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No Diamond Puns Here: Rookie Strikes Out Ten, But Cubs Lose Again

Eight years ago, a highly-touted first-round pick Cubs rookie starter struck out ten in his major league debut.

It happened again last night, although Thomas Diamond wasn't a Cubs first-round pick (the Rangers took him with the 10th overall pick in 2004), and instead of being highly touted, it's taken three years of work since Tommy John surgery for Diamond to come back and make his major league debut at age 27.

21-year-old Mark Prior struck out ten in his debut on May 22, 2002 and Diamond matched that mark last night; they are the only two Cubs starters to do so in their debut since 1920. Oddly enough, it was also last night that Prior made a "re-debut" of sorts, pitching for the Orange County Flyers in the independent Golden Baseball League.

Diamond also became the first player in the history of major league baseball with that surname (ha ha, first Diamond on the diamond), and threw six credible innings, but the Cubs lost again, 4-3 to the Brewers, their seventh consecutive defeat.

Star-divide

It looked like someone was tripping Cubs runners as they rounded first base last night. Derrek Lee hit what would have been an easy standup double in the first inning; it scored Starlin Castro from first base, but D-Lee tripped over first base and had to stay there. And then Castro inexplicably took off for second on a routine ground ball single to center in the ninth inning -- it scored Mike Fontenot, who had doubled into the left-center field gap as a pinch-hitter.

Castro slipped and fell rounding first base and was caught in a rundown and tagged out. There was no reason for him to try for second with only one out and the middle of the order coming up (although the way the middle of the order has hit this year...) -- that left no one on base and two out and D-Lee struck out to end the game.

The Cubs are now 13-25 in one-run games; that's the most one-run games in the major leagues this year and the most losses. Those can be attributed to two things, I think: a lack of timely hitting (the Cubs left nine on base last night, for example) and some bullpen meltdowns.

Incidentally, there were three assists on the Castro play in the ninth inning (throws from Jim Edmonds to Alcides Escobar to Prince Fielder to Rickie Weeks, who made the putout). Before that there had been only five assists in the entire game. If not for the Castro play, that would have set a new National League record for fewest combined assists by both teams.

Speaking of records, I wanted to weigh in on the front page on what was posted in this FanShot late yesterday afternoon; the Brewers apparently called the press box and asked for a scoring change on what was clearly a throwing error by Castro on a Casey McGehee ground ball. This was done when the Brewers were ahead 18-1 and apparently, for the sole purpose of getting a 27th hit in the books and breaking the Cubs' team record for hits allowed.

What an utterly classless thing to do. Good for official scorer Bob Rosenberg for saying no.

The game preview for this afternoon's series finale will post at 11:30 am CDT.

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Diamonds are a Cubs best friend - there I went and said it.

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 4, 2010 7:33 AM CDT reply actions  

Nice.

A couple more headline suggestions I considered e-mailing Al last night:

  • Diamond Dogs (use photo of David Bowie album)
  • The Return of the TOOTBLAN

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

Is it 2011 yet?

I just hope they play some decent ball soon. Because basically this sucks.

by Grockcubs on Aug 4, 2010 7:35 AM CDT reply actions  

Having read that Brewers anecdote

I now dislike them more than ever.

Yeah, they’ll take 2010…after that, I want the domination to make them LONG for the days before 2010.

[...]when Giants coach Steve Owen, a certified defensive genius, was asked how he planned to stop Nagurski, he said: "With a shotgun, as he’s leaving the dressing room."

by NobodySpecial on Aug 4, 2010 7:53 AM CDT reply actions  

NO PICTURE?!

Al you’re my constant source of positivity for the Cubs; don’t lose hope now.

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Aug 4, 2010 7:56 AM CDT reply actions  

There were no photos from last night's game in the photo editor when I made this post.

It wasn’t just the Cubs, either; something must be wrong with the way pictures get fed into the editor, because there were no photos of ANY baseball games from last night.

If any show up before I leave for Wrigley today, I’ll add one.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 7:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Here's a picture, just for you... ;-)

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 4, 2010 8:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Opposing teams and Cubs

is that the caption for that photo

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

except the Cubs have no sting

come to think of it…I don’t see a stinger on that wasp, either so… yeah.

by Emelie on Aug 4, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

the Starlin Castro hit machine keeps going

This kid is awesome. We’ve finally struck gold.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)

by SackMan on Aug 4, 2010 7:58 AM CDT via mobile reply actions  

What about the Diamond in the rough?

Really happy that he got to rack up 10 strikeouts. Will be a big boost to his confidence.

Better days are ahead, they might take a while coming, but better days are ahead.

"I think I'm going to a casino in Indiana and play snake eyes. I don't know what else to say, I'll be honest with you."

by AussieCub on Aug 4, 2010 8:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, for one year less of cost-controlled playing.

Thanks, Jim!

"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks

by dtpollitt on Aug 4, 2010 8:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

We can afford to pay our superstars, that's what separates us from mid tier players.

I would rather get Castro up and some experience when there wasn’t all of the pressure in the world on his shoulders. As bad as we are this year, I don’t disagree with the Castro call up.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 8:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't disagree with calling him up this year...

I just wish it had happened a month or so later than it did. Had we waited, we still get the benefit of him getting more than a half season’s worth of MLB experience, but probably save a year of cost-controlled status (or at the worst an extra year before we’d need to give him an extension).

Yes, we can afford to pay him. That’s not the issue. The issue is making sound financial decisions. Unless you have an endless budget, you still need to make cost-effective decisions.

If you think that the extra month of playing time is worth more than an extra year of financial flexibility, then we can agree to disagree.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 9:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Obviously at the end of the day, you hope to keep someone out of Super 2 status

However, I really think that the entire idea of worrying about super 2 is blown out of proportion to some extent. It’s an extra year of arb for the player, they dont become a FA a year earlier.

Assuming the Cubs begin to spend smarter moving forward, this wont have any major impact on the team overall. Let’s just hope they start spending smarter….

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

I agree that it's not a huge deal...

The biggest implication is that it puts added pressure on the team to spend more wisely. And for a team with a historical lack of smart spending, that’s not promising.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

I totally agree.

My hope is that the added pressure actually makes them spend wisely! I know… I can dream though!

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

Really?

DeRosa, Lee, Lilly, Dempster, Ramirez, Byrd were all incredible bargains.

I reject your reality and substitute my own.

by WayneCampbell08 on Aug 4, 2010 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

SouthernCub didnt say ALL the deals were bad

But there are quite a few crippling deals on the roster right now.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

it seems we called him up when we did

To try and kick start a lethargic team that was planning to contend. Of course…. things worked out differently.

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)

by SackMan on Aug 4, 2010 9:24 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

We don't have any superstars! Zero, none.

That’s the problem, we just pay middlin pitchers & hitters like superstars. We don’t have a #1 starter or a star in the field.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Marlon Byrd?

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

No, not a superstar

But a fine, decent player, wish we had more like him!

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

OK, I guess I wouldn't call Byrd a "superstar"...

…but he’s been a deserving All-Star and a “star in the field” this season.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

He's also still not a guy who is capable of carrying a team to victory

on a remotely consistent basis. He’s a very nice complimentary player

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

Fair enough...

I was just surprised to read “Byrd” and “Superstar” in the same thread.

Kat Williams used to have a bit about people posing by buying a Chrysler 300, and acting like it was a Bentley. And as he put it, it did look like a Bentley….until a Bentley pulled up next to it. Byrd is kind of like that.

by Damen Jackson on Aug 4, 2010 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

4th highest WAR in the NL.

This may be the peak of his career, but he’s playing at a very high level this season.

"You've got to get your damn shirts rolled up and go out and kick somebody's ass. That's what you've got to do. Period." -- Lou Piniella

by tripdenten on Aug 4, 2010 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's an entirely different arguement for a different day.

My point is the ability to pay superstars is what separates large and mid markets, nothing more.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

I was half asleep

and heard a warning was issued for the HBP. What was that all about? Didn’t it load the bases? No way was that on purpose.

"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 4, 2010 8:02 AM CDT reply actions  

It wasn't, but...

… I think it was because of Carlos Gomez being hit in the head on Monday. The umpires didn’t want it to get into a beanball war. It was the right call.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ok-thanks.

Thought it might have had something to do with that scoring issue although it seemed clear it wasn’t on purpose.

"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 4, 2010 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hey everybody.

I’ve been on vacation and traveling for work for the past 10 days, though I’ve chimed in occasionally. I want to ask about something that I’ve seen posted a few times …

Namely, why are so many people criticizing Ricketts for not making a ton of public comments in recent days? I know this season is a disaster, but what could Ricketts realistically say now beyond generalities?

I know that he COULD fire Hendry, and I would be in favor of that AFTER the season. But if he’s sticking with Jimbo and if Lou’s done at the end of the year, what could Ricketts say now that would make any difference?

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:13 AM CDT reply actions  

Most owners don't go spouting off to the media...

I think people are just generally frustrated with the team over the last couple of years, and are looking for anything they can grasp at.

The reality is that Ricketts is a business man and knows little about baseball. He’s the owner, not the baseball decision maker. Aside from retaining/firing Hendry, writing the checks, and setting the budget, there’s not much impact he should have on the baseball side of the operation.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 8:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

You all know I was the guy who wanted a statement from Ricketts about the Z situation.

However, in this cas you are both correct.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

cas=case

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'll be very interested to see what Ricketts says after the season.

But, for now, I can understand why he’s keeping a low profile.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

I agree.

I’m 100% certain he is observing and evaluating the entire organization this year.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

plus what does people want him to say?

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm staying out of that debate

but truthfully I won’t want to be him right now.

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

And then what?

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 4, 2010 8:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly...

I don’t necessarily have a problem with the idea of firing Hendry, so long as there is a clear/good plan in place for a replacement.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Meh.

There comes a point in many personnel situations where the performance level of an employee deteriorates to where termination is necessary even if a replacement isn’t readily available.

I think the “find-someone-better-first” argument has been used to keep Hendry for more than a year. And each week, as the contracts of Fukudome, Zambrano and others look worse and worse, Hendry gets closer to the point where he should be fired even if Theo Epstein isn’t on a plane to Chicago.

It’s up to Ricketts to make that decision. I’m personally OK with it happening after the season. But in eight months, if Hendry has made another round of bone-headed moves, Ricketts WILL have a lot to answer for.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

I gotcha.

I was speaking more generally to those (including Al) who say that finding someone (or at least having someone in mind) who’s better than Hendry needs to happen before we fire our current GM.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 9:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

I hear Matt Millen is available.

We have met the enemy and they are us! ~ Walt Kelly, Pogo, 1971

by Zeke on Aug 4, 2010 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

He'd have taken Samardzija for SURE

Can’t stay away from those promising young receivers!

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

OT

I want Matt Millen’s agent.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

they hire his replacement

It’s not that difficult of a concept

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

How many good GMs are available right now?

I’m fine with firing him. But doing so right now is largely pointless.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not advocating firing him RIGHT NOW

As I said, lower in this thread, I don’t need him to say something NOW. But Madison asked what people want him to say, that’s what they want him to say.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

You can't give the opinion that he should be fired unless...

you can think like an owner and have a list of 20 possible replacements even though that’s not your job. That’s how it works around here.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't believe it's anyone on here's job to fire Jim either

Yet you all seem to be doing a good job at giving your opinions on that. Either think out the whole job or let the people who actually know what’s going on do their jobs. They know way more than we do about where people stand.

It’s so easy to make rash decisions in a vacuum, but the fact is life isn’t as easy as “do this” “do that” without some kind of plan.

by gizmo6d9 on Aug 4, 2010 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

Could you please give us a list of what IS acceptable to discuss then?

I mean we talk about everything else until it’s been run into the ground, so I’d like some guidelines on what isn’t acceptable to discuss.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

He said it's not our job to pick his replacement

I simply was saying that it’s not his job to fire anyone either.

It’s easy to get mad and yell that things should happen or to make ridiculously overexcited posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But the fact is that this is real life and you can’t fire Jim just to get someone worse than him just because you are upset that your team blows for a couple years and quickly forget about the winning seasons you all enjoyed recently.

by gizmo6d9 on Aug 4, 2010 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh teh noes!

We can’t have teh opinions that someone needs to go because we don’t know a replacement. Oh teh noes! Teh world is gonna end!

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

Fine...

I’ll have the opinion that Theriot is the greatest Cub ever and that we should have never let him go… Just cuz I feel that way and we haven’t won without him.

It’s easy to have opinions. It’s hard when I have to think rationally about what consequences might occur if what I want to happen happens.

by gizmo6d9 on Aug 4, 2010 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

And if you actually made that opinion you know what I wouldn't respond with?

“You can’t talk about that because you have never been a major league GM”

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's not even that you have never been a GM

In the real world of business there is behind-closed-doors information and politics that go on. I’m simply saying that this whole argument is stupid and pointless because no one here has any idea what’s going on.

But whatever, use hindsight to make yourselves feel smart. I say there is a 99% chance that every last one of us would run this team into the ground YET you all continue to bash a man about a job in which you know nothing about.

Bravo!

by gizmo6d9 on Aug 4, 2010 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

For the one billionth time

I’ve never said I could do his job. I can’t hit a curveball either, yet I can clearly see when a hitter isn’t good.

Knowing someone is doing a poor job, and having to come up with his replacement in order to say so is a false argument far too many of you Hendry supporters have fallen back on.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

No one has said Jim is perfect

What I am saying is we are judging him based on decisions he made that may have come from other places. We do not know everything that goes on up there in the office.

When people make rash decisions to FIRE someone in an important position they need to have a replacement. How can Ricketts come out and say “you’re fired jim… oh we have no one to be the GM in the offseason while all the FA’s are being signed? Oh well, I’m sure the fine folks at BCB will be happy cuz I fired Jim with no replacement in mind” Or even worse… we need to fill the position and we fill him with the best candidate we can and he is worse than Jim.

Do you see why it makes no sense to bitch about Ricketts not firing Jim? There is no surefire candidate that will be better than Jim. Sometimes the best move is not to make a move.

by gizmo6d9 on Aug 4, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

It would really help if

you guys could just throw out ONE (realistic) name. Then we can at least argue it. Looking at experience and track records and argue if they are better than Hendry. Rather than saying “fire him”.

Maybe then Al could post a similar thread as he did for Lou’s replacement and then we could all discuss possible candidates. But to just simply say “fire jim” really does nothing for anyone.

by gizmo6d9 on Aug 4, 2010 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh and thanks for backing up your argument

The sarcasm really made your argument valid. So nicely done there.

by gizmo6d9 on Aug 4, 2010 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Perhaps you should have been more clear

When the question implies “what would you want Ricketts to say right now?” (following the logic of the thread – I’m aware those aren’t the exact words Madison used), and you respond “Hendry has been fired,” the logical understanding is that you want him fired now.

If you just want him fired after the season, then I don’t really have a disagreement (assuming we actually get an upgrade of course, which isn’t a given).

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, a comment on the Zambrano thing is a bit different...

as it doesn’t directly pertain to baseball so much as organizational behavior. So I wouldn’t have had a problem with the head of a well-known company making a statement about a highly-publicized incident involving one of his employees.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 8:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not sure what comments you are specifically addressing

But as someone who has been especially critical of Ricketts since the press conference announcing Lou’s retirement……

It’s not that I want him to say anything right now, it’s that I DIDN’T want him to say something like “Jim Hendry will be our GM in 2011 and beyond”

I think it’s monumentally stupid to keep Hendry on board.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 8:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's fair.

I can totally sympathize with that, because I want Hendry gone as well. I don’t have a problem waiting until the end of the season, but Ricketts’ vote of confidence for Jimbo was distressing.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

And it may be the classic "vote of confidence" statement...

that is often made not long before a person is canned. It may be that Ricketts made the statement to keep the media frenzy away for a bit.

Of course, the fact that he’s theoretically allowing Hendry to pick the new manager suggests that Hendry is likely to stay.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 8:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

In baseball, vote of confidence = don't make any holes in your walls

So we’ll see what happens in the offseason. Hendry may get a test period to see if he can redo the 2011 team in accordance with Ricketts’ “build for the long term” principle.

by ClarkFan on Aug 5, 2010 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

And

I think that’s a monumentally stupid idea.

I reject your reality and substitute my own.

by WayneCampbell08 on Aug 4, 2010 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Not if you don't have a list of 20 replacements

Jim Hendry is amazing! You can’t fire him.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Please give it up.

We know you don’t like him. We know you think he’s a bad GM, we know you want him fired either today, tomorrow, or at the end of the year.

We get it.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

And we know you do.

yet you continue to jump into every Hendry debate, only to proclaim how tired of them you are.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

:: cue the Wrath of God (in the form of Al) ::

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

The donut jokes have to stop.

It’s ridiculous. Criticize the man for his work performance — fine.

Criticize his appearance or weight — well, head on back to sixth grade, please.

Not here. Don’t do this again.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

This is absolutely ridiculous.

It was a throwaway joke. The first time I’ve ever done it. Overreaction is worse than the actual joke.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, guess what.

It’s not the first time it’s been done. It’s old, tired and disgusting.

Don’t do it again.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not going to get into a pissing match with you here.

I’ve asked you to stop something I don’t want here. That ought to be sufficient for you.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

You just don't back away, do you?

It’s his blog, he requested it to stop – simple instructions.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

b/c some people know better than Al does

Could we possibly have a thread where someone doesn’t call Al out on something? That’d be weird. Then people will accuse Al of not letting other people having their differing opinions.

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Just curious...

How does this differ from your year-long insults toward Lou Piniella, or does accusing him of being asleep in the dugout like some sort of senile, old boob not count?

by Damen Jackson on Aug 4, 2010 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Excuse me?

It relates to what I think of his appearance on the field and his job performance.

I trust that donut eating has nothing to do with Hendry’s.

Thanks for the personal attack on me.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's not a personal attack on you,

it’s a statement of fact. It’s an insult to Piniella. Plain and simple. And I find it hard to see the difference between what you’ve been doing, and these jabs at Hendry. Frankly, I think it all should stop.

But again, I don’t see how you feel attacked for me pointing out statements that you’ve made.

by Damen Jackson on Aug 4, 2010 9:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

I have criticized his decisions.

It appears at times that he has lost interest.

That is not a personal attack, Damen. Back off.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

Late to the party but recommending this anyway

The ageist comments all year long about Piniella have been out of line if Donuts comments aren’t allowed either.

by shoemile on Aug 4, 2010 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

This is the first time I've posted that I'm tired of it, actually.

You seem to completely misunderstand where I’m coming from. I’m not a huge fan of Hendry. I don’t think he should be in the Cubs long term plans. I don’t think he is a “terrible” GM, however.

I think we have bigger issues and should look at replacing Crane Kenney and Lou this year, and if things do not look good around this time 2011, start the search for a new GM for October/November 2011.

Your personal attacks on Hendry are growing tired by this point.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

No, it isn't the first time you've claimed you were tired of it

You claimed it yesterday in the two Hendry fanposts. (Neither of which I started by the way)

Personal attacks? Saying I think he should be fired is a personal attack now?

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, personal attacks in the form of the donut jokes.

No more. By anyone.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh for god's sake Al

That was the first and only time I’ve made a donut joke and it was freaking harmless

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't particularly care for junior-high humor on this site.

So just don’t do it again and we’ll be fine.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

Can I haz Big Gulp jokes?

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

You implied JH was a fat pig when you said he had donuts all over his keyboard!

Can’t do that!

Not if you said he was going door to door giving out NTC to people, that would be OK.

Get it?

by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

Do you not comprehend?

Eating donuts and being overweight doesn’t have anything to do with Hendry’s job performance.

Enough. No more.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

He claimed I made personal attacks

before I ever made the donuts joke. Which was the first one I EVER made.

What don’t YOU comprehend about THAT?

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

alright, you said "attacks"

Which insinuates I’ve made more than one. We’ll have to agree to disagree that a throwaway joke about crumbs on the keyboard was actually an “attack” but I’m done with this. Blood pressures are clearly up.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

In all fairness:

Do you think it is really Hendry posting on BCB? by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
.
I dunno, has anyone checked his keyboard for donut remnants? by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions

It’s not like HuskerCorner was blatantly insulting Hendry the way others have in the past, and maliciously criticizing him for his weight. It was simply a joke. And, you have to admit, it was kind of funny.

Lighten up!

by nickler on Aug 5, 2010 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wasn't even aware this was an issue.

Like Al, I would’ve liked a statement from the Ricketts on the Z thing but, at this point, I don’t expect them to say anything about how much of a dismal failure this team has been.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

good question

I always turn to the sports section first. The sports page records people's accomplishments; the front page has nothing but man's failures.
~Earl Warren

by lookingdeadred on Aug 4, 2010 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Can we add bad fundamentals to the reasons the Cubs have lost so many one run games?
Those can be attributed to two things, I think: a lack of timely hitting (the Cubs left nine on base last night, for example) and some bullpen meltdowns

making it three things. I was watching in a loud room (live music). We saw the Castro out in the ninth, but couldn’t hear what was said about it. The two Cub fans, among several amused Sox fans, in the room agreed that base running problems, fielding miscues, bad choices on where to throw the ball to get outs etc. have played a role in the Cubs’ horrible year.

One of Lee Elia's 15%

by waiting4cubs on Aug 4, 2010 8:17 AM CDT reply actions  

We could spend all day talking about why the Cubs aren't better.

In fact, that’s pretty much what BCB has come to lately. Pretty sad, though totally understandable.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

disregard my previous comment

I didn’t see that waiting was addressing the record in 1-run games.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, your comment does still apply.

Sad, but true.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

No one would ever put me in the Kool-Aid camp.

But I think 2011 will be brighter than we can imagine right now. Part of the success in 2007 was due to the experience guys like Theriot, Marmol, Hill and Marshall got in miserable 2006, and I think the kids this time around look even better.

Beyond that, we have more salvageable veteran nucleus than we did at the end of 2006. Dempster, Gorzo, Wells, Byrd, Soriano, Soto, Ramirez, Marmol, Marshall …

Getting through the next two months, however, will NOT be fun.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm with you.

Up to a couple of weeks ago, this did not feel like 2006. It’s starting to.

If this year does finish as badly as that year did, they’ll have to do a similar revamping in order to keep up ticket sales — and that’s even more critical now because prices are higher and the economy is in worse shape.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well ...

I disagree with you that a small drop in ticket sales would be the end of the world. If the Cubs fell below 3 million fans in 2011, I think fans would return in droves if the 2012 team was ready to rock.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

It won't be a small drop.

At current prices, and with the economy the way it is, they might be looking at a 25% decrease.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

even if it's 10%

that will be a huge loss of $$ for the Cubs

The off season news might be more interesting than the Cubs since the AS Break

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

Honestly? I don't think it will drop that much.

This is just my opinion (heh), but I think enough people go to Wrigley for the atmosphere, the drinking and because they’re in Chicago.

Will fewer people show up to a Thursday afternoon game next April? Yes — but I think that’s a given at this point. If the Cubs can do some creative ticket packaging, if they have a young team that’s exciting — even if it doesn’t have a great shot at the playoffs — and if they have marketable young players like Castro and Colvin, I don’t think attendance will fall that much.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think enough people go to Wrigley for the atmosphere, the drinking and because they’re in Chicago.

Not at these prices. That’s the difference between now and 2006 or earlier. They have raised prices to Red Sox levels — without the on-field success of the Red Sox. It won’t work.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hmmm.

Then “creative marketing” needs to include some really good deals for weekday and weeknight games, particularly early in the year.

Out of curiosity, Al — what would you do in the offseason to prevent the loss of fans? Can you give me a top-five list of player moves (I know you already want the first baseman from KC’s system) …

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 9:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Let me think about this.

It’s not something you’d put into a comment in a game recap thread. Requires more thought.

Creative marketing for the Cubs has to start with a ticket price reduction. That alone would create enough goodwill that they could stem the losses from season ticket cancellations.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's cool.

I think it’s worthy of a main post, actually. You’re obviously, and with reason, concerned that a rebuilding year will do too much damage financially. Given the Cubs’ limited resources in 2011 and the players already locked in, I’d be curious to see what you think the team should do.

For the record, I’d be all about signing a big name free agent to play FIRST as a headliner. But I’d want a responsible signing, and I don’t know if that’s possible.

FWIW, I DON’T think Ted Lilly is a big enough draw to merit headliner money.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 9:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Depends what "headliner money" means.

Lilly is very popular, as you have seen on this site. It would be a popular move to re-sign him, and a decent baseball move IF it doesn’t cost too much.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

I would theorize ...

that Ted Lilly is more popular on BCB than he is anywhere else — though he was a popular Cub.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

Couldn't agree more.

BCB loved Lilly, I’m not sure there’s the same sort of following outside this website.

He should be brought back though, for the right price.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

There isn't?

Tell that to the Ted Lilly Fan Club.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

There's also a freaking Ryan Theriot

fan club. There’s a fan club for everyone, everywhere.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ryan seems like a good enough guy

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

so who does?

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

Anyone can be a fan of anyone

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

compared to many Cubs

he was a bright spot. There was very little he did to bitch about.

Name 3 other Cubs this year that you can say that about.

Now people are complaining about people liking a player who has played well… as being too popular? Shouldn’t be liked as much.

I’d rather discuss him than Z, bullpen, most of the infield or the over paid outfield. Or the players that Lou forgets that are on the team. Or the GM & manager that isn’t doing a very good job either.

So who are we suppose think is good and not want traded

Marshall, Demp, Marmol, Byrd and Soto.

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh, I'm not complaining about Lilly's popularity.

I’m just commenting. If we’re talking about spending limited FA money to draw fans, I’m not convinced re-signing Lilly is the best say to go.

No disrespect to Ted.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's not really the point

and again, no one is saying that Lilly isn’t worth a roster spot. Elgato and I are simply saying that the groundswell of support to bring Lilly back may not be as large elsewhere as it is here.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions  

After this season....

most anything will be an improvement.

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

Nope, 2011 will just be a slightly improved version of 2010, if we're lucky

We still have no #1 or #2 starter, only two major league pitchers in the bullpen, no 1st baseman, weak catcher, and a washed up shell in LF.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, very

How many dropped throws and successful steals do you need to see?

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Seriously?

He’s about league average defensively, and above average offensively.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Good catchers don't drop throws home

and swing for the fences all the time. I do like his eye at the plate but he’s middlin as a defender.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

Are you really hung up on the ball he dropped that cost us the game?

This isn’t exactly a recurring trend.

He’s average defensively and he clearly does not swing for the fences every time he’s at bat…

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

No, he just dropped one on Monday nite!

He’s weak defensively

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

is he weak or middlin?

you seem to be contradicting yourself

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

I've softened to middlin

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

No, he's slightly below average defensively...

And in 2009, he was slightly above average defensively, making him pretty much exactly average defensively.

He also has the 4th highest WAR among all catchers this year. He is extremely valuable.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ok, the WAR convinced me, he's fine

The dropped throws still bother me though.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's totally fine.

I’m not going to try and convince someone not to be bothered by an aspect of a player. That is totally different than calling them weak. He has value and is far from what is wrong with the Cubs in 2010.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed, the dropped throws just stick in my craw!

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, Sori is a shell

of a former 30/30 leadoff hitter

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

He has lost most of his running game...

…but I wouldn’t go as far as to call him a shell. Soriano has slugged quite well this year, which is what he needs to do batting lower in the order and – don’t look now – but he appears to be having quite a resurgence defensively.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

He is not doing what he should

he still swings at virtually everything as if he’s the sole source of power on the team. Look at his AB with 2 men on last nite for example. Pathetic. He’s an average hitter and a below average outfielder, nothing more.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

If you read my post about 2 outs RISP for Soriano in this thread

You’ll see he’s actually well above average in that situation.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

There wasn't 2 outs and he struck out

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

If you want to believe he's good defensively, fine

I don’t and never will as long as he tiptoes for every foul fly and every ball in the gap and gets stared down by a rookie for not hustling. He’s a declining star with no wheels anymore and a shell of what we purchased in ’07.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

He's got a UZR/150 of 10.6 this year.

If you don’t like him, fine. But he is above average defensively this year, and better than average in clutch situations.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

This does NOT in any way

reflect that I believe he is worth his current deal. That’s a different arguement.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's what my point was

He’s not a superstar and a shell of what we signed in 07. He’s not horrible, just not a star

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Washed up shell is too harsh, but Soriano is in decline.

He has bounced back from 2009, but his 2010 performance has been losing momentum over the last month or so, particularly losing BA and OBP points. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him end up at 27/80/.260 with the headline stats, with OBP and OPS about in line with his career avarage. Not bad, but it sure looks like part of a lower higns/lower lows pattern of performance – 2010 is clearly a notch below his other “comback” years in 2002 and 2006-2007.

Barring some physical miracale or Soriano making major adjustments in his game, by 2012 he will not be a very impressive bat in the lineup. And his base stealing days are over.

by ClarkFan on Aug 5, 2010 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

Any guesses?

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 4, 2010 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

Not my job.

I don’t even want to begin assuming until we’re a lot closer to making that decision.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

August will be the really bad month

Starting Sep-1, we may get to see a glimpse of the near-term future.

by ClarkFan on Aug 5, 2010 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'll give Castro a pass because he's only 20 years old.

He’ll need to stop the rookie mistakes soon, though.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Castro's one of the only reasons to watch this team

He may have been safe at second if he wouldn’t have tripped since Edmonds bobbled the ball.

With the way the Cubs #3-6 hitters have been not-hitting, can you really blame Castro for trying to put himself in scoring position? I don’t call it a rookie mistake (since Theriot made similar “rookie” mistakes), I call it a hustle play that didn’t work out…….

by magicblue on Aug 4, 2010 8:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Rookie mistakes? I'm not surprised to see Castro making AAA mistakes.

And given that he started the year in AA, that is about right. He should be fine.

by ClarkFan on Aug 5, 2010 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

I know it's been a long season, but.......

Did I pull a Rip Van Winkle?

The game preview for this afternoon’s season finale will post at 11:30 am CDT.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 8:24 AM CDT reply actions  

I meant SERIES finale, of course.

I’ll fix it.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

No, we all wish the season ended today.

That was your subconscious typing…

Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!

by DKT on Aug 4, 2010 8:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, it probably was.

It’s raining pretty hard here right now. Maybe we’ll get a rainout. At least that wouldn’t be a loss.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

The forecast looks good, with the wind blowing in. It should stop raining around noon or 1 PM.

Sir Linkadrop

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 4, 2010 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Sigh

I need the bears now

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 4, 2010 8:30 AM CDT via mobile reply actions  

Rookie Mistakes

I’d rather have guys like Castro making them, and learning, than vets who should know better. I don’t care how many errors or baserunning gaffs the kids make in the next couple of months. To me, it’s all about building some equity for future years. It’s the only redeemable thing about this lost season.

Scott Bora$ is satan.

by Canadian Cubs Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:41 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Well, sure.

But you’d like to see some improvement over time. There has been some by Castro, for sure. But he should not have tried for second on that play.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

It was a bad play. But I’ll take Castro making a base-running mistake over a 30-year-old making one any day of the week.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 8:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

You're totally right.

And if he makes that same mistake over and over, then you’ve got a problem. All you can ask from your young guys is that they learn from their mistakes. I think he will, and we’ll all enjoy watching him play for the Cubs for many years. I think the kid is a winner. Ditto Colvin.

Scott Bora$ is satan.

by Canadian Cubs Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think Castro makes it to 2nd if he doesn't trip

Castro was 1/3 of the way to 2nd base, Weeks wasn’t even close to the bag at 2nd, and Edmonds bobbled the ball.

It would have been a close play for sure, but Castro’s got major speed……

by magicblue on Aug 4, 2010 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

Actually, Castro doesn't have great speed.

He’s a little above average.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Which makes him the fastest player on the team

I’ve seen him turn singles into doubles several times this season and doubles into triples (at least once in his 1st game). He’s fast, above average, whatever you want to call it……..

by magicblue on Aug 4, 2010 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

right now a little above average

is the best the Cubs have for speed. Guess it’s all relative

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

And THAT should be a drafting priority

Wrigley can be a slugger’s park, but the Cubs need more speed in the lineup.

by ClarkFan on Aug 5, 2010 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions  

Al, I think you're slightly understating his ability.

He’s not incredibly fast, as some are getting at, but he gets up to top speed quick and never takes anything for granted. At the end of the day, his above average speed and incredible hustle make him a tough out no matter what.

I always learned through my playing that you want to force the defense to make a tough play – I think he does that better than anyone on this Cubs team.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hustle

The kid was hustling, which cannot be said for anyone else on this current club other than Byrd and Colvin. The result wasn’t ideal but the hustle sure was and is something more of the check-cashers on this club should take note of. Unfortunately, as it goes at this level, they are more inclined to try to tone him down than ramp up their own effort.

"When the day comes with that last winning run and I'm crying and covered in beer. I'll look to the sky and know I was right to think someday we'll go all the way." - Vedder

by krummy12 on Aug 4, 2010 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

I disagree

Edmonds bobbled. A runner at 2nd, in the bottom of the ninth, with a DP machine at bat, is huge. Gives you 2 shots at tying it. He has above average speed, and he is a smart baserunner. If he doesnt fall, he may have taken 2nd, we won’t know, but I like the aggressiveness.

"It was a perfect situation for the Brewers," Hill said. "They had a guy up there at the plate [in Counsell] who takes a lot of pride in what he does and he practices those situations, so when it does come up, he gets the bunt down to the right side of the field. They have the perfect guy on first base [in Gomez], who is one of the fastest guys in the league, and they had one of the worst fundamental teams on the field, so it was a perfect situation for them."

by louslovechild on Aug 4, 2010 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Unlike the most of the other players

Castro usually makes a hard turn around 1st. That was exactly what happened in the 9th. And that is how i want him to play. Last night he simply fell. Same as Lee. He got caught because he was going harder. To call it a rookie mistake simply isn’t true. It was a physical error, not a mental mistake.

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Aug 4, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

rec'd

I don’t want them making lots of them, but I’d much rather have it from Castro then others

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 8:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

talking about rookies and their learning curve

I’ve started to become concerned about Tyler Colvin. .190/.346/.333 over the last week. He’s still sporting an .851 OPS for the year, so it would be nice to see a late-season surge so he can finish the year over .800 and give the Cubs a solid piece for 2011.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

true

but don’t many rookies have to adjust their game a bit once MLB pitchers start figuring them out. Let it be this season.

"Actually, Major League Baseball is more like Neverland

And the Lost Boys don’t have to ever grow up. Some do, anyway, but that is not a universal characteristic"

by Madison Cub Fan on Aug 4, 2010 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

Anyone can have a bad week...

hopefully it’s just that – a bad week. The week before last, he was killing it.

In addition to adjustments pitchers make to new hitters, there is also just the natural ebb and flow of a season to contend with.

If he continues to struggle, I’ll grow more concerned.

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

Why would he need a “late season surge” to maintain an 800 OPS? If anything, it’d be a DECREASE from his current level of production.

I reject your reality and substitute my own.

by WayneCampbell08 on Aug 4, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Not that I had my calculator out or anything

but if he keeps posting the same numbers he has over the past week for the rest of the year, wouldn’t he finish 2010 below .800?

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh

So you’re assuming that the last week’s number is his true level of talent? Stupid me, I thought the other 250 plate appearances were more important than the last 21.

I reject your reality and substitute my own.

by WayneCampbell08 on Aug 4, 2010 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

what's up with the snark this morning, dude?

I don’t mind admitting being wrong, and I certainly don’t mind a debate where I come away learning something. Just not sure my point warranted the condescending tone from on high.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

No, that isn't what he said at all.

Man, people sure do love to misrepresent what other people are saying this morning.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

What if he does the previous week though?

the one where he hit 3 HR, five extra-base hits, and hit .318/.423/.863 (1.286 OPS)?

by SouthernCub on Aug 4, 2010 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yep. I'd rather be young and bad than old and bad

"You win because of the quarterback. We have to get that position stabilized. We're fixated on that." -- Jerry Angelo (12.30.2008)

Jerry Angelo trades for Jay Cutler! (4.2.2009)

by SackMan on Aug 4, 2010 9:26 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Thanks!

Al could’ve also made a Prince reference with the headline “Diamond Twirls a Pearl.”

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

♪ Picture yourself in a boat on a river,

With tangerine trees and marmalade skies. ♫

"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 4, 2010 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

Big game last night!

The Cubs picked up a game on the Pirates last night! Only 8 1/2 games back now!

Jim Hendry and Tom Ricketts have this team ready to go!

I think with a little luck we can get this done! Its our year! Look out Pirates we are coming for you!

by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 9:17 AM CDT reply actions  

Did Diamond feature a Cutter last night?

Pun aside, I was at the game last night and Diamond looked good. I saw speeds on the radar from 79 to 93 and his slider by Ryan Braun look bad.

"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas

by RiskyBusiness on Aug 4, 2010 9:18 AM CDT reply actions  

Question:

Could Diamond enter the bullpen picture for next year (assuming he’s not a starter)? I don’t know anything about his makeup and didn’t watch last night’s game.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 9:20 AM CDT reply actions  

I've been wanting the Cubs to give him a shot in the pen all season.

If he doesn’t completely implode in his next start or thereafter, I’d have to think he’ll be in the running for a bullpen spot next season – maybe even an outside chance at the rotation.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm about as ambivalent as possible on Hendry

but find it humorous that the pitchforks are out when a guy he picked up off of waivers tossed a quality start last night. If only he were as sage as all the AL GMs that had no time for Diamond.

by timh815 on Aug 4, 2010 9:24 AM CDT reply actions  

I don't know whether they should or shouldn't have

because the point remains that it was one start. If he gets lit up like a Christmas tree in his next start, are you going to COMPLETELY switch gears and claim that Hendry was a moron for picking him up?

This is absolutely the stupidest defense of Hendry EVAR

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

Nope. I won't switch gears.

If you have intel that a top ten pick coming off TJS is worth a gamble, add him to the 40 man.

by timh815 on Aug 4, 2010 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

He should be leading off!!!!!

I heard he played well in Japan…..

Maybe he can get a 4 year deal with a NTC contract with the Cubs to play RF!

by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

I read that as "Maybe he can get a 4 year old with a NTC..."

LOL

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh, it's blow *%**@

out of proportion day. If a pitcher whiffs ten in his debut, then gets cut the next day, should we put in a waiver claim?

by timh815 on Aug 4, 2010 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'd release the following from our 40 man

for a guy that fans 10 in his MLB debut.

Fonty
Baker
Patton

Probably a few others

by timh815 on Aug 4, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Baker may have some value

If Lou remembered he was on the bench.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ha, I'd forgotten about Patton.

It’ll be interesting to see which of the Fontenot/Baker ghost platoon survives. I’ve read that it’s likely the Cubs will call up Darwin Barney soon and, with DeWitt playing everyday, those two are on thin ice.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, he did get a hit last night...

…but, yeah, DeWitt makes Fontenot more redundant than Baker.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

The whole Fontenot situation is so infuriating.

He has a terrible 2009 after being slotted in as the primary 2B to start the year. If anything, Lou OVERPLAYS him, starting him out of position and against some lefties. Then the Cubs re-sign him for money that could have been used on a more valuable, late-spring pickup (Felipe Lopez, come on down).

Then, this year, Lou sits him almost the entire season over Theriot DESPITE Lou’s supposed devotion to lefty-righty balance and DESPITE the fact that he was hitting better than last year AND better than Theriot.

I’m OK with sitting Fontenot NOW with DeWitt on the team. But talk about a player who was never used correctly.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Right.

If he’d have gotten some playing time, maybe he would have had some trade value. Now someone’s likely going to claim him on waivers for nothing.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

I really wonder ...

if Lou and Hendry coordinated very often regarding player signings. Tendering a contract to Fontenot almost seemed like something Hendry THOUGHT Lou wanted, even though Lou really didn’t.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

Couldn't agree more

It would seem reasonable that most coaches with teams that are sop right-handed would at least find a way to get some starts for the guy. But Lou has his own set of rules. Fontenot seems to be in the doghouse for something, maybe his performance last year. And if Fontenot is in the doghouse, Baker found some entirely new level where he can more or less be totally ignored.

by madcow256 on Aug 4, 2010 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Baker's in the doghouse ...

because he burnt his leg lighting farts on fire. That was the rumor, anyway.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's hilarious

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

The 2010 Chicago Cubs:

“So inept, we even bobble lighting farts on fire.”

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

That sounds like a Kangaroo Court issue

And not a “bury a potentially productive roster spot deep on the bench” issue. Thank God Lou is gone next year.

Pretty funny/random though.

by madcow256 on Aug 4, 2010 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

IIRC ...

Jeff Gray was involved, too. Jeff Gray looks like a permanent fixture in Des Moines, at this point.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Don't know.

But I’m sure glad we got so much value in the Jake Fox trade!

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hey Look

The cast of Dinner For Schmucks is posting in this thread. Of course TJ is battling Husker for the trophy and it’s a battle too close to call right now.

I reject your reality and substitute my own.

by WayneCampbell08 on Aug 4, 2010 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

crap, and I trained extra hard for this race!

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

I feel so sad now that the great Wayne Campbell does not appreciate my posts!

Maybe he and NOT Bruce can get together with Jim Hendry and have a big pity party!

As much as I want that trophy, I will never get while it is so proudly displayed on the giant wooden spool you use a table in your living room!

by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

122 pitches over 6 innings

Maybe it was butterflies in the stomach more than the second coming of Rich Harden. Hopefully Diamond will become more economical with his pitches, and hopefully he won’t suffer any lingering effects after yesterday’s outing.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think he'll be fine

Then again, with Rothschild in charge, I’m not so sure.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

Have you seen the bullpen this year?

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

If you give the Cubs 13 Aaron Miles

Do you blame the hitting coach when they suck?

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Because our hitting coaches have really worked out

Perry, Joshua, Jaramillo, all genius, I tell you. They’re amazing!

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

Reanimate Charlie Lau!

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

Dude, just stop talking now.

Perry was CLEARLY not the problem. Jaramillo didn’t just suddenly forget how to be a hitting coach. Von Joshua? Well, he might actually suck.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Jaramillo was the hitting coach in Texas

That could make anyone look good.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Batting averages are meaningless

It’s all about driving in runs, which is something the Cubs can’t do. Situational hitting is what really makes or breaks an offense. And where has that been all season? The Cubs have the most one-run losses in the majors. That’s just pathetically bad when you consider the amount of money they’re spending.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

I did

Batting averages of these players have improved, but the situational hitting hasn’t.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

Okay, let's try this...

Soto: 2 outs, RISP – .292/.500/.500/1.000
Soriano 2 outs, RISP – .281/.361/.469/.830
Byrd: 2 outs, RISP – .302/.362/.465/.827
Castro 2 outs, RISP – .241/.436/.310/.746

Only one out of those that isn’t damn impressive is Castro, and it’s still extremely impressive for a rookie shortstop. The lowest OBP of these 4 with 2 outs RISP is .361.

Anything else I can help with?

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

There's your middle of the order

for the rest of the year and 2011.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

Like I said! he must bat third!

All of his hits are when the game is on the line! Very Clutch!

I like him batting best with a runner on first!

by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

Reminds me of Sosa!

He alsways got his hits when it mattered most!

by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

But his numbers

with less than 2 outs is terrible. Surprisingly, the only starter with a BA over .300 with RISP was Theriot at .325.

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Aug 4, 2010 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

But yet it's not reflected in the final score

Imagine that.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

Are you serious right now?

Obviously my entire point is that THESE people are getting the job done during “clutch” spots. Your arguement here isn’t even valid.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think Ace is trying to say

That with all of these people batting so well in clutch spots, why do we lose so many games?

by TJ11 on Aug 4, 2010 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Because the team has a bad manager

and an inconsistent pitching staff to go along with less than timely hitting.

How Jaramillo becomes the scapegoat for Ace, when firing Perry didn’t fix a damn thing is beyond me

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

Actually, I blame the entire coaching staff

That’s why I advocate firing them all after the season is done.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, there's almost zero chance that happens

And I find it very odd that you completely ignore that Soriano and Soto have bounced back nicely under Jaramillo, and Byrd continues to put up career numbers.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

Losing record

I rest my case.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ace, if you actually "rested your case"

the opposing counsel would move for immediate dismissal, and would win.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

Losing doesn't make you wrong

For example, people make fun of Herm Edwards for saying, “You play to win the game.” He was right.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

Did that make him wrong?

How about this one?

If you disagree with me in any way about anything, you are wrong.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

What do Ramirez's RISP stats look like?

Becasue he has been wedged in the middle of all those guys with pretty good numbers. You put a solid out in the middle of a rally and the rally dies pretty fast.

And the stories I have seen indicate that the 2 hitting black holes of 2010, Lee and Ramirez, haven’t even been willing to work with Jaramillo.

by ClarkFan on Aug 5, 2010 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah - 3 decent guys and a cast of Who's He?

There is a difference between shaping a pitcher and raising the dead…..

by ClarkFan on Aug 5, 2010 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Tim Hendry? ;-)

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

I dont get this...

Rothschild is one of the most widely respected pitching coaches in the game, and probably one of the top 3 or 4 on any team right now.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'm all for a scorched earth policy with the coaching staff

There should be no ties to the old regime.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

m really happy for Diamond...

…but the one thing that concerned me was his velocity. I followed most of the game on Gameday and couldn’t help but notice that, though he did hit 90 a few times early on, he was topping out in the high 80s for most of the game. That makes me worry about his next start a little bit but, all in all, it was a silver lining to see him have a decent start.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:26 AM CDT reply actions  

*I'm

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by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

The thing that should really make you worry about his next start

is the over 120 pitches he threw. Fun to have a guy be the first at doing something since Mark Prior also throw over 120 pitches in his first start. Somewhere, Dusty is smiling.

by the nth on Aug 4, 2010 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

Even Prior didn't hit 120 in his first start, did he?

I agree a bit daver, however the fact that he was missing bats so much gives me some hope. It’s not like they were getting good reads and just hitting hard at people, he struck out, what was it, 8 people swinging?

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

103 in six innings for Prior in his first start.

Boxscore

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, he seemed to use his change-up well.

I definitely wish the guy the best, but his success last night may also have been at least partly due to the fact that the Brewers were so unfamliar with him.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well

It’s not really as big a problem for Diamond since he’s past the injury nexus and Prior wasn’t at the time of his big league debut.

I reject your reality and substitute my own.

by WayneCampbell08 on Aug 4, 2010 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, that's true.

I’d guess that, thanks to the insane amount of innings the bullpen has pitched lately, Diamond was basically offered up as a sacrifical lamb to the Pitch Count Godz.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Which, according to the above

is good, becuz he is a horrible pitcher. Or something like that.

by timh815 on Aug 4, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hmm, it's weird, because I just reread, and no one said he was a horrible pitcher

It’s appears all anyone said was it was his first and only major league start, and that he doesn’t prove that Hendry is smarter than every other GM for picking him up.

But continue to COMPLETELY misunderstand how the world works, it seems to make you happy

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

About that call that the Brewers made concerning the error/hit...

How common is it for teams to a call like that during a game? Does anyone know?

by murphymj on Aug 4, 2010 9:57 AM CDT reply actions  

The Brewers seem to do a lot of it.

Other teams, not so much.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 4, 2010 10:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's funny how the Brewers seem to incessantly focus on the small stuff

Things like calling the press box trying to get the official scorer to change the error to a hit, and even down to the players and their carefully planned post-victory rituals.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 4, 2010 10:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

I didn't think it was possible...

…for the Brewers to hire a manager MORE annoying than Ned Yost, but somehow they managed to pull it off.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

Players do it a decent amount of time

I don’t know that I ever heard of a team doing it

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't have a problem with it

You want a team to not get 26 or 27 hits on you? Try not stinking up the joint so much. Calling them classless is silly because this is professional sports.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

Class doesn't win games

I’d rather a team that plays all out than tries to make the loser feel better. This isn’t Little League.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

Eh?

If you think the official scorer made a mistake, why not ask for it to be corrected? To tell you the truth, I wish it had been changed to a hit.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

They were grasping at straws, it was pretty obvious it wasn't a hit.

And even if it was changed, it really accomplishes nothing other than pissing the other team off.

It’s called being sore winners.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

I go back to my original point

If you don’t like it, don’t stink so much. The Cubs deserve zero respect this year with how horrible they’ve played.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

I just don't see what's so classless about it

I found it pretty funny myself. I hate this year’s team, but I love the Cubs. If I can’t laugh at how horrible they are, I wouldn’t be able to watch the LOLCubs.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's classless because they went begging for something they didn't earn

 and which didn’t affect the game one way or the other one iota, after the fact.

I don’t see how you DON’T understand how that isn’t classless

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't see the problem with trying

I’d be proud of my guys if they set a record against a team.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's classless

Because they went back, after they’d won and won big, and requested that a play that was pretty obviously an error to be changed to a hit. They did this only because they knew it would set the record for most hits against the Cubs ever.

by bdlugz on Aug 4, 2010 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

No

But not that I see anything wrong with that either.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 4, 2010 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Y'know, come to think of it...

…maybe they did it as an odd form of retaliation for all the Brewers’ hitters who have been plunked this series.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

Beware of pissing off the Cubs!

They will retaliate by pouting.

If a quality pitching start is 3 runs and 6 innings, then a quality hitting day is 1 for 4.

by tharr on Aug 4, 2010 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I mentioned this above ...

but I want to open the discussion on this some more, because I think I might be onto something.

Is it possible that the problems of the past couple years have stemmed from Hendry incorrectly guessing what Lou wanted in terms of player-personnel moves? For example, Lou got a lot of criticism in 2009 for spurring moves to revamp the team (DeRosa out, MB in, etc.). Is it possible that Lou said, “Let’s go get more left handed!” after the Dodgers’ series but then didn’t like/didn’t know how to use the guys Hendry acquired?

I know this would assume that Hendry and Lou aren’t don’t coordinate much when it comes to FA signings — which I wouldn’t have believed possible two years ago. But now I’m not so sure, given things such as the goofy use of Mike Fontenot over the past two years, the fact that MB never seemed to be what Lou wanted — essentially, a left-handed RBI machine — and moves like trading Pie and getting Heilman.

Discuss. Note that I’m asking a question, not making a declarative statement.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 10:14 AM CDT reply actions  

I would HOPE it isn't possible that is where the problem lies, but clearly something has gone wrong

Honestly, Lou was using Fontenot plenty earlier in the year, so I don’t buy that he didn’t really want him on the roster or anything like that. I just don’t think that Lou is a very good manager, or knows how to use a roster at all at this point in his career.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 4, 2010 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's definitely a valid question.

Unfortunately, it’s also really hard for those of us outside the clubhouse/Cubs organization to answer. I’d also throw the Aaron Miles signing in there. That seemed like Hendry cherry-picking some odd stats to justify signing a guy for a job that Bobby Scales could’ve done just as well. And when you look at how much Lou played Scales last year, it seems like if Hendry had just gone to Lou and said, “Hey, how ’bout we just call up this Scales kid to back up the infield?”, Lou would’ve been fine with it.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yup.

I wonder how involved Lou was in personnel decisions after the ‘06-’07 offseason. Even Kosuke, the big signing after 2007, never seemed to mesh with Lou’s style.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, in Kosuke's case...

…Hendry might’ve thought, “Well, Lou worked well with Ichiro, so this shouldn’t be a problem.” But Ichiro is an elite, one-of-a-kind player who’s never struck out to the degree that Kosuke has.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

I consider you to be one of the saner posters on BCB daver ...

and I’d like your input on something. Do you think that Hendry should get a pass on the Kosuke signing because other GMs were equally as fooled? I know where Al and some others come down on this point, but I just don’t get defending Hendry because he was just as stupid/ill informed as a handful of other GMs.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's a really good question

in my opinion. I personally would never give Hendry a hard time over the signing itself. It was a competitive contract, by most accounts. However, the organization has since made some comments and done some things to suggest the expectation that Fukudome would slug, which most people that I talked to at the time felt wasn’t going to happen.

When you think about it, a great deal of money has been spent on LH sluggers who haven’t done the job, and arguably weren’t fit for that role in the first place. I’d be very interested to know what Hendry himself has to say about that.

by Damen Jackson on Aug 4, 2010 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

I think Hendry should get credit for the IDEA of signing Kosuke.

He obviously went a little overboard with the size of the contract, but that’s Jimbo and that’s also what the market drove him to. And I’m not sure Hendry was ill-informed – Kosuke was an elite, superstar hitter in Japan. It didn’t seem out of the question that those numbers would translate to at least a good hitter, coupled with very strong defense, in America.

I still find it refreshing that the Cubs, as an organization, seemed to finally recognize the value of high OBP and that they finally broke a barrier and signed a high-level Asian player. It’s basically been Kosuke’s terrible lack of consistency and high strikeout rates – plus, and I say this only half-jokingly, the fact that he looks so bad striking out – that have all but killed his major league career.

But I don’t think it was stupid to sign Kosuke; it was just a very high-stakes gamble that never really paid off in full and, admittedly, looks more than ever like it never will.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

I just think he's not making adjustments to the way ML pitchers pitch to him.

Whether that’s from an egotistical standpoint or something else I don’t know. The guy can obviously hit and has good strike-zone recognition, but he routinely falls into prolonged stretches where he seemingly abandons his “good Kosuke” approach and just looks LOST. It’s a shame, because when he’s on he’s the most patient hitter on the team and would be a perfect fit as a leadoff man.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Aug 4, 2010 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

true

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Aug 4, 2010 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, it's definitely a shame.

We’ve been speculating for years now about the fatigue factor. Of course, it’s hard to believe he’s tired this season seeing as how he’s barely played. But maybe it’s mental fatigue, not physical. Perhaps his approach at the plate just demands a very high degree of concentration that he just can’t maintain.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions  

He was somehow able to maintain it over the course of the Japanese baseball season.

Which, if I’m not mistaken, is a bit longer than 4 weeks.

As I've told you before, I never repeat myself.

by santoswoodenlegs on Aug 4, 2010 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Kosuke hits a lot better in most domed stadiums in MLB.

And there are many domed stadiums in Japan. Throw in the fact that Kosuke seems to play best when it’s not too hot …

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but I wonder if Japanese teams...

…are as competitive as major league teams in terms of using video and advanced scouting and such.

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by daver on Aug 4, 2010 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Totally agree on the idea of signing Kosuke.

That made a ton of sense — and it’s why when Kosuke was signed, fans (at least this one) were excited because the Cubs made a splash, spent some money and seemingly addressed a need.

But filling a need is really only part of the equation. I think Hendry becomes so determined to address needs that he overspends before the market fully develops (e.g. spending $30 million on MB when Abreu was later had for about $5 million). When the signings are made, fans get excited because the player is coming to the team AND because they often assume (wrongly sometimes) that a GM knows what he’s doing in terms of the pricetag.

A Hendry defender, at this point, would probably say something like “if you want to make an omelet, you’ve got to break some eggs” — and that’s true. But Hendry has four major contracts (Soriano, Z, Fukudome and Bradley) in which he correctly realized that he needed to make an omelet, but spent WAY too many eggs for the size of the omelets he actually made (to continue with a goofy analogy).

Each of those four deals (hell, those four omelets) were mistakes, but the two that I think were indefensible are Bradley (for obvious reasons) and Kosuke. And I refuse to cut Jimbo any slack because other GMs were just as wrong about Fukudome.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

addendum ...

I’ll say the Soriano signing appears to be a mistake. But he does have four more years to prove me wrong.

by elgato on Aug 4, 2010 11:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, the Soriano signing just seems very extreme...

…but I have a feeling, with Jaramillo, on board, the Cubs will at least get some value out of Alfonso for a while longer. And the Z signing doesn’t bother me too much because it really was market-driven and the national economy was much different back then.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I'd agree that...

…in both Bradley and Kosuke, Hendry put a huge amount of money on the table at a tremendous risk. With Milton, the risk was whether he’d stay on the field health-wise and stay out of trouble. And with Kosuke, it was whether his skills would translate to Major League Baseball. Both of those now look like losing bets. Going forward, all we can really hope is that Hendry has learned from his mistakes and won’t repeat them. For the time being, at least, the Ricketts seem to be offering Jimbo that chance.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, I'm presuming he'll keep his job for several more seasons.

Hendry could be in line for another big ticket signing in 2012. Prince Fielder, for instance.

Contributing Editor, SB Nation Chicago. Please follow us on Twitter!

by daver on Aug 4, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Diamond

was very good last night… I look forward to the next start!

by Ryno G on Aug 4, 2010 6:55 PM CDT reply actions  

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