Some Disturbing News About The Cubs Clubhouse: Cubs vs. Brewers Preview, Thursday 6/10, 1:10 CT
by Al Yellon on Jun 10, 2010 11:30 AM CDT
in Chicago Cubs Game Threads
Email
PrintI could write a lot of things about the final game of this road trip, but this one seems much more important than anything else about the current state of the Cubs.
Last night in one of the game overflow threads, BCB reader tomas 21 -- who has been a member of this site since 2005 and with whom I have exchanged emails many times -- posted this bombshell:
I have a contact with access to the Cubs clubhouse. He said the clubhouse is a disaster right now (maybe this game will help). He said the latin players, led by Ramirez and Z, have completely walled themselves off from everyone else, to the point that they wouldn’t let them team haze Castro in the typical rookie fashion (carrying bags, etc). He said Ramirez has completely shut down, refuses to practice, and is barely willing to take the field for games. The team never turned on Soriano, despite all his struggles, because he worked his butt off, but the team is turning on Ramirez, because he doesn’t, and doesn’t see a problem with it.
Since this was posted here last night, I received an email from tomas21 this morning elaborating further on this situation and given what he told me -- and I will not repost the additional information here -- I have absolutely no doubt that what he told me is 100% correct.
Here's my reaction to this: it is yet another reason Lou Piniella needs to be replaced. The manager has to be in control of his clubhouse and team! This is the kind of thing that we used to see and complain about when players' manager Dusty Baker let the inmates run the asylum. Any good leader would stand up and say he wasn't going to put up with this kind of behavior. Apart from today's starter, Ryan Dempster, the Cubs don't really have a lot of player-leaders -- they didn't after 2003 under Baker either, with predictable results -- and this may be one reason they re-signed Bob Howry, who has a reputation as a good clubhouse guy (and who is actually throwing decently since his reacquisition).
Either stand up, Lou, and end this kind of nonsense, or go home to Florida. You aren't leading.
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Dave Bush has had a rough year and the Cubs love hitting him. They scored nine runs in less than four innings against him on April 25 at Miller Park, including four home runs (Kosuke Fukudome, Derrek Lee, Geovany Soto and Tyler Colvin). Since the Cubs seem to have brought their HR-hitting ability to Milwaukee, let's hope that continues today.
Ryan Dempster has already defeated the Brewers twice this year, including April 23 at Miller Park, where he allowed only one run in seven innings. Prince Fielder, Ryan Braun, and Demp's old teammate Jim Edmonds have all homered twice off him, in 28, 30 and 27 career AB respectively. Keep the ball in the park, Ryan, and you should have a good day.
Today's game is on WGN and FSN Wisconsin. Here is the complete MLB.com Mediacenter for today.
Baseball-reference.com game preview
Please visit our SB Nation Brewers site Brew Crew Ball. As always, be careful over there.
Today's first pitch thread will be up at 1 pm CDT, and the overflows will post at 2:15, 3:15 and 4 pm CDT.
Discuss amongst yourselves.
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I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.
This news makes me feel sick.
I was really hoping it wasn’t true.
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
it makes me sad
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions
I want to add
that I still hope it’s not true.
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
by katie casey on Jun 10, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
It makes me sick, and sad, and I hope that it is not true.
However, I wonder if Lou is even aware of the issues in the clubhouse. Every time I have seen Lou in the dugout recently, he looks vacant and lost—like he is completely out of touch with everything—players, the game action, his staff. I do believe that it is his job, and his obligation, to manage people in the clubhouse, as well as on the field, and if he can’t, or won’t, or doesn’t know how to do it any more, he needs to go.
The sad other side to the story is that Lou manages multi-millionaires, who know that given their long term contracts and no trade clauses, that they can pretty much behave however they want in any situation, and they will not be punished or penalized. They know that they will go on making big bank, and Lou is the one who will be villified in the press and eventually fired, since they cannot be fired. The players have no obligation to do anything.
by Mrs. Zeke on Jun 10, 2010 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
you know that is a very interesting point
I hadn’t thought about that.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions
That's exactly the point.
If the manager is this out of touch that he doesn’t even know about this, much less do something about it, he has to go.
I wasn’t in favor of it before, but maybe Bob Brenly is the right guy for fixing this mess.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
*Palm to forehead*
Dear god, not Bob Brenly. Unless he is a stronger, smarter manager than broadcaster, I don’t think he is it.
Have you watched him in the dugout?
I think Lou is clueless about just about everything these days. Either by choice, or by other reasons, I think he just doesn’t know.
This is really shaky evidence to base your assumptions on
Even if I agreed with you (I don’t), you don’t think one of the coaches would at least let him know?
He may be clueless by choice
It makes things easier. Just like a parent who doesn’t look too closely at what their child does, because they really are scared to know what is going on, Lou may be choosing to turn his head so he doesn’t have to deal.
Lou may be choosing to turn his head so he doesn’t have to deal.
Dusty Baker, Tony LaRussa, and Bud Selig approve of this method.
"One of the things I like about baseball is that between innings you can go to the restroom.'' ~Manny Acta.
by Goodie1969 on Jun 10, 2010 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It's possible.
Not probable
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Clearly the man who didn't know Theriot hasn't had a walk in forever
is a man that always has his ear on the rail.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
As they always told us in Boston
“Don’t [relieve yourself] on the third rail.”
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
that is a myth and not true
urine never holds a solid enough stream, unless you are about 3 inches from the rail
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
@Cubbie-tim
Would you be willing to take a chance?
A question, if I may
I received an email from tomas21 this morning elaborating further on this situation and given what he told me — and I will not repost the additional information here
Why the withholding of information?
Source probably
Protect the guy from being reactively disciplined by the club
"Manny Trillo is coming in to pinch run. You know, for a lot of teams, you would pinch run for Manny Trillo." - Harry Caray
I doubt it
the manager is more concerned about his reoccuring dreams of sunny skies and warm sand, than what’s going on in the clubhouse. Unfortunately, Bradley is not here to continually throw under the bus.
"Is there any truth to the rumor that the Bears gave up their first-round pick in 2011 for the decals?" - Someone registered as the DailyNorseman at PFT suggesting the Bears gave up picks in order to get Gaines Adams tribute decals. Stay classy Minnesota fans!
Well, it's just that (for you) the phrase "Bob Brenly as Cubs manager" is the same as:
We have met the enemy and they are us! ~ Walt Kelly, Pogo, 1971
I too hadn't thought of it that way
What is it with the CUBS organization. They’ve locked themselves into those long term contracts and no trade clauses. It’s kind of like what got our country into the MESS it is in now. IE: (This is how I see it I could be wrong and have now desire to get into discussion about this part) Housing market prices dropped people jumped on the houses at the reduced prices. Then interest rates went back up and those FOOLS that bought houses were screwed because interest rates jumped up. Jobs went to hell since our country was no longer producing. Finally, people where in the screwed with their credit cards etc.
Now back to the main subject at hand the new Ricketts ownership find a field mgr who can take the HEAT. Lou tried but for whatever reasons things ran dray when the going really got tough that all their is to it. Time to call it quit Lou before your great career as a ML manager goes through the sewer. HAMPTON VA, CUBS FAN
Wow.
Housing market prices dropped people jumped on the houses at the reduced prices. Then interest rates went back up and those FOOLS that bought houses were screwed because interest rates jumped up. Jobs went to hell since our country was no longer producing.
There are so many things incorrect in these 3 sentences I’m not sure where to start.
This post was prepared as a service to the BCB community. Neither BCB nor any of its employees makes any warranty, expressed or implied for the accuracy, completeness, or usefulness of said post. The statements of the author expressed herein do not necessarily state or reflect the views of BCB and should not be taken as anything other than an opinion. Above post has no cash value, and is invalid in MA, VA, and Puerto Rico.
Its hardly news
its a completely unsubstantiated rumor from someone who has “contact” with someone with “access” to the lockerroom…please.
Lou has to go for many reasons, but to base it off something as unfounded this is misguided
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Jun 10, 2010 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Fair enough, although Al does call it "news" in his headline.
I was actually more referring to the “news” that Al believes this story to be true and the source reliable. Tomas 21’s post was brought up in an earlier thread where Al mentioned that he would address the topic. Wasn’t sure where he stood on the “rumor.” I trust Al’s judgement enough to find his opinion that this could be true to be disturbing so when I read this my initial reaction was to feel sick.
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
Something doesn't make sense
Aramis barely willing to take the field for games doesn’t sound like a player who would hide an injury to prevent going on the DL … don’t think both can be right.
Any reason given for Aramis’ alleged change in behavior?
My guess
It’s an ego thing. He’s struggling and he’s always been able to fix himself. Now that we have a respected hitting coach, people are pushing him to go get help, but Aramis feels like he’s good enough of a player (and rightfully so, he has been) to fix himself, and he feels hurt. As a result he’s acting out.
"Baseball is almost the only orderly thing in a very unorderly world. If you get three strikes, even the best lawyer in the world can't get you off." ~ Bill Veeck
by Musicdude10 on Jun 10, 2010 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Just wondering (not accusing)...
but did Rami exhibit any of this “me” behavior when he was playing in Pittsburgh?
We have met the enemy and they are us! ~ Walt Kelly, Pogo, 1971
Aramis Ramirez absolutely has to go
He was one of my favorite players, but they really need to get rid of him. If he doesn’t care, he deserves to get the boot. Piniella gets some blame too, but it’s pretty hard to put the genie back in the bottle when it comes out.
RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).
Although he can be very irritating to watch,
I respect Soriano. He gets paid the big bucks, yet he still works hard.
"That's life, that's what all the people say.
You're riding high in April,
Shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune,
When I'm back on top, back on top in June."
- Big boy Frankie
by lexmarklover on Jun 10, 2010 11:39 AM CDT reply actions 9 recs
I appreciate that a lot more than someone who quits on his team
Sosa did it a few years back and now Ramirez seems to be headed down a path of disgrace as well. The sooner the Cubs dump him, the better.
RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).
I agree.
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
by katie casey on Jun 10, 2010 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Probably the only saving grace of this story--Alfonso Soriano works his ass off.
I’m glad to read that. He may hop and not have the best baseball mind at times, but he’s a hard worker, and the $136M doesn’t change that.
MAKE IT GREEN!
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
true. I have new respect for Sori, if this information is valid and I have no reason to doubt that it isn't
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Did you ever think you'd utter err type those words?
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions
no, maddy
I’ve never been a great Sori supporter… now… time to reconsider
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
me either
But Soto’s two HR’s last night sure made me happy. My half asleep boyfriend commented maybe he’s good again :)
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions
love to hear that
I am hugely distracted this week so not following at all. Your Soto news makes me a happy camper.
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
We are moving in a week
I have lots of things I should be sorting or cleaning…….. not logged into BCB.
So I totally understand.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
we both have separate apartments about 20 minutes apart
and are moving in together….. into a new apartment.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
opposite way
about a mile west of Target in Fitchburg.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Given that this is the first I have heard about this anywhere, from any source,
I shall remain cautiously optimistic and wait for future developments.
"If I did not laugh, I should die." -- Abraham Lincoln
by Mondodude on Jun 10, 2010 11:41 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
That's a good way to approach it.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions
The AV Club continues to inform my vocabulary.
"If I did not laugh, I should die." -- Abraham Lincoln
the comments seem dubious at best
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jun 10, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
You don't need a source for a quote on the situation...
…to believe it first. It’s been going on for a long time now. I’ve been pointing out since late 2008 the issues with the Cubs “chain of command” approach to baseball management both in the dugout and in the clubhouse and the repercussions it will eventually have on a team and now…
here we are.
Jack
derv
@themightycub
if you are predisposed to believe something
you probably do not need verification
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jun 10, 2010 5:27 PM CDT up reply actions
I trust Tomas21, he's one of the few originals still around here.
Anybody with a UID in the 600s has been here quite a while—I’m only 900 or so!
Anyway, this makes a bit of sense, considering Zambrano’s level-headedness (sarcasm). I don’t really see the point, however. Aramis has been playing like pure crap from day one—it’s not like he’s playing great and not getting playing time, or some new punk kid was called up to replace him at 3B. There’s no real justification for this behavior—yeah, we suck, but everybody pretty much sucks this year, and if two guys that was to be blamed for the suck—it’s 100% Aramis and Zambrano. So they can wall themselves off—maybe they can wall themselves off to not playing anymore considering how much damange they’ve been doing to the team. Build that fort, boys, it’s better for everyone if you’re hidden in it.
Dan
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
I had an SAT score of 1100....
I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.
COASTIE!
We don’t take SATs in the midwest! Get off my lawn!
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
by dtpollitt on Jun 10, 2010 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
rec'd
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions
I took both.
SAT and ACT. Maybe it’s because those schools in the coasts wanted SATs…
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
You're ruining my fun here...
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Well, as a coastie-grad, I must defend it.
Though, truth be told, I don’t know why I had to take both.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I took both and went to school in Wisconsin, so
coast has nothing to do with it.
"You've got to get your damn shirts rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass. That's what you've got to do. Period." -- Lou Piniella
Mine too :(
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Terribly OT: SAT and ACT
Someday, I actually hope to post about baseball again, but I got my out-of-state tuition and $500 per semester scholarship from Mississippi State University because of my SAT scores. I also took the ACT. However, in 1991, State did not accept SAT scores from students in Mississippi. I have no idea why that was the case. Only ACT scores were accepted from those in Mississippi back in 1991.
"The big possums walk late." - Harry Caray
Arbusto:
Since May 05, 2007 – UID: 2679
Just go to the user’s profile. It’ll be in that blog-specific box.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Let's me know how long somebody's been on the site, usually.
The “new” BCB cross-over happened March 2008 so I use that as BC/AC.
Man I gotta get out more.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Just don't confuse an UID with an IUD, in which case for THAT
you look in a WHOLE ’nuther area…
We have met the enemy and they are us! ~ Walt Kelly, Pogo, 1971
actually the way some of us post, those areas might be pretty close...
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
I remember that happening
I had been a member since almost the beginning but I had to re-enlist a couple years ago
Are UIDs anything like IUDs? Just asking...
and JUST KIDDING
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Less painful
or so I’ve been told…
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Question.
What is the UID system? I joined after it ended.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
Preparing to hike to the summit of Mount Washington in New Hampshire on Saturday, June 12....
State high point count: 2/50
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Original numbering system for BCB then SBN members.
Lower the number, longer you’ve been apart. I believe if you join a blog with low membership you’ll still get a UID, but I’m not certain.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Makes sense.
Thanks for explaining it.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
Preparing to hike to the summit of Mount Washington in New Hampshire on Saturday, June 12....
State high point count: 2/50
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
I thought they were talking about some kind of birth control..
but I guess thats a IUD..
Favre-enfreude
The thrill of seeing an epic Brett Favre fail. Derived from schadenfreude - satisfaction or pleasure felt at someone else's misfortune.
My UID is 462
So when I tell you that the Cubs are on the verge of trading Aramis Ramirez to the Yankees for Alex Rodriguez straight up, do you believe it?
One thing I don’t ever do is take something I read on a blog as fact. Especially when it’s “Al heard from Tomas who heard from such and such who’s cousin sells watches in the Venezuela to Carlos Zambrano’s brother.”
Elements of this may be true, but seriously? Everybody hates Ramirez now?
Wow, I can’t wait to see who Cubs fans are hating or what they’re ranting about over the next couple of years, because this team is not going to be very good while rebuilding.
THE FONZ HAS ARRIVED!
Do you expect a serious conversation or retort to emerge from this?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
yes
actually I really don’t understand how people are automatically assuming this to be factual. Sure there may be tension in the clubhouse…..the team stinks. Sure maybe the latin players hang out together….why not?
But now all of a sudden everyone is calling Ramirez childish? He has been one of the most productive players on the field since 2003. Don’t we want to wait until more information is released before we start booing a guy for slumping?
THE FONZ HAS ARRIVED!
You can get away with a lot of things when you're doing well
Such as Aram’s propensity to not run out grounders. When things aren’t going well, the sharks come out.
I suppose so,
but is this really any different from any other club house in MLB?
I don’t know the answer to that, because I’ve never been a professional baseball player. But it sure does seem people are getting worked up over ARAM quite a bit.
Al, I don’t get it. You will jump on people all the time for posting things through third party sources, but when I question this I get slammed.
THE FONZ HAS ARRIVED!
BECAUSE YOU WANT HIM TO REVEAL HIS SOURCES
WHICH IS AN INSANE THING TO ASK FOR. MAYBE IF I TYPE THIS IN CAPS YOU WILL UNDERSTAND.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm fine with Al not revealing his sources.
It’s the lack of independent confirmation that irks me.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions
And as Americans...we all have the right to never be "irked"....file a lawsuit or shut up.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
I believe you're mistaking discussion around the topic of this thread for fact.
Just because we are talking about the issue doesn’t mean it is true, nor does it mean we all believe it. It was the discussion point of this thread, thus I’m talking about it.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
I don't know if it's factual.. I hope not.
My point in all this is that I find things interesting to learn that MIGHT be. I also don’t believe all the things I read in the sports page.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
What do you think now that Bruce Miles claims this isn't true?
He doesn’t need a source. He’s IN the clubhouse.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm waiting for an independent source to corroborate it before I believe Bruce Miles.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
to be fair
he said he also talked to another writer.
If there’s one beat reporter that I trust out there, it’s Bruce Miles. He’s never been that shy about voicing his opinions on the team, through either his blog or through other avenues. Sure, there’s lines he can’t cross, but he’s as good as it gets for beat writers.
I hope he right
But your obsession with a blog NEEDING TO BE 100% verified I think is silly. It’s Al’s blog and he can post what ever he wants. If you don’t like it…. you don’t have to read it. Just like I don’t read your posts b/c I’m not into sabermetrics. I don’t go into your posts and tell you how you should write them.
"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland
And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Just because Bruce is in the clubhouse, doesn't mean he knows everything that goes on in there.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
by Al Yellon on Jun 10, 2010 5:05 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
He is in the clubhouse 100% more often than anyone else in this thread
Yourself included.
This post was prepared as a service to the BCB community. Neither BCB nor any of its employees makes any warranty, expressed or implied for the accuracy, completeness, or usefulness of said post. The statements of the author expressed herein do not necessarily state or reflect the views of BCB and should not be taken as anything other than an opinion. Above post has no cash value, and is invalid in MA, VA, and Puerto Rico.
True.
It still doesn’t mean he sees everything or knows everything that goes on in there.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
We can't know everything
therefore this must be true.
Wait, what???
This post was prepared as a service to the BCB community. Neither BCB nor any of its employees makes any warranty, expressed or implied for the accuracy, completeness, or usefulness of said post. The statements of the author expressed herein do not necessarily state or reflect the views of BCB and should not be taken as anything other than an opinion. Above post has no cash value, and is invalid in MA, VA, and Puerto Rico.
I should have expected you to twist my words again.
I didn’t say that. I only said that Bruce doesn’t see or know everything that goes on in the Cubs clubhouse. Neither do the other writers.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
more credble than someone who is not in the clubhouse wouldn't you say?
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jun 11, 2010 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions
@amaru
Could it be possible that Ramirez is so deep in the hole that he doesn’t see any way out, and that this is causing so much anxiety? Something like that could make a team dysfunctional. It is sort of like how kids would feel if their always-reliable parents were no longer able to cope. The team’s best hitter is reduced to .159, and it is June 11. He would have to be on a hot streak for the rest of the season just to recover.
My uid is in the 100's
so do you believe me when I say that I know someone with a contact in the Cubs clubhouse and they’ve informed me that it’s a relatively normal atmosphere this year?
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Do you expect a serious conversation or retort to emerge from this?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
I'm hoping for one. Then again, I also was hoping the Cubs could compete this year.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
of course not
but he obviously can’t grasp the fact THIS IS A BLOG. He obviously thinks that one needs multiple sources to report anything about the Cubs.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
That, and Shawn (and amaru) are taking something as simple as me describing a UID as the sole stamp of approval I need to lay fact to somebody's claim.
Talk about a worthless discussion topic, and a complete twist of semantics.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
I like you anyways
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
No, that's not the point.
The point is that people here jumped at this rumor without much verification. And it looks like the rumor was probably a false one.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
If this was reported anywhere else you'd believe it. Like by a reporter.
Because it’s on a blog it has less face-value, which I call a fat BS on.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Sure,
then why doesn’t Al reveal his source?
THE FONZ HAS ARRIVED!
Why the bloody hell don't everybody release their source?!
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
You guys really don't get this
do you?
Facepalm.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
didnt we have
a similar discussion last year? Look when a journalist has an inside source that could get fired for talking – they tend not to reveal the source, unless they dont want to be a journalist anymore – you also have to realize that Al has written a couple of books on the Cubs and was able to get a picture taken on the field with a desk – so I am guessing he has some inside hookups…
Sipping the Kool-Aid since 1982 - Kinda
Currently 34,839 on the Season Ticket Wait List - Expected age of being #0: 119
Okay
I understand that.
But, I remember other people getting flamed here for posting trade rumors without sources.
But that’s not really my main point. My main point is that ARAM should get the benefit of the doubt here. The guy has been a stud for a long time and now he’s being canned by fans over a rumor which cannot be proven or disproven.
THE FONZ HAS ARRIVED!
If you admit
that this is a blog and doesn’t need multiple sources, then you must adjust your reaction. I have no problem with this being posted and discussed, but given that this is a blog, people shouldn’t be immediately switching their beliefs and throwing Ramirez under the bus based on a third hand rumor.
Also, while we're at it
the heading shouldn’t say “disturbing news”, more like “disturbing allegation” or “disturbing report”
this isn't reporting "anything"
it’s a pretty big accusation
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm the king of Peru!!!
hey look I just said something I wanted to say!!!
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Depending on how low your UID is
shawngoldman may think what you said is true.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Now, I certainly don't think that.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Talk about twisting one's argument around.
I was being sarcastic.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Take you awhile to come up with that?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Sorry, I have a life.
I’m not going to reply to everything within 30 seconds.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions
So you wanted to reply to me once
and then again 10 minutes after your first reply?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions
What the hell is your point?
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions
You have a life and aren't going to reply to everything within 30 seconds
when you already replied once, and then again even later. Your second reply was why I asked if it took you awhile to come up with that.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm honestly confused by your argument.
I truly do not understand your point.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Ugh, there is no argument
Look, you responded to something I said. Then, as if you thought about it for awhile gave a second reply to something I said, which is why I asked if it took you awhile to come up with that. Your response to that was, you don’t have time to reply to posts right away, when you had already replied to the post.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh.
No, I just thought it would be good to further elaborate my point. That’s all.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions
These are grown ass men, Al.
Lou Piniella isn’t completely innocent but if these idiots on this team don’t stop all this nonsense then this whole damn team needs to be broken up. The whole damn team.
Team chemistry was such a factor last year when Bradley was here and everyone blamed him for the lack of chemistry on the team. Now, if Ramirez is acting like an ass and NOT busting his ass like he should be doing — I hope the Cubs cut his ass.
If Zambrano is also part of this mess… he needs to take his act somewhere else too. I’m so sick of this overgrown child acting like he’s 15 when he’s 29-years old. These are grown men. If this turns out to be true, then I really, really hope we back the bus up and start a new team because if we are segregating this clubhouse like it’s the damn 1960’s — this whole team needs to look themselves in the freakin’ mirror. Insane.
Maybe next year is finally our year.
by Unique on Jun 10, 2010 11:44 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I call BS on that.
A manager’s job—besides making pitcher changes—is to keep clubhouse tempers in check. I don’t care if they are grown ass men, they should be kept in line by the manager.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
They should.
But if players are gonna seperate due to ethic/culture reasonings and being just flat-out childish, you have a hell of alot of growing up to do.
Maybe next year is finally our year.
This is always true
but, Unique, maturity is NEVER a given. I am a manager and I have to contend with all kinds of behavior from people of all decades. It is a matter of leadership … the folks watch the boss and emulate one way or another. Indifference on the part of the boss = shenanigans/indifference on the team. Boundaries/standards from the boss = snap-to-it-tiveness on the team. People will take the slack that’s given or not, grown up or not.
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Yeah.
I understand that. Maturity is never a given. You do wish that guys would have more morality than that.
Guess I shouldn’t be too surprised considering today’s society, huh?
Maybe next year is finally our year.
human nature, alas, regardless of century
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Its Kevin Millar's Job to keep the clubhouse in order
So where the heck is he?
by cozmotaylor123 on Jun 10, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions
MLB Network
keeping Reynolds away from the interns.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Allegedly.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
To a degree
If they’re acting like this, Piniella already dropped the ball. Now you really have to break this team up because it’s just downright ridiculous.
RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).
It is.
Sad really. So much talent on this team and if this IS true.. they all need to go. All involved.
Maybe next year is finally our year.
If true....
… yes, some of the team needs to be sent elsewhere.
In the meantime, it is the manager’s job to fix stuff like this. Not only has Lou not fixed it, he doesn’t seem interested in even knowing about it.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
You're forgetting one thing.
Lou Piniella is the manager of this team.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
Preparing to hike to the summit of Mount Washington in New Hampshire on Saturday, June 12....
State high point count: 2/50
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
With that beard thing going, it even looks like Lou's on vacation.
by TheGrinch13 on Jun 10, 2010 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions
On vacation? Where?
Under a bridge somewhere with a bottle of Dark Eyes vodka in his grip?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions
I picture Lou as more of a Thunderbird man myself...
…or maybe some Ripple.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
You know what
he definitely is a Thunderbird or Wild Turkey man. Lou with that beard looks like he’s ready to walk the Earth…
but first he’s going to stop at the 7-11 parking lot to pick up cigarette butts.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland
And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic.
by ClarkFan on Jun 10, 2010 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Great analogy
That might be my new sig line
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions
It is obvious these are not "grown ass men"
There are children in this clubhouse with a manager who will not lead.
I think it is clean house time, lets just see if Ricketts will step up and get Lou to the door first, and maybe some players to follow.
Sad
Great info Al. I’m not entirely surprised by the news (if true). Ramirez has had a terrible year and it sounds like its getting worse. “Quitting” while making millions just is not OK.
No one should be surprised that this club lacks a leader. This club is a rudderless ship, looks good when going well but with any trouble its a huge mess.
I make alot less than Ramirez
and I wouldn’t quit on a damn thing. He should be busting his ass out there to win ballgames.
Maybe next year is finally our year.
Two of our best players (well, at least before this year)...
…completely quit on their teammates and/or create massively bad chemistry in the clubhouse and you use this to add another log on the “let’s burn Lou at the stake” bonfire?
Nothing about ARam or Z or anyone else involved – this is all on Lou? I have a hard time believing that’s what you believe, but when that’s all you say on the BCB front page bully pulpit, I have to take that at face value.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jun 10, 2010 11:45 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I completely understand
your point. However when money and contract are involved it is tough to move these players to another team. I have supported “Z” for ever, but his act is getting old. I finally would not have an issue on moving his tail if a team would take on that money.
That's been Al's MO as of late
And I don’t think he’s completely wrong in saying some of this falls on Lou, but that’s not really a concern to me. When guys start acting like this, it takes more than a managerial change to fix it. It usually takes a change of scenery as well.
I would agree with that concept.
In the meantime, the inmates are running the asylum. That’s not the way to make a winning team. We found that out with the last manager. Why repeat it?
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
and select another Div II player nobody has ever heard of?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
If that is their destiny.
"One of the things I like about baseball is that between innings you can go to the restroom.'' ~Manny Acta.
It's not zero sum, ballhawk
but it is a situation that can be easily managed. I give Lou all kinds of benefits of doubt but this one is 100% on him. It’s not easy managing these situations, but it’s crucial that you stand up and do it.
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
So get rid of Lou and all our problems are solved?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
No.
Get rid of Lou and one of our problems are solved.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions
but at this point
Who could come in and fix any of this mess? I think it’s past point of no return with out w/ Lou.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Let me ask you this...
while this mess is getting “fixed”….do you want Lou managing it?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions
About as much
as I want BP continuing to “fix” their problem.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I didn't say that
I have loved Lou and have refrained from the debate. This situation, however, if true, and I think it is, requires energetic management. I don’t know what’s going on with Lou and for all I know he may be addressing this… if not, then yes, he needs to go. Problems solved? Not by a long shot. When these issues come up it takes at least a year to bring it all back around. Just ask Coach Taylor :-)
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Understood
I just don’t like the fact that Al brings this issue up and puts it out in a much bigger light, lays it totally on Lou, and does not say word one about the two alleged ringleaders in this fiasco. Next thing you know, there’ll be pictures of Lou playing a fiddle while Wrigley burns…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Leads me to ask... have you managed?
I mean that honestly… when it comes to teamwork, upstarts, and moving forward…. it’s ALWAYS on the manager. The upstarts are the symptom… therefore it’s up to the manager to address the situation.
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Emelie
Although I understand your point. I am far more curious about two alleged ringleaders in this fiasco.
Lou being a bad manager isn’t new.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, I have
and while managers have a great deal of responsibility, they are not the complete end-all. Sometimes the workers do get fired.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Totally with you there
There are times when you need to fire the popular guys for the obvious reasons and deal with the fall out;
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Or the UNpopular guys for that matter...
(cough) name redacted (cough)
Just curious, is his name on BCB officially “name redacted” now , or is it an honorary thing like HWSNBN?
We have met the enemy and they are us! ~ Walt Kelly, Pogo, 1971
It's an interesting situation
Where the manager is making much, much less than the employees who are problematic. How do you discipline someone then? Send him to the bullpen? Wait…
Maybe we need Billy Williams to tear ARam a new one...
…the way Dawson did to HRam. Oh heck, once the housecleaning begins, just bring Dawson back anyway. Or maybe Sarge…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
It's not all on Lou, but a decent amount is.
I coach high school baseball – obviously, it’s not Major League Baseball, but there is still a lot of player management that occurs.
If a Manager can no longer control the personalities in the locker room, convincing the player(s) to pull the same direction, he is no longer effective. And once one player realizes that the manager has lost control, it’s easy to lose a few more.
Now, I certainly wish Ramirez and Zambrano would act like handsomely paid, grown men. And to the former, I think he’s been one of the best Cubs in the last 40 years, easily. I don’t know the reason for his acting the way he has (wounded pride, injury, etc.), but it would certainly be troubling to me if one of my anchors seemingly shut off the manager and stopped “holding the rope” with regards to the rest of the team.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Some of it is on Lou
If he was more engaged, it probably wouldn’t be as widespread – it would be easier for some players to say, “I’m here for the team.” Lacking energy from the manager, players go looking for “leaders” in the clubhouse.
But even with stronger leadership, some house cleaning will be needed. With a strong manager in place, fence sitters will come back to playing hard but not everyone will.
If this is true
Lou needs to be gone first and fore most. Then if I am not mistaken Ramy has a option on a contract next year, he will never opt out because he will never put decent enough numbers for any team to offer him good coin.
But it is obvious Lou has no control of this team, none. I do not expect Bob Knight in the clubhouse, however, can someone just take charge of this mess.
You can still move Ramirez
It would be harder to move Ramirez than Bradley was. You’d once again have to take a player that someone doesn’t want.
RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).
I'd take another Carlos Silva
"Brant Brown...DROPS THE BALL!!!!"
by cubswgnrocks on Jun 10, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think it would be harder
He is only under contract for one more year as opposed to Bradley for two. Also, he has been a productive player throughout his career while, Bradley has been a problem child everywhere he has been. Ramirez value hasn’t been totally destroyed yet and nobody yet knows we have to get rid of him. With Bradley we advertised to the world that he couldn’t remain on our team.
by JSB on Jun 10, 2010 12:17 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
let's slow down a moment
if we can’t get the facts—obviously more to the story, how are we expected to comment without talking out of our arse?
However, I will tell you EVERY single clubhouse is constructed just like the Cubs. Latinos hang together in one area, blacks hang together in one area, whites hang together in one area, and I wold be willing to be Asians would be more inclined to hang together if multiple Asians were on a team. This is HUMAN NATURE, not a dysfunctional clubhouse.
Aramis is embarassed and hurt. Nothing else to see why he would “shut down” at this moment of the season. I would love to understand more detail regarding Ramirez—if he is hurt like many suspect, of course, he won’t be taking extra BP. Latin players protecting the “younger brother” in Castro—not earth-shattering either.
Lou should be citicized for his poor job of handling the on-the-field failures and debateable in-game strategies, not because like player congregate with like players.
by socalbob on Jun 10, 2010 11:45 AM CDT reply actions 3 recs
Aramis is embarassed and hurt
Aramis is embarassed and hurt playing like shit and acting like a baby because of it.
There, fixed that.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Glad to see you fixed your CAPS LOCK key as well
I was starting to worry about you…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
not gonna discount your choice of words
either. You don’t know and I don’t know. If he has worked at getting out of his slump and not seeing any results and his body is not letting him work even harder, then maybe he’s had enough and just said “F*** This!”
I know, it's a reach.
Even if Tomas21 is correct—and I’m not saying he is and I’m not saying he isn’t—it’s a big reach to pretend like we know what’s going on in the clubhouse. Seems more likely than not, however.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
I'd buy that
I just don’t see “the team” turning on A Ram. I see a lot of bad clubhouses and chemistry problems on Loser Teams.
DOesn't sound like that to me.
Sounds like the two guys that are a vacuum of suck in 2010 are walling themselves off. Other way around.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
didn't read it that way
he said the Latin players, led by Z and ARam, have walled themselves off. This is not earth-shattering. Every clubhouse in every sport has players from similar races hanging together.
It’s easy to point out because of the greatness of suck-itude from Z and A Ram on this season.
Yep, dt, you nailed it. I gave him the benefit of the doubt right up until this point. Diva.
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
BAM
Yes.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Absolutely true.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
Preparing to hike to the summit of Mount Washington in New Hampshire on Saturday, June 12....
State high point count: 2/50
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions
However, I will tell you EVERY single clubhouse is constructed just like the Cubs. Latinos hang together in one area, blacks hang together in one area, whites hang together in one area, and I wold be willing to be Asians would be more inclined to hang together if multiple Asians were on a team. This is HUMAN NATURE, not a dysfunctional clubhouse
Ok, the source said the team is basically segreating the clubhouse and the latin players won’t let others haze Castro, assuming because he is “one of them” and they have to protect him.
All that crap is bullshit. I’ve played ball before, and I’m black, and I’ve played at a college university. I hung out with all guys in the clubhouse, once my teammates put that uniform on — I don’t give a rats ass about their damn skin color, or where the hell they came for. When they put that uniform on, that represents US — they are my family. I did not hang out with the blacks just because I was black. I loved every single one of my teammates no matter what. That’s a society issue within it’s self. If this crap is true… all of the people involved need to get their ass in check and stop acting like an asshole.
Maybe next year is finally our year.
I don't see this having to do with race
I see this as prima dona’s. I won’t care if they were white, black or orange. Or choose who to hang out with based on salary.
It’s that two prima dona’s and their friends have choosen to act like asses
(If this is indeed true)
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
@madisoncubfan
It could be that the latin players are anxious about recent Cubs activities, and are trying to deal with their angst. There are some things that can be talked about in Spanish, that have no English equivilent. Trust me. I am fluent in five languages, Spanish being one of them, and Spanish allows more expression of feelings. Rami’s slump, and the call-up of Castro both involve latin players. Then there is the superstition regarding Fontenot. All baseball players have superstitions, but the players from the Americas believe albinos to be good luck. Fontenot got the short end of the stick when Castro got called up ahead of schedule, so this could also play into the problem. Usually latinos are less clannish than other ethnic groups.
It may or may not be based on demographics
But what is troubling is some players closing themselves off from others. That’s NOT how TEAMS work. Anyone here besides MPH73 here remember who Havlat’s buddies were in the Blackhawks clubhouse just 3 years ago?
Remember Lang and Koci? They were the ’Hawks Czech-Republic representatives. They closed themselves off from other ’Hawks players & created strife within the team. One guy taking exception was Martin LaPointe ex-Red Wing. He nearly took Havlat apart in a dressing room skirmish. While LaPointe was beyond his better playing days, the other 3 guys were jettisoned. Havlat not until last season since he had a large contract and injury issues leading into 2008-2009.
The moral of the story is the Blackhawks got rid of the bad attitudes. Khabibulen was also not the best team mate at times. He’s gone too but also for salary relief in this cap era.
In came great team mates like John Madden and Marion Hossa. In came good role players like Tomas Kopecky and up-and-coming stars like Niklas Hjalmarrson.
For the Cubs, players like Ted Lilly, I’d love to see him stay here because of his attitude AND capability. If he can’t perform, they move him. If he can perform, resign him if the money is here. Same goes true for the good guys like Byrd and Demp. D-Lee is tricky because IMO he’s in decline.
Simply put if Rami and Z are club house (OK, here comes that word) cancers, they MUST GO.
You don’t have look any further than what my other favourite team at 1901 W. Madison St. to see how far great players with great attitudes can take you.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Pfft
Yeah, that’s fine all, but did anything GOOD actually happen with the Blackhawks? Huh?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Dunno, let me go check on that, eh?
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions
totally agree with what you're saying but it's a little bit tougher with baseball than hockey or basketball
if only because baseball, while considered a team sport, is really more about a collection of individual efforts. The nature of the sport itself just doesn’t lend itself very well (relatively speaking) to teamwork when compared to hockey, basketball, or football.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Oh, of course so
What I’m more referring to as teammates is intrinsic support from one another but still your point is well taken.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions
The issue isn't that they hang out in different "cliques"
But that now there seems to be animosity between said cliques.
Uh oh... could we have a "North Side Story" situation in the making?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Interesting lineup today
Fukudome, Theriot, Byrd, Tracy, Nady (1B), Colvin (LF), Soto, Castro, Dempster
"That's life, that's what all the people say.
You're riding high in April,
Shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune,
When I'm back on top, back on top in June."
- Big boy Frankie
it's absolutely bizarre how Colvin went weeks without a start
and is now suddenly, in there damn near every day.
I guess I'm just a worrier, that's why my friends call me whiskers
by Nunyabidness on Jun 10, 2010 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
Glad to see Riot in the 2-spot!
in the 2-spot!
in the top of the order!
in the lineup!
playing!
Glad to see Riot!Glad to see.
Dan
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
at least he's not leading off
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes because his first pitch swinging is much better in the two spot
"I am not ashamed to say I love Greg Maddux" - Jim Hendry
Me either Jim
by Doggie Stalker on Jun 10, 2010 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
True
But I’d still rather have Dome up if Castro on base than Riot
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
His bunting ability is amazing
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
That's Ryan Theriot's full swing you're talking about.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Oh, silly me!
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Now if Fuk reaches
We get to see other teams get double plays
Exciting
Maybe that’s the only way we can get on sportscenter
"Baseball is almost the only orderly thing in a very unorderly world. If you get three strikes, even the best lawyer in the world can't get you off." ~ Bill Veeck
by Musicdude10 on Jun 10, 2010 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions
no Lee, Aramis or Soriano
Not exactly the lineup we were envisioning three months ago.
And not only that,
but actively wishing it so!
"If I did not laugh, I should die." -- Abraham Lincoln
What a stupid line-up.
Typical, don’t care, randomly pick people line-up.
Why sit Lee after he hit a home run yesterday? Does he always sit people when they start to get hot? I almost expected to see Soto and Byrd sitting today after their performances yesterday.
Why is Tracy hitting ahead of Colvin? He just got called up from AAA and he’s hitting clean-up?
Nady is horrible this year, but keeps batting in the middle of the order. Lou needs to stop it already.
Theriot has no business batting at the top of the line-up. How about getting Fontenot in there for once?
Again, this is a typical, don’t care, who cares if we win line-up. I don’t expect anything to change, however, because it seems like Ricketts isn’t paying attention to what has gone on with this team’s management for the past two years.
by TheGrinch13 on Jun 10, 2010 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Hehe
Does he always sit people when they start to get hot?
See Colvin, Tyler and Soto, Geo
"Baseball is almost the only orderly thing in a very unorderly world. If you get three strikes, even the best lawyer in the world can't get you off." ~ Bill Veeck
by Musicdude10 on Jun 10, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
am I reading the Onion?
“Woefully Underperforming Team Not Having Fun in Clubhouse”
shocking!
by neifi on Jun 10, 2010 11:50 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
You, too. could write for America's Finest News Source!
And that may be some of it. When a team was expecting to win and loses, players are likely to get surly at each other. After 2008, the Cubs must have been continued success and have been, well, underperforming. A manager can’t completely fix that, but he can push it in a more positive directions. Lou seems to have checked out when the team started faltering last August.
eerrrrrr.... wow?
"A waist is a terrible thing to mind." - Terry 'Fat Tub of Goo' Forster
by eths on Jun 10, 2010 11:53 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
So the Cubs players are racists?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 11:53 AM CDT reply actions
Haven't you been banned yet?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
You simpleton. You still haven't figured out that our very lives are a symbiotic relationship.
You’re the Skeksi to my Mystic.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions
I swear if Dan says another stupid comment....I'll post the picture of us.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions
::Places braided blue hair into SWL’s braided blue hair::
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
...
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 7 recs
I love that picture of us.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
I'll always remember the funnel cake you bought me...and how you "pretended" to spill the powdered sugar on my shirt so you could wipe it off.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions
this is... strangely... appropriate
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
My daughter is considering joining BCB.
Maybe I should discourage her.
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
by katie casey on Jun 10, 2010 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I would strongly prevent her from doing that.
Sew her fingers together?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Well, she has been wanting to learn how to sew
and I told her I’m not good at it….
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
by katie casey on Jun 10, 2010 12:12 PM CDT up reply actions
GOOD POINT.
What ARE her SAT scores?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Also, what kind of soup does she like?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
GOOD POINT.
What KIND of soup does she like?
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Fish/meat soup
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
by katie casey on Jun 10, 2010 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions
She only took the ACT.
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
by katie casey on Jun 10, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL!
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
Preparing to hike to the summit of Mount Washington in New Hampshire on Saturday, June 12....
State high point count: 2/50
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm submitting this to the Vows section of the newspaper
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh
it’s definitely full of win.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Okay, this liteally made me laugh out loud.
I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.
Preparing to hike to the summit of Mount Washington in New Hampshire on Saturday, June 12....
State high point count: 2/50
by Vermont Cubs Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
who's who?
I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.
I don't know what's worse....
The fact that you referenced a 1982 Jim Henson movie, or that I got the reference to said movie
"They say that money doesn't buy happiness...but it DOES by Cub tickets. You ever see a sad person with Cub tickets?"
You getting the reference is worse... much worse.
We already know SWL is a lost cause but we had such high hopes for you…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Wow...those are some cutting words.
ARam almost refusing to take the field before games and refusing to practice? Get him out of here. That’s just inexcusable.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
A team this shitty doesn't deserve it's own soap opera.
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
I don't think anything can spoil my mood today though. Honestly.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
No, but oh how I wish I did lol. But no, something better.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
Fleshlight?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL.
Those things are just awkward. Can’t imagine how just…awkward that would be.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
Don't front
you know you’re curious. You can be honest with us. We won’t think you’re weird.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions
Lol...I think I'll pass.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
Good point.
It really makes this multi-year fail arc a TON more palatable when our hockey team wins a championship with a young nucleus that’s under contract for the foreseeable future.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
And shows a stark contrast between how to form a successful organization
And whatever the Cubs are doing.
Case in point- spending huge money on Marian Hossa, rather than the Fukudomes and Grabows.
If you’re going to break the bank, break it on a difference-maker!
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
That's so the cap number is lower
He made $7.9M this year but his cap hit is about $2.5M less than that.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Very well said my friend.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
This Hawks roster is so deep... even with the elite nucleus locked up there will be some tough player losses
I assume that Bolland is gone. Versteeg too. I hope that they move things around to scramble to keep Buff, because he really demonstrated his value in the playoffs….
Because actual dollars are a WHOLE lot less important than cap space to our wealthy Hawks, I’m assuming that Huet gets bought out, thereby spreading out and lessening his cap hit, and allowing Niemi and Hjalmorsson to get big raises…..
It’s just fun to see an org where the roster is so unbelievably deep that we are all genuinely concerned that our 3rd line centerman could come back to haunt us!
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
That's what I think won the Cup for us.
The depth…sure you’ve got the young studs in Kane and Toews, but so many other guys made signifigant contributions to this team – Seabrook, Sharp, Big Buff, Marian, Versteeg, Bolland, Burish, Campbell, it just goes on and on. Like you said, this could be the start of a potential dynasty.
"Every player should be accorded the privilege of at least one season with the Chicago Cubs. That's baseball as it should be played - in God's own sunshine. And that's really living." -- Alvin Dark
The depth is going to take a hit this offseason b/c of salary cap issues.
TOTALLY WORTH IT, by the way.
They’ll have to back-fill the roster to a certain extent after Kaner-Tazer-Sharp-Hossa-Keith-Campbell. But the quality of players we’re going to lose is simply a testament to how awesomely deep this team was to begin with.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Bolland isn't going anywhere
I expect Madden to sign somewhere else as a UFA. $2.7M savings.
I expect Huet to be packaged with perhaps Versteeg where the team can save a $1M or $2M.
Sopel or Sharp may be moved depending on how much the cap moves. I heard it could go up between $900k and $2M.
Bottom line, the ‘Hawks are a bit short at centre right now and Bollands’ natural position is centre, so I see it as a long shot he’ll be moved.
The whole thing with the ‘Hawks vs the Cubs is not just the depth, it’s the [right] attitudes by ALL the players.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions
But the biggest difference between...
my Blackhawks and my Cubs is ALL Blackhawks players have the right attitudes. The same cannot be said for the Cubs. For each D-Lee there’s a Rami. For each Demp, there’s a Z. These diametrically opposed forces can break up what would otherwise be a good team.
Don’t get me wrong. The Blackhawks had those players. As recently as last season. But in the last couple seasons too. They’re ALL gone now.
It’s not just getting the talent. It’s getting the talent that will gel together. The Blackhawks have that, the Cubs do not.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Does anybody know if Aramis has a no-trade or not?
"That's life, that's what all the people say.
You're riding high in April,
Shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune,
When I'm back on top, back on top in June."
- Big boy Frankie
Aramis:
5 years/$75M (2007-11), plus 2012 club option
$5M signing bonus
07:$8M, 08:$14M, 09:$15.65M, 10:$15.75M, 11:$14.6M player option, 12:$16M club option ($2M buyout)
full no-trade clause 2007-10, $1M assignment bonus if traded
Ramirez has right to void contract after 2010 & become a free agent
award bonuses: $75,000 each for Gold Glove or All Star selection, $0.25M for LCS MVP, $0.3M for MVP,$0.35M for WS MVP
Ramirez may void 2012 option, but doing so forfeits $2M buyout
2012 option becomes guaranteed if Ramirez:
wins one MVP in 2007-11, or
places 2nd or 3rd in MVP vote twice in 2007-11, or
wins LCS MVP once in 2007-11, or
is an All Star 3 times in 2007-11, or
is traded & Ramirez exercises 2011 option
Emphasis mine.
Dan
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
F**K!
"That's life, that's what all the people say.
You're riding high in April,
Shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune,
When I'm back on top, back on top in June."
- Big boy Frankie
by lexmarklover on Jun 10, 2010 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Not so long ago, you would have considered it worth every penny.
"If I did not laugh, I should die." -- Abraham Lincoln
it's sad how quickly that can change
I’ve never heard Aramis to be a clubhouse cancer. What a damn shame.
"That's life, that's what all the people say.
You're riding high in April,
Shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune,
When I'm back on top, back on top in June."
- Big boy Frankie
by lexmarklover on Jun 10, 2010 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions
It's OK. No one was going to trade for him anyway.
He may as well have a “no time travel” clause in his contract.
Either way, he’s either going to be productive in 2011 or gone in 2012. That mutual option for 2012 really makes me happy — especially in a contract where Hendry seemed to be inventing line-items to give A-Ram leverage over the club.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
isnt he a 10-5 guy regardless?
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
I love Patrick Kane, that ugly son of a biscuit.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks, man"~JR
by jesus christos on Jun 10, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Yup... the no-trade clause is irrelevant
He’s a 10-and-5er. He has veto power anyway.
by SouthernCub on Jun 10, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
If Ramirez is so upset that he can barely take the field
Maybe this means he is more likely to walk after 2010. Especially if he feels the Cubs are less inclined to pick up his option in 2012…he’d only be walking away from 14 million instead of 30 million.
"I'd rather hit home runs you don't have to run as hard." -- Dave Kingman
by BucknerKongCardenal on Jun 10, 2010 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I've mentioned this a few times already
It would not surprise me if ARam just quits/retires after this season. He really doesn’t like to fly, I’m sure all the travel gets to him, his body is probably hurting in more places than just a thumb, and he’s probably got more than enough money to live the life of luxury back home in the DR. And if any of today’s allegations are even close to being true, it would appear he’s pretty much lost his desire to play.
I still respect him enough as a person to think that if he really doesn’t want to play anymore, he’s not going to go through the motions, exercises his option just to get another $14M from the Cubs next year. He’ll just walk away – take one last plane ride to the DR and rest.
Maybe a year off away from the game clears his head, heals his body, and he’ll come back and play somewhere in 2012. But I doubt it.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Yes.
The whole team does basically. I think I might have one myself.
Maybe next year is finally our year.
by Unique on Jun 10, 2010 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
hahah it seems that way
"That's life, that's what all the people say.
You're riding high in April,
Shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune,
When I'm back on top, back on top in June."
- Big boy Frankie
by lexmarklover on Jun 10, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
It doesn't matter much....
I think he’ll be tough to trade given his contract and performance level this year. It’ll be even more difficult if this story gets out into the public. Oh, wait….. it just did.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Now I'm wondering...
these are the same guys that claimed Bradley was a terrible clubhouse presence. Perhaps it was the other way around. Or they made a bad situation even more intolerable last year.
It wasn't the other way around - Bradley really is that bad.
Of course, this team was left leaderless last year w/o Wood and DeRosa, and nature abhors a (leadership) vaccum, so there are going to be a bunch of shifting hierarchies and hurt feelings and so forth. Losing just exacerbates the issue.
Pro teams divving up on ethnic lines is pretty much par for the course, though. I guess that the problem would be if things got hostile between the “factions”.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Does this team really need a scapegoat?
Can’t we just leave it at “they suck this year?”
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:04 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
As long as they contain the sucking to this year
Are you familiar with the old robot saying, "Does not compute"?
by dr stabbingworth on Jun 10, 2010 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I've got bad news doc....
the suck is going to be for a couple years.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions
This is like a bad combination of 2004 and 2006.
Best hitter becomes a clubhouse cancer while the team spins out of control.
I’m still holding out a little hope that the subtleties and nuances reveal Aramis to be less of an ass than he sounds like. I’m troubled by all the time I’ve seen Castro sitting by him in the dugout.
And the Howry signing makes TONS of sense now. If memory serves, Marmol considered Howry a sort of mentor.
I’d love to know where Soriano is on all of this. My guess is he’s above the fray.
Fukudome invited him into his one man Japanese clique
Since Sori has a frail grasp of the language after playing over there all those years ago.
Fukudome is a one man wolf pack
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
I used to be alone in my wolfpack...
"Baseball is almost the only orderly thing in a very unorderly world. If you get three strikes, even the best lawyer in the world can't get you off." ~ Bill Veeck
Thanks brah
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Quick Poll
Who here thought we’d be happy to have Sori and Silva. Disgusted w/ ARam.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Even if this turns out not to true
I was disgusted w/ ARam before.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Marmol considered Howry a sort of mentor
See: Tuesday night.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I know.
Marmol’s outing Tuesday night resembled “Gas can Bob” of 2008 vintage. Without the monster homer, of course.
Howry has been fairly solid since returning, I’ll give him credit for that.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Not really
Marmol gave up a HBP, a IBB and a bleeeder through the infield. Howry’s MO was rocket, rocket, HR.
by JSB on Jun 10, 2010 1:08 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
He's helping already!
Nice!
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
The thing about Ramirez....
…even when he was at his very best, he still wasn’t great. Not Sosa-level great, anyway. We can spend $15M annually a whole lot better than Aramis, even if he’s being 2005 or 2007 “good” Aramis.
MLBMilestone.com - following the numbers to Cooperstown
Is this really a surprise? Really!?
Look at the players attitudes towards their game as it pertains to the TEAM.
I’ve always wanted to support players because they are wearing my beloved teams’ jersey. But as much as I give Sori crap about his output at times, I never had a reason to question his attitude and approach. Z however, from one thing to another and Rami, just plain ol’ attitude issue, this comes as no surprise.
We’ve had these arguments here before about attitude and output, individualism versus true teammate.
If this is true that these players are doing what Al’s source claims – and we don’t have much reason to refute said statements yet as I can read on this – this is far more worse than a scapegoat and Rami’s DL move is simply something to stem the tide for now.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:08 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Rookie = carrying bags??
When has this happened before? Besides the rookie bullpen pitcher carrying the Hello Kitty backpack of snacks?
I have heard of rookies carrying bags in the NBA, but not MLB.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
all the time
this is standard hazing of young players. No big deal here.
Yeah, this seems like the norm.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Not carrying bags
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Jun 10, 2010 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions
WKOHDYD?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
and at least once a year, the rookies have to dress up... um... in some... err... rather unusual getups
Usually happens on a road trip and typically involves some stretch of public exposure, e.g. they have to walk from stadium to hotel, something like that.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Yes, once a year
In September usually.
But I have never heard of or seen a report of rookies carrying bags in MLB.
It’s a 25 man team with a lot of equipment. The NBA is 12 men with much less equipment by comparison.
So I am very doubtful of that aspect of this post.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Jun 10, 2010 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions
An NBA vet picks one rookie to carry their personal (carry-ons)
baggage at the hotels. I’m sure it would be the same with MLB. Just because you haven’t heard of it does not mean it doens’t happen.
But I have heard of it
MLB rookie hazing is well documented. It happens in September and consist of dressing up in strange costumes. Google mlb rookie hazing.
Google nba rookie hazing and it is well documented.
But no references to MLB rookie hazing and carry bags. That’s my doubt.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Jun 10, 2010 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Good lord.
Maybe it’s something new the Cubs started this year. We aren’t there so we don’t know one way or the other.
personal bags, Risky
the guys don’t tote their own equipment bags. It’s done for them. It would be personal bags.
Sept—is because that’s all you can recollect when rosters are expanded and a lot more rookies are called up. It’s done when a guy makes his big league appearance. This is normal.
What I'm saying is
I’ve heard of the bag carrying in the NBA. It’s a story in the MSM.
But I haven’t heard of the bag carrying in MLB. Not in the MSM. And that surprises me which is why I doubt it.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Jun 10, 2010 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Do we *REALLY* need to post this? Now?
For all the complaining we do about the “Main Stream Media” they usually get multiple sources before posting a story like this.
Al, you have a really big community. Many here will treat this rumor as fact, even though many of us will repeatedly point out that this is nothing more than hearsay at this point. I think that does a disservice to the team and the players involved.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:12 PM CDT reply actions 6 recs
Dude
It’s a blog…. that is what bloggers do.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
and it's not Al's job ...
to do a SERVICE to the team.
and this isn't exactly "main stream media"
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
Just pointing out...
that there are some things that are better about the MSM than blogs. I think this is one of them.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions
You do have a valid point.
I thought a long time before posting this, even though it had been already posted last night. I received corroboration that I believe to be 100% accurate.
I have no firsthand knowledge of this, that is true. Nevertheless, I thought it important to have it out for discussion, because as you know the MSM will not (usually) do this.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Just FYI...
I’ve heard reports from inside the clubhouse that say it’s a fairly normal one. Issues after a loss to be sure, but nothing out of the ordinary.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
who are your sources?
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions
hahahahahaha
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions
I thought you wanted anything on a blog to be verified
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
No, I want accusations like this to be verified.
There’s a HUGE difference.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions
and the rest of us don't???
what’s your real point?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions
No, the point is that you should get verification before posting accusations like this
Once the “cat is out of the bag” then it’s sort of open season. I posted what I discovered without independent confirmation because it went against what was posted in this "story.’
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Welcome to the internet shawn...enjoy your stay.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Do you really not see the difference between what you posted
and what Al posted?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes I do see the difference.
Let’s try this another way. Forget Al. Forget me. Let’s not make this me vs. him. Let’s look at the facts.
tomas has said he knows someone inside the Cubs clubhouse that says it’s a mess. Bruce Miles , who is in the clubhouse in a regular basis , refuted this directly.
That’s all you need to know.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions
A good question to ask is...
… how many people need to say the clubhouse is okay before people accept Al is wrong? I’m setting the over/under at three.
The clubhouse is OK.
only two more to go!
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Because Bruce Miles is infalible.
Here, let me make this as simple as possible:
Tomas last night: Hey, there’s a clubhouse division and I’ve been told this by a friend who works for the organization
Al today: I spoke with his source and yeah, there’s something there.
You: This clubhouse is normal is just like any other clubhouse.
This isn’t a you vs Al thing, this is trying to get you to understand the difference between what you said and Al said.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Bruce Miles is fallible.
Al is also fallible. I don’t know this tomas person, but I’m guessing the same is true of him. I am not the person making a claim about the clubhouse, one way or another. Tomas decided to pass along information to Al, whom chooses to post it on his very public blog, after getting it verified by an anonymous (to us, the reader) source.
You’re absolutely right. This isn’t a me vs. Al thing. This is a Bruce Miles vs. Al thing. I have no reason to believe either of these people would make something up. Bruce, however, has plenty of firsthand exposure to the clubhouse. Al has less, and admittedly is passing on information, not his own personal observations.
Why is it so offensive to many of you that there are those among us who would sooner believe a firsthand account with anonymous verification (“a writer”) over a thirdhand account with anonymous verification?
by Flatley on Jun 10, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Who's offended? The arguement seems to be over the appropriateness of Al posting the information in the first place.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions
DING
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Yup, he can post whatever he wants.
And we can call him out if we think he’s doing something inappropriate.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions
And we can call out people who take what is acknowledged as a rumor
and decide to call for someone to be fired
Exactly.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh, sorry.
I didn’t read the start of this particular thread. I thought we were questioning the validity of the claim, not whether Al should have posted it.
No, it's not Al vs. Bruce.
It’s ? vs. Bruce. We don’t know Al’s source and therefore can’t judge how trustworthy it is. But we do know Bruce’s source – it’s BRUCE! We know him to be reputable. Until I see something directly from someone inside the clubhouse, I’m going to believe Bruce.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm struggling to understand your point.
Al went forward with a rumor that included some serious accusations of Cubs players and management. He didn’t verify it. I know someone that tried to verify it with their own sources. Their sources ran counter to what Al was saying here, so I posted it. Normally, I wouldn’t post a story that says “The Clubhouse is Normal.” That’s not news. But I also wouldn’t go forward with what Al posted without independent verification, especially when that verification was fairly easily obtained. Once Al posted what he did, I thought it was fair game to post what I uncovered.
I’m really struggling to understand your argument here.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions
so you missed the part where Al said he's heard something like this from another source too?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions
If it wasn't Bruce Miles
it doesn’t f’n matter.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, in my opinion
Bruce Miles is the most reputable beat writer in town. And I’m far from alone on this one. I’ll take what he says over any other single writer. And he’s not alone. Quoting Bruce:
[Aramis] took BP and fielding right up to the other day when he had to rest his hand, and he was talking in earnest with Rudy Jaramillo (contrary to other speculation). I asked another writer this question a minute ago: “Do we have a bad clubhouse here?” He said, “A bad clubhouse? What are you talking about?”
So now we’re talking about believing Al’s and tomas’s unverified sources over Bruce Miles and another writer in the clubhouse. Furthermore, we haven’t heard a peep about this from the other beat writers, who are more willing to go to press with clubhouse chemistry stories.
On the contrary, it seems that “if it wasn’t Al Yellon it doesn’t f’n matter,” would be a more accurate description of your position.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions
You're not the only person who has a high opinion of Bruce Miles.
Al himself has praised the man on multiple occasions.
Exactly!
We’re not talking about a guy that has a bad reputation. This is the most respected beat writer covering the Cubs.
And people doubt him because…. why again?
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions
not to cause another bruce-fest
as that poll did awhile ago, but i’ve said this before, lived in numerous places, and without a doubt, the best beat writer for any sport, any level, that i have read has been Bruce Miles. and heck, his blog offers better insight than many columnists out there.
Ding!
And I’m still waiting for a reason to believe an unnamed source over him.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I have a lot of respect for Bruce Miles, as you know.
But do you think a random question to another writer disproves what I posted? I don’t. While writers do have clubhouse access, they don’t necessarily know everything that goes on there.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
That argument goes both ways, Al.
So at this point, it’s no better than a “he said v he said” situation, assuming of course the source in question is indeed a “he”.
Do you dispute that assessment? If so, why?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
by ballhawk on Jun 10, 2010 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
MSM will do it for ratings, Al
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions
The MSM will usually NOT do this?
I think the beat writers would run to the press with a story like this. Most of them, anyways.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe.
In any case, as I said, I trust the info I have received. And unlike your above post — I don’t think this is “normal” in most clubhouses. Granted, I have not been in the Cubs clubhouse nor any other, but this doesn’t seem right to me.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Exactly
Players closing themselves off from others, whether or not there’s a racial component will do nothing but create havoc.
The ‘Hawks got rid of those players over a 2, 3, 4-year time frame. Now it’s the Cubs turn.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
I think you misunderstood my above post.
Let me re-try.
I know someone with a source inside the Cubs clubhouse. They’ve informed me that this story is not true and that the clubhouse is normal.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
FWIW
It is my opinion that posting this sort of thing on a fan blog, whether true or not, is inappropriate.
If you thought a long time before posting it, Al, unfortunately you made the wrong choice. Whether the information is accurate or not doesn’t matter. This is damaging gossip at best and character assassination at the other end of the spectrum.
I would hope for better from BCB.
by azjazzman on Jun 10, 2010 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
Yeah, let's stick to discussing how it's still early and what the Toyota sign will mean for the fans.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
There's a Toyota sign going up?
In time for the BP crosstown classic?
Will there be an “AIG player of the game”?
Just win the next game...!
There are lots of interesting things
to discuss without wallowing around in questionable gossip and the character assassination of a professional athlete who has been an outstanding performer on the north side of Chicago for many years.
We're not talking about Ryan Theriot....
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
you mean in your opinion, Al made the wrong choice, right?
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
It goes a little bit further
than just my opinion. This is sending BCB into tabloid journalism territory. The argument that ‘it is just an internet blog’ is irrelevant. There are still protections against defamation and libel and this is a public forum that is/can be read by anybody. Including the people being called out and/or their friends and family. There are real people involved here.
It really just isn’t a good precedent to set to be conveying accusations of this sort, no matter how good you think your source is. Unless one has first hand knowledge, and even then I would caution to be very careful.
This crossed a line that I really don’t think Al was wise to cross.
well said
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jun 11, 2010 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions
You know, something about this just doesn't make sense.
Lou isn’t Dusty. If a player isn’t hustling and he is dividing the clubhouse along ethnic lines, would a guy who’s never been considered a players’ manager just keep penciling him in every day — despite a .160 batting average — in the cleanup spot?
Lou once got into a fight with one his own pitchers … and now he’s caving to Ramirez?
To me, that means there are three things that could be happening:
- the facts we’re getting aren’t complete/nuanced (i.e. the ethnic divisions are overblown) there are some important main facts that we’re completely missing (i.e. this is just flat inaccurate)
-
— Lou has lost all of the fire he once had
If it’s point three, then Lou has to go NOW.
It's probably all three
This is Lou’s last season, and this team isn’t good enough to make the playoffs. He knows this. He’s tired of it, but as we’ve seen, he’s a stubborn man. He’s not leaving until Jim makes him.
Let's not assume this is true, folks.
I’m not doubting that tomas was told this. But I think the Paul Sullivan’s of the world would be all over this story if it were true.
Color me skeptical.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:13 PM CDT reply actions
FWIW ...
Paul Sullivan isn’t with the team right now. I saw him at a bar last night, strangely enough.
Yeah, but he's been around the team plenty.
This doesn’t sound like a “this happened yesterday” story.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm skeptical, too.
I think Bruce Levine would be all over this one. My guess is there’s some truth there, but that we’re not getting all the info.
If all the Latin players were forming their own group … why would Carlos Silva say such nice things about being a Cub?
Yeah the beat writers *LOVE* stories like these.
I’d be shocked if they weren’t all over it.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions
You're assumeing that Paul Sullivan is both...
a) smart enough to figure out things for himself
and
b) paying attention
He doesn’t do either very well.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I think he looks like a Muppet.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
ha, strangely, Paul IS my first name
But Sullivan is not my last name.
A big league baseball squad on the verge of collapse?
Any reporter worth his trilby would be on that story.
"If I did not laugh, I should die." -- Abraham Lincoln
Hence my comment about Sullivan.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I think he's pretty damn gossipy.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
you are a company man
Do you work for the Cubs? After the crap Alou and that crew (Ramirez included for sure) pulled in 2004…you don’t think this is true. Ha!
As long as the ivy is green you can live happy right.
interesting that you brought up 2004 ...
it’s apt. But Alou and Ramirez weren’t the names most associated with the problems that year. Hawkins, Mercker, Farnsworth, Sosa …
I'll always root for the Cubs
And I rarely care about the personality of a team — just winning — but man, that 2004 team was wildly unlikable.
Most disappointing team in my fandom.
That year still gets me more than any other. I don’t remember ’84.
Looking back, my first thought about that team isn't even their underperformance
Just that they were a bunch of snot nosed brats.
so was last years team
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Guilty by association in my opinion
They didn’t do anything to stop it…and Alou was definitely on Stone’s case that year. He went crying to his dad to get a contract after that.
Hahahaha, no.
Not a company man. I’m just not one to throw accusations like this at people without multiple sources.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions
On a serious note:
Yeah, seems like this bandwagon got full pretty quick. But consider the following: (1) This is a blog, (2) Tomas21 isn’t some dude that registered yesterday, he’s been around here longer than 98% of the others on this site, and (3) it seems plausible, as in, it hasn’t been discussing the likelihood of Zambrano leaving his contract to join NASA.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Yeah, I want to be clear here:
I’m not doubting tomas. But when anything like this comes out, I’d like a 2nd source before going public with it. That’s all. And the lack of anything remotely close to this being reported by the beat writers – which have been known to stir up controversy where there is none – also makes me skeptical.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
I’m not doubting tomas.
oh, and how long have you been waiting to use that one??? ;-)
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
lol. I didn't realize I sait it that way. Honestly.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions
you can't get anything past that *&^%$^&*( ballhawk
they’ll make you laugh (at them), they’ll make you cry (tears of desperation)
well the 50s are over
and yes Mickey Mantle was a drunk…and the boys did get a little crazy on the road.
I for one expect to read stuff like this on this blog…very happy I can read stuff like this. I trust Tomas21 for sure on this one
Doubting tomas?
"Hats for bats.....keep bats warm." - Pedro Cerrano
"Hey bartender, Jobu needs a refill !!!!!!!" - Eddie Harris
by willie mays hayes' gloves on Jun 10, 2010 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
No, not tomas.
His source, I suppose. I just like confirmation of things like this. That’s all.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions
I would be very interested
to know what this “additional information” might be, and whether it sheds any further light on the matter.
"If I did not laugh, I should die." -- Abraham Lincoln
Unfortunately, I cannot tell you that.
However, I trust the source to be accurate.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
deep goat stikes again!
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Deeper
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, clearly someone who may have an in
should reveal their source.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Not the source of the information,
the part which Al did not include in the writeup.
"If I did not laugh, I should die." -- Abraham Lincoln
Well you'd like either the source OR independent confirmation.
I’d probably settle for either one. If you want to keep the source confidential, fine. Just get confirmation of the story. Even from a beat writer than for whatever reason can’t/won’t go public on their own.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
but Al gives the source
That is the last time many people trust him.
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Fair enough.
But then get independent confirmation.
This is pretty big news to be breaking off of hearsay. We’re not just talking about a “half the clubhouse likes this quarterback more.” This is suggesting divisions along ethnic lines. That’s serious stuff.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Again this is a BLOG
How many times do msm run with stories with out that
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, there's Fox News
but they really don’t report the news…
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions
So should Al's standards be lower?
Why? Why should a blog have lower standards? Sure, many do have lower standards. But that doesn’t mean they should have lower standards.
If it’s wrong for a paper to go to print without independent confirmation of something like this, it’s also wrong for a blogger to do so.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, and he better continue to start everyday...
or else we will have to see theriot who cannot hit play shortstop. Or we could see Fontenot there, with 100’s of errors…
Just curious...
If a player decides that they absolutely refuse to listen to the managers and they refuse to take the field, etc., can a team let go of them and get their money back? Could they file a lawsuit if it got that bad?
umm...
no.
guaranteed means guaranteed.
at least to the MLBPA
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on Jun 10, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
don't be too sure
I’d bet there is some sort of insubordination clause in there in the labor deal or something like that. It’s probably buried in the fine print and has a plethora of criterion associated it with it, not to mention the MLBPA would fight any such action tooth and nail and it would most likely not be worth the effort, but I’d guess there is something there.
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
even if a player outrightly refuses to play?
that wouldn’t negate the contract or something?
I'll color you a company man
Do you work for the Cubs? After the crap Alou and that crew (Ramirez included for sure) pulled in 2004…you don’t think this is true. Ha!
As long as the ivy is green you can live happy right.
shawngoldman???
you hardly now him??
yeah…it’s gonna be that kind of day…
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on Jun 10, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
I watched some of the Reds game last night
and they had a few shots of Dusty up on the rail showing some real emotion to plays. He was both excited and angry depending on the outcome of plays.
NOT saying I want Dusty back, or anything even close to that… but it would be nice if our manager at least looked alive in the dugout.
Dusty in 2007 could have easily been Lou, circa 2010.
I think some of that has to do with the team, standings, etc.. Dusty has a decent team (so far) this year, making him more invested in the pitch-by-pitch goings on of the game.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Exactly (Dusty in 06, you mean)
You want more excitement and fire from players, then they need to start winning.
I can fully understand that
but at the same time there is an argument for chicken and the egg. Does the manager’s emotions reflect the team’s standings or do the standing reflect on the manager’s emotions?
True.
The Lou Piniella we all came to know and love in 2007 and ’08 was seemingly emotionally invested in each and every game. Last year saw a decline in that and this year has seemingly seen it vanish all together.
Now, if the Cubs go on a run, does Lou revert back to his old form? It’s an excellent question.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions
That would be very interesting to see
and I HOPE we find the answer.
June of 2007 showed that maybe some fire is what they need to see or it could have just been a coincidence.
I hope we find an answer as well.
I don’t know that tantrums and locker-room fights will solve it, but who knows at this point.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, I'm not suggesting that he throw a tantrum or anything
just show some interest! Act like you care when someone hacks at the first pitch after a pitcher walks another pitcher.
I'd like to think Lou is going over that in the clubhouse, so as not to show up the player
But to be honest, I doubt it.
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
You're right
It’s not professional to yell at a player in the dugout, but we see it happening over and over again.
At this point Lou seems like that tired, bitter parent at Wal-Mart saying “kids..no..don’t do that..oh nevermind go ahead. Look, what do you want me to do?”
At this point, it's more apathy than anything else, IMO.
Now, I haven’t been watching as many Cubs games as normal these first few months (high school state baseball playoffs have pulled me away), but the look I see says “I’ve tried. They don’t change. I’m tired of it.”
I love to play baseball. I'm a baseball player. I've always been a baseball player. I'm still a baseball player. That's who I am. - Ryne Sandberg
by Bill Potter on Jun 10, 2010 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Lou is just tired
He needs to retire one way or another.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Yep we need a screamer
Maybe Ditka…typical meatball fan comment.
Yell at the players and the refs. And don’t take no shit off nobody.
It wouldn’t change one thing.
He wasn't yelling at the players
He was just IN to the game. He seemed fully invested. Rolen hit a double and Dusty celebrated. Someone on the Giants made a great play and he stomped his foot and said “damn”. He was into it.
Dusty's into his toothpicks too
But so what. Ozzie is pretty into it too on the south side and that doesn’t make a lick of difference. Changing the attitude won’t change the fact that swing at first pitches, don’t move runners, hit leadoff batters.
But if he shows some emotion about Theriot not being patient
then maybe that attitude would change in the dugout. If players see that you actually care about what they do then they tend to fall in line with your philosophy.
He doesn't need to show emotion
Placing Riot on the bench will be more than enough to get his message across.
Yet he isn't doin that
Yet he said that he wants Theriot to be more patient and isn’t taking action. That shows disinterest and lack of leadership. Enforce your ideas.
Well yeah, I think we agree on that
It’s just the whole “actions speak louder than words” thing we don’t seem to see eye to eye on
I guess my comparison to Dusty in the dugout isn't a great representation
I meant that Lou needs to show he cares. Dusty laid it out there in the dugout. But at least say “Ryan, you swinging at the first pitch doesn’t help this team win. I want this team to win. Knock it off or you’re out”
Which he hasn’t done. And we know that because Theriot hasn’t stopped doing and he keeps on playing.
How do you know Lou doesn't care
He’s tried lots of things…if they players aren’t responding he’ll get his firing in due time. But there are so many more problems on this team than the manager no being fiery enough.
He doesn't have to be FIERY
He can just take action. Sit a player if they continue to do the same mistakes. Not just sit there looking disgusted and shrugging your shoulders.
He hasn't tried jack SHIT...come ON.
He’s pissed away over a quarter of a season moving terrible slumping players up and down one or two batting spots and continually refusing to bench under performing players for any amount of time, while simultaneously jerking around the players that HAVE been producing.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Byrd, Colvin, Soto...you know...our 6th 7th and 8th hitters.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions
compare what those 3 have done this year....
with the rest of the lineup, and then try thinking in context about what you say.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Please acknowledge the fact that Lou has not made the moves
you perceive he has made.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm saying what is he supposed to do
There are few moves to make….the team is poorly constructed on offense. Defensive liabilities all over the place.
So you are a follower of the LWDYWMTD tribe?
That he should just give up and leave the players where they usually bat and just go with it?
So there's few moves to make
and yet our Houdini of a manager has pulled some many moves and tricks to make you think he’s done a lot.
OK
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
I think you underestimate the importance of attitude
Yes, putting those numbers of Soto, Byrd, etc into the 3 and 4 hole probably wouldn’t make us contenders. But it would show the team that if you play hard and succeed you WILL be rewarded.
Right now Lou tells this team that you need a solid few years and then you can play as crappy as you like and I will still lock you into your spot in the lineup. That should buy you a month or two but we are in June now.
I honestly don't know what you're tring to argue now...
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions
holy hell....no....
I want change because the players getting rewarded with batting in the middle of the lineup are performing in a manner which doesn’t help the team win baseball games.
This isn’t complicated to understand.
You claim
“He’s (Lou) tried lots of things…”
I called bullshit, that’s all.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Better than our locked in 3 and 4 guys
Who have barely moved at all.
At least they're doing SOMETHING
People get on base to die when Lee or Ramirez come up to bat in the same spots they’ve been hitting in all-season-long despite making Aaron Miles look good.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions
I would love it
if people actually looked at the “moves” that have been made with this team before saying Lou is creative, or Lou has tried a lot of things. Lou has been so sloth-like in his managing, that you would think he’s a step away from downing a bottle of Quietus.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions
And what the hell do you mean by the "meatball fan" comment?
Should I be offended?
it's the same thing Bears fan yell about Lovie Smith
they want Ditka. You want a Ditka personality to coach the Cubs…because you think it would make the players play harder.
No, I want a manager who is invested.
Someone who acts like he cares if the team wins or loses and if they play the game right.
Anyone can sit there and write names on a line-up card. Someone needs to lead. The players are paid to play. Managers are paid to MANAGE the team!
People complain about Lovie not doing anything
because he doesn’t do anything. Everytime the camera cuts to him, he always has the same staring out into the distance dead behind the eyes stare. All of his passive talk about the quarters of the season, etc. He makes Bill Belichick seem like Eddie Murphy.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe Lovie does, but no one witnesses it outside the locker room
Who knows really but he does seem really passive as you allude.
Just win the next game...!
And trust me, as a former player
Nothing makes you try harder than when your manager shows interest in your work. They don’t have to yell all the time. They just have to show you that they care about your successes and failures.
Yes these guys are professionals, but they are human. Sometimes it isn’t enough to just hold yourself accountable. You need motivation to get you through sometimes. Not a sleeping man who can’t even get up early enough to shave in the morning.
I played baseball, basketball, and football all through high school
I don’t see why where has anything to do with it. It’s about the makeup of a team. I’m not saying I was an awesome player. I just know the differences in a team when managers just show up everyday or actually WANT to be there.
I played 14 years of baseball, traveling leagues, everything. 8 years of basektball and 5 years of football. Do you want a resume’?
14 years...so even your T-ball experience tells
us that a fiery manager is best. Ok your experience means nothing to me. We all played little league.
I’ll just agree to disagree. And stop watching Dusty. Don’t mention him again please.
I only said I was a former player to state some experience
I’m not some couch-potato fan (or meatball fan as you like to call it I guess) that is speaking out of his ass.
this is why I'm a fan of meatballs
I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.
If the Latin players are causing problems
I’m not sure firing the Latin manager will solve the problem. I feel sorry for the guy who takes Lou’s place if this is all true.
Really have to wonder what caused the seperation. Z to the bullpen? Some heated debate on the Arizona immigration reform?
"I'd rather hit home runs you don't have to run as hard." -- Dave Kingman
by BucknerKongCardenal on Jun 10, 2010 12:36 PM CDT reply actions
z and rami being awful is the most likely reason
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
I love Patrick Kane, that ugly son of a biscuit.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks, man"~JR
by jesus christos on Jun 10, 2010 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions
This is why I DO NOT
want to see Ryno take over this dysfunctional team.
Just win the next game...!
by blackhawk24 on Jun 10, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Al - anymore info??
I wish there was more info to substantiate the claim about the clubhouse. Is there an additional piece of info you can share… anything?
Best Cubs Moment: [reserved for whatever I do on the night they win the World Series]
Worst Cubs Moment: Attended Game 1 of the 2008 NLDS on October 2, 2008 - my birthday - heard a fan scream "It's really happening!" when DeRo blasted the 2 run shot, only to hear the same fan say a few innings later,"I'm leaving - I'd rather win in a bar than lose inside."
That's for the BCB pay site
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions
I hate clicking on an article
which CLEARLY does not have the little “In” icon by the title, only to find out it’s an Insider article. That’s horses*!t.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
And by the way
I’m looking at YOU, Hollinger.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I do too. It's a complete waste of money and I cancelled it this past year.
I just go to MLBTR and they give you the jist of everything.
The real comedy
is that the rumor mill on ESPN Insider is 95% just a collection of newspaper articles. So when we lament Gordo spitballing something, it (and other drivel like it) often ends up on Insider.
I do have additional information.
However, I have been asked not to post it, and I will honor that request. I hope you can understand. If I get any further information that I CAN post, I will do so.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Thanks for posting what you have posted.
I think I can speak for most of the people on here when I say that if it is true, I’m not surprised at all. I believe that clubhouse trouble makers translate to poor field performance (see last season and this season for examples).
by TheGrinch13 on Jun 10, 2010 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Fair enough
I trust you, Al, this is just some extraordinary info. I’ve read daily for a few years, and this is one of the most intriguing posts. To think that grown men – blessed to be millionaires via baseball- would behave like this… I mean, it’s just really disappointing if it’s true.
All the same, I love the organization, and I’ll be there on Saturday cheering them on. Recommendation for BCBers: read The Yankee Years by Joe Torre – sort of nauseating with all the Jeter-loving, but it has good commentary on the inner working of ownership, management, and day-to-day life in the clubhouse.
Best Cubs Moment: [reserved for whatever I do on the night they win the World Series]
Worst Cubs Moment: Attended Game 1 of the 2008 NLDS on October 1, 2008 - day before my birthday - heard a fan scream "It's really happening!" when DeRo blasted the 2 run shot, only to hear the same fan say a few innings later,"I'm leaving - I'd rather win in a bar than lose inside."
by IrishCubsFan on Jun 10, 2010 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions
The Yankee Years...
…. excellent book, agreed, highly recommended.
I’m as disappointed as you are by hearing this information. I wish it weren’t true, but it appears that it is.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Please stop using that word, "true"
It may be credible or verified, but there is no way anyone can determine from this post what the truth is.
Hence his clever use of "appears"
If I did what I love for a living, what would I do in my free time?
Writer at windycitygridiron.com {-/-} http://www.twitter.com/kdoggers
You mention Dempster should keep it in the park
Is it just me or does he seem to have given up a few ore hr’s than usual this year?
"Baseball is almost the only orderly thing in a very unorderly world. If you get three strikes, even the best lawyer in the world can't get you off." ~ Bill Veeck
Until this story is verified someplace else,
no reason to get worked up about these allegations.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jun 10, 2010 12:40 PM CDT reply actions
If there is a chemistry problem, it's not just Piniella's fault (although he deserves some of the blame).
The problem started when we got rid of Wood, DeRosa, Edmonds, and company so that we could overpay in money and years for Bradley. Sorry to bring up old news, but this was just the beginning and no one was held accountable for it. Remember Sammy’s smashed up boom box when he walked out on the team? I wonder who did that?
If you get rid of character, quality guys and replace them with arrogant, selfish players than you get what you deserve. It’s refreshing during the past few years to have nice guys like Fontenot, Reed Johnson, Jake Fox, Sam Fuld, Jeff Samardzija, (especially) Ryan Dempster, and others take time to talk to the fans and be good examples for the rest of their teammates. These guys loved being Cubs and it showed.
The clubhouse chemistry was great until the Bradley debacle, which Piniella asked for as well (a “left handed bat”). Until Tom Ricketts wakes up and see what a mess the management of this team is, then it will only continue to get worse.
FOX!!!!
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
I love Patrick Kane, that ugly son of a biscuit.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks, man"~JR
by jesus christos on Jun 10, 2010 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
you'll have to ask SWL - he's the CRO around here
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
How in the heck is that post racist? That has nothing to do with it.
by TheGrinch13 on Jun 10, 2010 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree...he needed to ass this to the end of it...
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions
and that's why you're the BCB CRO
now if only we can find a position for Dan…
Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."
Should someone tell that guy who's in it?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I mean, his mom might see it and get upset. Maybe he didn't know that dancing and eating chicken was wrong.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, because a black guy is in it, it can't be offensive
Tell that to any of the black actors in Hollywood in the 1920s. I am sorry, posting an offensive stereotype in a thread with discussion of race is offensive.
I'm offended by your comments.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions
here...I'll offend white people so everyone can be angry.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Flagged.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Because your post only named white grinders as good clubhouse guys
What about Byrd, Lee, Soriano, Soto, Marmol etc.? I hate the assumption that because someone is white and untalented they must be a good clubhouse leader.
by JSB on Jun 10, 2010 1:20 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
STOP THE BULLSHIT
he named those three because they were released
Sipping the Kool-Aid since 1982 - Kinda
Currently 34,839 on the Season Ticket Wait List - Expected age of being #0: 119
touche
does he ever mention the color of anyone’s skin – when I read the post I didnt even realize they were all white until you brought it up…does that make you the racist?
Sipping the Kool-Aid since 1982 - Kinda
Currently 34,839 on the Season Ticket Wait List - Expected age of being #0: 119
Just an observation
I made tongue in cheek. This idea that scrappy well spoken white guys are automatically great clubhouse presences and play ball “the right way” has been around for a while though, and is indeed racist. Obviously what I intended to be a joke about grinch came off wrong, and for that I apologize.
by shoemile on Jun 10, 2010 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Juan Pierre is scrappy.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Just because he didn't mention the color of one's skin, doesn't mean the post can't be racist
I am not accusing Grinch of being racist, I don’t know him. But that does strike me as odd that he couldn’t come up with a single non-white player that has been a “nice” guy or a good clubhouse presence.
I like how "the dream" is for us all to ignore the color of our skin....
but you find it odd that he didn’t go out of his way to make sure skin color was a criteria for inclusion in his list of players.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions
That's BS
Anyone could look at that list in a second and notice the commonality between the players that he lauds as good guys and leaders. They are all scrappy white guys. It’s not necessarily racist, and it certainly isn’t necessarily purposively racist, but it makes me wonder why he automatically assumes all these players are great guys and clubhouse leaders.
I still wonder why you care what color their skin is.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Is this The Shield?
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions
loved that show
gonna be weird to see chiklis in a totally different role next year.
I can't think of a single episode of that I disliked
and the season leading up to Lem’s death was epic. I really need to watch The Wire as most people I know who have watched both said that if I loved The Shield, I will find that The Wire is infinitely better.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah, only with mermaids and an albino psychic.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Not quite.
It’s fairly amazing though, although this is unverified.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions
gotta say
the wire is a completely different type of similar show, if that makes sense. don’t want to give anything away, though.
Is it as slow moving as Treme?
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions
LOL
On this I agree. I watched Treme expecting anything to happen. Nothing did.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions
I've been enjoying Treme
But I get why other people don’t. I’m hoping this season is just kind of a transition to getting everyone back in town and on their feet and that next season they’ll like, do stuff.
From what I understand of The Wire
it was written from start to finish without HBO even picking it up for a full series run. There’s a lot of interweaving with the plotlines, a lot of great reveals, some conspiracy stuff, etc.
Treme has Steve Zahn playing a musician, and it had an appearance by Elvis Costello. Now, I like Elvis Costello, but I really struggled figuring out why HBO would spend money on Treme.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions
because of the director
and because it was a good way to do outreach to new orleans without doing outreach
I figured it would have some element of gang violence
or drugs, or policy brutality, or anything other than a straight up drama. I just expected something different.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions
It might eventually
All I’ll say is, after season one of The Wire, I definitely didn’t expect it to turn into the type of series it did.
hmm
as i’ve only seen one episode of treme, i’m not the best judge. i want to say no, it has some pace to it. it just isn’t, shield-pace, for lack of a better term right now.
Yeah
when the first episode of The Shield has Vic shooting the other cop in the head, followed by some other episodes of roughing up gang members, beating up perps with a phone book, and seeing his marriage dissolve, I don’t think other shows are paced like that.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions
and oddly enough, virtually nobody made that big of a deal about it.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions
BECAUSE THAT WAS A POINT IN THE COMMENT THAT STARTED THIS
He said the latin players, led by Ramirez and Z, have completely walled themselves off from everyone else, to the point that they wouldn’t let them team haze Castro in the typical rookie fashion (carrying bags, etc).
Yes, I’m yelling at this point.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Haha
you mad
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, I am.
I get pissed when people throw false accusations out there.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Well cry me a river you f'n baby.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions
So I get pissed when people carelessly accuse the clubhouse...
of being divided along racial lines and I’m a baby?
I’m just making sure I properly understand your definition of the word.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions
For someone who doesn't have a lot of time to reply to posts
you sure have had plenty of time to fall on your sword today.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Daniel T. Pollitt is an awful pastry chef, his tarts are inedible.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Who can verify this? WHO?
Are you just making shit up? I AM SO PISSED. I AM GOING TO SHAKE MY FISTS AT THE SKY!
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Is that a fact?
;-)
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Does Bruce Miles refute the claim that Aramis and Z won't allow Castro to be hazed?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Being white and untalented doesn't make you a clubhouse leader.
It makes you Ryan Theriot.
"One of the things I like about baseball is that between innings you can go to the restroom.'' ~Manny Acta.
and fontenot and fuld
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
I love Patrick Kane, that ugly son of a biscuit.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks, man"~JR
by jesus christos on Jun 10, 2010 8:53 PM CDT up reply actions
uh-oh
wheres doggie stalker at when you need her? How dare you slander Fuld…he is the greatest thing since sliced bread…
Sipping the Kool-Aid since 1982 - Kinda
Currently 34,839 on the Season Ticket Wait List - Expected age of being #0: 119
Also, I don't care that Jake Fox signed your ball
Reports were he whined internally about not getting enough playing time. Unselfish my butt.
Wow, someone who could mash
and actually help the team complained about not being played when Soriano was repeatedly left out there to die. You don’t say.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I doubt you go around your job complaining you're underappreciated
And expect it to help the business.
If you do it right...it works...you really don't get this?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Well that's funny
because in a meeting today I brought up how I do all of these things for our specific office, and I would like a larger role instead of grinding it out. And hey, what do you know, I have a bigger role now in the training and development of the employees for my company in all of our main offices.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh my God
Considering my boss is a rational person and knows what I’ve done and is willing to give someone a chance, especially when it can help our company, he wouldn’t say no. And even if he did, there’s ways of saying you disagree with someone and find out why they said no.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm failing to understand the point you're making
Sounds like you’re an excellent employee with a bright future. Congrats to you. You’re much more qualified than Jake Fox was at his job, since he couldn’t play defense to save his life.
My point is if you went to your boss and he said no, then complaining loudly around the office that you’re underappreciated and should’ve gotten the job over your co-worker Bobby is, in my estimation, undermining your boss. Perhaps you disagree. Oh well.
What you described is someone being a sissy
Undermining someone, like a boss, would be going to their boss to complain. You not understanding this tells me a lot about you.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Uh, no.
If I go around my office making disparaging remarks about my boss, I am attacking him using “indirect, secret, or underhand means,” which, hey, is the definition of undermine!
You’re really not giving much credence to your argument by throwing around juvenile slang like sissy. That can mean a thousand different things.
Great comback, Craig.
Yeah, I think I’d be pissed if I was hitting well and crushing the ball, only to be benched every day for a light-hitting second baseman playing out of position.
I also think that if my only at bat came once every few days against the other team’s closer, that my batting average would start to suffer. Real baseball fans actually understand that.
I never said he didn't have a right to be pissed
Just that going around voicing his displeasure and undermining his boss was a selfish thing to do
How was he undermining his boss?
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions
poor fox
hes still only getting AB against closers this year
oh wait…
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
I love Patrick Kane, that ugly son of a biscuit.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks, man"~JR
by jesus christos on Jun 10, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
The time for Lou to be relieved was last year
It was clear then, as it is now, that he lost enough interest to guide this team to victory. He’s definitely lost his edge, and the ability to make the right moves in the clubhouse and on the field.
"Is there any truth to the rumor that the Bears gave up their first-round pick in 2011 for the decals?" - Someone registered as the DailyNorseman at PFT suggesting the Bears gave up picks in order to get Gaines Adams tribute decals. Stay classy Minnesota fans!
They make Depends for that.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
You want to know what's really telling about all of this?
Tomas comes out with this revelation, Al looks into more and posts about, we read it, and a whole lot of us think, “Yeah, I can see that” or “That makes sense.” This team has gotten that rotten.
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by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 12:50 PM CDT reply actions
I pray this isn't true.
But, I respect Al and I am afraid that it is indeed true. A-Ram used to be one of my favorite players, but if he doesn’t care, neither do I. Lou needs to man up and take care of his team or Ryno will next season!
Assuming it's true...
…and if it has gone on for a while, Lou does need to go.
It does seem a little odd, because Ramirez has performed very well under Lou, and maybe Ramirez has just given up on this year because of his bad start (if so really dissappointed in him as well).
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
Bruce Miles says this is a load of crap on his blog
…sadly, people will only remember the accusations, not the refutation.
by JohnM on Jun 10, 2010 1:02 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
THIS IS A LOAD OF CRAP!!
I don’t know if it is or isn’t…would a rec or a flag help?
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on Jun 10, 2010 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Here's Bruce Miles' direct response
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Jun 10, 2010 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
two interesting points with his response
a) Marmol is working with the younger pitchers on adapting. You don’t always need vocal leadership. If Marmol is working hard to help youngsters adapt, that’s great leadership on his part.
b) I was wary of specifically asking about certain players (didn’t want to ask Bruce something that might harm his ability as a beat writer), but another poster did, and Bruce specifically responded that Aramis was taking BP and fielding practice, and that he was talking to Rudy.
But.... but...
He’s just a stupid BEAT WRITER! What could he know about the day-to-day chemistry of the Cubs? I’d sooner believe second-hand rumors and anonymous tips off a blog than a credible source any day of the week. GRRRRR LOU!!!
by Flatley on Jun 10, 2010 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Nice work there
I understand and expect that the clubhouse is not always a joyous family. And I would not be surprised if some journalist held back on sensitive stories – Michael Jordan and gambling comes to mind.
But I don’t think a story on clubhouse dysfunction comes to that level sensitive stories. It’s a good story and none of the sources are so great that the journalist would care if they got cut off. Unlike Jordan.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Jun 10, 2010 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions
your probably right
this probably isn’t a big enough story that would risk anything, but bruce has been good to me when i ask him for information that i can’t find elsewhere, and has almost always gotten me said information, so i figured i’d play it safe.
Of course this is true.
This has to explain why the Cubs suck this year. Everyone knows that latin players are lazy, egotistical, and don’t care about anyone but themselves. This is probably the reason why Theriot has been playing poorly lately. If only these lazy latinos could observe how the game is supposed to played, like Theriot plays, the Cubs would probably be in 1st place. There’s a qoute on here that someone has that says something about how you can learn alot just by watching or something like that and it’s so true. I can see with my own eyes when I watch on TV that this is going on. Wake up people!!
And Fukudome can't see pitches
when the summer gets brighter because……
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on Jun 10, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions
....
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
I love Patrick Kane, that ugly son of a biscuit.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks, man"~JR
by jesus christos on Jun 10, 2010 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Love the thinking cat
Nothing says stumped like a domestic feline.
"Is there any truth to the rumor that the Bears gave up their first-round pick in 2011 for the decals?" - Someone registered as the DailyNorseman at PFT suggesting the Bears gave up picks in order to get Gaines Adams tribute decals. Stay classy Minnesota fans!
I can't tell if this is satire or not.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh
it’s beyond satirical.
"Is there any truth to the rumor that the Bears gave up their first-round pick in 2011 for the decals?" - Someone registered as the DailyNorseman at PFT suggesting the Bears gave up picks in order to get Gaines Adams tribute decals. Stay classy Minnesota fans!
This thread has been infinitely more enjoyable than the actual game promises to not be.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Thanks for raining on my Blackhawks buzz, Al
…sigh… :(
Check out the Video Blog I host: WebSmart TV
by digitalbenjamin on Jun 10, 2010 1:19 PM CDT reply actions
how could anything actually do that?????
"I cherish this dream I had as a little kid to play baseball,'' Ted Lilly
by Madison Cub Fan on Jun 10, 2010 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions
WTF?
Since this was posted here last night, I received an email from tomas21 this morning elaborating further on this situation and given what he told me — and I will not repost the additional information here — I have absolutely no doubt that what he told me is 100% correct.
What are you K.C. Johnson now?
User..name..in..tatters
Al,
You should update your post with the info from Bruce. And you should probable change the title, as this isn’t news and is – at BEST – an unverified rumor that we have counter-claims on.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 1:49 PM CDT reply actions
Are you familiar with the old robot saying, "Does not compute"?
by dr stabbingworth on Jun 10, 2010 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I think it's a reasonable request...
particularly given how Al will sometimes go and edit the titles of other people’s posts when he feels they are misleading.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree with the firing Lou rants, but can we also not
drop Aramis? How long are we stuck with Aramis anyways? If Tracy has an explosive June and Baker does pretty well also, I don’t see the need in keeping someone like that. Even if you have Tracy or Baker for 2 more years, Vitters should be coming around by then. I wouldn’t mind having Colvin, Vitters, Castro, and Cashner on the field at the same time.
on how long we are stuck with aramis
well, that sort of depends. technically, the deal can run through 2012. 2012, though, is a club option. 2011, though, is a player option, and I’ve got a tough time seeing Aramis pass up 14.6 if he is continuing to struggle. That said, if he turns it around, then who knows. Trading Aramis might not be that easy unless he turns it around.
Vitters has some more work to do before seeing the bigs. He’ll finish this year at AA in all likelihood and really needs at least another whole year in the minors, if not a bit more. I’m okay with him at 3rd, but it’ll likely be a choppy defensive effort at best (young Aramis-ish perhaps).
As a side note, I’m very curious on the next month. I’ve long believed that Baker could hit better if he had more consistent AB’s, and it feels like he will get it this month.
I was about to ask...
why I should believe some random dude on a blog about this story, as the report seemed absurd. Then I read Bruce Miles’ comments. Thank God for Bruce.
So much for this guy’s credibility.
On this info
I can understand why Shawn et al are skeptical—they don’t know me or know who I spoke to, and there is someone (Bruce Miles) reporting contradictory information. I would probably feel the same way in their shoes.
The information was presented to me by someone in a position to know. Put yourself in my shoes—if Derrek Lee, or Colvin, or Dempster, or Rothschild, or the bullpen catcher, or I don’t know Yosh told you the information—you’d know it to be accurate, so you’d feel comfortable saying it was true. But unless you told people who told you (and got Derrek or Tyler or Ryan or Yosh in trouble for talking out of class) you couldn’t prove it.
I passed in on because I thought it was interesting and knew that the facts reported were accurate, I didn’t know it would garner this much attention, I just thought it was an interesting tidbit, and thought others here would find it interesting as well. I told Al who the source was out of respect for him because it’s his blog and I knew he’d keep it confidential. It is possible this is typical clubhouse behavior, but since I’ve never played pro baseball I don’t know. It doesn’t sound typical, but maybe you never know what’s really behind the curtain until you’ve been back there.
I don’t feel bad for sullying Aramis’ image here, because I know the information is accurate. Some here could/should maybe feel bad if they pass it on, since they don’t know for sure. But I feel ok about it. If he didn’t want his rep tarnished he shouldn’t be acting entitled.
Anyways, take the info however you want. I should’ve just relayed it to Al confidentially and let him do what he wanted with it. Live and learn.
That’s all I care to comment on this.
DEJESUS!!!
by tomas21 on Jun 10, 2010 2:40 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
::taps fingers while waiting for shawn to admonish you::
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't have any problems with that tomas has done.
He’s passing info up to Al. I have an issue with Al going front page with it and blowing it up.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Source?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey, I don't have any beef with you.
I’m skeptical, but that’s it. My issues are putting this front page and selling it the way Al has.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:44 PM CDT up reply actions
wrong tomas
You should feel bad for sullying his image because his body of work over his career in Chicago is in strak contrast to what you or said source reported as an isolated incident on a struggling player battling injuries. You and your source called him a quitter. That is careless and wrong.
Couple of quick things
I responsed only because I was asked, and I gave an honest answer. One thing I can tell you: Managers don’t run clubhouses. Players run clubhouses. There are a few basic rules such as no music after losses and show up on time (the vast majority of players shows up early, say 1 or 2 p.m. for a night game. Managers stay in their offices and go over reports and make out lineups. It’s this way on every team. The clubhouse is the domain of the players. I’ve been in bad clubhouses before, and this isn’t one of them. Now, I won’t pretend to sell you on the notion that everybody likes everybody because that wouldn’t be true. If Latin guys tend to hang with Latin guys, it’s more of a language and culture thing. I will share one cool thing I saw yesterday: Carlos Silva having an earnest talk with Andrew Cashner in the clubhouse about pitching.
by Bruce Miles on Jun 10, 2010 2:42 PM CDT reply actions 10 recs
I don't have a problem with what Bruce has done.
He’s hands down the best beat reporter in Chicago. I have an issue with some of us deciding that the sky is falling over this.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions
So it really just comes down to this:
Should have Al posted this on the front page?
I say no. You say yes. That’s the main (sole?) source of the disagreement at this point, right?
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually I say "it doesn't matter one way or the other". He could delete the entire post and it wouldn't make a difference to me.
You, on the other hand, are much more passionate about it….which is probably why it’s been so much fun going back and forth with you. Sorry.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll admit to getting a little pissy about this today.
But it’s something I get pissed about.
The way I approach it is this: I get pissed about journalists/bloggers being lazy in the same way many journalists/bloggers get pissed about players being lazy. That’s all.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions
OK.
The way I approach it is this: The internet is full of words. Some are true and others are not.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Fair enough.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions
And should it be labeled "News"?
This is a rumor, nothing more. And one that’s been quickly debunked by someone who verifiably spends time in the clubhouse.
This post was prepared as a service to the BCB community. Neither BCB nor any of its employees makes any warranty, expressed or implied for the accuracy, completeness, or usefulness of said post. The statements of the author expressed herein do not necessarily state or reflect the views of BCB and should not be taken as anything other than an opinion. Above post has no cash value, and is invalid in MA, VA, and Puerto Rico.
Not only is it not news, it's rumor and opinion.
It’s rumor that a “source” has said these things. The accusations made against Aramis are the opinions of the alleged “source.” This “source” is claiming Aramis’ behavior is inappropriate. How do we know this individual is not misreading the situation? Does he know Aramis well enough to know what his normal behavior is? This entire post is dubious rumor mongering and character assassination. The question is why did Al go forward with it? That seems obvious, this little story is someone else telling us that Lou has let the clubhouse get out of hand. Al has harped on Lou not having a handle on the team and this little nuggest of gossip fits right into Al’s narrative. It’s pretty obvious why he rushed to make this a big front page issue without regard for Aramis’ reputation or the facts.
by Acapulco Taco Pie on Jun 10, 2010 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions
thanks for the reply
for me, I could care less about which player hangs with whom in the clubhouse. I take note when someone is saying Ramirez has “shut it down” and now players are taking sides. Your information disproves that notion. Care to elaborate about what you see and hear on a daily basis about Ramirez? I think it would be worthwhile for people in here to hear A Ram is not a dog.
Thanks, Bruce.
This is why you’re the most respected guy in town. You’re always level-headed and reasonable. And I’d be saying that even if what you were coming out with refuted my take on the matter.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jun 10, 2010 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Thanks Bruce. Very Insightful.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
by RiskyBusiness on Jun 10, 2010 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Honest question Bruce....
is there any truth to the claim that Ramirez and Zambrano won’t allow the team to give Castro the customary “hazing” most rookies get?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions
How do you expect an honest/serious answer when you can't take anything anybody else says seriously?
are you kidding?
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions
ok
Self-Proclaimed President of the Castro Boobird Face Kicking Club
I love Patrick Kane, that ugly son of a biscuit.
"It's the Chicago Blackhawks, man"~JR
by jesus christos on Jun 10, 2010 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions
hmm
down time between innings eh bruce?
anyhow, didn’t mean to drag you over here. the most interesting thing about your response was the stuff on marmol (well, and the fact that aramis is working with rudy now). i’ll go over to your blog an dask this if you don’t see this, but in your opinion, is marmol considered a leader on the club now? It’s good to hear about someone not in our aging core stepping up to the plate and triyng to help our next wave of youngsters. I’m sure others have done it as well (like Theriot for Castro), but it’s still good to hear anyways.
On Ramirez
His pride has been hurt by what’s gone on this season, no doubt about that. he tried to play through the pain. With some guys, that would earn “gamer” status. I thought he hit the ball as hard as he’s hit it in Houston the other night. It looked like he was turning the corner. Injuries are a dangerous thing: you can speculate things about a person’s character, and the next thing you know, he’s getting an MRI or having surgery. I can tell you this story: A couple years ago, Aramis dressed down a player because that player was in the clubhouse during a game and not on the bench.
by Bruce Miles on Jun 10, 2010 2:52 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Thank you for your honest answers and taking the time to post here.
"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes
On to more important things
SWL, after seeing all that there was to see with the iPhone 4, how do you think it compares to the Evo?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 2:56 PM CDT reply actions
Based on market share the iPhone will generate more buzz and gross sales...
As Sprint rolls out more 4G coverage and the Andriod OS continues to improve you’ll see the EVO start to gain a much better foothold.
Comparing them side by side is problematic due to the fact that each is tied to a different pricing structure and network. Bang for your buck would dictate you go with the EVO if you live in an area where Sprint 4G is available or is being implemented soon. I’ve gotten to play around with an EVO in a Sprint store, 4G won’t be available until Oct here in San Diego, but just on the HD and screen size/processor alone…I almost crapped a brick.
AT&T is taking an odd stance with limiting/charging for using data, so the increase of that with the new iPhone is going to be interesting to see. Sprint is taking the one price approach, so it will be interesting to see if they’ve made their network robust enough to handle what the new breed of smart phones can do.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions
This is the strangest of places to talk about this
but anyway…So, do you have an Android phone now? I’m essentially trying to figure out what to get when the time comes in a month or so. I understand media playback on Android is not good, not good as iPhone, and the Retina Display and camera on the iPhone is nice, but that screen and size on the Evo is insane. I’m just wondering if Android gets the same game and app support that Apple gets.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I have an HTC Hero...and I'm happy with it....and I'll get an EVO when my upgrade path allows.
The media playback issue with Andriod is a funny thing. It caused by people misunderstanding what an Andriod based phone is. It’s base on an OPEN SOURCE OS, so the basic phone doesn’t do very much…you’re expected to find the app that does the thing you want to do.
Take my Hero, please! Kidding….but take the basic SMS (texting/messaging) application that came stock on it…I used it for a bit, until I downloaded Handsent SMS form the Andriod Market. Now I never use the default SMS that came on the phone. Media playback can be annoying and problematic on Andriod devices if you just use the stock app that came with the phone…and that’s the neat part about Andriod phones…you can go find/make something better and install it. I have a couple different apps for playing back media and I’m still not quite 100 percent happy with either, but they’re better than the stock app…and there are still probably a few DOZEN other apps I could try in the Market.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions
This is actually pretty helpful
I had no idea about getting the apps you need to do what you want on the phone.
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 3:22 PM CDT up reply actions
That's becuse people have been conditioned to think a phone that plays media is only allowed to use iTunes.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't even have an iPhone
and this is what I believed. And if it’s not that, it’s whatever iTunes-ish player is on Android.
One last question, for the SMS app you referenced, and other apps, do you have to pay for that stuff?
www.facebook.com/craighudak
by Craig in South Bend on Jun 10, 2010 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions
yes and no....
there are free and paid apps….almost all of the apps that cost $ are only one or two bucks. Many of the apps that cost $ also have a “free” or “lite” version that have basic functionality.
As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.
by santoswoodenlegs on Jun 10, 2010 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions
One of the best music apps is b-tunes
It will play all your itunes music and wahtever else you have.
My wife was dieheard iphone fan and was adamant we’d get those this spring. We then spent a day visiting all the phone carriers and she fell in love with the droid (which is what I wanted).
The one problem I have with android is that there’s constantly something newer and fancier coming out and I’m nerdy so I always want the newest. However, there’s always new apps coming out. So, for example, I wanted the Droid Incredible. Then out comes this app “launderpro beta.” Suddenly I can do everything I wanted in the incredible.
My wife is downloading probably an average of an app a day. I don’t know what all she’s getting/keeping but there’s always something. She does all our finances through hers. She’s doing workout tracking, calorie counting and who knows what else.
Everything’s fully customizable. Backgrounds, homescreens, the notification lights (I did this with Handscent, changed the conversation colors and made the color of the LED when I get a notification). Love it.
So I’d highly recommend Android. As to carriers, that I can’t tell you much about. Verizon is going to launch and aggressive 4g network this year sometime. It’s supposed to be better than Sprint’s technology but the tech Sprint’s using has a better high end than Verizon’s. I’m also not sure when V will get a 4g phone. But for now, I’ve got no complaints about my 3g Droid. It’s often faster than my laptop (a mac).
Think of Lou's run with the Devil Rays...
and how Lou practically was phoning it in during his stint there.
Lou’s also a few years older now, and I can easily see how his heart just isn’t into this whole thing anymore.
Over the winter and during spring training, when he kept insisting that he was 100% committed to this and was ready for the season, I just couldn’t shake the feeling that he was trying to convince himself that he truly felt that way. I felt that it was obvious that Lou was falling asleep at the wheel in mid-August last year.
I’m not sure how I feel about firing the manager now though – the Cubs are now far behind the Reds or the Cards, but can they play well enough the rest of the way to catch up? If they fire the manager, will that provide a spark in the team if they promote Sandberg or bring in an interim? Not easy questions to answer…
* NOT far behind the Reds or the Cards
I accidentally wrote in my comment above that the Cubs are “now” far behind the Reds and the Cards. I meant to type “not.”
man oh man...
Still feelin great from HAWKS WIN n gotta read this?! I trust Al Y, n if ya don’t, I dunno why you’d be HERE. Sad news indeed. Thats ok, i appreciate all Aram’s done over the years… big part of our success, now, apparently, big part of our failure. Good timing tho, he can n SHOULD play elsewhere next yr. Al’s rite, Lou is NOT doin his job. He’s now effeet. seeya Lou. BTW, I feel if Al wasn’t absoloutely confident of his “source”, he never woulda posted it. Thanx Al, a rare “glimpse inside”.
OMG
they will always be losers period,1 year they have pitching but no hitting the next year they hitting but no pitching,they need to stop trying to be the Yankees and build from the inside until then nuttin but LOSERS
another
not so fun season.apart from the clubhouse this team has no heart. will we even win 75 games? i really think the cubs should fire pinella and not just flush the season away.i still think the players just dont respond to lou anymore.with some consistent play we could be right back in it. but not with these guys.
same thing, new season
This posting of 2nd and 3rd hand rumors as “news” or as some kind of real journalistic “reporting” happened last year too with the “bradley” posts. As was true then, is true now, second hand rumors are not news, they are unsubstantiated gossip. Thatks all. Al is free to post such crap but don’t try to dress it up as anything but that. If Al gets bored writing recap blog posts about Cubs losses because “it takes too long and does not matter anyway”, and he wants to report real news then he should go get a degree in journalism and get on with a real news organization and learn the ropes, develop 1st hand, direct sources, and report real news. Otherwise, he should quit posting this junk that hurts his credibility and unfairly slams others. A rumor told by someone is not a source, OK. Picking up the phone and talking to someone with firsthand knowledge, who is in the clubhouse and sees/hears firsthand, that is a source. If you want to “report” this rumor, verify if first by talking to someone in the clubhouse who has direct knowledge. Don’t want or can’t do that, then post recap of the latest Cub loss and call it aday.
I know it does not look good guys....it always looks bad right before it gets worse. (Yogi Berra)
by letsplay2two on Jun 11, 2010 9:46 AM CDT via mobile reply actions 1 recs
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