The Interleague Finale: Cubs vs. White Sox, Thursday 9/3, 1:20 CT
by Al Yellon on Sep 3, 2009 11:00 AM CDT
in Game Threads
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PrintThe Cubs have played interleague games in September before -- there was a Cubs/Twins series at Wrigley in September 1997 -- but the meeting with the team from the South Side in September is a Chicago first.
These two teams have played each other nearly to a draw in the 13 seasons of interleague contests. In the 71 games played to date, the White Sox have won 36, the Cubs 35, and the White Sox have scored 350 runs to the Cubs' 341. Thus a win today is not only important for the Cubs' playoff hopes, but to even up the all-time series between the two clubs (and to have a split at three games each for 2009). If the Cubs could win by nine runs to even up the run total that'd be great, but I'll settle for a one-run victory.
Notes: the Cubs bullpen, so mediocre most of the year, has now thrown 20 1/3 consecutive scoreless innings. A lot of that is thanks to John Grabow, who hasn't allowed a run since he put on blue pinstripes. And remember when I wrote about the new Rawlings S100 helmet a couple of weeks ago and asked what the big deal was? The big deal, apparently, is that they're much larger than existing helmets, as modeled by Ryan Dempster last Saturday and the Mets' David Wright on Tuesday in Colorado. Wright's concussion was one of the reasons these helmets will be mandatory in the minor leagues next year, but for now their primary function appears to be providing fodder for jokes. Funny jokes, admittedly, but if they help save players from injury, I think they're a good idea.
Site note: today's recap will be delayed. I am leaving right after the game to head east on the next road trip, driving to New York and Pittsburgh. I'll try to find a wifi place on the road sometime in the early evening to post a recap, and any BCB'ers in NYC or Pittsburgh who'd like to meet up at the games, please email me using the link on the left sidebar.
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Carlos Torres is no kid prospect -- he'll be 27 next month. He's had decent numbers in the minor leagues, particularly this year, but his two major league starts were just decent and pretty bad. He walks a lot of hitters, so patience would be useful. This is, obviously, his first career appearance vs. the Cubs.
Because of the rainout back in June, Ryan Dempster gets the odd distinction of being able to start three games against an interleague opponent in one year -- he started one of the games in each of the two series in June, throwing six decent innings in a 4-1 Cubs loss on June 17 at Wrigley and getting launched pretty badly ten days later at the Cell. He's gotten lit up before by Jermaine Dye (.417/.500/.583 in 12 AB) and A.J. Pierzynski (.400/.471/.600 in 15 AB).
Len & Bob will be on WGN today. Those other guys are doing the game via CSN Chicago. For other games today see the MLB.com Mediacenter.
Baseball-reference.com game preview
Please visit our SB Nation White Sox site South Side Sox.
Overflow comment threads will post today at 2:15 pm, 3:15 pm and 4 pm CDT.
Discuss amongst yourselves.
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Oh no! No DLee today
DLee’s wife went into labor and he is with her.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
Congrats and good timing!
At least we were not on the road and he had to miss multiple games. Who’s at first today? Hoff?
This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).
Fox.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Sep 3, 2009 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
I think these helmets should be mandatory.
But just maybe a tad smaller.
David Wright looks like Rick Moranis from Spaceballs.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Seriously, I thought of this well before I read that article.
Damnit.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
holy cow
that’s HUGE.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Sep 3, 2009 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
TWSS
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
+1
"I won't be like A-Rod" - Z, 3/17/09
by Ihatethecards on Sep 3, 2009 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions
LMAO
“Have we stopped?’
“Yes, sir. We’ve stopped.”
“OK, then…smoke if ya got ’em…”
:::CRASH!:::
Catch my act on Twitter as @dat_cubfan_dave.
What a great movie, LOL
Dempster should be doing his Dark Helmet impression today too. He wore one last time he started.
No Lee in the lineup.
well, this should be interesting.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
I know.
still.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Sep 3, 2009 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions
So scratch her from the lineup!
I want my offense, dammit!
/s
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Any lineups yet?
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
Yep
WHITE SOX
Podsednik cf
Beckham 3b
Pierzynski c
Konerko 1b
Quentin lf
Getz 2b
Ramirez ss
Wise rf (Dweezie)
Torres p
CUBS
Fukudome cf
Theriot ss
Ramirez 3b
Bradley rf
Fox 1b
Soriano lf
Baker 2b
Hill c
Dempster p
Don't let anyone steal your Joy
Dome leading off again...
Finally.
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Sep 3, 2009 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
I like Theriot in the #7 or #8 spot.
He seems to be more productive hitting at the bottom of the order—or is it my imagination?
"I love California. I practically grew up in Phoenix."
-- Dan Quayle
Check out the numbers
on The Riot
batting 2nd…….in 331 AB …..OPS .745
batting 7th………in 35 AB……..OPS .979
batting 8th………in 20 AB………OPS .741
Don't let anyone steal your Joy
I was just about to do that:
I’ll add career numbers:
batting 1st…ops 708
batting 2nd..ops 736
batting 7th…ops 856
batting 8th…ops 700
he’s been great 7th in his career. And bigz you forgot to mention his 592 ops while hitting leadoff this year. That is just horrible.
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
as you guys might know by now, I am not a stats guy, but my gut feel
seems to be confirmed by your #s. theRiot seems very comfortable in the #7 spot. Of course that may have been in the days when we had Soto and RJ hitting a ton in the #8 spot last year. Either way, I wish Lou would bat theRiot at #7 more often.
"I love California. I practically grew up in Phoenix."
-- Dan Quayle
Look, not everyone gets to be comfortable
With Soto, Soriano and Bradley throwing off the lineup plan, someone has to get out of their comfort zone.
Ideally, Theriot IS #7, but ideally, Soriano doesn’t suck as leadoff and Bradley doesn’t suck as the #5 and Soto doesn’t suck as the #6.
Fukudome should be #2, but he has to leadoff, because Soriano can’t do it, or hit 5th, because Bradley or Soto can’t do it.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I do like Dome back at leadoff
apologies to Lou for assuming he was going to put Riot back in there. But it did take him too long to figure it out.
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
I really only think Dome is in leadoff again
because of the bizarre rest of the lineup
When Lee’s back, I think Theriot will be back at leadoff, with Bradley batting 2nd
My nemesis Pods is in the lineup today.
Will some please go to Wrigley and heckle him for me. He really likes it when you mock his strikeouts.
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
The numbnuts on the Score just pissed off Hendry
McNeil and his idiot sidekick, just had Hendry on live and kept badgering him so much about Bradley and the bad contracts that he cut them off and ended the interview.
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
With no playoff chase to talk about...
… you gotta create something to get people riled and tuning in. And if this site proves anything, its that bashing Bradley gives a good number of people a woody.
Follow me on twitter @andrewjstone.
by AndrewJStone on Sep 3, 2009 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Jesus.
What happened to actual reporting the news, not becoming it?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Ah, but first they have to tell you what they are going to tell you (in the next half hour)...
“right after this break”, and then after the break, they re-tease what they are going to tell you and then they do the report… which as it turns out isn’t really a news report but instead is a segment about what “health concerns” are “out there” (which is REALLY a plug for the doctors working in the health care system that just bought commercial time during the “newscast”…)
Gee. Am I cynical today…
Quia tuum es fatum titulis discidiis, vexillinis limbis nationalis,
gloriam seriis mundialisque, nunc et in saecula saeculorum...
Amen.
That's long gone!
They are still talking about it like they are so cool by asking the “tough” questions. What a bunch of Sox asskissing losers. What do they think Hendry’s gonna say about Z and Sori, “they suck and its a huge disappointment to me that I paid them so much”?
"He can't hit, he can't field, he can't run—all he can do is beat you."
What a bunch of Sox asskissing losers.
Losers? Perhaps, Sox asskissers? Hardly.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
It should be noted...
… that the person who asked the allegedly tough questions is a Cubbie fan, Matt Spiegel, not Sox fan – Dan McNeil.
"People shouldn’t bust your chops just because you’re a Sox fan on a Cub board — but I know it happens. FWIW, I think sites like this are more interesting when fans of other teams join in the conversation." by Shanghai Badger on Mar 13, 2009
Sportstalk hosts are not 'reporters.'
They are there to create conflict. Only the ESPN Talk hosts (Network, not local) stay somewhat close to reporting, but not all. (Certainly not PTI)
Those two are trying to generate ratings and buzz, that’s all.
by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 3, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
but hey
the media is gold.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Sep 3, 2009 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions
The writers on Tribune Live on CSN were also very tough on Bradley yesterday saying that Ricketts
should dump Bradley before next season. The main reason being he is not doing what he was brought here to do. They don’t look at the fact that he has settled into a very productive role.
I do agree that he still is not hitting well with RISP, but who is to say he won’t improve once he gets beyond this initial year and he knows what to expect going forward. To say “dump Bradley” just seems silly and these are just writers who want to be the news, not report the news.
"I love California. I practically grew up in Phoenix."
-- Dan Quayle
If Hendry gave in to pressure...
… and dumped one of his more productive players just to placate the assholes in the press who will say about anything to drive their ratings, and the assholes who somehow buy in to their shtick… well, that’ll be the end of my support for Hendry.
Luckily, it sounds like he won’t take lightly to those sorts of shenanigans.
Follow me on twitter @andrewjstone.
by AndrewJStone on Sep 3, 2009 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually I did a little research this morning
and Bradley has never been an RBI guy. (compared to other middle of order hitters) His best years at converting RBIs are the wort years of other guys. Buts what worse is that he has fallen off the deep end this year.
Bradley RISP RBI/PAs 30.4 35.3 34.6 32.5 25.9 5 year avg(before this year) 30.7 this year 20.6
other players for last 5 years:
dunn 34.6 35.7 30.1 32.8 33.3
ibanez 38.0 41.2 46.4 45.8 38.0 28.6
abreu 41.7 35.1 36.9 42.9 37.1 40.5
dlee 48.3 35.0 33.9 38.5 37.0 36.5
aram 44.2 45.5 45.1 41.8 34.0 43.8
Even from July on when he has gotten back to hitting, he is at 17.3. (But getting a ton of walks with RISP)
I think I am turning around on Bradley staying in the 5 spot. He would be better at 2 or 3 in front of both lee and aram.
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
I long for Adam Dunn like Jack & Rose long for that diamond at the bottom of the ocean.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
you long for Adam Dunn
the way he longs for someone to tell him what that brown leathery thing at the end of his arm is when he plays “defense”.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Sep 3, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions
drew, in this case...
…I DON’T CARE ABOUT STATISTICS.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
well your just an idiot then!
ecause statistics say we would have lost even more games if Adam Dunn was on our team.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, but:
—ballhawk would have more homers
—our offense wouldn’t suck
—the bleacher fans would enjoy a player, who, incidentally, is enjoyable
—and we would have the luxury of watching a man hit 400 foot bombs on a regular basis.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
correction...
You long for Adam Dunn the way Derrek Lee longs for a SS with an arm. l
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Well the Cubs are like the titanic this year.
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
Simple math...
DLee hits a homer with nobody on base in front of him, that’s worth one run.
DLee hits a homer after Bradley walks… that’s worth two runs. Twice as much! Woot!
I understand most people get this, but for some reason ignoring that seems to be easy for the Bradley haters. Its annoying. And propping the ignorance up on the “But Hendry said he’s bat middle of the order!” argument is…well… ignorant. Who cares? I wanted to be an astronaut when i grew up. Expectations and circumstances changes as the reality of life has its way.
He’s really really good at something… getting on base. He’s not horrible enough at anything else (including dealing with the press, handling his personal relationships, signing enough autographs, playing right field at Wrigley, whatever) to it be worth dropping him.
Follow me on twitter @andrewjstone.
A home run in the base/out state of no one out and no one on base is worth 1.4 runs.
Learn it, live it, love it.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
There aren't fractions of a run in the game i watch.
I understand the greater picture of how it all plays out, trust me. But if you try to argue that way, somebody will find some number that’ll prove you wrong, so i boiled it down to ultimate simplicity.
A runner on base is a runner with the potential to cross home plate. Thus, Bradley is valuable.
Follow me on twitter @andrewjstone.
wat?
A 4.15 ERA by Dempster means nothing? Or a 6.75 ERA by this Torres guy? The fractions are meaningless, I get it now.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Ah, I'll never forget the time
I saw Reggie Jackson hit 4.2 homers in a game…
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Games include context.
A lead-off home run, in context, suggests the pitcher is having a bad inning, there’s a rally coming, etc. You’re at the same base/out state you were previously at, only with a run on the board. It’s worth more than one run. I’m not in the mood to play stats guy today; AndrewJStone took my comment waaaaaay too seriously for 120 pm on a Thursday in a meaningless baseball game.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Uh-huh
And it also depends on the pitcher and how well he bounces back. It depends on which three batters are up next. It depends on whether the game is close or out-of-hand, or early or late.
Too many variables for me to take it seriously. I get the basic concept. Lead-off homer is often the opening of the floodgates.
But Stone’s point is that Lee had a 45 HR/107 RBI season, which is atrocious. A good OBP guy helps there.
Where he and I disagree is whether Bradley basically upsetting the plans the Cubs had for him is worth that.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Yes.
Thanks, Worf, for putting it better than i’ve been able to.
And i’ll be the first to admit, i didn’t consider Bradley in terms messing up the order for other players BECAUSE he’s an on base guy instead of an RBI guy.
But none the less, the criticism of him hasn’t been about that till you brought it up today, as close as i can tell.
Follow me on twitter @andrewjstone.
There is also a question of whether
Bradley will be a valuable 4 or 5 hitter next year, after he adjusts to life in the city.
Or… it could get worse, since we’ll have a whole off-season of “Dump Bradley”
I really don’t think reporters pull stories completely out of thin air. That piece Wittenmeyer
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
In no way was I saying to get rid of the guy.
I still love what he brings to the team. I am just agreeing with many who have called for moving Bradley higher in the order in front of Dlee and Aram. (I had agreed with Lou before that seeing the lefty backup protection thing for both our righties).
But now, hell give it a shot..Dome Bradley, Lee, Aram etc
Say this much for big league baseball - it is beyond question the greatest conversation piece ever invented in America. ~Bruce Catton
And the Cubs have to decide if it's worth $30 million over three years
for an on-base guy who DOES bring that baggage.
Especially when you consider that they now have to go find and pay someone else to do the job Bradley was brought in to do.
The Cubs hired a guy expecting him to perform one job and found he couldn’t. He is useful in another role — although with Fukudome and Theriot, he wasn’t really needed there — the fact remains that the original job still needs done.
Tell me, did NASA pay you to be an astronaut before finding out you couldn’t do it? If not, then your analogy is useless.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Theriot
is NOT good at leadoff. So if you want a good one-two punch, someone has to replace Riot.
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Sep 3, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions
or throwing basballs after going to his right.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Sep 3, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions
No, he's ideally 7th
but he’s not horrid at 2nd. Dome should be at leadoff, but since Bradley is 2nd and Dome is needed at 5th to take Bradley’s spot and since Soriano is no longer leadoff, someone has to do it
The question is whether Bradley is worth taking Dome and Theriot from their best spots? Because if someone locked down 5th, Dome could be leadoff.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Hah! Hilarious.
The Cubs hadn’t paid MB much when everyone decided he was a middle of the order RBI machine either.
I adjusted to marketing instead. Bummer for me.
Milton has adjusted to the 2nd spot in the order. Lucky for the Cubs.
Follow me on twitter @andrewjstone.
Theriot or Fukudome could have done that
The Cubs needed a middle-of-the-lineup guy. They still do.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Hey...
Why couldn’t Hendry do this research? o_0
Someday we'll go all the way...
by CubsBullsBears on Sep 3, 2009 9:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Hmm the Cubs have never seen this Torres guy.
This situation usually goes well….
"Pounding sand since 1982...."
Captain... I'm sensing
"I’m not going to allow Al Yellon to flush this thing down the crapper without a fight." (BLOU)
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on Sep 3, 2009 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Hope
they manage more than two runs off Torres
by VillanuevaExperience on Sep 3, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Here's how baseball should respond to the helmet whining
You may choose to wear the helmets if you like. If you do not, teams will not pay a dime toward medical care for head injuries that could have been prevented.
You don’t like it? Strike.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I bet Adam Greenberg wishes he had one of those helmets
by ChipSet on Sep 3, 2009 12:56 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
I wish he had one
of those helmets too.
Recipe for Disaster;
C'mon Cubs, hurry up and blow this so I can relax.
by Bluekoolaide on July22, 2009 3:08 PM CDT
Just got a fortune cookie that says...
Success is an accumulation of successful days. Hope this is another successful day. Let’s get more than 2 in a row this time.
"Fasten your seatbelts"-Pat Hughes
Need I say more?
You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat. - Albert Einstein
soriano
even though the game was already over with two out in the ninth, that worthless piece of garbage in soriano could have at least acted like he was trying up at the plate, waving at three sliders in the dirt, in the other batter’s box, with no care in the world, of course why would he care, he can not show up and still take home his millions, this guy is the worst hitter in baseball, please jim hendry if you had a half a brain, either let soriano go or trade him
LIKE I SAID PREVIOUS
my 9 year old neighbor girl has a better swing than Fonzie . It’s like he does not care anymore . as a fan it is hard to accept . ( Does Lou or the other coaches see this ??)
To those that still believe in 2009, so that you can feel positive, I'm sorry but...
Most of the players have given up and don’t give an F about the fans. Even moreso when the fans boo, these players stick it to us by not caring about winning. Like they can’t respond to negative pressure or respond back to the boos by quitting. If you guys can’t see that, you’re blind.
In the real world everyone that worked for the Cubs would be fired
I'M SORRY AL
But jvick88 is absolutely correct. Soriano did not even make it look half way real. He wanted to get the game over or somebody told him they were going to be late for their plane. Eat his salary, let him go and lets move on. I do not like this team.
Not like this team?
I hate the GM even more. He was the only one that believed in Bradley. Hendry must go. Now. Hendry supporters can stick it.
In the real world everyone that worked for the Cubs would be fired
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