My Fix to the Chicago Cubs
by Rami on Jul 8, 2009 9:42 PM CDT
60 comments
Hello, I'm a brand new to this site, and I think I have a lot to contribute.
The problem with the Cubs as of late is certainly not the pitching, but rather the offense, which is simplified by non-existent run production, and lack of production from our corner outfielders. My fix revolves around Alfonso Soriano. Soriano is our highest paid athlete, yet he's constantly unhappy, and basically worthless as of late. When Soriano first arrived to the Washington Nationals in 2006, the skipper thought he would fit better as a corner outfielder, because of their need for the position. Before this time, Soriano was considered one of the faster players, who was a speed threat on base.
I think that the outfield has kept Soriano off his toes, and basically made him less valuable. Soriano may be a power hitter, but he has the body of a base stealer.
Here's my fix: let's send Soriano down to the minors to play some second base. Play the rest of the all star break with either Hoffpuair or Fox in the left field position, and basically get them in the habit of going out there every day. When Lou thinks the time is right, we bring Soriano back up and plug him in at second base.
Our Cubs lineup:
1. Fukudome
2.Theriot
3. Lee
4. Ramirez
5. Soriano
6. Bradley
7. Soto
8. Fox
9. Pitcher
Looking at it like this, it's a pretty dangerous lineup. Of course, Hoffpauir and Johnson would be outfield subs, and Fontenot and Baker would be infield subs.
Give me your thoughts. Thanks.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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Welcome to the site!
Right off the bat, Soriano must agree to a minor league stint because of the 5/10 rule, and I’m highly skeptical that he would agree to such. Second, Andres Blanco is our only backup at short, so you have to include him on the roster somewhere. I think Soriano’s lack of stealing bases in more based on his leg problems than him playing the OF, but most importantly we need him to start hitting.
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jul 8, 2009 9:47 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
5/10?
I agree his contract may prohibit a minor league assignment, but not because of 5 and 10. He’s only been here 3 years.
by Orval Overall on Jul 9, 2009 7:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he's probably out of options right now
…not that he wouldn’t clear waivers with that albatross of a contract.
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
by Archie on Jul 9, 2009 7:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Count me in
On letting Soriano play second. I’m just worried he’ll be more worried about his defense and it will take away from his hitting. But he was put on this team to hit, not steal bases, that was just gravy.
"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 8, 2009 9:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
wow
on my 4 hour drive back home after the game on Tues. night I thought of this same thing….. but my lineup had fox and soto switched
the more I thought at 2am was that the defense would be god awful… and I just dont see Sori goin to minors and him at 2nd…
I figured maybe the only time we could see it is in colorado.. where we could win each game 15-10
by cubs2410 on Jul 8, 2009 9:57 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Just my Opinion
but I would move Lee out of the 3-hole. I know he is hot right now but I would put Milton in the 3 hole and Rami hitting cleanup with Lee hitting 5.
Go Cubs Go!!!!
by cubsluver22 on Jul 8, 2009 10:00 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I am also a fan of Bradley in front of Lee.
At least Milton has a good OBP and Lee has been driving in runs by the bunches.
Although I’d go Bradley, Lee, Rami. But either way I’m for the switch.
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
by KaliCub on Jul 8, 2009 10:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Soriano at second base = ugly
He’s a MUCH better defender in the OF than he is in the IF.
Nobody who ever gave his best regretted it. -George Halas
by Allie on Jul 8, 2009 10:02 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
and consider how brutal he is in the OF
that’s not a good thing. :)
"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly
by ambrosiadreams on Jul 8, 2009 10:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No but see he'll practice a lot!
And get better at it! Magically! In a couple of weeks! Even though he did it for years and sucked at it!
The we just need to do the same thing with Jake Fox will at third!
by Wreckard on Jul 8, 2009 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
While we're at it lets move Milton Bradley to shortstop !!!
Alfonso Soriano was a truly wretched 2nd baseman in New York and Texas. Very, very, very bad. And that was several years ago when he was still in his 20’s.
$136 million payroll for a .500 style ballclub. Good work Jim.
by BLou on Jul 8, 2009 10:10 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Unhappy?
Where in the world do you come up with that?!
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
by cubswynn on Jul 8, 2009 10:10 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Nevermind.
I just saw the fanshot. This is the first time he’s been mad since his holdout threat with the Nats.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
by cubswynn on Jul 8, 2009 10:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like it
but I doubt Soriano would ever agree to dropping down to the minors.
But I like Soriano switching to second, but at the same time, I realize how disastrous that would be to our infield. Let’s face it, Soriano is a terrible fielder, but having Fox in the lineup gives us a better chance to score runs. We also need to realize that having Soriano platoon with Fox will not allow Soriano to get out of his funk.
by cufban2522 on Jul 8, 2009 10:17 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Lineups, for the most part, don't matter.
You know that, right?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
by dtpollitt on Jul 8, 2009 10:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
but positions do
Sori at 2B and Fox in the OF is just not a good thought unless you are an opposing hitter who can aim the ball at them.
"I daydream just like everybody else, I just do it with my body facing the field, so everybody thinks I'm paying attention."- Greg Maddux
by Doggie Stalker on Jul 8, 2009 10:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, you are correct Jessica.
Soriano @ LF is a career 7.4 zone rating, and @ 2B, a career -10.2. That’s a net sum of 17.6 runs per year. That’s a ridiculous sum. Soriano hasn’t played 2B for more than a spotty game here or there since 2005. FOUR YEARS PEOPLE!!
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
by dtpollitt on Jul 8, 2009 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
soriano is and was a train wreck at 2b
wells4roty
by jesus christos on Jul 8, 2009 10:57 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
HOW ARE WE EXPECTED TO BELIEVE OR UNDERSTAND YOUR LINE UP/CUBS FIXES
WITHOUT USING CAPSLOCKS BECAUSE WE WILL THINK LESS OF YOUR IDEAS AND YOU WITHOUT THEM. PLEASE FOLLOW THE ERIC HANNA RULES WHICH ARE FIRST USE CAPSLOCKS BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL TAKE YOU SERIOUSLY AND UNDERSTAND YOU ARE FORCEFUL IN YOUR THOUGHTS SECOND DO NOT USE PARAGRAPHS BECAUSE THEY WILL GET IN THE WAY OF YOUR THOUGHTS THIRD PUNCTUATION IS OPTIONS JUST CAUSE FORTH MAKE AT LEAST ONE OFFENSIVE COMMENT ABOUT MILTON BRADLEY FIFTH COMMENT JUST ONE TIME BE MERCILESSLY MOCKED TO THE POINT OF SWL TAKING PITY ON YOU AND NEVER POST AGAIN.
OH AND LOUD NOISES!
(This story was produced by BCPDnewservice. Our motto: If you don’t like this story then suck it!)
by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on Jul 9, 2009 12:20 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jul 9, 2009 1:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
(This story was produced by BCPDnewservice. Our motto: If you don’t like this story then suck it!)
by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on Jul 9, 2009 1:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm all for change
But Soriano moving to 2B this season doesn’t seem like the right fix and he’s not going to play in the minors with that salary. While his hitting is nothing to write home about I do believe he’s had 2 multi-hit games since moving down in the lineup. They weren’t the best hits, but he still got on base so that’s an improvement.
As for 2B, Cubs need to find a solution to this in the off-season. Mark DeRosa wasn’t going to fix this one because he would have been a FA anyways.
Either Cubs need to sign a really good FA, maybe re-sign DeRosa back, or they need to work the entire off-season with Fox and Soriano at 2B. I’ve heard everyone say that Fox can’t move around the bases to be a 2B. I really believe there needs to be some sort of effort to see if he can make the transition in off-season.
And I’d say we should move Soriano back to 2B ONLY if he and Fox were hitting right now and it was the only way to get them in the lineup at the same time.
by ak123 on Jul 9, 2009 1:37 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I know I might be unpopular for this
but I think that DeRosa is probably getting close to done. He is on the wrong side of 30 and has a wrist injury. He was always a capable hitter and at times quite good, but I think that his best seasons are behind him now. Signing DeRo to a deal (which would probably be multi-year) sounds like the typical Cubbery of over-paying for past performance.
I’m not saying that he doesn’t and wouldn’t have value, but I don’t think that he is really the solution and might not really be much of an upgrade at all over a much cheaper Fontenot. (Not that he should be the solution either…)
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
by Archie on Jul 9, 2009 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I tend to agree
But DeRosa had his best two years the past two years so there’s no guarantee he would have been in a decline this year that’s substantial.
I haven’t been one of those people on the DeRosa being traded is a bad thing bandwagon. While I think it wasn’t a good move, I understand their reasoning. The one thing is, he would have been the perfect compliment to the team with Milton Bradley on it. He would play RF when needed and 2B when Fontenot was getting cold. Oh well…
by ak123 on Jul 9, 2009 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You do realize defense matters, right?
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 9, 2009 3:46 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You lost me at....
Here’s my fix: let’s send Soriano down to the minors to play some second base
NOT. GONNA. HAPPEN.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Jul 9, 2009 6:47 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
maybe he meant to say
Here’s my fic: let’s send Soriano down to the minors to play some second base
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Welcome
Just a word of advice, if you post ridiculous ideas you will get bombarded with critical responses.
by rlpete on Jul 9, 2009 7:41 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Soriano just threw a bitch fit
because he didn’t get his proper notice over not playing.
Do you think he’s going to the minors???
Moving Soriano to 2B to make room for Hoff or Fox isn’t the worst idea, but it’ll have to wait for the off-season. If he were to play 2B exclusively at spring training, it might not be a total catastrophe. It could just be minor disaster.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 9, 2009 8:27 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
a bitch fit?
I think that’s a little overstating the situation.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, it's not
I’ve defended Soriano too, drew, but when he yammers on about “wouldn’t have shown up ready to play,” then screw him and the horse he road in on.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 9, 2009 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
as I've said
that particular comment does look bad.
But I wonder how many players don’t have a different routine when they aren’t going to play.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They probably do
And let’s face it, that routine probably includes a few bad habits, such as staying out later or having a few beers instead of just one.
Soriano insists on high-status treatment when he is playing at a level that would get him benched or even waived if he didn’t have that contract.
That is a major problem. And I’m past caring whether or not his routine is messed up.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
by Worf on Jul 9, 2009 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but you just contradited yourself.
either players DO have two different routines, OR Soriano is getting “high-status treatment”.
I don’t think he’s getting anything of the sort; I simply believe that Lou thinks as I do — Soriano has to play it out.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have to so pin some of the blame on Lou..........
He has mis-managed this guy from day one, pampering him and giving in to his whims. I’m not holding Soiano without fault, but if Lou would have treated him like everyone else from the get-go then maybe Soiano would think he was SPECIAL
"We got some pretty good chemistry here. We got some toughness, and it's starting to show." - Lou Pinella
by Clutche on Jul 9, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
there's an R in his name.
Please provide evidence that Soriano has been pampered or has had any whims fulfilled by Lou Piniella.
Be specific.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How would you define "high-status treatment"?
Sounds to me like he just wanted to play and was just kinda pouting about not being in the lineup.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sigh.
The Soriano at 2B thing isn’t going to work for the reasons posted above.
This team is going to have to win with who it’s got, unless suddenly Jim Hendry finds a way to trade for a major bat — and that isn’t going to happen. Not because they don’t want to, but because so many teams are in contention that no one is trading right now.
The move to make is signing BJ Ryan. Virtually free and no-risk.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 9, 2009 8:49 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I actually noted that Ryan was cut in the game thread yesterday.
We could add him, try to revive his season as a LOOGY, and get Marshall back in the rotation.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
by SackMan on Jul 9, 2009 9:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll give you some credit, Rami.
A number of Cubs fans – a disturbingly large number – have flown the “Move Soriano to 2B!” flag this season, but I believe this is the first time someone has suggested sending him to the minors first to relearn the position. Sadly, all you’ve done is put a comic twist on a tragically bad idea.
Once again, I would ask anyone who would seriously consider moving Alfonso Soriano to second base the following question: Do you like double plays?
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2009 11:23 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
On offense or defense?
Do you like double plays?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 9, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
On defense.
Picture Soriano turning a 6-4-3 double play. Go ahead – I dare ya.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2009 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can't.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, he could hop over the baserunner
Of course, he’d be off the bag when the throw came in
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Jul 10, 2009 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fixing the Cubs in 5 easy steps
1. Do something with David Patton, there are 3 options as I see it. 1, actually let him pitch in games. 2. Send him back to the Rox. 3. Package him with a prospect for a useful reliever, or at least, a pitcher that Lou will use in games.
2. Trade for Kelly Johnson. He hits left handed and plays 2B, two needs for the Cubs. Martin Prado might have made him expendable and I could see the Braves maybe having an interest in Hoff, Fox or RJ. Could also consider trading for Cristian Guzman and moving Theriot to 2B.
3. Decide quickly if Casey Fossum can help as a LOOGY. If not, make nice with BJ Ryan. If not, make #1 work and make the pitcher you get back be named Joe Beimel or John Grabow.
4. Bat the Pitcher 8th with Ryan Theriot hitting 9th.
5. Ask (politely) all the people on the team that have sucked this year to stop sucking so hard in the 2nd half.
If that doesn’t work, you become sellers at the deadline and try to move gregg, harden, and one of the massive contracts in your OF.
by circuitclout on Jul 9, 2009 11:38 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You forgot
About getting Adam Lind.
"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jul 9, 2009 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
also
the live chicken.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Alright, I'll play.
1. I don’t really see how Patton is hurting this team, unless he’s shooting spitballs at Cubs hitters from the dugout. Also, the team has apparently already “fixed” this problem to a certain extent by DLing him.
2. You know who else plays 2B and bats left-handed? Mike Fontenot! Kelly Johnson’s OPS: .645 (263 PAs). Mike Fontenot’s OPS: .670 (269 PAs). It’s a wash, and before you say, “But Kelly Johnson plays good defense!” Mike Fontenot plays really good defense. Johnson is definitely not worth giving up RJ for, probably not Fox or Hoffpauir either.
3. I do agree that the Cubs need to take a close look at Fossum and perhaps give him a shot while Demp is out and Marshall is (presumably) back in the rotation. And I have to think Hendry is checking into BJ Ryan. Seems like a long shot, but doesn’t hurt to look. Neither one will “fix” the team, though.
4. I’m personally not opposed to batting the pitcher eigth, but Lou has scoffed at the idea on multiple occasions. Plus, it makes a little more sense when you have a “sure thing” like Pujols or a Braun-Fielder tandem in your lineup. DLee’s recent hot streak aside, no one on the Cubs has been anywhere near a sure thing this season.
5. It’s always nice to be polite.
And whether the Cubs will/should become sellers at the deadline will depend on the standings. I guess I could maybe see Hendry taking offers for Harden and Gregg, but the big contracts in the OF are going nowhere, fast.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2009 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
not helping
is basically hurting. i just tend to think that basically playing with a 24 man roster puts you at a disadvantage. Yes, having David Patton on the roster might not be killing you. But only having one lefty, having to overuse Marmol, Gregg and Guzman and being unable to play matchups because you can’t/won’t use the 12th pitcher you insist on carrying are clearly not helping win ballgames.
by circuitclout on Jul 9, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Guys at the bottom of the pen don't see much action anyway.
I do agree that taking a Rule 5 guy into the regular season was a big gamble that the Cubs probably shouldn’t have taken, but there weren’t a lot of great options to round out the bullpen anyway.
And I don’t think the lack of lefties has played much of a role in Marmol’s repeated overuse or Guzman’s impending overuse. (Has Gregg really been overused? He’s the closer.) Lou just goes with who he’s comfortable with – and for the last couple years, that’s been Carlos Marmol. Now Guzman has managed to work his way up the ladder.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
game log
patton has appeared 17 times this season. 10 of those 17 (11 if you count his first appearance) came on 4 or more days rest. 9 of 17 have come with the cubs trailing or leading by 4 runs or more (essentially blowouts). and twice he’s been used in extras because he was the last guy left in the pen. At one point he didn’t pitch for 15 days. That’s some excessive underuse.
By contrast, Jose Ascanio has appeared in 14 games despite only being with the big league club for 6 weeks.
by circuitclout on Jul 9, 2009 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Riiiiiiight...he's buried in the pen because he's a Rule 5 guy.
Again, that has nothing to do with Marmol’s overuse. Lou was overusing Carlos last season when Patton wasn’t around.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2009 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
every pen
has a guy who isn’t used often.
I'm a Cubs FANATIC. They are my team, through thick and thin. [ibid] This is the kind of fan I am.
by drewishdrewid on Jul 9, 2009 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Patton's on the DL and won't return till after September 1.
That problem’s solved.
Of the rest of your suggestions, #5 might be the toughest.
And I’m definitely on board with getting BJ Ryan.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Jul 9, 2009 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
just wondering
do the rockies have any recourse here if they want patton back. or do they just have to take us at our word that he is hurt?
by circuitclout on Jul 9, 2009 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i've heard theres
a limit of how often a rule 5er can go on the DL… but its definitely more than one time.
I just hope this year of not pitching hasn’t hurt Patton’s development. I really don’t like how they’ve handled him at all.
Nobody who ever gave his best regretted it. -George Halas
by Allie on Jul 9, 2009 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
everyone knows
you need a live chicken, i thought that went without saying. also worth reminding people that candlesticks make a nice gift, maybe a place setting….
by circuitclout on Jul 9, 2009 12:07 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Please use the reply function.
I've committed to tweeting about the Cubs for the rest of the season. (Does that sound as ridiculous as I think it does?) Anyway, if you're on Twitter, you can follow me here.
by dat cubfan daver on Jul 9, 2009 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
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