Where is the middle ground on this site?
I posted this towards the end of a deep fanpost, and felt like making it it's own fanpost. I'll will say straight up, this is a bit of a rant.
Take this as you will, this is just a rant I have about mainly this site and the people (and Cubs fans in general)
Why does the middle ground of the sane and rational seem to be hard to find? Don’t get me wrong, there are those of you here that are realistic and rational, but most of the people seem to fall in to one of two categories.
1, Sunshine and Puppies!
2, Everyone Sucks!, wharrgarbl!
Frankly, both sides annoy me about the same. Those who try to defend every bad thing and who are convinced that everything is perfect and well are freaking insane.
“But MrNFL, the Cubs are going to get hot and make the playoffs! You just have to believe!”
Um, I’m sorry. The odds of this team getting hot and making the playoffs are hardly existent. I’m not against optimism, but blind optimism is going to lead you off a cliff. I could BELIEVE that $1 million dollars is going to magically appear in my lap, but is it going to because I believe it is? No.
CAN the Cubs make the playoffs? Sure, if they win just about every game from here out, and 3 or 4 teams in front of them decide to fall apart. Those of you who are convinced this team is going to the postseason anyway are just in denial.
And then you have the other people, “DFA Soriano, he’s a worthless bum! Milton Bradley sucks! Piniella Sucks! Hendry Sucks! Everyone Sucks!”
We get it, you don’t like (insert name here) You don't need to have every post you say be slamming the team.. We are ALL unhappy about how the season has gone, remember this team was supposed to be improved from a solid season last year. But every post being so incredibly negative makes me feel like I’m reading a rival teams’ opinions on us.
We get it, you are angry. Yelling the same thing over and over again and then taking shots at members on this site who don't hate everything that exists makes you look insane.
And the worst, everything turns into a freaking war between these two sides of people. And all it ever seems to turn into is not rational debate of a subject, but childish yelling and insults. I think that reflects badly on us Cubs fans as a whole.
Realistically, this post probably will get me bashed by both sides of these people. But I don’t care. I’ve been on a lot of sports fan sites (Including other SB Nation sites) and this site has by far the biggest problem with this type of thing. There are members of this site I do respect and enjoy seeing their thoughts, because they are sane and rational. But it seems like too many are one of these two categories of schmucks.
I like this site, I like reading Al's articles, I feel this is the best place to find a solid conversation about the Cubs. But I almost don't want to come here any more with all these people yelling at each other.
Remember everyone, we all want the same ultimate thing here. With that said, Go Cubs.
/end rant
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
11 recs |
55 comments
Comments
Very Well Put
I’m a long time reader of this blog; however I seldom post comments. This is right on in my opinion.
by Les Lancaster's Mullet on Aug 29, 2009 5:01 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Agreed
This summed up a lot of what I have been thinking over the course of much of thsi season and is big reason why I hardly post comments anymore either
"I don’t believe that things go your way," said Lou Piniella, the Cubs manager.
"I believe you make things go your way."
by Basman on Aug 30, 2009 4:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup
I’ve often wondered at the people on this site who complain about negativity with a negativity every bit as annoying as the original negativity.
by BlueSox on Aug 29, 2009 5:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm pretty sure I remember from Physics class
two negatives make a positive. :D
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 29, 2009 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two wrongs don't make a right
But three lefts do.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Aug 29, 2009 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that the disappointment of this season
is heightening tension and it’s coming out in the way people post, but also in the way people interpret posts. I know I’ve had some posts that when I read someone’s response to the post, I thought, “Did I really come off the way this guy is saying?” So I look back at what I wrote and I saw I could have put things better, but part of it also was the interpretive choices.
I think the tension/frustration of this season will dissipate eventually and the tone will change so long as people don’t hold grudges. And I don’t see why people would hold grudges – after all, for me, it’s often the posters I disagree with most, but who can make their case well, who I am most interested in continuing to read.
Randy Wells - You continue to astound me.
by DGU on Aug 29, 2009 5:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately, I think a lot of it has to do with the whole online mindset
It just seems to me that people tend to drift to the most extreme sides. I’ve always found it interesting that the posts that are the least controversial or provocative tend to get the fewest comments. Too many people seem to get off on fighting and provoking. But, then, I guess that’s human nature.
I’ve gotten to the point where I try to avoid any post that has “Milton Bradley”, “Jim Hendry” or “Lou Pinella” in the title because I can pretty much predict exactly what’s going to be said and I know i’ll pretty quickly degenerate into anger, name calling, etc.
Ideally I’m here to engage my fellow Cub fans in discussions, debates, nostalgia, etc. When personalities start to come into play, I’ve begun to rapidly lose interest.
by bluekoolaide on Aug 29, 2009 5:23 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
hammer head nail award
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Aug 30, 2009 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't even need to read the title of posts anymore.
Just check the number of comments. Anything over about 50-60 comments is still possibly a worthy thread for discussion, but once the comment tally crosses the 100 mark, it’s unlikely to be generating serious discussion at that point.
Any thread with 200 comments or more is predictably a name-calling orgy of reactionary emotion. It never fails.
"Was you ever punched in the face five hundred times a night? It stings after a while." ~Rocky Balboa
by Goodie1969 on Aug 30, 2009 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly.
The whole Milton Bradley nonsense from a couple of weeks ago was insane. Then I allowed myself to get caught up in it and responded in kind to a poster.
It was enough to make me stay away for almost two weeks. For as much time as I’ve spent on BCB, I found that I didn’t miss it or those who insult anyone who has any opinion that differs at all from their own.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on Sep 8, 2009 8:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't consider myself a "sunshine and puppies" poster
I consider myself realistic.
Is it likely the Cubs will be in the postseason this year? No. Is it possible? Yes. Other teams have come back from deeper deficits with less time remaining.
Those who are wagging their fingers and saying “I told you so” because they were screaming doom and gloom in May should not be congratulated or commended on their perceptiveness. In a game like baseball, it’s ridiculous to postulate a six-month season based on one or two months.
I’d say let’s all try to lie back and enjoy what’s left of this season. Because you know you’ll be missing it in January.
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 29, 2009 5:34 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
not that I disagree with your view but
I consider myself realistic.
So does nearly everyone else on both extremes and across the middle of the spectrum.
It's not just your perceptions that can be wrong. Even your memory is often incomplete or possibly flat out wrong.
by shake n bake on Aug 29, 2009 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hmmm, was it realistic to say the Cubs were out of it in May or June?
Even though it appears the Cubs will not be playing in the post season, to declare the Cubs out of it months ago was absurd.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Aug 30, 2009 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
not saying everyone is actually realistic
just that pretty much everyone thinks they are. Just like the ragged man on the street mumbling about CIA microchips in his head and reptilian impostors running the government, thinks he’s a realist.
It's not just your perceptions that can be wrong. Even your memory is often incomplete or possibly flat out wrong.
by shake n bake on Aug 30, 2009 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No one said the Cubs were out of it in May or June.
Many posters said that the team had serious problems that needed to be addressed, and were loudly shouted down.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
by D98 on Aug 31, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I get angry at the "everything sucks" crew...
especially those who demand we make unrealistic trades with our best players while they’re not playing up to par. But I don’t believe we have a chance of making the playoffs and I certainly don’t think everything is sunshine and puppies. Does that make me cool in your book?
by smash! on Aug 29, 2009 6:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think the quote in my sig
explains it all.
"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will
by eswan9 on Aug 29, 2009 6:59 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for this post and the thoughtful comments.
Argue your position passionately if you must, but always remember there is a real person on the other end. If you wouldn’t say it to that person’s face, don’t post it here.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al on Aug 29, 2009 7:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think there are a lot of middle ground people
I consider myself one. Obviously for any regular reader I think Lou is a VERY bad manager and Soriano is very bad THIS season and might well be hiding a physical injury. I tend to be an optimist on the future and while I realize the Cubs have ALMOST no chance of making it , I will still hope because I can’t help it and I will still watch games.
I think a lot of vitrol is over Lou and a few specific players. Apparently I have to think Soriano is just one hot streak away from saving the team or should be dumped even if the Cubs eat 50 million dollars. With some variation the same on Bradley, Soto & Theirot. I happen to take a middle ground with all the above. I admit to disliking Lou and wanting him gone but that is a position I have held since last April so I don’t think you can pin that on this season or tenor or BCB.
Thing is we tend to see the posts that the entire Cubs orginization is rotten from Blou or to lesser extent Krummy and others or the if only everyone played to their career norms which we expect to happen any day now than the Cubs are gonna win the WS view of NBF and Drew. Most of us ARE in the middle even if we might hold a particularly strong view on a particular player ( or Lou). Add in fanshots etc and you will see that the majority of people here really are in the middle but they may not shout as loud.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 29, 2009 7:48 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
This is one of the other things to note
is that there aren’t constant sides for most posters here. Often times you see posters who disagree strongly on one issue, agree completely on another.
Randy Wells - You continue to astound me.
by DGU on Aug 29, 2009 8:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jessica,
I don’t think I’ve ever said that if the Cubs play up to their norms, they would win the World Series. I think I said they’d have an excellent chance of winning the division should they do that.
We all use hyperbole to bolster our arguments, but …
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 29, 2009 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
I pretty much said the same thing to myself upon reading that. One of my most repeated comments is that the playoffs are a crap-shoot. You CANNOT build a team to win the world-series. You CAN build a team that will probably win the division.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 29, 2009 9:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry boys you were just my best example
the VERY optimistic side. Yes I used hyperbole. I am sure there must be SOMETHING about the entire Cubs orginization that Blou likes.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Aug 29, 2009 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its mere existence may be the only thing he likes
What would there be to bash, otherwise?
An anecdote: I was a regular at a sports bar that had a good bit of staff turnover. One woman picked up as a waitress and stuck around for a while, but she was constantly complaining – about the boss, bills, her man, society…really, anything she could find. She’d smile for a table full of customers and no other time, ever. After she had been there for a year or so, someone observed, “If life suddenly became easy and carefree, she’d be the unhappiest person on the face of the earth.”
I’ll leave the MadLib substitutions up to your imagination.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on Aug 29, 2009 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hear ya
I’d like to know what BLou likes about the Cubs, but that would mean I’d have to endure another post from BLou … so I guess some things are better left unsaid. :)
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 30, 2009 2:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know anymore
when he gave up on his favorite spark-plug Theriot…
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 30, 2009 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
have you noticed
That if the Rox lose, the Cubs are only 5.5 games out of the wild card.
"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver
by wrigleyrocker12 on Aug 29, 2009 8:07 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
currently
they’re down, 2-0.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Aug 29, 2009 9:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
only 4 behind in the loss column
It ain’t looking good, but it ain’t over either. The teams in front of them are just as flawed.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Aug 30, 2009 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It is what it is
As I have stated a few times. This site like many others is open to all. The wonderful thing about it, is you see so many different sides of not only Cub fans, but people in general.
It truly is a microcosim of love, hate and indifference. I for one enjoy it. You learn different people through their names. I am sure many hide behind the fact that like Al stated above, only you can not see each other. Therefore the wall is broken down what is written for all to view. It does not matter, I am hidden behind my keyboard.
Nice post, but honestly who cares. Take it for what it is worth.
Trade Doug Deeds to Washington.
by wild bill on Aug 29, 2009 8:26 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh and one more thing
Emotion is displayed istantly with this avenue. Baseball like many team sports is very emotional.
What I have found is you learn the ones that truly understand the game. You learn the ones that often will share their emotions. Sometimes it is just nice to talk baseball. At times that will happen on this site. But more often than not people let their emotions take over.
Trade Doug Deeds to Washington.
by wild bill on Aug 29, 2009 8:35 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Is this a microcosm of American evolution?
Before I saw this fanpost, a similar topic came up in conversation over dinner tonight. On virtually any issue, America has become less centrist.
I am a fan, but I’m a centrist at heart. I believe in the power of the 80/20 rule, and that 80% of the Cub fans are not passionate enough to invest time in an online discussion board. And that in America today, “passion” and “centrism” are generally considered antonyms.
I held hope for the 2005 team, even though I almost had to be sedated when Dusty Baker sent Neifi!! up to pinch hit down by one with two out in the ninth with the tying run on 1st… in the second game of the season! But I walked away from the 2006 team very early – refusing to give a penny to the Tribune company or help their advertising ratings until they fired Dusty.
When the extreme doubters were throwing the 2009 team under the bus a week before the ASG, I held hope that they could win 8 of their next 11 – and the team played well against STL and @WSH to justify my hope. But I walked away after the losses at SD, even when the extreme believers were exerting patience. Both times, the extremists have been adamant that I was wrong.
I think I’m a centrist – following the Cubs is one of the ways I spend my free time, but not the main way. There are folks here who invest the time and effort to go to 15-20 road games each year. They have to be optimists, or else they are masochists. I do not DEMAND success – I REWARD it with my precious time. And conversely, I punish stupidity (and I’m looking for a picture of Corey Patterson while I’m writing this) by withholding my time.
It's a simple question, Doctor: would you eat the moon if it were made of ribs??
by Invalid User on Aug 29, 2009 10:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
15-20 road games a year
Any specific person in mind, IV? :)
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 30, 2009 2:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or I guess that's IU
Maybe I just need an IV …
by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 30, 2009 2:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You very nearly nail an important point
As a non-American but a fan of many things American, I am often amazed by how bipolar points of view have become in your country. It’s not that people don’t hold centrist views… many, if not most, do.
But the nature of discourse in the States often ends up crystallising around two polar opposite views.
The role of the media in this dynamic is central but a two party political system has some effect too….
Culture continually morphs and changes, and I don’t expect it to remain this way forever…. but at this point in time some people in other countries scratch their heads and say “are those people crazy or what?”
by kiwibob on Aug 30, 2009 5:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its a couple things
1) the nature of an online blog
- people with middling opinions tend to not post because they figure their thoughts on that particular subject aren’t very interesting. Remember the internet though conversational at times isn’t meant to track like a pure conversation with all the “ands, umms, etc” so if you don’t have a viewpoint on something its common nature to just refrain from posting.
2) the nature of how we remember posters
- if there are comments that aren’t particularly slanted one way or another you tend to forget them. You tend to remember the most controversial topics and then respond, so all the “middle ground” seemingly fades away.
3) as others pointed out, plenty of people are in the middle ground on things and are reasonable when it comes to posting
- you just tend not to remember them….
by DartmouthCubsFan on Aug 29, 2009 10:28 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
you see the same thing on talk radio and TV
Who gets the ratings? The bombthrowers (left and right) that’s who. No one pays attention to the person who tries to be reasonable and stakes out the middle ground … unfortunately.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Aug 30, 2009 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
yuppers
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on Aug 30, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep, nothing more fascinating than a milquetoast moderate who has no opinions.
That’s gripping radio right there.
"Was you ever punched in the face five hundred times a night? It stings after a while." ~Rocky Balboa
by Goodie1969 on Aug 30, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a good example of what is wrong today
the false notion that a moderate has no opinions, or that rationally discussing an issue is boring. This kind of “thinking” is why most debate in this country is being held captive by the lunatic fringes, left and right. Too many people want to be entertained when they would be better off being informed.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Aug 31, 2009 8:02 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don't think having core principles qualifies you as a lunatic fringer.
People who claim to be middle grounders will generally get no ratings not because they’re more rational than either side of a debate, but because not having an identifiable set of principles makes one uninteresting. Why can’t we be entertained and informed at the same time?
"Was you ever punched in the face five hundred times a night? It stings after a while." ~Rocky Balboa
by Goodie1969 on Aug 31, 2009 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That depends on what those principles are doesn't it?
Also, assuming a moderate has no core principles, as many on the lunatic fringes like to think, is pretty ignorant.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Aug 31, 2009 5:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Absolutely.
If you do not cause commotion on either side of the poltical scale, or stake out controversial positions on Newstalk or Sportstalk radio, you – the host won’t be around long.
Being ‘boring’ is worse than anything else in that hyper-charged venue.
We still see much of that in the print media, especially in Chicago. Elsewhere, not as much any more as the print media fades away. Now, opinions are being delivered via blogging.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 30, 2009 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+10000000000000
Expressed my thoughts almost exactly. Gets soooo old when non one can constructively criticize without the usual suspects coming to the defense and making an argument out of it.
There are regulars on this blog that have become self-appointed defenders of everything Cub, no matter what & that is so tired. I am as big Cub fan as anybody but I can still be realistic about evaluating their play & their playoff chances.
Pretty much a huge reason that I don’t post anymore and don’t enjoy this site nearly as much as I used to in the past.
"I don’t believe that things go your way," said Lou Piniella, the Cubs manager.
"I believe you make things go your way."
by Basman on Aug 30, 2009 4:49 AM CDT reply actions 4 recs
Well mrnfl
They don’t call us fanatics for nothing. We are bound to go a little nuts, it’s right there in our name.
by Notsnud on Aug 30, 2009 9:24 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
well said.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Aug 30, 2009 10:55 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I feel I owe the OP a beverage of choice.
IMO that would be better than a “+something.” But virtual beverages are so unfulfilling.
"This is an environment of welcoming, and you should just get the hell outta here." --Michael Scott
by Reddevil on Aug 30, 2009 12:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
my 2 cents
those who are extreme fall into two catagories
1. those who are extreme
2. those who dont like the extreme of one side and without meaning to take their opinion to the extreme in reply.
I am not extreme IMHO but I get sick of the extreme negative posters and I tend to go extreme in defense against them,
in the process coming off as extreme happy go lucky. Perception is not always as it seems with a poster, and this is a perfect example of it.
baseball is a game of outs......pop out, ground out, line out, pitch out, strike out, fly out, and Fox and Bud's favorite black out
by Cubbie-Tim on Aug 30, 2009 1:31 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I consider myself a baseball centrist for the most part.
I’m mostly here to learn.
Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.
by dat cubfan daver on Aug 30, 2009 7:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm glad you posted this, thanx!
As a Card’s fan posting and commenting on a Cub’s site I have to be pretty careful in what I say and how I say it and it wouldn’t be wise for me to open this can of worms. But now that it’s open I can comment.
What I see here are 3 basic groups:
1) those that want to argue (the closed minded)
2) those that want to discuss (the open minded)
3) those that are just off the wall, unpredictable, who knows what they are.
That pretty much reflects society in general.
When I came here I came waving a peace flag and said I was here to talk some baseball with the rival fans, just to get and offer the view from both teams’ fans. I expected a fair share of boo’s from the group 1 folks….and I got it in abundance.
But I’ve been here awhile and it’s getting a little better.
Since this is the only sports blog I visit I don’t have anything to compare to. (I’ve read the Cardinals site but don’t post or comment).
What I see here probably isn’t a lot different than anywhere else. People are basically the same everywhere.
The policing and the tolerance may be different, I don’t know.
I think a lot of the trouble stems from those who don’t READ carefully enough before they comment, or they read what they want to read instead of what was written, generally in order to pick a fight or start an argument. I think those are some of the negative folks you mention.
Another thing I see is that an opinion, too often, is not treated as simply an opinion. Too often it’s treated as someone stating it as FACT, usually by someone who claims to HAVE THE FACTS, period. (again, this reflects society in general).
I don’t mind the optimistic fans, God less ‘em! even though realism stares at them they choose to remain positive. It sure beats negativity.
What I am learning here (and I falter sometimes) is to not feed the beast!!!!! You just can’t be rational with irrational people and you can’t converse with someone who just wants to argue. So I try to not to give them a venue.
If these people are ignored they’ll have no platform or soapbox and they might just dry up and go away. naaaah!
Baseball first, teams second, players third, agents last.
by Dave Pendleton on Sep 2, 2009 8:42 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
you've been a great example Dave of being the contrarian
with class, style and erudition
i will never love the Cards – the ancient bloodfeuds must never be forgotten – but I can dig a friendly, respectful jaw with a Cards fan any time. I personally have never been as nasty and vicious as I’ve seen Cards fans can be (and as disgusting as I know Cubs fans can be also) and I still believe in treating others the way I think want to be treated .. as long as we keep it on the level, respect each other, sing God Bless America, hate any team from New York, Boston or California, enjoy chorizo and eggs, and help kittens cross the street.
i know you got more important things this time of year and that being to enjoy the Birdos’ moment in the sun, so we don’t hear you much here, but it’s always good to see a Card fan like you raise the bar of civil discourse .. I salute you.
Be that as it may, may thy knife chip and shatter! I hope the Cubs somehow catch up and pound the Cards this month yet .. (not too promising, it seems, but hey, any old thing can happen)
Blue mountains high .. Blue valleys low
I don't know which way we will go ..
One summer dream .. one summer dream ..
coda
ELO, 1975
by cubnational on Sep 3, 2009 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for the compliment.
and the civility.
Baseball first, teams second, players third, agents last.
by Dave Pendleton on Sep 4, 2009 9:00 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

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