Speeding up the Game
This is something I hear about all the time on ESPN and other sports outlets. Supposedly, Selig has one of his commissions out there looking at it.
The SEC is now putting a 20-second pitch clock on the field and activating it when no one is on base. Take too much time and it's a ball. If the batter steps out in the last five seconds, it's a strike.
Also, the teams will have 1 minute, 48 seconds between innings. If the pitchers and/or fielders aren't ready after that time, it's a ball. If the hitter isn't ready, it's a strike. (No idea how they came to 1:48, but there you go)
Look, we can wax poetic about how baseball is the game without a clock and all that garbage, but the fact of the matter is, the pace is too slow. And it is a flat-out embarrassment to all that is good and pure in humanity that playoff baseball games end after 1 a.m.
At some point, you can't control things. You can't limit the number of times a hitter can foul off pitches. You can't limit the number of throws to first. And it is true that an exciting 12-11 game is going to take longer than a dull 5-1 game, so length isn't always a barometer of excitement.
It's more about pace than length. What can be done to speed up the pace?
If you think it's fine as it is, move on. The back button is right up there on the upper left corner.
* Put the 20-second clock on the scoreboard and enforce it.
* No more pitching coach visits. You get one visit and that's to get him out of the game. What the hell do they talk about anyway? "Throw strikes?" "OK!" Figure it out, boys. You're professionals.
* Catchers get one mound visit per inning. That visit will last no more than 45 seconds.
* As the manager is leaving the dugout to get the pitcher, the relief pitcher leaves the bullpen. No more waiting. If the starting pitcher can't handle seeing the reliever, then he should retire, hide in shame and never again feel the touch of a good woman.
* You step out of the box unless it's an injury, then it's a strike.
What else you got?
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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Good suggestions
Another one, which I think may have already been invoked, is that if you bring a reliever in, he has to face at least one batter. I’m sick of the routine in which a manager brings someone in, warms him up, and then the other team switches hitters, so the manager yanks the pitcher and the whole warm-up routine starts again.
I may be wrong, but I think this is now a rule.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
Correct. Must face one batter
Are you familiar with the old robot saying, "Does not compute"?
by dr stabbingworth on May 27, 2010 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions
And
Here’s another sugggestion from me re. pitching changes:
If you warm a pitcher up before an inning to pitch that inning, he has to face at least one batter. Too often, we see the starter go back out for the 7th or 8th or 9th inning, warm up, and then the manager decides he’s seen enough and yanks him before the first batter hits. I’m convinced this is designed to provide sponsors with another commercial break. If you’re sick of your starter, figure it out before his next inning starts and replace him.
Also, I’d limit mid-inning pitching changes to just two. Seldom do we see it go beyond that, I’ll admit, but when it does, it becomes absolute torture. I’d also only allow a manager to make two pitching changes in the same inning once a game, because even two changes is more than I like.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
it's to get the reliever
more tosses in the bullpen to warm up. matter of fact it happened in last night’s Yankee game. Pettite warmed up to start the 9th and before facing a batter Girardi went out and got him in favor of Rivera. With Swisher homering in the top of the 9th of a tie game, Rivera was not warm to be summoned.
1:48 between innings?
Non-starter. TV will never go for it, and that’s the end of it.
Same with pitch clocks. TV promo chatter in between pitches is something the networks are not likely to be willing to give up, nor the extra ad avails.
Not to mention it’s a silly idea in the first place.
Back button, eh?
What’s an embarrassment is there’s people getting paid to come up with stupid ideas like this. Yikes!
I don’t care the pace it’s slow. It’s expected because it’s baseball.
Just win the next game...!
What 1am playoff games??
Example(s) ???
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on May 27, 2010 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't know where Worf is from,
but if he’s in the Eastern Time zone, a playoff game on the west coast that begins at 7 wouldn’t begin until 10:00 his time.
The last suggestion would never work, if you’re in the box taking a sign the pitcher can throw whether you’re ready or not.
Precisely...
on both accounts which is why I await a reply.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on May 27, 2010 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Then fucking get ready to hit
It’s not that difficult
2008 World Series and ALCS. Games were ending well after midnight and close to 1 a.m. Not always, but enough.
I’m trying to imagine the NFL allowing a playoff game to end after 10 p.m. That’s why the NFL kicks baseball’s ass in every single measurable way
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
You know, that's twice in 2 days you've ripped my head off.
How is a guy supposed to take a signal from the base coach or manager when he’s standing in the box? The pitcher will just lob a strike across. Not that difficult. Plus I don’t really have an issue with the other suggestions, so you don’t have to swear at me for disagreeing with one of them.
Lastly, I don’t know and don’t care where you live, I thought maybe that was why games were ending so late. Sorry to invade your fanpost, and good day.
I said good day!
Sorry, was more responding to blackhawk, who would argue that the Sun rose in the West if I pointed out it rose in the East.
Anyway, the hitter can stand with one foot out of the box during the 20-second period to get a signal. After the 20-seconds, he can be quick-pitched.
I also think the signals are overrated. The biggest change in baseball is really overmanaging. LaRussa — six pitchers, six outs — is by far the worst, but most of the other guys seem to feel they have to keep up.
That’s why I think you can chop off a lot of time by letting the guys play. PItchers know they need to throw strikes.
If conferences are so crucial, then use the NFL helmet technology and put speakers in the pitchers’ cap (or give them a helmet, which isn’t the worst idea in the world for them anyway)
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
The sun actually doesn't rise anywhere.
It’s the Earth’s rotation that makes it seem that way. :)
United we stand and united we'll fall......down on our knees the day we win it all!
by Bricks and Ivy on May 27, 2010 4:09 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
ROFL
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 28, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
So these were 5.5-6 hr games?
I wouldn’t argue sun rise E/W but it’s clear you’re a complete ass.
It’s fun to see what a cranky old bastard like you gets so revved up about when it’s clear you haven’t thought out the ramifications of your silly proposals.
Save the ESPN started it crap. They’re just a bunch of idiots creating controversy for idiots like you.
Just win the next game...!
Fuck you
Ban me if you want, Al. I’m tired of the name-calling.
“Ass”; “Bastard” and “Idiots”
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Clearly, you love to dish it out.
The receiving end? Not so much.
“Typical punk antagonist” would be a good summation.
Show me where I make personal insults to other posters
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Just wow. First you post something then tell people to leave
If they don’t agree with it. That’s completely idiotic. Why even have this site, do you think it’s just for people to come and admire your awesomeness? or for you to swear at them when they disagree with you? What is this obsession of yours with trying to intimidate people, you think you’re going to cyber-fight them?
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions
OK.
I just saw this part of the thread.
There are several people who did wrong here. Knock off the namecalling AND profanity. All of you. Thanks. (Apologies to those who did neither.)
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I was posting this not just because of the language
but also because he says in the post if you don’t agree its garbage and move on. Which is silly, until this becomes Worf’s blog. I don’t see in there any name calling so I suppose you were just looking for a good place to reply to this topic…but tell me if that isn’t true.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions
still pretending to be a tough guy I see
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 27, 2010 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Still chasing me around the Internets
I’m married, dude. I’m flattered,but married.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
You're married???
Proof that women have a sense of humor.
Seriously though, I believe you are an idiot, like others here it appears. Maybe it is time for you to do a little personal reflecting.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions
Regardless of your feelings about what he posted...
… knock off the namecalling.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
calling Worf an idiot is not namecalling
it is just telling it like it is
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions
from telling it like it it is? Nope.
BTW, gotta love the irony. worf, the clown who drops insults and f-bombs with greater regularity here than anyone else, accusing anyone of not being able to control himself
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 30, 2010 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions
you mixing blou and worf i believe there
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
not at all
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 30, 2010 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Like the 20-Second Pitch Clock
That would be a good way to get the length of games down. I don’t think you can do much about the time between half-innings because of TV commercials. I can’t blame younger people for not liking baseball with its slooooow pacing these days.
You’ve got to keep in mind how many people live in the eastern time zone. A game that starts at 8:05 PM eastern that lasts four hours is going to end at 12:05 AM eastern. That’s too late. Half the country lives in the eastern time zone.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
When would said 20s pitch clock start?
Soon as the ball is back in the pitchers’ glove?
So how will this help? The time between pitches goes up when there are runners on base. Where the control would be needed (though I still don’t agree) is when there are runners on base.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on May 27, 2010 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions
there's already
a time rule for pitchers. Just enforce the rule.
As far as the rest of it goes… baseball is not hockey, basketball (thank god) or football. There’s no need to speed up these games in that way.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 27, 2010 5:10 PM CDT up reply actions
That would be Rule 8.04
8.04
When the bases are unoccupied, the pitcher shall deliver the ball to the batter within 12 seconds after he receives the ball. Each time the pitcher delays the game by violating this rule, the umpire shall call "Ball." The 12-second timing starts when the pitcher is in possession of the ball and the batter is in the box, alert to the pitcher. The timing stops when the pitcher releases the ball.
The intent of this rule is to avoid unnecessary delays. The umpire shall insist that the catcher return the ball promptly to the pitcher, and that the pitcher take his position on the rubber promptly. Obvious delay by the pitcher should instantly be penalized by the umpire.
Once the pitcher allows a baserunner, the rule no longer applies.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Oh, yeah
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Right.
Name the last time that rule was ever enforced.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
well
that’s no reason to institute a new rule. Just enforce the rule you have.
And actually, it was enforced against Scott Eyre back before he was traded to the Phils.
Note that the rule requires the batter to be ready as well. It’s not all on the pitcher.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 28, 2010 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions
The rule isn't being changed
a clock is being put on the field to make it easier to enforce
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
that’s a 20 second clock. The rule states 12 seconds. The clock is being used in different situations.
It’s either changing the rule, or instituting a new rule. Neither of which is necessary.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 28, 2010 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions
THEN put in a 12-second clock
And stop being so damn dense
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
it's unnecessary
the Umpires are there to enforce the rules. Make the umpires do their job.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 28, 2010 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
Joe West tried that
and the Yankees and Red Sox threw a hissy fit.
The players have to be part of this too
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I don't give two craps
about the yankees or the red sox. Get a competent commissioner, and make the umpires do their jobs.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 28, 2010 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, news flash, Scooter
The Yankees and Red Sox are the two most important teams. If they put up a fight, no other player will go along.
Umps have to have support from the front offices.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
that's what I said.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 29, 2010 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions
like so many rules and laws
it does not get enforced.
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
Didn't you read the post Drew? Worf already told you that you can't disagree. Sheesh you should read more.
No fair having an opinion. You’re just supposed to post some variance of his ideas.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
same with 7 PM starrts in LA vs say NYM
Game starts in NY at 10 PM and ends between 1 and 2 AM
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
Bullpen
If you limited the bullpen to 5 pitchers or 6 at most rather than the 7 most teams carry, you’d speed up the game because managers would be forced to really use long relief, rather than replacing pitchers at whim.
It may seem like a novel concept, but until about 25 years ago, if memory serves, five or six relievers were the norm. I think 7 is really going too far, and were I a manager, I’d much rather have 6 and one extra bat on the bench.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
Foul balls
I know you say you can’t limit this, but I’d love to see a study of foul balls per game now vs. in the past.
I have no way to prove it, but I’m convinced that with all the focus on pitch counts, the number of foul balls has risen in the last 10 years. I’m pretty sure batters are trying to run up high pitch counts early in the game for starting pitchers because they know the starter will be lifted at a certain point (probably around 100 pitches).So they try to foul off as many pitches as they can.
If you can get a good starter like Dempster to 100 pitches in 5 innings rather than 6 or 7, the other team has to use less than effective middle relief, giving the opponent better chances to score. And more foul balls, of course, slow down the game.
Just another example of ways in which pitch counts are hurting our sport.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
I'm sure foul balls have increased.
With all the new parks, they limit foul territory… so there are a number of balls that used to be caught that end up in the stands.
That's a good theory
And probably correcf. But I like my theory as well. Maybe it’s a combination of the two.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
There's yet another IMO to the 2 points you guys already mentioned
Today’s hitters IMO again are not as good a 2-strike hitters as decades ago. So now, they’re more inclined to try to just foul off pitches where there’s a hint they can’t put the ball in play. Sort of like bunting isn’t as good as it used to be, I believe hitters aren’t as good a 2-strike hitters as they used to be.
Just win the next game...!
I'm not even radical enough to suggest
a limit to the number of foul-offs you can have.
And an at-bat that runs to a full count with several pitches fouled off CAN be exciting. There is just too much crap that goes on in between the pitches.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Pitch counts are hurting our sport?
Baseball is so much more fun when pitchers go down with career-ending injuries more often. Torn rotator cuffs are the only reason I watch the game.
I have no way to prove it, but I’m convinced that with all the focus on pitch counts, the number of foul balls has risen in the last 10 years.
Plate patience has increased in baseball over the history of the sport, which has more to do with things than foul balls. The idea that players are deliberately fouling off pitches to drive up pitch counts seems extremely far-fetched to me, but batters are taking a lot more pitches than they used to.
Over the last 20 years, pitchers are throwing the same number of pitches on average (around 97) but going fewer innings (5.9 from 6.5 20 years ago).
This is part of an overall trend though – in 1932, the average number of pitches per game was 115 pitches. These days that barely gets you through 6.
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It's lucky
that pitch counts have prevented career-ending injuries. No pitchers get injured these days, do they?
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
Prevented? No one said that.
Reduced? Almost certainly.
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The Reason For The Reduction
I believe that’s got a lot to do with the likes of Frank Jobe and James Andrews and the advances in medicine. With the increased popularity of the slider and the split-fingered fast ball, I believe pitchers are more prone to injury. It’s just there’s more out there to fix arm problems now than ever before.
Pitch counts are more important now than before because starters don’t pace themselves these days like they did in the past. Because of more stressful pitches, there most definitely needs to be a lot of attention paid to a pitch count. I agree that pitch counts have reduced injuries but give Jobe and Andrews of the world credit, too.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Right - Pitch counts are an effect, not a cause
They’re the result of better exercise and medical science that we have now. Like better surgical options, they’ve helped contribute to longer careers.
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hitters are not trying to hit foul balls
to run up pitch counts. But they do take more pitches and work the count more. Part Moneyball-ish in that the value of a BB has increased in the last decade, much like the decreased value of a stolen base attempt.
Man you don't listen. Yes he clearly said if you don't agree it's garbage and move on.
Stop having your own ideas and just agree with him.
I think it’s just logic that pitch counts run up foul balls. I don’t know that I agree at all that pitch counts are hurting the sport…but I think they are definitely overused at times. Problem is regardless with the money pitchers get and good ones always being in short supply, they’re here to stay in pro ball. Owners are going to protect their highly paid investments.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions
I guess I'm in the minority on this one....
but the pace of the game has never bothered me, and I don’t understand the obsession with speeding up the game. True, games used to played in about an hour and a half, which amazes me. I don’t know how they did that, other than the fact that pitching changes were much fewer and far between. Still, the game is what it is, and it’s a great game. Sure some games are slower than others, but for every fast worker like Carlos Zambrano, you’re always going to have an occasional human rain delay like Rick Sutcliffe or Steve Trachsel. That’s just baseball. Never bothered me.
"Don't complain to me about the stormy weather, boys. Just bring the ship into port." --Steve Stone, September 2004
I have the live footage of a mid 60's WS telecast.
30 between inning ad breaks. That’s how they did it.
I'm with you.
Alot of my friends that don’t watch baseball on TV claim it’s because the games are at least 3 hours long. We had a big debate about it, looked it up and the average baseball game last year was 2 hrs and 52 mins. One particular buddy mentioned that he watches soccer because it always lasts 90 minutes. He said if baseball was 90 minutes, then he would watch it. There is just too much time in 3 hours to spend watching one game. I don’t agree with it. But I consider myself a big baseball fan.
Are any of them football fans?
Because those games last at LEAST 3 hours, with just as much time of inactivity as baseball.
I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT
Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson
by Shanghai Badger on May 28, 2010 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions
So if you wanted an IBB
with nobody on base, you could just wait 80 seconds and they wouldn’t count those 4 pitches against your pitch count!
Fukudometer: Created 3/31/08 Wrigley Debut 4/5/08 WGN and Japan TV Debut 4/6/08 Sun Times Debut: 4/20/08 Coffee Table Debut: 7/17/08 (http://www.wearecubsfans.com)
Less offense
The simplest way to reduce game time is to reduce the amount of offense.
Over the last 40 years, the average number of runs scored per game has increased by almost an entire run:
As you’d expect, runs scored has an positive correlation with pitch counts:

That 1 run per game increase in runs scored has a serious impact on pitch counts, which have a linear relationship with game time:

Why make crazy, convoluted rule changes (a shot clock? really??) when you can handle this by going back to larger foul ball territory, deeper outfields, and a baseball that isn’t juiced? Alternately, raise the mound back up – that would have a negative impact on runs as well, speeding up the game.
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Now that's crazy talk!
All of this would work, but there is no way you will ever get the owners to pony up for those kind of renovations (except raising the mound)
Deeper outfields and larger foul ground also takes away seats for customers, which owners would be loathe to give up.
Raising the mound and un-juicing the ball (and actually calling a letters-to-knees zone) would all work, and those should have been done a long time ago.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Yes..
call the strike zone the way it is in the rulebook and it would defiantely speed up the game.
Favre-enfreude
The thrill of seeing an epic Brett Favre fail. Derived from schadenfreude - satisfaction or pleasure felt at someone else's misfortune.
+1
Jim Palmer got a lot of high strikes called back in his day. I don’t know how a Jim Palmer-like pitcher would do in this day and age.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
the main reason for longer games?
lousy pitching
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 27, 2010 4:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Sure, pitching has been diluted by expansion
But that’s somewhat canceled out by longer careers.
Lowering the mound, reducing foul territory, shrinking the strike zone, and juicing the ball tend to make pitching less effective.
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by Wreckard on May 27, 2010 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
recd
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
true enough about the new ballparks
most all are much more hitter friendly.
Baseball execs believe that more runs means more fans, but more runs also means longer games, so nothing is going to change anytime soon.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
i would not include the early days of baseball in the comparrison
maybe the last 20 or 30 only. Remember in the old days, a ball caught on one bounce was an out, for one example. the rules have changed so much sinec the early 1900’s as have the training for players, that the game is hardly the same.
otherwise, great insight
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
Pitching coach visits to the mound are a necessary part of the game.
Most of them are talking about something productive for their pitchers, especially the younger ones. And yeah I’m assuming they are talking about something productive because most of those guys wouldn’t lug their beer bellies out to the mound for no reason.
I’d like to see some sort of stats on the effectiveness of mound visits. In my experience of watching games they are very helpful to settle the pitcher down and remind him of scouting reports on opposing batters. Something that could have been used to settle “The Employee” down in ’03 after you know what.
United we stand and united we'll fall......down on our knees the day we win it all!
Why not give pitchers a headset, like quarterbacks have?
You’d be able to reduce mound visits and get rid of sign stealing at the same time.
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Exactly
And I think pitching mound visits have more to do with breaking up momentum and giving the pitcher a chance to catch his breath than any real strategy.
In that sense, they function as time-outs, which is fine. But every other sport has a limit to the number of time-outs.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Have A Limit Of One Mound Visit Per Inning...
without yanking the pitcher. Have the limit by inning and not pitcher.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
unnecessary
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 27, 2010 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions
This is exactly what I think is needed.
Some limit at least would be nice other than simply two by the manager. These endless visits by the team and the catcher only bog the game down to give time to a reliever warming up. Perhaps you could start by limiting it to one visit by the catcher, one by pitching coach, one for manager, per inning etc. Or limit how long the catcher’s visit should be. It’s not easy but I think an attempt made isn’t a bad idea…I sure would like to start the game moving back towards two hours instead of towards 4 hours which is where it has been going.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions
this attacks the symptom not the problem
too many pitchers on big league rosters that belong in the minors.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Well then it's strategy and I don't mind that either.
I don’t think any of us on here know, unless you’ve pitched at a high level or talked with pitchers, what they really talk about. I only see a couple mound visits a game anyway and I believe there already is a rule on how many you have in an inning before you must take the pitcher out.
United we stand and united we'll fall......down on our knees the day we win it all!
by Bricks and Ivy on May 27, 2010 4:05 PM CDT up reply actions
well said
mound visits are not the cause of the longer games.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 27, 2010 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions
pitching mound visits have more to do with breaking up momentum and giving the pitcher a chance to catch his breath than any realwhich is strategy.
Fixed that for ya.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 27, 2010 5:13 PM CDT up reply actions
They do - Rule 8.06
8.06
A professional league shall adopt the following rule pertaining to the visit of the manager or coach to the pitcher:
a – This rule limits the number of trips a manager or coach may make to any one pitcher in any one inning;
b – A second trip to the same pitcher in the same inning will cause this pitcher’s automatic removal;
c – The manager or coach is prohibited from making a second visit to the mound while the same batter is at bat, but
d – if a pinch-hitter is substituted for this batter, the manager or coach may make a second visit to the mound, but must remove the pitcher.
A manager or coach is considered to have concluded his visit to the mound when he leaves the 18-foot circle surrounding the pitcher’s rubber.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
lol! Worf,

Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 28, 2010 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions
Not the same
other sports get a set number of timeouts. They may burn them as they choose. They don’t get extra timeouts based on substitutions.
Managers get three mound visits that may last 2 minutes. (The manager must be walking off the field in two minutes) Catchers get one 30-second one per inning (not cumulative)
If you want to use them all for the same at-bat, hooray.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
I don't see any problem with mound visits that would suggest putting in headsets.
United we stand and united we'll fall......down on our knees the day we win it all!
by Bricks and Ivy on May 27, 2010 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Radical Idea On Relief Pitching Rules
I’ll throw this out there. What about if a pitcher was required to either finish the inning or come to conclusion with at least TWO batters? That would cut down on the number of pitching changes. Would this increase offense because the hitting team would still be allowed to put up a pinch-hitter when the pitching team would not be allowed to change pitchers? Very possibly. I’ve never liked LOOGY’s and ROOGY’s anyway. I like the relievers who are out there that can get both lefty and righty hitters out.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
In theory though...
one pitcher can give up an infinite amount of runs, before finishing the inning, which would make for a very long game.
I think limiting the amount of time a team has to change pitchers would work. You can change pitchers as often as you like, but you’ve got 60 seconds to do it.
That’s 60 seconds to get the old pitcher out and in the dugout and the new pitcher on the mound, ball in hand and ready to pitch.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
2-Strike Foul Off Limit
I know you’re not that radical. I wouldn’t mind 4 foul offs with 2 strikes becoming a strikeout. I know that rule will never be adopted. It’s an idea.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
The longer the game the better...
There’s nothing but garbage on the other TV channels anyway, & if I’m at the game, then I want it to last as long as possible for the money I’m spending on the tickets.
the clock
between pitches and between innings is worth trying, but there is no need to cut down on the number of visits by coaches to the mound.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
The 20-second clock on the scoreboard would work elsewhere
But at Wrigley, it would just lead to a lot of workman’s compensation claims by the manual scoreboard operators. Zing!
Fontenot (fon-te-no): Cajun for "scrappy"
So what is the Goal?
What time frame would be acceptable for an average 9 inning Major League Baseball game?
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
Good question
I think two and a half hours is about right. But I love those sub-2 hour pitchers’ duels.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
Again, it's about pace
not so much length. As I said in the OP… a 12-11 game can take longer than a 5-0 game and still be a more enjoyable day at the park.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Right.
It’s those interminable 4-3 games with 18 walks that grate on me.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I don't think I've ever been so unfortunate as to catch one of those
I remember that Dodger — I just blanked on his name — fouling 18 pitches off Clement. That was infuriating, moreso because he ended up hitting a homer.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
And yet, I bet you cheered when Gary Scott did it...
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Looking through the Box scores on the train to work today
The Game Time appears to be strongly correlated to the total number of pitchers in the game. Less pitcher means the pitchers are effective and efficient, means a shorter game time.
So the focus to speed up the game should be some of the rules listed in the OP – less/shorter catcher visits, get relievers in the game faster, reduce coach mound visits (maybe no pitching coach visit for relievers, unlike starters).
I don’t think we need to install pitch clocks, etc – let the umpire control this and the batter.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on May 28, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Couldn't be more right
RiskyBusiness hits it on the nail. The more pitchers, the longer the game. So the focus should be, as he/she says, on reducing the number of relievers per game. Specialization has contributed to rising game times.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
Well, you can't do that...
Again, this gets back to limiting the actual game play. You can’t limit the number of foul balls, relief pitchers or pickoff attempts any more than you can limit the number of runs scored.
I’m talking about speeding up the process a bit.
Again, this might have the effect of shaving — in real time — less than 10 minutes. But it’s the pace.
Baseball will almost never be a 90-minute game, not unless you change it to two strikes/three balls/two outs/six innings.
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Not mandating anything
Just would like to see managers stop using 6 pitchers every game. It’s gotten out of hand.
"They found a delivery in my flaw." - Dan Quisenberry
When Commisoner Doofus and his crack Speed-Up-The-Game committee...
…offer to eliminate the roll-out-the-red-carpet-7th-inning-God-Bless-America extravaganza, I’ll start to pay attention to the rest of their (or these) suggestions. I thought this was just another New York Yankee we’re-better-than-everyone-else happening, but I was at a Dodgers game last week and they pulled the same stunt. Set up some microphones, rolled out a few mats and then trotted out some choir to sing GBA.
And this was on a Wednesday!
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
I'm sick of this argument
Average 2009 NFL broadcast: 168 (2hrs. 48min.)
Average 2009 NBA broadcast: 155 (2hrs. 35 mins.)
Average 2009 MLB broadcast: 174 (2hrs. 54 min.)
Not really a noticable difference. Besides that, I have never watched a game (on TV or otherwise) and wished it would end sooner, except maybe when Hawkins used to close games. Pretty much everytime I hear this argument, it’s football/basketball fans complaining, and i have to explain its the pace, not the overall time, that they are unhappy with. Baseball isn’t EVER going to be a fast paced game, and its not for everyone. Maybe people just need to realize this, and either love it or shut up. Personally, I wouldn’t change a thing.
by thebluecrew1908 on May 27, 2010 5:33 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
You don't have to explain anything to fans here.
“love it or shut up”? that’s just as silly as saying you’ve never watched a game you wished would end sooner. I don’t know that there has been any rule here that would work to limit games, but I admire the effort. You have the luxury of watching NL games for your team like me, I doubt you’d have the same opinion watching Yankees games day in and day out. Perhaps you’d still like them being 4 hours since that average includes both leagues and the AL is of course much longer. I don’t think anyone is excited by watching Sabathia scratch his ass while the team delays to try to get an advantage. I don’t know what the best way to limit that is but I like seeing an effort to do it.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Okay I'll admit
Those comments were a bit extreme. But i at the same time, I went to an Indians-Twins game back in ‘04 that had like 9 walks and took 3 hours and I still enjoyed it through, not to mention I watch the Yankees AND Sabathia every chance I get, because they’re really good and that makes for good baseball. Maybe it’s just something about the game or being at the ball park, but there is no way I’d rather spend my time. And i fear that all these clocks and timers are just going to kill parts of the game, make it something it isn’t. I could be way off, and I’m probably in the minority, but I just don’t feel this is an issue. If i were commish, I’d be way more concerned with implementing better instant replay procedures to cut down on errant calls, THAT’S what grinds my gears, not “slow pace.”
by thebluecrew1908 on May 30, 2010 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Had to do it
so length isn’t always a barometer of excitement
TNWSS. Sounds like a personal issue.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
Funny story
I was on an exchange trip to Brazil and we were on tour bus with our group and our guide, who was a very courtly, elderly man. Very mannered and polite.
We’re stuck in Sao Paulo traffic and he turns to me and says, “This saying, ‘It is not how deep you dive, but how many times you go down’ What does it mean?”
I stammered and stuttered. He had seen it on a bumper sticker in front of us.
My compatriots told me to tell him. I finally said it was a sexual reference.
One of our other guides, a woman about our age, asked me later and I told her what “going down” meant. She got this thoughtful look on her face and said, “That makes sense.”
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Yeah, that goes along with one I saw. It was "Divers do it down deep." Obviously, divers
have a high opinion of their personal endowments.
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on May 28, 2010 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions
Where does Cliff Diving play into this?
Like this?

"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on May 28, 2010 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions
that's not a cliff
but I’ll allow it.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 28, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
want to speed up the game?
pitchers need to learn how to pitch not just throw. Maddux is a perfect example. When he pitched the game was over before you knew it. Too many pitchers just pull back and throw without the control they should have.
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
As I said in an earlier post, too many bad pitchers.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions
That's because of how many teams are out there in the MLB right now.
The talent pool got diluted. Howry wouldn’t be pitching this year 40 years ago…there would be no use for him. It’s a valid argument with no solution.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions
doubtful
yes, the number of teams is quite a bit larger than the 16 teams when I first started paying attention to baseball, but the population pool from which MLB can draw is quite a bit larger, too.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
i think it is less bad pitchers
and more bad coaching coming up starting in little league all the way up to MLB. Too many coaches in high school and college (in particular) either win now or are removed, so they take developing and toss it with the hope the kid can fire ball a 90+ MPH fastball past a kid batting who will never go anywhere. This pitcher feels like he only needs to throw hard to win and be successul., and never learn how to pitch. This falls on coaching IMHO more than the young pitcher.
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
agreed
bad coaching produces bad pitching.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
bad coaching also leads to
injured pitchers. Look at how Nolan Ryan has told the Ranger pitchers they will work deep into games, and he expects them to be able to throw pitches without being on a pitch count. he is expecting them to be conditioned for that. Len and Bob talked about it when the Cubs were in Texas
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
Speeding up games ... I'm being sarcastic here!
But … if I’m the batter … I won’t be able too ……. adjust my jock, tug on my shirt sleeves, spit, adjust my helmet, spit, walk out of batters box, spit …. adjust my batting gloves, spit… step out of box as pitchers starts windup…. spit, get dirt out of eye, adjust batter gloves, spit, tug on sleeves, adjust jock, spit … spit … strikeout!!!
I say make the strike zone bigger… I see more batters swinging at every pitch out of the strike zone then they do when it’s right over the middle. Go figure. Enforce the 12 second rule now in effect. I’m done.
This sounds like the best idea here. Limit delaying by the pitcher and the batter by enforcing a rule already on the books.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree
especially since I said the same thing above.
http://www.bleedcubbieblue.com/2010/5/27/1490028/speeding-up-the-game#38475425
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 29, 2010 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions
you and others make a good point
the batters slow the game down quite a bit, too.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on May 29, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Nomar disagrees
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
“Take me out to the ball game,
Take me out with the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and Cracker Jack,
I don’t care if I never get back”
When I am at a game, especially at Wrigley I don’t want the game to end. The game itself is an escape from realty. What’s the difference if a game goes 2:45 of 2:58
Of course I am a purist, I don’t like the DH, wild card teams, replay review, or interleague games. I still refer to the Diamondbacks, and the Devil Rays. I hate video gamization of the game.
13- Warner, 23- Sandberg, 40- Tillman, 11- Walter
You must have a pretty hard time nowadays...
"That pitch wasn’t down and in, that pitch was down and up." Tim McCarver
by wrigleyrocker12 on May 30, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
i know how to speed it up
1 strike = 1 out
2 balls = a walk
slaughter rule
no more than 10 can bat in one inning
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
Anything proposed by Selig
should be examined closely and assumed to be incorrect or detrimental somehow.
Baseball first, teams second, players third, agents last.
I don't like to tinker with the game too much
but I’d be ok with a No-Pitch intentional walk…just point to 1st base and give it to him.
Limit the number of times a hitter can step out of the box. That’s gotten WAY out of hand.
Can’t they get their signals from the coach like they use to do? Do they have to step out of the box after every pitch to find out “what do I do now”?
Forget these warm-up pitches every time there’s a new pitcher, except in the case of injury.
Pinch hitters and pinch runners are prepared to enter the game, why aren’t pitchers? (probably because it’s a chance to squeeze in another commercial or two).
The seventh inning stretch doesn’t have to be an event and if there is a need to trot out some choir for some special occasion then do it after the game or before.
How long should it take between innings? One commercial? Two? Three?
Limit the amount of dead time due to commercials and the game would speed up considerably. The broadcasters can tell me to buy a Chevy truck while the game proceeds. They usually burn up air time with bullshit anyway, why not be more efficient with it?
Speaking of commercials…look at how much can be said in a one minute commercial.
Do arguments need to be any longer than that? 30 seconds for the manager, 30 seconds for the umpire (MAX). The result is always the same anyway. The horse is already dead before you start to beat it.
Baseball first, teams second, players third, agents last.
Hmmm,
A few things:
High schools have used the no-pitch IBB for a while now, but I don’t see that as necessary for MLB. There are not that many IBBs so eliminating throwing the four pitches is not going to save you much.
Batters still get their signals from the 3rd base coach, but I agree that batters waste a lot of time between pitches with their OC-like antics. High schools out here have a one foot rule, the batter must keep one foot in the batter’s box between pitches. Unlike the no-pitch IBB, this is one rule MLB should copy.
Eliminating warm up pitches is a colossally bad idea … really.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren

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