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Cubs/Mesa Spring Training Complex Update

Yesterday, officials in Mesa, Arizona chose one location over several others for the proposed new Cubs spring training facility -- and the decision was in part made because of a waterpark:
Mesa and the Chicago Cubs are now exclusively considering Riverview Park in the city’s northwest corner for the team’s new spring training complex.

The team would share the area with the proposed Waveyard water park and resort, which is scaling back its plans to only include the water park.
There were originally three proposed locations, including this one (located near the intersection of highways 101 and 202), downtown Mesa, and a site near Red Mountain located near highway 202 and Recker Road in east Mesa. Here's why Mesa officials and the Cubs consider the Riverview site the best location:
The Cubs favor the Riverview site because of good freeway access and a central location. Also, a city-commissioned study shows that site had the most potential to attract specialty shops and restaurants that could be part of the Wrigleyville West concept that is aimed at making the complex active all year. The other sites studied were downtown Mesa and an area near Loop 202 and Recker Road. City officials said those sites would work but more specific plans need to be developed despite the uncertainty of how or whether Waveyard would be developed.

The new complex would include a "Wrigleyville West" entertainment and restaurant/bar area that would, the Cubs and Mesa hope, be a year-round tourist attraction as well as year-round facilities for the Cubs' extended spring training, summer league, and Arizona Fall League teams. But what will then become of HoHoKam Park? The current park and its predecessor on that site have been the Cubs' spring home since 1979.

Star-divide

This Ballpark Digest article says Mesa officials will be lobbying hard to get another team to move into HoHoKam Park when the Cubs depart:

Not a bad plan, really: might as well give it a shot. The plan is pretty simple: when the Cubs leave in 2013 (or perhaps earlier), Mesa will be working to have another MLB team lined up as a new tenant. While Mesa officials say they'll look to Florida for a team, they're probably wasting their time: virtually every team is now committed to their Florida homes via long-term lease; the few that aren't, like the Washington Nationals and Minneota Twins, are highly unlikely to uproot operations for Arizona.

The article says 2013 or earlier, but given the fact that part of the financing for the Cubs complex still has to go before Mesa voters in November and not a single shovelful of dirt has been moved, the more likely date is 2014.

Also, sources say that several Florida-based teams may indeed be among the clubs contacted to see if they want to move to a renovated HoHoKam, including the Twins, Blue Jays, Astros and Orioles. The Cubs are contractually obligated to help the city of Mesa find a team to take over HoHoKam, as part of the deal for the new complex -- the city of Mesa doesn't want it to end up this way, like the Brewers' old Compadre Stadium in Chandler, which was considered the jewel of the Cactus League when it opened in 1986.

Considering the fact that five teams (Rangers, Royals, Dodgers, Indians and Reds) have moved from Florida-based spring training to Arizona since 2003, don't count out the possibility that another team could be lured to train in Mesa. If nothing else, it would make spring scheduling easier by having an even number of teams (16) in Arizona, all of them in the Phoenix metropolitan area.

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Yes.

Done and done a long time ago.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 8:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

Unfortunately this ain't over

This is not a unilateral decision. A whopping $84 million of this project is contingent on local voter approval in November. What happens if the citizen taxpayers of Mesa vote ‘no’ and thereby withhold funding? I think TR was asked that very question and he responded by saying, “there is no plan B.” What the heck does that mean? The Cubs aren’t staying in Hohokam so what is plan A, rev.1 ?

I'm wet nurse to a (5th)-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!

by Eisman57 on Sep 18, 2010 7:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

Good, let's hope we can put this to rest and get this finalized.

I love spring training in Mesa and have gone for well over ten years. This appears to be a good site and easy to get to.

Al, is this close to the new Bass Pro Shop and that entire complex that sprouted up just recently in NW Mesa?

When I read about getting a team to take over HoHoKam, I thought of the A’s. Their facility is certainly not on par with others in the Valley. Would this be possible for them to get out of their contract to move?

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Sep 17, 2010 8:14 AM CDT reply actions  

Al, is this close to the new Bass Pro Shop and that entire complex that sprouted up just recently in NW Mesa?

Yes. I believe the property is adjacent.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

We went into this area last year,

went to Toby Keith’s bar, ate at a knock off of Texas Roadhouse. I couldn’t believe all the places to eat and stores. It just grew out of nothing! Of course this happens and the Fiesta Mall on Southern and Alma School was really struggling and losing stores. Restaurants around that mall virtually all closed. They can’t be more than a few miles apart.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Sep 17, 2010 8:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

You are correct MCF

The Fiesta Mall has been in decline ever since the Chandler Fashion Ctr was built. We used to got the FM until the CFC came to be.

Al, when the Cubs first made the decision to play hardball and threaten to move, I went to Google Earth and looked at any potential locations. The first one I liked was Riverview, no lie. I think it’s a great move, the location next to an already successful shopping/restaurant district helps and bringing in more Chicago themed stores adds to the mix. We ex-Chicagoans are always looking for more authentic Chicago restaurants and I hope that Portillo’s is an automatic entry. California has two, Arizona, which I have always named Chicago-West deserves one, too lol

PLus, it’s only a 15 minute drive from my house. Sweet!

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 17, 2010 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions  

Party in March 2014 at BigJohn's house!

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 17, 2010 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

LOL

The other reason to do it there, beyond the location and the highway access, is that it’s closer to Scottsdale and Tempe. They hope to draw locals from those areas.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Hell YES! And I'm not BSing

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 17, 2010 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

"Dibs!" on the spare bedroom...

..or couch…

…or that little area of shag carpeting right near the a/c vent.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 17, 2010 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Typically don't have the a/c on in March

but you are welcome to that spot nonetheless!

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 17, 2010 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

Interesting that it will be near a Bass Pro Shop

Because they do exactly what the Cubs are hoping to do – produce sham studies that predict wildly optimistic positive economic impact for areas in which the local pols are dumb enough to subsidize their stores with invented taxes or direct hand-outs.

by the nth on Sep 17, 2010 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

but,,,

I caught you a delicious bass

by cozmotaylor123 on Sep 17, 2010 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Wow, that's terrific bass!

♪♫ Take me out WITH the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and cracker jack,
I don't care if I NEVER get back ♪♫ Jack Norworth and Albert Von Tilzer

by katie casey on Sep 17, 2010 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

No contest. Entwistle BUT

I have to give PM his props. When you really sit down and listen to his grooves, they are pretty GD good. As an ex-bass player, I lean towards the Geddy Lee/Chris Squire/John Entwistle styles.

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 17, 2010 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ox!

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 17, 2010 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Both are very melodic in their playing

Take another listen to “Drowned” from Quadrophenia and “Mrs. Vanderbilt” from Band On The Run. Great stuff. Plus you get the extra bonus of Entwistle’s horn work on “Drowned”.

by EalyEagle on Sep 17, 2010 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

I've seen articles in the PHX papers

that the mayor of PHX wants to do something to keep the A’s in that complex, with improvements.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 17, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

"Waveyard"?

Hello, marketing people! “Waveyard”??? That’s the best you could come up with? In a region somewhat synonymous with retirement, ergo older folks, you come up something that rhymes with “Graveyard”??? Sheesh….

I hope the Cubs can use some of their mu$cle to influence a name change.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 17, 2010 8:22 AM CDT reply actions  

Good one ballhawk.

This is only the beginning....Lou Pinella end of '07 season and Chicago Transit Authority (the band when they were really good).

by mrcubsfan on Sep 17, 2010 8:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

Except that isn't part of the Cubs complex, it's an adjacent property.

You’re right, it’s a bad name.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 8:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

Understood that they're separate properties.

But seeing as how it hasn’t been developed yet (right?) and considering what the Cubs are bringing to the table, I’m thinking/hoping that Tom, Wally & the rest of the Cubs marketing team can strongly suggest that perhaps the Waveyard folks come up with a new name.

How about “Splash City”? Hell, call it “WaterWorld” and give Kevin Costner season tickets it. Just don’t call it “Key Lime Cove West” – I hate that commercial…

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 17, 2010 8:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

There you go.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 9:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

Perfect.

♪♫ Take me out WITH the crowd.
Buy me some peanuts and cracker jack,
I don't care if I NEVER get back ♪♫ Jack Norworth and Albert Von Tilzer

by katie casey on Sep 17, 2010 9:24 AM CDT up reply actions  

Noooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!

‘cause then when I go to Spring Training, I’ll never make it to a game – I’ll be standing over under the Waveland sign, waiting… and waiting… and waiting…

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 17, 2010 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, how is that different from what you do at Wrigley?

:-)

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well, if you're saying by 2014 the Cubs will have players that can hit the ball...

…all the way over to the “Waveland” water park entrance, I think we’ll all be happy.

Lou Brown: "My kinda team, Charlie, my kinda team..."

by ballhawk on Sep 17, 2010 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

The only team I could see moving to Arizona is the Twins

They are the westernmost team on the list and two of their division rivals are already there.

by Chi-Fed on Sep 17, 2010 9:00 AM CDT reply actions  

Another team that could move....

… due to proximity, would be the Astros. Houston is about 1000 miles from their current training site in Florida, and about 1100 miles to Mesa — just about the same distance, and probably more flights to Phoenix due to Southwest Airlines’ presence in Houston.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 9:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

Southwest Airlines' presence in Houston?

You must be talking about HOU. When I flew through Houston in August 2009, I went through IAH, and 95% of the planes there were Continental Airlines planes.

Biggest hub for Continental that I’d ever seen. It’s like being a fish out of water if you’re flying another airline into or out of IAH.

I didn't believe it last August, but it turns out that love survives.

Mount Washington conquered July 5, 2010! State high point count: 3/50

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Sep 17, 2010 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right!

If the Astros were to move their ST base to Mesa, you can bet SWA would make a major push for more flights from Hobby to PHX.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

OK, go ahead and build it

Just make a nice tailgating area like HoHoKam has; underneath those huge pine trees along Center St.

Just win the next game...!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 17, 2010 9:40 AM CDT reply actions  

Those are nice, aren't they?

I will miss HHK. They really do a great job there and considering how many fans come to teh games, they get you in and out pretty well.

I remember my first time at a Cubs ST game in 1991, way more laid back than now, obviously a lot less fans, too. Maybe 5-6000 per game. Beer was only $3, too. Hot dogs were $2.

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 17, 2010 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Love it!

We get there before the lot officially opens; 8:30-9:00. Parking lot guys are really cool. Sometimes even see Tim Sheridan (PA announcer) stop by.

Those trees provide great natural shade. We plant ourselves and I look out towards the NE to the left of those make-shift soccer fields and say, “I wonder how cold it is in Chicago this morning”.

Just win the next game...!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 21, 2010 6:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

Funny how the top attendance # in Chandler all seemed to involve the Cubs

"For the charming if somewhat curious branch of mankind known as Cub fans, spring is a sanguine time.. Every spring holds the blithe hope that perhaps this is the season in which Satan will grow weary and ease up on the headlock in which he has diabolically held Chicago's mightily struggling National League baseball team since 1908..." Lonnie Wheeler- "Bleachers"

by tommy veryzer on Sep 17, 2010 10:03 AM CDT reply actions  

Oakland

Assuming Mesa can’t get a team to move from Florida, I think the A’s would want to relocate in a heartbeat. While HoHoKam may not be cutting edge, its far better than Phoenix Municipal Stadium. Capacity is a few thousand higher and HoHoKam has berm seating. Neither stadium has practice fields connected, so the downside of training/playing at HoHoKam is nothing new.

If the A’s can’t get a new complex built they’d be smart to jockey for the move.

by dmlichte on Sep 17, 2010 10:04 AM CDT reply actions  

Great points

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 17, 2010 10:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

Depends on how long the A's deal is in Phoenix.

They just renovated that park about four years ago for the A’s.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

See my above comment.

More improvements may be on the horizon for the A’s. I don’t have the time to find the articles from the AZ Republic at this moment.

by San Diego Smooth Jazz Man on Sep 17, 2010 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

As long as I can distantly watch the Cubs ST game

from the top of the waterpark slide, I’m all for it.

To the Diamondbacks: You got a pool out past right field?? We have a whole waterpark out in left field! It’s on!

"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas

by RiskyBusiness on Sep 17, 2010 12:15 PM CDT reply actions  

And if Las Vegas ever got a ST team

their pool might be a clothing optional. I think they would win with that.

"WGN, Channel 9 Cubs Baseball, Excitingly, Importantly, Dramatically Yours." - Jack Brickhouse

by BigJohnAZ on Sep 17, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Or how about

a pool with blackjack tables around the sides and wide screen TV’s to watch games
from the pool like a sports book…

Ramirez, Fukudome, Soriano and Zambrano. It's the 2010 Murderers' Row of baseball failure. - Paraphrasing Gene Wojciechowski

by Endrick on Sep 17, 2010 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

If I was a player

And I knew all that was going on just past left field – to hell with the split squad game!

"They come to see me strike out, hit a home run, or run into a fence. I try to accommodate them at least one way every game." - Gorman Thomas

by RiskyBusiness on Sep 17, 2010 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

FLorida Site far more ATTRACTIVE

Ooooh, a waterpark ! How about miles and miles of beaches, major casinos, Disneyworld, Universal, SeaWorld, and a CITY TO YOURSELF like NAPLES FLORIDA. How many teams training in AZ have won a World Series in the past 20 years ? 16 teams in the same location in a city WITH A MAJOR LEAGUE TEAM, that’s a great idea. TIME to MOVE and now. We need to shake things up and get a NEW winning tradition.
And your pitchers can really throw breaking balls !

VOLCUBPACK1

by VOLCUBPACK1 on Sep 17, 2010 1:52 PM CDT reply actions  

This is a dead issue.

The Cubs aren’t going to Florida.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." ~ Yogi Berra

by Al Yellon on Sep 17, 2010 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hey man

Your arguments are about 6 months old – did you just wake up from deep hibernation?

"Ask Dad. He'll know. And on the off chance he doesn't, he'll make something up"

by StevenABQ on Sep 17, 2010 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

too much travel between team sites

Colleague is a RedBirds fan. He’d tell me how long a drive it is to other sites from Jupiter, Fla. He came out to AZ with me on an AZ ST trip a couple years ago and loved it. We stayed in Tempe since I had actual work near Price & Elliot. Four different stadiums over the course of a week and no time was it more than 30 minutes drive to any of them.

Besides there was never any way Maricopa Cty, City of Mesa and St of AZ would ever let the Cubs leave.

Just win the next game...!

by blackhawk24 on Sep 21, 2010 6:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

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