Groundhog Day: Kevin Gregg Gives Up Walkoff Again, Cubs Lose 4-1
by Al Yellon on Aug 18, 2009 8:00 AM CDT
in Chicago Cubs Recaps
Email
PrintThere's no sugarcoating this one. (Thanks to San Diego Smooth Jazz Man for the headline suggestion.)
Kevin Gregg gave up his second walkoff home run this month -- after being one strike away from nailing down a save. Kyle Blanks' three-run homer gave the Padres a 4-1 win over the Cubs, dropping them to six games off the NL Central lead (with the Cardinals defeating the Dodgers 3-2) and four games out of the wild card lead.
It was Gregg's sixth blown save of the year and Lou Piniella has, at last, had enough:
After Kevin Gregg gave up four two-out runs in the ninth inning in a 4-1 loss to the Padres on Monday night, Piniella said he plans on removing Gregg from the closer's role.
"I think we're going to make some changes as far as what we're going to do in late innings," Piniella said. "We'll have some more tomorrow [Tuesday]."
Piniella didn't say who would be his new closer, though Carlos Marmol and Angel Guzman are considered the likeliest candidates.
"And death is not an option": if Lou chooses Marmol, the blown-save parade is likely to continue, only it would take longer; Marmol's M.O. this year has been to blow leads via walks -- he's allowed only one home run this season. Gregg, on the other hand, has given up 12 homers. That is, as Gordon Wittenmyer points out:
... tops among relievers in the league and more than starters Randy Wells or Carlos Zambrano in a fraction of the innings.
So to me, the choice is obvious: Guzman, despite his relative lack of major league experience. He has been the Cubs' best reliever all year. Gregg has talent, but at this point he has to go back to Aaron Heilman territory and be used only in low-leverage situations.
Gregg's blowup ruined an outstanding return from the DL by Ted Lilly, who threw six shutout innings and allowed only four singles and a walk. He was going to be limited to 85-90 pitches but was pulled after only 70 for PH Sam Fuld, who singled. This was a waste for two reasons: one, it made the bullpen come into the game earlier, and two, it took Fuld out of consideration for defensive-replacement duty in the ninth inning. Do you think Fuld might have caught up with Chase Headley's ninth-inning double? Maybe not, but he'd have had a much better shot at it than Jake Fox did. The Cubs played shorthanded last night with Ryan Theriot not available (he should be in San Diego tonight after staying home an extra day with stomach flu). Why not use Jeff Baker as a pinch-hitter in that seventh-inning slot?
John Grabow and Marmol did a good job last night at keeping the game close after the Cubs had scored their only run on a Derrek Lee double and Aramis Ramirez RBI single.
And then came Gregg's disastrous inning.
Like I said, I'm not going to sugarcoat. That was a bad game, and Gregg is going to be replaced at closer. But if you are looking for me to say "it's over", you should know me well enough by now to know I won't do that with 46 games remaining in the season. The dead-tree edition of the Tribune (can't find this online) had an instructive chart showing the remaining games for the Cubs and Cardinals. It reads:The Cubs and Cardinals meet for three in St. Louis and have 21 identical games on the schedule (same opponent, same home/road). Each plays the Reds three times (Cubs at home, Cardinals on the road). Here are the games that don't cancel out:
CUBS CARDINALS 4 at Giants 3 at Rockies 1 at Dodgers 1 at Padres 3 vs. Mets 3 vs. Marlins 3 at Mets 3 vs. Braves 4 vs. Pirates 3 at Astros 3 vs. D'backs 3 vs. Brewers 1 vs. White Sox
It would appear to me that the Cubs have a slight schedule advantage; the Cubs also may have a bit of an advantage in the wild-card race because the Braves and Marlins play each other 10 more times, and the Giants and Rockies also play each other 10 times. Those four could knock each other out while the Cubs sneak ahead.
But to do so, the Cubs have to start winning games, especially vs. bad teams like the Padres. Start tonight, please.
651 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
goodie for you
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
I see the mood will not be
a happy one today. I wish I could just give up on this team, but the fan in me won’t.
by niuhuskie224 on Aug 18, 2009 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions
Sorry, but waking up and, before leaving bed, hearing the bottom half of the 9th...
did not get me off to a good start this morning.
It’s now 3:06 PM local time here.
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
I always thought it was a donkey well...
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
I thought it was Todd Wellamule
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Didn't miss it. Note I did not us profanity as indicated
by the space between the words.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
I appreciate that.
I have to tell you though, I am a little lost here. Are you offended by the picture? Or is there something you are trying to tell me? I am not really sure what is going on I guess.
Nothing of any sort.
Just poking at you in good humor. Second time the picture came out ( I like it), and trying to be cute pushing the profanity edge.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Cool man, Thanks!
I was afraid I offended somebody, because I am not trying to do that, like you, just poke a little fun.
http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1776175
I think I speak for everyone here when I say, "Wait, what the hell are you talking about?"
I went to bed
after the Cubs pulled ahead 1-0. I was praying to God they could find a way to hold on to the lead. I guess it wasn’t meant to be. But did it have to be with Gregg being one strike away from saving the game? Geez…
Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!
I went to bed
right after Gregg gave up the game-tying double with two outs and a full count. I didn’t even know he gave up the game-winner that same inning, I figured they lost it in extras. Pathetic.
"I don't think anybody's paying attention to the Cubs." - Prince Fielder
I went to bed
at the end of the game. Got up and started milling around, packing my lunch, whatever else, after it was tied up. Told myself i didn’t want to wait for extras. Wish i’d have turned it off as soon as it tied up.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:06 AM CDT up reply actions
he looked
utterly lost last night at the plate. I was begging Lou to put in Baker.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions
The season may not be over, but my gut feeling is, the oulook is bleak
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
According to baseball prospectus playoff odds:
Cards 88.94% chance of making the playoffs.
Cubs 14.69% chance of making the playoffs.
Yeah, the outlook is bleak.
Don't really care whether or not the Cards make it
It’s the 85% scenario where we dont win either the division or the wildcard that bothers me.
Come back next week
and let me know what those odds are. They’re always in flux.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm happy Lou is replacing Gregg. We need to shake things up a bit
and see what helps.
by Cubs and Hawks fan on Aug 18, 2009 8:07 AM CDT reply actions
Gregg's positional title should be GFU...
Guarrenteed F@#$ Up
"Whenever you go to a live sporting event, always bring a seeing eye dog and cane, just incase the refs forgot their's at home."
by Chiefsuntilidie on Aug 18, 2009 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Does it surprise you at all
To wake up and read / watch that Gregg blew another save.
This season problems fall on Hendry’s sholders
"If The Phone Doesn't Ring, It's Me"
How does this all fall on Hendry’s shoulders? I see a lot of players not playing to their potential.
True, but
He deserves a large part of the blame for assembling an ill-thought out roster.
You are correct that the players deserve blame, too.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:11 AM CDT up reply actions
This team is getting old
as evidenced by the number of injuries that they have had this year. That is my biggest concern. The window is closing…
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
It's happened to many very good teams in the past
How many Red Sox teams lost their window of opportunity despite having rosters that included future Hall of Famers?
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
I can think of a few
They eventually figured it out in Boston. I’m not going to use the steroids card here, but they figured out what sort of team they needed to field in order to be champions.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Still wishing
there was an ‘unrec’ function specifically for suggestions like this. It bothers me, because I bet Lou’s considering it….
"They say that money doesn't buy happiness...but it DOES by Cub tickets. You ever see a sad person with Cub tickets?"
I'm retreating to my bomb shelter for the rest of the week.
I’ll come back up when they come home.
"Fasten your seatbelts"-Pat Hughes
It is getting bad in a hurry.
I will root for this team until they are mathematically eliminated, but it is getting hard with loses like this.
I think what upsets me, and most, about how Gregg blows saves is he isn’t giving the HR ball up to Ryan Howard or Albert Pujols, he is giving them up to the following
Ryan Rayburn (Blown Save)
Cody Ross (Blown Save)
Kyle Blank (Blown Save)
Ben Francisco (Loss in Tie Game)
Jeff Francouer (Blown Save)
I mean 5 games where a HR just killed us. KILLED US. You cannot be a closer and blow saves to that list. You just can’t.
I'm a Tigers & Cubs fan and was in Comerica rooting for the Cubs and remember thinking...
who is Ryan Rayburn and how in the bloody hell did he just beat us?
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
THEN YOU WELL REMEMBER
Gregg in game one at Comerica Park. Pathetic again and no reason for it . Neat view from Hockey town though …
I was the Cubs fan sitting 3 rows behind home plate on the aisle burying his face in his hands as the ball left Rayburn's bat.
It had “that sound”…: GW HR
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
I probably was about seven-eight rows behind you
behind the plate at Comerica that night. I saw what Raburn’s stats were, and I had just said “the only reason they brought in Raburn is to hit a home run;” the words were barely out of my mouth when he hit it. That sucked.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I did get a chuckle when I watched the replay of the game on my DVR. Ball hits bat. Face buries in hands...
I saw where my wife and I were sitting and thought- we may be in some CF camera shots. Little did I know I’d be on Sportscenter as Rayburn launched his HR. Ugh.
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
Jeff Francouer maybe?
I guess I didn’t realize who was ruining our nights. Now you have made it hurt even more, haha.
Ignorance was bliss.
by ASpecialGuestAppearance on Aug 18, 2009 8:20 AM CDT up reply actions
That one was partially on Soto
Gregg struck out the previous batter and Geo did a horse$hit job of blocking the pitch, allowing him to reach.
The rest, however.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 8:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Glad I missed it
That was one of the games that our internet connection here in baghadad wouldn’t support MLBTV. Thank god.
by ASpecialGuestAppearance on Aug 18, 2009 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Are you in the armed forces or private industry?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions
Contractor for the Army
Got out of the MC a few years ago. I recently got transfered from beautiful, sunny Djibouti to Iraq.
by ASpecialGuestAppearance on Aug 18, 2009 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Either way, stay safe
And thanks for the prior service!
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Agreed
Now add to this post all of the AB’s Soriano has given away because of his awful approach. Plate appearances against all of the numerous stiffs that have made him their personal rally killer.
Who needs a stinkin' tag line? What are they for anyway?
I knew
you would be able to find a way to blame this on Soriano, who wasn’t even in the game.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions
and what will you do if/when they are mathematically eliminated - not root for them?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Oh, I'm stuck.
If eliminated, I’ll want to see call ups, how Lou behaves, all the hell.
If I can watch most every game in 99 and 06, this year is nothing.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
I'm sure I'll keep an eye on them
But it won’t be an every night thing.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I agree
I’ll watch every game I can. I am enjoying watching Fox and the resurgence of Lee.
by ASpecialGuestAppearance on Aug 18, 2009 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions
That's unbeleivable.
And, here’s the complete list:
8/17 K Blanks
8/11 B Francisco
8/2 C Ross
8/2 D Uggla
8/1 R Paulino
7/16 R Zimmerman
6/23 R Raburn
6/2 J Francoeur
5/16 L Berkman
5/16 C Lee
4/22 J Bruce
4/12 R Weeks
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
The Cubs have tread water this whole season waiting for one team to start winning and take hold of the division.
To their credit, the Cardinals have.
None of the myriad of season-long problems the Cubs have displayed since they started their seven game series against the Rockies and Phillies have gotten better. Remember, we were told that we’d know much more about this team after those games against two of the better teams in the league were over.
We now know this. The Cubs went 1-6 in those seven games. And save some wins against a AA-team playing as the MBL representative in Pittsburgh, the funk continues.
And unless the Pirates and Nationals have been scheduled about 40 times for the balance of the season, even the Wild Card is a remote possibility at best.
Now don’t get me wrong. I believe that until they are mathematically eliminated from all playoff possibilities, that the Cubs still have a chance. I saw the Tigers come back in 1987 against the Blue Jays in the final week of the season when NO ONE (save Kirk Gibson) thought they had a lick of a chance. It CAN happen, and I hope it somehow DOES happen for the Cubs.
But considering their FULL body of work, can you honestly say that the Cubs deserve to make the playoffs based on their play this season?
I can’t.
That being said, I hope I’m proven wrong…
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
by Zeke on Aug 18, 2009 8:13 AM CDT reply actions 5 recs
Reality has sunk in
This is not a good team. What has happened this season to prove otherwise? All they’ve had is a good two weeks against bottom feeding teams to start the second half. All you can grasp on to at this point is that the Cubs play a weak schedule or that maybe they’ll finally “come together”. They’re not technically out of it but I’m not delusional enough anymore to dream big about this team. The Cubs only make the playoffs if about three other teams suffer a total collapse. Then if the Cubs make the playoffs, what makes you believe that they could win more than one game against the Dodgers, Phillies or Cardinals? It would likely be more humiliating than last year. I’ve moved beyond anger and on to acceptance. This team is mediocre at best and this is not the year.
by delusionalcubsfan on Aug 18, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Does this mean you'll be changing your user name?
I’m not delusional enough anymore
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
No....
lol, more than likely I’ll be feeling delusional again by next spring. Then I’ll be feeling pessimistic again by August. Cycle of Cubfandom…….
by delusionalcubsfan on Aug 18, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
I disagree with Al that the Cubs have a slight schedule advantage over STL. We still have
6 against the Mets, who I know are struggling, but they’ve been without the Carlos’ for awhile. The have a good pitching rotation.
We still have to play LAD once, and they’re the best team in the NL. Then we have 4 in San Francisco, where the Giants are doing pretty well too.
We certainly need to be beating the weaker teams in the NL. We have San Diego right now and these are games we have to win. We need to sweep teams like Pittsburgh and San Diego.
Last night’s lost hurt, and it hurt bad, but being 6 games out with 46 to play, and 3 left with STL, we aren’t out of this by any means.
Let’s put together a win streak starting tonight, and get closer to the top by the time the calendar rolls to September.
by Cubs and Hawks fan on Aug 18, 2009 8:15 AM CDT reply actions
The Mets do not have a good rotation.
They have Santana and whoever else is warm healthy body. I am sure they have guys who can look like Cy Young to the Cubs
of late but they do not have a good rotation.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions
They have a dominant closer and a great lineup when everyone is healthy
The starting rotation itself, you are right Doggie Stalker. It’s not that good, but they have the ability to make it up with good offense….when they’re healthy.
by Cubs and Hawks fan on Aug 18, 2009 8:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Except
Their team hasn’t been healthy for the entire season, and now, they might even be without David Wright when we get there….
Clarification,
Those are the scheduling differences between the Cubs and Cardinals.
We play the LA Dodgers one more time than the Cardinals do, so that’s why it says “1 vs. LAD.”
This space for rent ... to anyone who can think of something to put here.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 18, 2009 8:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes indeed, those are the differences...
I still think STL has a slight advantage over the Cubs. It’s just my opinion though. They’re actually not all that different…almost even, really.
by Cubs and Hawks fan on Aug 18, 2009 8:37 AM CDT up reply actions
The Cubs may have a slight schedule advantage
but that is negated by the Cards having a better team and a lead of 6 games.
I don’t see 6 games worth of difference on that schedule.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Okay, campers, rise and shine, and don't forget your booties 'cause it's cooooold out there today.
I love the Groundhog Day reference! I live in Woodstock, IL where the movie was filmed and it has become quite a big deal in our family.
"Fasten your seatbelts"-Pat Hughes
by katie casey on Aug 18, 2009 8:15 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I got YOU babe...
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
Bing!
I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl. We ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters.
That was a pretty good day. Why couldn’t I get that day over, and over, and over…
"They say that money doesn't buy happiness...but it DOES by Cub tickets. You ever see a sad person with Cub tickets?"
My husband and I were at the game last Saturday.
It was beautiful! A day game, hot enough to know it’s summer, but not sweltering, the air show was going on, you could see the sailboats on the lake, we had a couple Old Styles, got to see the “W” fly….I said to him “why can’t we get this day over and over”.
Oh and BTW…Fuld bailed Gregg out in that one too with that catch running into the wall.
"Fasten your seatbelts"-Pat Hughes
Advantage?
“It would appear to me that the Cubs have a slight schedule advantage…”
Even Pat Hughes stated Saturday that in pennant races the “little sisters of the poor” can beat teams they are not supposed to.
The Division? Gone.
Wild Card? Dimmer.
We’ll see.
I wrote a long letter to Jim Hendry today. I’ll let you know if he answers it. I think you all should!
And Al, it would be great to have Crane Kenny “drop by” again in the bleachers to apologize for his G.M., and raising ticket prices in the worst economic conditions in 30 years.
well, it sure sounds like we now qualify at the "little sisters of the poor" level, so maybe we'll start beating all these teams we're not supposed to.
And I bet we’d all be glad to answer your long letter but you have to send it to us first. Why not post it here?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Maybe I will
Ballhawk Ken.
It was tough b/c I tried to be respectful, but my frustration showed.
Basically, I just want to hear personally from him, as a Season Ticket holder, what was he thinking this off-season?
LOL
I can just imagine what the “Meet the GM” session at next year’s Cubs Convention will be like. I’m picturing a really long line of folks at the microphone….
Tom: “Jim, Aaron Miles. What were you thinking?”
Dick: “Jim, Kevin Gregg. What were you thinking?”
Harry: “Jim, Aaron Heilman. What were you thinking?”
etc. etc.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Assuming he still has a job
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Indeed
Tom (Ricketts): “Crane, extending Jim Hendry. What were you thinking?”
Tom (Ricketts): “Crane, the priest in the dugout. What were you thinking?”
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions
No
Trash him here all you want, but that would be going too far.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
And at the 2012 Cubs Convention...
Mrs. Ricketts: “Tom, buying the Cubs. What were you thinking?”
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Me at most dinners with my dad in the summers:
Shanghai Badger: “Dad, the Cubs. What were you thinking?”
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions
While Gregg was a main culprit
do not forget Mike Fontenot leaving a ton of men on.
Aaron Miles accounting for 5 outs in 4 at bats
and Milton Bradley leaving men in scoring position on several occassions.
Jim Hendry’s greatest hits.
Which is precisely why Hendry needs to get canned
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
by Ace Venom on Aug 18, 2009 8:20 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Or caned!
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Good point
Glad you brought up Fontenot. Set aside Miles for a second, Fontenot is absolutely clueless at the plate right now. Absolutely clueless.
Who needs a stinkin' tag line? What are they for anyway?
I couldn't believe it when he swung at the (horrible) first pitch
after the Padres had just walked two straight Cubs to load the bases.
Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!
Neither did the Padres' TV guys
They voiced our collective thoughts – “I can see swinging if the 1st pitch is a fastball down the pipe, but a breaking ball down and in and off the plate?”
Futility is predictable.
Well - in response
the Cubs have risen from LAST in the NL to 12th out of 16th in success with RISP. Now up to .240 BA.
However, the starting pitching has gone from 3rd at the beginning of the month – to 5th.
You mean..
DLee has risen the the Cubs up from last to 12th.
"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"
Baker should be the starting 2B
Until his legs fall off.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
About Miles...
Santo said it best…. “All he does is hit ground balls”
I think I speak for everyone here when I say, "Wait, what the hell are you talking about?"
I'll say it
It’s over. I pointed the same out in June. Quite frankly, it was just as obvious back then as it is now. This is a mediocre baseball team that is playing mediocre baseball and has done so for just about the entire season. When you cut through all the noise, the reality is that despite it’s payroll, this team just isn’t talented enough to win the division. They are proving that on the field on a daily basis. It may be difficult to accept but it is the stark reality.
Lou was right about one thing, his guys will get plenty of rest this season and they’ll be more than fresh for the fishing trips, the golf excursions and the European vacations come October. They’ll be so fresh in fact that they’ll be able to watch the rest of the Iowa chaff come up and play meaningless September games in their stead.
This ship ran aground in October, 2008. Since that time, the only thing that has happened is that guys are struggling to keep their hold on the fuselage.
Who needs a stinkin' tag line? What are they for anyway?
by krummy12 on Aug 18, 2009 8:20 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I think I agree
A team is defined by its motivation, and this team has none. PIniella is apathetic, at best. Players like Fontenot, Gregg, Marmol and Miles have been walking around all season with their heads down.
I’m not sure there’s a person here, in their heart of hearts, who really believes this team can (and maybe should) do anything this year.
*Synth intro to "Jump"*
by SouthsideCub on Aug 18, 2009 8:28 AM CDT up reply actions
It'll be interesting
to come back here in October and see who was right and who was wrong.
You two need a suicide hotline, it appears.
I don’t know what’s going to happen, but sweeping declarations that predict the future aren’t in the plan.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
One unscientific stat re Gregg
He seems to have logged more innings than any other closer I can spot. Despite having played 6 more games
Franklin has pitched 10 fewer innings. Bell, Lidge , Rivera etc all pitched fewer innings. Gregg is bad but I don’t think
it helped that Lou used him so often in non save situations. Also the idea that you have to have a lights out closer to make it to the post season is a myth. LIdge is worse than Gregg and Broxton is not that much better.
Hopefully Guzman can be a good closer.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
You dont need a lights out closer to be a good team
it is simply one component of the team. But when you struggle in other areas and your strength is your starting pitching, your closer is a key component. The Phillies survive Lidge because they win a ton of games with their offense. We dont, and havent been able to survive Gregg.
Really??
How many saves the the pedestrian Lidge blow for last years world champs?
The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
I believe the poster meant this year.
They are in first place despite Lidge’s 8 blown saves.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes....
…and their GM went out and actually IMPROVED their offense…….(see Ibenez)…and they were able to survive a horrible slump from one of their top hitters (Rollins) and pitching
sidebar…..I believe Lidge may be their achilles heel this post season……
The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Last I had heard he was near the top of the pitches per inning ranks too
Which would mean his pitch count is astronomical.
Smoltz
He was released and can negotiate with teams Wednesday.
Supposedlly he was hitting close to 90 his last start, has extensive experience as a closer, and I’ve only read this, was effective his first time through a lineup his last few starts.
The Red Sox are paying him a lot, it could be similar to the Edmonds signing. Do the Cubs have a place he’d have any interest in? NL, contending. Would he come in as a middle reliever with the understanding success in that role could quickly earn the closer’s role?
Grasping at straws? YES.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
My God
Seems you’re on to something that Hendry would do. Back away from the computer.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
by Ace Venom on Aug 18, 2009 8:25 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Really, if he'd sign for MLB peanuts (league min-ish, not real world peanuts, which
are just that, peanuts) what’s the risk? Takes away a 6th inning from Heilman getting going, possibly earns the closer role?
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
You have any better ideas?
After last night, it can’t be any worse.
You can’t get worse than being 1 strike away from a save only to blow the save and the game a couple minutes later.
You just can’t get closer to being 1 strike away from a win.
Just win the next game...!
And signing a washed up pitcher who doesn't know when to hang it up is really going to make it better
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Did signing BJ Ryan hurt the team?
Could Smoltz be any worse than Samarzdja or Heilman?
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Oakley..
I’m with you on this one, at this point it wouldn’t hurt.
We Got This!
by cubbiebear316 on Aug 18, 2009 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions
I have no earthly idea if he has
anything left or whether Smoltz improves anything over what’s there.
I just don’t see how it could hurt.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Red herring
BJ Ryan’s ego was too big to wait for September call ups.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
No, no, no.
He knew he had nothing left. If his ego is so big, why hasn’t he signed with someone else?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Ego or done, either way, it didn't hurt the Cubs.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
hitting 89 with your fastball is a sign that you dont have it anymore
the cubs lineup needs moar LIND and HALLIDAY
by jesus christos on Aug 18, 2009 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Smoltz wouldn't take a minor league assignment from the Red Sox
So I’m guessing he wouldn’t do that for us either. Different situation than Ryan IMO.
Agreed, but that wasn't my point.
Cubs signed Edmonds to a similar no risk deal and he didn’t see any AAA time.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
How about Hundley...
tossing out Bradley! We got thrown out by i guy who has given up 42 SBs and only caught 6 of them. Hilarious.
"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"
he had caught
THREE before yesterday, THREE. Pathetic
that suggests
Higgy was right. My bad.
Either way, Hundley cant throw guys out but we are stuck station to station in a 0-0, 1-0 game
didnt intend to criticize you
so sorry if it came across that way. Maybe ESPN is right, Brenly said three i thought yesterday and then Bradley promptly got thrown out.
Lack of team speed is an underrated aspect of this teams failures tihs season.
not at all bro!
No criticize felt man…i just got more depressed.
"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"
I agree team speed is important
but that last time we had that aspect to our team (Juan Pierre) it wasn’t like that player was very good.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
That whole play felt odd
I wouldn’t think of a steal by Milton there. Felt like it came out of nowhere.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
It made sense...
trying to get a runner in scoring position, but i would not have done it.
"I love this world. I hope hell is as much fun!"
Usually the Padres are the ideal team to steal on
and Hundley isn’t good at throwing guys out, but stealing with Milton in the middle of an AB for Aramis didn’t feel right.
If that was Fukudome or even Theriot, then its open season on those bases.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
sad(der) thing was...
…it wasn’t even close. That throw was down there waiting for Bradley. i bet anyone watching in HD could have seen at least seven ants already setting up camp on the seams…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
It was eerie -
Like Hundley could hear Brenly discussing his inability to throw anyone out and how the Cubs should have success running. No sooner did Brenly stop talking, Bradley took off.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
How happy is Mark DeRosa right now??
The Cubs dump him for apparent salary freeing reasons, sign Aaron Miles to “replace” him and add Toy Man Milton Bradley (who has played reasonably better the second half).
He signs with a team that trades him to what appears to be a WS contender right now. and gets to watch the Cubs from cross division rival as they literally implode. Say what you say about DeRo and his performance, but in my opinion, he was similar to Eric Karros as far as clubhouse leader.
Eric Karros
Never lost it in the post-season the way that DeRosa did last October. If anything, the Cubs overachieved in 2003.
"When you're going through hell, keep going." - Winston Churchill
DeRosa lost it in October???
He scored 2 runs and had 4 RBI’s in 2008 post season….
Cubs only scored 6 runs in the whole series…..so that makes Mr. Mark involved in 66.67% of the Cubs post season production last year….and if I remember correctly, Mr. Edmunds had the other 2 (RBI’s)….
Just looked it up…..Edmunds had 1 and Ward had 1…..so……instead of dumping the non producers last October what does the Cubs brilliant GM do???
The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
One could make the arguement....
DeRosa was the ONLY one who showed up in the post season last year…..his line doesn’t look that bad…..especially with all those round numbers in there…..
Well … it is simple….. who produced for the Cubs last post season (or even last 2) and who didn’t??
In reality the Cubs have 2 players on the roster (with 3 RBI’s between them or 25% of post season 12 RBI’s in 07 and 08)…and they are Soto with 2 and TheRiot w/ 1.) For comparisons sake….WARD had 3 RBI’s in the last 2 post seasons…
Hendry had 2 years to see who the producers are and aren’t in October and he KEPT those that didn’t produce and dumped those who did. That said….they guys who did produce were’t going to play every day and get the Cubs in the playoffs….
The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Zambrano has had two solid starts in the last two NLDS appearances
And as much as I like DeRosa, that homerun was significantly aided by the wind.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions
So take away that home run.....
He would have had 1/2 of RBI’s…been responsible for 1/2 the Cub scoring in last years post season.
The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
1/2 of a pittance is still a pittance
I don’t necessarily disagree with your premise, but your supporting data is shaky.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm rambling and discussing "real small sample sizes"...
But my arguement is with the guy who said DeRosa didn’t show up in October…..DeRosa has been consistently pretty good in both 02/08 Octobers…won’t get him in HOF….but “pretty decent”….(and other than no RBI’s my favorite whipping boy DLee has nice ave/OBP in post season)…..
If the rest of the team had the kinda showing DeRosa did in the postseason…“things might be different”…:)
The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Yeah, ok
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know...
I’m sure the struggles of the team don’t make him happy. He was with the Cubs for two years, and has been a Cardinal for like 2 months….
Utterly disgusting
Someone should tell Gregg that there are 3 FREAKING outs in an inning! Does he just let off the gas after two outs? He has one job and that’s to get three outs. Just embarassing….
by cubbiefanTN on Aug 18, 2009 8:29 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
The NL Central is over
Barring injury to Carpenter and one of either Pujols or Holliday.
The good news is the Wild Card race favors us IF WE WIN GAMES.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
by nji232 on Aug 18, 2009 8:29 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I was thinking something similar when I woke up at 3 and flipped on the TV to see the score
Unless St. Louis utterly collapses, catching them is out of the question. Asking for a sweep in St. Louis and picking up 3 games elsewhere is a lot to ask, given the way the Cubs have played on the road this year.
Looking at the Wild Card, it’s a matter of winning as many games as possible and letting everyone beat up on each other. We’ll see if it happens.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
Yep
The West teams play each other a ton, and so do the East teams. Plus plenty of dates with their division leaders too. Meanwhile the Cubs play the Brewers, Pirates, and Reds. We need to win games, especially road games.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
Most likely the Cubs, if they manage to win the Wild Card
would play the Dodgers.
Exactly what have you seen that would tell you the Cubs would do more than win one game in that NLDS?
Hope. I do not haz it.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I never said we would win in the playoffs
We won’t, no freaking way, not against the Dodgers and not with our bedwetting bullpen. Still it would be nice to make it.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
I'm not sure that I agree
Still it would be nice to make it.
I don’t remember as much failure as a lot of posters here do; I only go back to the 1982 team. I do remember failure, and it’s great that the Cubs have contended a lot more often than not lately.
Still, if a postseason berth saves Hendry’s job, I don’t want it. Because he’s not the one I want in charge this fall fixing things for a better 2010.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions
As discussed yesterday, I'm not bullish on 2010 and a fix.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
I'm not giving up on it.
Reasons I am optimistic:
Lee
Ramirez
Fukudome/Johnson
Either a more consistent Bradley or no Bradley and salary room
Grudingly, Theriot
Lilly
Zambrano
Wells
Dempster
We’ll see if Soto has his wakeup call. I think a summer vacation in Des Moines might make the point more clear to him.
Soriano may or may not be done. But I think that there are enough good players to make a run again with some adjustments. I just don’t want Hendry making the choices, because I don’t think the Cubs need to overpay for anymore utilty players ala Neifi Perez or Aaron Miles, or miscast other players.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions
I'd rather Soto spend the offseason in Arizona
taking nice long romantic walks up and down mountain trails with Dempster.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
That's essentially what I mean by wakeup call
I just think the visit to Sue’s neighborhood might give him more motivation.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions
Forget that idiot clown Bradley
He’s not a winning ballplayer and never will be.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
You can't use a colander to store water
You need a jar for that. You can’t ask Bradley to be your big RBI guy, which is Jim Hendry’s failing. We didn’t need another OBP guy, but that’s what we got.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Ugh.
Yeah… a real loser that guy, what with his .392 OBP.
The hatred for this guy is so ignorant. We have a roster filled with dudes like Aaron Miles. Kevin Gregg has six blown saves. And everyone wants to harp on Bradley.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
A hearty amen to this one
I think you nailed something here, Andrew.
Right on it, Stone
I don’t understand the dislike for MB.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
I understand it, to be honest.
Many here feel he was the cause of guys they had emotional attachment to leaving. But again, i needs to be pointed out… Bradley is not in charge of offering or not offering contracts to players for the chicago cubs… he is an outfielder. Blame Hendry that we have Bradley instead of DeRo or Wood. Blame Hendry that Bradley gets $10 million this season. None of that is on Milton.
All he’s done is top his OBP by 20 points over his career average, and fall short of his career AVG by about 15. He’s done so while staying relatively uninjured, and while having very few of those freak outs we were all so worried about. He may not have lived up to expectations, but he lived up to his history. Expectations being out of whack as far as how he’d play is hardly his fault.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I have to ask
Did you forget the “B” in the front of your username?
I’m trying to be funny, and I understand your frustration (because I’m pissed too), but most of your comments are like this. No suggestions, no insight, just bitching.
Why not add your thoughts?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Bradley has 30 RBI
Less than minor league journeyman Fox and runt Fonty. He was suspended for being a hot head. He plays terrible defense. He threw a ball in the stands with only two outs. He was benched midgame by Lou because he’s a big baby. He gets platooned routinely because he can’t do the one thing Hendry liked about him, hit from the left side. It’s not mindless frustration, it was a mistake to sign this guy and everyone knows it.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
he gets platooned routinely?
It was not a mistake to sign Bradley. Everything pointed to him continuing to succeed at a high level, if not the career level of the previous year.
Everyone makes mistakes.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions
It WAS a mistake if the signing was to get a "bopper"
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Especially considering the cheaper alternatives.
3 years $30M for Milton Bradley is kind of a hilarious sentence. He’s Milton Bradley!
Bobby Abreu, Raul Ibanez, Adam Dunn…. all available.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
only ibanez
abreu and dunn were signed after gameboard got signed
the cubs lineup needs moar LIND and HALLIDAY
by jesus christos on Aug 18, 2009 5:48 PM CDT up reply actions
I didn't say it was mindless
But it is a lot of angry ranting.
I am certain that Bradley never said, “Sign me and I’ll hit 40 HRs and drive in 110”.
Hendry mistcast him.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Once again, whose fault is that?
If someone gives you $30,000,000, you take it, right?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh believe me, I'm well aware of whose fault it is.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Thank you.
Screaming “he’s not playing like he’s making $10 million this year!” reflects about zero on Bradley. He didn’t offer himself that contract.
Meanwhile, i’m not working like i’m making… well… considerably less than that. Back to the Richmond, VA market analysis. TTY all later.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 11:15 AM CDT up reply actions
I think alot of that has to do with...
him batting from the left, his average is around .312 from the fight with 11 of his 12 homers. Maybe he should quit batting from the left, so he can knock some freaking runs in.
"Whenever you go to a live sporting event, always bring a seeing eye dog and cane, just incase the refs forgot their's at home."
by Chiefsuntilidie on Aug 18, 2009 5:33 PM CDT up reply actions
homer error, dont know where i got 12 from
but most are from the right
"Whenever you go to a live sporting event, always bring a seeing eye dog and cane, just incase the refs forgot their's at home."
by Chiefsuntilidie on Aug 18, 2009 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions
uh...
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions
Good point
I suppose saving Hendry is a very bad thing.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
I'm not really sure that Hendry (alone) is to blame.
It’s more like the entire organization and despite the failures post-season failures, the last couple of years weren’t that bad. I remember seasons during my childhood, when finishing “only” 10 under .500 was a good year.
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
Hendry is the man in charge
He freaked out. So did Lou, but Hendry doesn’t have to listen to Lou.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
I remember those years, too
But that’s no reason to return to it.
Hendry had simply a horrendous offseason, and the budget constraints have exposed the folly of a lot of his decisions.
In no particular order:
-$10M to Samardzija – then continually promoting him without him having earned it
-Outbidding the Royals for J. Jones and casting him as a power hitter
-Casting Bradley as a power hitter
-Two years for Neifi Perez and Glendon Rusch in the same offseason, when it was questionable that there was a market for either for one year.
-Carrying Neifi, Enrique Wilson and Jose Macias AT THE SAME TIME!!
-Outbidding everyone by $10’s of M on Soriano, and length of contract (no problem giving him big $ and 5 years, but did it really take 8?)
-Giving Aaron Miles $5M
-Going into 2009 with no backup plan at 3B
-Allowing an overexposed Fontenot to be the starting 2B
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions
The Angels had made Soriano a 7-year offer.
So yes, if Hendry wanted him, he had to do that.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Probably should have let the Angels have him
I’m sure they’re glad he signed with Chicago NL.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
I can't blame him too much for getting Soriano
They were trying to change the mindset of the organization and the perception that the Cubs didn’t want big-name free agents.
So, I’m willing to take that one off the list.
Add:
Giving Marquis away for nothing. I didn’t mind trading him, but they got two weeks of Vizaino, and a Big Gulp for Badger to be named later.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
I've defended the Soriano signing
2007 and 2008 showed that it was a good deal. 2009, which I hope is a statistical blip, showed that it might be a bad deal. 2010 will be a good indicator.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
I have as well.
There were really only two big names that year – Soriano and Carlos Lee. Personally, I’d rather have had Lee – he’s been very good to me over the years out on Waveland and I tremble with excitement what he could do had he been playing 81+ games a year here instead of just 3.
But Soriano made me happy as well because instead of talking about big names and then signing someone from the second tier, we actually went and got a big name.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
IMO, Soriano was
ego backlash from missing out on Beltran and Furcal in prior years.
Hendry went in stronger than prior years to make sure he won. It looked too strong at the time and looks worse now.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Correct, and also...
Hendry misread Soriano’s skillset and believed he was a Pujols/Manny/Miggy Cabrera type elite impact player. Hence the massively prohibitive contract.
Agreed, Hendry thought he was a clutch hitter
who could steal 30+ bases a year.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Hendry also thought he was a centerfielder.
How does a MLB team make that kind of a scouting error?!
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Soriano had decent 07 and 08 numbers, nothing
close to his contract value, but still showed decline over prior years.
If the decline continues and the remaining 5 years suck more every year. Were those two years worth it? I don’t think so, but that’s me.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
No they weren't since...
…neither of those years included a World Series title.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
That's the key
Had it included even 1 pennant, we’d probably be much more satisfied with it.
Hendry rolled the dice on this one and so far, he’s hit snake eyes. But as much as I think it’s time for a change, he probably deserves some slack for this signing. I shouldn’t have included it above.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions
As has been discussed at length on here before
Sori actually more than earned his money in ‘07 and ’08. This year he has given it all back. We will see going forward. I’ll admit, I’m not optimistic…
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
I know, I've been in the middle of most of those conversations.
I have nothing against Soriano and am not dismissing his 07 & 08, but am looking forward and seeing diminished production on an albatross contract creating negatives far outweighing his regular season 07/08 work.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
I expect that you are right
but I hope we aren’t
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
There is no way I want to return to those years, but...
…the shouting & screaming as if the last months have been a total disaster is slightly overboard. This team has real and serious problems, and they have caused by everybody except (maybe) the batboys. I have done my share of venting, but on a more serious level, I am aware that just firing the manager is not going to cause manna to fall from above.
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
Or the GM
Look, I don’t think Hendry’s evil incarnate and done everything wrong.
I just think his past mistakes with outbidding himself and throwing money at problems, combined with the money they already have tied up, makes him someone that I don’t want spending the money.
Regardless of how this year plays out, I think the Cubs have a decent core of players that could compete in 2010. But I also think that the roster needs changes, and I don’t trust his evaluations after repeatedly signing players to roles that they aren’t accustomed to.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Full ack
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
So people actually are hoping
the Cubs don’t make the postseason so Hendry will get fired.
The height of stupidity now has been reached. Congrats, guys.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Not exactly what I said.
And if it’s a WC with a sweep, then yeah. I’d sacrifice that for a better team next year. Sue me.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I still think
that’s stupid thinking, but …
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm ok with that.
Wild cards and three game sweeps don’t do it for me, and I don’t see Hendry as someone who could make them significantly better.
That’s what this comes down to for me. If you think he can keep them consistenly competitive, that’s a different story.
I wouldn’t exactly mourn them winning the wild card. What I said was, if that saved Hendry’s job, I don’t think it would be a good thing.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Sadly, alot of people on this board (and Cubs fans in general)
Are satisfied with just being competitive. The goal is to win the World Series. Anything less is a failure.
The freakin’ Marlins AND D-Backs have won in the last ten years for Christ’s sake while we keep waiting.
Yep.
I don’t think NBF is just looking to be competitive, but I also don’t think that I stated my point very clearly.
Anyway, a WC is fine, but it’s not a reason to celebrate, unless they keep winning in the post season.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions
It's a fine line for sure
While we’ve all sat through some truly disastrous seasons and it does seem like the organization has turned a corner to some degree, it’s time to expect more.
I just don’t see it with this team/manager/GM and I’m not sure if it can be fixed anytime soon.
At least a WC would help make this season less of a disaster
But, like you said above, would bring back Hendry
You have to get into the playoffs before you can win the WS.
Just get in.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Right
And now, the Cubs are perennial contenders. Back in the day, they might contend one season out of eightor nine. Keep knocking on the door, and it should open.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll grant you that.
It’s not 1998, and he isn’t Ed Lynch.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Right on point one
and regarding point two, I don’t think I interpreted your point correctly.
I think in the WC era, the playoffs have proven to be a crapshoot. I’d like the Cubs to get in, then I’ll take my chances.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions
I stated it poorly
I am not rooting for the Cubs to fail. I hope they win 20 in a row, starting tonight, blow past St. Louis, and go 11-0 in the post season.
That would make Hendry king, and I’d pound my head over stupid moves he might make to make them weaker for years. And I’d be ok with that.
I guess the 1998 analogy is a better way to describe it – I don’t want that. I don’t want a flash in the pan followed by crap teams.
Hopefully I’m just as bad of an evaluator of GM’s as I think Hendry has been of players.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't want to see 1998 redux, either
Hendry has made more good moves than bad ones in his career. Everything he touched last year turned to gold, and everything he’s touched this year has turned to crap. I think he’s earned the benefit of the doubt.
But my GM-evaluator skills might be awful, too. I guess time will tell.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Equal time
-Ted Lilly was a steal
-Mark DeRosa gave them two years better than I thought he could
-Getting ANYTHING for Hundley was a feat; getting two integral parts of a playoff team was spectacular (which reminds me of the decision to let Grudz walk … no, I won’t go there)
-Howry and Eyre were very good their first two years with the Cubs; he realized a mistake from 2003 and addressed it in subsequent years
-Piniella was the right manager for the 2007 Cubs, just as Baker was for 2003
There are others; I do acknowledge that.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Hendry's success will be determined by WS titles
And while they are better at baseball than they used to be, how much longer does Hendry have? One more year? Two?
If it was me buying this team, I would give him one more year to make improvements. He’s earned at least that.
If it were me,
I’d want my own management team in there.
It also depends on when the transaction takes place. If they can’t get anything done by the end of the season, then Hendry should stay – because there won’t be enough time to get someone else up to speed on the organization.
Unless they want to bring someone in to work with Randy Bush.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I have no idea.
Other than the fact that LA hasn’t played good baseball in a while, I don’t know how optimistic I’d be entering that series.
However, I’d rather reach the playoffs and roll the dice than not make it at all and watch all the other teams play craps.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
Actually, I think the Phillies will end up with the best record in the NL.
The way the Dodgers are going, I’m not sure they will win the West. Their starting pitching has fallen apart and the Rockies and Giants are gaining in the standings. There’s plenty of time for one or both to pass them.
I think it’s still likely the Dodgers make the playoffs but it isn’t guaranteed. It will be interesting to see how things develop out west.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions
Very true.
If Atlanta and Florida can hang around in the East and LA has to play SF and Colorado, then I’m sure the best record will be undecided until the last week of the season. St. Louis isn’t that far back in that race, either.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Aug 18, 2009 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions
that's cute
that you think the WC race favors you, considering you’re 4 out and would have to leapfrog 4 teams. furthermore, the Rockies are on pace to win 90 games and for the Cubs to win 90 games, they’d have to go 30-16, a .651 winning percentage. I guess that favors you, hahahaha…
by Narcoleptico on Aug 18, 2009 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions
Hey Lou
If you’re going to leave your prized superstar on the bench for “rest”, you sure as hell better use him to pinch hit in meaningless situations with two out since you know damn well you don’t want to use him as a defensive replacement. Instead, pinch hit your best defensive OF replacement effectively eliminating him from the late-inning defensive mix. It may be a bit of a reach but if Sam Fuld is playing LF in the 9th inning instead of Jake Fox, there is a legitimate chance the game ends 1-0.
Who needs a stinkin' tag line? What are they for anyway?
excellent point
the defensive outfield is built for the cozy confines of wrigley which is why we often get burned on the road, especially in big stadiums.
that ball was not going to be caught
Blame Fox for knocking it around but it really wouldn’t matter. Gregg was getting pounded.
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Fuld would have had a MUCH better shot at catching that ball.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Well, Well,
other than speed, angle, and ability to close the glove on the ball, what advantage would Fuld have had? ;)
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Possibly if he dove
But walking eckstein is inexcusable
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 8:58 AM CDT up reply actions
That really was the key to the whole inning.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:10 AM CDT up reply actions
sure he would have come much closer to catching it...
…but if he doesn’t catch it, what does it matter?
Do you really think Fuld would have caught it? I don’t. Left-center is rather cavernous at Petco.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Possibly
I’m not suggesting that Fuld absolutely would have caught it but I don’t think there is any question he would have had a better shot at catching it than Fox. The point is, catch or not, Fuld should have been in LF as a defensive replacement for Fox in the 9th inning. But the particularly troublesome part is that you’re paying a guy ridiculous money and even on a “day off” not only is he not allowed to pinch hit with two out but he certainly isn’t allowed to be inserted as a defensive replacement in the 9th. Those two events should show exactly what Lou thinks of No. 12.
Who needs a stinkin' tag line? What are they for anyway?
Fuld would have caught in his TEETH
Seriously I don’t know but that is why I posted using Fuld to pinch hit in the 7th was a bad idea since he was more valuable
as a defensive replacement in the 9th. Alas Lou does not think ahead like that.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions
I didn't see the play
But I do remember you making the comment before the fact.
And I agreed at the time . . .
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions
Really frustrating
You are in a 0-0 game and you know your LF is VERY bad defensively yet you use the guy who can replace him
to pinch hit with two out in the 7th. Now Fuld got a hit and heck maybe he could have scored but really at that point with
two out isn’t Soriano the better option to pinch hit. Alas you are one player down without Theriot but I still believe it you
are thinking AHEAD you don’t use Fuld there.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions
Yep
Send up Soriano to take three (guess) hacks.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions
At least you save Fuld for the 9th
AND you remove the temptation of Lou to use Soriano with men on base and less than two out.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree with you
Maybe one of those hacks ends up a homerun. With two out and no one on, why not?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Gregg has blown six saves
and we’re six games back in the division. How long does this continue? I said it in another thread and it’s worth saying again …. HE LED ALL OF BASEBALL IN BLOWN SAVES LAST YEAR. And we’re the fools that sign him? Please don’t give me a bunch of worthless stats to defend him because there’s only ONE stat that matters when you’re a closer: save percentage. And his is not good. “We need a closer. I know, let’s go find the guy who led the big leagues in blown saves last year and sign him!” And now everybody is acting like they’re shocked that he’s tossing games away.
we didnt sign him
we actually traded for him. A decent prospect in Ceda. Now that is brillant.
Ceda seems to have fallen off the earth
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions
Ceda
Had surgery for a torn labrum several weeks ago. I would suggest that his career is in jeopardy as a result.
Who needs a stinkin' tag line? What are they for anyway?
Yeah, the hand-wringing on this one can probably stop
Maybe the Cubs knew something about Ceda’s training regimen
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Perhaps not
Just trying to give Hendry the benefit of the doubt . . . maybe trying too hard since I don’t think he’s doing a good job but I want to be fair.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions
I think the reason why the Cubs were willing to trade Ceda
is how he fell apart in spring training in 2008. I remember a ST game where he lost his composure and had a melt down on the mound. I think that threw up all kinds of warning signs that this may not be a pitcher suited to pitch in front of 40,000 + people at Wrigley Field every day.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions
This year, i'm starting to agree...
… but what in sam’s hell gives you the ability to see 365 days in the future?
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Well,
It’s well documented on here that we are held down to a lot of contracts for next year, this team will be mostly in tact, at least the impact players. They may add some fringe pieces, maybe change the bullpen a bit. I’m just offering my opinion that next years team is going to struggle to be competitive with the Cards again.
All this buttoning and unbuttoning
A little early to call that...
… as we have no idea the ownership strategy we’ll see take hold. $120 million dollar plus teams don’t rebuild. If spending stays where it is, there is no telling what will happen.
DLee is a great example. Everyone here was chalking him up as dead a few months in to the season. Who knows who’ll turn it around next year. Maybe sori gets his knee worked out. Maybe soto spends the summer climbing mountains with Demp.
We don’t know what’ll happen for the remainder of THIS season (although it doesn’t look promising). Making predictions about NEXT YEAR is wildly unproductive.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
I have to disagree
And to me it’s not a prediction, it’s my opinion on the make up of this squad. I feel this year is showing this squad to be ill equipped.
$120 Million can mean very little if spent poorly.
All this buttoning and unbuttoning
Its all relative.
Sori’s x millions were poorly spent this year. They weren’t last. You can’t predict this stuff season to season. There is no reason to be pontificating about the failure of the 2010 Cubs before the 2009 cubs are done.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions
And who could have ever guessed Soriano would be as bad as hea has been this year
Maybe in two or three years, but he dropped off pretty quickly
Exactly my point.
You can’t predict next season, so saying
Say goodnight to this year, and probably next year too.
is laughable.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed
Typical Cubbie-fan paranoia. Finish this season first, please.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree.
You only have to look at the Tigers and see that this is possible.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions
I'll give you that one,
The tigers are inspirational as to how you can turn something around. Then again, they have youth on their side. Power pitching and homegrown youth. But you never know.
Heck, around Toronto we do it with the Leafs all the time, you look at a team and you know it’s two years, three years, before they could add up to something again.
All this buttoning and unbuttoning
shrewd trading, too
Getting Edwin Jackson and Jarrod Washburn were very good moves. Dombrowski also gets credit for shoring up the defense on the left side of the infield.
He deserves credit for getting Miguel Cabrera, too.
That took some stones, but Dombrowski knew how to get it done, and recognized the value of acquiring a true elite talent who is still in his prime, and wasn’t damaged goods for any reason.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
I agree with the point,
but it’s worth remembering that the Tigers are currently only 1.5 games better than the Cubs. Everything’s easier when your division sucks. Fortunately, the NL Central may well suck next year, especially if Holliday is smart, goes for free agency, and lets the Yanks write him a big fat check.
Harden is gone, too.
That is really going to suck.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
yabbut, they'll have his $8M to
fill needs at second base, utility, closer, set up, loogy and middle relief.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Not really, other players are due raises in current contracts.
They also have quite a few arbitration eligible players.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions
...and 5th starter, and catcher and left field.
Trading Alfonso Soriano and a check for fifty MILLION dollars is starting to look like a really good deal.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Man, I'm used to people on this blog giving up on the Cubs in the current year
But now we’re predicting futility in future seasons?
I’ll beat that! 2023 Cubs- Gonna suck big time!
2014 though... i smell big things.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions
Nope
Sorry, but 2014 will be all Cardinals thanks to their pitching staff of aces, consisting of Aaron Heilmann, Kevin Gregg, Shark, Mark Prior, and Aaron Miles as the closer. Dave Duncan can’t be stopped.
1 run against the Padres
just flat out pathetic. Kevin Gregg obviously sucks but we left another 10 on base last night. It amazes me that average NL starters can look like Santana against us.
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 8:36 AM CDT reply actions
When your lineup includes
Miles and Fontenot, that will happen.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Why not play Baker?
and A-Ram continues to be the only clutch (regular season) player we have. At least Soriano was on the bench
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Baker apparently needed a rest
And Lou apparently thought that if you have a rainout, you actually don’t rest.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Lou
must be dreaming of pina coladas already. I’d rather see Baker at SS than freaking Aaron Miles
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions
I dunno
Lee’s triple was pretty clutch.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions
No one was on base
Lee HAS been clutch, but in the colloquial sense of the word, that won’t qualify.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions
well, alright
but without it, we don’t get the one run we did get.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Details, Details,
why bother with something as trivial as details?
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions
If you are going to bother with details, bother with ALL of them.
The discussion was about “clutch” hitting. A bases-empty hit is not “clutch” as colloquially defined, as I stated above.
I was vehemently defending Lee in last night’s game thread with supporting stats after people ripped on him for not driving home Bradley.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Hey, I was thinking back to that whole thing
I think you took my comments wrong. I was agreeing with you and defending your stance. Just FYI.
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
To be honest, I don't remember you being one of the "rippers"
So no worries!
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions
Say the Cubs are eliminated,
Who will people here cheer for in the playoffs? Or do you just watch without caring?
All this buttoning and unbuttoning
Assuming the leads today hold up
Probably the Phillies and anyone who plays the Cardinals.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I'm pulling for the Yankees
May be sacriligious, but I like the evil empire concept for MLB.
All this buttoning and unbuttoning
The Yankees certainly aren't as hateable as they have been
Texiera and Sabathia are nice enough guys. I’m tired of A-Rod getting smacked around.
I could get on board with that.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
You know the Yankees are my least favorite team
and even I don’t hate them that much this season.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
Personally, I'd like to see the Rangers win the wild card
and beat the Yankees in the first round. The Rangers have never been able to beat the Yanks in the playoffs.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions
Texas.
And I guess the Phillies.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
Will the Rays make it?
If not probably Texas. I suppose the Cardinals losing will be important given my location during the playoffs.
Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.
I don't see how the Rays can get by both the Red Sox and Yankees
this year.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
I'm happy to see Hamilton heating up.
Really, he’s been tearing the cover off the ball ever since those pictures of him in a bar were released. I think he’s all the way up to .270 now.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Philadelphia, I suppose
1) I was born there. We moved to Chicago when I was 8 months old and to Europe when I was 16 years.
2) A friend here is from Philly and a huge fan
But I really really really don’t want to “have” to be for the Phillies.
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
Truth be told
I won’t be watching much. My son is due Oct. 11.
Even if the Cubs make it, it’ll be tough for me to see everything. If they don’t, it will be nearly impossible.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
THE BEARS.
And also the Hawkeyes.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions
Well, at least I'll have Badger football to look forward to
Oh, wait. They will probably suck.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm not convinced of that.
Clay looked to be legit good last season, and you guys could just plain cram the ball down everyone’s throats.. If Sherer improves in the offseason you’ll be a little scary.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:01 AM CDT up reply actions
Rumor is that Sherer won't be the QB
Could be a true freshman.
Actually, as I said to Dan in another thread, I like that they are not expected to do much. They could sneak up on a few teams.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Wow... i hadn't heard that.
He wasn’t great in the what… seven games he started last year? I figured they’d work him hard in the offseason with the intention of continuing to ignore the spread and just running the ball in the the ground with Clay.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Here's the J-S take on it:
Based on what transpired during two practices Monday, redshirt freshman Curt Phillips appears to be the favorite to win the job, though his throwing still needs to improve.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Whoops.
Redshirt.
Got it 1/2 right!
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions
I was excited when they got him
until I realized he’s another running QB who can’t throw so teams will once again be able to stack the line of scrimmage
It's all about the O-line
Bollinger wasn’t a great thrower, either. Or Bevell. Yet all they did was win.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions
That style of football is dying
They need to kep up with the influx of spread offenses and faster teams in the Big 10
Problem is, it's hard to recruite the top prospects
Because they want to play somewhere warm. And when they ARE willing to go to the midwest, they want to play for Ohio State or Michigan.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions
No argument here
It’s just frustrating that with all the success the program has had in the last 15 years, they just can’t get the ‘elite program’ status and probably never will.
They tried after winning two Rose Bowls
And missed out on top recruits – which caused them to miss on second tier guys they’d have ordinarily had great chances at.
Alvarez has pretty much said that.
However, I do think it’s possible that they can be elite, but it would take a run of 10 years in the top of the Big 10 to really be viewed as one of those teams.
1992, if they don’t lose to Minny, they very well may have won the national title.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Hear hear.
The reason teams like Iowa and Wisconsin CAN’T move to the spread is because the quick dudes that excel in that offense tend to stay in florida and cali. We end up with big old farm boys, who are talented enough to push a team to a new years day bowl every few years, but not well equipped to fly around the field in the spread.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes, so it has to be "grind it out"
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
+1,000,000
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Go Irish!
Some people say the glass is half empty, some say half full. I say, are you going to drink that?
by BleedsbluinMI on Aug 18, 2009 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions
i have very high hopes this year .... maybe bcs bowl
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Brett Bielema said a lot of stupid things last year
But I loved his comment that ND gets special treatment on account of who they are.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:59 AM CDT up reply actions
he's damn right. BCS bowls want them there, which isn't very fair to other colleges.
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions
Unfair my ass.
I hate ND football as much as anybody else, but the money they bring in for the NCAA system and the opponents they “grace” with their presence is well worth it.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions
well that's easy to do when you have your own network...
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
some time when you're really bored...
…find and read the actual BCS agreement. You’ll see that ND is the only school mentioned by name. All the other references are to conference champions, i.e. Big 10 champion, SEC champion, etc.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
That's because ND was the only independent BCS contender when the agreement was drawn up
by Mike Martin on Aug 18, 2009 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions
Not true. There were other independents at the time.
Navy and I think Pitt as well. No argument that ND has a better football program but that’s not the point. ND got ‘hard-coded’ into the agreement when no other school did. As a result when ND sucks, which they have from time to time, they still get preferential treatment over the other schools when it comes to qualifying for BCS bowls. When a traditional BCS conference power school sucks, they just go to the BlueBonnet bowl while the confernece champion – whoever it is – represents the conference that year.
All they had to do was replace all the ND references with “highest ranked independent” or something like that and there’d be a lot less to argue about.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Definitely
Once the cubs season is over, baseball is pretty much over. moving on to football.
WOXY.com - The Future of Rock and Roll
by Gibbon Jockey on Aug 18, 2009 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions
The Blackhawks and Bears
But probably the Cardinals since someone has to win it. I pretty much hate all things AL, plus I live in St. Louis now.
And really, I’d just prefer have the title in the division.
If the Cubbies don't make it..
I won’t watch, Instead i’ll be watching and supporting DA BEARS!
We Got This!
by cubbiebear316 on Aug 18, 2009 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Baseball will be
over for me then. I’ll be cheering for the Hawkeyes, Bears and shortly there after the Bulls.
Recipe for Disaster;
C'mon Cubs, hurry up and blow this so I can relax.
by Bluekoolaide on July22, 2009 3:08 PM CDT
Its sad, really.
Nothing was as great as September 20th of last year.
Put on my Hawkeye jersey, went up to Merkles for the Iowa vs Pitt football game, then got to throw my cubs jersey over it and go watch them beat StL to clinch the division. One of the most fun days of my life.
I was hoping to see something similar on September 26th this year when the Hawks go to play Penn State and the cubs are away vs SF. Both are night games, and both away, so i couldn’t have pulled off the epic Iowa Bar to Wrigley feat i managed, but it could have been cool.
There is still a chance, i suppose…
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
October 11, 2003
Wisconsin beat defending National Champs Ohio State. I listened to the radio at Camp Randall as the Cubs beat Florida to go up 3 games to 1.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, absolutely
I was in Section P in the student section, wearing my beat-to-hell Cubs hat and (probably beer-soaked) UW hoodie. One of my greatest sports memories. I remember they put the final score up on the old scoreboard and a helluva cheer went up in the stadium.
I skipped out on my cousin’s wedding in southern IL that weekend, but it worked out for the best because my dad informed me later that it was a dry wedding. Unheard of!
A fan sitting next to me listening to the game
Commented that only Cubs fans could be nervous with a 7-run (or whatever it was) lead.
Whooping it up on State Street. Someone in a Cub shirt and a courdoroy sport coat high-fiving me (it may have been Dan) saying, “We’re going to the World Series!” I said, “It’s not over yet.” He said, “Yes it is!” Ah, youth. Too young to remember 1984.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Jim Hendry's offseason is the gift that just keeps giving...
…all season long.
When did he or anyone really think that Kevin Gregg was a WS championship closer? I mean is anyone really surprised based on his past performance?
Very frustrating season...
for a team a few over .500.
I’m starting to look at the Wild Card, unless the Cubs went on a huge run that coincides with the Cards faltering. Highly unlikely, the Cards don’t lose much these days.
Chicago Cubs baseball is on the air...
The Cardinals are in the midst of a stretch
where they play 19 of 22 games against teams below .500. I think LA is their only series against a winning team in that stretch.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
They just swept the Dodgers a few weeks back
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions
Right, then they entered the 19-of-22 stretch
in which the road series at LA is the only time they play a winning team. They’re capitalizing on the opportunities right now and threatening to run away with the division.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Aug 18, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Actually, they won 3 of 4
The Dodgers won the last game of the series.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Player contracts
INothing to say but I do have Questions.
Does a major league franchise have the right to include performance clauses in players contracts?
If the Cubs dump some of big contract players (Soriano) are they responsible for all the $$$ even if another Major league team takes them?
Yes, but top echelon free agents
don’t take them. They play teams off each other until all those kickers are out, but the money remains.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Performance clauses
In a word, no. Contracts cannot include things like hit .300, get a bonus, hit 40 HR, get a bonus. Contracts can have games played bonuses, or like Bradley’s guaranteed option year with a certain number of games played , Rewards bonuses(MVP, Gold Glove, etc.).
In terms of dumping Soraino, etc. Think of the Alex Rios situation with the Blue Jays/White Sox. The Blue Jays placed him on the waivers system and the White Sox were able to claim him, in this case the Blue Jays just said “Take him and his salary.” and the Sox had to since they claimed him. Now the Blue Jays could have attempted to work out a trade, but the White Sox probably would have wanted the Blue Jays to pay part of his salary and the Jays did not want to do that so to them not have to pay the $60+ million, or whatever he was owed was just as good as getting players in return. You can also consider the Marquis trade, where the Cubs are paying a portion of his salary, just to get him off the team, save money, and they got at least something in return for him. If they just cut a player from the team, yes, they are responsible for his salary, MLB contracts are guaranteed money, unlike most NFL contracts.
You can't win in the postseason unless you can manufacture runs. - Hall of Fame 2B Joe Morgan
Throwing money at the problem doesn't always help your situation
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Hendry made poor choices and left himself no money
Bradley over Dunn just totally confounds me. Dunn would hit 50 HR at Wrigley. Why was that so difficult a decision. Bradley has been a injury prone clubhouse cancer. He had maybe one year where he hit over 20 homers.
Letting DeRosa go..bad. Fontenot looked ready but clearly was not.
I understood letting Woody go but not for Gregg. Gregg was not even good enough to be the closer for Fla. However, I guess he felt Marmol would step into the job and then he wasnt ready.
Letting Marquis go I even agreed with but that also blew up.
I just dont get what he was thinking. But I guess its easy to be a Monday morning QB. Bottom line, he is paid to make the right decisions and his scouting department and he made BAD decisions.
by cubsmakemecrazy on Aug 18, 2009 8:57 AM CDT reply actions
Ugh.
Bradley has been a injury prone clubhouse cancer.
Who cares? He’s been neither since joining this team. Sure, he hasn’t hit the 50 HR you think Dunn would have, but he’s been on base and hasn’t caused issues with the team. Give him a break… there are those who have failed in a far bigger way than Bradley.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:04 AM CDT up reply actions
While Bradley has performed better lately...
… he still has not been the middle-of-the-order run producer that the Cubs were after in the offseason.
Adam Dunn would have been a better signing. For that matter, bringing back Jim Edmonds might have been better.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Agree on all accounts... there were better options.
We knew so then, and hindsight now confirms it.
None the less, the “injury prone clubhouse cancer” rep has very little bearing on THIS season. Bradley hasn’t lived up to expectations, but it hasn’t been due to being on the DL or messing with team chemistry.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions
But back when the season started it seemed like he wasn't on the roster...
…He was injured and when he played he played poorly. Given his comments about being uncomfortable here, he really picked the wrong place to get off to such a poor start. I think he was the type of player that needed to get off to a good start.
Maybe his power returns next year (hopefully next game)? He can definitely can get on base, so if his power does return in LHB he should be a huge contributor.
Ugh... commenting is giving me troubles this morning.
Anyways. Yes. I agree. Dunn would have been better. We knew it then, and hindsight confirms. Bradley hasn’t lived up to expectations.
The “injury plaged clubhouse cancer” rep had very little to do with that though. He’s been on the field, and has seemingly fit in well enough since the early season issues that may have been as much media driven as anything.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Bradley hasn't produced what Hendry signed him to do
However, he hasn’t exactly sucked either.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
He's NEVER done what Hendry signed him to do
I blame Hendry more than Bradley for that
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Excatly.
Anyone expecting him to be a power hitter was ill informed of his skill set.
Turns out he hasn’t done ANYTHING many figured he’d do here. Injuries minimal, freak outs rare, power nearly nonexistent.
Oh well.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions
Bingo
Bradley has made adjustments to be a productive player for this team. He’s not going to be a middle-of-the-order run producer. He could be a table setter with his desire to take walks.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
That's great, and useful, but...
… not worth $10 million a year.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
And again,
Who’s fault is that?
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions
*Whose
damn it
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
How much input did Lou have in the roster construction?
If those are “his guys” out there then I can understand his shell-shocked nature. I know I’d be questioning my own intelligence, thinking I knew how to evaluate talent only to watch the players I wanted underperform all season long.
Lou supposedly asked for a
Center Fielder with speed for 07, A LH Power Bat for 08, and a LH Power Bat for 09. He recieved Soriano, Fukudome & Bradley respectively.
Did Lou get what he wanted?
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
It was a rhetorical question
I think it was Hendry for signing a guy to do something that he’s never done in his career.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions
Actually it was a genuine question
Hendry has the reputation for letting his managers telling him which players to get. So if it was Lou that specifically said “Get Bradley, get Miles, get Gregg” then a lot of this is on Lou. And it would also explain Lou’s thousand-yard stare.
I'm not sure Lou wanted Bradley
He just demanded a left-handed bat. Hendry got him a switch hitter instead.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Fair enough
I meant it to be rhetorical, but you have a good point.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions
Hendry's jones for Bradley predates Lou.
The Cubs and Bradley have been eyeing each other across the dance floor like a couple of 8th graders for 5 or so years at this point. Sooner or later they were going to hook up.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
OUCH.
Warn me before you do that.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Ugh.
Please don’t post photos like that here again.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I just
blocked it.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions
Al is sick enough today
No need to make him actually vomit.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Or me for that matter
And I’ve got a reasonably strong stomach.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
He has kind of sucked, hasn't he?
I mean, he spent half the season being just hilariously bad, and the “new-look” decent Bradley is pretty much “2007 Second Half Jacque Jones” all over again.
At some point, your $30M man has to hit for power. And there’s no evidence that Bradley ever has, or ever will.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
That is very well put
I don’t think even his defenders will take offense to that.
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
Apologies for the multiple posts.
I was going to be having words with my ISP anyways. This doesn’t help their case.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions
The fact that both Dunn and Edmonds can actually hit left handed
is a difference maker.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
It's not Bradley's fault that Hendry thought he would be
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions
Dunn would have been a butcher
in the outfield. Like having two Sorianos, only the second Soriano is really bad.
Bradley has done fine. It would be nice to see more power.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions
i could live with defensive mishaps if he hit 40 HRS, 110 RBIs
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions
no guarantees
that he would.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
there's a very good chance though
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
You can practically set your watch to it.
Every year, Dunn winds up with exactly 40 HR and 100 RBI. It’s freakish in its consistency – within a couple of HR (but always 40) and a handful of RBI every year.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Both Adam Dunn and Carlos Lee seem to be players
that put up stats every year, but never seem to have much of an impact on their teams, in terms on wins and losses.
I’m not sure why this is or even if this is just a coincidence.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions
If so, Al, why
hasn’t anybody else signed Edmonds?
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Good question.
Maybe Edmonds wasn’t the answer, but Dunn could have been.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I think it would be hard to find a player in the ML this season....
…who has failed to live up to his past performance/expecations more than Bradley.
John Smoltz
Andruw Jones
David Ortiz
Jimmy Rollins
Grady Sizemore
Garrett Atkins
Howie Kendrick
Jeff Francour
In fact, I don’t think Bradley is the biggest bust on the 2009 Cubs. I think the 2008 ROY Geo Soto holds that honor.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Andruw Jones is actually having a decent year.
His OPS is .835. In a part-time role he has been useful.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I'd say he's "dramatically exceeding expectations".
Wasn’t he a non-roster invitee? What is he making? Not much.
Sizemore was hurt, and is still better than Milton Bradley.
I agree that Soto is probably the bigger bust. Or has the bigger bust. How does a pro athlete in his 20’s get that far out of shape? I was a lawyer in my 20’s who raised bad living to an art form and I was in better shape.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
A few more
Liriano
Padilla
Vernon Wells
Russell Martin
and others
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions
He's a giant clown who can't produce!
He’s done NOTHING at the plate or in the field to merit even being on the roster.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
Are we talking about the same player here?
He hasn’t done what was expected. He hasn’t done what we hoped.
He’s produced a .392 OBP though. That isn’t NOTHING. Once he was placed in a position in the batting order to take advantage of what he’s ACTUALLY good at, he’s done well. Hendry and those expecting 50HR screwed up for signing him and hoping for that. He didn’t screw up by not magically becoming a player he NEVER WAS.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
It is nothing. he was signed to provide left handed power and drive in damn runs
He wasn’t acquired to flash his stupid OBP! He got less RBI than minor league fillins Fox and Fontenot!
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
Fair enough.
Then be pissed at Hendry for signing him to do something he isn’t (and HASN’T EVER BEEN) equipped to do.
Bradley has been the same player his whole career, and the only difference this year is that he’s stayed pretty healthy (possibly thanks to the cubs training staff) and hasn’t had any major freak outs.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Since when..
is OBP stupid????
We Got This!
by cubbiebear316 on Aug 18, 2009 9:59 AM CDT up reply actions
well
it never scored well in IQ tests…
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
Hendry has made many poor choices over the last three years.
I understand not paying my favorite player (woody), I also believed Marmol would be the closer.
Signing Marquis was the error, then letting him go for no talent and eating contract compounded the error.
With the belief that Bradley could hit left handed and hit for power, his defense and 2008 made his signing look better. The reality that he’s a right handed hitter who can switch, if needed, makes the signing look bad.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
I still don't get that
“signing Marquis was the error.” What about Marquis wasn’t EXACTLY what he was signed to do: be a serviceable 5th starter and eat innings. He did EXACTLY that and did it well. You can’t expect a sub 3 ERA from your 5th starter. Just ain’t gonna happen. I actually think that Marquis was a C+ signing. There have been others far worse…
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Marquis turned out to be a decent 5th starter.
I just don’t believe GM’s go out and commit $10M contracts to 5th starters. They give those roles to guys like Heilman, Wells & Marshall who are interchangeable cost wise.
Marquis was a grade A 5th starter, not a passing grade to the GM for the signing.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
That's the rub.
Hendry gives out $10M contracts like candy.
And because he does that, he can’t afford the true difference-makers. For the price of a Fukudome and Marquis, you could have an A-Rod. It’s infuriating.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Not really. There's only one ARod and he's playing for the Yankees
You make it sound like there’s this big store out there full of ARods – all you have to do is find the money and you too can own an ARod. It only works when he’s available, i.e. a free-agent.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
bass pro shop has a decent amount rods
the cubs lineup needs moar LIND and HALLIDAY
by jesus christos on Aug 18, 2009 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Elite talents hit the market, or are traded, almost every year.
By “An A-Rod”, I meant “a player of similar value to Alex Rodriguez”, not simply the actual Alex Rodriguez.
This year, it was Teixiera. Prior to that, it was Manny. Or Beltran. Or Vlad Guerrero. Or Miggy Cabrera.
The Cubs have the resources. They invested those resources into Alfonso Soriano. They chose poorly.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
In my opinion the schedule does not mean a thing,
when you can’t win on the road no matter who you play how does it make a difference. They struggle to score more than 2 runs a game on the road and when they do score a run or two the bullpen gives it up.
Geez Cub fans
Boy so many of you give up or are thinking about giving up the season. Still 46 games left. Yes this team is not the class of the league, but if and I admit a big if, the ones that should carry the team come around, the last part of the season could be interesting.
Don’t forget this is baseball. A week or so ago the Cubs were either tied for first or real close. It can certainly swing the other way. Keep the faith.
Trade Doug Deeds to Washington.
I have
always been a fan of Hendry. But he sure had one bad off season. So many of us have just shaken our heads at signings like, Bako & Miles, and Bradley to some extent. With change of ownership looming I highly doubt Hendry will be around much longer.
Trade Doug Deeds to Washington.
but he's on a roll lately re: signing
jeff baker!
by doofus cubs guy on Aug 18, 2009 9:11 AM CDT reply actions
oops - forgot about giving up the rights to
new mexico’s largest city to get the bakester
by doofus cubs guy on Aug 18, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Gotta hand it to Jim Hendry and Lou Piniella
It’s commendable that Hendry decided to give Heilman and Gregg second chances. If he were GM of the Washington Nationals, then this wouldn’t be a big deal. Brad Lidge catching lightning in a bottle with his second chance is a major fluke. Kevin Gregg wasn’t going to do it and what’s sad is that Kerry Wood was willing to give Chicago a hometown discount.
Kerry Wood hasn’t had a great season either, but to think Hendry traded for Gregg is just astounding. Why? Hendry wanted Bradley so bad that he was willing to destroy this team to get him. Hendry wanted to resign Dempster, which was a bad move in hindsight. Bob Howry, Jason Marquis and Mark DeRosa have all done well with new teams while this team has languished. Hendry deserves a second chance too, but with another team. If the Cubs hadn’t had the best record in the NL last season, having to be an outside contender for the Wild Card wouldn’t be such a bad thing. Here’s the problem. It’s now Wild Card or bust for a team that won two straight division titles and was predicted to win a third.
Instead, I can’t forgive Jim Hendry for this cluster@*!%. I have my gripes with Lou Piniella too, but I do have sympathy for him because he does have to play with the hand he’s dealt. I don’t even know if LaRussa or Torre could make a championship team out of this year’s Cubs lineup. Perhaps it’s good that Ryno has been stewing in the wings because this team has been in need of younger leadership since yesterday.
It may not be all Lou’s fault, but he’s definitely looked clueless out there. He’s shown that he’s too slow to make necessary moves. Why was Kevin Gregg still the closer after giving up back-to-back blown saves? Why did Soriano hit in the leadoff spot for so long? Why use Aaron Miles in pinch hit situations? What do you want him to do? Manage the team as it needs to be managed. That involves stepping on a few egos here and there. He’s turning into Dusty Baker out there because the game is getting away from him. You’re witnessing the end of Piniella’s career and what an inglorious end.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Often speculated, never documented
Kerry Wood was willing to give Chicago a hometown discount.
In fact, he admitted after signing with Cleveland that they never discussed a one-year deal. Not offering arbitration was a tactical error, though.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions
You're probably right
Given that Kerry Wood has a proven track record for success, something Dempster didn’t have despite a career year, it was the wrong deal to make in hindsight. You can trade for another closer if need be. You can’t unload Dempster’s contract when you have other expensive contracts there.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
In hindsight, no arb was an error.
If Hendry wasn’t going to pay the $10m or so everyone assumed Woody could get in arb, he made the right choice.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Not offering him arbitration
was a favor to a guy who had been loyal for a decade. It would have been hard for Wood to sign if someone was giving up a pick.
I know the GM is supposed to me more ruthless and you can call this a sentimental move if you want but it was not a tactical error.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Sentimental moves that hurt your team ARE tactical errors
On a very small, silly scale, this is why in my Strat-O-Matic league, I don’t have the Cubs. They became available 2 or 3 times since I’ve been in it, and I’ve turned it down. Because I knew I’d make sentimental moves.
Hendry telling Wood to get more money is a sound baseball decision and I agree with it. If Hendry thought Wood was worth that money, he WOULD have signed him.
If Hendry didn’t offer arbitration because he didn’t think $10M would fit in the budget, it makes sense. I might not agree with the overall strategy, but that is not a tactical error.
If Hendry didn’t offer arbitration because he didn’t want Wood to “feel bad”, then he is ill-suited to be a major league GM.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions
It is not a question of "Feeling bad"
It is showing respect for someone who earned it. It would have been very difficult for Wood to sign if he had been offered arb.
This is basically the same thing as letting Maddux go in 06 rather than forcing him to play out a season from hell and holding
him hostage for a draft pick. You do things like this because besides being right it earns you stature and trust among players and agents.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Trading Maddux was a classy move
Getting Izturis in return was stupid. I was stunned at the time that they couldn’t do better.
I can’t imagine it would be that difficult for Wood to sign had he been offerred arbitration. I just don’t see it. I am willing to concede the possibility that you have insight on that, but it seems off.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
When you're limited in your trading partners,
you’re likely to to not get much back in return. Maddux only wanted to be traded to a NL West team in the race. That didn’t leave Hendry much leverage.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions
Maddux is a classy guy
I think he’d understand if Hendry had gone to him and said they couldn’t get anything that would be nearly as valuable as a draft pick in return.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions
Um versus
A chance to get to the post season ? I don’t think so. I am sure Boras was the messenger but I am sure Hendry understood that he had to let Maddux free and get whatever he could for him. At the time Izzy looked reasonable but had they traded him for some class A catcher it would have been understood why.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions
I've got to take issue with this
I’ve gone on record defending Hendry’s player-friendly ways. I do think it helps them sign players.
However, it’s still a business. His responsibility is to do what is best for the Cubs. Sometimes, that needs to mean that the player doesn’t get what he wants. Not always, but sometimes.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Then Hendry's player-friendly rep starts to erode...
…and he no longer has an advantage when wooing free-agents and/or negotiating extensions.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Really? If he doesn't do it 100% of the time?
So be it, then.
Because there have been 105 WS Champions, none of them GM’ed by Mr. Hendry. I am willing to take my chances on abandoning that system.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not buying it.
The Cubs made Kerry Wood a very, very rich man. Kerry was very grateful to the Cubs.
The Cubs had the right under the CBA to take actions which would better their team, and they opted not to take actions. It was a bad move.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
And while I like some of the "little things" like this that Hendry does
It has won 0 championships and tied up a lot of money.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Kevin Gregg is total garbage
And he made my shit list back in June. I knew it was just a matter of time before all the deep fly balls stopped falling into gloves, and started going over walls. He’s junk… total junk. He gave up a game tying double off the wall, and a friggin walk-off HR in PETCO for crying out loud. One of the most pitcher friendly parks in the league. Horrible. Just horrible.
Back in June, he lead all relievers in HRs allowed, and pitches per appearance. It’s now August, and to his credit, he’s been consistent, as none of that has changed. Earlier in the year, it just happened to be masked by some luck, while recording saves.
Gregg could just save us all a whole lot of time by just throwing the ball over the LF wall next time he comes into a game.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
I remember him blowing that save in the fist Brewer series
That guy’s fastball has no movement. It’s like Howry all over again, except as a closer.
Wish it was a fist... to Gregg's face.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
A loss is loss but
this felt more like a punch in the gut. One pitch away and BOOM. If Lilly had given up two runs and the Cubs lost 2-1 the outcome would be the same but the pain would be less. Replacing Gregg with Guzman is relatively easy but
the mystery of the massive underperforming hitters is something else. What enrages me is also what still gives me
hope even if it is diminished. These guys CAN hit and they sure can pitch. There does seem to be some lack of heart or whatever you want to call it and Lou looking like a zombie drives me F(&^%$$ing nuts. I have been through 04 and 06 so I can live through this but it is a painful waste of listless talent. that is running out of time to wake up.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
Kyle Blanks is the 2009 version of Victor Diaz.
Sure, it’s earlier in the season, but it feels just about the same.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
This game was tied, though
And that team was in the process of choking away a WC lead.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
It wasn't tied entering the 9th, though.
And this team is in the process of choking away any shot at the playoffs.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
Fixing the bullpen solves very little
The Cubs offense has now mustered 3 runs in 34 innings at PETCO this year. They totaled a whopping 3 runs the past two games against two of the worst teams in the league and have gone back to leaving mad amounts of men on base every game. The bullpen has had its ups and downs this year but it is the offense that is creating these losses. The bullpen has no margin for error because we score no runs.
The offense has been horribly constructed by Hendry and we are having the same conversations Aug. 18 as we did May 18 – zero clutch hitting, zero consistent hitting from game to game = no chance at putting together a long winning streak.
Hendry got these garbage players for us
and discarded Mr Vesatile DeRosa in the process, it’s Hendry’s damn fault! Bradley is, was, and will always be a selfish malcontent who can’t produce and take the heat of playing for a contender.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
One lost player isn't the problem.
You can’t blame Hendry for Lee’s slow start, Soto’s inability to hit, ARam’s injury, Soriano not getting hot like he did the past few years, or even Bradley not coming close to his career numbers.
I’m willing to blame Hendry for overpaying players, but the players we have shoulder plenty of blame for just not performing.
He knew, or should have known, what Soriano was capable of.
The Cubs signed Soriano to be their centerfielder.
That’s just ridiculous. What kind of punch-and-judy operation are we running here?
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Part of it is him
He didn’t put together a good enough roster.
The team sale – or lack of – played a part in handling of salary.
Lou made some curious, if not silly moves at times.
And the players haven’t performed at times.
All in all its turning into a complete pooch screw.
Just win the next game...!
That is too easy
The greater majority of losses have resulted the pathetic inability to score runs with ample opportunity.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions
i know i just thought that was funny
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions
The first 50 times people said it, maybe.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions
No.
Not really.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
What's with all of the men left on base this year?
It’s clearly not a problem of getting guys on. You’d think somebody would ‘accidentally’ hit a gapper at some point.
Too many chokers and not ready for prime time players batting in key spots
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
I would rather
take a punch to the face then watch Aaron Miles take another at bat in a Cubs uniform.
Frito: What's the minus of thirty and twenty?
Joe: Uh, it's eighty. It's eighty billion dollars. That's a mighty big minus isn't it?
Frito: Yeah. I like money.
After your common games between the Cubs and Cards
it comes down to this. The Cubs must absolutely hammer the Mets in those 6 games, the snakes in the 3 they have with them and the 4 extra against the Pirates and the single game against the ChiSox.
Factor in the Braves and Fish both visit StL, hoping either/both of them have some game and there’s a glimmer of hope.
As I mentioned in another thread, the Cubs have to gain ground on the Cards through this trip and that is from the perspective of going into this week’s series.
Just win the next game...!
It is full fledged panic mode time
I think that the division is still a better case scenario than the WC if only for the fact that there is only one team ahead of them. While it is true that the other WC teams all play each other, that is only a benefit if all the teams split. If one of those teams beats up on the other, they might walk to the WC.
My vote is for Guzman. He has been the best reliever this season.
Can Smoltz get a look over?
by jerry morales rules on Aug 18, 2009 9:39 AM CDT reply actions
Man.
I went to be cautiously optimistic that we’d keep pace with the Cards. This is a bad loss.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
1/3 each would be reasonable but otherwise
Players 50% ( not like you are asking them to do things they have never done or are not capable of) Lou & Hendry 25% each.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:54 AM CDT up reply actions
I'd say everyone shoulders the blame
But there are only so many players you can dump. It’s easier to start again with a new GM and manager and dump the players you can dump.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
i think hendry is the most to blame because if it weren't for the enormous contracts, there would be "economic flexibility"
with this flexibility he could probably make moves … all be it really crappy moves.
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions
and lou doesn't know how to use a bullpen
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Asking them to do things they have never done or not capable of:
Bradley – power hitting run producer
Fontenot – every day player, plus back up third base
That’s 25% of the projected opening day lineup (excluding pitcher).
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Bradley was coming off a career year and Fonty looked OK
Mistakes to be sure but nothing compared to the non hitting of Soriano & Soto and Marmol’s meltdowns in terms of damage.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions
Reasonable.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:10 AM CDT up reply actions
Fonty had 2 seasons of 250-odd PA, almost all vs. RHP.
It was a gigantic reach to assume he was ready for everyday use. Lou had been very judicious in picking his spots with Fontenot.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
I agree completely with that
I meant her response about Soto, Marmol, etc was reasonable.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
I thought that the plan at the beginning of the year
Was that Fontenot would platoon at 2B with Miles, not be an “everyday” player.
The injury to Aram helped to put that in the dumpster.
"When you're going through hell, keep going." - Winston Churchill
That is a substantially worse plan.
If Miles was slotted for regular AB, Hendry should be slapped in the face.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
and great minds think alike again.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Kevin Gregg singlehandedly caused the economic meltdown
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
Kevin Gregg is really Red Skull in disguise:
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
If Kevin Gregg started
he would give up a walkoff 5 run HR in the first inning.
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Kevin Gregg couldn't save a coupon.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Kevin Gregg brought back el nino
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Ther's no crying in baseball
except when Kevin Gregg comes in
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Kevin Gregg may not be Red Skull
Recent investigations have revealed this possibility:
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Choosey moms
don’t choose Kevin Gregg
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
But when they get stuck with a Gregg, it ain't a nice sight
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
It was a toss up
Between Elmer Fudd and Barney Fife.
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Cubs team doctors
now refer to whiplash as Greggitis
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Kevin Gregg
was once within 26 outs of a perfect game
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
If Kevin Gregg had a Native American name, it would be
Choking Bear
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
The shortest distance between two points 400 feet from each other
is a Kevin Gregg fastball
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Kevin Gregg was the ready liquor was invented
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
On the 6th day, God created man
On the 7th day, God rested. They brought in Gregg
On the 8th day, God created the blown save.
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Kevin Gregg
has taken steroids for 10 years, but no one ever thought to test him.
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Kevin Gregg was not born
he was pooped
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Kevin Gregg
once gave up two home runs on one pitch.
Both were walkoffs.
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
ok i'm done.
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
This is how Kevin Gregg was born. NSFW.
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
I saw somewhere that this is the first time since 1981
that a Cubs reliever has allowed three walk off home runs in one season
WTF
Thanks alot Kevin Gregg for the walk off home runs this season. In addition to all the cold bats your inconsistancy is icing on the disaster cake. Maybe next year guys………..;(
Although I will always bleed cubbie blue i am pissed and dissapointed yet once again……
Kevin Gregg steals from the Ronald McDonald House
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
Kevin is bringing the Brett Favre rumors back.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Aug 18, 2009 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions
He renamed the Sears Tower the "Willis Tower" - because he loves "Diff'rent Strokes".
Also he green-lit the new Red Dawn remake. But only if the ending is re-written so that the USA loses.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
The Cards play the Dodgers,
we play the Padres…and loose ground. Wow.
"Cub fans like to think of things in catastrophic terms." - Crane Kenney
StL is 4-1 against the Dodgers this year
Meanwhile, we are 3-4 against the Padres.
One difference between us and them.
Another difference: the Cubs are 13-15 in 1-run games (would have been 14-14 had Gregg made the save last night).
StL is 14-10 same stat.
Depressing
I am disappointed
not only in Jim Hendry’s choices this off-season, but that Lou is taking the money once again next year.
I have enjoyed most of his time here, and respect his baseball experience greatly, but it is enough now.
Too slow, bad moves again and again, and just time to move on.
We had our best shot last year, imo, with this club, and the window is closing fast.
Agree...
the window of opportunity is shutting fast
"Cub fans like to think of things in catastrophic terms." - Crane Kenney
by NashvilleBlue on Aug 18, 2009 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Which is exactly why it was stupid to trade DeRosa for middle relief prospects.
The time for winning was now. And the return on the trade was irrelevant to 2009, and likely marginal thereafter.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
So I want to ask the panel this question:
Would it be proper for Kevin Gregg to go up to Lou and say, “Skip, I’m killing the team and I know I’m not getting it done, so don’t pitch me in the ninth any more”? In other words, is there any circumstance where it is acceptable for an athlete to ask out of playing because he recognizes his performance is hurting the team?
What's the point? He's out of the job now.
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
The bigger question is the second one.
I’m no athlete, so I want to know if there is ever a situation where a player “quitting” is acceptable when the reason is because said player sucks and does nothing to contribute to victory any longer.
You have to assume Gregg is in his "prime"
or at least he thinks he is. At that level of presumed play, you don’t quit, even if you’re not entirely trusting on your stuff.
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
Some players will do that, yes.
I’d say it happens more with the aging veteran who realizes he isn’t pulling weight and needs to step aside for a while. Who knows if Gregg would actually do something like that.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Aug 18, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
As a team player, sure. As a guy trying to make a living playing baseball, no.
Every player who’s slumping has to believe they’re one outing away from fixing it or they can’t play at that level.
I am done with this team...
I actually stayed up to watch this miserable excuse of a team blow it in the 9th — it was like watching, oh I don’t know, 20 other losses this year. They failed to tack on any insurance runs in the 9th inning, when they had RISP, AGAIN, and then Gregg showed me that he simply does not have closer stuff, AGAIN. Guys are just teeing him up right now, as they have been all season.
I am done. I have tickets to a few more games, which I will probably attend, and that’s it. Get the ownership situation straightened out, and then maybe I’ll start paying attention again.
So that means next season
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Aug 18, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
I'll take those tickets off your hands
if it’s too painful to go to the park to watch them.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Well, if Gregg is too bad and Marmol is too wild and Guzman is too young and Smoltz is too old...
how does Billy Wagner grab you?
Billy Wagner didn’t want to discuss trade speculation, saying he was “a New York Met today.” But the former closer, who is returning 11 months after undergoing Tommy John surgery, told the Daily News Monday that he would not stand in the way of a deal by the Aug. 31 deadline that would make him eligible for a contender’s postseason roster.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Depends on the cost and
if his arm’s back or in that 6 month rehab period all the TJ guys seem to go through.
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
Finding new ways to take other people's money
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Kevin Gregg is Red Skull
Any questions?
And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.
Trade Gregg to the Sox...
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
Lynda Carter...
Why don’t you answer my letters?!
I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best
Two wrongs
might make a good Kevin Gregg inning
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
Why not give Grabow a shot?
He has closed at the MLB level, even if it was for the Pirates. Not a lot, but some. Better than turning it over to Marmol. He isn’t the answer this year. Guzman, Grabow, or Marshall is all I can see. The thing about Gregg is his losses, and blown saves just scratch the surface of the games he came in with a meaningless 3 run lead, gave up a run or two, and still got the save.
At least in what may be a rapidly dwindling opportunity Grabow wouldn’t be doing something he’s never done before.
Even better...
Rich Harden?
Gorzo goes to the rotation.
Depends on the HRs
If there’s evidence that Harden’s HR rate is less than Gregg’s, then I say go for it.
Harden is a more effective starter...
and as previously discussed, his arm/shoulder is not able to handle pitching as often as would be needed.
You can't win in the postseason unless you can manufacture runs. - Hall of Fame 2B Joe Morgan
Interesting to wonder if
pitching one inning three nights in a row would be less wear and tear than throwing 100 or so pitches every fifth day.
he can't do it.
it’s been discussed.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions
With some metrics to back up the opinions, I hope
I’m just thinking of those who said 4-5 years ago “Kerry Wood can’t be a closer, his arm’s too fragile” solely on the basis of opinion. If there’s some quantifiable evidence that shows Harden would be the suck, then fine. Otherwise I say give him a shot as the closer.
no
the discussions revolve around it taking too long for him to recover from warming up and then pitching.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 18, 2009 10:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Probably agreed.
He has such injury problems.
However, the “modern closer” seems to be the “oft-injured lights out closer” ala Gagne, Woody, and others.
Drew -
Serious question, not poking at you.
I recall the discussions specific to Harden’s injury history comparing to Wood and Wood’s success coming out of the ‘pen and not having the pitch counts. I also recall the answer being that moving to the ’pen would not help Harden’s arm as his issues are not related to pitch counts and he was more valuable as a starter.
As respects Harden’s health (and for now, disregarding his pre-pitch routine), is it that moving to the ‘pen doesn’t help and is neutral to Harden’s arm health, or does it increase his incidence for injury?
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
ah, see your answer above re his recovery.
Is there any data on his recovery time if he pitches one inning?
if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand
If
you’re asking Gorzo to be a dependable starter, I think we need another solution. He can’t pitch against the Pirates and Reds every day
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions
No, Kevin Gregg FOUGHT the law
But the law won.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions
When Kevin Gregg gets 21
its not blackjack
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
We've seen this before
I went to bed before the last inning and woke up to the bad news. But we’ve seen this before, a microcosm of the season, road version: Cubs defeated on the road by a rebuilding team that has been playing like one. Too little offense supplied by Lou’s RHP lineup, the bullpen craps, and the starting pitcher does a great job having to be removed from the game at the time that he was primarily because they needed some runs. 6-8 through in the lineup draws 1 walk. For the upteenth time, I’m cutting Lou some slack because there is no way in hell Miles would have been in that lineup had it not been for this scene’s “’cubbie occurence” which is/was, of course, Ryan Theriot’s flu.
Kevin Gregg isn’t a closer. While this season isn’t next season, there are still stakes hammered into the ground when jobs and roles are determined. So, one of the better things the Cubs can do for the remainder of this season is give Guzman a shot at closing and just see how he handles the job. That can provide important feedback about whether they have to pick-up a closer during the offseason.
Jeff Baker should have been playing too. He’s not that bad vs RHP and it is difficult to get power leverage at Petco anyway.
it is difficult to get power leverage at Petco anyway.
Not difficult enough.
by Mike Martin on Aug 18, 2009 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Right-handed power can work at Petco.
The kid, Blanks – has it. I watched a few of his games at Portland. He’s the 1B-in waiting. Putting him in the OF is Jake Fox-esque.
LHB — forget it, unless you can aim at the RF jury-box seats adjacent to the foul pole. That’s why Adrian Gonzalez MUST leave that team, or waste his talent. He went crazy the week before in parks that are not airplane hangars. NL Player of the Week — achieved on the road.
I don’t think A-Gon would resign, anyway — the Padres have his replacement, and we saw him come through last night against a shitty closer.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 18, 2009 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Kevin Gregg cheats on his wife
I’ll stop now.
He’s gone—no matter what—at the end of the season. Let’s all look forward to a future without him and one Aaron Heilman.
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
I hope you're right about Heilman ...
COOL BEANS!
by lexmarklover on Aug 18, 2009 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions
The Cubs will always have a Kevin Gregg and/or Aaron Heilman
That’s just the way of the world.
by Mike Martin on Aug 18, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe
we expected too much from this year’s Cubs after last year’s 97 win season. Look at all the players who had career years in 07: Lilly, Dempster, Marmol, Fontenot, Soto, Theriot, Johnson. And there were no significant injuries except Soriano.
This year all of them have regressed to the mean except Theriot.
Lilly is having a very good year
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions
Weren't the Cubs up by a game about a month ago?
That means they’ve dropped 7 games in a month. Jesus
Dropped seven games in a month?
Jesus Christos!
This space for rent ... to anyone who can think of something to put here.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 18, 2009 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions
Last night was very frustrating to watch in person.
Well, the first eight innings were okay. Cubs fans outnumbered Padres fans by a 60/40 ratio.
But that ninth inning was miserable. I have never seen a bullpen meltdown like the one I saw last night. I was on Gregg following his collapse against Houston in May, but last night was, for me, the nail in the coffin.
In my opinion, if Lou wants to try a new closer, it should be Guzman. He isn’t wild, he goes up there and gets guys out without being flashy. And, he doesn’t give up home runs every other day!
This space for rent ... to anyone who can think of something to put here.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 18, 2009 10:29 AM CDT reply actions
I don't really think it was 60-40 at all
They drew 23K. Without the Cubs, they would have drawn 16K on a Monday night. I do not think we outnumbered Padres fans at all. I thought we would. Obviously, some wiser Cubs fans decided not to attend.
Of the many games I’ve attended at both parks, I believe this was the fewest amount of Cubs fans I’ve seen at a SD/Chicago game in years and years.
The game winning ‘yell’ was quite louder than anything Cubs fans were able to muster.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 18, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Where's Blou?
Sadly his ramblings look fairly accurate at this point
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 10:36 AM CDT reply actions
I was thinking the same thing
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions
Yep
I was trying to find some positives the past few weeks and it’s getting next to impossible. This team leaves so many runners on base it’s embarassing. Why Fontenot and Miles continue to play are beyond me
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Siting in LF
(about 40 feet to the left of where Blanks’s ball landed) I do not think Fuld would have gotten to the double.
I feel like I was run over by a truck. A crappy one with its wheels falling off. Barely slept.
Deja Vu all ove again.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 18, 2009 10:36 AM CDT reply actions
I know,
I was there, too. Barely slept as well.
This space for rent ... to anyone who can think of something to put here.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 18, 2009 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions
Just when I thought it couldn't be any worse
listening to Pat’s dejected voice as he called the walk-off, I see this. Sorry; how bad that had to be, I really can’t imagine.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Aug 18, 2009 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions
When I got on BCB last night, I said something to the effect of
“There aren’t words to describe that one. Don’t say anything … just don’t say anything.”
This space for rent ... to anyone who can think of something to put here.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 18, 2009 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions
Did you hear the double?
It sounded like Santo didn’t say “Gee, whiz.”
It sounded like he said “Jesus!”
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Aug 18, 2009 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions
Fuld
would not have gotten that ball. It was well hit and near the gap. Again, Gregg trying to pitch around Eckstein was one of the worst things about that debacle.
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions
What was the pitch that Blanks hit?
Blanks can’t hit the curve yet — unless it was a hanger.
It really was a mini-version of 1984 and Garvey’s HR. Nothing was as bad as seeing that in person, but this was the regular-season knife in your throat type of scene.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 18, 2009 10:45 AM CDT reply actions
Favre stay retired!
This space for rent ... to anyone who can think of something to put here.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 18, 2009 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions
Favre just wants to avoid training camp
He was coming to the Vikings the whole time. Either way, he needs to go away
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Hendry
clearly tried to go on the cheap with Gregg as his closer. Should have used the money we spent on Miles, Gregg, etc. and go for a big-time closer like K-Rod. Even Brian Fuentes would have been a much better option.
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 10:49 AM CDT reply actions
Both K-Rod and Fuentes have blown 5 saves each.
One good thing is Gregg is a free agent and he will be be playing elsewhere next year.
Hey, it's a new century!
by cowsarecool220 on Aug 18, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Fuentes has 34 saves
Gregg just also created the problem on having to get another free agent. I like Guzman but chances are he won’t stay heathly
by VillanuevaExperience on Aug 18, 2009 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions
Don't forget Brad Lidge's suckitude too
One day I hope to come up with something worthy of this space.
Here's the thing about 'cheap' closers
ESPN the Magazine ran a short “box” story about Cheap v. Expensive closers. (Gregg fell into neither category) All of the expensive closers — KW included were either failing, or not performing to expectations. (Trevor Hoffman didn’t fall into either category, he was not making enough cash with the Brewers to be considered "expensive.’) That guy in the Bronx was doing OK, by the way, in this ESPN breakdown.
All of the budget closers were doing quite well. Teams overpay for closers. You just have to identify the talented ones. (Heath Bell would be one, for a decent price — this year.)
The Padres, to their credit have been able to have decent bull-pens on the cheap. Hoffman was the only guy making $$$$$, and were able to surround him over the years with discards, who came through for them. Doug Brocail had his best seasons in SD. So did Scott Linebrink — until he got the big money elsewhere. Heath Bell, the next example.
You just have to identify talent, and use it while you can — and then let somebody else splurge and overpay for him.
The WBC might have cost Marmol the closer’s gig, remember? Gregg reeled off 9 straight saves in the spring. Marmol never got it together after getting back in camp, and that might — just speculation, mind you — might have set the table for his problems this season.
Perhaps Marmol had a crisis of confidence, perhaps the ‘brilliant’ pitching coach tinkered with him.
So, Gregg assumed the position, so to speak…..
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 18, 2009 11:09 AM CDT reply actions
Wasn't able to see the game
so what does ESPN do? They give me a “Bonus Coverage” and show the entire ninth inning. Thanks a lot!! I’m not one to give up until we are mathematically eliminated but this really has be doubting whether we really can come back. I’m really down in the dumps today.
A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings. ~Earl Wilson
I wish I'd realized sooner just how bad Gregg has really been.
I’ve been – somewhat reluctantly at times – one of Kevin Gregg’s defenders all year. Every closer hits rough spots once in a while, I’d say. Don’t let a couple of blown saves define his season, I’d say. Saves are stupid stats anyway, I’d say. You could do a lot worse, I’d say…
…and now I look like a total idiot. The home run problems are just too much to bear at this point. I decided to do a little statistical research this morning, and not only is Gregg really, REALLY bad in that department – he’s HISTORICALLY bad.
To begin with: Gregg’s groundball/flyball ratio is 0.58. Only 11 NL pitchers with 50+ innings pitched are worse. 13.3% of his flyballs end up as home runs. Only 5 NL pitchers with 50+ innings give up more than that. One might dismiss that as mere bad luck, but most of the home runs he’s given up have been no-doubters. According to Hit Tracker Online, all but 2 of the homers Gregg has surrendered would’ve made it out in at least 27 big-league parks. Only one (Ryan Zimmerman’s) has had significant wind assistance, and it was hit hard enough that it didn’t need it anyway. Two (Carlos Lee’s and Jay Bruce’s) were actually hit against a pretty strong wind. Oh, and remember the one he gave up to Lance Berkman on May 16? That’s still the longest homer given up by any Cub pitcher this season.
That’s just for starters. Gregg is currently on pace to give up at least 16 home runs. You know how many full-time relief pitchers have given up that many homers in a season in the last 108 years? Fifteen. In all of modern big-league history, only fifteen guys have done that! That’s how bad Gregg’s home run problem is right now.
Oh, and by the way, all 12 of the dingers Gregg has given up were in the 9th inning or later. I don’t even want to know how many players have managed to match that stupefyingly bad feat. I’ll bet it’s a very, very small number.
To summarize: Kevin Gregg sucks, and has been sucking quite badly, for quite a long time. I should’ve done the research earlier. Mea culpa, everyone.
Even with Gregg as a setup man now, I’m really worried. Maybe he’ll do better under less pressure, but I dunno. If that problem isn’t corrected one way or another – and fast - the Cubs can probably kiss their playoff chances goodbye.
"I see great things in baseball. It's our game - the American game." - Walt Whitman
by hip2bsquare on Aug 18, 2009 11:30 AM CDT reply actions 7 recs
Nice research!
Rec’d
This space for rent ... to anyone who can think of something to put here.
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 18, 2009 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Agreed. Thanks for putting some numbers to the "greg sucks" feeling we all have this AM.
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end"
by AndrewJStone on Aug 18, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Awesome job!
That just confirms what I’ve been feeling about the guy all year. Too bad Lou never had that data or chose not to heed it.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
I agree but
He is or was a closer so of course all 12 of the home runs he gave up where in the 9th inning or later. The number is INSANE the timing is
a matter of logic. Hey would have been less of a problem if he gave them up in the 5th inning.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 18, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions
True, but...
Kevin Gregg has entered 8 games (out of 58 games pitched) prior to the 9th inning this year. So it’s not like he only gets chances to give up homers in the 9th or later.
"I see great things in baseball. It's our game - the American game." - Walt Whitman
Good stuff
Kevin Gregg has been a closer. That is why 12 of his dingers have been given up in the 9th inning or later. No pitcher is any good when they giveup toooo many HRs relative to innings pitched.
by AboutTheCubs on Aug 18, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Excellent work
and a fine blueprint for how to back up your take with numbers.
Someone said earlier that Kevin Gregg is really Mel Rojas. He might be Dave Smith, too. Two relievers with fly ball tendencies who were saved by their cavernous home stadiums (Olympic Stadium and the Astrodome).
Very nice work
Terriffic research. +++++++!
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 18, 2009 11:36 AM CDT reply actions
All losses hurt
but last night really hurt. I’m glad I didn’t get to see the game especially the ninth inning.
Recipe for Disaster;
C'mon Cubs, hurry up and blow this so I can relax.
by Bluekoolaide on July22, 2009 3:08 PM CDT
You're grasping for straws, Al.
It would appear to me that the Cubs have a slight schedule advantage;
And it would appear to me that with a 6 game deficit, that “slight” advantage is obliterated like a Kevin Gregg meatball.
So I suppose you'd rather give up.
Go right ahead.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Well put, Al
Some Cubs fans have the backbone of cooked macaroni.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 18, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions
As bleak as things look, me give up? No. Wild optimism? No. Mild optimism? No. A vague, toothache like hope? Maybe?
On the other hand I can’t get this out of my head:
To be, or not to be: that is the question:
Whether ‘tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, ’tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish’d. To die, to sleep;
To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there’s the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause: there’s the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
The oppressor’s wrong, the proud man’s contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law’s delay,
The insolence of office and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover’d country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o’er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action. – Soft you now!
The fair Ophelia! Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remember’d.
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
What am I "giving up"?
I’m not playing. My involvement as a fan has nothing to do with whether they win or lose.
I’m just pointing out the silliniess of you referencing their “slight” schedule advantage over St. Louis when they’re a week’s worth of games behind. Nothing more, nothing less. I understand it’s sort of your job to engender optimism, I just thought you were reaching there, and I still do.
You know,
I didn’t notice it at the time, and I guess it’s been mentioned….Lou came out in the 9th — to take Gregg out…with nobody warming up? That’s what ESPN has just said.
If that’s the case….this manager has lost it, he’s semi-retired, he has no idea what’s going on anymore and it’s time to make the move to Alan Trammel.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 18, 2009 1:29 PM CDT reply actions
No, that's not what happened.
Lou came out to talk to Gregg, not to take him out. I suspect the discussion was whether to intentionally walk Kouzmanoff, which they did. It was a VERY brief discussion, Lou never made it to the mound. After that, the plate umpire summoned Lou over and Len & Bob assumed it was to tell him, “That counts as a visit”. Lou acknowledged that.
ESPN said that? Idiots.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
ESPN also said
that the Cubs advantage down the stretch run was their bullpen. Ok…..
by BeltwayCubsFan on Aug 18, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I think they have a roulette wheel
in the studio or booth. Every so often when they think they’re gonna run out of good things to say (which appears to be more and more often lately), they spin the wheel and one of the guys reads the category.
Last night must have been, “well one of their strengths down the stretch has to be their bullpen”.
Just win the next game...!
This has to be right.
That’s the only thing that makes sense.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
>> giggle <<
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
I (and others) have been saying this even before the Cubs run in July
This team needs a shake-up. Firing Lou can’t possibly hurt this team right now. And what can we expect out of him next year if he stays anyway?
Firing Lou will not:
- Make Soriano learn to quit trying to hit the snot out of every pitch that comes his way.
- Make Rami injury free.
- Make gameboard all of as sudden look like Junior in his heyday.
- Make Fontenot an every day player.
- Make Harden injury free.
- Make Zambrano stop swinging a bat like he’s auditioning for a Halloween movie.
- Make Geo snap out of his season long slump.
- Make Dempster go back to his pre-$52M dollar contract performance.
- Make Marmol find the plate.
- Make Gregg suddenly make us all forget we don’t have a closer.
- Make Miles go far, far, far away.
Just win the next game...!
And how would it hurt this team?
Are you saying his decision-making isn’t slipping?
Make a new manager would be able to address some of these issues. Lou was afraid to move Soriano from the lead-off spot for how long? Until he absolutely sucked is the answer. That’s some great managing right there.
While I will question the manager
It’s not the high hitter on the pareto chart to address.
In things like Soriano’s lineup position, I honestly believe its a situation of the tail wagging the dog. it’s part of the reason why I dislike him and players like him (selfishness). Not so sure a different manager can change that.
There’s been far too many players under-performing and many injuries that have bigger affects. Now couple in Hendry’s assembly of the roster (issues due in part to lack of financial flexibility due to the team sale limbo) and it’s a full blown issue.
I put underperforming players 1st, lack of a solid roster 2nd, and questionable managerial moves / injuries tied for 3rd…as the top reasons why the Cubs are 6 back instead of 6 up right now.
Just win the next game...!
I agree with your assessment(s)
However, Lou just isn’t getting enough out of this team and IMHO, that’s the manager’s job
Besides, Jim and the players aren’t going anywhere anytime soon and they already changed hitting coaches. So what’s left?
I wouldn't be so sure Jim is safe
Only a hunch though.
But think of it, Lou is a pretty good manager. If he can’t get the right results, who can? I’m not sure I have an answer to this.
Now, changing managers during the offseason, after the GM has either been assured of staying or them getting a new GM and after the sale of the team, then fine. I just don’t know that promoting Trammell or getting another guy (please not Ryno) would do much.
Just win the next game...!
I'm not sure either
I just believe it couldn’t hurt
To me Lou looks like he checked out long ago. Maybe even after last year’s playoffs
hardens been injury free with the cubs so far
unless you count the sean marshall-randy wells audition DL stint an injury
the cubs lineup needs moar LIND and HALLIDAY
by jesus christos on Aug 18, 2009 2:53 PM CDT up reply actions
I count that and the fact he
has to be coddled a lot, making shifts in the rotation for various issues he’s had throughout the season.
Just win the next game...!
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
Cubs By The Numbers
Cubs By The Numbers is a history of the ballclub by uniform number, but the biographies help trace the history of our beloved team in a new way. For everyone who's a Cubs fan, anyone who ever wore the uniform is like family. Cubs By The Numbers reintroduces readers to some of their long-lost ancestors, even ones they think they already know.
Click here to order your copy, available now!
Recent Stories in Ticket Exchanges
Baseball Nation Recent Stories
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- The Cardinals Hall of Fame can now be found at Bill Clinton’s library in Arkansas (Huh?)
- Will Bryce Harper start the season with the Nationals?
- Mitch Mustain puts football behind him, signs reported rookie deal with White Sox
- Robinson Cano and Denzel Washington face off in Jay Leno’s Yankees trivia contest
- Shane Victorino lands role on ‘Hawaii Five-0′
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
