Trade Rumors Fly As Cubs Win Third Straight, 5-3 Over Reds
The Cubs used the long ball again today, three of them, to defeat the Reds 5-3. That makes three wins in a row, seven of nine (resistance is futile!) since the All-Star break, and nine of the last 13 dating back to the St. Louis series before the ASB. At 50-45 the Cubs are five games over .500 for the first time since May 19, when they were 21-16 and in the middle of that disastrous eight-game losing streak.
And all you guys want to talk about is trade rumors, right?
Let's get started, then. As first posted by tomas21 earlier this afternoon in this FanPost, Milton Bradley may be on his way to becoming a Detroit Tiger. This rumor was confirmed to me from my own sources, so I think this possibility does have legs, and I hope it happens, sooner rather than later. You all know my position on Bradley, but I'm going to be nice here. Regardless of his numbers in the past or whether he can pick up this season to be even close to that (and it's hardly "early" any more, with 67 games remaining), I just don't think Bradley was ever a good fit as a Chicago Cub. Remember a few weeks ago when he was quoted as saying "I don't like the attention, I just like doing my job and going home"? I think being in the fishbowl of attention that comes with being a Cub -- probably more than any team except the Yankees or Red Sox -- was too much for Milton. He may have the ability within him, but I suspect he put too much pressure on himself -- that's a recipe for failure. I'd think he would be very successful as a DH and part-time outfielder in Detroit.
If today's pinch-hit homer -- the first PH homer of Milton's career -- was his last AB as a Cub, I wish him well.
Now, for those who think that Sam Fuld or Reed Johnson becomes a full-time player if Bradley is dealt, that can't be right. Clearly, dealing Bradley would be in part to clear his contract to acquire other players -- perhaps Adam Dunn? The Nationals have said they may not deal Dunn, but they'd be foolish to reject an offer of young pitching. Or maybe Magglio Ordonez, who is off to a start as bad as Bradley's, would come to Chicago from the Tigers in a Bradley trade. In any case, a deal of Bradley would be a beginning, not the end of dealing. More on trades and today's game after the fold.
I have also heard that the Cubs have made inquiries about Dan Haren from the Diamondbacks -- that would be a fantastic acquisition, as Haren is currently leading the NL in ERA and WHIP. Further, I've heard that the Blue Jays have had scouts watching nearly every team in the Cub farm system over the last few days -- could the Cubs be a dark horse candidate in the Roy Halladay derby? The Phillies rejected what the Blue Jays asked from them in an attempt to get Halladay, so perhaps Toronto is looking elsewhere. With Ted Lilly out for an undetermined length of time, the Cubs not only could use the extra bat that could come by clearing Bradley's salary, but another starting pitcher has to be high on the wish list.
Thankfully, Kevin Hart filled in admirably today in his best start as a major leaguer. After a shaky first inning when a run scored (and it could have been more if not for a pinpoint throw by Reed Johnson after he barely missed a diving catch on Chris Dickerson's leadoff single, throwing Dickerson out at 2B), Hart gave up only three hits and struck out five from the 2nd to the 6th. More importantly, he only walked one, after issuing five walks in his other two starts.
Cubs bats put three runs on the board in the first inning, highlighted by Derrek Lee's triple (could his awkward slide into 3B have triggered the neck spasms again?) and Aramis Ramirez's second homer in as many days -- so nice to see A-Ram's bat going again. Alfonso Soriano looked solid at the plate today, with two singles and his 17th homer, and Bradley's 8th-inning jack ended the scoring. Both Angel Guzman and Carlos Marmol looked really good in relief today, and that's especially good news about Marmol, who looks to have gotten back into his groove.
That Bradley homer was nearly necessary, as Aaron Heilman nearly gave the game back in the 9th inning. Here, I'll say something nice about Heilman -- he didn't walk anyone. Instead, he gave up a pair of homers, the second of which, by Jonny Gomes, landed about five rows below us right in the middle of three different bachelorette parties that sat themselves in our section today. A young woman wearing a shirt that read "BITCH #1" (there were eight of them) caught the ball and threw it back. Can we please end the Heilman experiment NOW? Just release him.
There was another "throw it back" incident that nearly caused far more trouble than it was worth. Gomes' double in the fourth inning bounced into the stands down the LF line in foul territory. It was caught by a young boy who looked like he was about seven or eight years old. Adults around him egged him on to "throw it back", but after he did, he was surrounded by two security supervisors and five or six other security guards -- enormous overkill, in my opinion. Two of them started talking to him -- a child, alone. The poor kid looked terrified. Fortunately, nothing happened and later, security guards brought the kid a ball to keep. Since the "throw it back" culture has been so approved by management, it's not surprising people urged the kid on -- so the better idea probably would have been to just let a young boy be.
I hope Jim Hendry is burning up tons of cellphone minutes this afternoon and evening and we have a trade announcement sometime tonight. Things appear to be happening. The team is starting to play better. Keep the faith, and go Phillies (at this writing, leading the Cardinals 3-1 in the second inning).
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Al have you heard anything on who the Cubs
might get back?
DEJESUS!!!
No.
I did read the Magglio Ordonez possibility, don’t know how I feel about that.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I think
Maggs is a worse version of Bradley in nearly every way, except he’s not an asshole. He has lost all power, can’t hit the other way anymore, and has a worse contract than Bradley (assuming it vests).
I’m all for dropping Bradley, but it has to be for a better situation, and Maggs isn’t it.
Trading Bradley and his salary for a crappy prospect, and using the money freed up for Haren/Halladay, THAT would be worth it. That would be worth a Fox/Fukudome platoon in right, Fuld/Reed in center, and Sori in left. But that’s just my opinion.
DEJESUS!!!
The asshole comment is unnecessary.
Come visit me inside Wrigley along the Addison side mezzanine fence straight up from 1st base.
by section229beer on Jul 25, 2009 8:37 PM CDT up reply actions
The Bradley thing isn't happening
It’s being shot down by almost every non-Steve Stone source.
Great game to watch today. Kevin Hart did his job, and it sure seems like Aramis is getting hot. Soriano is clearly mid hot streak.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
It will be interesting to follow then
The Tigers GM seemed offended when asked if he was looking at Milton. I think the quote was “That guy would never be on my team”
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
Deep Goat's
track record hasn’t been awfully good. And if DG is the source on Dan Haren, he is really off base. I know of two prospect packages that the D’Backs have already turned down for Haren and they were way beyond anything the Cubs have to offer.
DG is NOT the source of the Haren rumor.
That came elsewhere.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Sullivan
Miles and the Tigers mlb guy have all said there is NOTHING there.
So its those three vs Deep Goat, Kaplan and Steve Stone
Well...
… I have heard from other sources that there’s “nothing” to the Bradley rumors.
So — take all of it for what it’s worth. Rumors like this do fly often when we get close to the trading deadline. We’ll see what actually happens.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
these rumors
are why july is such a special and entertaining time
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 25, 2009 4:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Inquirying minds would like to know
if that pitcher that you were talking about yesterday was Roy Halladay.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
Scott Downs, perhaps?
Jackie likes the smell of cut grass, he used to play ball on Saturdays, Playin in the sun...
i think
Al said yesterday that vitters wasnt being mentioned. No Vittters = no Halladay.
I still think its Kerry Wood
well then
im out of ideas. you are a crypic man Al. What player would make everyone happy yet not cost us talent like Vitters?
Is Maddux coming back?
Julian Taverez.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 4:35 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL.
Maybe it’s Grienke. I don’t know. Has to be a reliever then.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
Didnt we have a shot at him a few years ago?
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Zack Duke
According to Yahoo!
Aqui viene el Toro Venezolano, Carlos Zambrano, a batear...el lanzamiento...A LO PROFUNDOOO...NOO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NOO...DIGALE QUE NO A ESA PELOTA!! GANAN LOS CACHORROS DE CHICAGO!!
by Azul Cachorro on Jul 25, 2009 8:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think we would
ALL be happy with that trade though. Maybe it is though.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
Gorzelanny and Grabow...
IMO.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions
and wouldn't understand why Al would think that would make
anyone VERY happy
by WanderingWanderer on Jul 25, 2009 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know.
Maybe it’s Josh Johnson. lol. It’s only a select amount of people that would make us all happy.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
if we dumped miles and his contact in the process
we would be happy
Well Kraplan and Stone are idiots... and Deep Goat doesn't exist.
So you do the math.
I'm a truth teller, I'm a risk taker, I'm like Johnny Cash - I walk the line...
by Jimmyeatworld on Jul 25, 2009 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I believe..
it start being used when, he who shall not be named (Brian Roberts), trade rumors started last year, if I’m wrong someone correct.
The sun will shine in '69
It's a play on Deep Throat from Watergate...
It’s obviously a made up name.
I'm a truth teller, I'm a risk taker, I'm like Johnny Cash - I walk the line...
by Jimmyeatworld on Jul 25, 2009 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Ahhaha
No, I’m pretty sure that’s his birth name. “Obviously.” For crying out loud.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." ~Alvin Dark
by DamonBerryhillsMitt on Jul 26, 2009 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
The name is "Goat"
Deep. Goat.
It’s a ‘foreign’ name.
For the record
Al reported he heard something last night. This didn’t come to fruition until midday today. Despite not happening, Al heard what we heard hours earlier.
I don't think Al has specifically told us what he heard last night.
Yes, he did say DG confirmed the Bradley rumor, but I don’t think he’s confirmed that this was the trade tidbit he mentioned in yesterday’s recap, has he?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Can you at least say
that today’s rumors (Haren, Halladay) would make us more happy than the info from yesterday?
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
It's all made up conjecture. Deep Goat doesn't exist.
I'm a truth teller, I'm a risk taker, I'm like Johnny Cash - I walk the line...
by Jimmyeatworld on Jul 25, 2009 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I think he exists
I just don’t think he has any actual inside info
by WanderingWanderer on Jul 25, 2009 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Neither of you is correct.
Today’s rumors would indeed make us happier than yesterday’s, if true.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Except one of those rumors was already shot down
quite hard by the other team’s GM. So……………
by WanderingWanderer on Jul 25, 2009 4:56 PM CDT up reply actions
I haven't seen a link
or quote. Do you have one?
DEJESUS!!!
What could possibly make you happier...
Than Haren or Halladay?
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions
With terrible run support...
so Randy Wells is a bust too then.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions
dude, dude
I never like to use this argument, but if you think Zack Greinke is overrated, you don’t understand the game of baseball.
Dude is a great talent on a terrible team.
by WanderingWanderer on Jul 25, 2009 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions
The Tigers GM just shot this down.
Sorry, try again.
"Those are my principles, and if you don’t like them, well, I have others." - Groucho Marx
It never made sense
Jim Hendry isnt going to trade a guy simply because the fans dont like him.
The Tigers have DH type players, Magglio would be a downgrade.
Bradley goes Bye Bye
I saw a post on mlbtraderumors.com earlier today about the possibility of trading Bradley to the Tigers and I got so excited. Perhaps there are some players in the Tigers’ farm teams that would be of interest to the Blue Jays or D-backs. I also think the Cubs need to acquire some bullpen help, a la Sherrill from the O’s. Hopefully one of these teams will take Heilman off our hands. We have enough young starting pitching to keep this team afloat now that Lilly and Dempster are on the DL, but acquiring Haren or Halladay certainly wouldn’t hurt. Lets hope our offense keeps playing as well as it has been.
Andy R.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Jul 25, 2009 3:57 PM CDT reply actions
id rather have bradley than magglio
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 25, 2009 3:57 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I'd rather have Neifi than Bradley.
Andy R.
by WindisBlowingOut! on Jul 25, 2009 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions
and
Cubs bats put three runs on the board in the first inning, highlighted by Derrek Lee’s triple (could his awkward slide into 3B have triggered the neck spasms again?)
lou said he did it while trying to break up the DP aram grounded into
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 25, 2009 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Did he say if he should be OK?
As in to play tomorrow or Monday?
Same here
I want nothing to do with an aging, past-his-prime player like Magglio.
by salparadise23 on Jul 25, 2009 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions
I think the Cubs are interested
in Halladay. I think they are a darkhorse. We match up better than people think.
And he is the one of the few players I would trade Vitters for. Haren is in that select group also.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
I agree.
I think Vitters can be a star — four or five years from now. Halladay is a great pitcher. Haren is 28 (turns 29 in September). Either could be a difference-maker in any rotation.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Yeah,
I think Vitters will be a star. I think if we gave him up, the worst thing that could happen is that it would be a fair trade to both teams (barring injury)
I’d be fine with that if it means Halladay would bring us a championship.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
Complete game...
With 10Ks today, what a freakin’ stud.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Angels
are now giving the Phils a run for the money in the Halliday sweepstakes and they have the parts needed to put a deal together. Wouldn’t hold my breath on either Halliday or Haren.
A package of
Vitters, Marshall, and Jackson/Castro would get the Blue Jays attention.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
My only issue with giving up those guys
Is that we essentially give up our future and have to pray we win it all this or next season.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
I'd do that in a New York minute
The Jays will want more, I think.
by salparadise23 on Jul 25, 2009 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Which jackson?
Tito or Marlon?
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
through in Fox
he be a perfect fit in teh AL
Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."
I thought Phils
turned it down and are done being in this race?
Agree
I think the Cubs simply don’t have enough in their farm system to even make a serious offer for either of those guys.
by salparadise23 on Jul 25, 2009 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions
The Angels are always in discussions, but barely ever pull the trigger
They got Texeira for a bucket of baseballs from Atlanta, but they seem reticent to ever move their prospects.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
Was Bradley's homer
from the right or left side?
Bulls and Hawks winning in the playoffs, Cubs' season off to a fresh start, and Cutler hysteria still simmering?
Just another day in Chicago sports.
"Just" in the basket...
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
Lou called it the "net"
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions
I just
wish people would quit think Adamn Dunn is the solution to our problems.
For so many reasons thats just a bad idea
Today we won
So today…. we have no problems.
(Only if everyday could be like today)
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
His defense basically negating all value from his bat is
reason number 1
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
the fact
that he is just as lazy in the OF as Soriano is another
That I agree with
If you unload Bradley, the best bet is to use the savings to go after one of the top three/four starters on the market Haren, Halladay, Lee and Bedard and use Reed/Fuku/Fuld as a centerfield option with Fuku/Hoff/Fox as your right field options.
Adam Dunn would be a good idea
as soon as the N.L. installs the D.H., not a second sooner.
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions
We signed Soriano...
To play CF… just sayin’.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Soriano
is, career, a plus defender. Dunn really really isn’t.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Soriano and "plus defender" don't belong in the same sentence.
I don’t care what kind of numbers you want to show me. He’s atrocious in the field.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
by SackMan on Jul 25, 2009 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
right!
because, of course, your eyes are more correct then the facts.
Career in the outfield, Soriano has a 24.0 UZR. This year, a bad year so far, he’s got a -6.2
Career in the outfield, Adam Dunn has a -93.0 UZR. NEGATIVE 93! This year, so far, he’s a -6.8.
So. Soriano is obviously playing poorly. Dunn, everyone says, is playing well. And he’s STILL a worse defender then Soriano is!!!!
o.0
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:04 PM CDT up reply actions
But you don't understand...
STATS DON’T MATTER, No matter what they say!
/s
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jul 25, 2009 5:07 PM CDT up reply actions
I know
I’m sorry.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:08 PM CDT up reply actions
UZR...
Look at why his UZR was so great.
In 06, 6.6 UZR but 6.5 was due to his arm.
In 07, 22.4 UZR but 14.3 was due to his arm.
In 08, 5.2 UZR but 4.7 was due to his arm.
Now, teams have stopped running on him, and his UZR isn’t that great.
by serbianking33 on Jul 25, 2009 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions
SO WHAT?
then they’re not advancing the runner! How is that BAD?
You can’t say “Well, the arm doesn’t count”. Or are you someone who says “the nationals are no good, our sweep doesn’t count”?
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Whoa Drew, relax...
I’m just making the point that him getting to the ball is the issue this year.
by serbianking33 on Jul 25, 2009 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Him getting to the ball has always been an issue in the OF
Him dropping the ball has always been an issue in the OF and at 2B.
He’s a bad fielder. Period.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
compared to....
most ML players? then yeah probably
the average left fielder? Not really, this year somewhat, but overall no.
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 6:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Oy.
He was so g damn bad at 2B, that they moved him to the OF.
Now, he’s so g damn bad in the outfield, that he’s got a -6.2 UZR, is tied for the lead among all MLB OFs in errors (8 – tied with A.Dunn), an has the second worst fielding % among all OFs (.954 – Dunn is last)
My comment was not a comparison to Dunn. I simply mentioned that Soriano and “plus defender” don’t belong in the same sentence.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
it's like you didn't read what I wrote.
yes, they do. His career UZR is 24.0. And even being tied with Dunn for the most OF errors, Dunn STILL has a worse UZR this year.
So you want to put THAT in Wrigley’s RIGHT FIELD???
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:13 PM CDT up reply actions
No...we want Milton Bradley for the next 2 years.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Milton Bradley
is also a plus defender.
Maybe you don’t keep Bradley. But you do NOT replace him with Dunn. No thank you.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions
maybe not want
but eating a bunch of cash and giving up prospects for what won’t be a big a net upgrade, is NOT something I want.
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 5:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not even suggesting we get Dunn!
When did I say that?
All I said was: "Soriano and “plus defender” don’t belong in the same sentence." He’s a horrible fielder. A horrible career fielder. Hence why they moved him from 2B.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
his career UZR is still positive right now.
the 2B terribleness canceled out and then a bit with OF goodness.
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Pick your poison
what does more damage him muffing a few grounders or dropping pop ups to left, which would produce more runs? OF mistakes tend to be more glaring whereas IF mistakes give extra outs
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
UZR is in Runs
not plays.
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions
point being?
My question was which of his flaws, IF or OF defense, would be the most damaging— with the thought that extra outs can lead to runs
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
I watch him play everyday. He's atrocious.
And there’s no calculation in any of these zone ratings that account for balls that he flat out doesn’t attempt to catch, or how many times he bobbles something on the ground in the corner and gives up an extra base.
He’s bad in the outfield… and you should all have no problem admitting that, no matter what these stats show.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
uh
no. I don’t. His stats clearly show that he’s a good leftfielder. This year is an outlier.
And he’s STILL better then Dunn.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions
"STILL better than Dunn."
Well… way to raise the bar there. LOL.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
unfortunately this year is...
…this year.
I’d feel a heckuva lot better if that outlier year was a few years ago.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
yeah, well
we play the team we have, right?
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 7:44 PM CDT up reply actions
agreed for the most part
my indirect point was though seeing as how we are now a sizable chunk of the way through this season, it doesn’t do much good to keep trotting out his career UZI’s or whatever those things are. What matters most is what’s going on this year – and this year, he ain’t looking so good.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
he's looking a lot better
of late, tho.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions
I presume you have in-season numbers to back that up?
are there monthly (or even weekly) UZR breakdowns for this season that show a positive trend for Soriano?
Based on games I’ve seen and listening to Pat & Ron/Dave/Judd/Keith, I get no sense that his defense is improving.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Defense is hard to measure with stats.
It may get better with things like HitFX — then again, it might not. At any rate, UZR takes a long time to stabilize, and monthly and weekly totals are basically meaningless. Everything I read suggests it takes around a half-season or so of data before you can trust it.
Also, UZR fundamentally can’t account for a lot of things (difficult wind and sun conditions, for example, which can be really important for OFs), and for outfielders the range component only counts fair fly balls. The “arm score”, AFAICT, has a lot to do with how many bases the lead runner advances relative to the hitter, which is somewhat silly because the fielder has something to do with where the hitter ends up as well (if a ball is hit to the OF and a baserunner goes first to third, the OF gets more credit if the hitter goes to second than if he stops at first — it may be that in general the fielder has more control over the lead runner’s progress, but from what I’ve seen of arm calculations, it looks like they disregard the idea that the fielder has any control over the hitter’s progress).
And it’s, as far as I’ve heard, never been proven that the numbers they come up with really correspond to runs saved by defense — I’m sure they’re trying hard, but it’s flat-out hard to know. On the whole I think UZR is cool and neat and maybe useful over a long period of time.
no, I don't think
that they do UZR by month. It’s simply my personal observations; he’s moving back towards the wall, he’s making more running catches.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 26, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
the question is:
how much of soriano’s value in the outfield derives from his arm? he has been among the league leaders in assists the last few years. is his UZR affected by throwing? if so, then i think it’s a bit misleading.
soriano definitely has a plus arm (see: accuracy), but he is not at all good with the glove.
"If you play more than two chords, you're showing off."--Woody Guthrie
by buckmulligan on Jul 26, 2009 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions
defense includes
the arm and the glove. You can’t separate the two.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 26, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
remember this is compared to the average left fielder
not exactly a position known for defensive excellence.
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 5:30 PM CDT up reply actions
What part of
above zero do you not understand? Yes, Soriano stunk as a 2b. So? That’s why they moved him. They moved Rick Ankiel to the outfield. Players move positions.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Albert Pujols has moved.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 5:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I think the moved him b/c they had Jose Vidro in place
who was also an all-star secondbaseman, but incapable of playing anywhere else
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
Soriano led all major league second basemen in errors every year from 2001 to 2005
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
its a very good thing
sorianos not the second baseman for the cubs then, right?
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 25, 2009 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions
I was just saying the Nats didnt really have cause to move Vidro either
nor could he really go anywhere else
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
And I was just sayin
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
when fangraphs first hit the web
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
When someone leads the league in errors for 5 years in a row
There’s OBVIOUSLY a problem with his fielding.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
the statement was a career plus fielder
that is true.
Bitch about him playing poorly this year, but he’ll have to really turn up the awful to undo his career “plus-ness”
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe at LF...
But we initially signed him to play CF. I think we can agree that would’ve probably been a disaster?
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions
well
that’s why he was moved to left.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 5:06 PM CDT up reply actions
and that was a bad idea
just like Dunn in the OF is.
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions
His defense is....not so good
But for a horrible team, he is having a very, very good season. 25 HR, 70 RBI OB .403 SLG.553 BA .275…this doesn’t suck.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jul 26, 2009 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Holy Ronny Cedeno batman
Kevin Gregg’s favorite Detriot Tiger Ryan Rayburn over-slid second base.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
Unlikely, yes.
No chance? You can’t say that. Haren has been traded twice before for a package that the Cubs could do. The best pitcher in baseball has been traded before (Santana) for a package the Cubs could do.
DEJESUS!!!
The best pitcher in baseball
in a pure opinion.
Can the Cubs trade for Haren? The can, but it’s a matter of how much can they give up without risking the whole future.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
If Haren is available...
then I feel confident saying that there’s zero chance that the Cubs can come close to matching the packages that multiple other teams can and will offer.
Haren being available...
Could possibly lower the asking price of Halladay? Just a thought.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions
If only one team were shopping for a starter, then yes
but since there’s several teams supposedly on the lookout for an ace, I don’t think so.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
I would guess
if the Cubs are talking to the Jays it’s about Scutaro rather than Halladay, but who knows. Maybe Jimbo needs to dump Bradley’s salary in order to afford Halladay/Haren.
DEJESUS!!!
This.
I seriously doubt we are anywhere on the Halladay radar.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions
If the kid, who caught the ground rule double ball, was about 8 years old...
…then, geez, do not pressure him to throw it back. I would have been thrilled when I was a youngster to have caught a ball during a game. The reaction the Wrigley Field security also sounds as if it was stupidly heavy handed. I’m not sure giving the kid another ball later is adequate recompense.
On the other hand, I do wonder, what a 7 to 8 year old was doing in a stadium alone?
I believe there was an adult with him, but...
… security surrounded the kid before the adult could get there. At least that’s the way it looked from where I sat, not far from where this all happened.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I don't even understand
what the point is of throwing back a ground-rule double. We don’t throw back foul balls, either. Sheesh.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
+1
"Do you want a bunch of duds walking around with their shoulders slumped and having no emotions, no feelings?" Bradley said. "I don’t think the fans want that. I think they want a guy who’s going to get into the game and feel a little bit. I’ve always said, ‘I don’t really play baseball, I feel it.’ "
Amen
Sillyness
Jackie likes the smell of cut grass, he used to play ball on Saturdays, Playin in the sun...
I remember one time when "we" threw a foul ball back and everyone cheered.
not sure of the team, but it was an ex-Cub who hit it.
Can’t remember the circumstances either but I’m pretty sure it was either a sincere throw back because it was from a hated ex-Cub like Hundley (Dodgers) or more of a just-kidding throw back because it was a beloved ex-Cub like Maddux (Braves).
anyone else remember this?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
You have to be completely
wasted to want someone to throw back a ground rule double. Drink ten beers right now, THEN you’ll get it.
DEJESUS!!!
see
and I just got back from the restaurant. If only I’d known!
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 7:44 PM CDT up reply actions
the whole thing was BS from the bitter old man stone.
The guy is useless and should be put out to pasture. He’s a joke.
A Joke
That forgotten more about baseball than you will ever know. Shut up troll.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
by WayneCampbell08 on Jul 25, 2009 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Another thought
if Lou and Von Joshua put in all this work to get Bradley fixed and his swing from the LH side is back……why on earth would you ever trade a hitter like that?
His swing from the LH side is "back"?
After a handful of at-bats this week? Small sample size?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I can't believe
you called out everyone on the website for being stupid and then made this post.
“a hitter like that”?
DEJESUS!!!
well
when Milton Bradley is hitting like he can he is putting up a very strong OPS. Normally you dont deal hitters like that.
True.
But we have seen little evidence of that sort of hitting, and as I said it’s no longer “early”.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
but
we have a long track record of it. I ask again, is it wiser to assume that Bradley will never again hit from the LH side or to assume that he is in a prolonged slump?
This is why I said that...
… I think Bradley is not in the right situation for him. He puts too much pressure on himself — we have seen evidence of that. Those kinds of things can prolong slumps, even to the point where they last 2/3 of the season.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
maybe
I don’t put as much stock into the off field stuff as some. I think its just a matter of time before he gets his swing fixed.
In the meantime, even a partially functioning Bradley is better than the 4 headed platoon of doom mentioned today
"A matter of time"?
95 games isn’t enough?
Further, if Bradley were traded, I doubt they’d do so without acquiring another OF bat to replace him (Adam Dunn, maybe).
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
two things
Its still under 300 AB’s Al. That isnt very statisically siginigant. Its not nothing, but it isnt much to make a big judgement off. Espeically with hundereds more AB’s saying this will most likely correct itself.
RE- Dunn- I think us sabrmagicians have shown why on the field its not a good idea. For people who take off the field stuff into higher account like yourself, there are good reasons not to get Dunn as well
forgive the
AWFUL spelling- I have to head to the store
What "off the field" stuff regarding Dunn are you talking about?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
"intangibles" probably....
since I assure CalCalender is going to go with the standard…“Dunn-is-bad-a-defense-and-will-make-babys-cry-if-he-plays-in-the-outfield” excuse.
Funny that he refers to himself as a sabermagician, and yet can’t see the advantage Dunn’s offense provides will far outweigh his below average defense. It’s like having an Alfonso Soriano that can hit for more than 2 weeks at a time.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Uh....
What statistics are you looking at that tell you that his offense outweights his defense, let alone far outweighs?
I haven’t seen any that indicate that. The closest he gets is best-case to be like a +2 or +2 WAR.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jul 25, 2009 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess I should have framed that statement...
in relation to what we’re gotten from the RF position in recent history.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions
I think it's obvious...
That Dunn eats kittens and punches kangaroos in his spare time.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I can live with that
Eating kangaroos and punching kittens, though – nope, gotta draw the line somewhere.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
seriously, I'd recommend eating kangaroos for everone.
It’s one of the healthiest meats on this earth.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
i've never had kangaroo soup.
now a kangaroo burger, yessir, i’ve had a few of those in my day.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
If true, this only increases his value in my eyes.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions
santos
go read Dunn = Morgan over at Fangraphs
should explain things nicely
or the cliff notes
Adam Dunn is = to Nyger Morgan when you factor in his defense.
Think about that
Except that small fact that Dunn has done what he's done with a bat....
~.900 OPS almost every year for 6 years
And Morgan has about one season of AB in his entire career…..so yeah…they’re EXACTLY the same player.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions
i can tell
you didnt bother to read that did you?
I read it...
defensive metrics are also really really imperfect and you don’t seem to want to lend ANY credence to my point either. Dunn is head and shoulders better at hitting than all our current OF’ers.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 5:06 PM CDT up reply actions
read closer.
Dave Cameron gave Morgan’s defensive stats a heavy regression based on the fact you mentioned above. So even if Morgan isn’t as good as he has shown so far, he still is = to dunn in overall value.
Look, I get it, Dunn is fun to watch. Before defensive metrics started to improve I thought his value was much higher as well. But the facts are that Adam Dunn is a historically awful OF. And RF at Wrigley is the last place he should ever find himself.
OK, I give up. I'll get a Milton Bradley Jersey...
and enjoy 2 more years of “defense”.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Get him one of these

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Good idea
He’d be the only one stupid enough to actually carry it in the field.
"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 25, 2009 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions
The media questions would be the best part!
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
someone posted
something about how some scouts don’t think that Dunn is “a winner”. I’m not entirely sure what that means.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 25, 2009 4:56 PM CDT up reply actions
He is so lazy
in LF that Tom Tango of all people complained about it
thats like me giving Cedeno props for his clubhouse attitude
I don't think he's lazy...
Just… really… slow.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:59 PM CDT up reply actions
its been
a long running complaint about Dunn that he not only is really slow but its prone to loafing around.
Maybe he's just like an Ent...
and it takes a while for him to commit to movement.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jul 25, 2009 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Playing for...
The Reds and Nats have probably given him a “loser” stereotype?
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions
So playing for the Cubs should turn that around 360 degrees!
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 5:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Come home Dunn...
Come home.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 5:05 PM CDT up reply actions
It's still early in his contract...
which is what we use in our valuation of him. If you’re argument is that only this year matters then maybe you could argue we need to look elsewhere and dump him for some ostensible short term upgrade.
But if we’re trying to estimate his value for the duration of his contract, than its pretty damn premature to formulate an opinion. He’s only had 280 PAs…
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jul 25, 2009 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions
My implicit point...
in case it isn’t clear, is that it seems far more likely that even if Milton struggles for the rest of this season, he will probably return to normal production in the subsequent years of his contract. (That’s based off of his career norms).
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jul 25, 2009 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions
He's not...
And he hasn’t all year, so…
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I think
I think it was an “if this is happening” statement and not an “it has already occurred”
"Do you want a bunch of duds walking around with their shoulders slumped and having no emotions, no feelings?" Bradley said. "I don’t think the fans want that. I think they want a guy who’s going to get into the game and feel a little bit. I’ve always said, ‘I don’t really play baseball, I feel it.’ "
The Heilman disaster caused us to use our closer yet again...
for the 3rd game in a row… neither of which were close situations at the start of the 9th inning. Pathetic.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Fortunately, Gregg threw only four pitches.
He could probably go tomorrow if needed.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
We need to stop wasting him on unnecessary appearances.
It’s bad management… and, I don’t even like him, but I’m sticking up for him here.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Oh... please, pretty please.
Make it overcast and turn the lights on for Harden…. wear blue jerseys, and tell him to change the time on his wristwatch
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
dont forget shaded sunglasses
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 25, 2009 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Not really bad management...
Heilman pretty much forced Lou to pull him and put Gregg into the save situation. 4 pitches and a save, I don’t think Gregg is too upset about that.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Guzman had only thrown 11 pitches in the 7th.
I wanted him to go two
That's big talk for a little guy,
but I'm walkin' without reply.
-Lil Wayne "Mr. Postman"
by shake n bake on Jul 25, 2009 4:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Heilman
should only be used in blow outs one way or another at this point.
Why don’t we see more of the Shark? Is he in Lou’s doghouse?
by salparadise23 on Jul 25, 2009 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions
That's a good question.
Why have those guys (Shark, Stevens) on the team at all if they are only going to be used in 8-run blowouts or extra innings?
You’d think that Heilman could protect a 4-run lead in the 9th. If he can’t do that, he shouldn’t be on the team.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
stevens
in particular has looked sharp. And F7 has looked better
len and bob were talking about something interesting regarding Shark.
They said if Hart went 6 or 7 innings and the Cubs won that Lou and Larry were thinking about having Shark start tomorrow so they could allow Harden to start Monday Night in a night game vs the Astros. Not sure how I feel about that, but idea is intriguing.
by MandMexpress12 on Jul 25, 2009 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Fine!
Can’t be much worse than Harden’s 7+ ERA in day games at home.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
I really wouldn't mind...
Shark starting tomorrow, pushing Rich to Monday night.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions
He SHOULD be used in long relief
but Lou keeps trying to make him into something he isn’t.
"I daydream just like everybody else, I just do it with my body facing the field, so everybody thinks I'm paying attention."- Greg Maddux
by Doggie Stalker on Jul 25, 2009 4:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah...a ML Pitcher.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 25, 2009 4:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I can't imagine
who would think Fuld would be a full time player if Bradley was dealt ???
Well Ok I could make an educated guess but how but just having him on the roster. A tad more versatile than
Hoff with just a bit more speed & defense.
"I daydream just like everybody else, I just do it with my body facing the field, so everybody thinks I'm paying attention."- Greg Maddux
Can someone tell me if DLee is OK?
Why did he get replaced with Fox? I was watching somewhere with no volume on the TV
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Damn it... the same thing as last time.
At least he didn’t miss any games after the last occurence.
The baseball gods hate us.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Hoffpauir had been used as a PH in the bottom of the 6th.
Which I think is why he wasn’t out there for Lee.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
Off the top of my head..
Aren’t the Dbacks experiencing a problem at 1B right now? They have Josh Whitesell / Chad Tracy playing there right now, and it’s not like either of them are the second coming. Hoffpauir anyone?
A little bit...
He played today there, and Lou said he might get the start there tomorrow.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Lou, Lou, Lou
so when Derek Lee goes down, we use Jake Fox, and he says he might get the start there tomorrow. If that’s the case, why in the hell have we not used Fox basically at all since Soto went down?
If he was worried about not getting the backup catcher hurt, why is Fox “maybe” going to start at first tomorrow instead of Hoff?
Lou’s moves continue to confound
by WanderingWanderer on Jul 25, 2009 4:49 PM CDT up reply actions
He said Fox...
Then he paused and said maybe Hoffpauir, I’d like Fox to get the start, but my guess would be Hoff.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Because he's saving Fox for the playoffs?
Geez… all he talks about is finding a way to get Fox’s bat in the lineup. Well… friggin do it already!
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
not having him be the only catcher behind Hill would be a start
The Dynamic Duo has made some terrible roster decisions this year, and that is among the top of the list
by WanderingWanderer on Jul 25, 2009 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions
you sir, are an idiot
by Orval Overall on Jul 25, 2009 5:04 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Hoffpauir?
No they would want Fox at least. Along with Vitters and a couple of other high rated prospects.
Tamia Lynn Davis:
Born: August 18, 2008
Why would they want Vitters / Fox
If they have Mark Reynolds? Obviously there’s going to be some prospects involved, but here is what I see on their team:
They are set at catcher with Miguel Montero emerging and Snyder good enough to be a partial starter / backup
1B is a black hole
2B isn’t that great, but Ryan Roberts has been doing okay
SS has Stephen Drew, set there.
3B has Mark Reynolds, he’s having an All-star caliber year
2/3 of their OF are young guys with a lot of promise (Upton / Parra). Young has not been good this year, but he’s also young.
I mean technically they have Conor Jackson on the DL but the guy has a scary illness and nobody knows how he’ll be when he finally recovers….
they could always move whoever to make room for Vitters
Reynolds can play 1st or 3rd, he can steal a few bases so one can assume he’s athletic enough to play a corner OF spot
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
You guys
don’t know what you are talking about. There is nothing scary about Jackson’s illness – recovery will be 100%, it just takes time. 1B is not a black hole, in fact, they have multiple quality options there. They just got the 1B of the future. 2B is a the real need, but nothing the Cubs could offer would be an upgrade.
Hoffpauir anyone?
Not sure what that question is asking. Hoffpauir is older than both Tracy and Whitesell and isn’t doing any better than them either. None of the 3 are the second coming, but maybe they can fight it out to be the third or fourth coming.
Tracy has valley fever
Whitesell has not been doing well at all. Not saying that Hoffpauir would be great, but at least he could solve some of their issues right now. (Obviously there would be more in this deal)
Rebuttal
Whitesell hasn’t been doing well only a 7OPS+, but neither has Hoffpauir and his 82 OPS+. Also Hoffpauir is two years older than Whitesell. Neither one looks to have much of a future in the majors. Hoffpauir’s inclusion in a proposal for Haren would have no impact in making it more palatable for the D-Backs.
No
Conor Jackson is the one with Valley Fever. Tracy was hurt earlier in the year, but is healthy now and is hitting well. Whitesell has not had enough ABs to make a judgement on, but every indication is that he will hit at the major league level.
Besides, the D’Backs got their 1B of the future from the White Sox a couple of weeks ago for Tony Pena. His name is Brandon Allen and he is tearing it up in AAA Reno.
As I said below
The D’Backs already addressed 1B in a trade a couple of weeks ago with the White Sox. They got Brandon Allen, who was one of the WS top prospects. He appears to be the real deal.
I'm off.....
To meet Andre “the hawk” Dawson in person at a local Triple A game tonight. Hopefully when I get back I have a ton of autographed stuff and some new additions to the current Cubs.
Go Cubs Go!!!!
hmm - think I read somewhere once that a baseball weighs about 4.5 ounces
so if my math is right, a ton of autographed stuff would be around 7,111 baseballs. Not sure how many 8×10s that would be… ;-)
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
More on Haren...
He’s signed to a very team friendly deal thru 2012. The only reason the DBacks would trade him is if they get an offer that blows them away. The Cubs simply can’t do that.
Al, I know you merely said that the Cubs inquired — but I’m sure it was a very brief phone call. Haren isn’t going anywhere.
How much is that painting...
$10,000? Okay thanks bye.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Jul 25, 2009 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Absolutely correct
Publicly, the D’Backs have said they cannot imagine that somebody could come up with a package that would entice them to deal Haren, but that doesn’t mean they wouldn’t listen.
Privately, it has been said that Dan is the closest they have to an “untouchable” outside of Justin Upton.
Folks, I have to say THIS is why I love baseball MORE than any other sport.
It’s a beautiful summer Saturday. The Cubs have already won their afternoon game. And we get to spend the rest of the day tossing around “hot stove” trade rumors involving the Cubs (my #1 team) and the Tigers (my #2) team and a host of other MLB teams, players and minor league players.
God, this is the best time of year for a baseball fan…
(…at least until the WS parade down Michigan Avenue.)
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
It's a fun time. Speculation run amuck!
Hee…Hee…
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.

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