Arizona Legislators Draft Bill To Pay For New Cubs ST Facility

The bill would raise "tourism-related fees" to help pay for a new Cubs spring training complex in Mesa.

over 2 years ago Al Yellon 20 comments 0 recs |

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IT'S HAPPENING!?!?!?!?!?!??!?

COOL BEANS!

by lexmarklover on Jan 9, 2010 8:56 PM CST reply actions

Well I have hopes

this will go through, but what with the economy downg down, the bill may have some difficulty getting passed.

"Chicago baseball fans, who are composites of scar tissue and mortifying memories..." - George F. Will

by eswan9 on Jan 9, 2010 9:54 PM CST reply actions

In a solidly Red state

…I don’t see this happening unless the fix is in.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Jan 9, 2010 9:57 PM CST reply actions

With respect, I don't know if I buy that...

Spending 80 million to save the 50+ million that comes in each year seems like a smart call to me.

LILLY!!!

by Lablover on Jan 9, 2010 10:01 PM CST up reply actions

I saw it yesterday but it sounded sort of same old stuff

Maybe I am getting cynical.

"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim

by Doggie Stalker on Jan 9, 2010 10:26 PM CST reply actions

not much of a surprise

Arizona was not going to let the Cubs leave, and this just confirms that

Just because you talk a lot doesn't mean you're saying anything. dtpollitt 1-7-10

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 9, 2010 10:35 PM CST reply actions

As a 10 year, and current, Mesa, AZ resident

I can tell you I highly doubt that the city will let the Cubs leave, all the talk is about the land that will likely become the new ST facilties, which I personally hope for because the proposed sites are around Greenfield and the Loop 202, which is literally 10-20 minutes from my house

by CubsFan87 on Jan 9, 2010 10:37 PM CST reply actions

so we can all crash at your house for ST?

Just because you talk a lot doesn't mean you're saying anything. dtpollitt 1-7-10

by Cubbie-Tim on Jan 9, 2010 10:41 PM CST up reply actions

Sickening

I don’t fault the Cubs in this one iota because it is simply good business on their part, but it is ridiculous how government entities across the country cave into privately-held sports interests. These professional sports leagues and owners have enough damned money in their pockets to build stadiums and spring training camp homes, etc. Why does the taxpayer always need to foot the bill or subsidize things?

Despicable. And again so as we are clear, I do not fault the Cubs in this.

The Blackhawks and the Stanley Cup in 2010.

by BLou on Jan 9, 2010 10:55 PM CST reply actions

I agree completely.

This is an area with severe water problems, severe pollution problems, pathetic public transportation, uncontained auto-dependent sprawl etc. but they choose to spend their time giving a sweetheart deal to a professional sports team. I also do not fault the Cubs for taking the deal. Just like I didn’t fault Boeing when Daley bent over and handed them the keys to Chicago.

The business of America is now the transferring of public money into private hands. And having once investigated a firm that tried to convince cities they needed new convention centers and sports facilities, I can promise you that $50,000,000 per year has no basis whatsoever in reality.

It’s like assuming if a Cub fan didn’t take a hotel room, or eat at a restaurant, then that room or table would be empty. It would be akin to saying the replacement for Derrick Lee at first would have no batting average, no homers and no RBIs.

And even if the number was real, do you really think the taxpayers are going to see any benefit outside of two months of low paying service industry jobs? What’s saddest of all is very few people even bat an eye while they get screwed over and over.

by the nth on Jan 10, 2010 2:07 AM CST up reply actions

Aha... I sense the arrival of a new statistic when it comes to public funding for Spring Training facilities...

the DART factor – as in Dollars Above Replacement Tourist.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Jan 10, 2010 9:27 AM CST up reply actions

I was thinking the same thing

as I wrote it.

by the nth on Jan 10, 2010 11:56 AM CST up reply actions

You guys are being facetious...

… but there ARE real dollars at stake here. The Cubs outdraw everyone in the Cactus League by a significant margin. If they left, even if replaced by another team, the dollars spent by out-of-town tourists would drop.

By $50 million a year? Probably not. But say they do spent $80 million to keep the Cubs — forever, essentially, because in building a new complex in Mesa, the Cubs would be committing to be there for decades. Over time, that $80 million would be repaid to Maricopa County and the state of Arizona many times over.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Jan 10, 2010 12:19 PM CST up reply actions

Keep in mind two things.

1. The business generated by people coming to spring training far outweighs the costs involved.

2. The taxes used to pay for this are generally paid by tourists — part of the proposal is a rental car tax, part of it is a tax on all Cactus League tickets. Thus the people actually going to the games wind up paying for the facility.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Jan 10, 2010 8:01 AM CST up reply actions

But in an area that suffers the problems I stated above,

is spending whatever tax money is raised on a stadium the best use of that money?

Again, the idea that in the winter there would be no tourists in one of the warmest spots in the country if not for spring training is just wrong. How many people avoid the place because it’s overrun by drunk goofballs in baseball jerseys? How many people come to spring training games because they live or happen to be in the area? These “studies” put together for local governments are a joke.

The people that put these studies together for communities are, at best, economics majors who are now in the business of public relations. The multiplier effects they use (i.e. the ripple effect that a facility has on local business) have nothing to do with actual economics. They are the stuff of fantasy. As I said, I investigated this stuff for a few years. The “studies” are wishful alchemy. These idiots who run cities have been sold a bill of gods that the “glamour” of being associated with a baseball team is what makes you good place to live.

Here’s a link to an interesting article.

http://www.bizofbaseball.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=3672:the-politics-of-spring-training-a-good-investment&catid=67:pete-toms&Itemid=155

by the nth on Jan 10, 2010 12:29 PM CST up reply actions

Bill

of goods. Although a bill of gods could be good as well.

by the nth on Jan 10, 2010 12:30 PM CST up reply actions

OTOH...

… you could say the same thing about Florida, which is also attempting to get public money to use to back their bid.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Jan 10, 2010 12:44 PM CST up reply actions

I realize that.

It’s not like all the dummies running towns are in Arizona. That’s why I mentioned Boeing and Daley in my original post. Boosters of anything will tell you what is necessary to get their stuff done and there seems to be an unending line of boobs in government who will happily slurp up their swill. Thank goodness this use of dubious economics has had no effect on a national level say, with an unimaginably massive financial bailout of a poorly run industry :)

by the nth on Jan 10, 2010 1:03 PM CST up reply actions

LOL

And with that, let’s end the political discussion.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Jan 10, 2010 1:05 PM CST up reply actions

Now it's in the Cubbies laps!

While I am disappointed the “lifelong Cubs fans”, who have never been to a Cactus League game, are making a decision before seeing what Spring Training is all about. I am very pleased to see Mesa putting on the full court press with all of the political, business and community support. The Cubs would be crazy to go to southwest Florida where it’s an hour drive just to get to Naples. Then it’s 2-3 hours to go to away games.

On a strictly business sense, Maricopa County and their 4 million residents are a much bigger market for the planned Wrigleyville West, then the 200K resident Collier County.

by westerncubbie on Jan 9, 2010 10:57 PM CST reply actions