Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Full Coverage of 2012 Coke 600

Hello, Old Friends: Cubs vs. Mets Preview, Friday 8/28, 1:20 CT

Let's push controversy aside for a while, shall we, and try to just enjoy a baseball game this afternoon?

The last time the Mets visited Wrigley Field was more than 16 months ago, on April 22, 2008. That isn't that long ago in baseball terms, but of the eight starting Cubs that day, four are no longer with the team and one is on the DL. Five other Cubs who appeared in the game are elsewhere as well. As for the Mets, four of their starting eight from that game won't appear due to injury and three others have departed.

Ronny Cedeno hit a grand slam in that game, just to remind you of blasts from the past. It's still his only slam. (That's just about the time we started calling him ONEDEC.)

Two very different teams will take the field at Wrigley this afternoon from that long-ago day in 2008 (the Cubs did face the Mets last September, still almost a year ago, when the Mets were desperately trying to win a playoff spot, which they lost on the last day of the season). The Mets have been decimated by injuries, both to their starting lineup and pitching rotation -- the three Mets probable starters in this series, Pat Misch, Bobby Parnell and Nelson Figueroa, were definitely not the pitchers Jerry Manuel envisioned in his rotation in April.

OK, I suppose I can't resist a couple of links and comments regarding the current Milton Bradley situation. Phil Rogers says the Cubs should just cut him, which would cost north of $20 million and I think is a ridiculous idea, but Rogers also offer some suggestions of other teams' bad contracts that could result in a trade:

The only way to trade Bradley, according to executives with other clubs, is to up your ante to take on someone else's bad contract. You know the names -- the Blue Jays' Vernon Wells, owed $98.5 million over five years; the Giants' Barry Zito, $83 million over four years; the Astros' Carlos Lee, $55.5 million over three years, maybe the Giants' Aaron Rowand, $36 million over three years.

The best of those scenarios involves the Rangers' five-year, $80-million deal with Michael Young, who at 32 is a productive player. He's owed $16 million a year for four more seasons.

In a cost-cutting mode because of ownership problems, Texas might consider a Bradley-for-Young trade. But it wouldn't do it during its ongoing playoff race and it's going to be increasingly awkward for them to try to wade through a hugely problematic trade.

As Rogers says, Texas is in a playoff race and probably wouldn't do it now. So are the Giants with Zito, who has actually pitched very well since the All-Star break. The Vernon Wells deal would be more palatable to the Cubs if it didn't have five years and nearly as much money as Alfonso Soriano's. But I'd do it. Wells is virtually the same age as Bradley (about eight months younger) and, though he's had a couple of tough years since he signed his monster deal, at least he does have proven power numbers from the past, and could play CF, allowing Kosuke Fukudome to move back to RF next season (with Reed Johnson retained to back them both up).

And strangely enough, the best local media words on this situation come from the Tribune's Steve Rosenbloom, who I almost never agree with and who often writes ridiculous bombast. But today he nails it, in a column titled Bradley's response ought to anger those who take on racism seriously:

Racism is serious. If you are concerned or angry enough to put that in the public discussion, then you seemingly should be motivated to explain when and where this happened. How else do you take a step toward keeping it from happening again?

But when Bradley offers only cynicism and sarcasm, he diminishes the severity of the issue. Moreover, he does a disservice to those suffering abuse but who are willing to fight the fight head on.

...

Under no circumstances does anyone deserve to be abused racially. Underachieving baseball player and racial epithets are dots that should never connect.

But Bradley’s history and now his dismissive response to questions following his serious charges invite the suggestion that he’s looking for ways to shield himself from his problems, self-inflicted or otherwise.

One hundred percent correct, Mr. Rosenbloom. Bravo.

Try to enjoy today's game.

Star-divide

Today's Starting Pitchers
Ted Lilly
Ted Lilly
Cubs
vs. Pat Misch
Pat Misch
Mets
9-8 W-L 0-1
3.40 ERA 4.09
116 SO 13
27 BB 13
21 HR 1
vs. NY -- vs. Cubs

W-L G GS CG SHO SV BS IP H R ER HR BB K ERA WHIP
2009 - Ted Lilly 9-8 21 21 0 0 0 0 135.0 123 56 51 21 27 116 3.40 1.11

Pat Misch's stats below are with the Mets only; see the pitcher box for his full-season stats.

W-L G GS CG SHO SV BS IP H R ER HR BB K ERA WHIP
2009 - Pat Misch 0-1 15 0 0 0 0 1 18.2 18 6 6 1 10 13 2.89 1.50

There's no profile photo of Pat Misch in a Mets cap available (at least not in that size), so you get one of him with his former team, the Giants. The Mets acquired Misch on waivers in July and he's spent the last couple of months shuttling between Buffalo and New York, making 15 relief appearances with the Mets (after four with the Giants). He is a Chicago-area native who graduated from Glenbrook North HS in Northbrook in 1999 and has made three career relief appearances vs. the Cubs, all in 2007. This will be his first start as a Met. Only one current Cub has a hit off him -- Koyie Hill (1-for-2), but that's covering only eight total at-bats from all current Cubs.

Ted Lilly is 2-1, 3.86 in five career appearances (four starts) vs. the Mets. His last two starts against them, one in 2007 and one in 2008, were both wins, the last one in the April 22, 2008 game mentioned above. The current Met who has the most AB against Ted is Gary Sheffield; Sheffield is only 5-for-28 against him.

Cable-only today in Chicago (CSN) and New York (SNY). For other games today see the MLB.com Mediacenter.

MLB.com Gameday

Baseball-reference.com game preview

SB Nation game preview

Please visit our SB Nation Mets site Amazin' Avenue.

Overflow comment threads will post today at 2:15 pm, 3:15 pm and 4 pm CDT.

Discuss amongst yourselves.

Comment 154 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

I like Lee and Bobby Scales, and most Cubs fans do

So that whole racism idea is a non issue..

I'm a lefty, maybe Lou should give me a shot for a position in the bullpen!!

by Chanman25 on Aug 28, 2009 11:08 AM CDT reply actions  

oh, come on.

it’s not nearly as simple as that.

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

But but but...

I’ve got black friends. That HAS to mean I’m not racist right?

/sarcasm

by Arbusto on Aug 28, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

This is exactly what I was talking about

in the other thread where I was told my comment about questioning if Bradley has been subject to racism will result in being called a racist.

Excellent example and almost exactly what Wreckard posted to me yesterday when I asked a serious question about the experience of racism in the bleachers and RF specifically, pointing out the adoration of Sammy and Dawson and asking if it was a phenomenon that started after Sammy’s departure.

I visit this site less and less frequently because of things like this. If you dare question the group-think of some of the posters, then you’re personally attacked, called names or it’s implied that you’re a racist. Nice.

It’s a shame, Al, that it’s gotten like this.

by ScottT on Aug 28, 2009 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

How is that comparable?

I saw your question yesterday about Sammy and Dawson (never saw the response since I didn’t go back). But how is your question the same as a statement that “I like 2 other black players, therefore, I am not racist”?

by Arbusto on Aug 28, 2009 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

The question is

Would he get the same amount of grief if he were white? I suspect not, but that’s based on my general feeling that black players will get a quick, hard-to-erase label of being angry, lazy, etc. due to lingering sterotypes. Those of you sitting in the RF bleachers would have a closer view of what is going on up close.

by cubmudgeon on Aug 28, 2009 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, I think he would.

Perfect example: Todd Hundley.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 28, 2009 5:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Neifi Perez

I'm a lefty, maybe Lou should give me a shot for a position in the bullpen!!

by Chanman25 on Aug 30, 2009 9:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

It is not that simple,

maybe certain fans will only like “certain” kind of black players. Just because someone likes Dlee doesn’t mean they don’t like Bradley because he’s black.

And I’m certainly not saying anything about, just in general.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

anything about you Chanman.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Second?

"Fasten your seatbelts"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 28, 2009 11:15 AM CDT reply actions  

Where is everybody?

Are they still arguing in the fanposts?

"Fasten your seatbelts"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 28, 2009 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

At least that smarmy-ass picture is gone

That picture seriously made me want to punch him in the face.

There is no such thing as an ugly female breast

by Worf on Aug 28, 2009 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Just win the game.

I don’t care how, just win.

I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg

by Bill Potter on Aug 28, 2009 11:16 AM CDT reply actions  

+49

"Fasten your seatbelts"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 28, 2009 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

"Try to enjoy today's game."

Um, if they do anything enjoyable…

by Blue Heron on Aug 28, 2009 11:21 AM CDT reply actions  

Let's get Lee

He’s never had a problem bashing them out of Wrigley. Course that’s with us pitching to him.

by beckmania on Aug 28, 2009 11:22 AM CDT reply actions  

NO MORE DUTCH!

There is no such thing as an ugly female breast

by Worf on Aug 28, 2009 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

Speaking of such things

I found a new dutch-oven-like trick. With a wetsuit.

Rip a good one, then put your hand near someones face, and open up the seal on your wrist.

Fart a la face.

"This next song... it's about the White Sox. It's called: F*** Em'." - Eddie Vedder

by PacificCub on Aug 28, 2009 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

Like Spiderman!

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Aug 28, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly!

Especially if he had been bitten by a skunk. Of course, then he would be skunk man, I guess… doesn’t have the same ring to it.

"This next song... it's about the White Sox. It's called: F*** Em'." - Eddie Vedder

by PacificCub on Aug 28, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

Skunk-man just needs a catchy song!

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Aug 28, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

perfect!

Let’s get a package together for the marketing department.

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Aug 28, 2009 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

What's wrong with having Cajuns on the team?

Being a Cajun myself, I’m very curious.

And the eighth and final rule: if this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight.

by Ace Venom on Aug 28, 2009 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

They're too spicy

We Cub fans like bland stuff.

by Arbusto on Aug 28, 2009 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

"All" these Cajuns?

Aren’t there only two now?

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Aug 28, 2009 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

The lingering effects of Paul Bako can be felt to this day

Some fans just won’t forgive or forget him.

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

I saw him (on TV) hit a home run last night!

Bakoball – catch the fever!

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Aug 28, 2009 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Completetly agree with Rosenbloom

and Milton should be working with Cubs security to identify the culprits, something he apparently has never done.

Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by DC Cubbie on Aug 28, 2009 11:27 AM CDT reply actions  

Given Milton's nature to be a bit of a crazy person Rosenbloom is right to question him

But at the same time it would be foolish to dismiss his claims just because he said them. Hopefully the Sun-Times and ESPN Chicago writers who went into the stands yesterday go back in a few weeks when this thing blows over. Right now their accounts come when people have to be on their best behavior because they know the media and security is watching their every move.

Just say no to players named Aaron on the Cubs.

by nji232 on Aug 28, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Glad

I wasn’t the only one to agree w/ Rosenbloom. Read it this morning, and couldn’t actually believe that I was agreeing w/ him… for once. A virus is a virus is a virus.

"Chicago Cubs fans are ninety percent scar tissue." - George F. Will

by Slakkr on Aug 28, 2009 11:37 AM CDT reply actions  

I just saw on the Dan Patrick show that today is...

Lou’s birthday. Hopefully the team gives him a win for it!

Go Cubs!

by CubsWin!Oregon on Aug 28, 2009 11:39 AM CDT reply actions  

be nice

to get a win today.

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 11:50 AM CDT reply actions  

Wells????

The Vernon Wells suggestion is laughable. You’d be taking on 3 more years and 80 million for a guy who can’t really play CF any more and would be a downgrade offensively from Milton. He’s also had his own problems staying healthy. One of the reasons Halladay is still a Blue Jay is because no one wanted to take on VW’s contract.

by cubfan2201 on Aug 28, 2009 11:50 AM CDT reply actions  

I'd stay away from Wells, Al...

He’s actually making MORE money than Soriano from 2010-2014 ($98.5 million vs $90 million). His contract is probably the worst contract in baseball. He’ll be making $20+ million per year from 2011-2014.

And we’d be taking on an additional $78.5 million (and three years) for a guy who probably ins’t any better than Milton Bradley (certainly not as good as Bradley was last year). Wells is a career .802 OPS guy, is probably hitting the decline phase defensively (meaning he may need to move to a corner OF spot). And in two of the past three years, he’s had an OPS of under .725.

by SouthernCub on Aug 28, 2009 11:53 AM CDT reply actions  

And wasn't Wells the player...

…who specifically stated that he didn’t want to play at Wrigley Field? Or am I thinkin’ of someone else?

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Aug 28, 2009 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

The GM in Toronto...

…is also another guy who is lucky to still be in his position.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 28, 2009 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed...

Getting back to the topic of possible Bradley trades, I don’t think the guys listed by Rosenbloom is the appropriate list. I think a more realistic idea would be more along the Hundley for Karros/Grudz trade lines – pick up a couple of smaller contracts that teams don’t want who would be reserve players. I certainly don’t think we’d be trading Bradley (who "only has a bit over $20 million due after this year) for players with $50+ million left on their deals.

by SouthernCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can see Rosenbloom's point, however....
But Bradley’s history and now his dismissive response to questions following his serious charges invite the suggestion that he’s looking for ways to shield himself from his problems, self-inflicted or otherwise.

This goes both ways. Wrigley’s recent history with Latroy Hawkins, Jacques Jones, Dusty Baker, and Don Baylor invite the suggestion that maybe there’s something to Bradley’s claims.

by Wreckard on Aug 28, 2009 12:00 PM CDT reply actions  

well

for one, you focus on the play, and not the hype. The “angry black man” stereotype DOES EXIST. It’s hard to suggest that you don’t like Bradley because of his attitude without being painted. That sucks, I guess.

But it also matters in context — what do you think of Z’s outbursts? What about Riot having to be physically restrained, and Lilly charging the ump when he was thrown out of a game he wasn’t even playing in?

Those last two got barely any media play at all. Why?

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

isolated incidents, that's why

when it becomes a pattern, that’s when it’s talked about as an issue.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ted Lilly

punched his manager in the FACE!

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

this is the only time i've heard you say something negative about a Cub

and it’s in defense of another one. Come on Drew, I’m willing to hear your arguments, but you need to at least acknowledge that this has been an ongoing problem with Bradley throughout his career.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

Milton

gets way more flack than he deserves. The press decided he was a no-go before he even got to Chicago. When you don’t get a clean slate from one team to the next, you cannot ever win.

I say negative things when it’s deserved. I’ve wondered why Soriano hasn’t had the MRI on his knee. I complain when Lou uses Miles to pinch hit. I don’t like Dome hitting fifth, and I can’t undersatnd why Fontenot plays over Baker. Marmol’s walks drive me crazy.

But Milton Bradley has improved month to month all season. There’s NO REASON for him to get the crap he gets.

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

but there is

saying things like “i pray the game only goes 9 innings so I can get home quickly” is blasphemous for a professional ballplayer to say.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Don't you blaspheme in here!

People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. -- Bruce Bartlett

by berselius on Aug 28, 2009 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

It was Blue Lou Marini, IIRC

People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. -- Bruce Bartlett

by berselius on Aug 28, 2009 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not to be confused with BLou

oh, God, could they be one in the same?

I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg

by Bill Potter on Aug 28, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

yes

because you never want work to run long. Give me a break. He goes to work and essentially gets yelled at the entire 2.5-3.5 hours.

Is he still hitting the ball and fielding the ball? Yes? Then what he SAYS is IRRELEVANT.

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't want to work in the current conditions that he does either.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

It was only a warning punch.

I think we all know that Ted can do much better.

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Aug 28, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

What pattern are we talking about here?

Bradley’s history? Or his actions as a Cub?

AFAICT, his actions as a Cub have been completely above-board. An argument with an umpire and a brain-fart have been the only things that people can hang on him concerning his actions on or off the field. No one’s a saint over 120+ games, even Lilly, as Drew pointed out.

It’s his words that are getting him grief now, and have been from the beginning. Anything he says that can possibly make him look bad is trumpeted to the heavens, furthering preconceived notions until we get to where we are now. It’s a vicious circle, and I’m not very pleased with the direction it’s heading.

Bradley’s been very good on the field and at the plate for the last 6 weeks – truthfully, that’s all I care about. His hard work and baseball smarts are finally reaping the rewards which we all wanted on day 1, and I’m glad for that. At the same time, everything else is coming to a head, completely overshadowing his play.

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

+1, I like it when someone can eloquently state (much better than I) my similar thoughts. I Recd

Some people say the glass is half empty, some say half full. I say, are you going to drink that?

by BleedsbluinMI on Aug 28, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think we have a problem with labels.

There are different types of racists.

I’m racist. I grew up in Winnetka. I had a black friend growing up, but he grew up in Winnetka with a white mother. So my particular brand of racism is not really associated with skin color, but with a culture that is unfamiliar to me.

I absolutely act differently around black people. I don’t say things I might say around white people. I don’t mean racial slurs, but borderline comments that I self-censor out of the fear that they might offend. Example: I like to say “aks” instead of “ask,” mostly because of an episode of Futurama. But I don’t do it around black people. And that means I’m racist. Because I’m treating them differently.

If you want to call your boss a slave-driver, but don’t because there’s a black person, that’s racist. It’s not Ku Klux Klan racist. But it’s behaving differently around someone because they’re different than you.

A co-worker of a friend used the term “oreo” in front of a black person. The black person told them that term is offensive. The white person said “no it’s not.” The black person had to explain that it was, because it offended her.

Racism is something that is a part of all of us. It’s in the way we were raised, the environment we grew up in, the way our role models treated people.

Not all racists light crosses on lawns. In fact most don’t. But make no mistake, most of us are, in fact, racist. We just may not know it till someone points it out.

We need to try to not let an emotionally charged word get the better of us as we discuss this. It’s just a word.

by redward on Aug 28, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think this is entirely accurate.
Having read many of your other posts, you really seem to believe that much of the vitriol shown the aforementioned is race related.

What I think is this: the vitriol shown by Cubs fans specifically towards Bradley seems waaaaay out of line with what he’s ever done, both as a Cub and before he came here. I honestly have no idea why this is, but I do think it would be naive to think that race isn’t part of it, even if it’s a small part. And I think the knee-jerk defensive reaction sells short what, at some point, needs to be recognized as a pattern.

If you’ve read my posts, you’ll notice that not only do I think the vitriol directed towards Bradley is stupid, immature groupthink at its worst, but I think that the same problem extends to many other Cubs players as well.

But that doesn’t really answer your question which boils down to: what’s a hater to do? How can I, Wreckard, both hate Bradley and not be called a racist?

My recommendation: You should get some fucking perspective.

I mean seriously. You “despise” Bradley? A man paid to play a game for our entertainment? Simply because he fails at a skill that is completely and totally unrelated to said game – dealing effectively with the media and saying the “right” thing?

Because really that’s what it comes down to. This whole Bradley thing was actually a lot simpler back when he was simply under-performing. But now for nearly 2 months straight he’s performed pretty close to his career norms, and there’s still this giant shitstorm of hatred raining down on him from Cubs fans. And that makes a lot of us question what this is really about.

by Wreckard on Aug 28, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ted Lilly will make all things right again today

I could really use a win today. I’m feeling the blues lately. The Bleedcubbieblues…

by Freddyd on Aug 28, 2009 12:08 PM CDT reply actions  

I like it

bleedcubbiebluesssss, we’ve all got it.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Aug 28, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thanks for that title, Al

Now I’ve got “The Sounds of Silence” running through my head.

The words of the prophets are written on BCB…

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 12:34 PM CDT reply actions  

You know, now that the song is in my head, too (thanks)

I can only think of the scene in Old School, and how the Cubs seem to be slowly sinking to the bottom of a pool without a fight.

I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg

by Bill Potter on Aug 28, 2009 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Rosenbloom hit the nail on the head

I really do hope that we can find a trading partner for Bradley. I just don’t envision the Cubs winning with him. I also don’t think it’s any coincidence that our controversies went from basically zero to many after he came on board.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 12:36 PM CDT reply actions  

really?

all the fuss over Z last year? The pissy astros over the no-hitter?

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

all the fuss

about Dome’s free-fall?

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

there was no fuss.

Lou sat him, and that was that. that’s the difference, Dome is a team player.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

I remember

a LOT of angst about it. “the contract is an albatross, what will we do about RF?”

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm sure a lot of people did say that

I wasn’t one of them, though. And, it didn’t seem to have a negative effect on the chemistry of the team, and that’s the point i was trying to get across.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

perhaps

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe if we had DeRo as the clubhouse leader

with Bradley, things would have been different. I think that sure would have helped our chemistry and leaderless problem.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Plenty of calls to DFA him

Send him back to Japan. Do anything to get him off the team, including eating the money remaining on his contract.

Seems familiar somehow.

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Of course it's no coincidence

The Chicago media couldn’t wait to welcome Bradley with open arms and a delicious apple pie.

I’m not usually a “blame the media” type of guy, but MB’s been a marked man for these jackals from the day he signed.

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

yep, they are really getting my ire right now.

I wish I could shut them up, they are making things worse.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I do agree with that.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

yea, we agree. :)

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

They love it because it makes good copy – objectivity and (particularly when it comes to Phil Rogers) logic be damned.

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Aug 28, 2009 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Do you really think that if

Sori, Soto and Fontenot had played like they did last year that Milton would have dragged this team down? Milton can be a part of a good team, not just the go to spotlight guy.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm more apt to believe that the negativity

has had an adverse effect on Sori, Soto, and Fonty…not the other way around.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

it's still

the Press’ fault.

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

So MIlton helped Soto go on his twinkie binge?

makes Sori swing at every slider off the plate? C’mon I don’t think he has the kind of affect on other players you do. You don’t like Milton, but don’t blame other players woes on him too.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can see your point on that

and perhaps that’s my personal feelings speaking instead of reality.

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think many Cubs fans feelings about Milton Bradley's personality...

…affect how they view him as a baseball player. I agree with Rosenbloom’s point – and I can’t deny that Milton draws a lot of ire with his words and actions – but I choose to look past that and focus on his talents as a ballplayer.

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Aug 28, 2009 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

Good post, Daver!

I wish more fans would try to focus a little better on that.

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Aug 28, 2009 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

That April 22, 2008 game...

IIRC it was my first game of 2008. And yeah, it seems like a loooong time ago.

It was Ted Lilly’s first win after a shaky start (0-3) to 2008. ONEDEC’s grand slam came off of Jorge Sosa, who must have nightmares about Wrigley; he’s now on the Nationals, and the Cubs lit him up this Wednesday night. And Kevin Hart pitched the 9th for the Cubs; had forgotten he was on the big league club at all last year.

by ChipSet on Aug 28, 2009 12:38 PM CDT reply actions  

Even though Zito has pitched well lately...

11 earned runs allowed over his last 8 starts, SF would certainly dump his contract in a hurry if offered only 2 years of Milton in exchange. They have plenty of stupid contracts (Rowand, Renteria, Winn, Dave Roberts—$6.5 M to stay home!) they wish they’d never done.

I’m seeing Zito vs. Marquis on Saturday night, and am actually looking forward to it. I would have bet big money against that in April.

by bison on Aug 28, 2009 12:38 PM CDT reply actions  

Yes.....

But could we give them Soriano’s instead, and use Bradley in one of the other aforementioned trade scenarios? I’d like to think on that one……….

"Bite my shiny metal ass!" -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

"Life is just one crushing defeat after another until you just wish Flanders was dead."

by The Jade Scorpion on Aug 28, 2009 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Caption, sort of

Lou: Fifty bucks say you can run out there and kick Quade in the ass and get back here before he knows what happened.
Ted: Oh I know I could do it.
Lou: Fifty bucks…
Ted: Fifty buck huh?

There goes one over the fence...a Tru-Link fence.

by truelinkfence on Aug 28, 2009 12:47 PM CDT reply actions  

This site has been really contentious this week

I don’t know if it would be better for us to lose the next ten games so we can get all the angst out of our system and focus on next year, or rather keep winning a few and keep the small of glimmer of hope flickering.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 12:55 PM CDT reply actions  

There is no way in hell I would take Vernon Wells for Milton Bradley.

NO
WAY
IN
HELL

You’ve got to be kidding me! Bradley is a significantly better defensive player, has better offensive metrics like OPS+ and BaBIP, and is a contract that is only here for two more years.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Aug 28, 2009 12:57 PM CDT reply actions  

And it's a lot cheaper contract... not just a shorter contract...

Bradley has probably added more value to his teams than Wells over the past 3 years, in spite of his injuries.

I’m not saying we should definitely keep Bradley. But I’d rather have Bradley than Wells.

by SouthernCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Anyone got a lineup yet?

There is no such thing as an ugly female breast

by Worf on Aug 28, 2009 1:00 PM CDT reply actions  

just guessing here

riot, bradley, lee, aram, dome, sori, soto, baker

sigh

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fuld in CF

"I love California. I practically grew up in Phoenix."
-- Dan Quayle

by LAcarl519 on Aug 28, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

is the pitcher a lefty?

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

yes, Misch is a lefty

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

oh, I'm sure I'll get it right tomorrow when we face a righty.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

lol

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

I just tried to scribble it down per the pregame interview.

I think it’s this:

Theriot
Bradley
Lee
Ramirez
Baker
Soriano
Fuld
Hill
Lilly

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Aug 28, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

+1 for having Hill in the lineup

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

at least he is playing him more often

that a small plus in Lou’s column

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I like Baker there

Let’s see if he is over-promoted.

There is no such thing as an ugly female breast

by Worf on Aug 28, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Don't like Baker in the 5 spot, but we don't have many options.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

ISWYDT

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

So what does Baker say to the fan taunting him?

“Eat me!”

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

GET BAKED!

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

haha love it! :)

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Baker

understands the honor of putting on a Cubs uniform. He should bat in all positions.

(sarcasm aside I do like Jeff Baker)

by CalCalender on Aug 28, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

He will rise to the challenge.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

I really didn't knead to hear that

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's just trying to get his piece of the pie

There is no such thing as an ugly female breast

by Worf on Aug 28, 2009 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

What kind of half-baked thread is this?

You won’t get a rise out of me!

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Aug 28, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hope Lilly puts up some doughnuts.

Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton

by KaliCub on Aug 28, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeesht.

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think Soto is in front of Fuld and Hill is obviously out.

otherwise, you were close.

that is my recollection…granted, I am on meds. I could be totally wrong.

"I love California. I practically grew up in Phoenix."
-- Dan Quayle

by LAcarl519 on Aug 28, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

No Hill today

Cubs lose

People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. -- Bruce Bartlett

by berselius on Aug 28, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Piniella/Lilly caption...

Lou: Ted, give me your honest opinion of Larry
Ted: He’s overated
Lou: Yea, I agree. Hendry told me they were gonna spend all this money on players
          so I went along with his desire I keep him as pitching coach. What a dumbass I
          am!!!

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 28, 2009 1:01 PM CDT reply actions  

Since Al

and others seem to think that Mitlon is overexaggerating or even making up these racial claims I want to repost this comment here. This comes from a BCB poster who sat in the stands yesterday

That’s me and I was there.
Section 206 Row #3. Second inning 4 guys in their early 20’s rolled in and sat two rows behind us. The section was mostly empty. Them in row 5, us in row three, rows 2 and 1 were vacant. The 106 Section usher is just in front of us, 10 feet from them.

Three guys were wearing Cubs-ish gear. two of the three had on the "if they lose, we still booze" T’s I can’t really call Cub stuff. The loudest and 4th brashley announced to the others they must suck if they let him, a White Sox fan, find them their seats.

They then proceeded to verbally crap on everyone in the area. The guy to our right in a Michigan jacket is a fag because he wasn’t a ND fan. To Soriano in the field, he needed to hit another wall because he sucks too much to play. To young women walking by, they had special seating arranged for them, To Kevin Gregg he sucked worse than LaTroy Hawkins because he wasn’t supposed to be a closer, etc.

Bradley’s first at bat, they were quiet until he made the out, then he was a horrible f’er who needed to leave town.

Second AB, they were abusive immediately when he strolled to the plate.

During the third AB, The one who had claimed to be a Sox fan yelled that Bradley "deserved to be beaten like Rodney King" for sucking like this.

Did I report this to security. No. The staff seemed fully aware. The usher was 10 feet away and looked at them with every utterance and word Security walked by constantly looking up at them.

Do I usually pay this close attention to a few drunks nearby? No, but I took my 5 year old daughter to her first game.

You could argue none of the comments individually were racist. I’m looking at the perspective if I was an African American man with big contract and believed I was underperforming and hearing abuse like this night in and night out. I would certainly believe there were racial undertones.

That the guy claimed to be a Sox fan is irrelevant to whether Bradley hears these things. It’s just ironic that it’s the reputation of Cubs fans and Bradley’s experiences as a Cub being discussed.

if this was still new to me, i wouldn’t understand
by N Oakley on Aug 28, 2009 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would like to see some of you doubters explain that and “HIGGYS” comment away.

by CalCalender on Aug 28, 2009 1:03 PM CDT reply actions  

Let's see

Homophobic comments, attacks on white players like Gregg, sexist comments and a guy claiming to be a Sox fan making a racist comment — I do agree that making Rodney King references to a black guy is racist.

Seems like they are equal opportunity offenders.

No, seriously, the anectdote is horrible.

But I must giggle and your reliance on anectdotal evidence here. Your abacus broken today?

There is no such thing as an ugly female breast

by Worf on Aug 28, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

What else do you need?

Written affadavits from racists at wrigley? months of CCTV footage?

Of course it’s going to be anecdotal

People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. -- Bruce Bartlett

by berselius on Aug 28, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wonder if

their parents are proud of them?

Recipe for Disaster;
C'mon Cubs, hurry up and blow this so I can relax.
by Bluekoolaide on July22, 2009 3:08 PM CDT

by sue369 on Aug 28, 2009 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

My “abacus”

Sadly that is probably the most up to date educational tool Worf has used.

by CalCalender on Aug 28, 2009 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Photo caption:

Ted: Y’know a fan heckled me once.

Lou: Oh yeah? How’d that work for him?

Ted: (Long pause.) Not too good.

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Aug 28, 2009 1:06 PM CDT reply actions  

*sigh* are you here all week? :P

"Yes, dear. You're right. I'm sorry." -Bob Brenly

by ambrosiadreams on Aug 28, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Only until the puns run out.

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Aug 28, 2009 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

the waitress

is on a gyroscope.

"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.

by drewishdrewid on Aug 28, 2009 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I hope our performance at the plate

Results in a Misch mash.

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Take your puns elsewhere

JUMP!

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 28, 2009 1:16 PM CDT reply actions  

Mostly disappointment

The world – including the stands at Wrigley – can be full of jerks. Those jerks, their attitudes and their comments, wouldn’t matter if the Cubs were winning. They wouldn’t matter is Soto weren’t having a world-class sophomore slump, or Sori were on a streak, or the bullpen could be reliable two games in a row, or Piniella seemed to give a hoot, or. . . Bradley hadn’t choked.

This is really all about reaction to a pretty bad Cubs team, isn’t it? Especially in relation to the previous two years? At least apart from the jerks.

I admire those of you who can still joke about it, even if they are really lame jokes. I’m pretty close to clinical depression about this season…

AlaskaFan

"Year after year after year after year . . . . . after year after year after year . . ." - Steve Goodman, "Dying Cub Fan's Last Request"

by AlaskaFan on Aug 28, 2009 1:19 PM CDT reply actions  

Mets

Let’s forget all this and embarrass the Mets all weekend !

by If we only had Hubbs on Aug 28, 2009 3:46 PM CDT reply actions  

Bradley for Wells?

Are you serious? Absolutely not.

by rlpete on Aug 28, 2009 4:19 PM CDT reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to Bleed Cubbie Blue, the Chicago Cubs blog for the SB Nation, created on February 9, 2005 by Al Yellon

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Small
Maybe it's time to take a deep breath

Recent FanPosts

Small
Top 10 things I liked about watching the Cubs lose at PNC Park
Seinfeld_jerk_store_black_shirt_small
Cubs pitching problems answered!
Zambrano_background_2_small
What is the most likely move in June regarding current players?
Small
Draft Prep: Pierce Johnson
Small
Trying to be positive (need some help)
Small
Soriano back to Second?
Small
Javier Baez Peoria Bound?
Small
Draft Prep: Conference Tournament Version
Despite-an-inflated-babip-lahair-is-no-one-month-wonder
Suddenly, I feel your pain

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recommended FanShots

Former MLB PItcher Bob Ojeda On Pitching And Pain
Wrigley Field Supporters Propose Tearing Down Rest Of Chicago
Doug Glanville On His Teammate, Kerry Wood
Thanks.
Samardzija takes a dig at Hawk Harrelson

Recent FanShots

A Day In The Life Of An A-Ball Minor Leaguer
Baez to Peoria
2012 Stars and Stripes Hat
Sveum moves Castro back to #2 spot
OT: Tyler Colvin bats 2nd
The Pittsburgh Pirates Offensive Catastrophe
Roy Halladay Bobblehead Fail
Full sized image

+ New FanShot All FanShots >

Featured Poll

Poll
Should the National League adopt the designated hitter rule?

  1042 votes | Results

Cubs By The Numbers

Cubs By The Numbers is a history of the ballclub by uniform number, but the biographies help trace the history of our beloved team in a new way. For everyone who's a Cubs fan, anyone who ever wore the uniform is like family. Cubs By The Numbers reintroduces readers to some of their long-lost ancestors, even ones they think they already know.

Click here to order your copy, available now!

Recent Stories in Chicago Cubs Game Threads

Yahoo_full_count

Recent Stories in Ticket Exchanges


Managing Editor

Alyellontoppscard_small Al Yellon

Front Page Contributors

Profile_small Josh Timmers

B_w_avatar_small Brett Taylor

Marvin_the_martian_small Shawn Domagal-Goldman

Other Contributors

Toonmike_small Mike Bojanowski

Dsc_0139_small David Sameshima