The Wells May Have Run Dry: Cubs Game Essentially Over After Six Batters
by Al Yellon on May 28, 2010 5:25 PM CDT
in Chicago Cubs Recaps
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PrintThe first thought I had after Randy Wells faced six batters this afternoon and didn't retire any of them was, "Well, Carlos Zambrano is supposed to be stretched out to start. Why not let him go five or six innings here?"
Maybe because Z was under the weather yesterday, Lou didn't want to do that -- or maybe Lou just wasn't thinking. Again. Z did eventually get in the 7-1 Cubs loss to the Cardinals, throwing a scoreless eighth inning with one walk. If it is his final relief appearance -- and it likely is -- Z finishes his bullpen stint with 12.1 innings in 12 games, with 16 hits allowed, three walks, ten strikeouts, one HR allowed, one decision (a loss in this dreadful outing vs. the Pirates on May 14) and a 4.38 ERA.
Lou said in his postgame remarks when asked if this horrific performance by Wells meant that Wells would be the one leaving the rotation, "No", but I don't believe him. This one, Wells' second awful start this month, might make the decision easy.
Here's something else remarkable about today's game: since 1952 -- the length of time that baseball-reference.com has play-by-play data -- there have been 159 games in which a starting pitcher left after recording zero outs and giving up at least five runs. Only four of those games resulted in that team's bullpen throwing nine scoreless innings and in only one of them -- this White Sox 6-5 win over the Athletics on September 27, 1981 -- did that team come back to win.
The Cub bullpen nearly pulled that off today, throwing 8.1 scoreless innings before John Grabow gave up a meaningless two-run homer to Ryan Ludwick in the ninth. Small consolation, I suppose, but give the pen credit, particularly James Russell, who gave up only two hits in four innings, and Jeff Stevens, who retired all six hitters he faced. Even Bob Howry threw an uneventful inning, giving up a double.
The Cubs might have made a game of it had they not run themselves out of a rally in the first inning. It appeared they might repeat what the Cardinals did when Kosuke Fukudome and Ryan Theriot both singled, but then they inexplicably tried a double steal on a 3-2 pitch -- Derrek Lee struck out and Fukudome was an easy out at third. Someone must have missed a sign -- or if not, that was a pretty dumb sign to give.
Aramis Ramirez then walked, but by then all the air had been sucked out of the crowd (at least the Cub portion of it; there was a loud and significant St. Louis minority decked out in red today, along with a few errant Blackhawks fans who forgot that you don't wear your red Blackhawks jersey to a Cubs game when the Cardinals are in town) and Alfonso Soriano flied out to end the inning.
Tyler Colvin -- who Lou said is "telling me he wants to be in the lineup" (Duh!) -- hit a pinch-homer in the fifth for the only Cubs run, the only highlight of a day of unlimited sunshine and the first near-capacity crowd all week (word was there were plenty of tickets available on the street for below face value).
That's really all you can say about a game that was over before the first Cardinal was retired. The Cubs will be facing a pitcher making his major league debut tomorrow, Adam Ottavino. Usually, that results in disaster -- but tomorrow is another day. I'll repost this in the morning, but the Cubs/Cardinals game is Fox's primary game tomorrow, going to 78% of the nation. Here's a coverage map so you can see if the game's on in your area. Or maybe after today, you'd rather not see it. Until tomorrow; go Astros!
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According to MLBTR
Dempster is deferring $3 million of salary this year so the Cubs can pick someone up. Link
Good for him.
One more thing I forgot in the recap: Grabow has to go on the DL. He has to be hurt. No one can be this bad without being injured.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
The only thing about that is Lou can't seem to put Rami on the DL when he obviously needs it.
It’s very optimistic to think he will with Grabow.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh I had no illusions on this having to happen.
It just is more glaring now and harder to ignore. Sadly you are very right. In both cases.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions
ready yet?
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions
For what?
If he’s injured, doesn’t that kind of negate any deal you & I had?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
what?
so you’ve decided he’s injured therefore he is?
it cant possibly be that he’s simply not a good pitcher????
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by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Right.
So a pitcher who has pitched fairly consistent, not great but decent, relief for four seasons is suddenly awful? He’s already taken a cortisone shot in his knee. Clearly to me, there’s a knee problem. He needs to go on the DL.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
he's been awful for four seasons
you’ve just been tricked by looking at stupid stats
he was worth -400k in 2008 with the Pirates, same as this year
his xFIP the last 4 years
4.15
4.55
4.95
5.41
he’s not a good pitcher and hasn’t been his entire career
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by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
But if you look at those stats,
He’s been getting progressively worse over the past four years. So yes, we can say Grabow’s been at his worst this year.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
"To [Vermont Cubs Fan], good luck, stay strong!"
-Captain Richard Phillips-
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 29, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
but you could've said that last year
and thus not signed him….
his 4.95 xFIP last year was an indication he was a replacement level reliever and SHOULD have been one of the many factors that suggested Grabow shouldn’t have been signed to more than a “scrap heap” type contract
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 29, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Okay, look at the difference between xFIP in those years.
4.15-4.55 = 0.4
4.55-4.95 = 0.4
4.95-5.41 = 0.46
While I agree with you that he is replacement at best, his dropoff from 2009 to this year is much larger than his dropoff in previous years.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
"To [Vermont Cubs Fan], good luck, stay strong!"
-Captain Richard Phillips-
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 29, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions
huh?
6 one hundreds of a point is much larger?
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by DartmouthCubsFan on May 29, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
the deal was simple
you’d admit when you were wrong
i said the signing was a waste of money and a horrible one
its pretty evident that’s the case. Grabow’s been worth -400k so far
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 6:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Right, because you knew he was going to be injured.
It’s clear to me that he’s hurt.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
let me know....
when you’re done coming up with excuses
he was bad before the cortisone shot, he was bad after
he was bad his whole career, he’s worse now
make all the excuses you want, he is what he is
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Not. This. Bad.
Frankly, I don’t like your smug attitude about this. There, I said it.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
shouldn't we wait until he goes on the DL ...
before we ASSUME he’s injured? I know that something similar happened with Soriano last year, but still.
Aramis Ramirez probably needs to go on the DL, too.
Not sure why they won’t do this.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Al, as a married man...
you should know exactly how to admit you were wrong. What are you trying to prove here? Everything you’re saying is flying in the face of logic and reason….is this some kind of Lou performance art?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 28, 2010 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't really care for...
… the idea that listing a set of numbers is “proof” of anything. Grabow has been a decent, not great, relief pitcher for four years. Was it too much money? Probably. However, NO ONE should have guessed or could have guessed he would be this bad this year.
To me, that indicates injury, especially when it has already been made public that Grabow had a knee problem. He needs to go on the DL.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
OH. MY. GOD.
I don’t really care for…the idea that listing a set of numbers is "proof" of anything.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 28, 2010 6:44 PM CDT up reply actions 8 recs
Make this green!
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by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on May 28, 2010 7:49 PM CDT up reply actions
As much as I agree with you and Grabow this time.
Color me also an idiot that thinks a set of numbers has to mean something. Sabermetrics and stats can be used pretty much to prove whatever point you want to make and I don’t trust them on face value. The Cards here in the Loo are obsessed with them and post them all the time when they favor their team…and have always been convinced they show their team will hit well, won’t have errors, etc. You need someone in charge that can evaluate a player based on what’s there right now…and the Cubs just don’t seem to have that with Lou and Hendry.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:22 AM CDT up reply actions
This is the most useless talking point the anti-stats crowd trots out
Sabermetrics and stats can be used pretty much to prove whatever point you want to make and I don’t trust them on face value.
Please use advanced statistics to prove something we all think is false, like say that Jeff Samardzija has been a good MLB pitcher in the last 2 years.
People trot out this tired point all the time, but never actually back it up.
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by Wreckard on May 29, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sooo...it's as simple as posting a stat and those are
the only things that back up a logical argument? Since when do humans always perform as their numbers say they will? Stats can tell you tendencies…but those tendencies are frequently wrong for a player or a day. I don’t mind at all you throwing out what you think is right and why…I’m just saying as before that if you disagree and post your beloved numbers, once ought to be enough and posting endlessly with more advanced infallible numbers is irritating since you are interpreting what they mean. Numbers are numbers, not opinions.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Your getting confused.
Since when do humans always perform as their numbers say they will?
Stats don’t say how someone will perform, they say how someone did perform.
Numbers are numbers, not opinions.
Numbers are a reflection of what actually happened on a baseball field. Opinions are based on a person’s interpretation of what happened. But if the numbers contradict that opinion, or the opinion can’t be supported by facts, that opinion has no merit.
But that’s not the point anyway – you said that “stats can be used pretty much to prove whatever point you want to make” which is simply not true. If it was, you’d be able to make a legitimate stats-based argument that Shark is a good pitcher, or that Neifi Perez is the greatest Cub of all time. Those opinions would be dumb and completely unsupportable.
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*You're
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Some guys
are more concerned about being “right,” even if it’s dubious, than anything else, Al.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 28, 2010 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Ἰατρέ, θεράπευσον σεαυτόν
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Didn't Socrates say "gnothi seauton" (know thyself)?
Sorry, I don’t have a greek keyboard handy…and I don’t want to write in symbol font :-)
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Congratulations on recognizing the last word there
γνῶθι σεαυτόν was indeed Grecian, although whether it was Socratic (or even Athenian) is a debated topic. My thought: If Socrates did utter it, I’d say he ripped it off from Pythagoras.
Ἰατρέ, θεράπευσον σεαυτόν (Iatre therapeuson seauton in the Latin alphabet) is a bit more pointed. Medice cura te ipsum in the actual Latin.
“Physician, heal thyself.”
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Maybe that's what Al meant by a "list of numbers"
Pythagorean triples and/or the “Friendly Numbers” first discussed by the Pythagorean school?
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Find me a hypotenuse in Grabow's numbers
Aside from the vectors of his pitched balls off of opponents’ bats, that is. :D
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Yeah, and those are usually the same people hounding others endlessly
saying you’re just so wrong let me show you by digging up 5 million stats to prove it…so they have another opinion to prove correctly. I have to walk away from those, if you can’t agree to disagree in four posts about a topic, its obvious to me that what’s important is making a prediction, not being a fan of a team.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:29 AM CDT up reply actions
and other guys refuse to admit they're wrong, even when it's
obvious. I find that sad as well
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 29, 2010 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Some guys
are more concerned about not being “wrong”, even if there is evidence, NBF.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 28, 2010 6:56 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
So let's see.
Grabow has been horrific this year. To some, that’s “proof” that he was always “bad”?
Or maybe he could be injured. There could be many explanations. Some of them might not be lists of numbers.
Why is that such a difficult concept?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Al that is a Strawman argument
at best.
Most Garbow haters looked at his numbers and thought the price Hendry paid was far too high.
They were right. Even if Garbow was pitching above his career average they would still be right (according to the numbers).
I would agree that in order for Garbow to suck this much something else is wrong but arguing numbers don’t matter really has nothing to do with the very simple fact that Hendry messed up big time with in regards to the 2010 Cubs bullpen and Garbow being exhibit number 1.
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by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on May 28, 2010 7:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Hmm it is a fact that Hendry messed up signing
Grablow for that amount of money. But strawman argument…that’s a silly term. If you think it’s a fact, of course that’s fine. But stats don’t play on a field and everyone is entitled to their own opinion…that Hendry messed up is only a fact because we’ve seen his performance now. Before there was no facts, just stats and speculation. I bet no one would have predicted Edmonds would do as well as he did for us based on his previous stats…which is why I think people should be entitled to an opinion without being ridiculed for it not having stats they like.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:37 AM CDT up reply actions
You... don't know what a strawman is do you
Grabow has been horrific this year. To some, that’s "proof" that he was always "bad"?
That’s the quote where Al uses a strawman. No one who thinks Grabow is bad is using this season to prove he’s “always” been bad.
They don’t need to – they have Grabow’s career stats to prove that.
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Nice new avatar
Better live up to it :P
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
If you think I care what your exact definition of strawman is
you’re very wrong. I think Graybow’s stats do show he’s bad yes…but if someone thinks otherwise then they are entitled to say so without you or anyone else hounding them endlessly to gain the magic of your wisdom. Go ahead and keep posting…I’m done with this.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions
I'ts not "his" definition of a strawman
it’s the definition of a strawman argument…….Everyone’s
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 29, 2010 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Not just "Grabow Haters"
But independent 3rd parties as well:
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/john-grabow-gets-paid/
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i wonder if you view
the educators of children the same way?
When they grade someone poorly do you think they’re more concerned with being right than educating someone?
I’m simply trying to educate someone that the “prediction” that Grabow wouldn’t be very good isn’t something out of this wolrd, it was very easily predictable based on past performance
As a Cubs fan i’m rooting to be wrong on this stuff. But as an intelligent person who understands baseball statistics it was easy to suggest Grabow couldn’t fill the role he was signed to fill, in fact a number of others did.
Now instead of admitting that there was something to this, learning and trying to enhance your understanding or education you’re like a defensive child coming up with all sorts of defenses for why the test isn’t fair
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions
OK.
Maybe I was a little over the top. However, Grabow could have been a perfectly serviceable middle reliever. He has failed in that, and yes, clearly is not worth the money.
I believe it’s because he is injured. You believe otherwise. Neither of us has proof of our position.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
That he isn't on the DL already
is “proof” enough that he isn’t injured right now. You are wrong.
soriano would like to have a word with you
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
by jesus christos on May 28, 2010 9:37 PM CDT up reply actions
So just because one player
avoided the DL, means that every other player who plays bad is automatically “injured”
anecdotal = causation
is the mantra Al sets around here
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 9:40 PM CDT up reply actions
false
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
by jesus christos on May 28, 2010 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions
It isn't what you said, and the assumption
That not being on the DL being proof of anything is just as flawed. Rami is right there for you. We’ve got medical experts saying he was injured yet he didn’t go on the DL. No one can be 100% sure he is or injured now…the DL isn’t a magical indication of anything because there are so many factors in why players are put there as well as options besides using it.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Notice I didn't say PROOF
but i said “‘proof’ enough”… The Cubs have no good reason for keeping a player like Grabow or Ramirez on the roster if they are definitely injured. It’s something other than an injury that the Cubs probably feel he has to work through. Thus, they keep sending him out rather than DLing him.
So his upside is "serviceable middle reliever"
At that price a serviceable middle reliever would be a tremendous waste of cash.
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One only
has to look at Kevin Gregg..last year and now this year to see similar circumstance..
by iowacubfan69 on May 29, 2010 8:46 AM CDT up reply actions
he's also deeply mediocre
guys like that get shelled for a month now and again, especially when they only throw 2 or 3 innings a week.
Grabow was a waste of money and another example of Hendry being hopeless at assessing talent.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on May 28, 2010 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions
He has a severely inflamed
ERA. They can’t see that on an MRI, can they?
Gotta love those soft tissue injuries.
If I have learnt one thing this season it is that John Grabow sucks
He is terrible. I hardly have any confidence in him, and what scares me is I am starting to have more confidence in Howry than I do in Grabow. If I were in the front office or whoever holds the decision for this, I would send Grabow to the DL and call up Jay Jackson or Cashner. Cashner is about to start working from the pen in Iowa, if he hasn’t yet, and Jackson just got put back in the rotation after spending a little while in the pen. It’s been proven that these guys are ready, and who knows, these two guys could be like Russell or Stevens have been so far this season after getting the call up. There’s no reason Grabow should be pitching. Al, I am different were I’m not saying that HR was meaningless because he needs to work on his mechanics every chance he gets, especially in live action. He may be seeing these guys tomorrow, but hopefully not, but he needs to get his mechanics together every chance he gets.
by alabamacubbie on May 28, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not sure what you mean by this
Al, I am different were I’m not saying that HR was meaningless because he needs to work on his mechanics every chance he gets, especially in live action.
… but I agree with you, get Grabow to the DL and Cashner called up.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I was just referring to the recap where you said that
Grabow just gave up a meaningless homerun. I wasn’t really disagreeing with you, but I thought that you made it sound like it did not matter than he gave that homerun up. I just thought that he should have definately worked on some stuff, and not just thought to himself that he was just out there on some mop up duty, and I hope that Pinella was paying attention to his mechanics and will maybe send him to the DL. While I’m on the DL subject, Rameriz should be sent to the 15 day DL. Tracy is batting like .430 or somewhere around there since joining Iowa. It wouldn’t hurt either party to call him up and send Rameriz to the DL and maybe work on some stuff.
by alabamacubbie on May 28, 2010 10:25 PM CDT up reply actions
If Rami to the DL was gonna happen, it should have happened before he played today
Or maybe that’s part of Lou’s Master Plan. Hmm…
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
May I kindly remind you of the days of Glendon Rusch
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Howry wasn't injured
in 2008.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 29, 2010 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions
I LOVE Dempster a lot (always autographs for my kids even when no one else does)
But why should he do this? I mean Ricketts is rich enough. Hell, why doesn’t Sori do it? Or Grabow?
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
I think the word you're searching for
is “return”
It never gets to be easy
by chitownhawkeye on May 28, 2010 6:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Grabow should give all his money to me because I was off work
today and I had to watch this sad pathetic excuse they like to call a middle reliever.
by alabamacubbie on May 28, 2010 11:04 PM CDT up reply actions
I find it's more assuring to go through life acting as though you're owed nothing
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
kind of funny
everyone will clamor about demp giving up 3 million (and good for him) but then in the offseason when i call Grabow’s contract a waste of money (and many others do) they respond with “what’s 3-4 million anyway”
Demp, I was wrong about your contract and how good of a pitcher you are. I love what you bring to the club on and off the field. I appreciate you trying to bail out Jimbo Hendry like the rest of the world is throwing around bailouts, but $3 million isn’t going to do much
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, that's a $6 million dollar a year player
since presumably it would only be for half a season. That’s Jorge Cantu, for example.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I think our pen problems
are small compared to our offense, which is dying with Aramis and Lee.
We’ve got Marmol, Marshall and Russell pitching well. We found Russell on the farm, I think we can find another. I keep saying Casey Coleman would be a good middle reliever, but no one listens to me. We’ve got Cashner and Jackson too. At least one of those guys could succeed.
We need offense right now.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions
we found Russell on the farm ...
we also found Caridad, Berg and (in a slightly different way) Shark. I think a good MLB team can expect about one breakout performance from within its organization each year. We should shop around.
The Dodgers and Cardinals bullpen.
would dispute that idea.
Almost entirely homegrown talent in their pens.
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on May 28, 2010 6:34 PM CDT up reply actions
much quicker than our guys!
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on May 28, 2010 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions
even if the money is spent wisely
it’s not going to be enough to make a difference
and its a wild assumption at this point that the money will be spent wisely
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 6:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Well if we start with the conclusion that everyone is terminally stupid
then we should fire everyone and trade every moving part we can.
But you’ll forgive me if I don’t jump to the conclusion that because the Cubs have made some stupid moves that every move they’re going to make from now on will be stupid.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
cuts both ways
you’re assuming the 6 million will be turned into 6 million worth of value. There’s a long history to suggest otherwise
and even if the 6 million were spent wisely it can’t change an 82 win team to a 90 win team.
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 8:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Then why bother?
I’m not saying that everything is going to be peaches and cream. I’m saying we need to keep trying. I don’t think the Cubs are making the post-season, but I do think that having the chance to make a change if our fortunes change is a good thing.
I’m saying if we can improve our team without mortgaging the future, we should.
You’re saying everyone should just give up and go home. Great.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
not at all
i’m saying there are things that can be done that sacrifice this year’s win total but improve the team in the future. I think those things should be done
like i said trading Byrd to free up flexibility to give Colvin an extended look and let us know if he’s a long-term solution or not. That should be done
an extra 3 million just gives the club more incentive to try to win now and puts more future assets potentially in play to sacrifice. That’s something they’ve done in the past (i.e. Pie) and I’m concerned (i think legitimately, you for some reason don’t) that those mistakes can be made again with the wrong interpretation of this season
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 9:05 PM CDT up reply actions
I think that given Hendry's history, bad and even some good,
That you have to be concerned about any moves he makes that involves trading or signing players. Shuffling minors to bigs is easily changed in the future. And I mean concerned that he’s making the moves….he’s a great person and seems nice enough, but I don’t trust at all anymore that a move he will make will help the team in the future. I’d like to see someone else in charge with things that will affect next season significantly.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm not quite ready to give up on this team
on May 29th.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 29, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
to each his own
I’m just playing the percentages here with my feelings.
according to BP, we have a 16% chance of making the playoffs as currently constructed
But i understand not being ready, etc. Miracles do happen. I’m just outlining ideas that I think would be beneficial long-term to the Cubs when those making the decisions ARE ready.
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 29, 2010 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions
I am a Cubs fan and terminally stupid... ;-)
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Ain't we all?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
We could start CFA...
All to gether now:
Hi, Clutch16
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
No step past #1 has ever made sense to me.
Except #10, but that should be the rule, not the exception, IMHO.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Note he is defrerring, not giving up salary
although I think Demp is a nice guy, I think this is more his way of saying this team needs help, than actually thinking his 3 mil will help the team get a difference maker. We scored exactly 2 runs in 2 days, not good. I can not stand watching this team fail to score with runners on 1st and 2nd no outs. Just sickening. Agree we need a bat more than pitching.
On a more positive note met Rickets today. Very nice guy talking to all the fans. My first time at Wrigley this year and I love the little changes. From a female perspective, the bathrooms are so much better. My daughter said “mommy it isn’t gross in here anymore”. Which I could have said the same about the game.
One thing I could always say about Disney
when they owned the Angels was that they kept the bathrooms (and the whole park) clean. Of course, it helped that no one was at the games.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions
We scored exactly 2 runs in 2 days, not good.
We’re also 1-1 over that same time period. Not good, except in context.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
No, scoring one run a game is not good, no matter what context you put it in
The win mitigated some of the problem, but in a big picture setting, 2 runs in 2 games is always bad, especially since our offense has gone long stretches this season of looking awful already
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 29, 2010 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions
We need offense
but it is available within our system. Put Rami on the DL, see if Tracy can keep up what he is doing or even 2/3 of what he is doing (which would be a +.300 average). There’s a big hole filled. Then get Colvin in everyday. Forget the righty/lefty matchups and get him in. He can even rotate between the three spots. That could be a lot of production without spending anything.
by portlandcubfan on May 28, 2010 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions
hmmmm.
We scored exactly 2 runs in 2 days, not good.
We also shut out the Dodgers twice. Just sayin’.
Forget all that other stuff. I gotta believe.
by drewishdrewid on May 29, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
God Dempster is awesome.
What else can we ask of him to do?
Relief: CHECK
Start: CHECK
Make Jokes: CHECK
Defer: CHECK
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
A couple of years ago
wasn’t he doing Harry Caray impersonations? I suppose that gets filed under “Make jokes”
It never gets to be easy
by chitownhawkeye on May 28, 2010 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions
I love seeing this and completely agree. I'm not afraid to say I have a mancrush on him.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Bring Back Sandberg
to manage and play third. He could probably play third better now than some of the Cubs backup third basemen. I’m only slightly joking about that.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Ala Lou Boudreau.
Kind of funny and cool at the same time.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Despite His Being 50 Years Old
I believe Sandberg could hit at least .180. I don’t think he could leg out too many infield hits, though.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
and ARam has a history of legging out infield hits?
Carlos Silva lemonade: made from freshly squeezed Milton Bradley lemons. -- the Jim Hendry kook book.
I thought I was going to laugh until I puked when Brenly said that
Ramirez hustled into 2nd base on that bloop double late in the game lol When was the last time anyone said that ARam hustled into a base?
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
I'd put Sandberg against Rami right now.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Sandberg Might Hit Better
Okay, I’m being a bit facetious. I don’t know how well Sandberg could play third these days. Then again, Ron Cey didn’t exactly have much range at third for the Cubs. Even with Sandberg not being able to move like he did 28 years ago, he might be able to play third as well as Fontenot. I’m not being too facetious about that.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
That's what I'm sayin. He could hit as poorly and field as well as Rami's replacement.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Gary Scott? Kevin Orie?
Those guys hit better than what A-Ram has hit this season.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Lol. Funny thing is Micah Hoffpauir is in our minors.
Tracy not good enough hitting .500 for you Lou? Mebbe Lopower is…seems to be attractive to Lou.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:31 PM CDT up reply actions
No
You would not.
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by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on May 28, 2010 8:01 PM CDT up reply actions
ummmmm
No he can’t.
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by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on May 28, 2010 8:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah!
A left-handed throwing third baseman! We could have the first since the 1870s!
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Mike Squires
He only played 14 games at third for the White Sox. Squires was left-handed.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Yes
And I think a few other guys have filled in for a game or two. Someone in the 1930s must have played theres, since Squires Wikipedia page said he was the first left-handed third baseman in 50 years.
Checking B-R, Squires started 4 games at third. In the 14 games he played there, he had a grand total of 12 chances.
I think it was done mostly so Tony LaRussa could prove what a genius he was. He had Squires catch a couple games too to prove his genius.
But I don’t think that any lefty has played more at third than Squires did since the founding of the National League.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:23 PM CDT up reply actions
I created a LH 3rd basemen in a video game
just to see what the throwing motion looked like. I was showing my little sister why you don’t see any LH infielders (except 1Bs). He ended up fielding the ball and turning 180 degrees, to the point where he was facing the CF, just to make the throw. It was the strangest thing I’ve seen in a while.
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on May 29, 2010 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Unless I'm mistaken ...
Colvin throws left-handed — which means it would be near impossible for him to play third.
I thnk he should start subbing for Byrd a little
Marlon is having a rough stretch here lately.
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on May 28, 2010 6:35 PM CDT up reply actions
someone owes me a
Vacation day. Not how I like using them up. A 7 – 1 loss.
by cozmotaylor123 on May 28, 2010 5:39 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
Theriot has lost his ability to get on base atm, time to get Fontenot some starts
by Adam U on May 28, 2010 5:41 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Odd that you posted this today
2 times on base in 4 plate appearances. Your broader point is probably correct though. A platoon with both of those guys would be nice.
by JSB on May 28, 2010 5:44 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
LBR should have started
Righty on the mound
Lou said in pre game wind would be helping left handers. Um I’m pretty sure he was there 3 hours before the game started and could have put LBR in the starting line up .
by cozmotaylor123 on May 28, 2010 5:50 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Unless Fontenot could have pitched the first inning better than Wells, what difference would that have made?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
??? impossible to know
Xb hit here or there. Rest for theriot.
by cozmotaylor123 on May 28, 2010 6:26 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
wells
Believes in Hendry and Lou’s philosophy we need to be more left handed. If Font had started Wells would have had greater chi and this would have resulted in 3 K’s in the first inning and a perfect game overall.
Are you saying that Fontenot at 3B
Provides better feng shui? Because of the reeds at 1B and SS, perhaps?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Piniella said he can't get Colvin into the lineup because all the regular outfielders are batting over .300
Well after today Byrd is down to .299. There you go Lou.
Byrd is going to be benched for extended periods of time?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on May 28, 2010 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Byrd needs to play
I think, over Colvin. But he does need to learn to take a walk. I am a big Colvin fan and wish he would play more often. I said before that he should rotate through each position which would give him at least three starts. I also think Tracy should be at third. This is just mind numbing why he isn’t. Theriot is really bad with risp? Need to look up the stats but he seems to hit into alot of dps or fcs.
if we traded byrd....
we’d have room to play Colvin
which is what i’ve been calling for over the last 3 weeks
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by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I think Byrd is better defensively
but with out seeing enough of Colvin in CF hard to say for sure. Saw Byrd in Arlington over last weekend and when he was with the Rangers(live in texas). He really works hard. He was usually out on the field preparing for the game unlike most of the others.
Byrd isn't going to be traded, not now anyway.
But rotating a day off between Byrd & Soriano three or four days a week so you can get Colvin some playing time wouldn’t hurt.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
It's a problem
because our offense really needs an upgrade and Colvin could provide it. The problem is the three guys in the lineup who are producing are Soriano, Byrd and Fukudome. And you can’t trade any of those three.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Can you DH for managers?
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Not in professional baseball
It’s done in amateur ball, but it’s not permitted by the rules of the MLB.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions
That is Crazy!
Sori has been the best hitter this year for the cubs.
You want to sit him 3 days a week?
Why not start theriot at SS while you’re at it?
(This story was produced by BCPDnewservice. Our motto: If you don’t like this story then suck it!)
by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on May 28, 2010 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions
No ONE day a week
Colvin can play all 3 fields and it is not unreasonable for each regular to take one day off a week more or less. That gets Colvin the 2 or 3 starts Lou said he would get back in April. Does not make him a starter but it gives him a few starts a week which he deserves. As a bonus on the day he does play for Sori,we don’t have to waste a bench spot putting Colvin in to replace him in the late innings for defense.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on May 28, 2010 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Just as a salary dump?
Or would you want something else in return? I am not sure I would want to get rid of Byrd just in a straight salary dump.
by JSB on May 28, 2010 6:06 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I hear ya but we gotta do something to wake up this team. Lou won't make the
easy obvious moves like DL an injured player…or keep Grabow on the bench. Or put Colvin in for Nady to start lol. Least a trade could force him to do something. I hope?
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:33 PM CDT up reply actions
I am not sure trading a productive player for nothing is the answer
Moving Z to the bullpen was “something” but it didn’t help because it wasn’t a good idea. Making a bad move just for the sake of making a move is the very definition of dumb.
by JSB on May 28, 2010 8:13 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I wasn't serious about making a move for the sake of making a move.
Just frustrated. I do look for something to force Lou into putting Rami on the DL and getting a hot hitting healthy Tracy in there for a few weeks instead.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:03 PM CDT up reply actions
you trade him to clear flexibility
otherwise Colvin can’t play for 2 years, there’s no room
the difference between me and most others is i dont believe this team can contend for a world series championship this year, so i’m willing to sacrifice 2 wins on an 82-84 win team for a clear understanding of what Colvin can do as an everyday player
otherwise we won’t know for 2 years
Fukudome cant be traded because of a NTC and a 12 million dollar commitment next year, Soriano can’t be traded because of contract
the only way we ever find out what Colvin can do in an everyday role is to trade Byrd. Fortunately because Byrd’s contract is a decent one, he has some trade value and could be sent to a contending team in need of OF help, regardless of market size
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions
I'd rather see the Cubs move Fukudome
Yes, he is playing well, but he is one of the salaries that is a major drag on the payroll. The Cubs could probably get more salary relief moving him that Byrd is due over the rest of his contract. And unless Fukudome has found some new mojo he is just a month away from his July-August-September swoon.
fukudome
has a NTC, isn’t likely to accept a trade to another city where he has to re-establish cultural differences etc, and is unattractive to other teams because he’s owed another 12 million next year
who is going to pick that up?
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by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Now, here's where you & I agree.
He’s been productive enough at the plate, is a plus right fielder, and yes, the contract is one we are stuck with.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Any of the West Coast teams need a RF?
The cultural connections are easier than Chicago, and he will get more interaction with the Japanese media. NTC may just mean that the team needs to be a contender.
for any of those teams that would want kosuke
wouldn’t they be more interested in Byrd who comes with less cost, more flexibility, no NTC, and better production???
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 9:38 PM CDT up reply actions
answered below
i could see ATL, SF, DET interested in OF help
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by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 10:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Most?
Does anyone think the Cubs are contending for a World Series this year? The Cubs aren’t going to sign Carl Crawford next year, and at the price he is going to command I am not sure I want them to. If you want to dump salary, Fukudome makes as much next year as Byrd does in his entire deal. I am all for finding Colvin a spot, but I don’t think it makes sense to dump a fairly cheap asset without getting any value in return.
by JSB on May 29, 2010 2:02 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
it does given the circumstances
1) As I’ve mentioned throughout this thread I dont think Fukudome is tradable because of the NTC and the lofty contract. It’s unrealistic for most teams to take on another 12 million in salary next season
2) By keeping Byrd and preventing Colvin from playing you are essentially doing just what you suggest “dumping a fairly cheap asset without getting anything in return”. You’re not finding out what Colvin can give you so while he’s not getting shipped off the team, you’re getting nothing out of a cheap asset
Given Colvin’s development is far more important than Marlon Byrd’s for the next window to contend, he’s the guy you have to create room for and Byrd is the only guy that room can be created with
As to my “most” comment, I think that’s accurate. I think most of the community views the Cubs as contenders. They don’t view the window as having closed yet, they think this is the last year it can be open.
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 29, 2010 9:02 AM CDT up reply actions
You place a lot of trust in your "windows to contend"
Could you specify when the next one will be for the Cubs, exactly?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
DCF and I don't often agree.
But I see what he’s saying here. There are times in the history of baseball franchises (and other sports too) where a core group has a “window” of several seasons in which it can legitimately contend for a championship, before adjustments have to be made due, primarily, to the aging of the core group.
This is year 4 (2007-10) with this core group. If they don’t manage to turn it around and make the playoffs this year, changes will have to come. Now, I don’t think that means “blow it up and start over”, as some have mentioned.
The good news is that we can already see the future on this team (Colvin, Castro). Others (Cashner, J. Jackson, B. Jackson and more) are on the doorstep. Several contracts end after this season (or next) giving payroll flexibility soon.
I think this group has a shot at the postseason this year. If not, I do agree that changes will come. It’s the scope of those changes that many of us disagree on.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I believe that DCF is saying that the former window closed in 2009
Although he’s not giving up hope that this Cubs team can make the playoffs this year, he’s also not betting the house on it. I’d like to know when he sees the next window opening, in that case…
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
I'm not sure anyone can predict that, because...
… you don’t know what the makeup of this team will be if the current core is, in fact, broken up after this year.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
you can't predict exactly
when it will be and how long it will be open, etc
but you can make educated guesses based on the pipeline in the farm system, payroll flexibility, current assets, and impending FA’s
I think 2012 is a pretty informed guess as a target date. It might take a year or more after that for them to actually develop into WS contenders, but by then we’ll hopefully have Castro in his 3rd full year, Soto at the back-end of his prime, Cashner/Jackson manning rotation spots and down to 62 million in contract commitments, Brett Jackson in CF and opportunities at some of the easiest positions to find in FA open (1B – Pujols, AGonzalez, Fielder are all FA’s in that class, RF)
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 29, 2010 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions
i think the next likely window
is 2012 and beyond
how long that window opens will depend on player development
I’ve kind of outlined this before in some other threads, most notably my monstrous thread on comparing Cubs to contenders, but the combination of young players being ready to contribute and a lot of contracts rolling off after the 2011 season makes 2012 a prime target of a date where a window can be opened
I think 2011 will be a bit of a transition season. I’ve said it before and I agree with Al’s take on this, people need to re-frame their idea of what the word “rebuilding” means. The Cubs don’t have to sell off all assets for junk and tear it up like the Pirates. They have deep pockets and a developing farm system. They just need to NOT extend the contracts of aging veterans and be more tactical in their FA targets going forward
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 29, 2010 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Wow.
You and I actually agree on this.
However, I will put in this caveat: the Cubs aren’t going to sell tickets next year if they have a down year this year AND don’t make offseason moves indicating they intend to contend in 2011 — similar to the Soriano signing in November 2006, they will have to make a statement in the offseason. New ownership can’t afford that.
Thus, IF this season — which I am not giving up on yet — turns out to be a bad one, they will have to have more than a “transition” 2011 before the 2012 and beyond core establishes itself.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
"make a statement"
that would be incredibly idiotic
unless they’re going after Carl Crawford there is NO ONE they should pursue in the next FA class. And to go after Crawford you have to clear at least Byrd and possibly Fukudome (if you believe in giving Colvin a shot)
the 2011 offseason is the one that fits a need with the FA class coming at 1B
the Cubs ownership and organization need to be a lot smarter about this than just appealing to the fan base to “do something”
otherwise they’re doomed to make all the same mistakes they’ve made in the past
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 29, 2010 12:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Mmmm...fallacy
Something must be done! This is something, therefore it must be done!
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Good point on "Rebuilding"
as long as you have a 120+ million dollar payroll, you should never have to bottom out. Look at what Boston is sort of doing this year – adding guys to their group to try to “rebuild on the fly.”
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on May 29, 2010 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Who is going to trade with the cubs for Byrd
While he’s got a three year contract?
(This story was produced by BCPDnewservice. Our motto: If you don’t like this story then suck it!)
by BrewCrew'sPrinceofDarkness on May 28, 2010 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions
only 2 yrs
after this one. Given the 10-12 million on the contract over 2 years i think another contending team that needed OF help might be willing to take on the small cost commitment.
Just thinking off the top of my head here, but the Braves could use some OF help. The Giants need some offense. The Tigers could use some help in the OF if Brennan Boesch turns to a pumpkin (which i think he will).
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 8:38 PM CDT up reply actions
It's a pretty cheap contract
Byrd is not anywhere near the situation we had with Dome or Bradley.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 29, 2010 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Check the stats on Theriot
As of a week ago he was leading the team by a wide margin in BA w/ RISP and w/RISP and 2 Outs
by JSB on May 28, 2010 6:03 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
While this might be
he also is second behind Lee and Aramis in GDP. This is from a guy who, while batting second, should be moving the runner over. He also is second on the team behind Aramis in Rbat according to baseball reference.com.
Did he actually freaking say that?
Holy shit he’s a moron. Never mind that Byrd is something like 4 for his last 35. Because he got off to a hot start, and his average has FALLEN to .300
What a goddamn idiot we have as a manager
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 29, 2010 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Today would not have hurt as much at all to me if Lou hadn't kept Rami on the team
hurt and now impossible to put on the DL without making it 15 full days. And in cleanup to boot. This is going to have ramifications long past this game.
If we had lost by the same score with Rami on the DL and Tracy coming up…its just a bad loss. But not now. We’ll have Nady in there and Rami hurt.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 5:49 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Look....
WKOBDYP?
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Yep, Look, what do you want me to do?
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Losing Aramis for 15 days
would almost certainly help the team at this point. Something is wrong with him and he’s not getting better.
We love you Aramis, but you need to sit for a while.
by Josh Timmers on May 28, 2010 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep I think so. I just knew that Lou had a possibility of doing it when it was less time
Being retroactive. He’ll keep Rami playing now and hurt the team until Rami can’t play at all.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Perhaps
Lou now puts Ramirez on the DL, This way he will have to stay for another 15 days. Is Lou that sneaky? Is Lou that sneaky? Let’s see if Tracey plays tonight or he’s headed to Chicago.
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
God I think this is impossible but I shall be praying hourly that you are right.
Hourly. Book it.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Do you guys really think
putting someone on the DL is the manager’s decision alone? I don’t believe it is.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 28, 2010 6:52 PM CDT up reply actions
No but it IS his decision to let him play everyday, often at cleanup
despite the fact that he flat out sucks. I think we all hope and assume he is injured because there is no other logical explination for this drop off a cliff. He is NOT seeing the ball. Even Lee at his worst was not swinging at balls 3 feet outside the zone and striking out twice his usual rate. A better manager would tell him that he SHOULD go on the DL to figure out what is wrong and get in some rehap work and UNTIL he does he will NOT be starting let alone batting 4th.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on May 28, 2010 7:20 PM CDT up reply actions
I was always under the impression that move was a GM's call
I don’t think you can blame every personnel move in the organization on Lou. I think DL’ing/not DL’ing guys is mostly on Hendry. I also don’t think you can just put a guy on the DL because he isn’t performing. Something tells me the Player’s Association wouldn’t look to kindly on that.
by JSB on May 28, 2010 8:15 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
MLBPA understands the game
If a player “needs” to go on the DL because of a “forearm strain”, they never raise a fuss.
You just shouldn’t DL a guy with contract incentives when he’s approaching an incentive milestone. That’s a big no-no.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Players go on the DL with phantom injuries. I don't see them making a fuss
Over a documented sprain and thumb injury. I don’t know at all if Hendry is holding up Rami from going on the DL, but if he is he certainly is wrong. Rami’s 16 million contract or whatever isn’t helping us when he’s wincing half the time at bat and having such a bad year to boot. A serious attempt at getting him healthy is definitely needed and I doubt anyone thinks he could possibly be 100% with a couple days off.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Did anyone suggest
it was exclusively a manager’s decision?
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
Yeah, a lot of people
have said “Lou should put him on the DL.” Look at this thread.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 28, 2010 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I sure did. I didn't know the GM could hold that up..
I knew he had influence on big contract players especially but I thought the decision was ultimately Lou’s. I sure could be wrong about that. Either way he should be rehabbing not playing and hoping it magically heals doing so.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I thought it was more of a community decision
among the manager, GM, trainer and perhaps the player.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 28, 2010 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I suspect the ususal scenario is
the manager suspects a player is hurting and has the trainer/doctor check him out. If something is wrong and will take some time to heal, the manager tells the GM, “Put him on the DL.”
Whereupon, the GM says, “Sure. Who do you need from AAA to replace him?”
If the cause for the DL is inflamed ERA or shrunken BA, the trainer/doctor step may be skipped.
You really think if the manager of the team said
Hey Jim, ARAM is clearly hurting, OR he really needs to sit out an extended period of time, we need to DL him.
Hendry turns around and goes “Hell no! Keep trotting him out there damnit!”
That’s honestly how you think this works?
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 29, 2010 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions
The funny thing is I actually agreed with using him today.It was better than Lou
using him in a tight game with a lead or tie on the line. Lou’s use of Grabow just irritates me like Rami. You can’t do much about his lineups really…he can’t please everyone. But he sure can put obviously injured players on the DL and keep horrible pitchers out of tight games.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:03 PM CDT up reply actions
What do you guys want?
ARam to go on the DL and try to avoid a repeat of the Soriano situation from last year?
Grabow to go on the DL with an enlarged ERA?
Tracy to be brought up and platooned at third with Baker?
Fontenot to be platooned with Theriot at 2B?
Cubs pitchers to be able to pitch without having to look over their shoulders, knowing the Cubs want to put Z back in the rotation?
The Cubs to fire Lou?
The Cubs to fire JH?
Colvin to play ahead of Nady vs RHP?
What is wrong with you people? Lou knows the way and it is totally working!
We are just fans and we can’t possibly see the game how the Cubs brass sees it.
I am with you Lou, don’t worry about the negitive talk, we fans just don’t know baseball like you do!
Hmm don't have the energy for each one so I'll just say yes.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions
You didn't stay around after we lost today did you? You should have met that
Troll from El Birdos. Bet you could have given him a run for his money.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions
He is an example of why tigers eat their young.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions
I live in Cardinal country now and have to deal with it all the time.
What really sucks is that no matter what the Cubs do, they have the World Series trump card……
I can never win a big argument!
Believe me I will hear it big time tonight…..
Oh believe me, I live here in the Loo and hear it all the time.
When we won the division for two years I had to listen to every argument end with well…so what we have a WS!!!!!!!!!! didn’t matter what the conversation was about. That and well Cub fans are all drunken idiots in a dirty town. I steer clear of most fans besides good friends.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions
They've cleaned up St. Louis?
Maybe it’s nice now. Never once have I driven through and thought, “I need to spend the night here.” Hell, I’ve never once driven through and thought, “I need to eat here”, or “I need to use a restroom here.”
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Well...the downtown immediate area is fairly clean.
But of course you are right they have blight like any town. I am sure most of it is like anything…jealous of your big brother. It’s the only thing I can think of to explain their obsession with making fun of Chicago the City and Cub fans. I’m used to talking trash with Packer fans, Brewer fans, etc. but that’s always just about sports. There’s nice places to stay in the Loo and great restaurants, sights etc. But Chicago sure isn’t worse by comparison.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 7:41 PM CDT up reply actions
St. Louis is a nice-enough city
Like you said, nice places to stay and eat (the Hill is unbelievable), and good places to have a drink or three.
The thing I can’t stand about it is the heat in the summertime. Well, that and the Cardinals fans, of course.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 28, 2010 8:48 PM CDT up reply actions
The hill is wonderful...cool that you know it.
Milo’s bocce garden is a place unlike any other or favazza’s. And I completely agree, being from the Chicago area for 21 years, its unbelievably obnoxious here how they hate on anything Cub related and Chicago. If you ever swing by the loo here try Ted Drewe’s…not that far from the hill and well worth it.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Favazza's is the real deal
Also like Charlie Gitto’s and Cuneto’s. Never been to Ted Drewes but I’ve heard all about it.
There’s a really good Mexican place on Hampton, too. Pueblo Solis, I think?
Two of my closest friends, including my college roommate, live in St. Louis. I make it down a couple of times a year.
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 28, 2010 10:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know if we can talk
until after the Stanley Cup finals are over. :) Seriously, I hope things are better out your way. Can’t wait until they drop the puck; it should be a good series, although I know who’s going to win. ;)
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 29, 2010 12:21 AM CDT up reply actions
I know Hampton but haven't been to a mexican place there.
Zia’s, Mama Campisi’s, and Amighetti’s bakery are other good places to visit. I’d stay away from Rigazzi’s myself…mostly good just to visit for a tourist of the signed jerseys as the food is so so.
Most people from out of town don’t realize Yogi Berra and Joe Garigiola came from the Hill. Or that in addition to being a high point in the city it is called the Hill because a good portion was built over a garbage dump. If you ever get a chance to visit during the soapbox races in the Hill streets its fun to see.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
The fan breakdown around Memphis is 75% Cardinals, 15% Braves, 5% Cubs, and 5% other teams. I hated 2006 when that lucky team won the World Series. Cardinals fans don’t care about 2007 and 2008. I so wanted the Mets to beat the Cardinals in the NLCS back in 2006. I would love for the Cubs to beat the Cards in the NLCS for the NL pennant some year, if not this year.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Yeah me too. It gave their arrogance about everything credibility to them.
Specially with that team being so freaking horrid all year. That should be listed in the dictionary under FLUKE.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Imagine the children
born of a marriage between a Cardinal fan and a Cowboy fan,
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
Cards fans still have nothing on Yankees fans
At least when it comes to arrogance
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
I spent 2 years in Dallas
Their fans are the most intolerable of any I have ever met. The whole town is Cowboy nuts. In the middle of baseball season all the sports talk shows were almost exclusively discussions of the football team and interviews of practice squad players.
If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.
All those championships have something to do with that
"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse
Yes they do and as much as I hate the Yankees, they
don’t irritate me nearly as much. They know they are good and don’t feel the need to rip on Chicago. As I’ve said before, got no problem with saying my team is better than yours, just hate the snide remarks about fans and the city. I don’t have any problem with the Cards saying yes but we have more championships! its a fact…can’t dispute that.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions
Hmmm...probably would look like Bradley and T.O.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions
"Yes" to every sentence that ends with a question mark...
“No” to every one that ends with a period.
Only if Ditka declines.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Took a gameday snap of Byrd's last AB...
but too lazy to upload. Gauging by a plate width of 17 inches, the pitch would have been 8-10 inches off the corner. That should warrant some kind of discipline.
The worst thing about it was there were actual men on base.
If there’s no one on …I doubt Marlon gets as carried away. That ump should be disciplined big time. When the ump decides it makes a difference what inning it is or what the score is or what the team is and makes that obvious a bad call……the league needs to tell him it isn’t ok.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions
That call was borderline criminal.
I was actually surprised Marlon wasn’t tossed, though he sure had a right to be pissed.
Yep and it showed the ump knew it was bullshit.
No way the ump lets him rant and throw his bat and helmet otherwise.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Relax...
Let’s be honest, did you all really think the Cubs were going to beat Carp today? Losing the opener of this series is frustrating but pretty much expected with him on the hill.
I truly do think that tomorrow you will see a much better performance both pitching and offensively. Keep the faith guys!
Cubs will win last two games of the series! This team is starting to figure it out…really reminds me of Lou’s 1st team here!
You will never move forward by looking back....
by By Santo's Grace on May 28, 2010 6:19 PM CDT reply actions
That you TJ?
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:23 PM CDT up reply actions
I was just wondering that myself.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
"To [Vermont Cubs Fan], good luck, stay strong!"
-Captain Richard Phillips-
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 29, 2010 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
God I love the
We were going to lose anyway, so stop complaining crowd. I’m not sure why that crowd wants us to get to the playoffs, since we’re going to lose anyway, it’s a weird logic.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on May 29, 2010 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Why does that little sliver of Michigan...
get the Rangers/Twins game tomorrow… I could understand the UP getting it, but why the east side only?
Hmm...didn't expect a UP television conversation tonight.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Because the Tigers are in the Twins' division.
They do this all the time. There are a lot of people in Houston who don’t really care about the Cubs/Cardinals (since they are out of contention) and would rather see the Rangers game.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Hopefully those maps stay consistent
I live on the west side of Michigan, and have on more than one occasion turned on my local Fox station to find the AL Central game on. I don’t get CSN, so WGN and FOX are my prime Cubs-channel opportunities. ESPN too, but the Cubs seem to have a history of forgetting to show up when they’re on that nework.
Dammit!!
I don’t WANT to watch SEA vs LAA!
"You’re playing a baseball game. You’re not playing Tiddlywinks. There is competition, for God’s sake."— Lou Piniella
Grabow gave up a meaningless HR?
It just means he is getting worse by the week.
Can’t believe we invested $6 mill in this guy.
If you think you've seen it all...just wait!
by CubFanSince1970 on May 28, 2010 6:44 PM CDT reply actions
That's been my thought since the season started.
But Lou and Hendry have 6 million reasons to wait until he destroys more games.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions
7.5 million
for the sake of accuracy
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 8:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Ugh. Now I'm more depressed about him lol.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Prayers: I don't believe in them, but here's one:
Please bring up both Cashner and Jackson to the team, and please dump Howry and Grabow.
I’d also say bring up Tracy and put Aram on the DL.
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Yes please
um can Lou go for a long rest in Flordida too?
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on May 28, 2010 8:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Those sound good...just add Hendry tagging along with Lou.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Nobody panic: The Savior Carlos Silva is pitching tomorrow!
A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.
I wonder who will remain when Z comes back to the rotation?
"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.
Braves AAA pitcher throws no hitter
To tired to do a fanshot but Todd Redman of Gwinnett pitches a no no tonight.
On a side note David Patton is still with the Cubs ( I assume he easily passed waivers after being taken off the 40 man roster) and still sucks.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
Hooray?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Hmm...seems to be about all I'd have.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Grabow proved his "worth" again as he
gives up two runs in a no pressure inning.
At the present time we have:
ARam = Miles
Grabow = Patton
So things are looking more like 2009 as we have two dead weights on the 25 man roster..
The ARam problem can be fixed. Lou should have forced him on the DH, instead of rewarding him with a start AND hitting clean up. Why can’t Lou say, “Rami, you are on the DL back to last week. I suggest you work with Rudy and figure out your swing or you will rot on the bench the rest of this year.”
When push comes to shove, it seems that Lou lets the player push him around. I think Sandberg as manager would not put up with this crap. A young Lou would not have put up with this crap either.
Carlos Silva lemonade: made from freshly squeezed Milton Bradley lemons. -- the Jim Hendry kook book.
Still harping on the "Rami won't talk to Rudy" thing?
Find me a news story about that and we’ll talk, ’k?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
I think he's talked to Rudy myself and regardless at this point he needs time off.
Waiting for him to magically pick up some part of his stance or pitches isn’t helping. He needs to rehab and get healthy so there’s no reason to worry about his health.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree
except that Patton is not RH.
Lou is in a tough position. A-Ram has a very good REGULAR season career track record.
In most years, he is the one you want up with the game on the line. Like Al’s Grabow injury opinion, I believe Ramirez has been injured in spring training lingering from last year, and just is not the same player.
Personally, I would just like to see him batting 7th until he either figures it out, or just gets less playing time starting in July (unless the thing is over).
I just do not believe Lou is getting “pushed around” it is just standard protocol with the old-school managers.
You & I don't often agree.
But here, you are correct. Ramirez is clearly hurt. He needs to go to the DL — should probably have gone on today, so they’d have had an option to bring him back a week from now. Having played today, he’d now have to miss two more weeks.
They have to do something. Maybe Baker is OK to play tomorrow, but better, get Tracy up here so there’s someone who can actually hit.
And if Cashner is ready to go to the pen, get Grabow to the DL. Something’s obviously wrong with him.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Someday, Al
we will have the interactivity to allow fans to run the team!
Actually, we agree more than you think. You acknowledged after my Fanpost and more failures that indeed (for whatever reason) Grabow just is not very good and Marshall is the best LH option.
Marshall has been an outstanding setup man this year.
Marmol has been an outstanding closer.
It’s the other five bullpen slots that have been trouble.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
well yeah that's the problem I have with it.
I know the money and the role he was expected for is the reason he’s pitched so much…but Marshall has been good, the other 5 slots horrible…but tell me Russell hasn’t been better. Why not use Russell instead of Grabow…have them switch roles is what I’m saying. something other than throw out Grabow and hope he magically improves.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:40 PM CDT up reply actions
except
Al was in favor of the Grabow signing when made…. so we’d be in the same spot
follow me on twitter for fantasy sports analysis @http://twitter.com/DrewDinkmeyer or get the full analysis at www.fantistics.com
by DartmouthCubsFan on May 28, 2010 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions
As I have been saying.
I was in favor of the signing. Was it too much money? Probably, yes. However, if Grabow had pitched anywhere close to his career level, the Cubs would have received SOME value from the deal. Because he’s been so bad, they have basically received none.
I believe that is because of an injury — which has already been partially acknowledged (knee problems). Get him to the DL already.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Sounds great to me. Anything that could help him we CAN do is good.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:20 PM CDT up reply actions
It's the "lingering from last year" bit I don't get
Rami dislocated his left shoulder last year. This season, he showed up to ST and sustained an injury to his right triceps. Now, one could make the argument that throwing or batting is a full-body motion and that discomfort somewhere equals discomfort everywhere, but in this case, that’s really stretching it.
As I said to a Cardinals troll earlier – accuracy. Rami’s got problems, yes he does, but not a one of them stems from the injury he sustained to the completely other side of his body last year.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
And you know this
as fact?
You know he declined surgery to some I know, including an orthodedic surgeon friend of mine, believes he may need.
I think the right tricep injury may be worse than the shoulder problem.
Remember, he came back from the shoulder problem and had a good second half. These two months have been horrific.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Well, I did leave myself an out clause there
No, I don’t know that it’s a fact. As much as I’ve loved on the dude, I’ve never sat down with him over pasta and had a frank discussion about his injury history. Or performed a physical examination. All I know of Rami is from observation of his play on the field. It’s possible that a popped left shoulder could lead to a right triceps injury via overcompensation. Likely is a different matter.
If he was a pitcher, I could see the point of arguing this, but the Cubs ain’t that desperate. Yet.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
I listened to the Royals game tonight.
It was more interesting.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
By Red Sox standards,
That game was very interesting.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
"To [Vermont Cubs Fan], good luck, stay strong!"
-Captain Richard Phillips-
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 29, 2010 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL
No, it’s not. In the context you used it — in that rant — I didn’t think it was necessary. That’s all I was trying to say.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
You know what really sucked..ok not like putting Rami in there...
oh never mind. I just get grumpy seeing us get reamed with a horrible call that could have stopped us from getting close to the Cards…and knowing if we make a stink about it we will be laughed at by other fans since we lost so badly. Hate seeing cheap calls affect us even when we deserve to lose.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Washington.
.
Washington.
.
Washington.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
So?
Have you noticed that Washington is actually a good team this year? And have you also noticed that in the wild card standings, as of this moment, there are three teams with 25 wins, three with 24 and the Cubs with 23? Thus, with a three-game winning streak, they could probably pass five or six teams?
I repeat: the NL is an almost unrecognizable mass of similarly flawed teams. If the Cubs can correct even a couple of those flaws, they can win a playoff spot.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
i definitely noticed
how many teams are at or near .500. the wild card races are WIDE open, imo…
by brian custer on May 28, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions
You sure don't have to worry about hearing about Washington with STRASBURG playing so close to ESPN.
I turn on the radio and I’m constantly updated about him coming soon to the big leagues! I’m sure we know what kind of dog he has and the toilet seat he poops through. Washington is better than last year…but I think we have yet to see if they are going to be a contender or not.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Strasberg does not poop.
He has a personal assistant that gives him a daily colonic.
Carlos Silva lemonade: made from freshly squeezed Milton Bradley lemons. -- the Jim Hendry kook book.
That's *gotta* be a Soutern Cal thang...
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Maybe the Cubs can be
the MLB version of the Philadelphia Flyers?
i want the cubs to win
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
by jesus christos on May 28, 2010 9:25 PM CDT up reply actions
= sigh -
AS I have said, I have picked the team for 79 wins at the beginning of the year.
My only request would be that if the team is substantially behind with too many teams to climb over even for the Wild Card, that management get value for the few valuable pieces with expiring contracts, or say – a certain starting former Cubs Ace – and players that need “changes of scenery”.
The worst thing would be for things to be status quo when/if it becomes obvious to most that the year is pretty much dead (although if NBF was running the team, it would not happen until the team was mathematically eliminated! lol – love ya Bruce!) and Hendry makes the decisions too late to pull the trigger.
LOL
Flyers in 6!
You wouldn’t want to see the Cubs battle back from the brink to get the title?
Funny
I see that series going the other way in the same number of games. I like the Flyers’ style – fast and hard-hitting. I think it’ll give the young Hawks some pause, in fact. But I also don’t see their defense (and goalkeeping) to be nearly as devastating as the Hawks’. In the Finals, that’s what counts, and I’m happy to predict Chicago in 6.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Tomorrow
The boys better bring their hitting shoes, because I have a feeling this is the game that Silva gets beat around a little bit. Make the rookie throw strikes, and then pound him. Need a win.
Scott Bora$ is satan.
by Canadian Cubs Fan on May 28, 2010 10:14 PM CDT reply actions
Got that right. And I love your sig.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 28, 2010 10:33 PM CDT up reply actions
There's been a lot of predicting that "this is the game that Silva gets beat around a little bit" over his last 8 starts.
Got anything besides a “feeling”? Scouting reports? Matchup splits? An inside line on which ump is behind the plate? Anything?
Me? I’m gonna let our 6-0 veteran go against some dude making his major league debut. Granted, those last 7 words haven’t exactly been kind to the Cubs in recent years, but the last time I put cold, hard American currency on them, I did win.
I’m betting the Cubs do too, for tomorrow at least.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Nothing more than a feeling....
and you’re right, I’ve had the same feeling in previous Silva starts, and was glad to be wrong. I’d be happy with 6IP 4 Runs. The Cubs should score 6 at least today off the kid and Cards pen. Is the kid a rightie? If so, Colvin in the outfield, Fontenot at 2nd with Theriot riding the pine.
Scott Bora$ is satan.
by Canadian Cubs Fan on May 29, 2010 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
I was saying got that right to need a win.
I haven’t liked people predicting Silva will mess up myself…sure it could happen but why predict it…unless for the sheer joy of being right. Anyway, I sure hope he wins the battle today.
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
and you know this how?
Carlos Silva lemonade: made from freshly squeezed Milton Bradley lemons. -- the Jim Hendry kook book.
Scarlett O'Hara
Total babe.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Just watched the first 16 pitches of the game - Now, I will feel sick for the rest of the day.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
The other Cubs' pitches are pretty decent, though
Except Grabow’s.
There should really be a macro for that phrase. Like I hit Ctrl-Shift-F, and it just pops up “Except Grabow” in the comment box.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
by Clutch16 on May 29, 2010 3:44 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I saw the last 3½ innings yesterday - the first 16 pitches (watched this morning) were terrible.
The bullpen did hold the Cards for the most part, and if the offense had clicked a bit, maybe they could have come back, but that was not to be.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
LOL I like the Grabow function. Wonder if Al could make that happen...
"Everything has an end, except a sausage, which has two."
by Sandberg's evil twin on May 29, 2010 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions
And Brendan Ryan really needs to lose those socks
Seriously.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
In fact
Caption: Mike Fontenot (right) shields his eyes from the Horror Which Lives on Brendan Ryan’s shins.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
famous last words
bring on the cardinals by al yellon.everyone knows we cant beat carpenter.who knew the game would be over after 6 hitters.as good as this team is playing they are starting to look like a team that might win 80 games.MIGHT.just a continuous battle to get to 500. that they are losing.grabow is horrible and should only pitch in these type of games.and can colvin play once ina while??
Except...
Al can use punctuation and grammar. I have no idea what you were trying to say and I read it three times.
Kinda awe-inspiring, ain't it?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
thats how NOMAR rolls
eric hanna uses caps, NOMAR uses no puncatuation and spaces
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
by jesus christos on May 29, 2010 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions
Between the two of them, they kind of even up.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Why the hell didn't Zambrano come in to releive Wells?
We’re trying to stretch him out, and get him back in the rotation. And, instead we have to use our whole f’n pen in the first game of the series, before finally using Zambrano in the 8th.. Great f’n management Lou.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Plus the fact that Lou won't want to use Zambrano
tomorrow and possibly today because he is supposed to start next week. I have been puzzled by so many things this season and not using Zambrano for multiple innings in what appeared to be the perfect spot is just another one.
The only reason I can think of...
… was Z’s illness the day before — maybe he couldn’t have gone more than the one inning he did.
Otherwise, yes, that would have made perfect sense.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Probably didn't need any more mound there?
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
He came in to pitch late in the game.
If his illness was a factor, then he wouldn’t have played at all.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Not necessarily.
You don’t think the exertion of pitching, say, six innings, wouldn’t have been more taxing on someone recovering from illness than throwing one inning?
I do.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Micheal Jordan won a championship game while playing with a stomach flu.
"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)
Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)
.
Actually Lou just used up Russell & Stevens
Everyone else should be available and he did not touch Marshall or Marmol. He really did not waste the pen, he mostly gave guys he never lets out a chance to pitch a few innings. I confess I thought Russell’s arm would fall off since I imagine it has been a LONG time since he threw that much. MAYBE it will show Lou he can use him more. 5-0 is not an insurmountable lead especially in the first inning and the kid shut down the Cards for 3 innings. It was pretty impressive.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on May 29, 2010 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree with you
The Terrier was impressive.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Four innings, actually...
… since he got all three outs in the first inning and came into the game with nobody out and a runner in scoring position.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
oops
Russell really deserves kudos for making a really bad day slightly better. Coming in
with minimal warm up and no real expectations of pitching that long and shutting down the Cardinals is really amazing. He single handidly kept the Cubs in the game.
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on May 29, 2010 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions
If Piniella intends to start Zambrano on Monday, he should not go in for a long stint on Friday.
An inning of work would be close to normal between-starts throwing. 3-5 would push his next start back to Wednesday. Plus, if Z did 65 or so pitches in a simulated game last Monday, a long stretch on Friday would be short rest.
But ... but ...
Lou should have known Wells was going to get blown out in the first inning Friday and had Z ready to go! Fire him!!! He’s “senile” and doesn’t care!!!
(Sorry for taking the TJ exclamation points and overdosing on them.)
by Not Bruce Froemming on May 29, 2010 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
The Sat game is on Fox. Buck and McCarver.
So, we got that going for us, which is nice. /s.
Formerly known as BleedsbluinMi.
"You ain't a beauty, but hey you're alright. And that's alright with me" - The Boss
Unfortunately, I live in Twins country
And so I will be treated to that game instead.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Damnit
Two Cardinal homers. I enjoy Buck’s football work but he and Tiny Tim are unbearable come baseball time.
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on May 29, 2010 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
And why no one will ever nominate "Yellow Submarine" for their Favorite Album Ever
“Pepperland Laid Waste” Dreck.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
I wish I understood this comment.
But I don’t.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Dreck is German for dirt (or in some cases a synonym for "Mist") - Intentional or cowincedence?
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Completely intentional
I’m going through the Beatles’ oeuvre on Shuffle. That song came on, and for some reason, I thought it appropriate to comment on it.
Having listened to a couple of more tracks from the album, I’m left wondering why they released it at all.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
And I have just now deleted the entire Yellow Submarine album from my hard drive
OK – I understand it’s a score. But it’s a horrible, horrible score to a crap movie. Do Not Want.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Also
Dear Beatles-
I hate that you ever tried jazz. Ever. You hurt my brain.
Love and kisses-
Clutch16
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
After doing what Germans would call "dairy maid calculations"
I’m not sure how high my KoolAid dose needs to be today:
1) Assuming that Silva has a 50% chance of winning a game, then a 7-0 record has a ~7.1% chance of occurring.
2) Assuming that Silva has a 50% chance of winning then he has a 50% chance of winning today.
Of course with enough KoolAid, I know the Cubs are going to win one way or another, so maybe I should just stop being worried.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Upps: ~7.1% should of course be ~0.78%
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Remember
The Cubs could conceivably win this game without Silva getting a “win”. The Cubs are 8-1 in Silva’s nine starts, and the only loss was April 9 in Cincinnati, Silva’s first Cub start, a game in which he threw well (one ER in 6 IP) and left with a 2-1 lead. The bullpen blew that game.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Oh Al, how could you mention the bullpen... ;-)
I’m really looking forward to seeing that white flag with the blue W in about 7 to 8 hours.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
You're being charitable
How often do you see a rookie being left on the mound in the late innings to fester, rot, die, and then give up a GS?
Caridad blew that game, plain and simple.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
In other words Silva should already be 7-0 and 8-0 would be a ~0.39% chance...
More seriously, Silva has been a really pleasant surprise and I look forward to seeing him pitch today with a forecast 13km/h (c. 8mph) wind blowing in from right/center field.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
There was a fairly strong wind blowing in yesterday.
It won’t be as strong today.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
According to MLB AtBat yesterday it was 15mph blowing in from left
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
That sounds about right, although...
… I have noticed that in general, the wind speeds in boxscores tend to be lower than it actually feels in person.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I may have a new Jump phrase
“Komm, Gib Mir Deine Hand”
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Komm! Gib mir deine Hand! - Gefällt mir...
Correct capitalization is an important part of German spelling & German Grammar requires the exclamation marks as well.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Someone didn't study enough...
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
I've always found the German version very funny.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
It kinda cracked me up, too
But just because all the syllables lined up so nicely.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
They surprising little accent, but it still sounds wrong.
If we want to do German jumps: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLTWTKpP7g0&feature=fvw
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
They have surprisingly little... My kingdom for a proff reader.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Do *not* mess with me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uE-1RPDqJAY
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Do *not* mess with me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYwiDHKJ-7M
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
or NSFW
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TH0iYA9zZuk
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Srsly
“They taking the hobbits to Isengard!” Just play that 3 times in a row and you will find a terrible new way for your brain to be occupied in its downtime.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
YouToube says: This video is not available in your country.
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
You lucky bastard
The classic it is, then: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Sorry but "This video is not available."
What do I need to search for?
A more “positive” piece of music : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IY3DBPj8xY
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
I've always got a trump for Kraftwerk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=855QLTV2Rj4
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Sounds a bit like Laibach
Two “goodies” for you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhM_e1gbAZQ&NR=1
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxnMIDFvq0k&NR=1
And if you don’t know Laibach:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3776gcqY_gE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3SvjSu4R-8
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
The first one has similar visuals
But sub-par guitar.
The third one is hilariously awful :D
Just to keep up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiYG8l3-15E
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
Whoever wrote the lyrics can't spell... Or I'm missing something.
Time for dinner here → Chicken wings with baked with Hungarian peppers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5mlb3Bjzs
blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhTCYqJsfqs
See you later in the pre-game thread.
Eamus Catuli
Go Hawks
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
Speaking of the pregame thread,
Where is it? I just checked, it hadn’t been posted yet. I know FOX Saturday baseball is carrying today’s Cubs game.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
"To [Vermont Cubs Fan], good luck, stay strong!"
-Captain Richard Phillips-
by Vermont Cubs Fan on May 29, 2010 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll remember that :D
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
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