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Al was right, I was wrong about ticket sales.

Bet that  got your attention, but it is probably not what you think it is. I still believe I was dead right about the Cubs mismarketing tickets  last year, but last week when Al wrote that a failure to sell out the Convention would be a warning side of the disastrous ticket sales to come, I disagreed. I responded that if it took a whole day to sell out tickets that have nearly always sold out in under an hour since they went to  on line sales and a few hours in the many years before that, it would not be a huge deal. Little did I suspect that over 2 days after they went on sale, they are still available. To say this is a disaster is an understatement. There are only 15,000 tickets, the price is less than a box seat and gets you 3 days of to collect autographs, listen to your favorite players from years gone by or ask serious questions of management .  That the Cubs have not sold this out is simply extraordinary but like last year their marketing was HORRIBLE.

I was stunned to look on the page Thursday and see literally NOTHING on the convention tickets. They did send an email reminder to people who are subscribers, but ZILCH on the web site.  When you did get the link, there was an interesting malfunction for the first two hours or so in which it would not let you just buy tickets, the only link that worked was if you bought a ticket and hotel package. Interestingly the hotel package had never been available before probably because they sold out long before the regular tickets went on sale and without EVER being listed. People who go regularly just knew when the hotel  would accept bookings and made them.  Finally there is a link on the site. This reminds me of the Cubs failure to promote first day sales by never listing the info for buying at the box office (wristbands) which they had always done in the past.

This is more evidence of ignorant marketing people who simply look at spread sheets and have no clue how the ticket sales really work. Since the convention has always sold out in the past, it must this year, therefore we don’t really need to do anything except send out an email. The same people who think that they will get all the money the brokers used to get by raising prices to scalping level, but will soon find out that the brokers where their best customers and that having to sell 5.000 plus bleacher tickets to every game is far from easy. The more moves I watch by the Cubs marketing & sales the more I think the image of Ricketts as fan friendly owners is a scam.  If they had a winning team, they probably could get away with their arrogant style of paying lip service to fans (those silly “greeters” around the park) while spending the majority of their time raising prices and catering to corporate sponsors, but they don’t have a winning team and they don’t have a clue that this changes the equation.

Eventually I believe the convention will sell out, though I suspect you will see plenty of offers for tickets below face. This is the canary in the coal mine and the Cubs should be ready for a major collapse.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.

Comment 117 comments  |  21 recs  | 

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Was Wondering if I Had Missed A Post On This

I was amazed they weren’t gone within a few minutes as usual, but to remain available for days is indeed somewhat breathtaking.

In fact, if you try to buy now you will get ticket #1671, so it looks like they’ve still got quite a few left to sell.

I also foresee taking another bath on my season tickets this year. If I had known this before the renewal deadline, I probably would have cancelled.

by 08Cubs on Nov 6, 2010 3:10 PM CDT reply actions  

You can still cancel, you know.

Just because you sent the form back saying you’d return doesn’t mean you have to pay for them. If you haven’t paid yet (and why would you since they’re giving you till January 9), you can cancel any time.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 6, 2010 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fingers In Ears

Right brain had enough trouble overriding left brain to command the renewal as it was ….

by 08Cubs on Nov 6, 2010 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hey, it's up to you.

But I understand your thought process. I’m renewing mine, but I can understand why some aren’t.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 6, 2010 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

You'll all be even more surprised to read this.

I completely agree with Jessica’s premise here. I am stunned that convention passes are still available today — in fact, if the sequence numbers are correct on the currently available passes, they appear to have sold none at all since early yesterday.

My guess is that the convention will NOT sell out. As of Saturday afternoon there are 168 passes on sale at Stubhub, at prices ranging from $85 to $475 (!) — those will go slowly if at all; if the sellers want to move them they will quickly go for below face.

Same thing on eBay. There are 28 listings for passes (some for more than one pass), average price seems to be somewhere around $100-$125 per pass. It appears that not one convention pass has sold at all via eBay listing — there are two completed listings, neither of which have sold.

What Jessica and I disagreed on is “marketing”. My contention was that marketing and “buzz” had nothing to do with the declining sales last year. It was the economy, the high prices for tickets, and a mediocre 2009 season.

Now, you are coming off a mediocre-to-bad 2010 season, the economy is still in the tank, and prices for many games went UP. They may do all right selling tickets to the “value” dates — but others, they’re in trouble.

She’s right — this is a warning shot. The Cubs may be VERY surprised on the Friday in February when single game tickets go on sale. They may not need wristbands at all.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 6, 2010 3:15 PM CDT reply actions  

Also, I rec'd this post.

Suggest that others do, too. This one deserves to be around for a while.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 6, 2010 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh you just like the headline.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 6, 2010 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, that too.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 6, 2010 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

“My contention was that marketing and "buzz" had nothing to do with the declining sales last year. It was the economy, the high prices for tickets, and a mediocre 2009 season.”

I agree with this, especially for the convention. It used to sell out regularly year after year. People know it’s there. They just don’t want to go.

by bluemagic9 on Nov 6, 2010 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Marketing has a lot to do with ticket sales

The Cubs downplayed the Convention on the web site to the point where I could not even find the info or link on Thursday. They have done nothing to push it. Usually the promote with a list of past players, expectation of current players , etc., this year pretty much a link to buy tickets when you can find it. It is part of the overall pattern of simply taking it for granted that fans who have bought tickets before will buy them now and their time is better spent on commercial promotions. You can’t just attribute this to a bad team or economy, this is an event that has sold out in anywhere from 30 minutes to several hours for twenty-five years straight. So maybe it might take a few more hours to sell out the 15.000 tickets. Nope, they aren’t selling. This is not to say the economy and bad team are not major factors but the continuing disconnect between Cubs marketing and fans is also a major factor.

Ironically a dirty secret on this as it was with regular ticket sales is that brokers, scalpers or people trying to make a few bucks often bought huge chunks of the Convention tickets to resell them for profit. They no longer see a profit leaving many more tickets in the pot. If you see this kind of effect on an event which sold out faster than ANY regular season game and has only 15,000, just imagine what game tickets will be like. I stil think the Convention will sell out, but the lack of sales at this point should scare the sh*&%^$#$ out of the Cubs.

Lastly I am left to wonder if the lack of promotion by the Cubs might have something to do with the fact that this is a charity event for which the Cubs make no money. It seems as if they have other priorities.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 6, 2010 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hmm

Pretty sure I got two e-mails about Convention passes going on sale, and the link is right on Cubs.com main page. After selling out for 25 years, I can understand keeping the marketing to a minimum. It pretty much sold itself… until this year of course.

Doesn’t the list of attendees usually come out after the passes go on sale anyway?

by bluemagic9 on Nov 7, 2010 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, it does.

Jessica also has a point about brokers/scalpers buying up a lot of passes (and tickets to games) for resale. As I noted above, there appear to be no sales at all this year on eBay and StubHub; those who bought for that purpose may wind up losing money.

I do NOT agree regarding the “lack of promotion” regarding the convention because it’s a charity event. The Cubs do want to help out their charity. And yes, the list of attendees has not yet come out and rarely does before the passes go on sale.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 7:20 AM CST up reply actions  

The link is up now, but it was not when I went up Thursday morning

In the past the Convention was the TOP of the page by itself with information on the first day it went on sale. There was no reason at all to keep marketing to a “minimum”, this is exactly what they did with first day ticket sales at the park and no matter how bad the Cubs had been there had never been anything like the lack of sales at the park the first day. When they assume they don ’t have to worry about convention tickets or getting out info on buying tickets the first day, they are not doing their job.

I am aware the list does not come out this early but in general there is far more info on past atttendees, events etc. Even the current link/promo is totally half assed and just a simple link to buy tickets with of course the hotel package first.. To me this part of the trend that they really don’t have to do anything because people will buy tickets anyway.

I do believe most of the Cubs employees want to help the charity, but I think the powers that be have decided they just don’t really need to spend too much time on it.
I will be “charitable” and assume per above this is because they just assumed it would sell out, but like other aspects of their marketing they had better start doing a MUCH better job of reaching out and catering to those “regular” fans who fill up the Hilton and Wrigley Field.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 9:37 AM CST up reply actions  

Actually...

… they never put out the list of events until a week before.

You do happen to be correct that they are operating under the assumption that they can just throw the doors open and people will stream in.

That used to be true. It no longer is.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:29 AM CST up reply actions  

I am not talking about a specific schedule of events

Perhaps I am getting a bit dotty but I remember the web site listing past players and info on the convention not merely a link of day & time to buy the tickets. THat is to say the link to buy tickets looked the same but there was far more information about the convention on the web site.

Here is an old example. Perhaps this means little to most people but again how hard is it to put up this info as they clearly have in the past?

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051102&content_id=1263555&vkey=news_chc&fext=.jsp&c_id=chc&affiliateId=CommentWidget

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 10:48 AM CST up reply actions  

There was some information, yes, but...
A complete list of attendees and details on the weekend sessions will be published in January.

Take a look at this article from October 27, 2010 which essentially says the same thing, except without the specific names.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 12:02 PM CST up reply actions  

As far as I recall Al , an article like this has been ON the site

in the lays leading up to the sale and on the site on the day of sale until this year. This is like the wristband thing again, yes they wrote an article/ press release but unless you were specifically looking for it, it was not up when tickets went on sale. I am not saying but for the lack of this article tickets would have sold out, I am saying the marketing people are lazy and incompetent and just seem to think they need to make no effort to get the information on basic things because hey it always sells out so why spend any time on it.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 4:40 PM CST up reply actions  

I agree with everything you say...

…and would add this; I think a lot of folks are not pleased Ricketts is allowing Hendry another year, after two straight playoff misses with a huge payroll.

In my estimation, probably half of Cub fans are really miffed about this. If Ricketts had addressed this with a quality hire, I’ll bet there would be a bit more positive vibes from Cub fans.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 7, 2010 4:26 PM CST up reply actions  

Has it always sold out?

''"I always thought I was the most competitive person out there. I never thought I'd find anybody more competitive until I met him.'' Ryan Dempster talking about Ted Lilly

by Madison Cub Fan on Nov 6, 2010 4:07 PM CDT reply actions  

It has sold out since the first year

For the last 4-5 years when tickets wer sold on line. it has sold out in literally 30-60 minutes. Prior to that you had to buy over the phone throught the Cubs which and in that case it took 2-3 hours. Kasey and Al would know better but I can’t think of any year it has sold out within hours on the first day.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 6, 2010 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed again.

I can’t recall any year when the passes weren’t gone within a few hours; it took longer in the years that you had to buy by phone, obviously, because there were only a small number of people taking orders.

This lack of sales is truly unprecedented.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 6, 2010 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd be curious to know

if people that typically go to the convention are the types that would be big Sandberg fans and they are considering boycotting because they hired Quade instead of him. Just a goofy thought. I have nothing to base that on myself because I have never been to a Cubs convention. Any idea Cubs con goers?

by katie casey on Nov 6, 2010 5:02 PM CDT reply actions  

I think a lot of them would be pissed

but I don’t think it explains this kind of drop in sales. Had the Cubs been smarter though, they would have sold the tickets as soon as the season was over, that way no one would know who the manager was an many would probably assume the Convention would be a Sandberg love fest.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 6, 2010 5:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well...

… they have normally sold them around this time, so they wouldn’t have moved the date up or back because of a managerial selection.

Now, in answer to katie casey’s question, I doubt that’s a major factor.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 6, 2010 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thanks. You guys are probably right.

More likely it has more to do with that mediocre-to-bad 2010 season you mentioned.

BTW Doggie…nice post. I liked the catchy headline too.

by katie casey on Nov 6, 2010 5:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

It is much more than a bad season

This is a convention that sold out and quickly for decades and most year it was after many bad seasons.

Figured that headline would be fun, almost as much fun as my Zambrano DFAd post
( Victor of course).

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 6, 2010 5:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

The bad season did not help

But if Sandberg has been named Manager, I’m sure convention ticket sales would be higher.

"Easy on the words, brother,'' Quade said.

by RiskyBusiness on Nov 6, 2010 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Probably so.

But I’ll bet it still would not be sold out.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 7:20 AM CST up reply actions  

There is only so much money to go around in a bad economy and choosing

between the convention in the dead of winter or attending a game or two at Wrigley Field come next season – I think many will choose the latter. Of course, the Cubs must brace themselves for a growing number who will choose neither as well.

Like people who never foresaw housing prices ever going down, I think some, including probably the Ricketts, felt like Wrigley Field would just always be full no matter what product limped out there onto the field. Same with the convention.

Plus, right now, other than some young players with promise, there’s not the usual “star” the Cubs have often had in the past no matter how bad the team is to draw in casual fans.

by the nth on Nov 6, 2010 6:25 PM CDT reply actions  

Thats right with the

economy still making a slow recovery certain things get cut from a budget . I would much rather see a game than wander around a packed Hilton . The fans that travel from out of town just saw another jump in gas prices as well . Friends that have season tickets advise the sell about 1/2 of them . Some of their loyal customers have had to cut back on the games they attend . So there are a few factors but the Cubs poor showing this last season did not help.

by cubs north on Nov 6, 2010 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Convention gives you a chance

to see Banks, Santo, Dawson and tons of stars from your childhood and $60 is really not much. I don’t think you can explain how an event that has sold out in hours for years when the Cubs sucked and in bad in bad economic times has tons of tickets left. The Cubs marketing made very little effort this year and it is part of the pattern of merely assuming it would sell out because it had in the past. While out of town people might cut back there are more than 15,000 Cub fans in the city limits. Cubs need to get their noses out of spread sheets and corporate branding and start focusing really hard on those “regular” fans many folks said really did not matter to big business like theirs.

For the Convention I would start by confirming some big names, do something to insure that everyone who comes who wants it can get one “big” autograph etc.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 6, 2010 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Let me throw a big name into the mix: George Clooney.

Seriously, like you said, Williams, Santo, Banks, Dawson – All these guys have been there before. What big Cub name is there short of bringing Tinker, Evers and Chance back from the grave that would excite convention goers anew? (A decent percentage of whom return year after year anyway?)

Now I do agree that their marketing sucks. Calling anything associated with this team Year One other than 1909 was arrogant and just asking for trouble. And those awful commercials with the sappy music and nostalgic narration were bad, too. Try putting a good team on the field instead of trying to draw everyone into the “Wrigley experience.”

I will say this in the Cubs’ defense, however. What else can we expect from a team with a smaller staff than any other organization in baseball that until last year had offices in a converted Yum Yum Doughnuts?

by the nth on Nov 6, 2010 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

People like to see these guys

They mix up the group every year. Me I always wanted to see Don Kessinger and never had the chance. Not to mention a certain ex Cub who does not like cold weather and has not been to many conventions at all. This is what most people go for and it has worked fine for
25 years of sell outs.

The Cubs office’s were never at the Yum Yum shack , though I believe it did house some overflow for a year. It also served as a bag check for a few years.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 9:42 AM CST up reply actions  

You're incorrect.

Media relations was in the Yum Yum shack for about a year before they demolished it — they then moved into the trailers.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:30 AM CST up reply actions  

Did not realize you were refering to Media Relations

I just meant the Yum Yum shack was not the a main office for the Cubs front office just an overlfow spot.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 10:41 AM CST up reply actions  

Right.

But they did use it for offices for several years, and still don’t have enough space. They will once the Triangle Building gets built.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:45 AM CST up reply actions  

Never said that the main office was in the doughnut shop.

But isn’t it sad enough that any department of a MLB team had their offices in a converted doughnut/hot dog stand for even a day? It’s certainly a metaphor for something that ain’t good.

by the nth on Nov 7, 2010 10:24 PM CST up reply actions  

Well I think it is sad, but only because I miss Yum Yum

I used to bring in my lunch from there for nearly every game. Wrigleyville Dogs is now the only hot dog/hamburger place around and it is on the wrong side for me, Yum Yum had excellent donuts and when I lived near Wrigley I would eat breakfast there once a week or so.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 10:27 PM CST up reply actions  

Cubs Convention

I’m waiting for the Groupon alert and $32 convention passes.

"Easy on the words, brother,'' Quade said.

by RiskyBusiness on Nov 6, 2010 6:37 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Tribune scalping service

The Tribune Co. has or had the ticket scalping service that a judge said was legal. I wonder what happened to that. Maybe the scalping service used to buy the convention passes also and doesn’t anymore. Just a thought.

During this last season I didn’t think a few things were marketed as well as they used to be, but it is hard to tell what makes these things happen or change.

by AboutTheCubs on Nov 6, 2010 6:46 PM CDT reply actions  

Premium Tickets

I think it still exists but a shadow of what it was in light of stubhub etc.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 6, 2010 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

It does still exist.

But I doubt they sold very many tickets this past season and I don’t think they ever dealt in convention passes.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 7:21 AM CST up reply actions  

To have been a fly on the wall in the ticket office on Nov. 1

I would love to know how many people canceled their tickets outright this year. Like the convention, I bet it is unprecedented.

by bluemagic9 on Nov 7, 2010 12:30 AM CDT reply actions  

Not only that...

… it’s still possible for you to cancel now. The form only confirmed that you “want” to return. If you don’t pay by January 9, you won’t have your tickets and it’s always possible to cancel before then.

I won’t — I am renewing — but I bet there will be others who will cancel before 1/9.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 7:22 AM CST up reply actions  

And especially if there isn't anything to generate a buzz.

The Cubs need a signing or something or you will see more cancellations by 1/9. I still think there is a reasonable chance the Cubs sign Dunn.

John Grabow: $4.8 million in 2011.

by rlpete on Nov 7, 2010 9:44 AM CST up reply actions  

Hard to see Dunn selling that many tickets.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 9:45 AM CST up reply actions  

Well I think it is going to get VERY interesting

when they go through the waiting list. I think the biggest problem is bleacher tickets. The fact is most people on the list don’t really want to sit in the bleachers let alone by $4.000 for a ticket and the Cubs plan to add more to the season ticket mix. With such a long waiting list I think they will sell
at least all non bleacher tickets despite cancellations but the real bloodbath will come with individual ticket sales.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 9:45 AM CST up reply actions  

Guess what?

I agree with you again.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:30 AM CST up reply actions  

For me, Quade as Manager indicates rebuilding mode

Typically, Convention is early hope. This year I don’t have any. I believe the Cubs will try rebuilding like Minnesota, whom Tom Ricketts always talks about emulating. In theory I like that idea, however, as a fan paying top dollar to attend events such as the convention, games etc. I want to believe this will be the year. I don’t think that will be the case for 2011, in fact I don’t expect any big signings. Therefore, I’m willing to skip all the hype and hoopla and save money. I have always bought several tickets in Feb. but doubt I will this year. I think it will be easy to get tickets, possibly below face value at some point early in the season. It’s a gamble I’m willing to take.

Btw, felt like this about tickets, convention after 2006 until they went out and signed Soriano and, got a big name manager. I quickly got convention tickets and several game tickets…very glad, fun year. Although I wish the same for 2011, I think this time it will be different, and I’m saving my money as a result.

by mgfabc on Nov 7, 2010 10:12 AM CST reply actions  

Btw, felt like this about tickets, convention after 2006 until they went out and signed Soriano and, got a big name manager. I quickly got convention tickets and several game tickets

They’ll have a hard time replicating that buzz this year.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:31 AM CST up reply actions  

Does anyone remember when the 2006 Convention tickets went on sale?

I wonder because Soriano was signed on Nov. 21 which I presume was a few weeks after the convention tickets went on sale. Al, Kasey any idea if the convention had in fact sold out BEFORE Soriana was signed and after the season from hell?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 10:39 AM CST up reply actions  

Most likely it was before.

Nov. 21 seems late for convention passes to go on sale.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:46 AM CST up reply actions  

Also FWIW

… they appear to have sold about 15 passes since yesterday. The sequence number is now 1688 — that would imply there are several thousand remaining.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:47 AM CST up reply actions  

Hard to tell because of the tickets that go with the rooms

but clearly lots of remaining tickets.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 4:42 PM CST up reply actions  

The other thing to recall...

… is that by this time most years, the hotel rooms are also sold out. The fact that you can still get rooms as well — and this is the first time you have ever been able to get them on the website — also speaks volumes.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 5:03 PM CST up reply actions  

If Ricketts is contemplating a rebuilding effort like Minnesota,

he’s out of his mind. Chicago is not a small market. It should contend every year.

If he’s serious about this, attendance will crater in 2011. And then he’ll have less money to spend. Vicious circle.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Nov 7, 2010 4:45 PM CST up reply actions  

Agreed.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 5:04 PM CST up reply actions  

But the Twins DO contend every year,

and they do so, in part, because they produce many of their own players from their farm system.

Hey, it's a new century!

by cowsarecool220 on Nov 7, 2010 9:33 PM CST up reply actions  

That's fine, but

the Cubs should do and can do more.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Nov 7, 2010 9:38 PM CST up reply actions  

But the Cubs' farm system isn't that good

It would be a good goal to make it that good, but they aren’t close yet. Note that the team could use help at 1B, 2B, and bullpen, and there isn’t much talk about farm system players filling those roles.

by ClarkFan on Nov 8, 2010 4:27 PM CST up reply actions  

A high payroll club...

…should be able to “reload” vs rebiuld. That is, if you haven’t made a lot of bad decisions on players.

I know a lot of people disagree (and some agree), but I think he is out of his mind for not bringing in new leadership right below him to oversee the baseball operations.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 8, 2010 9:07 AM CST up reply actions  

Regarding the MLB site

I wonder if the poor job is more related to MLB than the Cubs. The websites for teams has a Pravda feel to them if you ask me. Often, similar articles will appear simultaneously at different sites like the GM needs to be creative in FA. The writers put out fairly standard stuff and even touch on controversies once they become widely discussed, but I don’t expect much beyond that.

Regarding the headline to this fanpost: Be careful, too much praised and Al’s head will swell to Bruce Bochy like proportions.

by ol Pete on Nov 7, 2010 10:29 AM CST reply actions  

LOL

You can rest assured that won’t happen (about the praise).

Anyway, you’re right about the MLB sites. I hate the redesign they did last winter, with those awful drop-down rollover menus that are impossible to navigate.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 10:31 AM CST up reply actions  

I agree about

the MLB sites. Sometimes I start cussin a blue streak because those friggin menus seem to take forever to roll up…….LOL

Why did they change it anyhow? It wasn’t broke, why fix it.

The menus on the NHL sites are much easier to navigate.

by Swoosie on Nov 7, 2010 11:38 AM CST up reply actions  

Why did they change it anyhow? It wasn’t broke, why fix it.

Way too many websites do not follow this simple idea, not just MLB.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 7, 2010 12:03 PM CST up reply actions  

"It's the Team, stupid"

sorry, not calling names, just re-imagining a famous political slogan.

By all accounts, it’ll most likely be the same faces and the same sorry team that’ll be lucky to take 3rd in the division next year…minus Sandberg and LouPa. Whatever you may think of those two, they did bring some measure of starpower.

I haven’t seen the list of Cubs attendees, but if it’s the current members and the same retreads (Hundley/Santo/Williams etc.) then why would anyone want to pay for this?

Maybe the Cubs will get Andre Dawson to show up to sell some tix, but unless his appearance fee is less than the sales bump I wouldn’t bank on it.

Point being, there is no reason to go to this thing because the outlook for the 2011 Cubs is less than positive.

WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station

by Gibbon Jockey on Nov 7, 2010 2:22 PM CST reply actions  

Um it is the same guys rotating for the last 25 years.

and people come and the event sells out as soon as it goes on sale so this is very, very different.

Also just to make it clear none of the players is paid to attend, there is no appearence money.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 4:35 PM CST up reply actions  

Where did you hear they weren't paid?

I worked with this event for many years. The players are paid somewhere between $500-$1,000 for attending, plus they get first class air fare, free room, meals, etc. for them & their families.

by cubsscoop on Nov 7, 2010 10:49 PM CST up reply actions  

They get the airfare and the room

at they may get some spending money to over incidentals such as bar tabs, they do NOT get an “appearance” fee ( which is usually in the many thousands). This is a charity event and it makes little sense to pay fat fees for people to attend and most of the players are happy to attend because it is an all expense paid vacation to hang out with old friends even if it is in Chicago in the dead of winter.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 11:10 PM CST up reply actions  

Hmmm.

Now, we have two conflicting reports.

Jessica’s appears to be speculation. Anyone know for sure about an appearance fee? If I had to guess, I’d guess they do get one.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 8, 2010 7:18 AM CST up reply actions  

The Cubs have said they do not

I would believe them $500- $1000 would really be considered spending money. Appearance fees are in the $5,000 and way up dept. If you were paying the 50 or so players that come appearance fees such as they might receive to go to a sports show the Convention would likely lose money.

Slightly OT ,but my dear “sweetheart” Lou will be at the Foxwoods Casino in CT next week for a promotional event for which I am sure he gets a nice appearance fee. I am
hurt that he did not call me and see if I could meet him for a drink.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 8, 2010 7:39 AM CST up reply actions  

Jessica, just FYI

I rec’d this post only because everyone else was and I didn’t want to feel left out. I’m a follower.

by Arbusto on Nov 7, 2010 4:27 PM CST reply actions  

Lemmings are good.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 4:42 PM CST up reply actions  

and kinda cute

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Nov 7, 2010 4:49 PM CST up reply actions  

I happen to think I'm very cute

Most of it comes from my magnificent ginger beard.

by Arbusto on Nov 8, 2010 8:37 AM CST up reply actions  

So they aren't Cub fans after all?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 7, 2010 11:10 PM CST up reply actions  

Wow (?)

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Nov 7, 2010 4:35 PM CST reply actions  

Lousy team, lousy economy, lousy buzz, and lousy venue=lousy ticket sales

I haven’t been, haven’t I read horror stories of the convention outgrowing the Hilton?

I guess the good news would be that lower ticket sales means less of a packed feeling.

Wherever you go, there you are!

by Dan Serafini on Nov 8, 2010 4:38 PM CST reply actions  

Yes, it would.

The convention outgrew the Hilton more than 10 years ago.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 8, 2010 5:37 PM CST up reply actions  

For a second, I thought this was about Wrigley Field sales.

However, that would require Hell freezing over.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Possibly hiking up Mount Marcy during the weekend of October 23-24. State high point count: 3/50

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Nov 8, 2010 5:23 PM CST reply actions  

Good, good, good, good

This will wake them up a bit. Let some of these events and ticket sales stunts and promotional gimmicks fail. That’s good. Failure sometimes is good. It will make them alter their approach.

Sometimes it takes utter and complete failure; bottoming out to depths not seen recently. It’s what they then do with it is what counts the most.

Just win the next game...!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 9, 2010 7:49 AM CST reply actions  

This will wake them up a bit.

I wonder about that. You’d have thought the empty seats and unsold tickets at the end of last year would have been a wakeup call. Instead, prices were raised for a lot of games.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 9, 2010 8:20 AM CST up reply actions  

Again guys with spreadsheets and MBAs

or at least that is how it seems. The $81 bleacher tickets stand out because they are so clearly assuming that in “matching” broker prices they can sell all 5100 tickets per game at that price.

You would think they would have realized how dire the situation is by now. Perhaps they are in a panic over the Convention sales because it is beyond belief that an event which basically sells out in under an hour is still around but I am sure they are telling themselves it is some kind of fluke and not related to game sales. I have a feeling the VWR is not going to be too crowded this year. I can tell that just between Al and me who usually by extras for ourselves or friends but won’t be this year, there will be $4,000-$5,000 less spent on bleachers and that is just from the two of us.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 9, 2010 9:01 AM CST up reply actions  

Who has a spreadsheet and an MBA?

Cubs front office folks have those “amenities”?

Just win the next game...!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 9, 2010 1:04 PM CST up reply actions  

There certainly appears...

…to be a “disconnect” between whomever in the Cub’s brass made this decision and what is going on in regards to the economy, recent ticket demand and most importantly, the quality of the product.

I’m wondering this ticket price strategy was driven by Kenney. His motivation would be to show Ricketts he knows how to increase revenues and he talked Ricketts into doing this. I also say this because, it is very clear that Hendry has also influenced Ricketts and sold him on the fact “things are going well” and he has been retained.

I don’t think Ricketts needed much more than common sense to determine the ticket price strategy might not go over to well, but he does need baseball knowledge/experience to determine whether what Hendry is telling him is indeed reality. He should have the former, but he clearly doesn’t have the latter.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Nov 12, 2010 9:35 AM CST up reply actions  

I believe you may be correct.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 12, 2010 2:55 PM CST up reply actions  

Yeah I have to say if last year's sales weren't enough,

I doubt this convention will have much of an effect. I can’t believe they thought raising prices was a good idea with the climate and the last two years performance of the team…not to mention lowered expectations for next year at best.

Starlin Castro singles on a pop up to catcher Jason LaRue.
Ryan Theriot scores. Two out -Gameday 7/23/10

by Sandberg's evil twin on Nov 9, 2010 12:19 PM CST up reply actions  

Pass sale update

They’ve sold about 60 of them since early Monday morning.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 9, 2010 3:26 PM CST up reply actions  

Nobody should ever buy tickets to the stupid convention!

What are you celebrating, another crappy season? or a chance to rub elbows with weirdo memorablia collectors in the autograph lines?

Until the Cubs actually win something or Jim Hendry is fired, no Cub fan has any reason to pay real money for tickets to go to a convention of losers.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Nov 9, 2010 11:42 AM CST reply actions  

that's not true

My kids thoroughly enjoyed the convention in previous years, especially with the learning about the great players from the past that are always there.

Just win the next game...!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 9, 2010 1:55 PM CST up reply actions  

I did not go for the first 20 years

I went for the last few. It is a CHARITY event so the Cubs make nothing. I don’t care about the memorabilia, but I do find the sessions interesting and have been known to ask a pointed question or two. For logistical and financial reasons I remain undecided about this year.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 9, 2010 2:48 PM CST up reply actions  

Just figure out who you want to call you "Sweetheart,"

And when you’ve made up your mind, then go to the convention.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Possibly hiking up Mount Marcy during the weekend of October 23-24. State high point count: 3/50

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Nov 9, 2010 5:22 PM CST up reply actions  

Unfortunately I don't think either Maddux or Fuld will be there

(If didn’t say that someone else would)

I imagine if I went I might ask about $81 bleacher tickets and if there is any chance of getting Coke over Pepsi at the park.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 10, 2010 1:10 AM CST up reply actions  

I'd be happy with Vienna Hot Dogs

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 10, 2010 8:14 AM CST up reply actions  

I can't wait until you ask Crane Kenney about the $81 bleacher tickets.

Everyone here should go for that show. It would be worth the price of the convention pass.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 10, 2010 9:00 AM CST up reply actions  

Someone probably pointed this out sometime already -

I don’t get here as much as I’d like – but it is funny that for people of a certain age, me for instance, the price of that one bleacher ticket in 2011 would have gotten you exactly one bleacher seat for every single home game when I started following the Cubs.

by the nth on Nov 10, 2010 9:30 AM CST up reply actions  

That's true.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 10, 2010 11:08 AM CST up reply actions  

I am glad Mr. Maloney is retired

He always seemed to be taking a hit for someone else’s policy when I asked him a question about ticket sales.

I don’t think Kenney would call me “sweetheart”, but I do seem to have a history of bringing out the paternalism in Cub personal. Many years ago when I went to my first Cubs stockholder meeting and asked a pointed question of then GM Bob Kennedy, he responded “Young lady, I think you are being hostile”

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 10, 2010 10:07 AM CST up reply actions  

This is why you HAVE to make it to the convention.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 10, 2010 11:08 AM CST up reply actions  

I wasn't going to go

But that might be worth the price of admission.

"It's important in life to not give a shit. It can help you a lot." - George Carlin

by bluemagic9 on Nov 10, 2010 10:48 PM CST up reply actions  

It is.

The “sweetheart” moment might have been my favorite moment at a Cubs convention — ever.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 11, 2010 10:28 AM CST up reply actions  

Not sure how to take that.

Bob Kennedy’s “Young lady I think you are being hostile” was my highlight for management interaction. This was long before there were conventions. I got a share of Cubs stock for my HS graduation present and went to a meeting, most likely in 1980. This is just 50 or 75 people in a hotel conference room and the Cubs had been bad for as long as anyone could remember. I figured the other stockholders were devoted but concerned fans, but when it came time for Q&A people were asking things like " Do you plan to carry two or three catchers?" . I honestly don’t remeber exactly what I asked but I know it had to do with
roster movies in the last few years and a reference to Bill Madlock finding out he was traded by being called by a San Francisco paper late one night.
Anyway eventually I graduated from a hostile “young lady” to
a “sweetheart”.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 11, 2010 10:39 AM CST up reply actions  

roster movies

Those would be interesting, but probably best watched on DVD.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 11, 2010 11:07 AM CST up reply actions  

I only watch movies on the BIG screen

a good freudian slip though.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 11, 2010 11:27 AM CST up reply actions  

Forget whining at the convention

that’s just a convenient forum for “let the fans spill their guts” then we’ll get back to business.

Wanna make a real statement? Stay the hell out of the ballpark.

But I do like the title of the post, finally we have some closure to the hot topic from this past Feb/Mar.

Just win the next game...!

by blackhawk24 on Nov 10, 2010 10:39 AM CST reply actions  

I am addict and I can't quit

What I don’t do though is ever buy any food for drink inside.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Nov 10, 2010 10:42 AM CST up reply actions  

Update

About 30 convention passes have been sold in the last two days. Still plenty available.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 11, 2010 11:40 AM CST reply actions  

Crazy

but even crazier is the fact that hotel rooms are available. Those used to sell out by August.

"It's important in life to not give a shit. It can help you a lot." - George Carlin

by bluemagic9 on Nov 12, 2010 1:58 PM CST up reply actions  

Or at the very latest, around the end of the regular season.

This will be the first convention in 25 years to not sell out.

Checking eBay and Stubhub, there are 30 active listings and 8 closed listings on eBay. Two of the closed listings resulted in sales, at a price slightly over face (why would anyone do that when there are plenty available?)

On Stubhub, there are 199 passes listed, priced from around $80 to $500 (!) It’s impossible to tell whether any have sold, but I’m guessing not at those prices.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Nov 12, 2010 2:59 PM CST up reply actions  

What if no one showed up to the convention?

Ricketts would probably raise bleacher tickets $10 a game in retaliation!

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Nov 11, 2010 2:22 PM CST reply actions  

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