Cubs Shut Harden Down for Season

A bit surprising. Does this have more to do with performance or health?

over 2 years ago digitalbenjamin 28 comments 1 recs |

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Either can't be good.

if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand

by N Oakley on Sep 17, 2009 11:45 AM CDT reply actions

Gordo's original tweet on this made it seem less definitive:

@cst_cubs: Lou says Harden to be skipped next start, maybe 2. Says he’s physically OK.

But it does appear we’ve seen the last of Harden for the year. Well, 26 starts is still more than virtually anyone expected. Maybe the Cubs figure they got enough for him and do plan on trying to keep him for next year. Meanwhile, they can see what Da Gorz and…gulp…Samardzija have to offer.

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Sep 17, 2009 11:46 AM CDT reply actions

Guess the Fat Lady is emerging from the stall, throat clear with

some singing to do.

if this was still new to me, i wouldn't understand

by N Oakley on Sep 17, 2009 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions

If you are afraid the player is going to reduce his trade value by more exposure to scouts...

then you skip some starts or shut him down “citing” arm fatigue or some other convenient excuse…

"Pain don't hurt you none" - Sparky Anderson (1987)

Obviously Sparky was never a Cubs fan...

by Zeke on Sep 17, 2009 11:50 AM CDT reply actions

trade value?

he’s a cub for about two more weeks.

by neifi on Sep 17, 2009 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions

Harden has no trade value.

He’s a free agent at the end of the season.

by Inkin on Sep 17, 2009 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions

↑ This. ↑

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Sep 17, 2009 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions

Don't confuse me with facts!

Seriously, DUH. I had a brain fart. I knew that.

OK, let’s see how I can walk this back…

Speaking as Mr. Zeke’s representative, what he meant to say was:

Since Harden can’t be counted on for next year’s pitching staff, it’s only logical that Lou & Larry would like to see more of some of the newer guys on the staff like Gorzelanny – to further assess with more pitching opportunities to see if they fit in with next year’s pitching staff plans.

Yeah, THAT’S what I meant to say.

"Pain don't hurt you none" - Sparky Anderson (1987)

Obviously Sparky was never a Cubs fan...

by Zeke on Sep 17, 2009 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions

I call "DO-OVER!"

"Pain don't hurt you none" - Sparky Anderson (1987)

Obviously Sparky was never a Cubs fan...

by Zeke on Sep 17, 2009 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions

Um the first of many "shut downs"

Soriano, Harden. Ram next ? Don’t get me wrong he is playing just fine but you might want to avoid risk.

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim

by Doggie Stalker on Sep 17, 2009 12:04 PM CDT reply actions

I agree.

This may indicate the Cubs are serious about bringing him back. (Of course, it also indicates they’re not serious about making a miracle run to the postseason.)

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Sep 17, 2009 12:12 PM CDT up reply actions

It could be that, or...

alternatively it could be that the team wants to see what they have in Gorzellany and Samardzija (maybe Marshall as well), and doesn’t want to waste starts on Harden.

by SouthernCub on Sep 17, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions

Doh! didn't read your previous post...

in which you said the same thing.

by SouthernCub on Sep 17, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions

the probelm with that is

you don’t learn what you really have with any pitcher by giving him a few starts at the end of September against a lineup full of call ups.

Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living."

by DC Cubbie on Sep 17, 2009 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions

I agree about Aramis.

Everytime he goes to the ground, I turn my head. I’m afraid we’re risking a lot more than gaining. Let Fox finish out the season and get some experience.

"Pounding sand since 1982...."

by cubswynn on Sep 17, 2009 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions

Bruce Levine just quoted Pinella saying it would be one or two starts

Seems like that is the rest of the season.

Some people say the glass is half empty, some say half full. I say, are you going to drink that?

by BleedsbluinMI on Sep 17, 2009 12:44 PM CDT reply actions

So this is what Harden gave us the past 2 seasons

2008: 5-1 1.77ERA 12GS 71IP
2009: 9-9 4.09ERA 26GS 141IP

Was it worth what we gave up (player and $ wise)?

Mustache be gone!

by digitalbenjamin on Sep 17, 2009 1:37 PM CDT reply actions

Yes.

The Cubs needed one more starter in 2008.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Sep 17, 2009 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions

As of right now, yes.

We lost the playoff crapshoot, but he was instrumental in getting us there. Who knows down the road though, with the benefit of more hindsight.

Donaldson spent all year in double-A and was average, Gallagher and Patterson have been crappy this year in limited playing time. Matt Murton was always fun to watch, but he hasn’t done anything special yet either.

I don't care how long you've been around, you'll never see it all.

by Dou on Sep 17, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions

A valid reply. Let me reply with another question:

Was trading Joe Carter for Rick Sutcliffe worth it?

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Sep 17, 2009 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions

Not an apt

comparison in my humble opinion. Sutcliffe went 16-1 that season and 82-65 in 8 seasons with the Cubs. They got their money’s worth out of him. I don’t think we gave up that much to get Harden and he did help us last year so I think it was worth it. I don’t think he has done anything special this season and wouldn’t be upset at all if we don’t resign him. He can be lights out, but it seems like he is either very good or absolutely horrible, not to mention his physical fragility.

by qccub on Sep 17, 2009 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions

I disagree. It is an apt comparison.

Hindsight is 20-20. Both trades were worth it.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Sep 17, 2009 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions

I'd say yes.

He was also supposed to be a key piece of the Cubs long, successful 2008 postseason run, which, of course, never happened.

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Sep 17, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions

Unless Josh Donaldson is a ROY

Yes

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim

by Doggie Stalker on Sep 17, 2009 5:11 PM CDT up reply actions

From what I have heard about this....

… it’s not true. He’s just going to be moved back a few days.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2009 4:36 PM CDT reply actions

Exactly.

Everyone should read this article by Bruce Levine, in which Harden denies being shut down explicitly. Paul Sullivan completely jumped the gun on this story and should be ashamed of himself. Yet another strike against a guy who insists on dwelling on the negative at the expense of any sort of objectivity and, in this case, even accuracy.

Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.

by daver on Sep 18, 2009 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions

He should only be shut down if he resigns with Cubs before season over

Otherwise he’s not the teams problem and they shouldn’t baby him.

Wells on the other hand should be the one done. I’m glad Cubs aren’t being as ridiculous as Yankees are to Joba with innings watched but Wells has proven he can be a really good pitcher next year. Let him pitch when it counts again.

by ak123 on Sep 17, 2009 7:35 PM CDT reply actions

The Cubs will play important games

very possibly, against the Giants as they battle for the WC. I don’t think this team is going to be shutting anybody down, unless it’s to protect a young pitcher, such as Wells.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 18, 2009 1:36 PM CDT reply actions