All-Star Lilly Dominates Cardinals; Cubs Win 5-2 (Still Worried About Marmol, Though)
by Al on Jul 11, 2009 7:29 PM CDT
in Recaps
110 comments
Games like this absolutely infuriate me.
Infuriate? How can a crisply-pitched game with timely hitting, 5-2 Cubs win over the Cardinals, be infuriating?
Because I keep wondering why the team that showed up today can't show up every day! What is it about the 2009 Cubs that makes them play like this -- like the 2008 version -- one day, and another (yesterday, for example) look like they couldn't beat a team of T-ballers?
If anyone has the answer to that, call Jim Hendry and Lou Piniella right away. They, like the rest of us, would like to know.
Ted Lilly went eight innings for the first time since May 2 vs. the Marlins, when he also allowed just one run, and was in command all the way, posting his 100th career victory. He could have had eight shutout innings if Jeff Baker hadn't triple-clutched on a ground ball that the speedy Colby Rasmus beat out for an infield hit; later in that inning a bouncer by Ryan Ludwick glanced off Aramis Ramirez's glove for a RBI double, and that's all the Cardinals got till the ninth inning. More on that ninth inning later.
In the meantime, the Cubs came out swinging in the first inning against Brad Thompson, though the only really big hit was Baker's two-RBI single with the bases loaded, after Milton Bradley had taken one for the team and was hit by a pitch, forcing in the first run of the game. Nice work, Milton, and nice work again in the fourth inning; Bradley reached on a dropped third strike when it seemed as if no one really knew what was going on or where the ball was. That inning didn't produce any runs, but Lilly also had a nice idea when he tried to push a bunt past Thompson with Bradley on third. Lilly, realizing his hitting limitations, tried to surprise the Cardinals and almost got away with it. (Dave reminded me that such a play works much better with a lefthander on the mound.)
Lilly continued dominating; after the one run scored he gave up only two harmless singles and got out of the seventh with a slick double play that kept his pitch count low enough for him to throw the eighth (otherwise Angel Guzman or Sean Marshall probably would have thrown that inning). I especially liked the way Lilly ran out of the dugout for that eighth inning, something you likely didn't see on TV -- hustling, even though he was nearly gassed.
Then Lou decided to, again, give Carlos Marmol some work in a low-pressure situation, four runs up in the ninth inning. It was... not pretty. After an easy groundout, a single and walk put two runners on and then Marmol got a comebacker... which he almost threw into center field; it took a great stab by Ryan Theriot to prevent that, and Tony LaRussa came out to argue the out call at second base (he might have had a point; Theriot might have been off the bag). When Yadier Molina singled in a run, Lou was forced to summon Kevin Gregg to finish it off, which he did.
What's wrong with Marmol? Mike thinks his velocity might be down, which means he can't use the fastball as an out pitch and he either doesn't have command of, or doesn't trust, his slider, which was the pitch that got so many hitters out last year. It's getting beyond the point of "a couple of outings" for Marmol -- since June 2 he has thrown 18 innings and issued 20 walks. That's... well, it's bad. His season WHIP is 1.51 which is... well, it's bad. Maybe the All-Star break will help him get his head on straight.
The All-Star break also beckons Derrek Lee, who suffered a relapse of the neck spasms which put him out of action for almost a week in early May. D-Lee says he's good to go tomorrow, but I wouldn't take any chances with that unless he shows up tomorrow morning and says he's 100%. And although Koyie Hill said he could catch both games tomorrow, Jake Fox says he's ready to step in and catch if needed. If he is needed, expect him to catch the second game, where Randy Wells will start -- Fox caught Wells as they were both coming up through the system and making the same stops for the first few years of their careers.
Note I said "second game" -- Lou has, according to that link, decided to switch starters tomorrow and go with Z in the first game and Wells in the night game. That's fine with me. The Cubs can make a statement tomorrow. It's way past time to do so.
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On the Marmol throw to Theriot....
replays showed Riot touched the bag and THE RUNNER WAS OUT BY A 1/2 STEP AT FIRST! Would have saved much of the drama in the ninth.
Great game by Lilly!
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jul 11, 2009 7:35 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
exactly
and Marmol’s velocity on his fastball seemed alright according to Fox’s broadcast. Seems to me he just can’t find a consistent release point for either of his pitches.
by CubsFan87 on Jul 11, 2009 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe that's it, then.
There’s still something off about Marmol. Hope he finds it soon.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 11, 2009 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You probably haven't seen the replay
it showed Theriot held the bag and it should have been a DP.
by LT on Jul 11, 2009 7:35 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for that.
I hadn’t seen the replay. Glad it all worked out.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 11, 2009 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I haven't noticed any drop in Carlos's velocity
it seems to me its all about control. The guy is still nearly unhittable, opponents are only .157 against him.
on to tomorrow, man a sweep in twin bill would make the next four days a lot more pleasant.
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by DC Cubbie on Jul 11, 2009 7:37 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Is fox really going to be answer as the backup C for the next month
that makes me a bit nervous. I hope Jim works something out over the break…
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
by DC Cubbie on Jul 11, 2009 7:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Rosenthal
mentioned how we missed out on Chris Coste on waivers, the Astros put in a claim at the same time as the Cubs (before yesterday’s games) and at that time they had a worst record so they got priority.
by CubsFan87 on Jul 11, 2009 7:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here are a couple of catchers who might be available.
One is Henry Blanco. Seriously. He knows this pitching staff and would fit right in and could probably be had cheaply.
I’ll bet Jose Molina is available, too. The Yankees have Francisco Cervelli, who started when Jorge Posada was out. Molina can hit a little and is an excellent defensive player. You could probably get him for a prospect.
I can’t imagine the Cubs not getting a major league backup catcher over the break.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 11, 2009 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I did not know that.
I see now that he pulled his hamstring a week ago. OK, forget that one.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 11, 2009 9:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like your Molina idea though
I like the Molina boys. They’re really solid.
Nobody who ever gave his best regretted it. -George Halas
by Allie on Jul 12, 2009 2:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe Marmol can catch right now
He sure isn’t pitching!
Go Cubs Go!!!!
by cubsluver22 on Jul 11, 2009 7:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
At least for now
and even more interesting is the fact that to backup to Fox is one Randy Wells, according to Carrie Muskat(see bottom of article):
See article!!
So let’s hope for the best on Sunday!
by dtc0405 on Jul 11, 2009 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cards & Cubs since May 1, 2009
Cubs 31-31
Cards 31-34
Cubs with almost every player outside of Lee underperforming
Cards with their entire pitching staff overperforming
Should be a fun and exciting second half!
by IllinoisCubs on Jul 11, 2009 7:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
wow
Someone tell Blue Lou, he’s team to run away with it isn’t as good as he thinks lol
by jeff_pico on Jul 11, 2009 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But, it's a fact
’cause he said! Deal with it!
/sarcasm
by Wrigster on Jul 11, 2009 8:20 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
This is pretty encouraging...
I seriously still think this is our division…then anything can happen…despite how opposed people are to thinking this team can do
by Wrigster on Jul 11, 2009 8:12 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, my favorite is Pineiro
He has a 3.20 ERA and a 1.11 WHIP and last year after the All-Star break he put up an ERA of 6.05 with a WHIP of 1.51. To Pineiro’s credit, I don’t think he is 6.05/1.51 bad and his first half might have even been a little bit of luck evening out, but given the law of averages, he is bound for a second half with an ERA of at least 4.50 and a WHIP somewhere around 1.30 if not worse in both categories.
by IllinoisCubs on Jul 11, 2009 8:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think...
Reply fail…lol
by Wrigster on Jul 11, 2009 9:25 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
As has been said
Marmol shouldn’t have had to be replaced, because the game was already over, had the call not been botched — and then we’d be calling this game a possible good first step for Marmol.
It was a good game. Hopefully, we feel the same way about tomorrow.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 11, 2009 7:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree...
I think the bad calls got into his mind, which is pretty fragile IMO
by Wrigster on Jul 11, 2009 8:08 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
The game was already over in the ninth?
Not according to the Fox Sports Buck/McCarver duo.
They were virtual cheerleaders for a redbird comeback that inning, spewing all kinds of Cards comeback theories. They cheered, “And the tieing run comes to the plate”.
Then, Gregg’s fairly quick strikeout of Schumaker threw them for a moment and Buck had to say rather forlornly,“Cubs win”.
by JFCubFan on Jul 12, 2009 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's why I hate Buck/McCarver doing Cardinals games on Fox
They both are clearly in love with the entire Cardinals organization and they don’t know how to put their biases away. As a sports journalist, I know firsthand how hard it can be not to root for your favorite team while at the game, but it’s an unwritten rule that you don’t cheer in the press box. I don’t even like it when a team’s regular broadcasters (i.e. Len and Bob or Harrelson/Stone) show objectivity. If you ask me, Pat Hughes is one of the greatest broadcasters I have ever had the privilege of listening to. Sure, he gets a little more excited calling Cub homers than opponents’, but he always calls the game in a classy, professional manner. Buck/McCarver don’t even try to hide their affection. Please Fox, don’t ever let them call another Cardinals game. I would also accept the firing of McCarver. Thank you.
by burncruisin on Jul 12, 2009 12:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They wanted a bit of excitement in their game
Its not a Cardinal thing, its was (IMHO) just a “God, let something interesting happen” thing…
Nobody who ever gave his best regretted it. -George Halas
by Allie on Jul 12, 2009 2:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
worked yesterday and would have given good money to hear that
Blue mountains high .. Blue valleys low
I don't know which way we will go ..
One summer dream .. one summer dream ..
coda
ELO, 1975
by cubnational on Jul 12, 2009 7:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hmm...
Fox caught Wells as they were both coming up through the system and making the same stops for the first few years of their careers.
But how well? I seem to recall a few Minor League Wraps where Fox accounted for multiple errors in games. Anybody else has a third catcher they don’t need?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Jul 11, 2009 7:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think at this point
They are more concerned about Koyie Hill catching 18 innings (possibly more if either game goes into extras) than Fox giving up an error or two.
by IllinoisCubs on Jul 11, 2009 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seriously
McCarver has put out a cd?? My gosh when they starting playing that I about puked in my mouth.
Go Cubs Go!!!!
by cubsluver22 on Jul 11, 2009 7:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The very menion of his name makes me puke in my mouth. I don’t even like hearing about people named Tim besides cubbietim because of that.
Yes I have joined twitter. Find me at puckyprosecutor. First person to identify where the puckish prosecutor is from gets credit! (not enough to spell our puckish).
by cubstoseriesby100 on Jul 11, 2009 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Must be right up there
With William Shatner’s album
"When you're going through hell, keep going." - Winston Churchill
by vonde6 on Jul 11, 2009 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey, wait a minute...
Shatner’s “Has Been” was pretty damn good.
Don’t take my word for it; read the reviews on Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/Has-Been-William-Shatner/dp/B0002RUPH4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1247368840&sr=1-1
by bison on Jul 11, 2009 10:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that duet with Henry Rollins
is actually pretty cool.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 11, 2009 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"In my view,
as good as the Cubs were in the first half of this game, that’s how as bad they’ve been now." Tim at his best.
by dtc0405 on Jul 11, 2009 8:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's gold, Jerry.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 11, 2009 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Despite another horridly biased broadcast from the two clowns
Great game to watch. Ted Lilly is so freaking good its just not fair. He owns that team.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
by nji232 on Jul 11, 2009 7:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Over at VEB
they think Buck is too pro Cubs. It is all about perspective I guess. That said really dislike Buck. I liked his Dad a lot though.
by LT on Jul 11, 2009 8:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats funny because at one point that players not get paid
on days they are injured and not able to play. This is after Lee leaves the game. Soriano and Soto get shown. What a joke.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
by nji232 on Jul 11, 2009 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
At one point McCarver suggested this
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
by nji232 on Jul 11, 2009 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
pete rose said that
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 11, 2009 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Today
Today I made a decision. I went to a bridal shower at 3 and turned off my phone to not get updates to see if I could handle it.
I did it. Maybe I should try that more often.
This is not a good week to be a favorite of mine. Favorite TV actress and favorite pitcher both broke toes this week.
The AL just forfeited the ASG. They can’t take the idea they might face Ted.
Yes I have joined twitter. Find me at puckyprosecutor. First person to identify where the puckish prosecutor is from gets credit! (not enough to spell our puckish).
by cubstoseriesby100 on Jul 11, 2009 7:58 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
wat
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
by dtpollitt on Jul 11, 2009 9:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ours is not to wonder why...
…ours is just to read and cry.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jul 11, 2009 9:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Meatball
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 11, 2009 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
dont know how i feel about fox catching
This was tried and tried numerous times. And has failed @ every level. I think we need to bring up clevenger. He cant be allowed to be behind the plate.
4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42
by fischisgod on Jul 11, 2009 8:04 PM CDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
You want to bring up...
… a guy who has played 62 games above A-ball, and put him in a pennant race?
Clevenger might be good in a couple of years. He is NOT ready now. Go get a major league backup.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 11, 2009 8:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tomorrow
Tomorrow is the absolute biggest day of the season so far. They need at least a split, getting swept at home would be pretty devistating. A sweep would be awesome momentum. Going to be quite a day.
by jeff_pico on Jul 11, 2009 8:10 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
We can't sweep or get swept
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 11, 2009 8:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
cant sweep when both teams already have 1 win
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 11, 2009 8:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
To answer your first question Al,
the Cubs hit bad pitchers. They don’t hit the good ones.
by Rick B on Jul 11, 2009 8:15 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
we made suppan look good
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 11, 2009 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Opposite IMO
Cubs hit good pitchers and make the bad ones look like Aces.
3 runs off Carpenter is success.
by ak123 on Jul 11, 2009 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's such an idiotic statement.
ALL teams hit bad pitchers more frequently than good pitchers. Otherwise, good pitchers would not exist.
This season IS over. -BLou 6/30/09
by Kansas25 on Jul 11, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tautologies rock!
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Jul 11, 2009 11:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Still too many mistakes.
Baker on second and no outs. Should have advanced and scored that inning. Theriot getting picked off. If he doesn’t, Pulos is holding him on and Hoffpauer’s line drive is a single. They would have had 1st and third and no outs. Too many bad baseball plays.
by Rick B on Jul 11, 2009 8:17 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Winning
is the only statistic that matters. We do more of it, and we get a pony!
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 11, 2009 9:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Someone might, but you will not
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Jul 11, 2009 9:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 11, 2009 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You can nitpick
Everygame…
Theriot didn’t mess up, he was victim on a great play by Molina…
You’d probably be mad if he didn’t take a look after the ball in the dirt…
by Wrigster on Jul 11, 2009 11:37 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Tomorrow
Tomorrow if we sweep the 2 games we’re on our way. If we get swept pack up the saddle Aunt Millie time to start thinking about Bears training camp.
If we split meeeh.
Yes I have joined twitter. Find me at puckyprosecutor. First person to identify where the puckish prosecutor is from gets credit! (not enough to spell our puckish).
by cubstoseriesby100 on Jul 11, 2009 8:24 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Nah....
If we split 3.5 out.
If we lose now it’s 5.5 out which isn’t horrible.
If we win both, 1.5-2.5 out (depending on Brewers I think).
Had we been swept – 7.5 out – Then it’s preseason football time!
by ak123 on Jul 11, 2009 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You can always count on Ronnie
“When you’re eight games behind, it’s like eight miles. When you’re eight games in front, it’s like eight inches.”
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Jul 11, 2009 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Milwaukee won today
Current standings are:
Tm GB
StL -
Mil 2.0
Chi 3.5
Milwaukee plays one against the Dodgers tomorrow, and we play St. Louis twice, so:
Cubs win both, Mil L: StL-,Chi 1.5, Mil 1.5 (Cubs W/L would put them in 2nd place by 0.00026 – 1 up in the loss column)
Cubs win both, Mil W: StL-, Mil .5, Chi 1.5
Cubs split, Mil L: StL-, Mil 2.5, Chi 3.5
Cubs split, Mil W: StL-, Mil 1.5, Chi 3.5
StL win both, Mil L: StL-, Mil 3.5, Chi 5.5
StL win both, Mil W: StL-, Mil 2.5, Chi 5.5
The last two scenarios are complicated by the fact that Houston sits a 1/2 game behind the Cubs, and Cincinnati is a game behind the Cubs. If the Astros beat the Nats, and the Reds beat the Mets, a St. Louis DH sweep would drop the Cubs into 5th (!) place in the Central going into the All-Star Break.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Jul 11, 2009 10:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brewers are 2 back of the Cardinals entering Sunday
So no matter what happens, the Cards will still be in first by at least a half-game.
by burncruisin on Jul 12, 2009 1:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Theriot deserves some credit...
Had a very nice game at the plate (2-3 with a walk and 2 runs scored, without verifying that) and made two VERY nice plays in the field. The first, a great stab on that ball up the middle that he flipped to Baker who caught it with his bare hand and then fired to first. Man, what a thing of beauty that play was! And then the second, the previously mentioned stretch to prevent the ball from going into CF, and managing to get the out at the same time. Great game by The Riot!
by kanderber on Jul 11, 2009 8:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Should be on the SS vote for All Star Game
Oh well maybe next year.
by ak123 on Jul 11, 2009 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nats are creaming the Astros
Those guys have bothered me ever since the hurricane whine-fest last year.
"When you're going through hell, keep going." - Winston Churchill
by vonde6 on Jul 11, 2009 8:51 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Prince Fielder stole a base today
I have a collective 10 steals on one of my fantasy teams today… gotta be a record.
by lswaidz on Jul 11, 2009 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Games like today don’t just frustrate me, they piss me off. We are (I still think) better than we have been playing, but I am certain tomorrow we will lose 2-0 or so, and then win another game 6-2.
Don’t see BRUNO, it’s not nearly as good as BORAT. Off to PUBLIC ENEMIES.
Dan
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
by dtpollitt on Jul 11, 2009 9:11 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
tell us how public enemeies is
i haven’t decided if i want to see it.
Nobody who ever gave his best regretted it. -George Halas
by Allie on Jul 12, 2009 2:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know of a ML backup catcher who just came off the DL last week...
…and is currently wasting his talents at Triple-A Las Vegas while Barajas and Chavez clog the home plates up in Toronto. He can hit pretty well with his right hand, knows how to block the plate, and can point to the scoreboard with the best of them.
He’s already pretty familiar with the Cubs staff – in fact, you could say he was a real hit with Z a couple years ago… ;-)
Get ’er done, Jimbo!!!
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jul 11, 2009 9:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You have got to be kidding me.
I’m not welcoming him back … not after what happened with Z and then the yelling contest he had with Rich Hill two weeks later.
Cubs record since April 2004: 4-0
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jul 11, 2009 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i think he is kidding you
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 12, 2009 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course I'm kidding
this team can only handle one MB headcase at a time! ;-)
In all seriousness though, it is unfortunate that Barrett overstayed his welcome and/or didn’t have the requisite skill set to ensure his staying here. Regardless of what you thought of him, I gotta give the guy credit – even in the short time he was here, I think he understood better than most what it meant to be a Chicago Cub and play at Wrigley in front of these fans. To borrow one of Al’s oft-used phrases… he ‘got’ it.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jul 12, 2009 12:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he definitely "got" it.
Up until the time he got into it with Z he was one of my favorite Cubs. The punch on Pierzynski? How can you not be a hero for that? He always seemed to play hard and wasn’t all that bad with a bat either. Maybe my memory is getting too hazy. Still don’t want him back though.
by burncruisin on Jul 12, 2009 1:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Solid win
Lilly is tough. 41 wins as a Cub, and here I thought when he was signed it was a bad contract, boy I was wrong. He has been excellent.
If Baker doesn’t get that first inning hit, who knows what the game is like. I still want to see Milton rake one with runners on, he needs a few big hits.
Jose Molina has a two year deal, I don’t know if the Cubs would take on that money, Hank White went on the DL last week, who knows.
Have to at least get a split tomorrow, Z needs a good start.
Lets go Cubs!!!
"Have You heard of the Boom on Mizar 5?"
by Grockcubs on Jul 11, 2009 9:21 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree with you...
But, Z has been having quality starts. No run support
by Wrigster on Jul 11, 2009 11:46 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
This game
was so enjoyable today. A little tense when Marmol was in but nice to see Gregg finish it off well. Lilly was fantastic. Lee is really needed in this lineup and if he says he’s ok I hope he really is.
Go get ’em tomorrow Cubs!!!!
by sue369 on Jul 11, 2009 9:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
When will we stop
trying to parse a single win or loss as a projection of things to come? Yes, we won today against the Cards and Lilly pitched a great game. But we still went 2-11 with RISP. We scored all 5 runs against a AAA pitcher and nothing after that. Marmol is still inconsistent.
We still show no indication that we are anything but a .500 club. BTW, Soriano did swing the bat much better today. He actually had a warning track out. OTOH, it wasn’t against a quality pitcher.
If you like Selig's handling of the steroid issue, you'll love his choice for next Cub owner.
by tharr on Jul 11, 2009 9:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
so
a win today doesn’t mean anything, but the loss yesterday means that the season is over?
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 11, 2009 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sorry
I misread your post.
But there are lots of people who suggested that yesterday’s loss means the season is over.
I don’t see why we can’t hope they’re the team they were today, rather than mourning that they’re the team they were yesterday.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 11, 2009 10:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
To be honest
I never suggested the season was over at any point this year. OTOH, this team has had more ups and downs than i can remember. All i was suggesting was a wait and see attitude. Our talent should win over the season. However, the extent of things gone wrong and players underachieving suggests no one game signifies anything that can be projected.
BTW, of course we can hope. I know I do. But to suggest they are today’s team seems ill advised based upon past performance. Hey, we beat a AAA pitcher. How many of those do we expect to see in the playoffs?
If you like Selig's handling of the steroid issue, you'll love his choice for next Cub owner.
by tharr on Jul 12, 2009 4:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Point of Refrence.
I am sort of in the middle of this season is over and we will come back to win the division. But on Monday we bet Jair Jurjens and scored 4 runs off him in 2 innings. He just finished twirling another gem vs the Rockies in Coor’s field. Look up jurjens numbers and they are very impressive. I think anyone would take 3 runs off Chris Carpenter before the game started. That being said its obvious we have to hit better off everyone especially late in the games and any time there are runners in scoring position.
by MandMexpress12 on Jul 11, 2009 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mike is completely wrong
Marmol hasn’t been able to locate his fastball all year. The velocity isn’t a problem it’s being able to consistently place the pitch.
He needs to place the fastball inside the strike zone so that when the slider LOOKS like the fastball down the middle the batter flails at it.
That hasn’t happened this year.
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by Gibbon Jockey on Jul 11, 2009 10:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
im all for sending him down to iowa for a few weeks to get his location back. have guzman do the 7th, stevens or shark do the 8th, and gregg the 9th
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 11, 2009 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Marmol's velocity looks fine.
It’s just his location that sucks.
by rencelas on Jul 11, 2009 10:58 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
From that graphic there,
His velocity appears to be the same it was in 2007 and 2008. Location, location, location.
Ted Lilly had to make that adjustment last year, as I recall, when his pitch speed was not what it was in 2007.
Cubs record since April 2004: 4-0
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jul 11, 2009 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Marmol
Velocity is fine
movement is down
Command is way down
I continue to think we’re paying the price for the last 2 1/2 years of abuse
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 12, 2009 12:25 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I somewhat agree
I continue to think we’re paying the price for the last 2 1/2 years of abuse
However, you would think the abuse would affect his velocity more than location, wouldn’t you? Maybe I’m wrong, I’ve never pitched a game in my life (not even Little League). It could be many things, mental or physical. It might be something as simple as needing to get his eyes examined.
by burncruisin on Jul 12, 2009 1:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well...
his fastball velocity is down and his breaking ball velocity is up (at least last i checked)
hardballtimes did a piece last year noting Marmol’s arm slot when fatigued and how it drops causing him to lose command and movement, so i’m kind of basing my opinion of that. I haven’t seen the arm slot data though that i believe pitch f/x also tracks
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 12, 2009 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
looks to me like the movement is still there.
i think the problem is lack of command with the fastball; everything else spirals from there.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jul 12, 2009 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is anyone else annoyed that Lou didn't let Lilly finish the game?
I was pretty pissed about it.
Lilly was cruising, sent down the Cards 1-2-3 in the 8th, and only had 103 pitches. With the doubleheader tomorrow, we could’ve saved our entire pen. Instead, we end up using both Marmol and Gregg. To me… it was an absolute ridiculous move by Lou. And, it nearly proved to be costly, as the tying run came to the plate.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
by SackMan on Jul 12, 2009 1:36 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Three days off after tomorrow
I don’t think Gregg’s 3 pitches are gonna put him out of either game tomorrow, and if Marmol can’t go after 21 pitches, well, I’m ok with that too.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Jul 12, 2009 1:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understood playing for more runs
and getting marmol in a less “high leverage” situation…
but after having to get gregg in the game, it sure didn’t look like a good choice.
but, that double play gets called correctly and its less of an issue.
Nobody who ever gave his best regretted it. -George Halas
by Allie on Jul 12, 2009 2:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
keep in mind
that Lou operates according to a broader picture of just one game. He needs to not only win the game, but eye opportunities to get Marmol his confidence back. The Cubs play ALOT of close games, a four run lead for this squad sadly qualifies as a “big lead,” – one that can be used to test Marmol without putting the game at risk – which happened anyway. The fact is a Lilly CG is nice, but unless Marmol is functional at some point this year do you really see this team doing much down the stretch run relying solely on Guzman as your setup guy?
by BeltwayCubsFan on Jul 12, 2009 6:51 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed.
Not only that, but Lou had to keep in mind the fact that the next day, the Cubs play a double-header, which can really wreak havoc on his pitching if he overuses the bullpen in the first game.
Cubs record since April 2004: 4-0
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jul 12, 2009 7:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i like the SP switch
If Z can pull out a gem in game one, l like having the more consistent Wells pitching the nightcap for the chance to take 3 of 4
by BeltwayCubsFan on Jul 12, 2009 6:49 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
marmol
carlos was like this last year and finally straightend up after the all star break. carlos wil never get the closer job pitching like this. dont know if gregg will be back or not but carlos should keep that in mind. and how about this. last year 8 ALL STARS. this year, ONE. that sums up how this season has gone.
by NOMAR on Jul 12, 2009 7:04 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Marmol's 1st half decline this year has been more prolonged than last year's
Last season, he went to crap in June, where he’s been struggling since about mid-May this season.
Last year, he pitched a beauty of an inning in the ASG which seemed to get his confidence back up, and then he came back as a dominant setup guy in the 2nd half. We’ll see if they ASB works for him in 2009 as well as it did in 2008.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Jul 12, 2009 7:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
when Marmol lost it last year
it also came directly after an absurd string of usage that was something like 9 appearances in 12 games or something like that, i made a long post about it at the time….
this year the command has consistently alluded him
its a rather big difference as you suggest
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 12, 2009 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Baker "pounding the mitt"...........
………..so-called single to Rasmus still has me pissed off. That went as the first hit of the game for the Cards, allowed Pujols to come to the plate with a runner aboard, and most certainly caused Lilly to throw an unnecessary number of additional pitches.
It’s a gaffe that gets lost in a game like this (thanks to Al for pointing it out), but Lou should have yanked his ass right off the field. There’s no excuse for that at the MLB level.
"I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." ~ Frank Sinatra
by tville on Jul 12, 2009 8:32 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
He did that more than once.
Not a very good routine for a second baseman (or anyone, for that matter).
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 12, 2009 9:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Saw the game yesterday, seeing both today...
… a few observations:
I sat LF bleachers most of the game yesterday. Sori is slow on his first step and often seemed to push off his left leg, which seems odd.
The Cards fans in line were nervous. One particularly candid guy (who i happened to be in line near last year for one game as well) admitted he couldn’t even really keep a straight face when pointing to the ranking flags with his team on top on top of the scoreboard. They don’t expect to remain there, and he admitted that not having buried us with Aramis out didn’t bode well. “Surely we’d fall in the division if we lost Albert for 50 games!” he said.
I don’t know if it was the humidity or what, but that was the hottest bleacher game i’d seen in a long time.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Jul 12, 2009 9:48 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
that's a nice comment
from a Cards fan
and i love aramis….
but aramis is no pujols
by DartmouthCubsFan on Jul 12, 2009 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
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