall’s methods, if not the geriatric Doc himself, to the real modern era of baseball!
I hear that Keven Costner is starting a new independent league team in Lake County next year. Perhaps his Field of Dreams will be smart enough to seek out the “ancient” Doc Marshall to bring scientific “magic” and enlightenment, plus cost-effective pitching and training methods to baseball!
Obviously, Jim Hendry and the Cubs are too smart and have plenty of trades they can make to find the cure for a World Series caliber pitching corps, rather than give Mike Marshall a chance!
Someday…
by GeneticCubsFan on Jul 1, 2009 4:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Another "old" Doc Marshall's 12 year old's video
showing how an ancient blackballed scientific pitching coach has nothing effective left to help teach any pitching staff, let alone a young kid!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZtSU37OrC4
Click on more of the videos on Doc’s site to see the progression of this young man’s “non-traditional” pitching effectiveness!
Someday…
by GeneticCubsFan on Jul 1, 2009 5:35 AM CDT up reply actions
so… we have no chance because we have a terrible bullpen, but the cardinals won it all with a worse pen?
I think maybe you have a logic circuit in backwards.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Sending Bradley to Tama would be OK if they would take him,
but I think that Tampa is his “Final Destination”!
Sorry about the typo, but it is befitting the typo that Bradley and Hendry plus the Tribco brass signed off on during the off-season!
Come to think about it, the “off-season” for the Cubs has never ended – going back to the NLDS whimpering display of more mediocrity shown by Lou’s lack of strategic leadership.
Someday…
by GeneticCubsFan on Jun 28, 2009 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions
why do you think Tampa would...
a) want Bradley after what he’s shown so far this year, and
b) give up by and far their best player to do so?
I’m sorry, but Shark, Fox, Marshall, Harden, Miles? And possibly Marmol? Of that group, only Marshall comes close to being a dependable player that will give you some return on investment. Shark really hasn’t proven anything yet, TB already has a Fox in Burrell (and probably a better one), Harden could break down any moment, and Miles…. well, I’m just going to assume you got caught up in the heat of the moment and threw his name in there out of habit.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Wait... what?
By far their best player? Crawford isn’t even one of their best three hitters, let alone players.
Yeah, I suppose "by and far" was a bit of a reach
Longoria and Pena are probably at the top of the list, and Zobrist has put up some incredible numbers. But The Colonel is no slouch – I think he leads the team in runs, steals, and hits.
I guess my real point was you can’t expect to go out and throw a bunch of junk at somebody and wow them with quantity to get one really good player.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
So by Bold, you really mean...
…implausible to the point of absurdity? Really, the only one that might be feasible is one. The others are laughable.
Ladies and gentlemen! It's 1985 all over again, but this time the offense goes to hell!
What is laughable
and feasible is your inability to read the entire thread, and comprehend the absurdity of your remarks.
Someday…
by GeneticCubsFan on Jul 1, 2009 4:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Trades
Our entire OF is making a fortune. If we’re waiting to find someone to take one of their contracts off us, we’ll probably have to wait for hell to freeze over. We can whine about Bradley all we want, but I can’t see us getting rid of him. That’s especially true with the sale of the team still pending. The best we can probably hope for is Johnson coming back and using him along with Fox and Hoffpaiur as platoon starters. That means Lou would actually be willing to platoon Sori, Bradley and Fuku. The problem is that Lou seems unwilling to actually do that on a regular basis.
When Aram comes back, Fontenot and Blanco platoon at 2B. Unfortunately we’ve determined that Fonty isn’t a full time option. He already has 240 AB. Last year he had a total of 284.
In the bullpen Guzman needs to move to Marmol’s slot. The relief WHIP this year is 1.52. Last year it was 1.33. And most of the difference is BB. We’ve scored 78 runs in innings 7-9 and surrendered 112. That’s a recipe for disaster and I can’t see how it will improve with the current staff. Relievers are cheaper than position players. That’s the area I’d look for Hendry to improve.
Finally, when is the last time you’ve seen an opposing pitcher throw inside on our hitters. Why aren’t our hitters expecting that? Today we had 9K and at least 8 of them were on pitches away. It’s not brain surgery.
If you like Selig's handling of the steroid issue, you'll love his choice for next Cub owner.
Eddie Robinson
Too bad that MLB doesn’t allow a team to simply tell a player to stay home like the NBA does. The Bulls decided that Eddie Robinson was a bad influence on his teammates so they told him to stay away from the team’s facilities. They had to pay him, but he was effectively removed from the team. Of course, the NBA is also the league with phantom injuries causing trips to the DL. Oh wait, what condition does Miles have now?
I suppose the Cubs COULD do that with Bradley.
But they won’t.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
It's either that
or pay Bradley to play somewhere else. Neither solution is a good one.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Just do it!
Every game he’s in the lineup is just more egg on the Cubs’ face. He has done nothing at the plate or in the field. The Cubs are a laughingstock for signing that knucklehead and it’s time to cut our losses!!
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
I was just watching
video of Lou on Len and Bob’s blog. He says petty soon he’s gonna have to put other people in the lineup. My question is what other people!? We have no bench to speak of and they aren’t hitting either.
He says that after every loss in which we don't score
he’s not going to change anything
by WanderingWanderer on Jun 29, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Should have thought of that before the season
In the wake of DeRosa’s contributions, Zobrist’s value is sky high right now. Give Hendry credit that he saw the value that a multi purpose guy like DeRosa could have on a team. Now all GM’s are looking for that type of player and Zobrist is beginning to look like one of the best guys in the league in that type of role.
by jerry morales rules on Jun 29, 2009 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm sorry, did you just say what I think you said?
“Give Hendry credit that he saw the value that a multi purpose guy like DeRosa could have on a team.”
Hendry saw so much value in having a player like that on the team, that he traded him away.
by WanderingWanderer on Jun 29, 2009 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions
He may have become lost along the way
That part I can’t explain. He may have outsmarted himself saying that if it happened with DeRosa it could happen with Miles.
by jerry morales rules on Jun 29, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Too bad Hendry got nothing useful for Mr Valuable, DeRosa!!
Time to start selling off guys and shitcan this season, there’s no way in hell that this team, as it’s currently constructed, is going to win anything.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
He did get something valuable
The stats of the three minor league pitchers that we got are all good. I don’t have the link, but check out the other DeRosa threads (I think that means all of the threads around here).
people clamoring for Ben Zobrist?
I thought this day would never come … and now that it has, I’m laughing my ass off.
Evil will always triumph, because good is dumb.
Yeah, that is kind of ugly...
Cubs fans are so desperate right now… it’s kind of sad.
Ladies and gentlemen! It's 1985 all over again, but this time the offense goes to hell!
yeah! Who wants a utility guy that's hit 16 homers, is hitting .287
and has even stolen 8 bases.
I understand you don’t know Zobrist well, but you look like a fool when you claim wanting a guy who has been extremely valuable to his team is sad
by WanderingWanderer on Jun 29, 2009 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
oooh 8 stolen bases
let me retract my initial comment and say that I’m now REALLY LAUGHING MY ASS OFF!
8 SBs!!! .287 average and 16 HRs! — this guy is a role player at best. c’mon man. we’ve got a whole team full of overpaid, under performing players (Rami aside at this point) and we’ve got people out there calling for Ben Zobrist (who two years ago was the equivalent of Asdrubal Cabrera) … the guy hit .155 and .253 in respective years prior to this one. i know, i know, he’s not an everyday player and you can’t project what he’ll do with a full season under his belt!
yeah, why not just call for Hendry to go out there and get us Skip Schumaker while he’s at it? are we that desperate yet? it sounds like it from some of you.
Evil will always triumph, because good is dumb.
Why did Hendry
ever think MB would be able to handle this city? I think that move will be the one that ultimately costs him his job. This is like watching a train wreck that has lasted 3 months.
For some reason I’m still excited to watch the Cubs tonight at 6, despite the fact that they haven’t been that likable, rarely score, have a bad bullpen…maybe I’m the idiot.
Chicago Cubs baseball is on the air...
Because it's a disease
It’s ok. It’s not your fault. . . .
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jun 29, 2009 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Who knows? It made no sense then and even less now!
But didn’t we get all these assurances from Hendry the Bradley is such a great guy in the clubhouse and he’s not a cancer and he’s really a high effort guy who gives 110%?? It was all total bullshit! Truth is, none of those things are true and the only reason he succeeded last year was that he was totally coddled by his Manager. The guy is a piece of sh*t!! Just ask Lou!!
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
proof
that he was “coddled” by his manager last year?
Lou has apologized for the comment. Perhaps you should too.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
It's well known that Ron Washington insulated Milton from the press and controversy last year.
And I’m sure Lou was advised to appologize for the good of the organization and the $30 million bucks it wasted on this specimen.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
it is?
provide a cite.
Or maybe Lou apologized because he realized that his reaction was over the top.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Ugh I am so distraght
This team stinks. I hope they get their head out of their asses and pull out some wins soon or I might write them off completely. This is terrible.
by Sam Householder on Jun 29, 2009 1:18 PM CDT reply actions
Because I get so tired of the reactionary...
“Soriano Sucks! Bench him!” talk…
I thought I’d note that since June 18 (10 games, 49 PA, 45AB) , Soriano is batting .289/.347/.356/.702 (That’s AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS)
While it’s not enough data to make definitive conclusions, this is nonetheless a good sign. It’s very possible that he’s turning things around (regardless of a supposed injury). As well, someone already noted his UZR ratings in left, so I don’t need to mention them.
Bottom line is the statistics say Soriano is a good player. And trends might inspire hope that he is coming around batting-wise now.
I realize that this won’t matter to all the people who believe the only metric with which to measure a player is their all seeing perception of how hard he’s hustling. But I’m not sure it would be wise to bench someone when it appears they may start performing to your expectation levels…
it's because
he doesn’t DIVE, man.
It’s odd to see Soriano gradually improving. We’re very used to “augh crap! Wheee! Carry the team!” with him.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
They really should have...
a “# of dives per game” statistic. Maybe work an incentive clause into contracts, rewarding good dives. We can turn MLB into Mexican League soccer in no time.
(Apologies to Mexican League fans out there, but really…they take dives even more than the Italians do…and that says something.)
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions
If that stat comes about, Edmonds and his agent will be on the phone trying to get back pay from Angels, Cards & Cubs.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
I suppose I should've noted...
that my idea about a dive-stat was entirely tongue-in-cheek….
One of these days I’ll learn that fecetiousness doesn’t translate well to the internet.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions
of course
you’d have to split it up between offensive dives and defensive dives. Diving to steal a base or score is WAY different than diving to catch a ball.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions
as was mine.
your facetiousness factor is just fine
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
True, it's more like Soriano has some sort of on/off
switch where he is all or nothing for weeks on end either way.
Oh, and what is the ratio of D(ives)P(er)G(ame) to VOM?
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Hmmmm. DPG/VOM. I’ll have to think on this one.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions
How long has it been since he's homered? Seems like he had 14 HRs on about May 20th.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
That's true.
He hasn’t hit a HR since June 7th. While that’s surprising (and not exactly good for a player like him), it seems to me that he’s getting more and more solid contact. Yesterday for example, he very well could’ve been 3/4 if not for a line drive directly at the 3B.
He also has 3 doubles in his last 4 games, and multi-hit games in 5 of the last 10.
These aren’t leaps, but they’re positive steps.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions
at one point, he was on pace to hit 162 HRs. Good times.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. When they play over their heads, and when they play under the gutter. When they win the division, and then get swept in the division series. When they get no-hitters and when they blow no-hitters. And some day, when they go all the way and get those rings. This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jun 29, 2009 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions
By my calculations...
That would’ve been some kind of record.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions
I didn't say it was....
In and of itself. He’s not hitting for power, which obviously hurts his OPS. But that’s irrelevent. We’re analyzing the marginal difference between previous performance and current trends. From May 19th (approx when he really started to tale off) until June 17th (ie the day before my above referenced trend) his stat line was: .146/.214/.252./.467
A statline of .289/.347/.356/.702 is therefore a dramatic improvement.
My point is that while he still has a long way to go, recently he’s finally begun to hit the ball consistently and with greater slugging % (and at least from my perception, I’d say he’s hitting the ball more firmly.).
I assume you agree that that’s a good thing and a trend in the right direction.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions
.356 is an awful slugging percentage
In fact, a slugging pct. of .252 with a batting average of .146 is more extra bases per at-bat than .356 with a BA of .289.
A .347 OBP is no great shakes for a leadoff hitter, but I’d take it from Soriano if he started actually hitting for power.
Ugh...
I understand it’s not a good slugging percentage. I’m analyzing MARGINAL difference. Not absolute value.
As for
In fact, a slugging pct. of .252 with a batting average of .146 is more extra bases per at-bat than .356 with a BA of .289
That’s true. So what? Is your suggestion that the best way for Soriano to come out of his slump is to get less hits, but have them be for extra bases? And exactly how would that help?
It would seem to me for a guy with a career of hitting extra bases, the best way to erase a slump is to restart the ability to get any hits at all (be they singles or whatever). Extra bases will eventually follow a more consistent ability to make contact for hits.
In other words, I’m analyzing based on what I see are indicators of future performance. (Perhaps your point?) and others is to simply say “I don’t like the result” regardless of acknowledging the marginal indicators of improvement and the prospects for a return to career-mean.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I get that it is a marginal improvement
But the argument has to take into account that he still has a ways to go. Is it moving in the right direction? Of course, but he hasn’t “righted the ship”. This argument would hold more water if we could get a baseline of recent performance that would be acceptable. While improving, his play is still unacceptable.
I don’t have the numbers in front of me, but I did read somewhere (probably on this site and maybe on this page) that Soto was hitting .286 since May 13. Now, that is an acceptable pace. Until Soriano can produce at an acceptable level, even for a few weeks, then we might have something to be encouraged about. Right now, it’s still crap.
by jerry morales rules on Jun 30, 2009 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions
In a similar vein to my post on Soriano above...
It’s worth repeating what other people have noted in other threads: Milton Bradley is definitely coming around.
From May 6th (which is the start date of his first consecutive game hit streak of the season; and really the first indication that he knew how to hit a baseball) until June 24th (I’m omitting this most recent White Sox series for now, to illustrate my point*):
Milton batted: .286/.384./.437/.821 (AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS). Clearly, he’s still lacking power. But it’s a definite improvement over his initial slow start. (From the beginning of the season until May 5th, when he was struggling mightily, his line was: .128/.305/.255/.560.)
What’s especially useful to keep in mind is that his stats are illustrative of how difficult it is to overcome the drag that a poor stat has on the appearance of your total season statistics. Despite the increased production from May 6th on, his season Batting Average has risen less than .90 points, for example. Which is my season-statistics aren’t really useful until later in the season.
*Before someone cries foul: If you include the recent White Sox series, where Milton had a rough go of it, his line from May 6th until today is: .276/.370/.417/.787. I would speculate that that was simply just a rought series and not indicative of his current upward trend; hence my omitting it above.)
*why....
“Which is why season-statistics aren’t really useful” that should read. D’oh!
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jun 29, 2009 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Zero power and 8th on the team in RBIs is a joke.
Add in his terrible defense and temper tantrums, and Bradley has had a major negative influence on this ballclub. He’s had many opportunities to produce in the clutch and failed miserably. Most recent example, yesterday, 3-0 game, 1 out, man on 3rd, what’s he do? Strike out.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
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