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Mailing It In: Cubs Lose Another Pathetic Effort, 11-4

Lou Piniella won't be making the trip to San Francisco with the team because his 90-year-old mother has been hospitalized in Tampa and he wants to be with her. That's absolutely the right thing to do for him, I believe.

But things like this are making me believe, more and more, that Lou should simply retire now, and go home. I was wondering why the Orioles would have hired Buck Showalter now rather than wait till the end of a miserable season, and many of you told me -- I think now, correctly -- that they want him to start turning things around and getting an idea of what he has and doesn't have during the last two months of this season. (It appears to be working, at least so far -- the O's are 5-1 under Showalter).

So while I wasn't in favor of it at the time that Lou announced his retirement, maybe now IS the time to give the job to Ryne Sandberg, let someone else finish up the season at Iowa, and get him a head start on 2011. It's clear that these players have quit on Lou -- they're 5-12 since the retirement announcement date (July 20) and have now lost 10 of their last 11. It's reminiscent of the way Jim Riggleman's players quit on him the last couple of months of 1999. That team actually contended for two months, then stumbled, and by the time August came, they were as dead as this bunch. The 1999 team went 19-42 from August 1 to the end of the season, and this group could end up that badly, which would put them close to 100 losses.

There's a difference between then and now -- ticket prices are much higher and there are likely to be a ton of unsold tickets for many of the night and weekday games remaining (16 of the 22 games will qualify under that condition). Making Sandberg manager now would create a little buzz, sell some tickets, and let him get a head start on 2011.

I wasn't in favor of it before, but I've changed my mind. Make a bold move. Thank Lou for his service and let him go tend to his mother, and make Ryne Sandberg Cubs manager.

Star-divide

There's something the same between then and now -- all the rookie pitchers on the staff. In 1999, the following rookie pitchers made appearances for the Cubs: Andrew Lorraine (11 starts), Micah Bowie (11 starts with an ERA of 9.96), Brian McNichol, Richie Barker, Kurt Miller and Steve Rain (who had "top prospect" written all over him after a 1999 minor league season with a 1.66 ERA and 26 saves between AA and AAA, but posted a 5.46 ERA in 53 major league games).

None of those men really belonged in the major leagues.

Can any of you really, TRULY tell me that Thomas Diamond, Casey Coleman, James Russell and Mitch Atkins belong in the major leagues? Of those four, only Russell, I believe, truly has major league talent. Diamond's a nice story, but he's really only here because Cubs assistant GM Randy Bush was his college coach and they're trying to reward him for his hard work in attempting a comeback from Tommy John surgery with a few starts. He's Richie Barker. Casey Coleman -- another good story, the first three-generation pitcher family, but he really doesn't have the velocity, repertoire or mound presence to be a major leaguer. He's Andrew Lorraine. As for Mitch Atkins? He's Brian McNichol, Triple-A roster filler.

James Russell has had some good outings and could be a good back-of-the-bullpen guy. And while I'm at discussing the bullpen, I would like to challenge the next manager (Mr. Sandberg, I'm looking at you) to go with an 11-man pitching staff and quit overworking every man in the pen by using them for only one inning at a time. Get that extra guy on the bench and you won't have to resort to using Carlos Zambrano as a pinch-hitter in the seventh inning of a game when you've actually got a shot, with a couple of hits, at coming back from an 8-0 deficit. Yeah, yeah, I know. Z gets all kinds of cheers when he comes out to PH and maybe he can connect and slam a ball over the bleachers, but the reality is this: Zambrano is now 2-for-25 in his career as a pinch-hitter with 13 strikeouts. He's a terrible choice. The Cubs should have a six-man bench and an 11-man pitching staff. Enough of the seven-man bullpen.

You may have noticed that this recap has almost nothing to do with what actually went on during the Cubs' 11-4 loss to the Reds this afternoon, apart from the remarks about Z. Travis Wood is a fine young arm and held the Cubs without a hit until Koyie Hill broke it up in the sixth inning. I truly wish the Cubs had some arms like that in the upper minors, but the reality is -- with all due respect to Josh and others who write about these things -- they don't, with the possible exception of Jay Jackson (and Andrew Cashner, who is already here). Why don't the Cubs recall Jeff Samardzija and put him in the rotation, and at least get some of their money's worth?

Sorry, I've gotten away from the recap again. OK, here goes: the late-morning rain that ended around 1 pm might as well have stuck around all afternoon, because the Cubs played shoddy defense, walked way too many hitters and please remind me why on Earth Xavier Nady is still on this team? The official scorer was generous to Nady in not charging an error on a ball that Nady just dropped in the ninth inning. That, unfortunately for Atkins, cost him an earned run. Seriously, how much money is left to pay to Nady -- $1 million or so? Just release him. He doesn't belong on a major league roster.

Enough. This is getting 1999-level ugly, and seriously -- maybe it is time for Lou to go home and move on. Ryne Sandberg for manager. Now. It's time.

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Excellent title. I'm glad the "mailing it in" phrase has finally hit BCB.

And that’s just what this team is doing: mailing it in.

I think they should just forfeit the rest of their games….maybe get the #1 draft pick.

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 5:40 PM CDT reply actions  

Ugh ... all I can say.

I have never seen a baseball team with less heart. The talent is there, but the players have quit en masse.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 5:43 PM CDT reply actions  

You're a little too young to remember that 1999 team.

This is getting to that level.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

I remember 1998 a little bit,

But I didn’t really follow baseball, or the Cubs, until 2003.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 5:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

I was 10 in 1999 and I remember how bad that team was

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Great Post Al.

I come here to “hear the news straight up”. Even tho I may not like it, I count on hearing the truth here. The truth is Lou has “already retired”… he still happens to occupy a place on the bench tho. He’s obviously lost the ability to motivate this team, or, is unable to solve the issues. I realise this yrs cubs are a bad product… but, this bad???

on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown

by jeffstorm2 on Aug 9, 2010 6:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

Sorry kid, they ain't got the talent...

… a change of heart isn’t going to change the fact that this is one godawful team.

We have to demand more!

by copingwiththecubs on Aug 8, 2010 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree completely

At this point even Trammel would be preferable.

Unfortunately, our “holographic owner” has rendered this a moot point.

by bluekoolaide on Aug 8, 2010 5:43 PM CDT reply actions  

Team looked just as dead the three games Tram managed

I don’t think anyone’s gonna wake this group up this year.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with this for the most part

I don’t have a problem with Ricketts’ taking the year to assess what’s going on, nor do I need him coming out and making statements every week about the state of the club. His decision to retain Hendry, however, is quite disappointing.

by shoemile on Aug 9, 2010 1:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

In light of what we know, perhaps

He has guaranteed Hendry no more than that he will still be the GM of the Cubs on Opening Day 2011. For a director-level employee, that’s a terribly short time for him to justify his existence to the brand-new CEO.

“Your first three quarters under our review procedures have shown diminishing returns based upon historical numbers on per-week and per-month results. We will discuss this again after 3 more quarters have passed, but at your level and salary, we believe that if you cannot deliver results commensurate with past performance within a year and a half, we may have no choice but to explore other options.”

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 9, 2010 1:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

You're absolutely right

But then, instead of rebuilding, Hendry has to transform a fifth place team into a contender right away to save himself. That sounds like a lot of patchwork, which could/will set this team back .

by shoemile on Aug 9, 2010 2:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

Depends on the budget, really

If Hendry is faced with the Herculean task of attempting to rebuild this team in the offseason with no additional cash, then he may very well resign before Spring Training. If he is granted exceptional cash above and beyond budgetary numbers, to (say) acquire Cliff Lee, then we may be seeing a new era of attempting to patch holes and contend at any cost.

I believe that this would set a poor precedent in terms of spending going forward – essentially handing over the keys to both the SUV and the liquor cabinet on one ring to a single man. For that reason, I think that Hendry should be given just enough rope – $145M worth of it – to either figure out a way to begin to shift the sails on this club or hang himself before April 1, 2011. That doing the former would take a miracle is of no consequence. He’s pulled off the unthinkable before, maybe he can do it again.

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 9, 2010 4:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

it also greatly depends on what Tom

considers to be an acceptable level of performance in 2011. They might have a target for payroll that he has to get the team under or a reasonable number of wins or just an overall movement towards where they need to be – any which way it is pretty normal for one of the top people in a company to remain in power with a new owner/ceo/chairman of the board…regardless what the masses on here want

I Love Larry - Brick are you looking at random things around the room and saying that you love them - I Love Larry
Currently 34,839 on the Season Ticket Wait List - Expected age of being #0: 119

by hansman1982 on Aug 9, 2010 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's certainly his choice

But if the team continues to look like this, it’s gonna cost him some money.

Personally, I think Ricketts should have made a move or two (Pinella, maybe Hendry) already, both to prep for next year, and to prevent this garbage the Cubs are currently putting on the field (which surely is “not selling”). I would not give Ricketts a very good grade as first-year CEO of the Cubs business. He, his team — whatever — have largely been MIA as the team crumbles.

But, it’s his choice to stand pat and lose money (and fans). I wonder how ticket sales will go next year.

by cubmudgeon on Aug 9, 2010 7:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

Amen, brother!

"Don't shed any tears. You think about this: Here I am, the grandson of a slave. And here the whole world was excited about whether I was going into the Hall of Fame or not. We've come a long ways." BUCK O'NEIL

by HotDogDude on Aug 9, 2010 9:17 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Agree completely...

…and if Ricketts is smart (and I’m hoping he proves he is) he understands that the success the Cubs have or don’t have will be directly related to the people he has running the team from the GM on down.

Trust me, you don’t want an Al Davis who pokes his head in everything that goes on with the team. You want quality people running the show (just as Ricketts stated in his initial press conference) and hold them accountable.

Baseball (like most other team sports) wins when you have a strong organization from the head of baseball operations on down. When you have that, you will see better decisions on roster assembly, better decisions on contracts given out, a more sound philosophy in the farm system and the right manager chosen who is inline with your organizational philosophy.

The Cubs have not had these qualities since Dallas Green was here, and let’s all hope they can somehow get it back in place.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Rec'd

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well said Clutch.

A lovely story:

One day, long, long ago, there lived a woman who didn't whine, nag or bitch. That would be me....

But that was a long time ago and it was just that one day.

The end

by sue369 on Aug 9, 2010 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

In general, a good post... just one question?

Why did Tom Ricketts promise to take cubs to the top?! Are you saying he’s a liar???

on the sands of hesitation, lie the bones of countless millions, who, at the brink of the best, sat down to rest, and resting...they died. Author Unknown

by jeffstorm2 on Aug 9, 2010 5:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Clean house now.

This season is unsalvagable. Might as well play the young kids, get their manager (Ryno) in to help them adjust to the bigs, and figure out what we need to add or subtract for next year. It could be called “Spring Training Part Deux.”

"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.

by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 8, 2010 5:44 PM CDT reply actions  

Mr. Sandberg your August Call up is waiting for you...

Lou… I hope your mother is feeling better soon, go be with her…

This Space Intentionally Left Blank in Silent Protest of Our 2010 Cubs

by Endrick on Aug 8, 2010 5:44 PM CDT reply actions  

No

Showalter has a proven history of building young teams. He isn’t the best at finishing the job, but he can build a wonderful foundation for you.

He is perfectly suited to finish out a season.

Sandberg may or may not have that skill set. And Showalter also isn’t arguably the greatest living Oriole, like Sandberg is with the Cubs. He doesn’t have the same expectations as a savior.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 5:45 PM CDT reply actions  

Showalter isn't just "finishing out a season", though.

Get Lou out of there. His time is done.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fine. Get Lou out.

But you also give Sandberg a fresh start.

Showalter is ideal for rebuilding a team. Sandberg may or may not be able to do that, and the 2011 Cubs aren’t exactly going to be fresh-faced rookies eager to please the teacher.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Or, maybe some of them will.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Uh-huh

I have a sick feeling Sandberg thinks that he just has to play a tape of his HOF speech and he’ll win 100 games.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not the case at all.

If that were the case, he wouldn’t have ridden the buses at the lowest level of the minor leagues to learn the craft of managing.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good for him

Joe Maddon did that, too, and rode the big-league bench as a second banana for a long time before he got his chance, too.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Joe Maddon isn't Ryne Sandberg.

The situations aren’t comparable.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Correct, sir

Maddon is much more accomplished in baseball management than Sandberg is.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, NOW, yes.

In some ways, you are like Jessica. You have an irrational dislike of Sandberg, so even if he cured cancer tomorrow, you’d likely find a way to criticize him.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:40 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

It's not an irrational dislike, Al

Like I said below, if I handed you his resume with the name redacted, you would throw it in the trash, or at least put it in the bottom of the pile. Only because he’s Ryne Sandberg do you want him.

And you’re basing his fitness for the job on his willingness to sit on buses for five months of the year and live in pits like Peoria and Des Moines.

Now THAT, in my view, is irrational.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:59 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I think

Ryne Sandberg would be on the short list for a lot of managerial vacancies if the Cubs don’t hire him.

It’s not every day a popular, hall of fame player who spent 4 years winning titles and learning the managing ropes in the minors happens to come along.

I’m not sure exactly what pedigree you want from a manager, but most of the time if a guy is available, it’s because he’s failed one or more time elsewhere. Either that, or he lacks experience. Sandberg has never failed, and he has at least some managing experience.

I know you laugh at minor league experience, but I’d rather have someone who made actual managing decisions at any level than a guy who was second or third fiddle in the major leagues and never had to make any tough decisions. I don’t know what line of work you’re in, but in most, there is a big difference between making suggestions and making decisions, and I’d much rather have someone with experience with the latter.

DEJESUS!!!

by tomas21 on Aug 8, 2010 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't laugh at minor-league experience

I think it needs to be blended with major-league experience.

I can see Sandberg being in line for a big-league coaching position someplace. I just haven’t heard his name in connection with any big-league managerial job, either ones that had opened or ones that might open, except this one.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 7:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

At this point in time I think it's obvious he's being groomed

For the Cubs job, so I wouldn’t expect his name to come up in regards to other teams. If he’s passed over, I could see him being a candidate elsewhere.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 8:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

There are plenty of managers...

… who have succeeded without major league experience.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

So what is it about Sandberg

that you think makes him as good as them, Al? And please, leave his HOF speech out of it.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

His HOF speech was amazing!

In all seriousness, he’s winning at different levels. I think that makes him qualified.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

To be a bench coach on a major-league team

or to perhaps manager a team like the Royals.

Not for the Cubs.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

If he is qualified to manage the Royals, he's qualified to manage the Cubs.

They are both major league teams.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

OK, Al, this is ridiculous

You know exactly what I mean when I suggest that.

If you fall flat on your face in KC, nobody cares.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

They do in KC

Royals fans care.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

How often do managers leave for other jobs

Unless there’s a problem with the owner or GM? It’s not guaranteed if Ryno takes the Royals to a few division titles he’s gonna be running to take over the Cubs.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 8:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Last I checked

They’re both major league teams.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not for the Cubs???!!! Seriously???!!!

"Don't shed any tears. You think about this: Here I am, the grandson of a slave. And here the whole world was excited about whether I was going into the Hall of Fame or not. We've come a long ways." BUCK O'NEIL

by HotDogDude on Aug 9, 2010 9:22 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

His willingness to start at the bottom to learn his craft.

His steady rise in the organization and having been praised by his co-workers and management on his hard work and effort in learning the job.

The fact that players like Castro and Colvin, who have been managed by him, raving about him as a good manager. In fact, since we are likely to have more players managed by him over the next couple of years on the major league team, this is an even better reason.

His HoF credentials — not his speech — and the hard work he had to do to get there, also speak for him. He wasn’t a HoF player when he came to the major leagues. He had to work at it. I know he will demand that kind of effort from every single one of his players.

His popularity with fans is a bonus, not the reason. But there is something to be said about having a manager who has been a Cub, understands what it’s like to be a Cub, knows the city and the fans and the media here.

Obviously, Joe Girardi is the best choice. But he will not be available. Sandberg is the best available.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh, Zing!

Sounds like someone didn’t have his coffee today!

Yes'm

by OrangeGore on Aug 8, 2010 7:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Joe Girardi

spent one year as Torre’s bench coach in New York before he became the manager of the Marlins, just two years after retiring as a player. He had never managed a team anywhere and had a grand total of one year of coaching experience.

by qccub on Aug 8, 2010 6:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

He also has an engineering degree from Northwestern

and he was cited as managerial material often during his playing career. Sandberg never was, best as I can remember.

Girardi also managed the Marlins, which isn’t exactly like managing the Cubs.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Loved him as a player

loved Jody Davis as a player, too. Don’t want to see either one of them managing the Cubs.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Love of Jody Davis

is probably a disqualifier of men for judging MLB fitness.

[...]when Giants coach Steve Owen, a certified defensive genius, was asked how he planned to stop Nagurski, he said: "With a shotgun, as he’s leaving the dressing room."

by NobodySpecial on Aug 8, 2010 9:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

Weak argument

What in the hell does having an engineering degree have to do with managing a baseball team? If that’s the standard, lets hire Stephen Hawking or some guy from NASA. I don’t think you need to be a Rhodes Scholar to manage in the major leagues; it’s probably more about dealing with people and personalities.

I don’t know if Sandberg is the guy for the job or not; I would prefer Girardi if he is available. I don’t think he is anywhere near as poor a candidate as you seem to think he is.

by qccub on Aug 8, 2010 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Girardi was also a catcher

and that traditionally has made for a good transition to managing.

Also, very few superstar athletes have become successful coaches in any sport. Larry Bird had a good run — although he was supported by strong assistants.

If we insist on getting rid of Lou early, then give the job to Trammel and have Sandberg be a coach.

I just don’t think this ends well. Better to let Lou finish, warts and all.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

If we insist on getting rid of Lou early, then give the job to Trammel and have Sandberg be a coach.

This might be a reasonable solution.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think what we'll ultimately wind up seeing is NO change

while the minor league season is still going on. The iCubs are playoff bound and why penalize their Iowa franchise and fans by yanking their manager with only four more weeks in the minors’ season? The Cubs parent organization has a responsibility to the Iowa team ownership and fan base. That’s part of an affiliation understanding, if not specifically set out in writing.

Ryno will likely come up AFTER the iCubs season ends and then take a spot on the bench with other September player call-ups. Then for the next month he’ll begin to evaluate what’s there.

Remember, Ryno is hardly a LOCK for the 2011 manager’s job. I think the Cubs will take their time in the off-season before announcing the new manager (and coaching staff). Might be Ryno- might not.

Folks, I think the coaching faces you see in the Cubs dugout now will be there for the duration of this season- unless THEY themselves resign, retire or ask to leave before Oct. 4.

We have met the enemy and they are us! ~ Walt Kelly, Pogo, 1971

by Zeke on Aug 9, 2010 8:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Joe Torre

is a borderline hall of famer as a player. Seriously, if he hadn’t played most of his career in the second dead ball era, he’d be in.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Torre and Lenny Wilkens

were excellent players who were Hall of Fame-caliber. I don’t consider them to be on the level of Sandberg or Bird.

But if you want to add them, fine. The list of greats who flopped is stil longer.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good call on Wilkens

I barely follow the NBA, so I didn’t think of him.

Bob Gainey was a great coach and player in the NHL

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Joe Maddon

never played in the big leagues either.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

You have insight, no?

How calculated was the timing of his announcement? And who, in your opinion or in fact, suggested that he manage out the string?

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

At this point...

…I don’t disagree that keeping Lou around is looking more and more like it is meaningless.

If Sandberg is your guy, go ahead and hire him now and let him see what the club is for the last 40-50 games. If Sandberg isn’t your guy (or you want to explore other candidates), let Trammel finish the season and then start the new manager evaluatin process.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with you on Sandberg.

I’m a little nervous to see him as manager at any point. Those of us who don’t pay attention won’t have any expectations for him this year or much for him next year. But what happens the year after when we have expectations again and they play like this? I know we have to find out what he’s got.

It seems to me the only managers who last over five years are the ones who win a World Series. If Sandberg doesn’t win, he’ll go down as a failure—one of the greatest Cubs players who failed as a manager.

Seems like the best idea—if you care about his legacy—is to make him manager when he has the best chance to succeed.

by mic on Aug 8, 2010 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Also, re: calling up Samardzija...

because he’s awful and he should’ve played in the NFL.

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 5:46 PM CDT reply actions  

Which team would take him?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Bengals

They take everybody.

"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.

by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 8, 2010 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Well done

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 5:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Would choosing baseball over football count?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

He violated the gold grill clause

by not having one.

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Diamond needs to be cut.

Pun aside, watching the guy today, you’re right – he has no business being in the majors. Maybe not even in Triple-A. He’s outright terrible. Makes me long for the good old days of Dickie Noles.

Russell was a (sort of) bright spot. He looked OK – or at least “not terrible” in his stint.

by MN exile on Aug 8, 2010 5:46 PM CDT reply actions  

Russell is bad

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

One bad outing and he's terrible?

Did he look terrible when he struck out 10 batters in his major league debut?

Sheesh. Give Diamond one or two more starts, if Cashner isn’t going to be given a chance.

by JohnM on Aug 9, 2010 6:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, actually he didn't look very good striking out ten.

He had a lot of long counts and threw way too many pitches. His velocity barely broke 90. It was an outing that looked better in the box score than in reality.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:42 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Agreed.

His first outing was labor-intensive.

I spent 90% of my money on women and drink. The rest I wasted - George Best

by Blue W on Aug 9, 2010 8:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

Not a bad idea...

Why not Ryno? But your idea of putting butts in seats is probably closer to the truth. Give Cub fans something to root for and Ryno a chance to see what he has to work with. It’d be funny if he finished the season and then said in his best Lou Brown voice, “awwww I dunno”.

by Fully Kreusened on Aug 8, 2010 5:46 PM CDT reply actions  

Lou should retire, Trammell should take over for now

and the Cubs need to do a real manager search as soon as the season is over. This should no be handed to him.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 5:46 PM CDT reply actions  

You're presuming of course, that the Cubs have already decided that Ryno is their guy for 2011.

In which case, your idea may have merit.

But if they haven’t made that decision yet, do you really think they’d trot Ryno out there on an interim basis to manage the rest of a garbage season and then go hire somebody else (Girardi, Listach, etc)?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 5:47 PM CDT reply actions  

No, they wouldn't do that.

I suppose they could have Alan Trammell finish out the year. But seriously, it’s time for Lou to go home.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 5:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry already promised an exhaustive search for the new manager...

Even if chances are Ryno gets the gig, they have to do the stupid dance where they bring in 5-6 different guys for interviews – and the whole process takes a month. If Hendry had any balls, he could have fired Lou after the 18-1 loss (at home) against the Brewers and that would have been that.

Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!

by DKT on Aug 8, 2010 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

MLB Rooney Rule??

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry is exhausted, he needs another nap...

"Don't shed any tears. You think about this: Here I am, the grandson of a slave. And here the whole world was excited about whether I was going into the Hall of Fame or not. We've come a long ways." BUCK O'NEIL

by HotDogDude on Aug 9, 2010 9:33 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Think we can bring in Girardi in mid-season?

;-)

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 5:49 PM CDT reply actions  

Can't Wait

Just arrived in San Francisco – at least it’s Jerry Garcia bobble head night tomorrow.

by 08Cubs on Aug 8, 2010 5:49 PM CDT reply actions  

FYI

I’m going to this series, too. Primary reason for my trip: visiting my dad who lives there. I like the ballpark, too. Will be posting from SF the next four days.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

I went to a game in SF last year.

Can’t make it this year … it would be great to meet up with you if I was out there.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Safe travels and have fun, Al

Bad baseball (especially in a beautiful place) is better than no baseball.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bad baseball (especially in a beautiful place) is better than no baseball.

Very true. I hope for at least some good ballgames. Haven’t seen too many of those in Chicago lately.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Your opinion is duly noted

but for me it’s a living hell seeing the Tigers and/or Cubs stumble through a season.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh, it certainly sucks

but come the middle of January, it’ll look pretty good.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Enjoy yourself

San Francisco is a great city. I used to live just up the road in Vallejo for a few years and loved spending a Saturday down in the city. Went to a few games at Candlestick which was not a pleasant experience. Unfortunately the city itself will probably provide you with more entertainment than the Cubs will.

by qccub on Aug 8, 2010 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

I love SF..

Been there many times as my dad has lived there for almost 30 years.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

i know i dont post much on this site

but i read it religously. where are you sitting, Al? I live here and am going to the first three games and it would be cool to finally meet the guy who I read so much

by bbates6 on Aug 8, 2010 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'll be in club level on Mon & Wed.

Section 132, row 26 on Tuesday. Hope to see you there. Same for anyone else who’s out there.

Haven’t bought tickets for Thursday yet.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm section 134

on tuesday, maybe I’l get a chance to introduce myself. thanks.

by bbates6 on Aug 8, 2010 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sounds good!

See you there. I’ll have my Cubs jacket on.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Does it look like this?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

Maybe it will after the series is over.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Eat at Cafe Sport in North Beach.

Great NW Italian cuisine a la Ligurian Sea style seafood.

"Don't shed any tears. You think about this: Here I am, the grandson of a slave. And here the whole world was excited about whether I was going into the Hall of Fame or not. We've come a long ways." BUCK O'NEIL

by HotDogDude on Aug 9, 2010 9:38 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Al

I will probably be at the day game on Thursday. Let me know where your ticket are via e-mail. I would love to meet you.

"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk

by vonde6 on Aug 9, 2010 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

whoops

Read the rest of the post, and I see that you don’t have tickets for Thursday yet. Neither do I.

"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk

by vonde6 on Aug 9, 2010 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

Al

hope to finally meet you in SF- never have met you in Wrigley. We should be able to spot each other- there will likely be 7 people wearing Cubs’ hats- we’ll be two of them. Safe travels.

"Chicago Cubs fans are ninety percent scar tissue." - George F. Will

by Slakkr on Aug 9, 2010 5:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Grilled cheese sandwiches and orange pop 1/2 price

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Devil's advocate

if players quit on managers, isn’t that as much on them?

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 5:51 PM CDT reply actions  

It absolutely is

But when they send Baker, Nady and Hill out there, with a terrible bullpen (sans for Marshall and Marmol), I don’t think they’re expecting to win the game.

"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.

by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 8, 2010 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think Lou quit before the players did.

Go back to last year, with all the LWDYWMTDs he said in post-game interviews after tough losses.

He quit then, and it took the players until the series in Colorado to quit. Some of them may have quit before, but after the series in Colorado, the last players giving any fight quit then. They look like they’re out there to get paychecks instead of pay.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I don't think he "quit"

I just think the Cubs don’t have what it takes

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bobby Scales in LF = the manager quit

And he did that when the team still had some hope left.

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Scales was a sparkplug for a little while

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not last Sept he wasn't

and that is when Lou had him in LF. The Cubs were already out of it, but Lou wanted career minor league vets over those pesky kids, sweetheart.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Which was a nice reward for the kid

Considering his future was about the same as Fuld’s, Hoff’s, and Fox’s in the organization.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not even close. Scales was no "KID"

Fuld especially last year had a future and he was an actual OUTFIELDER. Scales was 32 and long past having any chance on an MLB roster. It is fine to bring guys up as a reward in Sept, playing them daily in a position they have not played in years is insane and typical of what Lou did last Sept. Until the enough balls went over his head, he let him play LF even though he was an IF.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh, man.

Are you EVER going to let this go?

I’ll be glad when Lou is gone for one reason at least — your irrational hatred of him will end.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

I hope that you are right, Al

But Jessica’s reasons for hating Lou could easily apply to anyone who sits in that seat. If her hatred is irrational enough – that is, the reasons are BS – then the next guy might get a pass for doing the same things (caring about lefty-righty, using pitchers to get one out or for just one inning, etc, etc, etc).

"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk

by vonde6 on Aug 9, 2010 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

How is it not close?

Have I missed the days when the guys I mentioned have played in Wrigley this year?

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh, man.

Are you EVER going to let this go?

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think her answer would be "no."

It’s part of her continuing point of how Lou is bad. He will never do anything right.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ok to the rest of you

So playing Scales DAILY in Sept was a good thing?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

ENOUGH ALREADY!

LET IT GO!

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think he was just trying to see what Scales could do in LF.

Don’t you think you’ve overstated your point just a little bit?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Who cares what Scales could do in LF?

He had no future and had not played the position in YEARS. Again you play guys who might actually have a future .

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

You forget

That the Cubs had to adjust their lineup because [name redacted] had been suspended by the team for his comments.

So the lineup might have been different post-suspension. If that means Scales in LF, does that really justify holding the issue against Lou like this?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Actually the problem was not "name redacted"

It was Soriano FINALLY admitting he was injured. I don’t know how hard it is to grasp that playing a guy who is 32 and not played the position in YEARS is a bad idea over 4 younger guys with varying degrees of value ( Fuld, Colvin, Fox & Hoff)

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Then why would they call up So Taguchi first?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Cubs were out of it....why not?

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Um the whole point of my "sweetheart" exchange with Lou

was that when a team is out of it , YOU PLAY YOUNG PLAYERS to see how they do and give them more MLB experience. It’s fine to bring up someone like Scales, it is not fine to start him every day.

I love how everyone is bashing me , but most people including Al agreed with me at the time.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't say I'm bashing you at all...

I’m just saying I had no problem with him playing scales.

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's what I remember saying too.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe they're using hindsight

And seeing that the Fuld’s and Hoffpauir’s aren’t exactly young guys either, and have no use to the team this year either.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fuld was a prospect last year

and Colvin absolutely was. In fact when Lou was trying to evade my question what he said was " We did not call up Colvin till September, Sweetheart" , when the very first words in my question were ’In Sept". Colvin, Fuld , Fox and Hoff all had more business in LF than Scales.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fuld isn't good

Someday you’ll get that. And again, the organization brought Colvin up for emergencies, otherwise he would’ve been up to begin with instead of So Taguchi.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

So hitting .299 last year was a fluke?

He has no speed or defense ?or more importantly Scales is better?
Fuld is not a starter but he could have been a good bench guy just as he was last year.

If any other manager put in a 32 year old minor leaguer who had not played in LF for YEARS over 4 younger players who had, you would I hope be all over him but somehow Lou’s 1800 wins made it a decent move until again to many balls went over
Scales’s head.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've said time and time again

The move was irrelevant. None of those guys has a future with the team, as we’ve seen this year. It’s quite transparent why this is such an issue to you, as it took away at bats from Sam Fuld. If Hoff and Fox would’ve been out there with their stone hands you’d be whining all the same.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Colvin has no future with the team?

It does make a difference but obviously we disagree and you think playing a guy who can not say this enough had not played the position in years and who did in fact suck at it was better than the four younger players including Colvin.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Colvin was coming off TJ surgery

And was brought up as an emergency when So Taguchi went down (otherwise he would’ve been called up before, yes?). As far as the other three, well, they all suck, so as I said before, it didn’t matter.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

????

Colvin was NOT coming off TJ. He had played daily in the minors.

The “other” 3 were all younger players who had experience playing LF
Even HOFF would have been better than Scales in LF.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Colvin had TJ surgery after the 2008 season

And thus the team didn’t want him playing too much, otherwise he would’ve been brought up instead of a 38 year old So Taguchi.

The “other” three had no future with the team, as we’ve seen.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not true

Colvin was brought up because the other available players had scattered and he was basically the one theycould find. His season did not warrant a Sept. call up. I expect they might have called up DuBois if he was around. They had stories about this at the time. It was not TJ surgery since again he played everyday and in winter ball, they clearly were not concerned about overusing him.

However it is also silly to focus on Colvin since again ANY of the 4 was far more qualified to play and had far more of future than Scales the 32 year old infielder. There was no reason at all to let him play in LF.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Colvin underwent TJ surgery after 2008

And had to leave the AZ fall league. You can look it up, if you like.

I agree though, it is silly to focus on Colvin. Silly to focus on the other three as well, since they aren’t major league players.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

By this logic

The Cubs should bring up Hoff this Sept. to catch if Soto gets injured. He deserves the reward for a good minor league season and Castillo and Hill really don’t have any future with the team so why does it matter who catches?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well a LF to C is absurd

but a guy who has not played the OF in several years is also absurd when you have 4 guys who have. Honestly answer me why it is OK to put in a guy who has not been in the OF in years and did in fact let balls go over him ( and under him)?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

It was done because Scales had "paid his dues", so to say

And the other guys had no future within the organization. I thought we went over this?

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh well he paid his dues

Then by all means let him play out of position. Hey Brad Snyder has paid his dues why can’t he play SS in Sept?

Fuld and Colvin had far more of future with the Cubs last fall than Scalsey.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

no kidding

but if a regular gets injured ( and Soto maybe already) I am sure no problem playing an aging minor leaguer out of position to replace them even if you have guys who can play that position because aging minor leaguers deserve to be rewarded by playing daily in a position they don’t normally play.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again, the SS skillset is much different than LF

If, however, there are four guys who have no future with the team, I don’t care which one plays, which has been my point all along. I wouldn’t have cared if Fuld played, or Hoff, or Fox, or So Taguchi.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

LF is a different skill set then 2B

which is the position Scales plays.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

and Soriano...

…and Biggio.

Now Yount, he played SS so I won’t mention him. Oops, I guess I just did.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 7:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

LET IT GO, JESSICA. IT’S OVER. WE KNOW HOW YOU FEEL. ENOUGH.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I'm more interested in how Al did this.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Kind of like this

by Danwood on Aug 8, 2010 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

In the main text area:

<h2>Foo</h2>

Foo

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 9, 2010 1:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

Aw, man

I was hoping SBN had implemented real tags in comment boxes. I could have so much fun with fonts.

Pout.

"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root

by Clutch16 on Aug 9, 2010 1:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

I know what you mean.

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 9, 2010 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

Okay.

Let’s see if this works.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 9, 2010 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

nope - still small print...

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 9, 2010 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

You need your eyes checked. ;-)

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 9, 2010 5:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again Al

I did NOT bring this up but when someone says Scales was a sparkplug or a Kid I get to respond and when it goes on that this it was OK for Lou to have played him in LF I get to respond to that too. Please note it was NOT me who originally made mention of Scales. According to your view I am just supposed to let those comments pass and I think you know me better than that.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'll take the blame here for bringing it up

It just seemed like the clearest example of a manager making odd decisions with no real chance of working out. Once last year’s team fell out of the tie with St. Louis, Lou started doing odd things with the lineup that carried over into this year (ARam has a great history here, but there is no way a manager should put a guy hitting .160 in cleanup). To me, all those things just seem like a manager mailing it in or at least unable/unwilling to challenge his own tendencies and assumptions.

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 7:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, you could let them pass.

Every single person on this site knows how you feel about it. LOU PINIELLA knows how you feel about it. You don’t need to do the dead-horse-beating again.

It was just another chance for you to bash Lou. Very unseemly.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh gosh I wouldn't want to be unseemly

responding someone suggests Scales is a kid, a sparkpug and it was just dandy to start him in LF in Sept. over the younger guys. It was then as now indicative of how Lou thinks and we have had another season to suffer through the coddling of vets be they major league vets or minor league vets.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Jessica.

It’s over. It was almost a year ago.

LET IT GO.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Is there a copy/paste act behind these huge letters?

I’ve literally LOL’ed at each one (except Danwood’s).

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nope.

I’m just going to keep doing it until she stops.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Couldn't resist a slam, could you?

Please keep in mind that Jessica is a longtime personal friend of mine.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, why did you let him evade your question?

Why haven’t you been able to corner him at a convention these past few years and tell him exactly what you think of him – just like you do here?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Um actually I did

I responded that I HAD asked about Sept though I did not tell him what I thought of him. He said that “scalsey” was a perfectly fine option for LF.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, there you go.

Lou thought he was a perfectly fine option for LF. Obviously you didn’t. So instead of just leaving it at that and moving on, you continue to hound the guy at just about every opportunity. Which obviously is your prerogative – so if it feels good to you, do it.

But building on a basic BCB principle of commenting (don’t say anything here you wouldn’t say to their face), I’m just wondering why – since you had the opportunity – you didn’t tell Lou what you think of him and his managing methods in a similar vein to what you use here.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 7:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

I did tell him

Though not in the same words I might use here , I told him I could not comprehend how unlike ever other manager in baseball he chose to let a career minor league player play daily over younger players. I am sorry but Lou and I don’t talk regularly or I am sure I would be happy to tell him more.

I don’t think anyone but Lou and Shoemile and You(?) think playing a 32 year old career minor league infielder daily at LF when you have 4 other options is a “fine option”.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

I like Bobby

That’s it. I just like him. I probably wouldn’t play him in LF.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

I had no problem with Scales in the IF

Playing him daily in LF was what sent me over the edge.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Gotcha

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 7:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well then, it was worth it... ;-)

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 7:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fontenot and Baker still had a future

with the team in 2009. Having Scales play over them wouldn’t have bothered you? I thought Lou was supposed to manage to win games.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Depends on the game

Guys like Scales are OK for a start once in a while but usually only back up.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

As I've stated before

It was when the Cubs were out of the running, and three of those options had no future with the Cubs as we’ve seen, while the fourth was only brought up for emergencies.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Even if you believe none of them had a future

( and of course disagree) all of them were better left fielders. You can spin it any way you want but letting Scales start in LF was a terrible idea both as a way to win a ballgame and as a way to manage players.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Worse than Fuld? Yeah.

Worse than bulky guys like Hoff and Fox? Disagree.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 7:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

"bulky" guys

who had actually PLAYED LF. Seriously how hard is that to get. They played OF including LF. Scales did not. That would be the Cubs organization playing them there. not me. They were not great left fielders but again they were in fact outfielders.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

He did

but not only had Fox & Hoff played LF they had even played it in the majors. The point is 4 guys who can play the OF and one guy who is an infielder not to hard to figure the better option. You do remember he was a bad left fielder right? I remember the last straw was when a ball went past him for a triple, after that Lou finally stopped playing him in LF.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

And my point is he was rewarding him in a lost season

Because the other options had no future with the club, outside of Colvin’s special circumstances. This clearly was the ultimate sin, since it involved Lou Piniella not playing Sam Fuld. It’s obvious why you’re so invested in this, but in the end, neither one of us is going to change the other’s mind.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 8:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

You won't believe me but it was NOT about Fuld

who actually was not 100% after um crashing into a wall. It was about watching Scales day after day mess up at a position he had no business playing.
Go through some of those game threads if you don’t remember.
Again it is fine to reward minor league guys, just don’t play them every day and out of position. The reward is being on the roster and getting a LITTLE playing time but unless you have a future or needed skill set, nothing more.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

And for me, arguing varying degrees of bad don't matter

Hoff, Fox, and Scales were all bad outfielders with no future on the Cubs, so I simply didn’t care.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ok to just you

So bitching about Lou DAILY all season is a good thing?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

No

This what I tangled with Lou over at the convention. It was indicative of the kind of manager he is and it played itself out in a nice ugly way this year as he continued to play worthless vets over younger players.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lou's not going to be the manager soon.

Can you let it go? It’s done. It’s over. It doesn’t matter any more.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

I did NOT bring it up.

but when it was brought up I have no problem reminding people Scales was no “sparkplug” or “kid”. It was not an isolated incident.

Let’s remember how much grief you gave me saying Nady was worthless in April.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

At least he called you sweetheart

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

Two of those games were with Trammell managing

Were Cubs players disappointed in Lou leaving for three days like Doggie was?

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Please bring Fuld up now.

Not because he is a great prospect or even has that much of a future with the Cubs but at least he will provide some high energy play. The Cubs need to get SOME life. Also if Soto is in fact out for more than another day, put him on the DL and bring up Castillo. It makes no sense to overtax Soto. They need to do something to make the next six weeks worth watching on some level.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 5:51 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Rec'd

"Whenever one finds himself in the majority, it is time to step back and reflect," Mark Twain.

by WindisBlowingOut! on Aug 8, 2010 5:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh dear lord

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 5:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

What? You have any bright ideas that will make the team suck less?

Especially with the cast of overpaid misfits in the roster?

Hell, pretend it’s September 1.

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with you.

Nady has no business on this team.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Rick Sutcliffe would like a word with you

Shoulda heard him during the broadcast today talking about Nady…

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Really?

What did he say?

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

"I'd like to see Xavier Nady back here next year.

With his swing, I think this ballpark will be very good for him. He could really do the Cubs a lot of good in the future."

He said some other stuff too. Really was all over Nady. I was really surprised

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

WTH????

Has he not been seeing how badly Nady has done this year????

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Apparently not?

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh without a doubt

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Like Aaron Miles?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Naturally.

You seriously think it would happen any other way?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Man.

Sutcliffe has lost it.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I know. I was thinking to myself

Maybe it’s something that ESPN does to them, i.e. Joe Morgan.

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why was Sutcliffe broadcasting today?

It was a 1:20 PM start.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

He sang the 7th inning stretch

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ah, now I understand.

I thought he did the whole game. Guess I forgot to take the guest conductor for the 7th inning stretch into account.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's all good.

Bottom line was that’s what he said. I was a little surprised

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think Sutcliffe is smarter than a lot of you.

with the type of swing Nady has, he has to get consistent ab’s. Offensively I think he would be the best option for 1b next season. He’s hit his entire career and would be a cheap stop gap until the Cubs get these bad contracts off the books.

by troutfishin on Aug 8, 2010 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Screw the "he's got the swing" part

and thumbs-up to the stop-gap part

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

He said he's like

to see Nady back if he can get healthy.

A lovely story:

One day, long, long ago, there lived a woman who didn't whine, nag or bitch. That would be me....

But that was a long time ago and it was just that one day.

The end

by sue369 on Aug 8, 2010 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sutcliffe was loving all over Nady

it was weird.

The 2010 Randy Hundley Fantasy Camp ruled!!!!

by VegasCubFan on Aug 9, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

?

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wait.

Are we talking about Rick Sutcliffe or Joe Morgan?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bring Fuld up,

And it is not a guarantee that he will add life here. For all we know, he could get caught up in the depression that has hit this team and he could become just as lifeless as the rest of the players.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

I doubt that

His career is pretty much flashing in front of him and he needs to do well. He played with high energy last year when he came up and the Cubs were out of it.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bring up Scales

I recall him smiling a lot.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I imagine they will bring him up in Sept.

After all he has paid his dues.I have no problem with that so long as he gets nowhere near the outfield but I hope Barney is brought up to get a little playing time unless of course you want to tell me he has no future so Scales should get all the at bats.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Barney should get some playing time at second

I’m not all that sold on DeWitt. It’ll be interesting to see who the infield backups are next year. Hopefully one of them can play an adequate shortstop.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Don't faint but

we agree on something.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Scales is no longer on the 40-man roster.

I doubt he’ll be back.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

In that case no he won't be.

Too lazy to check but is Barney?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

No.

But Barney is a prospect and Scales is not. Someone could easily be removed from the 40-man to make room for him.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

He’s no Ryan Dempster

<<>>

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

God I wish I didn't agree with this.

But by the numbers, this team MAY be good in 2013, so why not finger the dyke (TWSS – ha ha ha) until then?

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I dare you to ask her

something about ticket sales. Just kidding Doggie. I’m with you about thinking Fuld could bring some energy.

"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 10, 2010 7:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

I haven't heard from him in a while.

He’s probably just basking in glory

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 5:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nope - he undershot

He was saying 72-75 wins. Looks like he was 5-10 high.

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not going to happen.

Didn’t Hendry just say two days ago that the search for the next Cubs manager will be a very exhaustive process that could take “up to two months?”

I mean, it’s fine to discuss the idea of Ryno being “called up” I guess, but there’s zero percent chance that it actually happens.

by kanderber on Aug 8, 2010 5:57 PM CDT reply actions  

It doesn't sound like

this search is going to be rushed.

If the rest of us are going to have to watch bad baseball for the next six-eight weeks, then so should Lou.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

If Hendry did indeed say that,

Then I am inclined to agree with you. This is unfortunate (I’m referring to the search process here) and it means we are stuck watching a lifeless team go through the motions until early October.

Is it football season yet?

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hendry will need many naps...

"Don't shed any tears. You think about this: Here I am, the grandson of a slave. And here the whole world was excited about whether I was going into the Hall of Fame or not. We've come a long ways." BUCK O'NEIL

by HotDogDude on Aug 9, 2010 9:57 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Sorry for the erros

low = Lou
set for a LONG time = set back for a LONG time

by Luis on Aug 8, 2010 5:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

When you have

A ridiculous payroll composed of a lot of dead weight there’s not much you can do.

by Luis on Aug 8, 2010 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

As of now, yes

We’ll see how things look in March.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fuke and Z will probably be gone

He will eat those dollars just to get rid of them.

"It was a perfect situation for the Brewers," Hill said. "They had a guy up there at the plate [in Counsell] who takes a lot of pride in what he does and he practices those situations, so when it does come up, he gets the bunt down to the right side of the field. They have the perfect guy on first base [in Gomez], who is one of the fastest guys in the league, and they had one of the worst fundamental teams on the field, so it was a perfect situation for them."

by louslovechild on Aug 8, 2010 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Cubs situation is unprecedented

At no time in the history of the game has a team with a $145M payroll had so much of it held hostage by multi-year contracts and NTCs. So unless Ricketts increases payroll by another $20M, the only way out of this jam is to let the awful contracts expire and peddle the ones you can get other teams to take on. That could well take 3-4 years.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think they can clean up a lot...

…in the next two years, but it will be costly.

This offseason will be telltale when we see what kind of appetitie Ricketts has to eat money on some of these deals.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think the NTCs are a red herring except for Lee who will be gone

IF you could move Z, Sori , A-Ram or Dome I strongly suspect they would accept it
so long as they got their money.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

You could be right Doggie, and I hope you are

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good points, Jess

Z and Dome I would part with, given the right deal. Sori and A-Ram? They still have value to this franchise.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

They are a bad team

But not this bad. This is a team just cashing paychecks, and looking at the scoreboard to see when the game is over. A new manager could lower the comfort level just enough that they go back to putting in some effort.

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Teehee ^-^

"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon

by Cubbiegoon on Aug 8, 2010 7:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Twice

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

I like Castro, but he needs to do more infield work.

I’ll give him some slack this year because he’s 20. But the rest of this year and spring training, he needs to perfect his infield work and be a major league SS in 2011. Right now, he’s not.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agree 100%.

I love Castro. He’s gonna be there at short for (hopefully) a very long time.

I was really upset with Baker just flat out dropping that DP ball.

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

We'll agree that he's talented

but that the call-up was a PR move, no?

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Castro has a 2.7 UZR so far this season BTW

That’s pretty good, in case you were wondering

by magicblue on Aug 9, 2010 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

Aren't UZIs banned in the city of Chicago?

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

This.

It seems like Al is trying really hard to find a reason to not like Castro, claiming he isn’t fast (he merely has “above average” speed according to Al – despite being tied for 15th in the majors for triples in just 300 at bats) and that he needs to “perfect” his infield work to be an MLB shortstop, despite being in the top half of all shortstops for UZR/150 and making spectacular play after spectacular play.

by Wreckard on Aug 9, 2010 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

I don't think the Cubs want Sandberg, or he would be here

They want Girardi. They are going to hold out for that interview and make a decision in November.

Girardi is the sexy pick. He will be the first big move Ricketts makes. Sandberg is not who they want. He will be an interview candidate and that is it.

"It was a perfect situation for the Brewers," Hill said. "They had a guy up there at the plate [in Counsell] who takes a lot of pride in what he does and he practices those situations, so when it does come up, he gets the bunt down to the right side of the field. They have the perfect guy on first base [in Gomez], who is one of the fastest guys in the league, and they had one of the worst fundamental teams on the field, so it was a perfect situation for them."

by louslovechild on Aug 8, 2010 6:08 PM CDT reply actions  

If there's even a remote chance

of getting Girardi, take it. Take it twice on Sunday.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

That is why Sandberg shouldn't and probably won't sniff Wrigley this year.

Girardi is the choice, but we will see if the Yankees let him go.

"It was a perfect situation for the Brewers," Hill said. "They had a guy up there at the plate [in Counsell] who takes a lot of pride in what he does and he practices those situations, so when it does come up, he gets the bunt down to the right side of the field. They have the perfect guy on first base [in Gomez], who is one of the fastest guys in the league, and they had one of the worst fundamental teams on the field, so it was a perfect situation for them."

by louslovechild on Aug 8, 2010 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

If Hendry and the Cubs liked Girardi so much

They could have hired him four year ago.

I think it’s you who is waiting for Girardi, not the Cubs.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Agreed.

The Yankees won’t let him go.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

OK

Fredi Gonzalez, Brenly, Bobby Valentine, Ted Simmons. Any of them are better candidates.

"It was a perfect situation for the Brewers," Hill said. "They had a guy up there at the plate [in Counsell] who takes a lot of pride in what he does and he practices those situations, so when it does come up, he gets the bunt down to the right side of the field. They have the perfect guy on first base [in Gomez], who is one of the fastest guys in the league, and they had one of the worst fundamental teams on the field, so it was a perfect situation for them."

by louslovechild on Aug 8, 2010 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why?

Because they’ve managed before? They’ve all been fired before too.

Actually, Simmons has never managed. He was a god awful GM who got canned though.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Simmons has had some serious health problems and is 61.

No thanks.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's an insane suggestion

But he’s got to come up with some name that people will recognize and he can convince people is better than Demon Sandberg.

Brenly and Valentine haven’t managed in the majors in almost a decade. Gonzalez is taking over for Bobby Cox in Atlanta.

He’s got nothing.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Apparently Valentine's experience in Japan is worthless

Maybe Gonzalez is taking over in Atlanta, maybe not.

I think you’re the one who has nothing, Josh.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh

So now Ryne Sandberg needs to manage in Japan first before he’s qualified to manage in the bigs?

Your whole point is that the Cubs need to hire a retread. Sorry, we’ve done that with no success.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

If you want to deliberately obfuscate things

and distort and twist my point and put words in my virtual mouth, you’re doing a heck of a job.

Listen, I get it, he’s Ryno. Just admit it’s all about sentimentality and I’ll drop it. Or am I putting words in your virtual mouth?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

I am not sentimental about Sandberg

but I think he is probably the right guy for the job. Girardi is NOT happening. I confess I kind of want Gonzalez, but that is not happening either unless you really want to overpay for him.

I think Sandberg has the skill set & experience the Cubs need and I am definately tired of retreads.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't like retreads, either

But there are a lot of guys out there who aren’t retreads who are more qualified than Sandberg is.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

We get it

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, just the same way

the Ryno-holics keep flogging that horse, AV.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

And if it works?

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I highly doubt it will

But I think if the Cubs are serious about winning instead of marketing, they’ll look elsewhere.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

You always ask me for my crystal ball

Where’s yours?

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

What W-L record satisfies you?

10000000000-0?

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Do you ever get tired of making arguments

that also disqualify the guys YOU want? I mean seriously?

by HuskerCorner on Aug 9, 2010 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think it's a sentimental choice, Not B.

The Cubs have fallen short with their last “superstar” managers. Why not take a chance on Sandberg.

What the F has this team got to lose? Go with the ‘rookie’ manager.

I just don’t see how things can get worse than a team that has shut itself down without anybody to account to right now.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 8, 2010 8:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

It can get a lot worse, SDSJM

Sorry to differ with you, but for most fans, it is a sentimental choice.

Again: Take his name off his resume, and nobody would want him.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

But you keep wanting to take

16 years in the majors off his resume. Yes, playing time counts

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't see it getting to 1950's, The early to mid 60's

or even 1997 levels, Not B. All of that is much worse than the current train wreck.

In my case, it’s not sentimental. It may be for many. I just don’t want to see a Riggleman-esque name.

Bud Black did not have that much experience outside of being a pitching coach. The Padres took a chance. Now, he’s about to get a contract extension.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 8, 2010 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bud Black did not have that much experience outside of being a pitching coach. The Padres took a chance. Now, he’s about to get a contract extension.

DINGDINGDING! Winner.

The Cubs have been there, done that with big-name, old-school, retread managers… those have been the last three hires. That’s now 11 seasons worth of … well, a few playoff appearances, but also several really bad years.

Enough. Let’s try something different.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes

Let’s talk to Joey Cora or Jose Oquendo and see what they think.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Just because they were bench coaches?

Look, you & I are going to disagree on what experience is necessary. You have an opinion of Sandberg that apparently isn’t going to be shifted no matter what.

Cora and Oquendo are likely good managerial candidates. I don’t want either of them with the Cubs.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

And neither is your opinon going to shift, Al

Why do you not want either of them? Because they aren’t Ryno?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not Al, but...

Maybe it’s for the same reason I want Ryno. He looks to be the most qualified candidate.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's exactly why I want him.

Obviously, NBF differs. He’s entitled to his opinion. I disagree with it. If we can do it reasonably without personal attacks — and there have been none here — there’s nothing wrong with this.

Why don’t I want Cora? Because to me, bench coaching with no previous managerial experience anywhere doesn’t really make him any more qualified than Sandberg.

Why don’t I want Oquendo? Ask yourself why, after more than a decade as a coach, he’s never received any managerial offers. Maybe he’s not that good a coach. (And he’s a 3B coach, not a bench coach.)

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

I respect your opinion, Al

and we agree on more than we differ, but I can’t go with you on this.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

And I respect yours, despite our disagreement.

Next year, I suspect we’ll find out who’s right.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

NBF, you sort of tipped your hand

in another thread a couple weeks ago. You alluded to something that happened which really soured you on Sandberg, and it sounded like something off-the-record that affected you personally. All I ask is if you can be intellectually honest with yourself, separate your own individual experience from Ryno’s qualifications, and then form an opinion on the merits of Sandberg as the Cubs manager.

Believe me, I can sympathize. I have plenty of personal dislikes for players (Hunter Pence) and managers (Valentine, LaRussa) for no other reason than they rub me the wrong way. But if it can be reasonably demonstrated that Pence, Valentine, or LaRussa would logically make sense for the Cubs, then I would put my personal feelings aside.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nah, not really, EE

I have no problems with Sandberg personally. He’s a good guy. I just don’t think he’s big-league managerial material, at least not for this job.

His qualifications, IMHO, simply are not strong enough for a job of this caliber.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fair enough

We’ve had reasonable discussions about this and other topics so we’re good.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

btw Joe G. is fine with me too

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Don't know if he would do it

But I wouldn’t reject it out of hand.

BTW, Bobby V would NOT be good with me, despite his experience. Josh has a good point about retreads. I guess we just differ about what qualifies as a retread.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hunter Pence?

Is he really worth a strong dislike. I save that stuff for Garvey, Clemmens, and major league jackasses.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hunter Pence is a minor-league jackass

But he certainly has the potential to become a major-league one.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hunter Pence stands little chance

of being a major-league anything. I can’t work up any great dislike for him.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Pence thing

is only because he saves his best games for the Cubs.

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly

Garrett Jones has that potential, too.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sandberg...

…is clearly not the most qualified candidate and those that say that are not being objective.

He may indeed become a good major league manager, but there is higher risks in hiring someone who has never managed before. It will take him a couple years of making mistakes before he is reaching whatever potential he will have as a big league manager.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think

this is a fair critique, MPH.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm with you on the Riggleman-esque stuff

I definitely don’t want that. The Cubs shouldn’t have to settle for that at this point.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Rec'd

Exactly.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Turn it green

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

I saw him every day for two years

as did a lot of other people whose judgment I respect, and all of us have come to the same conclusion.

I don’t know what you’re seeing, but it’s not what we were seeing.

Maybe Cubs fans really are sheep.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

you have a label

for everyone who doesn’t share your opinion….

by LT on Aug 8, 2010 8:26 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

You go to every game in Peoria?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not now

but in a previous existence, yes.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well could you give a little detail about what you saw in all those games

that convinced you he would be such a bad choice for manager?

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hotheadedness, vapidity,

a by-the-book approach to managing … among other things.

I also think there are better, sharper candidates out there.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

OMG! A valid reason!

If this is your reason for opposing Sandberg, fine. It’s a perfectly valid opinion. I don’t know how Sandberg serving as a bench coach in the majors would change any of that, since you say he can manage after serving as a bench coach.

Nor can I square that with your support of Girardi, who is a hot-headed by-the-book manager.

But hey, at least you’re giving a rational argument rather than just making up qualifications for the job out of thin air. Because this isn’t an argument he needs more experience, it’s an argument that he should never manage the Cubs.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

If he had more experience

it might be different.

But ask yourself this: What has Sandberg ever won in the big leagues?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

So no player who hasn't won a WS as a player should be a manager?

Guess that disqualifies Tony LaRussa, Bobby Cox and Joe Torre.

In fact, Sandberg has played in eight more postseason games than all three of those managers combined.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

And no other organization in MLB

has as urgent of a mission as the Cubs do, Al. None.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

On that, you and I agree.

We just disagree on who should lead that mission.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Your comparison is inapt.

You are, essentially, calling Sandberg a sitcom character, and saying we need a tough-guy old-school general.

Neither is true.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm saying we need

someone with smarts and with experience, not someone who makes the fans swoon at the mention of his name but brings little else to the table.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

You don't know...

…what else he brings to the table because he has never managed at this level.

He may be good or he may not be and only time will tell what the answer is.

The one thing I do know for sure is this; if the organization overall does not improve, chances are any manager is not going to look very good.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

And the role of the 2011-2012 manager may be "sacrificial victim"

If the team stays on budget, the 2011 roster won’t be very good (there will either be holes in the offense or rotation – can’t afford to fix both), and 2012 will just be coming together. On the back of any promises to contend in 2011, that won’t make for very good job security for the manager.

by ClarkFan on Aug 9, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Also, eight more postseason games was incorrect.

It’s ten more. Sandberg played in 10 playoff games. Torre, LaRussa and Cox all played in none.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't have a dog in this fight

But things like “won a ring as a third base coach” says pretty much nothing about someone’s qualifications (And yes, I know Ozzie won one with the Marlins).

The problem is Minor League Manager vs. Major League Bench Coach, should be pretty low on the totem pole if I was heading up the search. Things like managing philosophy, things we simply can’t know for sure as observers outside of the interview room, are a lot more important. Unfortunately, all we really have to go by is job experience, which isn’t really indicative of how one would perform in a head position.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

The most important thing...

…is how will the new managers philosophy match up with the organizational philosophy/direction?

Figuring out what the Cub’s organizational philosophy is has been like predicting the weather.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again

if you put all the prospective Cubs managers’ resumes in a basket, took of their names and sorted them out, Ryno’s would be near the bottom of the pile.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Get over your Sandberg issue...

Al is right he should be managing NOW!

If he sucks and looks like Essian and Kimm, let him go……

If not, lets see what he can do.

by TJ11 on Aug 8, 2010 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Get over yourself, TJ!!!!

I’ll give Al credit: He probably wanted to get his posts and page views up afer a piss-poor game, and he succeeded.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not really.

I just write what I think of the game and the current Cubs situation. You guys do the rest.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good one!!!!!

I am sure that what he was going for!

Did he say something wrong in the recap? Did you watch a different game?

I must have because I thought they played great today!

by TJ11 on Aug 8, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Cheer up, TJ.

You have less than two months of performance art left.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

I will miss this team so much!

It has been a wonderful experience getting to watch this team play!

by TJ11 on Aug 8, 2010 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's been an experience, all right.

On that, we agree.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Joe McCarthy

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

(mini-facepalm)

Girardi’s contract is up at end of this season. If he wants to leave, he can leave, and Yankees wouldn’t be able to do a thing about it.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 6:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

True but irrelevant

If he leaves the Yankees, it will be because they don’t want him back. People who think he’s going to leave NY to manage the Cubs out of love for the organization are living in Candy Land.

Manage Mark Teixeira, CC Sabathia, Alex Rodriguez and Derek Jeter? Nah, he’d rather figure out how to build a team around Ryan Dempster and Alfonso Soriano. And for less money, too!

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

But if we get him season tickets to Northwestern football

he might consider the job.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Well then, why are you a Cubs fan? Wouldn't you rather cheer for Tex, CC, ARod and Jeter?

Given the chance, maybe the guy would just rather manage the Cubs than the Yankees. Is that such a hard thing to believe?

Interesting how we spend so much time here bashing the Eastern Seaboard Programming Network for their love for the Yankees, and then turn around and just assume that somebody like Girardi wants to be a Yankee for life. Do you equate Girardi to the vacuous suits in Bristol?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 8:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

As a corollary, then,

I guess some people want Ryno not because he’s the best for the job, but because nobody better than him could possibly want it.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'll give you credit for qualifying it with "some people"

you changed your usual tiresome “Cubs FANS” tune a bit

by HuskerCorner on Aug 9, 2010 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

huh?!

"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 9, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

But who do you watch games with if you don't like Cubs fans?

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

My fault for making a blanket statement

I should have said MOST Cubs fans.

I think I’ve posted this before, but in the Sandberg debate, only one of the Cubs fans I know personally is in favor of him.

I guess there are differences between the Cubs fans in your circle of friends and the masses at places like this or on sports-talk radio.

Although even the worst poster here is scads more with it than the average caller to the Score or ESPN or Cubs postgame shows.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Doubt there is a remote chance unless Hank Steinbrenner has some loose screws

Girarid has MLB managing job #1, with the guarantee of a talented roster every year. Why leave that for this ulcer-inducing Baseball Hell?

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Exactly

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's already accomplished the big prize in New York

He’s from this area, was a Cubs fan his whole life and ended up playing for them. Plus his wife is from the Chicago area, and his father isn’t in great shape.

Of course, your question could be asked of anybody: Why do you want to manage the Cubs?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

But it's the Yankees.

A-well-a Byrd, Byrd, Byrd, well the Byrd is the word.

by mikegncb34 on Aug 8, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

True

but this is the Cubs. It wouldn’t work with most others in that situation, but with Girardi, it might.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

The truth is I hope you are right

I’d love to see Girardi as the manager. I’m still don’t understand why Hendry was so hot to hire Piniella in 2006, especially after Lou essentially quit on Tampa Bay. I just don’t see Girardi leaving the Yankees, and the Yankees not giving him every possible incentive to stay.

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Girardi is my #1 choice.

But it is wishful thinking to believe he would walk away — unless he’s not given a contract extension before the end of the season. The Yankees will want him back.

Hell, Dusty is expecting a contract extension. I hope he gets it, because this Reds season won’t be repeated — just as the inexplicable Padres continue on their merry way.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 8, 2010 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

He will be given an extension AFTER the season.

The Yankees have a policy against doing contracts during the season.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

BUT.....

if one person in human history would blow offf the NYY….Joe is it….

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

No, he won't.

Not sure why you think this.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, I'm not sure what KC is basing his opinion on

but you can’t state unequivocally that “HE WON’T”

It’s all conjecture at this point

by HuskerCorner on Aug 9, 2010 9:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

Why the hell is everyone so anti-anything Sandberg?

I put at least 10 people ahead of him.

"It was a perfect situation for the Brewers," Hill said. "They had a guy up there at the plate [in Counsell] who takes a lot of pride in what he does and he practices those situations, so when it does come up, he gets the bunt down to the right side of the field. They have the perfect guy on first base [in Gomez], who is one of the fastest guys in the league, and they had one of the worst fundamental teams on the field, so it was a perfect situation for them."

by louslovechild on Aug 8, 2010 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'd be okay with Sandberg

Girardi would be cool too. It’s not really a pressing concern to me.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I despise him.

I think the Cubs refuse to get rid of him for the same reason that they won’t get rid of Lou. They are nice and won’t do it to a class guy. If he was ready to manage a high profile organization, he would have received offers from another team.

"It was a perfect situation for the Brewers," Hill said. "They had a guy up there at the plate [in Counsell] who takes a lot of pride in what he does and he practices those situations, so when it does come up, he gets the bunt down to the right side of the field. They have the perfect guy on first base [in Gomez], who is one of the fastest guys in the league, and they had one of the worst fundamental teams on the field, so it was a perfect situation for them."

by louslovechild on Aug 8, 2010 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Because he's Ryno, of course

He made a nice speech at the HOF about “playing the right way.” And he’s paid a grand total of not even four years in the minor leagues. And he was forced to live in hellholes like Peoria and Des Moines. So he’s “paid his dues.”

Some fans truly think Sandberg deserves a shot based on his credentials. Most, I think, support his bid based on emotion and sentimentality.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's your own prejudice talking

You just don’t want him because he’s Ryne Sandberg. I can’t believe that a manager who took the AA team to the League Championship Series and is currently managing the team with the best record in the PCL would not be a serious candidate for the job.

You do realize you want to hire yet another coaching retread. Every single manager the Cubs have hired since Lee Elia got fired has been a retread—and most of them were successful elsewhere.

How has that worked out? You happy with the results?

Time for fresh blood and not someone who’s been canned by another team.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

Girardi is a retread? Really?

One thing MacPhail said when he hired Showalter is that he didn’t want to hire someone with no big-league managerial experience. That’s in moribund Baltimore. And that’s a hire Al cited in his recap.

The Cubs, however, should turn over the keys of their high-stakes kingdom to someone who hasn’t spent ONE DAY in a position of authority on a big-league bench.

What is wrong with this picture?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

He was fired in Florida

and if the Yankees don’t re-sign him, then yes, he’s a retread.

Dusty Baker took a team to within seven outs of a World Series before the Cubs hired him. Lou Piniella won a World Series. Don Baylor took an expansion team to the playoffs.

What you want to do is the same damn thing the Cubs have been doing for 25 years. Find a guy who’d had some success elsewhere and pay him a bunch of money to manage the Cubs. It hasn’t worked for 25 years! What makes you think it’s going to work now?

What’s the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

25 years? Try seven

Unless you thought Jim Essian and Jim Riggleman were John McGraw material.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Jim Essian was an interim manager

And Jim Riggleman managed the Padres before he managed in Chicago.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

At least get you facts straight

Riggleman managed the Padres for more than two seasons.

Get your facts straight before correcting me, because you’re wrong.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Posted in another thread but I got a chuckle today

when VIn Scully referred to Riggleman as " a bright YOUNG man" As noted I guess everyone
is young to Scully, even Torre.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 8, 2010 8:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

When did the Cubs really begin their big push?

When they hired Dusty in 2003. That’s the point.

This 25-year stuff you cite is just so much bunk.

Hey, maybe Ryno can be the next Whitey Lockman or Jim Marshall.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

So you're happy with Dusty Baker

OK. Now I understand to take everything you say in that vein.

Clogging the basepaths with walks is a bad thing in your mind. Good to know.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again, more words in people's mouths

Stick to writing up minor-league updates, please.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

This time I'm not

You said the Cubs turned things around when the Cubs hired Dusty Baker. I’m not putting anything in your mouth. You were the one who connected the Cubs turn around to hiring Dusty.

Instead of insulting me, why don’t you explain how hiring Dusty Baker helped the Cubs win like you said it did?

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Let me refine that point, then

Hiring Dusty is when the Cubs really began to signal they were serious about competing for something more than a divisional title.

Now, reach back in your memory bank and tell me how Dusty did in his first season. Remember that?

I soured on Dusty in 2004, largely because he lost control of a team that IMHO underperformed.

Is this a little more clear for you?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

The problem is.....

the manager is only 1 piece of it….you actually need…um…players…you know..pitchers and hitters and fielders….
\
\I love the fact he has created expectations….BUT those expectations will never be met….

New MGT is completely necessary

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Big push for what????

Mediocraty????

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm sorry, we should do things that ANDY MCPHAIL does?

The Orioles were bad when he got there. He’s made them worse. He hasn’t made a correct decision in I don’t know how long. We also have no idea if Buck Schowalter will work out in Baltimore.

When you start saying we should be copying the moves of a guy who has done almost nothing right over the last five years, I have to just shake my head

by HuskerCorner on Aug 9, 2010 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

Again, your reading comprehension is for crap

No surprise, since I’m not sure they teach that in Nebraska.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

hiding the wife's eyes

since her folks are from outside Grand Island :-)

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

double hide

that’s where they went to college! LOL

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

And there are other guys

who aren’t “retreads” who would be better candidates than Sandberg.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 6:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

According to you

Look, I don’t know who the best manager for the Cubs is going to be. But at least I admit it. You’ve got no clue who a good manager would be but you insist that you do.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

Please list canddidates

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wrong.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

But it's not....

It’s Ryne Sandburg…….

As the wheel spins…it ain’t what you hnow…it’s who you know

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Cubs have moved him up rapidly as well

Which is why the hype continues to grow. Do you think the organization is as blinded as you’re saying people in the “Pro-Sandberg” group are?

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 6:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

Please NBF...

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

tell me what they were thinking in the offseason least year????

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Joe Morgan

Because he apparently knows everything there is to know.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

He knows so much that other people don't know.

In fact, he knows facts the true baseball fans don’t know.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Don't remind me.

Or how he saw that the Cubs-White Sox brawl in 2006 wasn’t at the White Sox’ home park.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

it's the fucking YANKEES

He’s not leaving

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Didn't Torre leave?

I don’t follow the NY tabloids that closely though I do recall Torre had a few words with ownership every now and then. But I certainly don’t get the sense that he was run out of town, Can anyone out there withOUT an ax to grind provide an objective recap of the Torre/Bronx breakup?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 11:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

He left for a team that (seemingly) had (immediate) promise

Our guys won’t be there for a while

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yes he was run out of town

Not going to happen to Girardi. Torre wanted a multi-year contract and the Yankees would only offer a year and there was a lot of bad blood. Torre accused Cashman of screwing him. It got pretty ugly and I just don’t see this happening with Girardi.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 1:12 AM CDT up reply actions  

Here is link

on the Torre/Bronx breakup. You can google more.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/27/sports/baseball/27torre.html

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 1:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ok, so Torre wanted more than a year but Yankees wouldn't give it to him.

But they still wanted him back, albeit for only a one year. Torre said no.

That sounds to me like Torre left. If he had been “run out of town”, they wouldn’t have offered him the one year.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 9, 2010 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

There are times...

…when teams offer a guy something they know they will turn down to accomplish the same thing – running him out of town.

With that said, the tenure Torre had in NY was long and he may have been run off (with a deal they knew he wouldn’t take) more for personality conflicts than anything else.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't want Sandberg

Anywhere near this mess. He’s got the Iowa Cubs clicking on all cylinders right now: Five in a row, a five game lead and the best record in the Pacific Coast League. At this point in the Minor League season, it’s all about winning a pennant. Let Ryno finish what he started. On top of that, the PCL Playoffs would be a good chance to see Sandberg manage when he doesn’t have to worry about development.

Give Ryno a fresh start in February and let the Iowa Cubs win their first PCL title ever.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:21 PM CDT reply actions   2 recs

You have to remember

They played in the American Association until 1998. They won the American Association Championship in 1993.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree, though probably not for the same reason.

there is a manager in the reds system who has been at the same job 5 years. in fact he is the winningest manager in the history of this minor league franchise. I would argue he’s better than baker. but then again, look at the reds now. when you have superior talent for several years even the worst manager can look competant. just because ryno has the best team in the pcl doesn’t mean anything because the main job of AAA is to give prospects that final polish. winning isn’t a priority. that manager in the reds system i talked about this year started out terribly, like dfl terrible*. I would rather have Sandburg stay at Iowa for a few more years. its not like he’s some sort of hotshot blue chip managerial prospect who needs to be here right now.

*and as soon as this team starts out like 9.5 games out of first and probably 12-15 games under. 500, rick sweet and the Louisville redbirdsERRRRRRbats are now 3.5 games up in the wildcard and 3.5 games out of first in their division in the international league after a record July (11 consecutive wins and a 22 win month). perhaps its because sweet’s a good manager too.

by jcarti01 on Aug 8, 2010 6:54 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

But you can say the same thing about Joe Girardi

When has he ever won without a $240 million payroll?

There’s a double-standard here.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ergo, HE'S NOT LEAVING THE YANKEES

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

if you were implying i’m for girardi i’m not, at least in this post. i am for girardi but only because he’s had some major league managing experience. i was for him when the marlins let him go, but not when he was just retired. double standard because of the lack of experience? maybe. put ryno on the bench in some capacity for a few years, then offer him is my official position.

by jcarti01 on Aug 9, 2010 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

It means nothing, that's why you consistently see guys called up before the playoffs

before are finished. Their value to the mlb club is more important. Get Ryno up here so he can do some evaluating before the season is over.

by troutfishin on Aug 8, 2010 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Only if the team needs them

in a playoff run. If teams are out of it and their minor league is still playing, they usually wait before promoting many people.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Good call Josh

I am with you, I have no idea how Ryno would do in the bigs. Let him finish in Iowa, win some playoff games and if Girardi stays in New York hire Sandberg.
 Goodness give me a clean slate, some freaking retread I do not want. No Joe Torre, No Cora, No Freddi Gonzalez, and No Bobby “I no more baseball than Joe Morgan” Valentine.

by Grockcubs on Aug 8, 2010 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes

They’ve managed elsewhere before and have been fired.

You seem to have a different definition of re-tread than everyone else.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can get on board with the no retread mantra

but you guys need to stop raising the bar so that anyone not named Sandberg is a retread.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Anyone who's managed elsewhere before

Is a retread by definition. At least my definition and by most definitions. If you have a different definition, fine. But make yourself clear.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Re-treads

Joe Girardi, Charlie Manuel, Terry Francona, Tony LaRussa, Jack McKeon, Joe Torre, Jim Leyland, Bobby Cox, and Lou Pinella all won World Series’ in the last 20 years in their 2nd or 3rd (or more) job.

Since 1990, only Tom Kelly, Cito Gaston; Bob Brenley, Mike Scoscia and Ozzie Guillen have won championships with their first team.

If you want to go back further, you’ll find LaRussa again, Dick Hauser, Sparky Anderson, Joe Altobelli and Whitey Herzog. Lasorda won twice in the 80s with his “first” team. I refuse to count Lasorda as a green manager.

In that era, only Dallas Green and Davey Johnson won championships early in their tenures with their first teams.

That’s seven out of 30 years. 23 out of 30 years, a man who managed at least one other place has been at the helm of the championship team.

At some point, the fear of a guy who has actually dared to get some experience somewhere is irrational.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 9:56 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Fair point

I guess my argument is that the Cubs have not had luck with a manager that has been a high profile manager lately, Baker and Lou.
 I would just prefer a different approach. My first choice is Girardi, it has been since he was fired in Florida. I do not see him leaving New York. Sandberg is my second choice.

by Grockcubs on Aug 8, 2010 10:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hell, maybe I should apply

I’m not a retread. How about you, Worf?

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I managed the Newark Bears

I’m out.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 10:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

I managed the Bad News Bears

I’m in.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 10:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

This

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

So give me a list of CHICAGO Cubs fans that cares two shits

about the PCL championship

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why Sandberg?

Sandberg is purely a sentimental choice. It wouldn’t occur to any other team to hire him as a manager. It is this kind of thinking that keeps the Cubs underwater.

by NYShep on Aug 8, 2010 6:27 PM CDT reply actions  

And why would you say that?

Why would you think the manager of the team with the best record in the Pacific Coast League wouldn’t be a good choice to manage?

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 6:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Think big

What about someone who has already excelled in the Majors? This is small town thinking, not worthy of the fans.

But no manager is going to turn this team around. How can Ricketts even think of letting Hendry put a new team together? With the third biggest payroll, he’s made the decisions — and the Cubs are a flop. Hendry may be a nice fat guy but he has made one mistake after another.

Why is Ricektts sticking with him? Cause he’s all talk. He’s a big guy now, he owns a team — and just maybe that’s what he is in it for. The truth is he doesn’t want to eat the contract. More of the same.

by NYShep on Aug 8, 2010 6:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

im not sold on sandberg

but picking someone who has already excelled in the majors hasnt worked

by jesus christos on Aug 8, 2010 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

FORGET ABOUT HENDRY

Thge team we have is (largely) the team we will have for the foreseeable future. The object is to assign the best-qualifiedmanager to get the Cubs through the next couple of seasons Whomever that is, is most likely going to besomeone who has experiece managing existing major leaguers, not Peoria Fucking Chiefs.

JESUS!!! What don’t you people understand?!?

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

I said this a while ago

If they know Lou’s gone next year (and he is) why not have Ryno cut his teeth in 2010 (a lost season) and have any potential boneheadedness worked out (at least in part) this year?

by rgonzale on Aug 8, 2010 6:28 PM CDT reply actions  

2011 is going to suck!!!

Please stop thinking past your noses!!!

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 8, 2010 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Progess is unfortunately hampered

by the contracts with which th team is saddled. Immediate resolve is improbable.

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 1:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

You're probably right

And the fevered discussion over who is going to be the manager next year isn’t a cure all like some believe. They still need one though.

by shoemile on Aug 9, 2010 1:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

No right thinking baseball fan

can fault Lou 100 percent for this tough season, think less of Lou or consider this a negative mark on his long successful career if he and the brass decide to call it quits. This team is not playing as it should. Event after event has created a snowball effect. Now with the difficult time Lou must be going through, I would be pleased to know that the decission is Lou’s to make and can be handled in the most sensitive of ways. He has earned it obviously. Ryno up? Sure. I would like to see him here prior to the arrival of the September call ups. This would give him a chance to become aquainted with the regulars. Also, Keep Tram as bench coach. Ryno and Tram can figure out weather they work well together. This decision does not have to be a final decision. Just get the season in the books and learn something along the way.

There goes one over the fence...a Tru-Link fence.

by truelinkfence on Aug 8, 2010 6:48 PM CDT reply actions  

But Lou does have a lot to do with it

The first half of the season, when Lee and Ramirez were struggling (Ramirez was surely hurt), he kept trotting them out in the 3-4 spots in the lineup. He ignored matchups and started Theriot in games he had no business starting. That lineup construction killed us for so many games, even when the pitching was doing its job.

by ChipSet on Aug 8, 2010 8:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree...I think a different manager using the same players, but...

…rearranging the batting order would have gotten 8-10 more wins.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 8, 2010 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's possible

That’s still not good enough for a 150 million dollar payroll though

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

No...but it woulda kept them closer to the leaders...

…and maybe had a more positive affect, instead of quitting like they’ve done.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 9, 2010 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe

My concern right now is that this is a bottom dwelling team made up of high priced veterans and a retiring manager instead of a team that will be bringing up young kids looking to make an impression for next year. All the young kids and their energy will likely be on the bench. The one opening we can expect is 1st base, but I really don’t expect that opening to be filled by someone in the system. When September rolls around, there won’t be a lineup filled with young kids yearning for a spot next year. Most of them are already taken, and the same quitters will be going up against teams either in contention or made up of kids trying their hardest to secure a job for next year. September could get even uglier.

by shoemile on Aug 9, 2010 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

You're right...
September could get even uglier

I think that’s a given. This team has not yet begun to TOTALLY quit. Plus, the way this team is embarrassing itself, I believe there’s ONE more internal explosion coming. Whether it’s Z or someone else is anybody’s guess, but, you can just sense it. Should get real interesting.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 9, 2010 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

I sense a rallying cry in the offing…

“We have not yet begun to quit!!!!”

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 9, 2010 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Easy Ed for manager!!!

Hindsight’s awesome

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

Dude...seriously! ... You need to walk away from the bottle and get ahold of your sponsor...immediately, if not sooner.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 9, 2010 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sorry man. I was up pretty late

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think

that Ryno, or any other manager of the future, should be kept away until the GM has had a chance to rework this roster as much as possible.

I don’t see why it matters if the Cubs are playing flat. They aren’t in contention, which means the games are effectively meaningless. Let the young kids get some experience and make mistakes when they aren’t going to be booed mercilessly every time they err.

They aren’t likely to sell a lot more tickets this year no matter what they do.

And my vote is Giardi #1, Ryno #2. If Ryno doesn’t take the Cubs job he’ll be on a lot of short lists elsewhere. He’s owed nothing, but has had nothing but success managing in the minor leagues. I don’t know how smart or dumb he is, but it doens’t matter much. Baseball is a simple game. Managing is more about personal relationtions than game strategy, imo.

DEJESUS!!!

by tomas21 on Aug 8, 2010 6:57 PM CDT reply actions  

Are any other organizations

talking about Sandberg as a candidate for their jobs? Serious question, not snarky.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 7:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Unfortunately

I think we’re one of the only teams actively looking for a manager right now.

DEJESUS!!!

by tomas21 on Aug 8, 2010 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think the only other one I heard was Arizona

Hell, I might have heard that here.

But, a lot of openings won’t manifest themselves until after the season

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 8, 2010 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Serious answer

Not relevant. And there may very well be such teams — just not now.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

I dont see how it could hurt

(Re: Keeping Ryno, in this instance, away from the team) I would like to see which regulars step up. Which do not. These guys are still on the clock so to speak. Are you a ballplayer or not? I would like to know now rather than figure it out next to a cactus somewhere.

There goes one over the fence...a Tru-Link fence.

by truelinkfence on Aug 8, 2010 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Al, I know you and others on this site

don’t like Nady but he might be the cheapest and most viable option at 1b next season. His reconstructed arm will not hold up over the course of a long season in the outfield and his long swing isn’t conducive to him being a bench player. When he’s healthy he’s an average Derrek Lee, 20-25hr. and 75-80rbi with fewer K’s. Overall I think he would be the best option especially for an organization that is going to wait out these contracts before they open up the wallet.

by troutfishin on Aug 8, 2010 7:04 PM CDT reply actions  

the are screwed either way next year

btw, when healthy at this point in his career, Nady would be more valuable offensively than Lee. Nady of course would be nothing more than a stop gap. Don’t get your hopes up for next year.

by troutfishin on Aug 8, 2010 7:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

And they aren't if DLEE is there??????????????????????

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Never said that

Although for as bad as Lee has been, he’s still been much better than Nady.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 11:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yea right.....

Most overpaid 1b man in baseball…..

He’s (a big part of) the problem….not the solution……

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

I still don't understand what point you're making

No one in this sub-thread suggested Derrek Lee play for the Cubs next year. Your extreme disgust for D-Lee has gotten to the point where you’re creating imaginary arguments so you can bash the guy.

by shoemile on Aug 8, 2010 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

or hire him for say 1m next year....

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nady never had a chance

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

????

Nady had plenty of chances. I think he and the Cubs made a mistake in rushing him back to fast from surgery and putting him on the roster before he was 100% healthy.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 1:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hindsight speaking again.

I agree with you. In retrospect, they should have signed Jonny Gomes, who actually wanted to come here and would have been cheaper.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

Um not hindsight for me or even the Cubs.

remember those hundreds of posts I had in March, April , May etc that
Nady was not healthy and had not looked terrible in ST and should not be on the roster until he was 100%?. It is not as if the Cubs did not know Nady wasn’t fully healthy. They made a deliberate decision to sign and play him while admitting he would not be healthy for the first 2 months of the season. The theory was that it was “only” his long throwing that would be the problem and they could cover that. Signing Nady is the first place was a very poor move, and let him play without recovering was even worse.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 6:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

They are FAR more screwed if it's DFL....

anywhere near the terms of this years contract…..

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, it won't be

So I’m not really sure why you’re so concerned about it

by shoemile on Aug 9, 2010 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't like Hendry's recent work either

But I don’t think any of us are qualified to comment on that aspect of his health.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 7:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, think about it - it's actually a pretty fair statement, isn't it?

Unrealistic but fair…

1. Sign Adam Dunn
2. Sign Cliff Lee
3. Trade for Zach Greinke
4. Trade Fukudome for prospects.

That’s four moves. Do all that, and I’d say we’d be in contention for NL Central and/or Wild Card, don’t you?

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Here's how it is...

1: Get better than the Astros
2: Get better than the Brewers
3: Get better than the Cardinals
4: Get better than the Reds

"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon

by Cubbiegoon on Aug 8, 2010 7:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

I like you

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Isss szimple, Natasha

Then hypnotize Fealess Leader for the $60M to execute fiendish plan!

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

With what money?

…To trade Fuke for prospects the Cubs would have to eat most if not all of his remaining money. Adam Dunn is won of the games most prolific power hitters(not going to be cheap), Cliff Lee? Very expensive and he’s said he wants a no trade clause considering how many times he’s moved the last few years,

That kind of money being spent will not happen for a while, btw, you did nothing to address the bullpen. Seems to me that’s more than four moves.

by troutfishin on Aug 8, 2010 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He’s already with the team, so I didn’t think that’d count as a move. ;-)

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 8:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think the "we're only 3-4 moves away from contention" stuff is just talk

What else is he going to say to the press? “We’re really bad so we’re going to blow this whole thing up and start from scratch.” With the Cubs’ payroll, that’s not gonna happen.

Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!

by DKT on Aug 8, 2010 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

No....I'd say a whole enitre revamp....

is necessary….and what better excuse than this season…..he made his bed…let him rest in it…

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

If he survives the first couple of weeks after the season and is

allowed to lead the search for a manager, any major moves he makes will only happen if he can break the kung fu like grip that Ricketts has on his wallet.

by troutfishin on Aug 8, 2010 7:32 PM CDT reply actions  

I agree with Josh about leaving Ryno in AAA to finish out the season there.

The Cubs wouldn’t have done it anyway because it seems like every time Al wants the Cubs to do something, they never do it.

"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality." John Lennon

by Cubbiegoon on Aug 8, 2010 7:32 PM CDT reply actions  

Just got a message from a friend (Yankees fan):
Someone please tell Joe Morgan to play in traffic. He’s such a pompous-A$$

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 7:34 PM CDT reply actions  

I can't stop laughing

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

He went on to say that Miller is doing games by himself half the time.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

I am showing an Eastern Airlines plane in my avatar because they are returning to the US airline industry. A boardroom member told me that they plan to restart Eastern Airlines sometime in early 2011.

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Aug 8, 2010 7:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

If you can dodge traffic, you can dodge a ball

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 7:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Do I have to drink my own urine?

No, but it’s sterile and I like the taste.

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions  

Would someone like Pat Listach be a viable candidate for Lou's job next year?

Asking the more knowledgeable out there. He left on good terms, right? And he would probably be interested in the position? Had some success at Iowa.

Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team

by carmen_fanzone on Aug 8, 2010 7:36 PM CDT reply actions  

Actually, possibly.

Listach was where Sandberg was two years ago — managing at Iowa and very highly regarded as a possible managerial candidate (obviously, two years ago, not with the Cubs).

The Cubs let him go when he got a major league coaching job. He’d still be considered a strong managerial candidate, and is only 43 — could be a manager for many years.

If Sandberg is hired, I’d expect Listach to at least get consideration for a Cubs coaching job.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed

If Ryne Sandberg were not in line for the job, Pat Listach would be a serious candidate.

by Josh Timmers on Aug 8, 2010 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nice recap of the previous post

Way to stick your neck out there

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions  

Nice snark.

The point is, that Pat Listach did exactly what Sandberg did — started at the bottom, worked his way up through the organization, and was widely praised by players and his superiors. He was (and is) considered a top managerial candidate, though he doesn’t have the HoF name Sandberg does.

Some here, though, hold that HoF status and popularity against Sandberg, though he is highly qualified. I find that attitude strange.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

'Highly qualified'

Al, I wish you were hiring at my place. I think you’d make me CEO.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

Al...

…I would re-word that and say Sandberg is qualified to “get a shot” with someone, but his HOF status really has no bearing on whether he will be any good.

"I don't like them fellas that drive in two runs but let in three" Casey Stengel

by MPH73 on Aug 9, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

As an aside from manager talk

Al used the perfect phrase… mailing it in.

So I’d just like to “thank” the Cubs for that “effort” when I paid $90 to take my father to a game for his birthday.

Thanks for nothing, guys.

Shut up Joe Morgan.

by fsuapollo on Aug 8, 2010 7:48 PM CDT reply actions  

I hope your dad had a nice birthday anyway.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 8, 2010 8:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Take him to Diamond's on North Avenue if you want a sure thing

Stop whining

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe White Sox fans have it right.

You don’t win? We don’t attend. We’ll watch at home, but keep your tickets. This is not a boycott, but a decision to spend entertainment dollars elsewhere.

Seems to work in SD, too.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Aug 8, 2010 8:18 PM CDT reply actions  

BUT....

Who is prodducing on the field? Who has brought the baccon home in the last 100 years????

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ah...the World Series of '05...the one nobody remembers.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 9, 2010 12:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

I do. The Sox lost one frigging game all p/offs.

A dominant performance. It’s a shame no one recognizes it.

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

It's because it's a Cubs' town...and the White Sox fans are obnoxious and arrogant.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 9, 2010 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

and have far much more reason to be so....

ntn

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 9, 2010 12:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

Obnoxious? Maybe not. But arrogant, for sure.

Hell – when the Cubs win, you won’t be able to shut me up!!!!

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 1:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

I remember it.....

…….and the Marlins off 9y7 and 03…….

Quit being a snob

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 9, 2010 12:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

Easier for most people to follow this strategy. If they’re bad, don’t attend. If they’re good, watch them on TV.

"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk

by vonde6 on Aug 9, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

HORSESHIT

Boycotting does nothing but rob ownership’s coffers and its ability to compete for high-priced FA’s. Pretzel logic at best.

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

whatever......

rewarding poor performance doesn’t ever seem to help much either…..

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 9, 2010 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Any fan base of any team would be miscontrued to be led to

think that NOT attending games would help

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 1:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

Now, I haven't agreed with a lot of what you've said here.

But on this, I agree.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

Managerial change and young players

There are money and logistics involved with Lou being the manager for a while longer. Things like having to pay Lou for the rest of the season whether he is here or not on top of having to pay whoever they would bring in; at least there isn’t a union involved. Things like Ryno not being a slam-dunk pick for the job. And they don’t know the total field of candidates until the season is over. Jim Hendry is down as saying he wants to take his time on this one.

I don’t think there are any young players coming up between now and the end of the season to impress and pick-up the slack. That’s because a few young players were already put on the roster earlier in the season.

Still think some players might be let-go in the waivers process. Good riddance.

by AboutTheCubs on Aug 8, 2010 8:20 PM CDT reply actions  

That is what is so aggravating

with this team. There is some talent here, players with a track record. They can say all what they want, but there effort is about 50%. And shame on them.
 The perfect storm, a manager who managed one year to many, inflated contracts, and marginal effort leads you to 95 losses.

by Grockcubs on Aug 8, 2010 8:22 PM CDT reply actions  

Mark DeRosa for manager

He will save us.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:28 PM CDT reply actions  

Ted Lilly for player-manager :-)

"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.

by zevkalman on Aug 8, 2010 8:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Second the motion for Ted Lilly as player-manager!

"Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?"--The Brain

by brook on Aug 8, 2010 10:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

You guys are joking, right?

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

What's sad

is that the core of this team was steamrolling into the playoffs in 08 and look what they have become now. Did getting swept by LA start this debacle? This Cubs scenario really proves how the window of success is open barely a crack.

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Aug 8, 2010 8:32 PM CDT reply actions  

See???

As much as ai despise Hendry, he DID build a team that was capable of winning the World Series. Thye just didn’t perform.

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

sorry for the typos - I'm hammered

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

I never would have noticed.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 1:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 1:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

ur hammered....

Jimbo hasn’t even come close to what you suggest…..

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 9, 2010 12:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

Oh my God

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 1:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Regardless

The fact that FAs are signed and committed to based solely on past performance is a necessary evil. As much as I’dlike to bame him for the bloated contracts, he was seemingly understanably reassured that these players’ future performance would mirror their past. It just didn’t work out that way. (i.e. Soriano – EVER should a player be signed after a career year).

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 1:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Some did mirror their past

But some were also on the downside of their primes

by shoemile on Aug 9, 2010 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

We're not getting Girardi

We’re not getting him. He has a good gig and he will get an extension. What’s a more prestigious job? Managing the Yankees or managing the Cubs? If both jobs were available, which one would you take? Here’s a hint on what my answer is. I’d get rid of my beard in a hurry.

RIP Ronnie James Dio (July 10, 1942 - May 16, 2010).

by Ace Venom on Aug 8, 2010 8:35 PM CDT reply actions  

Cubs have the third worst record in the NL. Who wants to come into that kind of a team?

I’d be happy with Ryno, or Girardi, or even Bob Brenly.

"I'm not much of a chemistry guy, you know. Chemistry to me is a pinch-hit double with the bases loaded"--Jim Frey, Chicago Tribune, 1985.

by zevkalman on Aug 8, 2010 8:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

I find it amazing that you write off Girardi

entirely, knowing his history.

You all might be in for a shock.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 8, 2010 8:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

You still believe that after what his team did to Boston tonight?

Girardi will stay in New York. The top brass there will be forced to rehire him. The fans and the local media won’t take less. The Yankees’ job is the most coveted one in baseball. It brings media attention and a lot of endorsements. The Cubs job brings a lot, but not more than that.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 8, 2010 10:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Absolutely...the Yankee job is a very prestigious job....

you win a World Series there and you’re the toast of the town…UNTIL, that first 5 game losing streak the following year.
You manage the Cubs to a World Series? WOW!!! Face on Mount Rushmore…maybe take Abe’s spot on the $5 bill…you’d be added as the 13th Apostle…you’d never have to spend another penny in the city of Chicago again as long as you lived.
Since 1909 (the year AFTER the last WS win) how many different managers have managed the Yankees to a World Series championship? Now, if someone managed the Cubs to a World Series, how many since 1909? Yep…ONLY him.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 8, 2010 11:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh...and one more thing...

You manage a World Series with the Cubs and even Michael Jordan would have to call you “Da man”.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 8, 2010 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Cubs job....

ain’t a cakewalk…..
1. Starting pitchning scares noone
2. Bullpen scares noone
3. Lineup scares noone….

Until MGT come in and hires people that fix issues 1,2 and 3….furrggghhheeddaaabout it

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 9, 2010 12:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

I won't be shocked at all.

People ask “Why would he leave NY?” My reply…“To come home”. Plain and simple.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 8, 2010 11:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

You got it, EE

Girardi isn’t typical.

Not saying it’s gonna happen, just don’t be shocked if it does.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

I have no idea if there is a chance he'd come

I figure probably not. But I’d also think how the Yankees finish this year will be a factor as well, and that story has yet to be told.

by shoemile on Aug 9, 2010 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions  

The Cubs probably feel a strong sense of loyalty to Lou...

… and will let him finish. But it’s possible that the Cubs don’t feel that Sandberg is their guy and whoever is their guy is not available right now.

by DudeVf11 on Aug 8, 2010 8:40 PM CDT reply actions  

Bingo!!

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 8, 2010 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yea and they're "playin out the string".....

I’d want a refund if I had any tix this point forward……….I hope ricketts feels some “empty stands” pain from here on out………they ain’t competing any more…….so as to make some responsible decisions about the BB people going forward…..

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

What a game today!!!!!

The effort put out was top notch! I hope you were watching Tom Ricketts!

by TJ11 on Aug 8, 2010 9:03 PM CDT reply actions  

And if he was watching, I hope he was rigged up like Alex in "Clockwork Orange"

So he couldn’t blink or turn away. If it makes him retch when he sees games like that in the future, that is only useful conditioning.

by ClarkFan on Aug 8, 2010 9:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

AAA beaseball is jusst that....

it’s why its banished to Iowa….

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Today's "Clutch AB of the game"

So many choices!!!

But I have narrowed it down to

Hill’s single that broke up the no-hitter….
Hill’s clutch K during the rally….
Soriano’s flyout that he hustled so hard on when it was caught at the fence!

I pick Hill’s clutch K.

by TJ11 on Aug 8, 2010 9:06 PM CDT reply actions  

Special play of the game!!!!!

Nady’s throw from RF on the sac fly!

WHAT A CANNON!!!!!!!

Even the announcers went silent. (Did anyone else catch that?)

by TJ11 on Aug 8, 2010 9:08 PM CDT reply actions  

I am mailing in my post:

What “options” are in jeopardy by calling up selected AAA-ers?

Anyone know the definitive list?

I will go sit on the bench now and wait for the answer…

by The E-Man on Aug 8, 2010 9:10 PM CDT reply actions  

Al, you said in the recap that many of these young pitchers should not be here.....

But in their defense they are used to having a manager, defense, and offense working together to try and help them win….

Its an adjustment to come to the big league Cubs!

by TJ11 on Aug 8, 2010 9:16 PM CDT reply actions  

I've been a Cubs fan since 65

And this has to go down in record as one of the worst teams in Cubs history. But it’s comical to see people calling for Sandburg or Samardjia to be called up. It wasn’t but three years ago when everyone was counting the World Series championships for the Cubs when Pinella came to the Cubs. And it wasn’t but two weeks into the season when everyone was calling for Samardjia’s head to be hoisted on a pike outside of Wrigley. Zambrano? Wasn’t that long ago when people where flagellating themselves over the fact that Hendry may let him get away.
Look, you want to be a Cubs fan? Expect the worst, life is much easier. You’re never disappointed, and when they do make the playoffs, you feel really good. I’ve had a lot of relatives that have died that never saw the Cubs win the World Series, if they do it during what is left of my life, then I’m one step up on them. But if you live your life expecting it, you’ll just live your life angry and bitter.

by PokyCubs on Aug 8, 2010 9:19 PM CDT reply actions  

Wow

Been a fan since 1970, and I choose not to accept bad baseball. I don’t give a damn that they haven’t won a World Series since the Civil War. The past is the past. There is no reason why this team can not win.
 Accept the losing, no thanks.

by Grockcubs on Aug 8, 2010 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Funy to read that you've been a fan since 1970 and are NOT willing

to accept bad baseball.

"I'll take one in the mouth over the eyes any day". - AJ Pierzynski

by lostinthevines on Aug 9, 2010 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

One thing for sure.....

There will be a new skipper at the helm of the 2011 club . I want to go back to 2008 season and all the fun we had . ( Until the playoffs ) .
Lets hope that Ricketts is watching all the problems of the present team . He will need to make some very tough choices before long .

by cubs north on Aug 8, 2010 10:25 PM CDT reply actions  

so what?

Until the queen bee that keeps puttting these teams together is gone……

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not sold on Sandberg yet.

My first choice was Showalter but the Orioles beat us to get him. You might want to put an experienced guy like that now as manager but you wouldn’t want to do that with an inexperienced guy in the majors, which is what Ryno is now. This team needs someone who will “motivate” the players to do their jobs. They are paid until the season ends, not until Lou called it quits. So, why are they mailing it in, instead? The next manager, whoever he is, has to clean house. We don’t need players who quit trying to improve. My fear is that the Cubs have painted themselves into a corner with Sandberg. There isn’t a way not to hire him despite all the doubts out there. I just hope he’s the right guy. But as for the next 2 months, let Lou go out on his terms. He’s earned at least that and the alternative won’t change this season’s outcome, anyway. Ryno knows what he has especially what’s coming from the minors and it isn’t pretty to me.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 8, 2010 10:52 PM CDT reply actions  

I haven't read ALL the posts to this thread, so, apologies if this was mentioned, but...

…why do you think it’s automatically going to be Sandberg? I STILL believe the reason for Lou announcing his retirement was for :

A) He was told to or be terminated then and there…and

B)They wanted certain others (Girardi) to know that the job was coming available to give them (Girardi) time to mull it over.

I do believe he’s their first choice. He probably won’t leave NY if he wins it all again, but, if he doesn’t…? That’s a whole different ballgame…pardon the pun.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 8, 2010 10:58 PM CDT reply actions  

You're right but I don't think Girardi will leave NY after a successful season. They won't let him go.

Others are available. Maybe people want to comment. Jim Leyland will possibly be available next year. So will Fredi González. (He might sign with the Braves, though.) Even Ozzy might be out there looking for a job. Along with Bobby Valentine. What about Joe Torre? Larry Bowa? Or F. Rodríguez, the current Marlins manager? Can we tempt Bobby Cox out of retirement?

I don’t like many of those names. I just mention them as conversation starters (or killers).

What I would really want to see are names to be considered for the GM post. Unfortunately, I think Ricketts is serious about leaving Jim Hendry in that post. If that is so, Sandberg is the manager unless someone like Joe Torre is readily available.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 8, 2010 11:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

If a manager was born prior to the Cubs last World Series appearance...

then we shouldn’t want them. We need someone who’ll be around a long time LIKE Bobby Cox…NOT Bobby Cox himself. Torre? No. LaRussa? Hell no…for one, the guys a jagoff. Ozzie? There’s NO way.
It’s Girardi OR Sandberg, I believe.

Ron Santo - 8,143 ABs, .277 BA; 342 HR; 1331 RBI = NO Hall of Fame?

Brooks Robinson - 10,654 ABs, .267 BA; 268 HR; 1357 RBI = Hall of Fame.

Any more questions ?

by Easy Ed on Aug 8, 2010 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Finally, a valid argument

A reason entirely of Girardi’s choosing – maybe he doesn’t want to leave. I can accept that.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 8, 2010 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I dont think he's ...

“unavialable”…..BUT I agree as you ssay….he might not wanna leave the skanks…

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Can anyone spell class action lawsuit????
Can any of you really, TRULY tell me that Thomas Diamond, Casey Coleman, James Russell and Mitch Atkins belong in the major leagues?

I’d of been pissed if I had spent a bunch to go to chicago and see “this team”…this weekend….and got this………..

And hopefully ricketts understands that too…..

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:08 PM CDT reply actions  

I have a job-related trip to Cincinnati later this month when the Cubs play there.

I’m seriously considering going to just one game (because I want to see the ballpark) and hasten my return home. There’s no use in seeing those teams play more than once, or once for that matter. It’s Cincinnati’s game to throw away, basically.

by Fraggin Judge on Aug 8, 2010 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why even bother to go to 1....

????

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

TV isn't good eenough...:)

(the other owners need to feel empty seats too….)…:)

The best defense is a good offense.....Lou Pinella...still hasn't managed the Cubs to a post season win. D. Lee still doesn't have a post seasson RBI for Cubs...ditto for Soriano
"It's so simple, it's unbelievable," manager Lou Piniella said. "When you score runs, you win."
Dusty Baker is the only manager in the last 100+ years to lead the Cubs to a post season series win....
"Take the hands off the clock, we're gong to be here a while"

by kcjones on Aug 8, 2010 11:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

::raises hand::

May I throw up now?

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 9, 2010 12:46 AM CDT reply actions  

by all means

"Wait, are you saying I'm a sunshine-pumping, koolaid-drinking, Soriano-loving, rainbow-rising, unicorn-riding, double-clutching, Sweet Lou-backing, Hendry-supporting, hey hey whaddya saying, Cubs are going all the waying, glass is overflowing, Rothschild is all-knowing, Cubs fan? - ballhawk

by vonde6 on Aug 9, 2010 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

At least the Coburg Cubs are playing .500 baseball...

If the Cubs still have a chance, no matter how small, it’s still Go Cubs, damn the math and pass the KoolAid.

by eths on Aug 9, 2010 1:15 AM CDT reply actions  

And them some.

A lovely story:

One day, long, long ago, there lived a woman who didn't whine, nag or bitch. That would be me....

But that was a long time ago and it was just that one day.

The end

by sue369 on Aug 9, 2010 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

I have zero problem with Lou leaving the team for the second time in three weeks to be with his family

I have a problem with him coming back. The guy clearly doesn’t have his heart in this team, and I can understand that. However, he’s leaving anyway, he should do the right thing and just leave now.

by HuskerCorner on Aug 9, 2010 9:08 AM CDT reply actions  

Great point Al has about inserting Sandberg now

but his “bold move” remark pertaining to what the front office should do isn’t rooted in reality. The only bold moves they’re willing to try means putting a big noodle in front of Wrigley.

"Don't shed any tears. You think about this: Here I am, the grandson of a slave. And here the whole world was excited about whether I was going into the Hall of Fame or not. We've come a long ways." BUCK O'NEIL

by HotDogDude on Aug 9, 2010 9:10 AM CDT via mobile reply actions  

Ryno

Interesting piece on development of Sandberg as manager in the NYTimes this AM — http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/09/sports/baseball/09sandberg.html?_r=1&ref=todayspaper

by NYShep on Aug 9, 2010 9:20 AM CDT reply actions  

I love the "Sand-berg" typo - twice...

Does anyone else have a hyphen in their last name for no reason?

Get 'em on, Get 'em over, Get 'em in!

by DKT on Aug 9, 2010 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

I haven't seen it but

it probably needed to be hyphenated in the dead tree edition and they just copy and pasted that text into the online version.

by JohnM on Aug 9, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

Bring back Rock Cherry

Linus: Life is rarely all one way, Charlie Brown. You win some, you lose some. Charlie Brown: Really? Gee, that'd be neat.

by CyberCyclist on Aug 9, 2010 11:31 AM CDT reply actions  

you mean this guy?

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

He might be the only one

who could get away with wearing that suit.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Check out the NHL Network this coming season

Cherry’s suits get far, far worse than this!

I'll go to my grave believing Armando Galarraga tossed the 21st perfect game in MLB history.

by EalyEagle on Aug 9, 2010 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Al, you couldn't be more right about Lou

The fans don’t deserve this crap just so Lou can ride off into the sunset on his terms, it’s not like he’s been here for 20 years or won a world series! I’ve been saying this since he retired. Stay in Florida, Lou!

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 9, 2010 3:01 PM CDT reply actions  

The team's not getting any better

with Lou or without Lou.

Maybe his early departure would be cathartic for some fans, but it doesn’t serve much other purpose.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Winning a game would be an improvement

No team in baseball just mails it in for two months with a lameduck manager. There are games to play with opportunities to work with young players and see who can play, not sit in the dugout and play DLee every day and begin interviews with “I don’t want to talk about our hitting”. Bring in an interim guy or whatever but this is a travesty and can’t keep going on. There is not one single reason for Lou to be there the rest of the year.

"Any player who gets the opportunity to play at Wrigley should welcome it"

by Itchy on Aug 9, 2010 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

*Sigh*

I guess you’d rather see Nady at first than Lee?

This isn’t a travesty. It’s a baseball game.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Playing Lee is one thing

batting him 3rd every day is another especially when Soto is batting 8th.

"Lou Piniella's been a great manager for a long time and I stand by him completely"
Jim Hendry

by Doggie Stalker on Aug 9, 2010 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Very true NOT Bruce!

Nobody could do any better than Lou!

by TJ11 on Aug 9, 2010 4:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

You guys are still going on about this?
I wasn’t in favor of it before, but I’ve changed my mind. Make a bold move. Thank Lou for his service and let him go tend to his mother, and make Ryne Sandberg Cubs manager.

Hendry isn’t going to send a Hall of Fame manager into retirement with a pink slip. That’s just not how he rolls.

Sandberg as a manager is a questionable idea for a lot of reasons, but there’s really nothing to gain by bringing him up now.

by Wreckard on Aug 9, 2010 4:20 PM CDT reply actions  

I didn't ask for a pink slip.

A combined announcement that Lou feels he needs to retire for personal reasons would work.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Aug 9, 2010 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

3rd worst in the NL

1st in payroll in the NL, correct? Everyone on this team should kick themselves in the nuts. Exceptions: Castro, Byrd, Colvin, and Marshall.

"In order to have a winner, the team must have a feeling of unity; every player must put the team first- ahead of personal glory" - motivational sign at Halas Hall.

by propheteer on Aug 9, 2010 5:42 PM CDT reply actions  

Franz Beckenbauer said about Germany's appearance

in the last World Cup (not this past one): “You could put all the players and coaches in a sack and hit it, and you’d hit someone who deserved it.”

I thought that was clever.

by Not Bruce Froemming on Aug 9, 2010 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes

There’s so much crap on this team that I failed to mention those two, especially Soto. I don’t necessarily believe Marmol has had his best year though.

"In order to have a winner, the team must have a feeling of unity; every player must put the team first- ahead of personal glory" - motivational sign at Halas Hall.

by propheteer on Aug 9, 2010 9:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Surely you're joking
I don’t necessarily believe Marmol has had his best year though.

by Wreckard on Aug 9, 2010 10:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's set the bar really high

I guess it’s the way he struggles then somehow seems to get out of a self-inflicted jam.

"In order to have a winner, the team must have a feeling of unity; every player must put the team first- ahead of personal glory" - motivational sign at Halas Hall.

by propheteer on Aug 9, 2010 10:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's not only his personal best season but it's among the best seasons by a reliever ever

When you’re striking out 2 out of every 3 batters you’re facing you can afford to walk a few guys now and then. I’m not sure who you’re watching but Marmol has been the single best reason to watch the Cubs this year.

There’s so much crap on this team that I failed to mention those two

This team sucks, but there’s not “so much crap” on this team. You’ve basically identified half the starting lineup as good, only excluding Soriano, who’s been very good, and Ramirez, who’s been very good since he got healthy. The starting rotation has been very good as well.

So basically what sucked was Theriot (gone), Lee (hurt, leaving), the bench and the bullpen guys not named Marmol and Marshall.

by Wreckard on Aug 9, 2010 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah sure

but this team is close to 20 games below .500, so there’s more suck than not. By all accounts Aram has been horrible this season, Lee, middle relief, and clutch hitting. It’s a lot more fluff than actual good results from this club. Aren’t they one of the worst with RISP? I’m not sure why I can’t find this on baseball reference.

"In order to have a winner, the team must have a feeling of unity; every player must put the team first- ahead of personal glory" - motivational sign at Halas Hall.

by propheteer on Aug 9, 2010 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nothing new here, just thought I'd add one more comment - it was sitting at 699 and looked lonely

now we’re at a nice even 700. That’s all, folks!

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Aug 10, 2010 10:56 AM CDT reply actions  

You made me look.

I like odd things. :P

"Fasten those seatbelts!"-Pat Hughes

by katie casey on Aug 10, 2010 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

We're at 709. I think we can get to 715

I like nipples.

Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted. -- Albert Einstein

by Worf on Aug 10, 2010 4:03 PM CDT reply actions  

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