Should We Make Trades?
by Tater01 on Jul 24, 2010 8:16 AM CDT
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I'm as much of a fan of the Cubs as anyone else. However, there is one factor about the recent run the Cubbies have been on which trouble me with regard to any thinking about pennant races or postseason...all of the scoring seems to be coming via the home run (or in the case of Friday's final run against the Cardinals, a fluke play).
Don't misunderstand me - I love when the home team is making balls fly to Waveland and Sheffield. I was so much more impressed, though, with the squeeze plays that resulted in runs last weekend against the Phillies! I want to see more of that which can lead to sustainable rallies. As much as the home run is fun to see, it basically resets the scoring for that inning, starting from scratch.
This team was built for the home run in 2007 and 2008. It worked great against the soft underbelly of the National League during the season with two division titles but the Cubs still have yet to win a post-season game since 2003. This year, the Cubs seem to do a little better against the better teams and struggle against that same underbelly.
In other words, I'm going to enjoy the ride, but I'm afraid I'm being a little bit of a pessimist regarding the true prospects for this team. In my opinion, let's go ahead and make a few trades if they can improve our team for 2011 and beyond.
Or have I lost my mind living in Missouri too long?
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or Al Yellon, managing editor (unless it's a FanPost posted by Al). FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable baseball fans.
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I know I'll take heat for saying it,
but I would really like a fire sale – a complete unloading of as many big salaries as possible.
Official MCM Pessimist.
Oh, I'm sorry; did I poke a hole in the echo chamber?
by The Jade Scorpion on Jul 24, 2010 8:24 AM CDT reply actions
Easy to say.
Not so easy to do. Who’s going to take these contracts?
I’d like to do that too, but realistically, it will be very difficult to unload the biggest of contracts. Also, you’d like to get a decent return in prospects if possible.
The bottom line is that I don’t think the Cubs will make a major deal before July 31.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I suspect they won't.
But I am still hoping they will.
To me, just getting salary relief is enough return in many cases.
Official MCM Pessimist.
Oh, I'm sorry; did I poke a hole in the echo chamber?
by The Jade Scorpion on Jul 24, 2010 8:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Here's the thing:
There are really only a few guys who either CAN be traded or make sense to be traded; All the young guys (Marmol, Colvin, Castro, etc.) aren’t going anywhere. And most of the vets on long-term deals either have NTCs or prohibitive contracts.
Really, the only guys who can be dealt are Lilly, Lee, Theriot, Fontenot, Baker, Nady and MAYBE Fukudome (please, please, please find a way to dump Kosuke, Jim). I bet two, maybe three, of those guys get dealt. So a fire sale is all but impossible.
Depends on what you mean by 'major deal.'
Sounds like Lilly might be gone this weekend. See fanshot.
Yeah, I saw that article.
Doesn’t match up with what I’ve heard. But we’ll see.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I think the Cubs will make a personnel move by the deadline.
Whether it’s Lilly, Nady, Theriot or (please, please) Fukudome, someone will be playing for a new team soon.
You may be right.
But it’s not easy to move any of these guys AND get a decent return.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
I think Lilly is dealt by Tuesday.
A bad start in Houston could really lower his value. I’ll bet you a Big Gulp he’s dealt before 9 p.m. Monday.
I agree
There are too many contenders that need starting pitching. I would be surprised if Lilly stays.
by JSB on Jul 24, 2010 5:29 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Depends on how you define the return.
If someone will take Fukudome and pay about half his 2011 salary, then new bunting for Opening Day 2011 at Wrigley is a “decent” return.
And for the record, I’d take that $ and Lee’s $ and go all out for Cliff Lee. Even though offense is much more of the “problem”, the Cubs really need a true ace to lead the rotation.
Shut up Joe Morgan.
Fukudome needs to go!
Can we please get rid of this over-hyped non-starter!!!!!!!
really
fire sales only work for teams who have guys they brought up for the minors and who are still under team control, not for Alfonso Soriano and Zambrano
I Love Larry - Brick are you looking at random things around the room and saying that you love them - I Love Larry
Currently 34,839 on the Season Ticket Wait List - Expected age of being #0: 119
While I agree this team needs to re-boot
unloading some of these salaries is next to impossible. That said, you do what you can do right away to start clearing away the overpaid underperformers. By 2012, the Cubs should have quite a bit of salary flexibility again.
I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren
by lookingdeadred on Jul 24, 2010 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions
I'd like to see them trade some people too,
but its not that easy. There’s probably not a market for Soriano and Fukudome and we wouldn’t get much in return for Z.
As long as they trade Theriot I’m happy.
Lilly is 50/50 depending on what they can get back.
"You've got to get your damn shirts rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass. That's what you've got to do. Period." -- Lou Piniella
by tripdenten on Jul 24, 2010 8:33 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
What's the point of making a trade?
a) salary relief
b) improve for the future
c) both
In a perfect world, the answer is c. In an imperfect world, the answer is b.
In reality, the answer is A.
This team needs to unload salary. The Cubs are paying people large sums to not play regularly. And are paying people large sums to play irregularly. And are paying people large sums to play in the minor leagues.
It’s going to take a couple of years to wipe this clean, and by then Hendry’s contract will be up and then….2014….It’s Gonna Happen.
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
Aside from Spellcheck
Who are they paying to play in the minors? Don’t say Z bc that is temporary.
by JSB on Jul 24, 2010 5:30 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Fair enough on Z...not sure what the problem is
because even if temporary, Z is pitching in the minors as well as the restricted list. It’s certainly temporary, but still that’s the hand being played. Other teams most certainly do the same thing with big name players on rehab assignments, but this one isn’t really an injury recovery in the baseball sense of the term, is it?
Spellcheck also counts. And by my calculation, the Cubs are paying Aaron Miles a million bucks to play for the cardinals.
The Cubs are throwing away a lot of money and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future.
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on Jul 24, 2010 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Players don't make money
for the time they spend on the restricted list.
Technically, that's true.
However, the Mariners did pay [name redacted] when he was on the restricted list earlier this year.
The Cubs may have paid Z for this time period. I just don’t know.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
Should we make trades?
Is Ed “Too-Tall” Jones too tall?
There is no such thing as an ugly female breast
Does Charlie Daniels play a mean fiddle?
that’s how you do it, son.
WWOZ.org - New Orleans Jazz and Heritage Station
by Gibbon Jockey on Jul 24, 2010 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions
If you trade all the people you want to trade and don't
get much but salary relief, who’ going to play? There are NO major league ready prospects being blocked and NO ONE will pay to see the Chicago version of the Pirates/Royals play next year. I won’t pay the prices they charge to see it. Sorry, not many others will either.
The Cubs have to field a very competitive team to draw 3 million fans.
The Numbers don't add up for the Blow-It-Up crew
I sat next to a guy at last Tuesday night’s great comeback win who presented various options to blow up the Cubs, tell the fans we stand no chance for the next 2 years and rebuild. I focused more on the game and he shifted to other conversations with other people.
Since Tuesday night, I thought about what he proposed. He thought the Cubs could pair high salary players with lower salary, valuable players to trade. One of his examples was Fukudome and Marmol to Boston in a deal.
The Cubs have 6 players under contract for 2011 for over $10MM. What constitutes blowing up the current team? Is that 3 or more of those 6 players?
I don’t think the Cubs could trade away even 3 players each with more that $10MM salaries for next year, in the next 7 days. I don’t think they could get the deals completed in time.
I think the roadblock to blowing up the Cubs is not if, but how.
"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas
Right on the edge
At 9 games out with 60+ to play they are not IN it, but not totally OUT of it either. The deadline is coming at good time. If they keep winning and close to within 6 or 7, then you can justify not trading Lilly or Lee (who is definitely heating up and helping the Cubs now).
if they lose Sun. nite and stay 10 or more games out, it’s more logical to sell as long as they get a decent return.
Trading Nady just to dump salary and one (at least) of Theriot, Baker and Fontenot (forgotten man for some reason) makes sense no matter what.
Agree on Kouske but not sure any teams are that desperate. He could help a San Diego for sure, not sure how they’re doing it with that lineup/outfield!!
Trading Nady just to dump salary and one (at least) of Theriot, Baker and Fontenot (forgotten man for some reason) makes sense no matter what.
Well, sure it does. But again, this is easier said than done. You have to find a willing taker, too.
"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra
the trade being good for us
needs to help the other team as well, sometimes I think people forget that part of it
Unofficial Self Appointed President of the Player Formerly Known as Castro Blocker Fan Club
Bleed Castro Blue
might as well
this team seems unable to do any better than 10 games under 500. only a major winning streak will bail them out. i dont think they can do it.
I don't think...
…they will be able to move any of the huge contracts (Zambrano, Soriano, Fukudome or Ramirez), simply because I don’t see Ricketts being willing to eat what he will have to to get that done.
Lilly is likely to go, but beyond that, you won’t see any of the big contract guys get traded unless I am wrong about Ricketts.
"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel
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