Booing or not booing and why
This was in the game thread and Al touched on it in the last paragraph of his game post. I figured it belonged in its own thread and not as a hijack.
To boo or not to boo?
I personally try not to boo unless I am perceiving a real lack of effort or I see a flat-out stupid play.
An outfielder making a bad throw after hustling to get to the ball is NOT boo-worthy to me. That same outfielder throwing to the wrong base IS boo-worthy.
I try not to boo failure when there is effort. But in general, I am pro-booing, or at least, pro-choice booing.
I think the fans pays their money and deserve to see a product. At the end of the day, this is entertainment. If you went to a rock concert and saw a shoddy show, you'd be upset.
I am anti-cursing, anti-invective and certainly anti-racist comment, but good old-fashioned booing? Bring it on.
I get most of the arguments against it. It's lame. It can be disruptive to other fans and the average fan, after 6 beers, wouldn't know a smart play from a dumb one. Fair enough.
But there is one argument that burns my ass and that is the reason for the thread.
"The player knows he failed! Why boo?"
Folks, we do not boo to provide information. We do it to vent. By that same logic, D. Lee should not have been cheered when he hit the grand slam, since he is an intelligent baseball player and knew he just hit a homer.
"Booing doesn't help!"
It is not MY job to make the player hit, field or pitch better. There are highly-paid coaches armed with state-of-the-art video equipment to do that.
I am not there to serve the player's needs. They are there to entertain me and provide me with a nice distraction to my day. I have a job, a wife, several dogs and a baby on the way. At any one time, I am stressing out over something.
The Cubs (and Bulls and Packers and Blues and Illini) provide release from that.
And if that means booing, even when it is illogical, ill-conceived and against my own rules, is part of that.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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100 comments
Comments
I don't disagree
And hey, Packers . . . cool.
But the booing of Bradley last night made little sense. If the crowd doesn’t like him, boo him when he’s announced. But they had it in mind to wait to see what he did and boo every out. Seemed juvenille.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 3, 2009 7:58 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I would not have booed Bradley
and it was especially stupid considering how quickly the fans went from “YAY! Grand Slam!” to “BOOO!”
I’m just saying the whole notion of “We need to support Bradley because he’ll hit better if we do!” is stupid.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 3, 2009 8:11 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I know
I didn’t mean to phrase it like I was contradicting you; I think we’re on the same page.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 3, 2009 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought the same thing...
How do you cheer loudly for a good 60 seconds or so, and then shift that emotion to boos 15 seconds later? Really bizarre.
by kanderber on Jul 3, 2009 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately.. I think the MB booing may be a Jaques Jones situation..
I don’t want to start a sh!t storm as to why, so I’ll just leave it at that. I will say that it only takes a few people beeing loudly for the boos to be heard – so I think most people probably aren’t booing bradley (though I wasn’t at the game). One thing about cheering the guy on is that it can quickly drown out the boos. I live too far to goe to Cubs games, but if I did go, I’d probably choose to cheer for Bradley. He’s a guy on my team.
by DisCUBbobulated on Jul 3, 2009 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, that booing was quite lame.
To me, it sounded like “Hey, you did not hit a home run, too. You are therefore worthy of our beer-soaked, illiterate scorn.”
"You have to have short-term memory, no matter who you are in this game. There's always tomorrow." ~Derrek Lee
by Goodie1969 on Jul 3, 2009 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
The Packers should be booed
…whenever possible.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jul 3, 2009 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bite it!
:)
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 3, 2009 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If people want to boo then so be it.
The people put down hard earned money for seats at the game. Do I agree with it? No. Some people are entertained by booing, others by heckling. I myself would find no joy in this. If Milton wants to stop getting booed he may want to fill the role he was put on the team for to begin with.
I don’t doubt the mans want to win. I do doubt the way he goes about it though. It is frustrating to say the least.
by jajonez77 on Jul 3, 2009 9:11 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I choose not to boo.
It just ain’t my thing.
In Milton Bradley’s case, booing is probably particularly counterproductive because he does seem so acutely aware of the crowd. I mean, OK, if Milton throws a ball into the stands with only two outs, I can see why he would be booed (though I still wouldn’t).
But the guy is clearly having mechanical issues with his left-handed swing, and he finally seemed to break through a little bit last night. Of course, many (if not most) of the fans booing probably aren’t familiar with the term “lefty splits.”
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 3, 2009 9:18 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
well
i boo everytime aaron heilman comes into a game.
by TJ3117 on Jul 3, 2009 9:31 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
That's different.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jul 3, 2009 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I too am pro-choice booing
But it just doesn’t make sense to boo. I mean what’s the difference between Bradley being at the plate with runners in scoring position and Lee at the plate in the same situation. When Bradley is up they boo. When Lee is up they chant “Let’s Go Cubbies”. So in other words, when Bradley is up it isn’t appropriate to root for the Cubs over your disapproval of a player?
by daeviant on Jul 3, 2009 10:07 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If booing
is more likely to hurt a player’s performance than help it (as I believe is this case with Bradley), I don’t care what your rationalization is for doing it. You’re an idiot (directed at the faceless masses who insist on booing whoever the easy target is at the moment for the past 5 years).
Wrigley has turned into a pretty hostile place for the home team if a player gets into any kind of slump. Fans can insist they paid their money and have the right to boo, but I don’t see it being productive in any way, probably more the opposite.
Booing should be reserved for players not showing effort. Used sparingly, I think it can be effective. The way it’s used at Wrigley makes us look like bad fans.
DEJESUS!!!
by tomas21 on Jul 3, 2009 10:34 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
boo
its pretty obvious the fans are not taking to bradley. his reputation will follow him everywhere. hit and all will be forgiven.
by NOMAR on Jul 3, 2009 10:36 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
i think it's perfectly fine to feel you can boo your own team
when its warranted
when the Cubs of the 1978 team walked on the field, I wanted to boo .. the waste of time was almost criminal and the futility levels were insane. But I didn’t because I’m a Cubs fan .. and because if I booed every time I saw the LL’s on the field, I’d get throat cancer after blowing out my vocal chords and die.
I think the last time I had the chance to be somewhere when the Cub fan booing was clearly pathetic was that ill fated game in which Kerry Wood got beat all over the field by the Braves in one of the last games of that nightmarish 2004 season. Fans were frustrated and began booing everything that moved, and when the bleachers started tossing junk on the field, everyone started booing the bleachers “RIght Field Sucks” became the cry up on the terrace level boxes. It was a juvenile moment for us all.
Last night, from what it sounds like, was kind of stupid but not totally unwarranted. Still, Bradley has a bat and a brain and a brilliant potency that occasionally conjugate and make some noise. The best way to shut them down is to do what he’s being paid to do.
Blue mountains high .. Blue valleys low
I don't know which way we will go ..
One summer dream .. one summer dream ..
coda
ELO, 1975
by cubnational on Jul 3, 2009 10:51 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Bradley should have been cheered
For running hard on the ball he hit back to the pitcher. Because he was hustling and taking nothing for granted, he almost beat it out when the pitcher made a lackadaisical throw.
by Mike Vails Evil Twin on Jul 3, 2009 11:00 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Bradley is turning into
The Carlos Delgado of the Mets last year. Delgado is a better player but it’s similar circumstances.
Bradley isn’t hitting, has bad plays in his position and people start to boo. Bradley turns around and hits better but people still boo him just as much.
Just wait until he gets a big time home-run….everyone will ask for a curtain call. And I seriously think he won’t give them it….unfortunately deservingly so.
by ak123 on Jul 3, 2009 11:02 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Who actually says the word "Boo"
Is what Im wondering, I find expletives more effective or a few ‘you gotta be kidding me’s’
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Jul 3, 2009 11:10 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Booing Bradley is just wrong yesterday, that guy is trying.
I would boo Bradley when he tossed the ball in the stands before the third out.
or if Sori hops before a ball and drops it
or if someone admires a potential homerun and it goes off the wall resulting in a single.
Stuff like that, when they don’t have their heads in the game. Not just the normal not producing stuff.
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
by KaliCub on Jul 3, 2009 11:56 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
There's a lot of reasons I don't boo.
The main one is that I’m not an asshole.
by Wreckard on Jul 3, 2009 12:20 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
fine
ill be an asshole booing until they actually win a playoff game. its not like they have a payroll over 130 million or anything. this isnt tee ball. if i suck at work my boss doesn’t say ‘oh well you’ll get them next time, nice effort.’ and im not being paid 18 million a year.
by TJ3117 on Jul 3, 2009 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, you're a regular working class hero booing them like that.
if i suck at work my boss doesn’t say ‘oh well you’ll get them next time, nice effort.’ and im not being paid 18 million a year.
I hate to burst your little fantasy about your role in this equation, but in no way shape or form are you the boss of any of these players. You’re a customer.
by Wreckard on Jul 3, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And customers have every right
to express displeasure with the product.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 3, 2009 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure, of course they do.
But having that right doesn’t make it right.
by Wreckard on Jul 3, 2009 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
please elaborate
on how booing is wrong? are we suppose to coddle million dollar athletes? the fans booing should have zero affect on the players. the only thing it does is it lets the frustration out for a fan base which hasn’t seen a championship in over 100 years! but i guess that makes those fans ‘assholes’
by TJ3117 on Jul 3, 2009 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You keep mentioning their salaries
as though making millions somehow makes them less human. As though your inability to make millions somehow entitles you to treating them like shit. They’re still people, they’re still going to fail from time to time.
the fans booing should have zero affect (sic) on the players.
If you believe that, then why do it?
I have no idea to what extent it affects the players. But I know that it’s certainly no fun to work in a hostile work environment, and that if I had a choice between two jobs and one of them was a supportive environment and one of them was hostile I’m pretty sure I know which one I’d pick.
When I was young I was taught that sportsmanship is valuable; that even though winning is important it’s important to both succeed and fail with dignity and respect. I believe fans share that same responsibility.
by Wreckard on Jul 3, 2009 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
That's shor purty
But the most unrealistic thing I’ve ever read.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 3, 2009 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hostile?
people booing is hostile? it must really hurt their feelings huh. i bet they start crying when they get into their Escalades and drive to their penthouse suits. give me a break.
by TJ3117 on Jul 3, 2009 4:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
people booing is hostile?
Um… yes?
it must really hurt their feelings huh.
Probably? Even though they make more money than your subliterate skills allow you to, they are still people.
i bet they start crying when they get into their Escalades and drive to their penthouse suits.
Man you’re obsessed with this class thing. Are you sure you’re not just booing them because they’re actually good enough at something to earn more money tan you?
by Wreckard on Jul 3, 2009 11:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your comments about why you don't boo are perfectly reasonable.
However, I do not think you have the right to judge those who differ with you as “assholes”. Not cool.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 3, 2009 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not backing off that one.
I’d say the same thing about diners who stiff their waitresses, customers who are rude to salespeople, or bosses who berate their subordinates in front of everyone. This isn’t some kind of lifestyle choice, it’s called treating people with respect. I’m sorry but people who don’t do that are the very definition of assholes.
by Wreckard on Jul 3, 2009 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your comparisons are, in my opinion, not accurate.
It’s really simple. Fans register approval of good play by cheering. I believe they have the right to express disapproval of bad play (however they define it) by booing.
You’re free to disagree. However, I’d ask you to stop the namecalling.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 4, 2009 4:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
:)
Not the most elegant way to put it…but I think this is kind of how I feel.
by CubsWin!Oregon on Jul 3, 2009 5:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
To boo, or not to boo: that is the question:
Whether ‘tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, ’tis a consummation
Devoutly to boo wish’d. To die, to sleep;
To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there’s the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause: there’s the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would booar the whips and scorns of time,
The oppressor’s wrong, the proud man’s contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law’s delay,
The insolence of office and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels booar,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover’d country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather booar those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o’er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action. – Soft you now!
The fair Ophelia! Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remember’d.
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on Jul 3, 2009 1:15 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Boo if you want
I just don’t see the point.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 3, 2009 4:40 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Not for me
I have not booed a Cubs team or player in 50 years and am not going to start. On the other hand, I am not going to go “Tsk, Tsk” like an old maid at those who pay their money, generally support the team and decide to do so.
I have read comments about booing affecting players’ performance and leading free agents to turn down more money to play in Chicago because of fear of being booed. Y’all need to stop taking yourselves so seriously.
WhistlerWilliams
by WhistlerWilliams on Jul 3, 2009 5:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
For the folks out there that are anti-booing, flip it around and answer me this - why do you cheer?
I’m assuming the biggest reason is because you’re happy with the results of a player’s effort. Well, why not just be happy? Why do you have to vocalize your emotion?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jul 3, 2009 6:16 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
To Cheer or not to Cheer..............
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on Jul 3, 2009 6:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
because it's fun to celebrate
in a group. It’s NOT fun to rip somebody down in a group. At least, I don’t think it is.
When we cheer, we’re sharing in the good moments, and it feeds the players as much as it does us.
Booing doesn’t.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 3, 2009 8:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
are you in the "booing has no effect on the player, so why bother" camp?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jul 3, 2009 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm in the
“why make a player on your team feel worse for something they already feel bad about” camp.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 3, 2009 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because I'm not doing it for or against them
I’m doing it to vent. Booing is about me and MY feelings.
The team is here to entertain me. I am not here to serve the team.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 3, 2009 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
That sums it up pretty concisely.
And I agree, even if I don’t often boo.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 4, 2009 7:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
To put it even more concisely...
As for me, I boo because I cheer.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jul 4, 2009 8:29 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I understand that
I do. And if you want to, then you should go right ahead.
But I think it DOES make the player feel worse, and I don’t see the point.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 4, 2009 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Players fully understand that booing is part of the game.
They also understand if they play well they’ll be hailed as a conquering kings. Only the most sensitive players let it truly affect them.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 5, 2009 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and
where do you come by this knowledge? I would expect different players to be affected differently.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 5, 2009 9:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I said that it does affect some of them.
Players are supposed to be professionals. What do professionals do? They do their job without worrying about outside influences, or any other thing outside of their control.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 6, 2009 12:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure I agree with that.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 6, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A good comparison
Not sure what you do for a living, but if you allowed yourself to be pre-occupied or very distracted by one angry customer/client how would it affect you? Your performance on the job would suffer for an X amount of time. I’m in sales, and if I get upset over a lost client or a prospective client it will surely carry over to the next business meeting or whatever.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 6, 2009 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but the players
already talk about how the cheers are great for them. How they want to do it for the fans. I posted a trailer for a cubs film a while back, and Derrek Lee talks about winning the WS for the Cubs, and how vested he is in that because of the fans.
We’re not talking about one person. We’re talking about having 40,000 people boo you. And I don’t see the point.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 6, 2009 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, thanks to you then, it will just be 39,999...
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jul 6, 2009 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
true dat.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 6, 2009 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
All 40k?
I don’t think every fan boos at once, but I see your point. This is another reason why they get paid the big bucks….to go out and perform under a lot of pressure. Booing and cheering is part of the fan experience, and well within their right. The only time I boo is when a player is dogging it like Sori does on occassion. To me, there’s no room for that. Fans are helping to pay for their salaries and should give 100%, 100% of the time.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 6, 2009 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I appreciate your point of view
but I’m relatively sure I would have a hard time doing my job if only 15 people were standing behind me, yelling YOU SUCK.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 6, 2009 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Especially an office job
you wouldn’t be able to hear yourself think.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 6, 2009 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Apostle Mark DeRosa
in his Letter to Rooters, book five, verses 1-5, say:
And lo, did I take the field with my bretheren
And the assembled masses did focus their intent upon us
And we did reign victorious 97 times
Not 96 or 98
99 was right out
And the voices of the masses were as like unto
The host of God all screaming
THIS IS THE YEAR
And I did have to raise my glove to my face
And scream into the void myself
to release the pressure.
The Gospel of Mark DeRosa, The Book of Rooters, verses 13-24, say:
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 6, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow, that's just strange.
Was that an excerpt on his blog or something?
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 6, 2009 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, I just made it up! :D
DeRosa did talk on his Cubs Blog last year, about the pressure and noise being SO INTENSE that he would raise his glove to his face and just scream into it to try and relieve some of it. I just made it all, you know, biblical. In recognition of his holiness. :D
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 6, 2009 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
All 40k?
I don’t think every fan boos at once, but I see your point. This is another reason why they get paid the big bucks….to go out and perform under a lot of pressure. Booing and cheering is part of the fan experience, and well within their right. The only time I boo is when a player is dogging it like Sori does on occassion. To me, there’s no room for that. Fans are helping to pay for their salaries and should give 100%, 100% of the time.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 6, 2009 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And I respect that choice.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 3, 2009 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pro booing people
using some kind of logic to justify thier reasons to support? the Cubs. Here’s my view on this.
I assume you are a Cub fan
You then root for your team whether they win or lose since you are a fan.
All players on the team are Cubs.
Root for all players on Cubs.
Seriously why boo for a player on our team. Would you boo for kid that your son didn’t like on his little league team. Oh I forgot the he’s getting paid and I can treat like garbage therefore arguement. Knowledgeable fans know when to boo players and when not to. Cub fans have not called knowledgeable fans, passionate maybe.IMO
by GHCF2314 on Jul 3, 2009 9:06 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Not a valid comparison
Would you boo for kid that your son didn’t like on his little league team.
Key word being, “kid”. Anyone who would boo a kid has very questionable priorities and judgement.
How is booing someone treating them like garbage?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 4, 2009 7:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This begs the question
when does a boo become a boo? Is it when the expression of disgust is conceived and expressed, or is a boo only a boo when someone actually utters the word “Boo”? Frankly, I think a lot of the noise a player might hear from the stands is actually a garble of mixed profanity that only sounds like booing.
So, which is more demoralizing? Suggesting someone’s mother may be less than honorable, or saying “Boo”?
"You have to have short-term memory, no matter who you are in this game. There's always tomorrow." ~Derrek Lee
by Goodie1969 on Jul 3, 2009 9:26 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
For purposes of this discussion
A boo is the general all-purpose expression of derision. “C’mon!” “Geez!” or “WHAT???” fits in as well.
I draw the line at personal attacks and profanity and especially racial comments.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 3, 2009 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
According to J.L. Austin
A Boo is an illocuationary act or a speech act. That is to say that by opening one’s mouth and making the prerequisite noises, one is performing an act.
This is like a bet, a prayer, a vow, an apology, or curse. Hate speech is an area of rich research for rhetoricians. (see Judith Butler’s “Excitable Speech”) ISTM the issue is not with uttering the noise, “boo,” but if this is an acceptable way to express dissatisfaction.
Some support their performance of this speech act due to it’s impact on the players. Others support the act because it has no impact on the players.
Some condemn the act because of how it reflects on the actor.
That’s about all I have to offer on the subject, but it is kinda funny to deconstruct the whole thing and consider that yelling such an odd noise is such a divisive topic of conversation.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
by Reddevil on Jul 3, 2009 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If a boo happens in a forest with no one around, does it make a noise?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 4, 2009 7:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since 2003...
Cub fans have have shifted from the lovable losers, to a team that is expected to win. They take no prisoners. If any player is not playing up to their capabalities for an extended period of time, they will be a prime target for the fans that have been waiting a lifetime for a championship.
by montecarlo on Jul 4, 2009 2:52 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Boo everyone, everywhere, for everything, then no one's feelings will be hurt or at least not anymore than the next person
by DudeVf11 on Jul 4, 2009 8:24 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If booing is outlawed, then only the outlaws will boo
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 4, 2009 4:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
boos don't hurt players' feelings
people who boo hurts players’ feelings.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 4, 2009 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it might be interesting to explore the idea of home-field advantage here...
Most teams in whatever sport have a significantly higher winning percentage at home than on the road. The Cubs certainly win more games in Wrigley than on the road year after year. What contributes to this difference?
Certainly, a greater familiarity with the playing conditions is part of it — for example, being more familiar with the idiosyncrasies of playing the Wrigley outfield should (on average) give our fielders an advantage over visiting outfielders.
But surely, a significant part of the phenomenon of home-field advantage is due to the support of the home fans. Would anyone dispute that?
If you agree that home-field advantage is at least partially due to the support of home fans, then it follows that the performance of players IS affected by cheers — which conversely suggests that their performance is also likely to be negatively affected by boos.
Maybe I’m being overly simplistic about this but to me it’s that simple — if you’re there at the game cheering then in some tiny way you’re helping your team, because collectively the ballpark full of cheering fans has a positive effect on the performance of the individual players and the team as a whole. I suggest that the flip side is that by booing you are going to have a negative effect on the team. As a fan, why would you want to hurt your team?
(postscript — you could argue that booing could motivate someone to perform better and that might be true for some people, but I just don’t believe that most people are wired that way.. )
"People ask me a lot about the values I got from playing for the Cubs for so many years. The value I got out of it was patience. A lot of people these days are not very patient." -- Ernie Banks
by CubFanInCanberra (9387milesfromWrigley) on Jul 4, 2009 11:07 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think that's part of it.
however, I also think that home field advantage exists because you play a LOT of games there, many more than are played at any one field on the road. You get to know the field, the way the wind works, the exact way the wall goes, etc.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 4, 2009 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know my post was a bit long...
..so you probably ended up skimming a bit. :) But that’s pretty much what I was referring to in the second mini-paragraph up there…
"People ask me a lot about the values I got from playing for the Cubs for so many years. The value I got out of it was patience. A lot of people these days are not very patient." -- Ernie Banks
by CubFanInCanberra (9387milesfromWrigley) on Jul 4, 2009 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I did miss it.
apologies.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 4, 2009 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no worries
I’m more curious to hear how a “pro-booer” would respond though…
Do they just not believe that booing would ever have a negative impact on an individual’s performance? Or do they just think their need to vent outweighs any other consideration?
"People ask me a lot about the values I got from playing for the Cubs for so many years. The value I got out of it was patience. A lot of people these days are not very patient." -- Ernie Banks
by CubFanInCanberra (9387milesfromWrigley) on Jul 4, 2009 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would also add
that at one time I found cubs fans too classy to boo their own; seems things may have changed.
by CubfaninRaleigh(869milestoWrigley) on Jul 4, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Booing
There’s a giant difference between booing when the man is obviously trying and booing when the situation is appropriate. I’m sure if a player desecrated the American flag, decked his own teammate or intentionally played horribly, the booing would definitely be warranted. But booing a man when he’s trying probably isn’t the best thing to do.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
by Ace Venom on Jul 4, 2009 3:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Defining why people go to games
I think understanding the different opinions in this debate is to understand why we all attend ball games.
For a lot of people, they go to games to root on the team and show support. This goes back to the notion that the presence of cheering, applauding boosters helps players perform to the best of their ability. It gives them energy and adds an extra boost.
But for others, they go only to see a game in person and nothing more. While the experience of attending a game is obviously different than watching it on TV – sunshine, fresh air, hot dogs – the intent is still the same. There’s no purpose for being there other than watching the game, and as such their presence has no bearing on the performance of the players.
So it makes sense, then, that the attendee-as-loyal-follower won’t boo because it upsets players who already know that they’re playing poorly. Conversely, the attendee-as-spectator has no problem booing because they perceive a disconnect between what’s happening in the field and the stands.
I’m in the “attendee-as-spectator” category. While I have no personal proof to support my opinion, I’ve always felt that an overwhelming majority of professional athletes aren’t affected by the noise of the crowd. That’s because the level of performance needed to play at just a basic level of ability in the major-leagues level requires blocking out all extraneous sounds, sights, and distractions. They can’t be bothered to care – and if they do, then they shouldn’t.
by CaliCub on Jul 4, 2009 10:07 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I would still argue
…that the actions of fans contribute a lot to the phenomenon of home-field advantage (HFA).
Baseball is somewhat unusual in the large differences between different ballparks, which obviously contribute a lot to HFA. But HFA can still be a huge factor in sports like basketball and football where every court/field is more-or-less designed to the same specifications.
The travel etc. involved in road games as opposed to home games would also be a factor, but surely, it’s got something to do with fans?
"People ask me a lot about the values I got from playing for the Cubs for so many years. The value I got out of it was patience. A lot of people these days are not very patient." -- Ernie Banks
by CubFanInCanberra (9387milesfromWrigley) on Jul 5, 2009 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cogito ergo boo. I think, therefore I boo.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jul 5, 2009 1:46 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
cub fans only boo african americans
wrigly field crowd loves to bash black players
take it easy
by angryandy on Jul 5, 2009 4:16 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
That's so wrong I can't even begin to tell you.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 5, 2009 5:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
As a black man I am offended by that remark. The Cub fans love DLee like he is a god. The Cub fans
cheer winning and boo losing just like any other fans. There are always ingnorant people who embarass all of us, but they don’t represent the majority of Cub fans. I have been to many Cub games and have sat in all sections of the park. Your statement is patently false. There have been many white players who have been booed un-mercifully by Cub fans. The common thread is that they didn’t perform up to expectations.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jul 5, 2009 8:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This would explain
the all the Todd Hundley love-ins.
"You have to have short-term memory, no matter who you are in this game. There's always tomorrow." ~Derrek Lee
by Goodie1969 on Jul 5, 2009 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Aaron Miles
would like a word.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 5, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Todd Hundley would as well
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 5, 2009 9:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, I totally missed that Goodie.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 5, 2009 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Andy, Andy...why so angry?
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 6, 2009 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's face it, it all comes down to the money...
…while not applicable to all players but certainly a significant majority, money is where it’s at; always has been, always will be. The highest annual salary and/or years.
Deep down inside many fans are envious (not jealous) of those earnings. It’s when the player is thought of less-deserving is when they’re more scrutinized. Players’ attitude also figures into this.
If fans want to question a players’ work ethic, that’s fine as long as it’s on a player by player basis, it’s based on his performance/desire and not in some general category; like I’ve seen commented in this thread.
I’ll admit I boo and heckle players, and most of the time it appears to be on the outcome of a play. But most often its based more on the approach (like swinging for the fences instead of a grounder to the right side for example).
I’ve also been some star-crossed Cubs’ players best friend in the bleachers over the years. I gave Corey Patterson hell, but I always encouraged him. There were a few times even up a Miller Park with the roof closed; all 40k+ heard, “COREY !!!” echo throughout the stadium. Same went for Jacque Jones and a few others. And it wasn’t always during a game but at BP too.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jul 6, 2009 12:08 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
no i am never jealous of players earnings nor other cub fans
I think fans boo and get drunk and create a carnival atmosphere at Wrigley because the Cub fan seeks too much attention compared to other baseball fans. They have an inferior complex
take it easy
by angryandy on Jul 8, 2009 2:13 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

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